question about copying a map

mjik · May 2013

Is it possible to copy a map from one quest to another, so i can make a return, in a subsequent quest of a larger campaign, to a map created from the ground that i used in the first quest, without having to rebuild it all over again??

chinspinner · May 2013

Yes, just duplicate. But do it before quest objectives are in place or you will crash the Foundry.

mjik · May 2013

yes, by duplicating the quest i can copy all maps from the first quest into a new one
but I think I expressed myself poorly, what i was really trying to do is to copy a map from quest "A" into quest "C" and also a map from quest "B" into quest "C", by duplicating i can only use one of the maps, A or B into quest C, so i was trying to ask is, if there is a way to copy only one map from one quest to another... or if there is a way to merge quests (kinda A maps + B maps -> new quest C)
any thoughts?

chinspinner · May 2013

Can you just cut and paste onto a new blank canvas map?

dirathius · May 2013

Currently, I do not believe there is a way to "copy" maps other than duplication. Which means, no, no A + B = C. (Which is terribly unfortunate, I nearly had that problem myself.)

dirathius · May 2013

@chinspinner Hmm... I haven't tried cross-quest cut'n'paste. Good idea! I think I'll test it now.

EDIT: Nope, cross-quest cut'n'paste didn't work.

wynde · October 2013

Ok so if I have any objects linked to objectives, I need to remove them in order to duplicated the map? For instance, I have a town and you can click on signs to see what a building is or a door to see who owns it. Do I need to remove those as well?

zbkolde · October 2013

wynde wrote: »

Ok so if I have any objects linked to objectives, I need to remove them in order to duplicated the map? For instance, I have a town and you can click on signs to see what a building is or a door to see who owns it. Do I need to remove those as well?

I believe all you need to remove is contact dialog from non-objective objects and NPCs. Otherwise, the dialog is pasted onto every item on the duplicated map. If it's just interaction text, that shows up in the black tooltip, it should be fine. And dialog that is an objective should be fine. But if you add dialog to an item or NPC, that's not an objective, that is what needs to be removed before duplicating. I'm not 100% sure on this, but it's how i've handled duplicating. I just copy/paste the text into a word document, then unselect the "Contact" option from the item, which deletes the text. Then i can copy/paste it back in. I normally try to duplicate before i've added much dialog though.

Also, remember to turn off the snap-to grid and snap-to angle options before duplicating, so that all your items duplicate to the correct spot.

celantra · October 2013

Quest copy is the only method to duplicate a map across multiple quests at this time.

wynde · October 2013

Thanks, zbkolde

wynde · October 2013

Removed any form of dialog, contact information etc but I still cannot duplicate my map. Dev's need to seriously fix this. It's becoming a pain in the ***. I need at least 4 copies of this one map to progress between buildings and other maps in this quest. Its set up as an RP map. Though, I do wish one could visit any of the buildings at any point and not have to set it up as doing other stuff to get to the one you want.

zbkolde · October 2013

wynde wrote: »

Removed any form of dialog, contact information etc but I still cannot duplicate my map. Dev's need to seriously fix this. It's becoming a pain in the ***. I need at least 4 copies of this one map to progress between buildings and other maps in this quest. Its set up as an RP map. Though, I do wish one could visit any of the buildings at any point and not have to set it up as doing other stuff to get to the one you want.

What exactly are you seeing, when you say you "cannot duplicate"? Are you getting an error? If you have dialog on something, it will still duplicate the map, just all your items on the duplicate will have the dialog. Are you able to duplicate at all?

wynde · October 2013

It will not allow me to duplicate at all. The foundry locks up completely and stops processing. I end up having to exit out and reloading.

zbkolde · October 2013

wynde wrote: »

It will not allow me to duplicate at all. The foundry locks up completely and stops processing. I end up having to exit out and reloading.

Just to clarify, you are duplicating a map, within a quest, right? You're not trying to duplicate a quest? Because that's different.

If it's a map within a quest, it could be a couple of things, possibly:

Do you have any patrol points? If so, try removing the patrol points. (You can write the XYZ values down in a notebook to make it easier to replace them later.) This might stop it from duplicating, but i can't remember where i read that before (somewhere on these forums).

There was a bug reported recently where duplicating a map caused every detail to also be duplicated on the map (as in having 2 of everything), which would put the map "critically over budget" and crash the client. I never saw this personally, you might want to search the forums for threads about it.

