pers3phoneBanned Users, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited October 2013
Repel is situational for me too. Not to mention I hate when it gets "resisted". Somebody here said on Tab Repel has shorter CD, I verified and it's not the case.
Problem is, on Tab IR has so much more bonus damage which you'll miss... I know some of the best mages play with SotEA on Tab but I find it extremely inconvenient, because shard evaporates whenever you get the smallest CC, and it's also quite easy to dodge, and the combos are predictable if you pay attention. However, when it works... it works very good. It's worth considering when they fix the CC issue.
The last days, I've been so frustrated about Repel failing in random times (even when I hit, the player would move so little that it felt like I wasted a cast), that I went with IR tab, and replaced Repel with Ray of Enfeeblement, leaving Entangling force and Chill strike as my other encounters. It feels ok, but I have to be extra careful on my kiting and pillar hugging.
* Notorious Dwarven Bear Cavalry Leader *
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degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Repel is situational for me too. Not to mention I hate when it gets "resisted". Somebody here said on Tab Repel has shorter CD, I verified and it's not the case.
Problem is, on Tab IR has so much more bonus damage which you'll miss... I know some of the best mages play with SotEA on Tab but I find it extremely inconvenient, because shard evaporates whenever you get the smallest CC, and it's also quite easy to dodge, and the combos are predictable if you pay attention. However, when it works... it works very good. It's worth considering when they fix the CC issue.
As a Renegade, I don't have Snap Freeze. My Icy Rays on Tab does around 9k-10k damage with a crit, and I have a Perfect Vorpal, 13.4 GS and all Rank 8s. I simply run Chill Strike as another encounter (crits for 8k-10k), so I really don't miss it. Plus, Chill Strike has a much shorter cool down. Yesterday we had a match with three heavily geared TRs. I switched to Shield on Tab and did just fine. That being said, there are other ways to run Spell Mastery. I may use Icy Rays if I have a match with two or more GFs. I only know a handful of mages who can successfully pull off SoTEA in PVP. It's slow, bulky, very easy to interrupt and has a long cool down. Some wizards swear by it. Personally, I love them dropping the Shard, and then I CC them and watch it disappear. Good fun!
What I love, love, love about CWs is that every Feat Tree is viable in PVP, which cannot be said about some of the other classes. Thaums have great burst damage with IRs. Oppressors have insane CC. Renegades have increased AP gain and crit severity.
As a Renegade, I don't have Snap Freeze. My Icy Rays on Tab does around 9k-10k damage with a crit, and I have a Perfect Vorpal, 13.4 GS and all Rank 8s.
I'm rene too, with G. vorpal and not-so-geared as you, 2000-ish ArP in PvP. The usual CS-EF-RoE-IR combo hits for up to 15K (the IR crit) on squishies (HV set), obviously less on armored guys. Give it another shot maybe, I'm sure you'll hit much harder
Keep in mind CW's role of CC'ing and bursting priority targets.
#1 target - other CW's
#2 target - DC
#3 target - focusing tankier characters with support
Repel has a negative effect when trying to focus GWF/GF, you push them out of range of your melee teammates. So given that this is your last target priority AND that when you finally get to that target it's counter productive repel is fairly useless outside of the 1v1 arena. For 1v1 obviously it's about the best skill we have.
Repel on tab may be neat that you can push groups off of points for 2-3 seconds but look at what you are losing for that utility. 2 consecutive prones and 10-14k damage on a crit on a single target, or instant prone of 2-5 characters with 10k damage on a crit to every one of them if they are standing close together. Obviously talking about shard here.
Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
As a Renegade, I don't have Snap Freeze. My Icy Rays on Tab does around 9k-10k damage with a crit, and I have a Perfect Vorpal, 13.4 GS and all Rank 8s. I simply run Chill Strike as another encounter (crits for 8k-10k), so I really don't miss it. Plus, Chill Strike has a much shorter cool down. Yesterday we had a match with three heavily geared TRs. I switched to Shield on Tab and did just fine. That being said, there are other ways to run Spell Mastery. I may use Icy Rays if I have a match with two or more GFs. I only know a handful of mages who can successfully pull off SoTEA in PVP. It's slow, bulky, very easy to interrupt and has a long cool down. Some wizards swear by it. Personally, I love them dropping the Shard, and then I CC them and watch it disappear. Good fun!
