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How active are the Gods?
caelith
Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 66
I was wondering how active the Gods are, do they speak to and help out their followers? or are the more passive and quite?
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((The gods don't play a role in game mechanics at this time. In lore though, they're very much active... always meddling in the affairs of mortals, trying to gain dominance over the Realms and allying with and battling with other gods. They meddle in their own Astral Realms and in the mortal Realms, either through followers, their servants, their Avatar Forums, or other ways of divine influence.))
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Thanks for the info, makes writting a background for a character a bit easier lol.
Would be interesting to see your chosen God take some sort of role in game, even if it was just a quest for a cloak or something.
I dunno, I'd say sending random followers on an epic quest to kill the (admittedly evil) leader of a foreign civilisation could be classed as meddling.
Well my definition of meddling is being a nuisance.
Gandalf is often accused of "meddling" or being "meddlesome."
The gods are not supposed to, in general, interfere (meddle) with the lives or actions of mortals. The gods are supposed to remain completely laissez faire with the concerns of mortals. in other words divine intervention is generally not something which is supposed to occur and in fact can no longer directly occur.
For one, and I'm surprised that Zeb left this part out, due to a ruling by Lord Ao the gods can no longer leave their home realms lest their home realm (and their divinity?) will cease to exist. So, at least until the Sundering, the gods actually only meddle in indirect fashions such as through their personal servants.
As far as I'm aware Gandalf does nothing but good.
Well I haven't read anywhere that the gods aren't supposed to get involved in the affairs of humanoids and humans. Putting that aside that doesn't fit my defintion and I don't think it fits the definition which you posted. You can't say it doesn't concern them because they helped create the universe. I don't think you can accuse deities such as Selune and Eilastree and Corelian ( I may have spelt their names wrong I'm just too tired right now to check spelling) of being unduly involved when they're protecting their people and saving lives. In saying that there are a lot of gods and you may find some examples which are appropriate.
By the way don't think I can read anything in that link that says Ao ordered gods not to leave realms and also not sure if that means they can't get involved.
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There is absolutely no correlation between "meddling" and "evil."
"Always you must meddle!" - Saruman
Indeed indeed! They meddle all the time but no longer in corporeal form on the PMT. That was more to point out that the following interation is no longer possible
I can't see anything in you're defintion that I can see that applies to gandalf, if there is please elaborate. I'm also having a hard time taking Saruman's opinions seriously. That's like Lex Luthor saying Superman is a nuisance.
Gandalf is a "Meddling Wizard." Elminster is a "Meddling Wizard."
They are both called meddling so many times in the books that it could be their middle names. Those character's sole purposes are to meddle and ruffle the feathers of mortals. They exist to stir the pot and cause changes to happen.
Case example is the fact Gandalf goes out of his way to push Bilbo out the door.
"Before you showed up we Bagginses were very well though of...you have officially been labelled a disturber of the peace!"
However, to put a nail in this coffin...
"Those meddling kids"
Meddling is interfering where you are unwanted, unneeded or not permitted. Even if a good god interferes with mortal affairs they are meddling. Just because you are meddling doesn't mean it is bad, it could have a very good outcome, but the gods are not supposed to be interfering in mortal affairs at all.
The gods are always meddling when they interfere in mortal business whether the help is wanted or not.
I don't care how many times they get called that what's important is that it fits my defintion and the one you posted.
You're using that as an example? When I clicked it I didn't see anything.
.....are you for real, you consider that a point?
Well yea if you're not needed or permitted that could be meddling not neccesarily if you're unwanted, and interfering is subjective. However still haven't seen any examples from you of gods meddling.
I dunno I thought it would be a good thing for a good god to interfere every once in a while...I guess I'm wrong.
Still haven't seen any proof for that.
Oh I see, so if you want somebody to get involved or not it's still meddling...I see. Look man I think I'm done with this thread you're not providing any proof to back up you're point and you're also being very liberal with the definition of meddling. I got my definition and you posted a defintion nothing you posted contradicts them.
Meddle: to interfere in or busy oneself unduly with something that is not one's concern.
The problem I'm having is that the gods helped create the universe how can you say getting involved with mortals doesn't concern them? Maybe there are example of them doing things unduly but you haven't provided any examples just statements from you and people not actual examples. It pretty much looks like the gods I mentioned are essential in helping mortals, so you can't say they're doing things unduly.
