hax melee weapons =/

XxLady_XelxX - Dreamweaver

Rawthorne - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Hmm let's see now...
1. Yah archers aren't "melee" w/ that insane lunar bow and sage mastery skill wth is their range like 34m or so w/ the ability to aoe continuously which you WILL debuff someone with it if left up for sev secs/thrown on a nice spawn spot like towers/crystals/bind spots.
2. Mmk a nice silly axe bm comes up and stuns me using his gx's but isn't able to kill me. So what's he do? 2 options, one is to perpetualy waste chi by keeping me stunlocked or just switch to the fists w/ all that - int gear blah blah and the chances of me pulling off a spell WITHOUT getting interrupted just plummeted.
3. As others have said we get interrupted repeatedly in say tw which is worse then missing. A nice fist bm can hit me 4/5x a sec whereas my weakest spells have a 1 sec cast and channel w/ the potential to be interrupted....
4. Bottom line to me is that ALL of the magic wpn bonuses for end game gear pale in comparison to the other classes wpn's. Give us something silly like a possibilty of protection f/ movement debuffs or temporarily inc. channeling/no channeling, inc. def., inc. att., refill hp/mp etc. and it would be more balanced.

Right...right...because a Wizzie gaining something 'silly' like a no-cost Sutra off of a weapon that probably proc'd as they were 1-shotting half a dozen people easy, then dropping 1-2 more ults or a barrage of other heavy nukes in quick succession would totally balance things.

And for the record...I'd tend to think full Arcanes that generally don't have squat for Crit unless they gear for it all of a sudden having 10-13% AND faster casting from gear alone pretty ridiculous. O_O

Regenbogen - Lost City

Michael_dark - Lost City wrote: »

1-3 read above.

Bottom line is that as a melee class, I have to deal with casters with lvl11 stone barrier with buffed pdef equal to many heavies and attacks that really never miss (except for the rare occasion I can get in range to cancel or stun you).

The ration of my mdef to your magic damage pales to a wizards pdef and my physical damage.

So keep QQing about OP classes when it's apparent that you always play one.

there are are other casters as well...

and i never heard a bm complaining about the phys damage pdef ratio when hitting >20k on an arcane with true emptiness...

we all know wizards can selfbuff their pdef and at the same time hit hard like hell...

b:bye

samasalao

I find nothing wrong with magic wands, they are mighty and good, yea thet lack the special effects of physical weapons but we have good spells to make up for that.

What I find broken are two effects:

Berserk / sacrifical strike: The effect stacks with critical, it also works on skills, this gives melee a ridiculous dmg spike, check the forums for ppl braging about damage, they are all melees with berserk weapons, the dmg spike this gives is ridiculous, with a high critical this skill is nasty.

Debuff: This effect is broken on bows, it also stacks with hits from skills not only normal hits, a debuffed player is pretty much dead in TW / PVP. The effect is broken please remove it.

One thing I am positive is that this game is easier to play as a non magical, not only your weapon comes with some really nasty effects but you are also harder to kill, both barbs and BM come with anti stun/freeze effects skills, also you and dont have to be running around hoping for two criticals out of 3/4 hits, and dmg wise your skills are not as strong as those of a wizie but much faster to pull out and come with some really broken effects like stun, and in the long run you end up dealing more dmg than a wizie/cleric, a demon archer is tremendous dder, same as a fist demon BM, heck even a high hp crazy hard to kill barb 1 shots magicals users with a a zerk arma, saying that melee class needs the weapons effects because are underpowered towards magical users needs to think this more.

I am not saying that magical classes are weak, but I do agree that some effects from melee weapons are overpowered compared to magical weapons current status.

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

samasalao wrote: »

I find nothing wrong with magic wands, they are mighty and good, yea thet lack the special effects of physical weapons but we have good spells to make up for that.