What I love, love, love about CWs is that every Feat Tree is viable in PVP, which cannot be said about some of the other classes. Thaums have great burst damage with IRs. Oppressors have insane CC. Renegades have increased AP gain and crit severity.
I still don't think that Snap Freeze does a thing for IR. I've tried it and found no difference in performance or in the tooltip damage (Chill Strike, for example, actually shows increased tooltip damage when you have Snap Freeze). It's the Transcended Master feat that ramps up IR damage.
SotEA is amazing, but situational. I often run it on my other CW because she's not highly geared or specced for huge burst like Testament is, so it's fun to try alternative strategies. It's a steamroller against teams with poor range and mobility, especially if you anticipate them correctly. If I'm up against a team with 2 or more CWs who seem to be decent or at least smart enough to pick my CW out for CC, I usually forego the Shard and go back to trusty IR.
Keep in mind CW's role of CC'ing and bursting priority targets.
#1 target - other CW's
#2 target - DC
#3 target - focusing tankier characters with support
Repel has a negative effect when trying to focus GWF/GF, you push them out of range of your melee teammates. So given that this is your last target priority AND that when you finally get to that target it's counter productive repel is fairly useless outside of the 1v1 arena. For 1v1 obviously it's about the best skill we have.
Repel on tab may be neat that you can push groups off of points for 2-3 seconds but look at what you are losing for that utility. 2 consecutive prones and 10-14k damage on a crit on a single target, or instant prone of 2-5 characters with 10k damage on a crit to every one of them if they are standing close together. Obviously talking about shard here.
Different play styles here... This is domination PVP. My goal is node control. Repel is amazing for that. Mind you, I strive to discern when to use it best. Why would I use Repel if I see 3 of my teammates pounding a GF? I'm not going to repel him away. Now, what about a DC camping out in their A. Shield that just dropped? Heck yes! Repel out, choke, and let the melee have their way. Also, Repel is a stun and an interrupt. It also has a 6 second cool down!
Now some wizard's swear by SoTEA. Use it, use it, use it! It's not my style. Too slow, too bulky, and too long of a cool down. It does not work on...
1) GFs blocking
2) Rogues in ITC and
3) GWFs in Unstoppable.
It's also very easy to interrupt.
In regard to Icy Rays: Love that skill. When I was a Thaum/Oppressor spec I used it like crazy. I still slot it from time to time. I simply prefer Chill Strike because of it's faster cool down and similar damage. I can more easily keep up HV stacks, too. To each their own. As long as you play your CW well, I have mad respect for you.
I guess that if you are going to run IR, then better put it on tab. Same with Repel
* Notorious Dwarven Bear Cavalry Leader *
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degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited October 2013
Okay, finally got a video up of Sentinel dueling in a real PVP match. It's not perfectly clean duels, because in real PVP players are coming and going all the time. But there were a few spots where Swordfish and I got a little 1-on-1 time.
Not my best playing, and not the best tactics, but a fun, quick match regardless.
Also, scroll ahead to around 11 minutes and you'll see a good example of why I use Repel on Tab. I kited a GF and GWF for a bit with it.
Also, scroll ahead to around 11 minutes and you'll see a good example of why I use Repel on Tab. I kited a GF and GWF for a bit with it.
Cool vids, man, really=) But repel on tab, as renegade with HV, meh... I mean, forgive me my criticism and off-topic (I wrote the same comment on youtube), but why not smth else? I mean, u still can have repel and in 90% cases its exactly the same functionality as tabbed.
For example, EF on tab. Hell! For HV rene its like legit hax (as far as I realize it). Its +50% damage and stun duration - already not taht bad. But, on top of that, when you touch nearby enemies with aoe it regen sick amount of AP, gives 1 stack of HV buff for each target - its only way to get more than one stack of HV buff in pvp, i guess, and 3 stacks ~10% bonus dmg res. It gives 1 stack of HV debuff on affected targets, which helps in mid teamfights. And, ofc, it builds arcane presence stacks, one per target affected. (I guess x5 stacked rene's RoE hits around twice harder than 0 stacked)
Note: All of the above was totally IMO. I'm using it in my rotation as opressor and find extremely strong. And i'm talking about pure utility, since oppressors dont give a $hit about arcane stacks. While for rene it's obvious damage booster.
