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Why do Elves get no love in this game?
yoadoad
Member Posts: 182 Bounty Hunter
This has been like that since day 1 which means it probably won't change, but am I the only one who thinks that the races aren't balanced?
Human: 3% defense + 3 extra heroic feats - One of the best choices
Drow: 5% to reduce opponent defense by 10%, double campfire recovery - Not bad, not great
Dwarf: DoT and knock resist - Not bad
Half Elf: +1% deflect, +1% crit dmg, +1% gold gain, +1 ability score - lesser compared to others
Half Orc: 10% run speed for short time, 5% crit dmg - Amazing abilities
Halfling: 3% deflect change, 10% cc resist - Pretty good
Menzoberranzan Renegade: Similar to Drow, not bad, not great
Moon Elf: 1% AP gain, 1% stamina regen, 10% cc resist- Similar to halfling, but with lower bonuses...
Sun Elf: Similar to Moon elf, again, I don't think 2% AP can compete with 3% deflect chance
Tiefling: 5% damage to low hp targets, 10% chance to reduce power of attacker by 5% - Pretty good
Wood Elf: 1% critical chance, 10% slow resist - Super bad. Orcs have 5% critical damage - Elves have 1% critical chance???
Basically, races can be divided into these groups:
Great choices:
Human
Half Orc
Tiefling
Dwarf
Not the best, but not bad choices:
Halfling
Drow
Menzoberranzan Renegade
Bad choices:
Moon Elf
Sun Elf
Half Elf
REALLY Bad choice:
Wood Elf
Moon&Sun Elf are only available for those who purchase packs, right? Why do they have lesser stats when you compare them for example to the Halfling?
And the Wood+Half Elf? Why such lame stats? Gold gain is useless, +1 stat increase to a secondary stat isn't great, and the wood elves 1% critical chance doesn't even begin to compare with the half orc 5% critical severity.
Unless you're into RP choices, you have absolutely no reason to play an elf in this game. Halflings and Half Orcs provide similar bonuses, but to a much greater extent.
In my opinion, Moon+Sun elf bonuses of AP gain and Stamina gain should be doubled (so that they provide 2%+2% or 4%), Wood elf should have at least 3% critical chance (to at least compare with the Halfling deflection), and Half-Elf should either be given a +2 bonus or increase it's bonuses to 2% each.
Human: 3% defense + 3 extra heroic feats - One of the best choices
Drow: 5% to reduce opponent defense by 10%, double campfire recovery - Not bad, not great
Dwarf: DoT and knock resist - Not bad
Half Elf: +1% deflect, +1% crit dmg, +1% gold gain, +1 ability score - lesser compared to others
Half Orc: 10% run speed for short time, 5% crit dmg - Amazing abilities
Halfling: 3% deflect change, 10% cc resist - Pretty good
Menzoberranzan Renegade: Similar to Drow, not bad, not great
Moon Elf: 1% AP gain, 1% stamina regen, 10% cc resist- Similar to halfling, but with lower bonuses...
Sun Elf: Similar to Moon elf, again, I don't think 2% AP can compete with 3% deflect chance
Tiefling: 5% damage to low hp targets, 10% chance to reduce power of attacker by 5% - Pretty good
Wood Elf: 1% critical chance, 10% slow resist - Super bad. Orcs have 5% critical damage - Elves have 1% critical chance???
Basically, races can be divided into these groups:
Great choices:
Human
Half Orc
Tiefling
Dwarf
Not the best, but not bad choices:
Halfling
Drow
Menzoberranzan Renegade
Bad choices:
Moon Elf
Sun Elf
Half Elf
REALLY Bad choice:
Wood Elf
Moon&Sun Elf are only available for those who purchase packs, right? Why do they have lesser stats when you compare them for example to the Halfling?
And the Wood+Half Elf? Why such lame stats? Gold gain is useless, +1 stat increase to a secondary stat isn't great, and the wood elves 1% critical chance doesn't even begin to compare with the half orc 5% critical severity.