What I find broken are two effects:

Berserk / sacrifical strike: The effect stacks with critical, it also works on skills, this gives melee a ridiculous dmg spike, check the forums for ppl braging about damage, they are all melees with berserk weapons, the dmg spike this gives is ridiculous, with a high critical this skill is nasty.

Debuff: This effect is broken on bows, it also stacks with hits from skills not only normal hits, a debuffed player is pretty much dead in TW / PVP. The effect is broken please remove it.

One thing I am positive is that this game is easier to play as a non magical, not only your weapon comes with some really nasty effects but you are also harder to kill, both barbs and BM come with anti stun/freeze effects skills, also you and dont have to be running around hoping for two criticals out of 3/4 hits, and dmg wise your skills are not as strong as those of a wizie but much faster to pull out and come with some really broken effects like stun, and in the long run you end up dealing more dmg than a wizie/cleric, a demon archer is tremendous dder, same as a fist demon BM, heck even a high hp crazy hard to kill barb 1 shots magicals users with arma, whoever was saying that melee class needs the effects because are underpowered towards magical users is a liar.

I am not saying that magical classes are weak, but I do agree that some effects from melee weapons are overpowered compared to magical weapons current status.

I fully agree.

Michael_Dark - Lost City

Regenbogen - Lost City wrote: »

there are are other casters as well...

and i never heard a bm complaining about the phys damage pdef ratio when hitting >20k on an arcane with true emptiness...

we all know wizards can selfbuff their pdef and at the same time hit hard like hell...

b:bye

Erm... confused much? That wasn't a QQ it was a response to someone QQing that casters aren't powerful enough. >.>

Great detective work, genius. lol

samasalao wrote: »

I am not saying that magical classes are weak, but I do agree that some effects from melee weapons are overpowered compared to magical weapons current status.

That may be true in theory, the reality is the outcome is that mages and venos are the most broken classes at end-game, and only recently with event gear you can add fist/claw BMs to that list.

An axe BM even with Sacrificial Strike is mostly gimped at lvl 100+ with relatively weak damage compared to any other class.

Conavar - Heavens Tear

Michael_dark - Lost City wrote: »

An axe BM even with Sacrificial Strike is mostly gimped at lvl 100+ with relatively weak damage compared to any other class.

Plus an Axe BM has to Zerk AND Crit to even think about coming close to say a Wizzies normal dmg.

The Zerk is added to those weapons because the base phy dmg is low from both normal atts and skills. If they started adding proc's like that to mag class dmg, then their base dmg would have to be nurfed to compensate.

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Conavar - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Plus an Axe BM has to Zerk AND Crit to even think about coming close to say a Wizzies normal dmg.

The Zerk is added to those weapons because the base phy dmg is low from both normal atts and skills. If they started adding proc's like that to mag class dmg, then their base dmg would have to be nurfed to compensate.

I have enough now. So I want 0.5s attack rate or less. And stunts spells. OK? b:angry

GothicAngeI - Heavens Tear

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I have enough now. So I want 0.5s attack rate or less.

Build a Fist Wiz then for 5 att/s b:pleased

EverDoom - Harshlands

JanusZeal - Heavens Tear wrote: »

-Channeling isn't special? When everything you do is casting, casting faster isn't special? Wow. Sorry faster heals and damage (which includes most things that are in procs), you're not special. Maybe this kind of stupidity is why you complain about phys-based weapons having special procs. Forget all about that, you're right, it's so unfair -- you may return to killing Wicked Pirates over and over now.

o boy we got a real mature person right here b:shutup anyways nice discussion guys so far. and as a few of you have mentioned, some casters dont have a good pdef shield. so compared to mag attacks hitting melee class hard, physical attacks hit robe classes just as hard...