Cool vids, man, really=) But repel on tab, as renegade with HV, meh... I mean, forgive me my criticism and off-topic (I wrote the same comment on youtube), but why not smth else? I mean, u still can have repel and in 90% cases its exactly the same functionality as tabbed.
For example, EF on tab. Hell! For HV rene its like legit hax (as far as I realize it). Its +50% damage and stun duration - already not taht bad. But, on top of that, when you touch nearby enemies with aoe it regen sick amount of AP, gives 1 stack of HV buff for each target - its only way to get more than one stack of HV buff in pvp, i guess, and 3 stacks ~10% bonus dmg res. It gives 1 stack of HV debuff on affected targets, which helps in mid teamfights. And, ofc, it builds arcane presence stacks, one per target affected. (I guess x5 stacked rene's RoE hits around twice harder than 0 stacked)
Note: All of the above was totally IMO. I'm using it in my rotation as opressor and find extremely strong. And i'm talking about pure utility, since oppressors dont give a $hit about arcane stacks. While for rene it's obvious damage booster.
A few reasons why I wouldn't run EF on Tab. In PVE, I want all my enemies grouped together. In PVP, I want all of my enemies apart (divide and conquer). Building AP is not an issue and, like Repel, EF on Tab really has the same utility as it off Tab.
It's just preference. I've played around with a lot of builds, feats, powers and passives. So yeah, it's just what I prefer. Thanks for the feedback.
Don't forget that Repel on tab is also incredibly effective against people who actually use their brains in PvP, since positioning plays a key role in this game whether you PvE or PvP. Anyway these people are much more dangerous than your run-of-the-mill "I'll just run to 2 and try to kill anyone in my way" players. These people actually play to win. Note that the PvP set also decreases the cooldown of tabbed Repel.
Mages sniping from elevated areas has already been mentioned. Others include: survivability-specced GWFs who try to make a run for your 1, forcing your team to split up; good GFs who try to do the same; good GF/cleric combos; multiple cleric combos (all stacking a ridiculous amount of HP/deflect/defense/regen).
Bottomline is that pushing these people away from points/delaying their progress/forcibly splitting them up is, more often than not, a much more effective strategy than just outright attacking/engaging them. Tabbed Repel can help you do all that, allowing you to slot any 3 other powers.
On topic knowing how to kill players while using tabbed Repel is certainly a good skill to have. Even if it happens very rarely, if you PvP a lot you will find yourself in a match where tabbing Repel seems like the best counter to your opponent's tactics.
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degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Off topic, but about tabbed Repel in general:
Note that the PvP set also decreases the cooldown of tabbed Repel.
Thanks for the response, trytallow. Of course I agree with your post. Again, it's not for everyone, but I've found it very effective in PVP.
I tried the PVP set with Repel on Tab. Because the cooldown is already so short (6-7 seconds), it only had a drop of 1 second for me. The HV set's 4-piece bonus + regeneration, I feel, is still far superior.
I tried the PVP set with Repel on Tab. Because the cooldown is already so short (6-7 seconds), it only had a drop of 1 second for me. The HV set's 4-piece bonus + regeneration, I feel, is still far superior.
No wonder, man xD GG set makes a difference on longer cd spells like IR and SoEA. I ran shard with GG set and felt rather happy about 11 s cooldown instead of 15.
GG set overall is really cool, in terms of damage its not much inferior to HV and doing actually more damage to tanks (still significantly loosing to HV on squishies). Only thing it needs is regen. Daamn, I wish there would be regen runes, for more gear diversity...
degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited October 2013
By the way, I just found another fun use for Repel on Tab: Breaking TRs Stealth.
If two players are coming at you, and one is a stealth TR, Repel hits them both. Normally, a stealthed TR cannot be targeted with Repel. However the Repel "bump" hits them both and breaks his invisibility. :cool:
I may play around with EF on Tab for the AP gain and stacks, but I've grown to love my Repel on Tab. We'll see.
