1. Those thread pale in comparison to other PVP threads asking for more maps, more modes, and ways to set up PMvsPMs. One doesn't even have any responses.
the request for more maps has been answered. modes and ways to set up custom matches have also been acknowledged. i wasn't going to list every thread that had the word 'leaderboard' in it but you're more than welcome to do that search yourself. i set the search to go back six months and earlier.
0
Options
degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
the request for more maps has been answered. modes and ways to set up custom matches have also been acknowledged. i wasn't going to list every thread that had the word 'leaderboard' in it but you're more than welcome to do that search yourself. i set the search to go back six months and earlier.
Melody, I'm not going to argue this point with you. I'm a guild leader of a (mostly) PVP guild, read PVP channels, talk to PVP players, and play a lot of PVP. I know how the Leader Board is affecting the NW PVP community in ways that you cannot know, but you're not a part of it. I'm arguing against the Leader Board because of how it affects players. You're for it, and that's fine.
We'll just agree to disagree. Just know that the people arguing against it have very valid reasons for doing so.
so what you're saying is the majority of players are interested in the leaderboard and adjust their play style to benefit their board placement? if it's something that is detrimental to the game, i haven't seen a whole lot of feedback about it. it seems there is more feedback questioning whether the rating system/matchmaking/leaderboards are working properly.
while i was looking up the exact quote from gentlemancrush, i saw a post from panderus that reiterated what the moderators enforce regularly... and that is respectful and constructive feedback.
we understand people being frustrated but you can't expect anyone to fully understand what you want to express if you're not expressing it in a comprehensive manner.
Most of the feedback is about placement. But people who are concerned with such a thing as K/D ratio will do what they have to in order to keep that number pretty. If a player cares about the leaderboaord, not just placement, they may do things that affect others in a match besides themselves. I.e. KS or play specifically to reduce the amount of times they die. And I'm not saying the majority of players. It doesn't have to be the majority. You basically said that you can choose whether or not you use a feature and it will not affect you if you choose not to use it. Example, I chose not to view the leaderboard and it should not change anything in my QOL. However, unlike GG or foundry, whether I use it or not it can affect me because of other player's behavior. It doesn't have to be the majority, it just has to be enough players to influence my QOL.
this is the explanation provided by the developer gentlemancrush:
This is the explaination Gentle has given BEFORE the command was known to see the hidden numbers.
A Dev is also not free of mistakes and in this case Gentle explainition IS NOT VALID!
I say this again!: due the revealing of the hidden numbers in the leaderboard it was PROVEN that you loose ELO POINTs and not only your ranking.
It has nothing to do with bowrd updates.
Maybe get the facts straight before quoting not-uptodate-posts!
Still angry with such ignorance.
This is the explaination Gentle has given BEFORE the command was known to see the hidden numbers.
A Dev is also not free of mistakes and in this case Gentle explainition IS NOT VALID!
I say this again!: due the revealing of the hidden numbers in the leaderboard it was PROVEN that you loose ELO POINTs and not only your ranking.
It has nothing to do with bowrd updates.
Maybe get the facts straight before quoting not-uptodate-posts!
Still angry with such ignorance.
you're talking about a bug or an exploit that shows proprietary information that was removed from the game... how do you know exactly what these numbers are? how can anyone know what a found command is showing you unless you are a programmer and understand the formulas behind it? your anger with ignorance sounds fueled by a lot of assumption and conjecture.
you're talking about a bug or an exploit that shows proprietary information that was removed from the game... how do you know exactly what these numbers are? how can anyone know what a found command is showing you unless you are a programmer and understand the formulas behind it? your anger with ignorance sounds fueled by a lot of assumption and conjecture.
It is fueled with anget because ur twisting words around until they match ur artificial "facts".
The fix was about not SHOWING them, but that doesnt mean they arent there.