Rawthorne - Heavens Tear

bah 2 many ppl to quote so I'll just summarize a few things here:
●Wield Thunder
Range 28.0meters
Mana 595
Channel 2.5 seconds
Cast 1.2 seconds

●Tempest
Range 28.0meters
Mana 655
Channel 4.0 seconds
Cast 1.5 seconds

●Great Cyclone
Range 28.0meters
Mana 265
Channel 1.0 second
Cast 1.0 second




Those are the only 3 spells a cleric is gonna be using against a melee class causing much of any damage (I listed the sage versions w/ the 28m range then). I'm ignoring siren's kiss, plume shot, and razor feathers as siren's kiss is a 1 spark aoe w/ not much damage, and plume shot/RF= phys damage.Obviously I also ignored thunderball due to it's low damage/dot vs time spent channeling/casting. Add those 3 up and you've got 7.5 secs in channelling (25% channeling will drop this to 5.625 secs) and 3.7 secs in cast time. So 3 spells = max of 11.2 secs and min of 9.325 secs (roughly). Wow so 3 spells that i can "3 shot a bm w/" but I've had to use 2 sparks to do it (maybe more if I spark prior thus adding to the time/damage). How many attacks in this time does a fist bm or an archer w/ - int gear pull off on me? A 5 sec/att fist bm in 11 secs would get a whopping 55 attacks off on me in that time? The chances of me not getting interrupted casting my spells would be? Oh and you guys are also forgetting that idk about you all but I have apoc 8 so I use 50% phys dam red charms in tw. They have the SAME cooldown as the mag red charms. So in theory a bm could have 2/3 of my spells protected taking 50% less damage vs me having 2/55 in the span of 9.5-11 secs.

I'm sorry but imo any good bm/archer who dies to a similar leveled/geared arcane only fighting each other at the time in tw end game = fail cuz of all the advantages they have vs us. Sometimes we may win but most of the times they should (discounting the chances of crit's/ sac strike's etc which are skewed anyways towards them). We basically have to get "lucky" and hope for alot of things like they've been purged by someone else, their m def charms are in cd and balance etc, or hit a crit and we all know where the chances of crits favor....Oh and that we can successfully kite them but that ain't happening vs an archer.

Yes I realize I can jump, use genie skills, plume shell, blah blah. Just as bms can use balance. Oh and let's not forget that genie skill that annihlates anyone in the air (I forget the name atm). That's a fun one to be nailed w/ all the time.

Asperitas - Lost City

Rawthorne - Heavens Tear wrote: »

bah 2 many ppl to quote so I'll just summarize a few things here:
●Wield Thunder
Range 28.0meters
Mana 595
Channel 2.5 seconds
Cast 1.2 seconds

●Tempest
Range 28.0meters
Mana 655
Channel 4.0 seconds
Cast 1.5 seconds

●Great Cyclone
Range 28.0meters
Mana 265
Channel 1.0 second
Cast 1.0 second




Those are the only 3 spells a cleric is gonna be using against a melee class causing much of any damage (I listed the sage versions w/ the 28m range then). I'm ignoring siren's kiss, plume shot, and razor feathers as siren's kiss is a 1 spark aoe w/ not much damage, and plume shot/RF= phys damage.Obviously I also ignored thunderball due to it's low damage/dot vs time spent channeling/casting. Add those 3 up and you've got 7.5 secs in channelling (25% channeling will drop this to 5.625 secs) and 3.7 secs in cast time. So 3 spells = max of 11.2 secs and min of 9.325 secs (roughly). Wow so 3 spells that i can "3 shot a bm w/" but I've had to use 2 sparks to do it (maybe more if I spark prior thus adding to the time/damage). How many attacks in this time does a fist bm or an archer w/ - int gear pull off on me? A 5 sec/att fist bm in 11 secs would get a whopping 55 attacks off on me in that time? The chances of me not getting interrupted casting my spells would be? Oh and you guys are also forgetting that idk about you all but I have apoc 8 so I use 50% phys dam red charms in tw. They have the SAME cooldown as the mag red charms. So in theory a bm could have 2/3 of my spells protected taking 50% less damage vs me having 2/55 in the span of 9.5-11 secs.