Different play styles here... This is domination PVP. My goal is node control. Repel is amazing for that. Mind you, I strive to discern when to use it best. Why would I use Repel if I see 3 of my teammates pounding a GF? I'm not going to repel him away. Now, what about a DC camping out in their A. Shield that just dropped? Heck yes! Repel out, choke, and let the melee have their way. Also, Repel is a stun and an interrupt. It also has a 6 second cool down!
Now some wizard's swear by SoTEA. Use it, use it, use it! It's not my style. Too slow, too bulky, and too long of a cool down. It does not work on...
1) GFs blocking
2) Rogues in ITC and
3) GWFs in Unstoppable.
It's also very easy to interrupt.
In regard to Icy Rays: Love that skill. When I was a Thaum/Oppressor spec I used it like crazy. I still slot it from time to time. I simply prefer Chill Strike because of it's faster cool down and similar damage. I can more easily keep up HV stacks, too. To each their own. As long as you play your CW well, I have mad respect for you.
I'm guessing you're talking strictly pug matches?
You trade your highest damage AOE prone ability for an ability that will generate 2-3 points by pushing enemies off the node. You should try shard sometime, if you EF and then immediately drop it you can keep them CC'd until dead for pretty much all classes except GWF, and it's your best weapon against GWF because coupled with ice knife you can keep them prone for 6+ seconds
Lol it works perfectly against blocking GF's, you put it behind them and roll over them while their shield is facing you. It is really the only great ability we have to deal with GWF's, b/c it is a double prone to keep them from even going unstoppable.
If you can't let go of repel then ok slot it, but as a tab skill you just lose so much damage for so very little and situational utility.
Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
You trade your highest damage AOE prone ability for an ability that will generate 2-3 points by pushing enemies off the node. You should try shard sometime, if you EF and then immediately drop it you can keep them CC'd until dead for pretty much all classes except GWF, and it's your best weapon against GWF because coupled with ice knife you can keep them prone for 6+ seconds
Lol it works perfectly against blocking GF's, you put it behind them and roll over them while their shield is facing you. It is really the only great ability we have to deal with GWF's, b/c it is a double prone to keep them from even going unstoppable.
If you can't let go of repel then ok slot it, but as a tab skill you just lose so much damage for so very little and situational utility.
I would agree on everything from above, Shard is effin cool, but it has one really annoying trick, as far as you know. As soon as you stunned (repel, EF, flourish, etc) or frozen, it dissapears. And its ~15s cooldown, omfg! My point, it's not a "win button", but more like "very-very-high-risk/high reward" stuff. So Trace's choice makes sense.
Edit
It's, ofc a bug and as soon as it will be fixed (if it will be ever fixed), SoEA will become a musthave choice, for sure.
I would agree on everything from above, Shard is effin cool, but it has one really annoying trick, as far as you know. As soon as you stunned (repel, EF, flourish, etc) or frozen, it dissapears. And its ~15s cooldown, omfg! My point, it's not a "win button", but more like "very-very-high-risk/high reward" stuff. So Trace's choice makes sense.
Edit
It's, ofc a bug and as soon as it will be fixed (if it will be ever fixed), SoEA will become a musthave choice, for sure.
Basically this. I agree that is a high risk-to-reward ratio. I've found...
1) Very slow animation.
2) Easy to interrupt (and shard disappears)
3) Very long cool down (I can get off two Chill Strikes in the same time, both critting that's about 18k-21k)
4) Quite easy to dodge (just set your camera back to 85 and it's easy to see it coming)
Also, I've never seen it "one shot" a GWF. It can be deflected just like anyone other attack. In regard to Sentinel dueling, I think it's a very poor choice. I can get in two repels or two Chill Strikes in the same time I can get off one shard. I'm also not a Thaum, so it won't be doing as much damage with SoTEA.
By the way, if you do have any other videos of dueling Sentinels, feel free to post them. I'd love to see how an Oppressor does Sentinel dueling, how Shard would work, or even other Renegade tactics. This is simply what I've found works best for me.
If you have any to post, please do so. I understand that I have a certain style/bias in regard to how I fight Sentinels. If anyone else has an effective rotation or build they've found, please feel free to share a short video.