After a match, you could check your ELO rating (and it was the ELO that was displayed! Dont say it was just a number… we are not fools…) and after a win it went down a fix amount. That happened several times everytime after a win against bad players. This was directly connected to a drop in actual leaderboard ranking.
This is a PROVEN FACT! Stating anything other means making a fool out of urself.
Because here it comes: Akromatik stated here in this forum WHY we actually LOOSE ELO POINTS (not only leaderboard ranking).
So it cant beeing a discussion about that matter because loosing ELO points by winning is an OFFICIAL stated reality. Backed up by the expierience of hundreds or even thousands of pvp players, btw.
So, as we clarified that, the discussion is about how meaningfil a leaderboard can be if u loose ELO by winning.
Now Melod has silenced on this matter.
But the facts stand as they are: the pvp leaderboard is completly broken.
Yesterday I won 10 matches in a row with my CW, and I DROPPED dozen of pages.
What is a leaderboard worth that depends on luck against which enemy you are randomized?
0
Options
degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Now Melod has silenced on this matter.
But the facts stand as they are: the pvp leaderboard is completly broken.
Yesterday I won 10 matches in a row with my CW, and I DROPPED dozen of pages.
What is a leaderboard worth that depends on luck against which enemy you are randomized?
Keep in mind, some players have found an way where they don't lose rank. I'm not sure how it's done, but it's clearly working.
As long as premades can fight pugs the leaderboard will be worthless and domination matches wont mean anything.
Why do the devs even allow players to join solo knowing 9 out of 10 matches will be blowouts in favor of premades.
Even queuing as a sub-optimum premade does not help, and in fact can be worse than solo pugging. I've spent the whole week solo pugging and got into a nice run of mostly balanced matches. Then last night I formed a lolgroup with 4 GFs just for fun. We were lucky and were given a geared and smart DC in our first match and it was enough for us to see off a better composition of 2 TRs, an HR, a GWF and a CW. After a big win we queued again as 4 GFs and were then put up against a full guild premade with an HR that sits on page 2. We stood no chance. The four of us were individually not horribly geared, but we are not monsters either. I am a 15k GF and the rest were also in the 14 - 15k range. PVP gear. But against a really geared guild that is communicating and has a good composition of the most effective PVP classes you will get wrecked. And if we are honest the top-end premades are only heading into PVP with the best classes and balanced teams.
TL;DR - Only good, optimum premades queuing will ensure balanced matches and forcing Average Joes to queue as a premade does not guarantee a balanced match and as I experienced will often result in a trainwreck of a match.
PSA: You don't need to grind Spinward Rise for your Elemental artifact main hand if you have some AD lying around. You can craft it via the Tyranny of Dragon's campaign screen.
0
Options
adernathMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I would not be unhappy if the Leaderboard was removed all together and in
it's place a mix of the following suggestions...
A Window with a Chat Lobby where People can set up teams to fight other specific teams.
PvP by Gear score brackets
A better fuctioning ELO WITH Matchmaking system
Ranked - Unranked Matches ( can be done in New PvP window )
Match Type..Domination, Last Man, 3v3, 5v5, Castle Defense, Maze, 20 Man Free for All
Tournaments Similar to March Madness held monthly
Zone Wide, Game Wide, Guild vs Guild ( Everquest had this feature in 1999 )
Yes, I already suggested that the system determines the average gearscore of a player during combat
(this shouldnt be so hard, as the IWD gear actually checks when you are in combat). And based on
that gearscore you will queue in a certain bracket. No ELO rating required.
Another option is, if the playerbase would be too low for the first suggestion, to introduce
standard arena gear without any enchants which you must use in ranked matches (i.e. you can not
unequip this during domination). This would LARGELY improve PvP and people can focus on skill and
class abilities only.
Currently it is a joke, you can have - like me - a toon of 9k GS and it can happen (quite often) that you must face some 16k IW-geared GWF. This is no fun.
Keep the discussion up, perhaps some day the devs have time to take over our suggestions.