Unless you're into RP choices, you have absolutely no reason to play an elf in this game. Halflings and Half Orcs provide similar bonuses, but to a much greater extent.
In my opinion, Moon+Sun elf bonuses of AP gain and Stamina gain should be doubled (so that they provide 2%+2% or 4%), Wood elf should have at least 3% critical chance (to at least compare with the Halfling deflection), and Half-Elf should either be given a +2 bonus or increase it's bonuses to 2% each.
Post edited by yoadoad on
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Comments
The only singular time I've ever actually noticed a race-based advantage over other races is the Drow ability to spend only half the time at a camp fire to heal up from respawn wounds. Other than that I've never been able to actually feel any difference between different races (on the same class) during combat or otherwise.
Obviously I am only expressing my own experience, I have no intention to proclaim OP is wrong in any way. I'm just saying I'm not actually experiencing any differences, especially once you get past level 20 or so when gear and enchantments and all the other fluff create so many variables that it's easier to accurately predict the local weather more than a week out.
I suspect the only time most of these stat difference can really be felt or make genuine difference is in the early leveling process, say up to 15 or 20, and in solo play. As for the preference of Halflings for a particular class in PvP (for example) - I suspect it's more of a psychological thing based on tiny combat-log numbers expressing some phantom advantage than any genuinely meaningful difference.
Halfling"
Halfling is the best race for most classes lol. But yeah elves seem a little weak.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
PS: me like halfpints even less than elves, me eat them both with ketchup and fries
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
That said the racial bonuses are tiny. The stats matter a lot more.
Honestly, unless you are doing serious pvp and roll halfling, just play what you like, although a dwarf cw or an elf tank would be pretty funny
Everything you need to know about CW:
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?780981-Chem-s-CW-Compendium-Everything-you-need-to-know
2% AP gain is a solid benefit.
Half elves are actually great for certain rolls...
Along with what AngrySprite said I really can't say this list is accurate to the opinion of the player base.
As far as the opinion of passive/stats for elves, I disagree completely. Everyone of my elves benefit greatly from their passive bonuses for their class and paragons. I personally feel every elven passive/stat choices are fine and can befit their race and compliment each class in their own ways.
So, to tally up, we have:
Free Races:
Non-Elves;
Dwarf - Stand Your Ground / Cast Iron Stomach
Halfling - Nimble Reaction / Bold
Half-Orc - Furious Assault / Swift Change
Human - Versatile Defense / Heroic Effort
Tiefling - Bloodhunt / Infernal Wrath
Elves;
Drow Elf - Darkfire / Trance
Half-Elf - Knack for Success / Dilettante
Sun Elf - Inner Calm / Sun Elf Grace
Wood Elf - Elven Accuracy / Wild Step
Pack (Paid) Races:
Non-Elves;
Dragonborn - Dragonborn Fury / Draconic Heritage
Elves;
Menzoberranzan Renegade - Faerie Fire / Trance
Moon Elf - Wanderlust / Moon Elf Resilience
Then on top of the plethora of varying elves we have, we have a whole Module based on the Eladrin and Feywild; Sharandar. There are elven armors and weapons to be found here as well as a few elven-based cosmetic items in Packs and Zen store.
Each elven race has their own pros and cons and in my opinion, the Sun Elf has the best active bonus of them all, with Moon elves having an almost equally good passive. I think the elves are in a fine spot, even though I would still like to see Avariel, Green Elf (aka Wild Elf), True Eladrin (you know, the ones that actually came from the Feywild and not just Native Elves that adopted Eladrin Traditions), Sea Elves, and Half-Drow.
Perhaps I just have a deeper or more fond understanding of how each race works with the various classes, as I have 25 characters and most of them are elves - with most of those elves being either drow or menzo drow. I have at least one character of every race, except for Wood Elf (He'll be my druid when druids come) and at least two characters of every class.
Let's see, I have:
1 x Dragonborn
2 x Drow
3 x Dwarf
1 x Halfling
1 x Half-Elf
2 x Half-Orc
4 x Human
5 x Menzoberranzan Renegade
1 x Moon Elf
4 x Sun Elf
1 x Tiefling
0 x Wood Elf
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
I can't imagine life without the 3 extra heroic feat points. As a CW that translates to 3% more stat ratings for your group or about 25% more DPS.