Please excuse my poor video quality. Still messing with Bandicam to try to get the right settings.
degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited November 2013
Another good example of a 1v1 vs. a Sentinel. I'm not sure how life will be after Module 2 (although I've very excited for more Regen on my CW), but until then, let CWs dominate! Notice how only once I was without a dodge when I needed one. Severe Reaction, don't leave home without it.
I play a CW and GWF (non-sent), and as I leveled and for a few weeks after hitting level 60 I had push on tab. It was awesome, I felt like I could defend points 3v1 and then when I got overwhelmed I could back pedal and line everyone up and send them flying and always get away. I was hardly ever dying, but not getting very many kills either. But in playing my GWF I discovered something. THERE IS NOTHING MORE ANNOYING THAN HAVING A PUSH HAPPY CW ON YOUR TEAM IN A PUG. IBS is a hard skill to line up because it has no range and a long animation/induction, and inevitably half the time I was about to use it, or even a quicker encounter, the wizard would have blown my target away from me and I end up wasting my encounter chopping dirt. So I decided to drop it and put the bowling ball on tab because I didn't want to be that guy.
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degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I play a CW and GWF (non-sent), and as I leveled and for a few weeks after hitting level 60 I had push on tab. It was awesome, I felt like I could defend points 3v1 and then when I got overwhelmed I could back pedal and line everyone up and send them flying and always get away. I was hardly ever dying, but not getting very many kills either. But in playing my GWF I discovered something. THERE IS NOTHING MORE ANNOYING THAN HAVING A PUSH HAPPY CW ON YOUR TEAM IN A PUG. IBS is a hard skill to line up because it has no range and a long animation/induction, and inevitably half the time I was about to use it, or even a quicker encounter, the wizard would have blown my target away from me and I end up wasting my encounter chopping dirt. So I decided to drop it and put the bowling ball on tab because I didn't want to be that guy.
Yep. Repel on Tab (or just using it) is definitely an issue of discernment. A wrong use of it can send an enemy away to get a pot or cap a point. Since they fixed RoE, that has been on Tab for me since the recent patch. Repel is still a great defense against TRs, GWFs, and GFs.
...the wizard would have blown my target away from me and I end up wasting my encounter chopping dirt. ...
There are different side of the story, since what you describe here is bad use of Repel. Suppose that you have a DC in your team, that attracts all kind of melees in his back. Repel would give him valuable seconds of healing and repositioning. Or if a snipper keeps hitting your mid node from the pillars. Or in situations that you really need to 1v2 or 1v1 with a GWF.
Definitely, hitting Repel blindly ends up in some random bad situations...like GWFs missing IBS or TRs missing Lashing Blade, but I guess when your target is getting hit by such a class, there is no point in Repeling anyone.
There are different side of the story, since what you describe here is bad use of Repel. Suppose that you have a DC in your team, that attracts all kind of melees in his back. Repel would give him valuable seconds of healing and repositioning. Or if a snipper keeps hitting your mid node from the pillars. Or in situations that you really need to 1v2 or 1v1 with a GWF.
Definitely, hitting Repel blindly ends up in some random bad situations...like GWFs missing IBS or TRs missing Lashing Blade, but I guess when your target is getting hit by such a class, there is no point in Repeling anyone.
It sure has it's uses, but for me the "multiple target" effect of having it on tab was a problem, often I was trying to repel something close to me but got something that was in line but farther away as well.
Well, I see your point, but I am saying that this is true with many skills that have similar effects . For instance, getting behind a target as TR and having a GF bull charging someone out of Lashing Blade range, or even sending him behind a pillar and out of line of sight of CWs etc.
Tab Repel is quite more difficult to manage, but again it does have its uses.
* Notorious Dwarven Bear Cavalry Leader *
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degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited November 2013
Back on topic, peeps! I'm curious if any other CWs have videos of Sent dueling. After a few criticisms/compliments of my encounter rotations, I'd like to see some other strategies against Sentinels. Any Thaums or Oppressors have some 1v1 strategies?
One more sidetrack
Think there are tears now, wait till next patch. Even without Tenes GWF will be much stronger.
Ranged closing at will ability (always wondered how GWFs could stand not having punishing charge in pvp - no need now), ranged high damage prone attack (really kind of puts IBS to shame), better daily than anything a GWF currently has.