I'm sorry but imo any good bm/archer who dies to a similar leveled/geared arcane only fighting each other at the time in tw end game = fail cuz of all the advantages they have vs us. Sometimes we may win but most of the times they should (discounting the chances of crit's/ sac strike's etc which are skewed anyways towards them). We basically have to get "lucky" and hope for alot of things like they've been purged by someone else, their m def charms are in cd and balance etc, or hit a crit and we all know where the chances of crits favor....Oh and that we can successfully kite them but that ain't happening vs an archer.

Yes I realize I can jump, use genie skills, plume shell, blah blah. Just as bms can use balance. Oh and let's not forget that genie skill that annihlates anyone in the air (I forget the name atm). That's a fun one to be nailed w/ all the time.

I disagree. You're making that comparison under the assumption both classes are just standing there beating each other up. If that's the case, of course a fist BM will rock a cleric. That's where BMs excel.

There's a lot more variables when you're actually fighting. Anybody can yell "OMG mages can force of will, undine, sleep, ulti, OP!!!". Anybody can say "tree of protection zerk crit armageddon OP!!!". But the way things actually play out are very different, and it's not enough to base it just on one factor.

Mrvate - Heavens Tear

honestly I don't know exactly what all of you are talking about magic hitting HA harder then melee hits AA. Yeah for wizards this may be true but it's not for the other arcane class's. In open pvp I can't even break through most bm's charm if they're near my lvl. but yet with me spamming ih on myself and being charmed they can still kill me with only normal attacks. or when bm's stun lock me, how do I fight against that. and yes for clerics we have plume shell, but there is 10 sec wait for cooldown. And it's not hard at all for a melee class to break through a clerics mp pool if the cleric doesn't have a mp charm.

also for the one who mentioned arcane class's sharding to get equal pdef to mdeg. HA gives more overall resistances them AA. And I hardly ever see HA sharded for mdef. ijs.

I definitely think magic weapons should have something more then just -chan on them. as I find -chan near useless.

Quilue - Sanctuary

kite the **** out...jeez...maybe i didn't make myself clear the first time, but you're not supposed to stick around when a fist bm is in your face. just as he took the time to get to you, maybe you should take the time to gtfo and not let him demon spark to 5attacks/s.

and i'm sorry but you're terribad if you need an archer purged before you can kill him 1v1.

Rawthorne - Heavens Tear

yes I'm very bored atm....

Asperitas - Lost City wrote: »

I disagree. You're making that comparison under the assumption both classes are just standing there beating each other up. If that's the case, of course a fist BM will rock a cleric. That's where BMs excel.

There's a lot more variables when you're actually fighting. Anybody can yell "OMG mages can force of will, undine, sleep, ulti, OP!!!". Anybody can say "tree of protection zerk crit armageddon OP!!!". But the way things actually play out are very different, and it's not enough to base it just on one factor.

Hmm so I target a bm in tw who's say 20 m away from me and he turns/comes towards me asap cuz only a fool would let a 101 cleric beat up on them repeatedly w/out going for them... a GOOD bm using mp def charms, geared similar to me (ala halfway decent gear) and balance SHOULD wipe me 9/10x (assuming my anti stun pots/def pots/abs domain on cd). That's what I was saying.

Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »

kite the **** out...jeez...

i'm sorry but you're terribad if you need an archer purged before you can kill him.

Hmm ok a 100+ archer fully buffed/geared out w/ say 9/10k+ hp who targets me 1st at 32-34m away w/ a lunar bow...right that's fail on my part cuz of the stuns/debuffs etc/ I will have to endure BEFORE I even get into their range to attack back? How many hits will I take on myself BEFORE I even land ONE on them? Chances are my pdef charms will be on cd, charm ticked, and just getting plume shell up (hopefully) by the time I am in range to attack them back. I now need to drop them ASAP hence why I say purge helps a ton.