Suggestions to improve NW:
- Dualspec
- Better rewarding foundry and foundry pvp maps
- Custom PvP leagues with leaderboards instead of the current 'matchmaking'.
- Armory
- make jumping cost stamina (to reduce hopping in pvp)
I made several posts outlining necessary changes to CW. The leaderboard supports my arguments and conclusions in every way. And will continue to do so UNTIL the DEVS fix the class imbalance.
I made several posts outlining necessary changes to CW. The leaderboard supports my arguments and conclusions in every way. And will continue to do so UNTIL the DEVS fix the class imbalance.
cheers
Yeah no need to bring up the TR because they got done raw with a strap on in Mod 4....
CW = CONTROL wizard...not DPS wizard... If you didnt understand that going into this game then the only things to blame here is your own choices.
Cryptic better start looking into fixing things in pvp so the matches are more balanced.
Ive been playing pvp in MMOs since Ultima online and havent stopped.
It seems every MMO company can't figure how to balance or please the PVP community and the pvp community ends up moving on.
We are at that crossroads now.
Once it stops being fun people stop playing.
Its already starting to look like a small handful of elites are chasing all other players from the game and eventually all there will be is a small handful of elites left playing the pvp section of this game.
Yeah and if they do get one competitive enemy in opposite team they just ZERG him/her. Honestly, there should be a separate q and learder board for premades and solo pugs at least.
I understand the concept of allowing premades to queue (so you can play with friends/guildies) but either place premades against each other or disable the function entirely. I think it's messing up the ELO system and also making PvP facestomp easy for those who commonly queue in premades.
It just makes queuing solo so difficult, for those who are really good and those who are new.
I understand the concept of allowing premades to queue (so you can play with friends/guildies) but either place premades against each other or disable the function entirely.
I don't wanna be put against a 18k superman pre-made with my pre-made consisting of friends @ 13k GS on average.
This just sucks, sorry. No fun at all.
Two different ques. One for Champion Ranked pvp with separate leader board. If you choose the Champion Ranked Pvp que, earn more glory amongst other rewards if you are ranked up on the leader board.
The second one is Intermediate Ranked Pvp. Different leader board for this rank but you don't get the better rewards. You just get to farm for glory.
There's no way to stop people from taking off gear before the battle then putting on different gear so gear check won't help. The elite pvpers always want better rewards. Rewards included should be chance to receive a bag of goodies for 1-3 on the pvp chart at the end of the match. In this bag could be some rank4-5 enchants, more glory, silver. On Monday or Tuesday, reward those who are on pages 1-3 with bag of goodies with better rewards.
No elite pvper would want to waste their time in Intermediate lvl 60 battle zones. They may occasionally to have a good laugh but it will be a big joke on them because they could have been farming Champion Ranked Pvp instead.
I do great in pvp but I didn't and still don't want a leaderboard because it doesn't prove anything and instead of being able to just enjoy the pvp now I get so frustrated when I get a weak player on my team when before I wouldn't have cared and now its more like work than fun....
Leaderboards don't even show skill, I seen this when I played on my 9k gs cleric and my whole team was under 11k gs and we fought the player who was 3rd on leaderboards....wth ? that one guy could have killed our whole team by himself but to make it even worse he had his guild friends and we just got massacred. No wonder people high on leaderboards have about 7k kills and only a few deaths because they seem to get weak players a lot.
Working as intended. This is also the reason ALL the really active PvP guilds that run nothing but premades are Delzoun. If half were Lauskan and half Delzoun then they would be able to que fairly and have to put effort into earning their positions.
Meanwhile they all remain in one camp and have ridiculous que times until they finally get paired with nothing GS players just get them out of the que. You didn't think these guys getting paired with much weaker players was an accident did you?
Working as intended. This is also the reason ALL the really active PvP guilds that run nothing but premades are Delzoun. If half were Lauskan and half Delzoun then they would be able to que fairly and have to put effort into earning their positions.