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pers3phoneBanned Users, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
One more sidetrack
Think there are tears now, wait till next patch. Even without Tenes GWF will be much stronger.
Ranged closing at will ability (always wondered how GWFs could stand not having punishing charge in pvp - no need now), ranged high damage prone attack (really kind of puts IBS to shame), better daily than anything a GWF currently has.
This wouldn't be an issue if the primary victims (i.e. the CWs) would get anything to compensate.
But we getting jack.
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degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
This wouldn't be an issue if the primary victims (i.e. the CWs) would get anything to compensate.
But we getting jack.
I'm not too concerned. FL Surge will stink, but I'm more concerned about Threatening Rush. However, I'm already planning on having around 30k HP and 1300-1600 Regen, plus Artifact powers. So Sents will be tough, but we'll have the bonuses, as well.
degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited November 2013
Our random EoA premade last night ran into a randome Lemonade Stand premade (Yikes!). Although we lost by 250 or so, I had chance to get in a couple pure 1v1s against their Sentinel. Enjoy!
Comments
Problem is, on Tab IR has so much more bonus damage which you'll miss... I know some of the best mages play with SotEA on Tab but I find it extremely inconvenient, because shard evaporates whenever you get the smallest CC, and it's also quite easy to dodge, and the combos are predictable if you pay attention. However, when it works... it works very good. It's worth considering when they fix the CC issue.
As a Renegade, I don't have Snap Freeze. My Icy Rays on Tab does around 9k-10k damage with a crit, and I have a Perfect Vorpal, 13.4 GS and all Rank 8s. I simply run Chill Strike as another encounter (crits for 8k-10k), so I really don't miss it. Plus, Chill Strike has a much shorter cool down. Yesterday we had a match with three heavily geared TRs. I switched to Shield on Tab and did just fine. That being said, there are other ways to run Spell Mastery. I may use Icy Rays if I have a match with two or more GFs. I only know a handful of mages who can successfully pull off SoTEA in PVP. It's slow, bulky, very easy to interrupt and has a long cool down. Some wizards swear by it. Personally, I love them dropping the Shard, and then I CC them and watch it disappear. Good fun!
What I love, love, love about CWs is that every Feat Tree is viable in PVP, which cannot be said about some of the other classes. Thaums have great burst damage with IRs. Oppressors have insane CC. Renegades have increased AP gain and crit severity.
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
I'm rene too, with G. vorpal and not-so-geared as you, 2000-ish ArP in PvP. The usual CS-EF-RoE-IR combo hits for up to 15K (the IR crit) on squishies (HV set), obviously less on armored guys. Give it another shot maybe, I'm sure you'll hit much harder
#1 target - other CW's
#2 target - DC
#3 target - focusing tankier characters with support
Repel has a negative effect when trying to focus GWF/GF, you push them out of range of your melee teammates. So given that this is your last target priority AND that when you finally get to that target it's counter productive repel is fairly useless outside of the 1v1 arena. For 1v1 obviously it's about the best skill we have.
Repel on tab may be neat that you can push groups off of points for 2-3 seconds but look at what you are losing for that utility. 2 consecutive prones and 10-14k damage on a crit on a single target, or instant prone of 2-5 characters with 10k damage on a crit to every one of them if they are standing close together. Obviously talking about shard here.
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
I still don't think that Snap Freeze does a thing for IR. I've tried it and found no difference in performance or in the tooltip damage (Chill Strike, for example, actually shows increased tooltip damage when you have Snap Freeze). It's the Transcended Master feat that ramps up IR damage.
SotEA is amazing, but situational. I often run it on my other CW because she's not highly geared or specced for huge burst like Testament is, so it's fun to try alternative strategies. It's a steamroller against teams with poor range and mobility, especially if you anticipate them correctly. If I'm up against a team with 2 or more CWs who seem to be decent or at least smart enough to pick my CW out for CC, I usually forego the Shard and go back to trusty IR.
Contagion - Cleric
Testament - Wizard
Pestilence - Ranger
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NIGHTSWATCH
Different play styles here... This is domination PVP. My goal is node control. Repel is amazing for that. Mind you, I strive to discern when to use it best. Why would I use Repel if I see 3 of my teammates pounding a GF? I'm not going to repel him away. Now, what about a DC camping out in their A. Shield that just dropped? Heck yes! Repel out, choke, and let the melee have their way. Also, Repel is a stun and an interrupt. It also has a 6 second cool down!