LadyofReal - Heavens Tear

Alright, I just had to say something here...

1. The game is pretty balanced as far as PvP is concerned aside from the new classes and based on the assumption that the classes involved are along equal standings. Notice I didn't say gear or level, but playing skill. Yes gear and level help, but a slightly undergeared player can still be victorious if they know what they're doing. So until, anyone knows how it is to be a certain, I wouldn't necessarily go so far as complaining about the add-ons for their weapons.

2. I am a axe/fist BM. In TW I have stunned opponents in mid air whether they were jumping or flying and still managed to successfully attack them from the ground, so jumping isn't necessarily the best of options.

3. You will never find me using marrows in TW. IMO it's just suicidal. Use phys marrow really weak against magic, use mag marrow, really weak against phys attacks. I'd rather just alternate continously between balance and mag def charms.

The only thing that I would suggest is to give clerics a longer range. Since they are predominantly a range class anyway, the chances of being able to hit an opponent should be flat with the range of other range dd'ing classes.

Slivaf - Dreamweaver

As other people pointed out, clerics, wizards, archers, and psychics, have a pretty long range, and very strong attacks to boot.

If you catch a bm without any chi at all the chances of them building up chi before you alcapwn them is actually pretty slim, even if they are a fist user, the fists alone don't give them any huge advantage, they have to have insane dps with lots of - int gear to build chi from the ground up, and then they have to be smart enough to use balance/ altar marrow magical in order to get within attack range, and hope that the cleric doesn't sleep/stun them.

Barb's have massive amount of health, and are almost always protected by a cleric. Range/Magic classes always have the element of surprise on there side. Whereas melee is lucky if they sneak up on a magic user without them not noticing... at least the experienced ones.

Magic already has a huge leg up on melee, no reason for magic to get even more powerful. <<

Clerics can heal there **** off, and not even with my fists (no - int gear) can I eat through there constant regeneration. =x Wizards, and Pyschics, have moves that even help defend themselves when melee users get close, not to mention that an archer can easily kite/pop up with magic attacks of there own. Ranger/Magic characters already have enough opportunities to fend off a melee opponent long enough to run and get higher ground, and pop more magic off at there attacker.

Though yes bms can stun lock, but as I said earlier without chi, we will be extremely lucky to either build the chi up, or kill you before you have more then enough opportunities to pwn the snot out of us, barbs at least get the massive amount of hp, and stuns to boot. =x lol

Oh and one more thing magic/range classes far outweigh the amount of melee classes in game... 5 to 3, though it you want to you could consider a veno to be a hybrid, that can do both.

So in short range/magic classes already have so many advantages on there side to begin with, but yes if a bm catches you up close and he or she has chi, you better start praying. =x

Quilue - Sanctuary

because, naw, you can't use genie skills while you're stunned, wait a minute that's not true.

archer is probably the worst class at 1v1, only good in mass PvP. way to name one of the few scenario for which archers can have an advantage against a cleric, when it has the first hit and range through the confusion of TW.

"i need a purge on that archer" you're going to get laughed at unless that's a heavily cash shopped +10 all gear archer

Slivaf - Dreamweaver

Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »

because, naw, you can't use genie skills while you're stunned, wait a minute that's not true.

archer is probably the worst class at 1v1, only good in mass PvP. way to name one of the few scenario for which archers can have an advantage against a cleric, when it has the first hit and range through the confusion of TW.

"i need a purge on that archer" you're going to get laughed at unless that's a heavily cash shopped +10 all gear archer

End game I really don't know about that 1 on 1 stuff... you all have a level 100 move that nets you full chi. =x

Archers seems to have an easier chance to pull off combos that could easily level a bm, even before level 100, though obviously I could be wrong, I am not an archer, and as I am sure you can tell from my sig, my alt that's an archer isn't a very high level.