Meanwhile they all remain in one camp and have ridiculous que times until they finally get paired with nothing GS players just get them out of the que. You didn't think these guys getting paired with much weaker players was an accident did you?
The PvP guilds are Luskan. When they queue up, Delz spend their time in spawn
Control wizards LACK control. They cannot control, and it is BY GAME DESIGN. GWF's can pop unstoppable, and go ha-ha, can't control me. GF's just shrug their shoulders, lift their shields, and shrug off damage and control. TR's are either invisible and cannot be targeted or pop Impossible to Catch and go for about 5 secs of killing the CW. DC's I'm not sure of the mechanic, but I've seen them ignore Entangling Force.
There seems to be some build that allows HR's stealth much like a TR. Have to research that one, but bottom line I've been attacked by an HR just like a TR would. Didn't think that was possible. Anyway, I know that HR's have CC resists.
All of this adds up to ONE thing... Control Wizards are NOT controllers. Not in any sense of the word. And UNTIL CW's are given PENETRATING, LASTING, ALWAYS FUNCTIONING control powers, ideally thru a three or four tiered feat in basic feat bracket, CW's will NOT be controllers. Because EVERY SINGLE CLASS CAN TOTALLY IGNORE THEIR EXISTING CONTROLS BY GAME DESIGN.
Contrast this with the fact that the CW does NOT have say, See Invisible. Say a range of 20 feet or so, so a TR could get close, but then AH HA, a CONTROL WIZARD has the INNATE ability to pierce illusions and see hidden things, because they are a Form of Control.
Or the fact that blink/combat teleport is only 25 feet. As a CW, I CANNOT break contact w/ a TR, or a GF, or a GWF. BY DESIGN. Can't do it. I can fire off three blinks in a row, that's it. GWF's and TR's run too fast, and GF's just jump to you, since you are NOT moving far enough away.
Bottom line is that the way the GAME is set up now, CW's in PvP are everyone's favorite target and punching bag. In the last week I have had THREE separate GWF's stop fighting whomever they were at the time, turn around and charge ME, ignoring the GWF or TR or DC that they WERE fighting.
And they ALL killed me, just so we're clear. That with me desperately blinking away, trying to slow them, with ANOTHER MEMBER of MY TEAM chasing them and trying to attack them. THIS HAS TO STOP. CW'S NEED PENTRATING BINDING CONTROL. Otherwise it's just a title.
cheerio
0
Options
degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited August 2014
Agreed. Currently, CWs have very poor control. Mod 4 will change things so, especially for Oppressors. We'll see how it plays out. I imagine a lot of QQ about CWs on the forums.
So, I have been pretty much against getting rid of the leaderboard from the start, but I did have an interesting situation come up last night that made me re-think my position. I was in a Domination match with a few of my guild mates and one random player. The group we were up against was pretty evenly matched with us, but there came a point where it was clear that the scales were tipping on our side. We had two bases covered and were fighting at the middle point which ended up in a four on one against one of the other team's HRs. In the middle of the fight, he disappeared. Clearly disconnected. His whole team was gone within a few seconds after that.
The thing is, that the HR held the current number one ranking on the leaderboards (or at least did last night). While correlation does not necessarily imply causation, it's not hard to imagine a scenario in which that team was pre-made, saw that they were going to lose, and disconnected en masse in order to avoid taking the loss. I realize that disabling the leaderboard would probably not change this kind of behavior, but if a person couldn't see that they were going to lose their ranking, they might not bail out of a fight just to protect their stats.
Perhaps the leaderboard should be replaced so that it doesn't rank you in total against all other players, but instead ranks you in categories. Most kills, most assists, most points captured/defended, etc. I'm just spit balling, but taking away visibility on an overall ranking might have changed that fight quite dramatically last night.
Comments
the request for more maps has been answered. modes and ways to set up custom matches have also been acknowledged. i wasn't going to list every thread that had the word 'leaderboard' in it but you're more than welcome to do that search yourself. i set the search to go back six months and earlier.