As for Gandalf it's been a long time since I read the Hobbit but I know in the Lord Of The Rings the events where going to effect the whole world, Gandalf is a part of the world so he had to get involved, especially since he's wiser and more powerful than others. Since he was pretty much instrumental in saving middle earth you can't say he got unduly involved. Taking that into account he probably got involved with the Hobbits and the dwarves for a good reason based on what we know about him.
Look to be quite honest you could probably find some examples of gods doing things that may fit into the definition of meddling I just don't like how you're going about proving your point and I don't think this discussion is going anywhere, so I'm out.
And accept that your definition of meddling is incorrect.
The gods meddle. Evil or good they meddle.
If you can't accept that after everything others and I have said then this is pointless and you are simply stubbornly ignoring everything except your own inaccurate perception rather than accepting the truth of the matter.
If you really want to argue it send a letter to Ed Greewood in which he'll say exactly what I have. The gods are above mortals and aren't supposed to interfere in their affairs. When they do (as they quite often do) it's meddling because the affairs of mortals are supposed to remain mortals.
If you have a problem with the terms that every author in the entire Forgotten Realms uses to describe the gods take it up with the creators. This is not up for debate. It's fact. The gods meddle. Any Forgotten Realms deity lore will point blank tell you that regardless of whether you agree with the use or not.
Void Reaper - 60 CW
Eliza Trickfoot - 60 TR
Scarlet Maiden - 60 DC
Timmy Orc-Bane - 60 GWF
Ranger Jo - 20 HR
God's would meddle (get involved, whatever you want to call it) in mortal affairs through their clergy, there are probably a good few written quests you can buy which revolve around, or include that.
As to answering caelith's primary question: gods of Faerun and Forgotten Realms in all are really active with the people. It could be seen in micro cases (like when they not only personally speak with their respective 'chosen ones' but practically inhabit their minds and souls to some degree in certain cases) and macro scales (like when due to their ploys a whole civilizations get 'changed' in a matter of time not even equal to half of most of olden races lifespans.)
Good example of micro-meddling (yes I'll use this word, sorry nordveig: let me explain it a bit later
On the bigger ones side are surely mentioned Times of Troubles when quite many gods appeard in mortal realm pretty much 'in person' to wage wars against each-other, in process killing off a large group of themselves and putting whole mortal realm in turmoil. Though this is a bit in the past now. More recent would be a so-called 'Game of Sava' played by Lloth and her daughter Eilistraee which resulted in slaying pretty much whole drow pantheon of gods beside Lloth herself and maybe Ghaunadaur, who lets say: lost interest in drow race and decided to leave their pantheon. Also about 20% of drow race which up this point was considered virtually 'evil' got redeemed (I know there were some exceptions Drizzt , I know). Also You seen spellplague abominations? What if I say they're but a fracture of 'what happened' after lady Mystra was slain quite recently? Yep, more or less deep s... you-know-what happened once our dear patron of magic was killed in the ploy put by other god. Many major mages 'all around the world' just lost their lives or mind in a blink of an eye, and then some headless 18 feet tall abominations and flying blue eyes started to roam our poor streets *sigh*... gods... wth were U thinking?!
As you can see the gods are here meddlesome as hell and even the good ones. Yes, yes: good ones as well! (after all Eilistraee was)
I do probably know from where nordveig is coming though. I did play some RPG forums with many kinds of people and some consider 'meddling' as something bad by nature. As the description provided says, it's surely not entirely good as it's at least not a 'good manner' thing
Hope it explains a few bits from my inexperienced and shabby side and will help yaa with the bg story of your character. In fact: CALL ME (PM) ONCE IT'S FINISHED! I would love to see and review it for yaa, and no worries I don't bite (if you give me waffles that is) so I would put only praise and creative ideas on it!
Yours sincerely - Angry Neko Elf
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Well, I remember that certain Clerics couldn't use edged weapons because their particular god had a rule against spilling blood, while others required you not harm specific animals, or refrain from certain acts, etc...
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. . . . . In 4th edition, weapon and armor restrictions have pretty much been abolished or left up to the DM to decide and dictate. Other quirks still exist, like it being a "sin" for a follower of Lolth to kill a spider, for example.
. . . . . I list of 4th Edition FR gods and other beings can be found in The Grimoire of Time as well as the tellings of The Sunderings.
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Around 1480 DR, the Spellplague is no more. Bhaal, Mystra and Mask have returned to life.
In 1484, Lolth tries to become the new goddess of magic through the creation of a Demon Weave, but fails.
By 1486 DR, there are a lot of Chosen of every god, and they all are being hunted by Netheril.