One thing that I do know, is that archers hit a lot harder on HA, then even bms do =x lol (at least the normal attacks)

I really think that the game is pretty balanced, you just have to know your classes, strengths and weaknesses real well, and how to counter them.

TigerLily - Lost City

EverDoom - Harshlands wrote: »

not to sound newby or anything, but y do melee weapons have like super cool effects on them and not mag weapons? like 5% hp for double attack, or something like that. the best thing mag weapons get is like - channeling which isnt that special...

Yeah i agree they should do that. Would be fun seeing lvl 7X wizards 1 shooting 9X barbs b:chuckle


Actually no one would play a physical class at all anymore if magic weapons had zerk b:avoid.

Monoftalmus - Heavens Tear

To comment on Raw.. hmm, you can kill cleric easy only if hes forced to heal someone or is trying to kill you 1 on 1 and is not +12 character. What they do do.. is HPath... skill that messed up the pvp balance.... and then hit and gun and sleep slow down and then hit and gun get assisted by pty member etc. Oh yea, when they hit and gun they hit you 100% always coz pwi stand on magic is one sided.

Okaj to say again: HOLY PATH SKILL THAT MESSED UP THE PVP BALANCE.... or should use 150 energy etc. Before this skil came up Game was more balanced. K everyone saw this.

GMs Saw this? okaj.. lets move on.

To add here on weps things, Its not the wep or the damage its the fact that non of the MAGIC attacks miss or fail ever or wizzle, I sure would like to see Zerk wep's for magic users if they can Miss as much as my 4k accuracy bm with an Aoe losing 2 sparks and still miss.

Evasion is gliched or has wrong description as its not saying ''physical evasion'' but evasion. That means when I see Fire ball or a dragon or a magic range attack comming at me I can acctually evade it and not wait to get hit, that makes no sence and I only seen it in PWI.
This is why Magic users are totaly pushing melee classes of the wars area.

Skils and game balance I would say. Also, some magic skills should not miss but not all of them. Bm's aoe's miss even if its AREA effect, how? where is the logic here?

Also, i have 8-9 phy attack and with all the buffs, EP and TMire I still get to hit 500-600 or max 1 k to some Magic users in similar refine levels, and they aint using Apo. And There is a chance to miss etc.

And my 10k magic resistance with marrow still gets 2-4k damage from magic users top skils with 100% hit. So wth... If i dont span my Defm magic charm (to cut that to half) I am as good as dead.
So bms with no Magic def charms that cost chi are very underpowered.

How ever you look you need much more money to compete to magic users which makes game disbalanced.

My opinon only tho

b:bye

Quilue - Sanctuary

Slivaf - Dreamweaver wrote: »

End game I really don't know about that 1 on 1 stuff... you all have a level 100 move that nets you full chi. =x

Archers seems to have an easier chance to pull off combos that could easily level a bm, even before level 100, though obviously I could be wrong, I am not an archer, and as I am sure you can tell from my sig, my alt that's an archer isn't a very high level.

One thing that I do know, is that archers hit a lot harder on HA, then even bms do =x lol (at least the normal attacks)

I really think that the game is pretty balanced, you just have to know your classes, strengths and weaknesses real well, and how to counter them.

if you're talking about just normal attacks, that's because ranged weapons have higher weapon attack than melee weapons, but ranged weapons are also a lot slower than melee weapons. axes are the slowest at 0.9 attacks/s yes? fastest ranged wep is slingshot at 0.71 attacks/s.

and for the record, awaken has a 15min cooldown, and as a lvl 100 skill it costs like 40m to learn. it also gets completely owned by the assassin's inner harmony, which gains 200 chi every minute.

MoonUsagi - Heavens Tear

These pretty much just like a game named D**a.
Magic class usually own early but owned later because those melee class gain
power full item or grow a lot stronger making them only receive little damage. b:sweat

But we has genie =0 . .

Asperitas - Lost City

Rawthorne - Heavens Tear wrote: »

yes I'm very bored atm....