I have no idea how you are getting those numbers man, no clue.
Everything you need to know about CW:
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?780981-Chem-s-CW-Compendium-Everything-you-need-to-know
sep non-humans can get that too...
and your maths...
and also the featured satirical comedic adventure "A Call for Heroes".
Focused Wizardry increased my single-target damage input by about 25% according to ACT. Unfortunately it's prohibited to post it here.
It can also be translated to 3% more damage input coming from Learned Spellcaster if you prefer, but I don't think people will use that since Prestidigitation gives about 1% more damage and healing coming from Power for each member of the group.
*Unusual race/class combo in PnP. Halflings have to use smaller weapons, and are generally a suboptimal choice for a weapon-based class. While human GWFs use greatswords, halfling GWFs use longswords two-handed. Imagine playing a halfling GWF using a GF longsword without the benefit of a shield. That's how halflings are in PnP. As for Dragonborn, IIRC, they get +2 Str and a choice between +2 Con or +2 Cha. They don't get two floating stat bumps.
However, some of my characters fall into "appropriate" race/class combinations:
I don't see any significant differences between playing the correct race/class combo as opposed to a mismatched one, and I get to reap the benefits of standing out in the crowd.
Taking a break from Neverwinter indefinitely...
. . . We'll need to keep all "help" topics off the forums, in regard to use of ACT. Instead, please direct and ask users to contact the developer(s) of ACT or any one that works for or assists the developer(s) of ACT privately through either PM or through ACT's own site.
. . . Our apologies for any confusion or annoyance the prior ruling of disallowing ACT had caused. Just to be clear; as long as ACT doesn't require Neverwinter to be running with it and doesn't in any way manipulate game files (other than the log files the game exports, while offline from Neverwinter), there should be no further issue with ACT.
Safe travels,
Archmage Zebular of Mystryl
PWE Community Moderator
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
1% critical strike is not nearly as high as 5% critical severity, 3% deflection chance, 2% ap gain, for sure not better than 3% power + 3% critical, 5% damage to low hp targets... It is even worse than the crappy Half-elf +1% crit dmg/deflection chance!
I've always been using focused wizardry, seems great but I am unsure how to parse that out. Since I run an aoe bar it seems a no brainer.
I never figured out exactly what learned spellcadter did, the tooltip was vauge. We tested this vs focused wizardry and it seemed meh.
Prestidigitation, when the team is hard up against dr seems the worst of the bunch. Only the hp and power would matter and then it's not much.
Maybe we should move this to the library? I'd love to hear how you got the numbers in detail.
Everything you need to know about CW:
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?780981-Chem-s-CW-Compendium-Everything-you-need-to-know
@Zebular
Nice to know. Thank you!
@Chemboy613
I didn't make an entire theorycraft about that. I just noticed that my DPS increased by about 1/4 when using Focused Wizardry; it's not a fixed and accurate amount.
I used Icy Rays, RoE, CoI and CS, and MM as filler. When I tested with Icy Terrain, CoI, SotEA and SS with CC as filler the damage didn't go up. I have no idea if passive effects like Storm Spell are affected by that since I tested with no class features and/or paragon feats. Since most of the difficult is in the boss I think getting it is the best choice... also for PvP.
If I get the time I'll go to Preview again and post the results in the Library. Sorry for changing the subject of the topic.
it's hard to know so when i tested back in mod 2 i would run CN 10 times or something and follow the results.
Everything you need to know about CW:
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?780981-Chem-s-CW-Compendium-Everything-you-need-to-know
They should have followed the DnD rules & racials to have a better selection for rolling classes, with certain races, again from a min/maxxers view.
Oh and for the guy that says stats from racials make for miniscule damage, that is not true in the least for PvP.
-Kymos
Even from a non-min/maxer's point of view. Not following the PHB on races and classes removed some of the more interesting distinctions.