Melody, I'm not going to argue this point with you. I'm a guild leader of a (mostly) PVP guild, read PVP channels, talk to PVP players, and play a lot of PVP. I know how the Leader Board is affecting the NW PVP community in ways that you cannot know, but you're not a part of it. I'm arguing against the Leader Board because of how it affects players. You're for it, and that's fine.
We'll just agree to disagree. Just know that the people arguing against it have very valid reasons for doing so.
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
Most of the feedback is about placement. But people who are concerned with such a thing as K/D ratio will do what they have to in order to keep that number pretty. If a player cares about the leaderboaord, not just placement, they may do things that affect others in a match besides themselves. I.e. KS or play specifically to reduce the amount of times they die. And I'm not saying the majority of players. It doesn't have to be the majority. You basically said that you can choose whether or not you use a feature and it will not affect you if you choose not to use it. Example, I chose not to view the leaderboard and it should not change anything in my QOL. However, unlike GG or foundry, whether I use it or not it can affect me because of other player's behavior. It doesn't have to be the majority, it just has to be enough players to influence my QOL.
This is the explaination Gentle has given BEFORE the command was known to see the hidden numbers.
A Dev is also not free of mistakes and in this case Gentle explainition IS NOT VALID!
I say this again!: due the revealing of the hidden numbers in the leaderboard it was PROVEN that you loose ELO POINTs and not only your ranking.
It has nothing to do with bowrd updates.
Maybe get the facts straight before quoting not-uptodate-posts!
Still angry with such ignorance.
you're talking about a bug or an exploit that shows proprietary information that was removed from the game... how do you know exactly what these numbers are? how can anyone know what a found command is showing you unless you are a programmer and understand the formulas behind it? your anger with ignorance sounds fueled by a lot of assumption and conjecture.
It is fueled with anget because ur twisting words around until they match ur artificial "facts".
The fix was about not SHOWING them, but that doesnt mean they arent there.
After a match, you could check your ELO rating (and it was the ELO that was displayed! Dont say it was just a number… we are not fools…) and after a win it went down a fix amount. That happened several times everytime after a win against bad players. This was directly connected to a drop in actual leaderboard ranking.
This is a PROVEN FACT! Stating anything other means making a fool out of urself.
Because here it comes: Akromatik stated here in this forum WHY we actually LOOSE ELO POINTS (not only leaderboard ranking).
So it cant beeing a discussion about that matter because loosing ELO points by winning is an OFFICIAL stated reality. Backed up by the expierience of hundreds or even thousands of pvp players, btw.
So, as we clarified that, the discussion is about how meaningfil a leaderboard can be if u loose ELO by winning.
But the facts stand as they are: the pvp leaderboard is completly broken.
Yesterday I won 10 matches in a row with my CW, and I DROPPED dozen of pages.
What is a leaderboard worth that depends on luck against which enemy you are randomized?
Keep in mind, some players have found an way where they don't lose rank. I'm not sure how it's done, but it's clearly working.
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
CW GF DC don't have a pot to <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> in.
Solo queue players arnt included either.
Every once in a while you will see a DC of a CW that only runs premades that get high ranks,but they NEVER solo queue.
Ive seen these guys wait hours to get thier perfect pvp group and if they dont find it they dont play the game.
If you dont run those 3 classes or run a premade dont even bother looking at the leader board its ONLY for them.
Why do the devs even allow players to join solo knowing 9 out of 10 matches will be blowouts in favor of premades.
What sucks is when i run premade im bored to death 9 outa 10 matches are total blowouts.
Any hardcore premade has got to be at their wits end with easy non challenging matches watching their score on the leaderboard go down when they win.
So either way its just broken mechanics.
separate the queues.
or admit you cant.
I would have to say as it is if my team wins its a blowout 90% of the time and we stand around waiting for the game to end.
and if we loose its a blowout 90% of the time and we stand around waiting for the game to end.