Hmm so I target a bm in tw who's say 20 m away from me and he turns/comes towards me asap cuz only a fool would let a 101 cleric beat up on them repeatedly w/out going for them... a GOOD bm using mp def charms, geared similar to me (ala halfway decent gear) and balance SHOULD wipe me 9/10x (assuming my anti stun pots/def pots/abs domain on cd). That's what I was saying.

Only a fool would let a 101 BM run towards them from 20m away, stun them, and fist the life out of them.

If I saw a BM running towards me, I would get away as fast as I could, be it holy pathing away, flying up, or sleeping him, whatever you got at the moment. I'm not going to stand there and try to fight toe to toe. That's stupid, and a biased comparison.

Michael_Dark - Lost City

Rawthorne - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I'm sorry but imo any good bm/archer who dies to a similar leveled/geared arcane only fighting each other at the time in tw end game = fail cuz of all the advantages they have vs us. Sometimes we may win but most of the times they should (discounting the chances of crit's/ sac strike's etc which are skewed anyways towards them). We basically have to get "lucky" and hope for alot of things like they've been purged by someone else, their m def charms are in cd and balance etc, or hit a crit and we all know where the chances of crits favor....Oh and that we can successfully kite them but that ain't happening vs an archer.

Wow... you're kidding. As a Cleric you're somewhat right. You need to actually know how to play your class to kill a BM or Archer. As a mage, in TW? From what pretty much ever mage has told me about TW is summed up by this "filter T for heavies... tab....kill.. tab... kill.... tab... kill.... tab... kill... tab... kill... oops, dead...". Mages get so many more kills on heavies during TW it's sickening.

FWIW, my patk with +10 GX is somewhere around 5k-9k. A end-game mage with a +10 CV weapon is something between 8k-16k. It's almost impossible to one-shot a mage with decent gear... however any half decent mage has a much better chance of one-shotting a BM or archer. Magic hurts heavies much worse than physical damage hits arcane. Especially when both are fully buffed.

And... LOL @ your wall of meaningless attack speed comparisons. You really must not PvP much.

Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »

archer is probably the worst class at 1v1, only good in mass PvP. way to name one of the few scenario for which archers can have an advantage against a cleric, when it has the first hit and range through the confusion of TW.

lol. That's why there are more archers in the PvP rankings than any other class. Seriously, archers kill most people even before they have time to react. Honestly they're not all that hard to kill, but you have to avoid being killed by them first, which can be difficult considering the enormous spike damage they have. A lucky crit on just Lightning Strike can one-shot many BMs. S surrpised me in Room 34 of cube. 16k crit. I was dead as soon as I realized what was happening.

Stunning arrow > thunderous blast > aim low > lightnightstrike... or whatever they do. It hurts like hell though. With +12 8juns it's more like Stunning Arrow > normal shot > normal shot > normal shot >normal shot > dead... or something like that.

Quilue - Sanctuary

^
uh dude, no lightning strike crit does not 1 shot bms unless there is a huge difference in gear or maybe it was triple sparked. lightning strike doesn't have as much raw damage as ****ing pyrogram. there r more archers in PvP ranking than anyone else doesn't point to archers being the best 1v1 class. it could've been ganks, group ganks, TWs, whatever.

and normal attacks, lol where do i begin? that's like saying a bm can walk up to u, stun and wack u with +12 axes to death (which attacks faster and could have zerk). maybe wat we've failed to emphasize is +12 8jun.

MoonUsagi - Heavens Tear wrote: »

These pretty much just like a game named D**a.
Magic class usually own early but owned later because those melee class gain
power full item or grow a lot stronger making them only receive little damage. b:sweat

But we has genie =0 . .

if you're talking about dota, this is nothing like dota. in dota the spell damage is fixed, that is why int heroes take a more supportive role later in the game.

here in PW, magic classes' spell attacks gain power as they level up and acquire better weapons. endgame caster classes are by no means weak

MoonUsagi - Heavens Tear

I know b:victory, i just want to make conclusion from what thread OP said.