Now some wizard's swear by SoTEA. Use it, use it, use it! It's not my style. Too slow, too bulky, and too long of a cool down. It does not work on...
1) GFs blocking
2) Rogues in ITC and
3) GWFs in Unstoppable.
It's also very easy to interrupt.
In regard to Icy Rays: Love that skill. When I was a Thaum/Oppressor spec I used it like crazy. I still slot it from time to time. I simply prefer Chill Strike because of it's faster cool down and similar damage. I can more easily keep up HV stacks, too. To each their own. As long as you play your CW well, I have mad respect for you.
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
Not my best playing, and not the best tactics, but a fun, quick match regardless.
Also, scroll ahead to around 11 minutes and you'll see a good example of why I use Repel on Tab. I kited a GF and GWF for a bit with it.
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Cool vids, man, really=) But repel on tab, as renegade with HV, meh... I mean, forgive me my criticism and off-topic (I wrote the same comment on youtube), but why not smth else? I mean, u still can have repel and in 90% cases its exactly the same functionality as tabbed.
For example, EF on tab. Hell! For HV rene its like legit hax (as far as I realize it). Its +50% damage and stun duration - already not taht bad. But, on top of that, when you touch nearby enemies with aoe it regen sick amount of AP, gives 1 stack of HV buff for each target - its only way to get more than one stack of HV buff in pvp, i guess, and 3 stacks ~10% bonus dmg res. It gives 1 stack of HV debuff on affected targets, which helps in mid teamfights. And, ofc, it builds arcane presence stacks, one per target affected. (I guess x5 stacked rene's RoE hits around twice harder than 0 stacked)
Note: All of the above was totally IMO. I'm using it in my rotation as opressor and find extremely strong. And i'm talking about pure utility, since oppressors dont give a $hit about arcane stacks. While for rene it's obvious damage booster.
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A few reasons why I wouldn't run EF on Tab. In PVE, I want all my enemies grouped together. In PVP, I want all of my enemies apart (divide and conquer). Building AP is not an issue and, like Repel, EF on Tab really has the same utility as it off Tab.
It's just preference. I've played around with a lot of builds, feats, powers and passives. So yeah, it's just what I prefer. Thanks for the feedback.
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Don't forget that Repel on tab is also incredibly effective against people who actually use their brains in PvP, since positioning plays a key role in this game whether you PvE or PvP. Anyway these people are much more dangerous than your run-of-the-mill "I'll just run to 2 and try to kill anyone in my way" players. These people actually play to win. Note that the PvP set also decreases the cooldown of tabbed Repel.
Mages sniping from elevated areas has already been mentioned. Others include: survivability-specced GWFs who try to make a run for your 1, forcing your team to split up; good GFs who try to do the same; good GF/cleric combos; multiple cleric combos (all stacking a ridiculous amount of HP/deflect/defense/regen).
Bottomline is that pushing these people away from points/delaying their progress/forcibly splitting them up is, more often than not, a much more effective strategy than just outright attacking/engaging them. Tabbed Repel can help you do all that, allowing you to slot any 3 other powers.
On topic knowing how to kill players while using tabbed Repel is certainly a good skill to have. Even if it happens very rarely, if you PvP a lot you will find yourself in a match where tabbing Repel seems like the best counter to your opponent's tactics.
Thanks for the response, trytallow. Of course I agree with your post. Again, it's not for everyone, but I've found it very effective in PVP.
I tried the PVP set with Repel on Tab. Because the cooldown is already so short (6-7 seconds), it only had a drop of 1 second for me. The HV set's 4-piece bonus + regeneration, I feel, is still far superior.
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No wonder, man xD GG set makes a difference on longer cd spells like IR and SoEA. I ran shard with GG set and felt rather happy about 11 s cooldown instead of 15.
GG set overall is really cool, in terms of damage its not much inferior to HV and doing actually more damage to tanks (still significantly loosing to HV on squishies). Only thing it needs is regen. Daamn, I wish there would be regen runes, for more gear diversity...