Lots of standing around waiting for the game to end
Even queuing as a sub-optimum premade does not help, and in fact can be worse than solo pugging. I've spent the whole week solo pugging and got into a nice run of mostly balanced matches. Then last night I formed a lolgroup with 4 GFs just for fun. We were lucky and were given a geared and smart DC in our first match and it was enough for us to see off a better composition of 2 TRs, an HR, a GWF and a CW. After a big win we queued again as 4 GFs and were then put up against a full guild premade with an HR that sits on page 2. We stood no chance. The four of us were individually not horribly geared, but we are not monsters either. I am a 15k GF and the rest were also in the 14 - 15k range. PVP gear. But against a really geared guild that is communicating and has a good composition of the most effective PVP classes you will get wrecked. And if we are honest the top-end premades are only heading into PVP with the best classes and balanced teams.
TL;DR - Only good, optimum premades queuing will ensure balanced matches and forcing Average Joes to queue as a premade does not guarantee a balanced match and as I experienced will often result in a trainwreck of a match.
Yes, I already suggested that the system determines the average gearscore of a player during combat
(this shouldnt be so hard, as the IWD gear actually checks when you are in combat). And based on
that gearscore you will queue in a certain bracket. No ELO rating required.
Another option is, if the playerbase would be too low for the first suggestion, to introduce
standard arena gear without any enchants which you must use in ranked matches (i.e. you can not
unequip this during domination). This would LARGELY improve PvP and people can focus on skill and
class abilities only.
Currently it is a joke, you can have - like me - a toon of 9k GS and it can happen (quite often) that you must face some 16k IW-geared GWF. This is no fun.
I have already discussed the current situation in this thread
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?718101-Matchmaking-overwork
Keep the discussion up, perhaps some day the devs have time to take over our suggestions.
- Dualspec
- Better rewarding foundry and foundry pvp maps
- Custom PvP leagues with leaderboards instead of the current 'matchmaking'.
- Armory
- make jumping cost stamina (to reduce hopping in pvp)
You should exercise your brain better. What the leaderboard is showing is the total dominance of TR, GWF, and HR. See thread http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?706631-Cut-the-CC-out-of-pvp-This-is-getting-stupid
I made several posts outlining necessary changes to CW. The leaderboard supports my arguments and conclusions in every way. And will continue to do so UNTIL the DEVS fix the class imbalance.
cheers
Yeah no need to bring up the TR because they got done raw with a strap on in Mod 4....
CW = CONTROL wizard...not DPS wizard... If you didnt understand that going into this game then the only things to blame here is your own choices.
Ive been playing pvp in MMOs since Ultima online and havent stopped.
It seems every MMO company can't figure how to balance or please the PVP community and the pvp community ends up moving on.
We are at that crossroads now.
Once it stops being fun people stop playing.
Its already starting to look like a small handful of elites are chasing all other players from the game and eventually all there will be is a small handful of elites left playing the pvp section of this game.
Dam ive seen it so many times.
Hope they can fix it before its to late.
Absolutely!
It just makes queuing solo so difficult, for those who are really good and those who are new.
I don't wanna be put against a 18k superman pre-made with my pre-made consisting of friends @ 13k GS on average.
This just sucks, sorry. No fun at all.
Two different ques. One for Champion Ranked pvp with separate leader board. If you choose the Champion Ranked Pvp que, earn more glory amongst other rewards if you are ranked up on the leader board.
The second one is Intermediate Ranked Pvp. Different leader board for this rank but you don't get the better rewards. You just get to farm for glory.
There's no way to stop people from taking off gear before the battle then putting on different gear so gear check won't help. The elite pvpers always want better rewards. Rewards included should be chance to receive a bag of goodies for 1-3 on the pvp chart at the end of the match. In this bag could be some rank4-5 enchants, more glory, silver. On Monday or Tuesday, reward those who are on pages 1-3 with bag of goodies with better rewards.