Caster has genie to escape from melee range anyway. b:chuckle
Any yeah BIDS ftw . . b:cute
Btw i see some post saying about cleric, what everyone think they should do ? b:surrender
Eh just forget it xD melee need lots money to match caster spells it seems.

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

What you all talking about? Without chi is mage pretty useless. They don't have control skill except FoW. And 4s sleep. Their magic attack can by easily interrupted with near melee attacker because of long channeling. BM killed me in cube so many time, because he locked me for many seconds in row and I was killed without hitting him. So what you talking about?
Classes are pretty balance except tideborns.

TigerLily - Lost City

Michael_dark - Lost City wrote: »

lol. That's why there are more archers in the PvP rankings than any other class. Seriously, archers kill most people even before they have time to react. Honestly they're not all that hard to kill, but you have to avoid being killed by them first, which can be difficult considering the enormous spike damage they have. A lucky crit on just Lightning Strike can one-shot many BMs. S surrpised me in Room 34 of cube. 16k crit. I was dead as soon as I realized what was happening.

Stunning arrow > thunderous blast > aim low > lightnightstrike... or whatever they do. It hurts like hell though. With +12 8juns it's more like Stunning Arrow > normal shot > normal shot > normal shot >normal shot > dead... or something like that.

There is a lot of archer in pvp ranking b/c its a ranged class thats good to kill lower lvl squishys. Any class thats mele will have to work far harder to get up the rankings. Just see who normally gets the kill in group pvp, its the wiz/veno/archer and sure as hell not the BM since he needs to fly up close range. Bms/barbs always get ksed on kills in pk by ranged classes.

I sure dont get 1 shoot by lightning strike from other archers, not even if its a rank 8 +12. No clue how you got hit 16k im guessing debuff, poison, hell spark, attack charms and maybe a dmg **** - unless you accidentally had phy marrow up.

Archer with your average +10 heaven shatter hits me like like 3-5k if they crit on lighting after metal debuff. Not even enough to bypass charm if im buffed <.< And my mag def sucks. Lighting strike doesn't even have a % in weapon dmg mod on it.

If pvp ranking was only based on fair 1v1 fights. Players with similar lvl and gear, and players that didn't try to run away but was fighting back, there would not be so many archers up there.

SinCityChick - Dreamweaver

Just in case nobody brought it up, I have (on a BARB) experienced times when my skills stop firing and I get the little message "Interrupted!". Therefore, I can say for a fact that magic never truly misses, it just has a chance to not fire, like any other skill in the game. However, I don't believe that this is wrong. Even on my barb, I was able to take a couple smashes from a wizzie and then get close enough to immobilize and beat the heck outta them. But if they were to have zerk, I (or any other barb, bm, assassin, etc.) would have had no chance at all. One-shot kills happen often enough for magic users, because (if built with LA in mind) wizzies can have decent crit %. Also, Gush slows down an attacker, giving the wizzie some time to kite away from a meleer. In other words, the game is fine as is, except for (as was mentioned) Holy Path. Nice for FB/BH/TT I am sure, but an absolutely stupid skill for PvP.

_makina_ - Sanctuary

Michael_dark - Lost City wrote: »

FWIW, my patk with +10 GX is somewhere around 5k-9k. A end-game mage with a +10 CV weapon is something between 8k-16k. It's almost impossible to one-shot a mage with decent gear... however any half decent mage has a much better chance of one-shotting a BM or archer. Magic hurts heavies much worse than physical damage hits arcane. Especially when both are fully buffed.

+10 CV even if its two sockets icebornes wont reach 16k buffed. I'm just saying because I have a +10 CV wand (granted im only lvl 100 its only one socket sapphire gem) and am 3 vit pure magic build im only breaking 12.5k-12.7k buffed. Just wanted to put that info out there for you to use.