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If two players are coming at you, and one is a stealth TR, Repel hits them both. Normally, a stealthed TR cannot be targeted with Repel. However the Repel "bump" hits them both and breaks his invisibility. :cool:
I may play around with EF on Tab for the AP gain and stacks, but I've grown to love my Repel on Tab. We'll see.
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I'm guessing you're talking strictly pug matches?
You trade your highest damage AOE prone ability for an ability that will generate 2-3 points by pushing enemies off the node. You should try shard sometime, if you EF and then immediately drop it you can keep them CC'd until dead for pretty much all classes except GWF, and it's your best weapon against GWF because coupled with ice knife you can keep them prone for 6+ seconds
Lol it works perfectly against blocking GF's, you put it behind them and roll over them while their shield is facing you. It is really the only great ability we have to deal with GWF's, b/c it is a double prone to keep them from even going unstoppable.
If you can't let go of repel then ok slot it, but as a tab skill you just lose so much damage for so very little and situational utility.
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
I would agree on everything from above, Shard is effin cool, but it has one really annoying trick, as far as you know. As soon as you stunned (repel, EF, flourish, etc) or frozen, it dissapears. And its ~15s cooldown, omfg! My point, it's not a "win button", but more like "very-very-high-risk/high reward" stuff. So Trace's choice makes sense.
Edit
It's, ofc a bug and as soon as it will be fixed (if it will be ever fixed), SoEA will become a musthave choice, for sure.
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Basically this. I agree that is a high risk-to-reward ratio. I've found...
1) Very slow animation.
2) Easy to interrupt (and shard disappears)
3) Very long cool down (I can get off two Chill Strikes in the same time, both critting that's about 18k-21k)
4) Quite easy to dodge (just set your camera back to 85 and it's easy to see it coming)
Also, I've never seen it "one shot" a GWF. It can be deflected just like anyone other attack. In regard to Sentinel dueling, I think it's a very poor choice. I can get in two repels or two Chill Strikes in the same time I can get off one shard. I'm also not a Thaum, so it won't be doing as much damage with SoTEA.
By the way, if you do have any other videos of dueling Sentinels, feel free to post them. I'd love to see how an Oppressor does Sentinel dueling, how Shard would work, or even other Renegade tactics. This is simply what I've found works best for me.
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If you have any to post, please do so. I understand that I have a certain style/bias in regard to how I fight Sentinels. If anyone else has an effective rotation or build they've found, please feel free to share a short video.
Please excuse my poor video quality. Still messing with Bandicam to try to get the right settings.
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Yep. Repel on Tab (or just using it) is definitely an issue of discernment. A wrong use of it can send an enemy away to get a pot or cap a point. Since they fixed RoE, that has been on Tab for me since the recent patch. Repel is still a great defense against TRs, GWFs, and GFs.
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There are different side of the story, since what you describe here is bad use of Repel. Suppose that you have a DC in your team, that attracts all kind of melees in his back. Repel would give him valuable seconds of healing and repositioning. Or if a snipper keeps hitting your mid node from the pillars. Or in situations that you really need to 1v2 or 1v1 with a GWF.
Definitely, hitting Repel blindly ends up in some random bad situations...like GWFs missing IBS or TRs missing Lashing Blade, but I guess when your target is getting hit by such a class, there is no point in Repeling anyone.
It sure has it's uses, but for me the "multiple target" effect of having it on tab was a problem, often I was trying to repel something close to me but got something that was in line but farther away as well.
Tab Repel is quite more difficult to manage, but again it does have its uses.
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Think there are tears now, wait till next patch. Even without Tenes GWF will be much stronger.
Ranged closing at will ability (always wondered how GWFs could stand not having punishing charge in pvp - no need now), ranged high damage prone attack (really kind of puts IBS to shame), better daily than anything a GWF currently has.
This wouldn't be an issue if the primary victims (i.e. the CWs) would get anything to compensate.
But we getting jack.
I'm not too concerned. FL Surge will stink, but I'm more concerned about Threatening Rush. However, I'm already planning on having around 30k HP and 1300-1600 Regen, plus Artifact powers. So Sents will be tough, but we'll have the bonuses, as well.
In the meantime, let the Sent duels continue!
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