No elite pvper would want to waste their time in Intermediate lvl 60 battle zones. They may occasionally to have a good laugh but it will be a big joke on them because they could have been farming Champion Ranked Pvp instead.
Working as intended. This is also the reason ALL the really active PvP guilds that run nothing but premades are Delzoun. If half were Lauskan and half Delzoun then they would be able to que fairly and have to put effort into earning their positions.
Meanwhile they all remain in one camp and have ridiculous que times until they finally get paired with nothing GS players just get them out of the que. You didn't think these guys getting paired with much weaker players was an accident did you?
The PvP guilds are Luskan. When they queue up, Delz spend their time in spawn
do you have a link to this? the only explanation i'm aware of came from gentlemancrush.
Here it be - http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?707131-Are-We-Sure-the-ELO-System-is-Working&p=8414391#post8414391
Hmm. I seem to remember having written a reply to this before. How odd. Anyway, I refer again to the thread http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?706631-Cut-the-CC-out-of-pvp-This-is-getting-stupid/page2
Control wizards LACK control. They cannot control, and it is BY GAME DESIGN. GWF's can pop unstoppable, and go ha-ha, can't control me. GF's just shrug their shoulders, lift their shields, and shrug off damage and control. TR's are either invisible and cannot be targeted or pop Impossible to Catch and go for about 5 secs of killing the CW. DC's I'm not sure of the mechanic, but I've seen them ignore Entangling Force.
There seems to be some build that allows HR's stealth much like a TR. Have to research that one, but bottom line I've been attacked by an HR just like a TR would. Didn't think that was possible. Anyway, I know that HR's have CC resists.
All of this adds up to ONE thing... Control Wizards are NOT controllers. Not in any sense of the word. And UNTIL CW's are given PENETRATING, LASTING, ALWAYS FUNCTIONING control powers, ideally thru a three or four tiered feat in basic feat bracket, CW's will NOT be controllers. Because EVERY SINGLE CLASS CAN TOTALLY IGNORE THEIR EXISTING CONTROLS BY GAME DESIGN.
Contrast this with the fact that the CW does NOT have say, See Invisible. Say a range of 20 feet or so, so a TR could get close, but then AH HA, a CONTROL WIZARD has the INNATE ability to pierce illusions and see hidden things, because they are a Form of Control.
Or the fact that blink/combat teleport is only 25 feet. As a CW, I CANNOT break contact w/ a TR, or a GF, or a GWF. BY DESIGN. Can't do it. I can fire off three blinks in a row, that's it. GWF's and TR's run too fast, and GF's just jump to you, since you are NOT moving far enough away.
Bottom line is that the way the GAME is set up now, CW's in PvP are everyone's favorite target and punching bag. In the last week I have had THREE separate GWF's stop fighting whomever they were at the time, turn around and charge ME, ignoring the GWF or TR or DC that they WERE fighting.
And they ALL killed me, just so we're clear. That with me desperately blinking away, trying to slow them, with ANOTHER MEMBER of MY TEAM chasing them and trying to attack them. THIS HAS TO STOP. CW'S NEED PENTRATING BINDING CONTROL. Otherwise it's just a title.
cheerio
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
The thing is, that the HR held the current number one ranking on the leaderboards (or at least did last night). While correlation does not necessarily imply causation, it's not hard to imagine a scenario in which that team was pre-made, saw that they were going to lose, and disconnected en masse in order to avoid taking the loss. I realize that disabling the leaderboard would probably not change this kind of behavior, but if a person couldn't see that they were going to lose their ranking, they might not bail out of a fight just to protect their stats.
Perhaps the leaderboard should be replaced so that it doesn't rank you in total against all other players, but instead ranks you in categories. Most kills, most assists, most points captured/defended, etc. I'm just spit balling, but taking away visibility on an overall ranking might have changed that fight quite dramatically last night.