Last thing i could think of would be the name of the map being too long. I know this is an issue when duplicating a quest, so maybe it also applies to duplicating a map. When you duplicate a map, it adds (Copy) or (Duplicate) or something (can't remember exactly what) to the name. Maybe the name of your map is too long, so that adding the extra word causes an error. You could try temporarily shortening the name of your map.

wynde · October 2013

zbkolde wrote: »

There was a bug reported recently where duplicating a map caused every detail to also be duplicated on the map (as in having 2 of everything), which would put the map "critically over budget" and crash the client. I never saw this personally, you might want to search the forums for threads about it.

This is exactly the problem. I was able to find the problem but then the "Critically Over Budget" notice came up. So what do I do now? I have a version of the quest already up but due to the recent bug of searchable quests, it is not accessible. Now I cannot set it up so I can republish it.

zbkolde · October 2013

wynde wrote: »

This is exactly the problem. I was able to find the problem but then the "Critically Over Budget" notice came up. So what do I do now? I have a version of the quest already up but due to the recent bug of searchable quests, it is not accessible. Now I cannot set it up so I can republish it.

I don't know what you should do, sorry.

Keep searching the forums about it, maybe someone else has an answer.

raphaeldisanto · October 2013

I had that issue, where duplicating a map gave me the 'critically overbudget' message. In my case, it was dialogues. I had to remove all of the dialogues from the map. (contact and quest)

What I did to fix it was twofold:

1. For contact dialogues, I made a copy of all of the objects that had contact dialogue in another map (because a contact dialogue is attached to the object that owns it) then removed the contact dialogues from the objects in my initial map.

2. For objective dialogues, I went into the story tab and dragged the objectives from that map into a different map (because an objective dialogue is attached to the story objective that owns it NOT the NPC/object that speaks it).

Then and only then was I able to duplicate the map without errors. Then I put all the stuff back in.

wynde · October 2013

I have removed all the dialogue from the mat. What its doing is making doubles of the details I have placed on the map and since there are already 1500, it makes 3000, thus making the new map over budget.

wynde · October 2013

Come on DEVs need this fixed and fixed fast in the Foundry! How the heck are we suppose to make the kind of foundries we want without transition maps that take a person back into the same area before proceeding to the next one?

Anyone know if there is a way to copy and past from one map to another and have it go into the same place as before?

raphaeldisanto · October 2013

You can copy and paste multiple details from one map to another, but it'll break all your y-axis values (The height of your objects)

Just select a bunch of objects in 2D, then copy/paste them into the other map. You'll note that they're pasted as a group, so you can still drag them (x/z wise) around, but the y values will all be broken.

wynde · October 2013

That sucks cause I was hoping to at least get sections of my map made for transitions to the next one but that will not work at all.

derpdedo · October 2013

I'm simulating a hub map to go back and forth within the story line. Found it easier to add everything I could possible need into a master copy, then duplicating it as many times as I needed. It's easier to delete what you don’t need, than to add over and over again as things change.

Because I have a lot of optional side things going on in each version, I'm sorta glad I'm not going back to the same map that is already hard to see with all the triggers, pathways, and such going on already.

Besides for the tracked quest, there is no way to track side quests from map to map without giving the player a item to carry to act as a trigger to start something else.

guitarzan698 · October 2013

Ok, I have the solution for you... Actually there are two solutions.

Solution 1)
Using this method is what you are doing now... For example, if you plan of having the character begin on the street and then enter a tavern and meet an NPC to get his quest, then go outside to the street and walk to a different building (maybe a merchant's house down the street from the tavern), sneak in and steal something, then exit the house, back into the street.. back to the tavern.... that would take multiple duplicate maps.
You construct the quest by starting with the outdoor street map. Player enters the door to the tavern... (map transition to tavern interior map)... then build that interior map. When the character leaves the tavern interior map by going out a door, you transition to a copy of the first street map (forming the next leg of the quest)... If the player will move to any map more than one time, you will need a duplicate of that map. You can build some very complex quests like this. BUT.. you must build each of the maps with as much background detail as you can... without any interactions build into the plot line in the foundry.. just blank maps. Then Copy each of these maps as many times as you need for your quest. SO ... in the above example, you need a total of 6 individual maps... 3 exterior street maps, 2 tavern interior maps, and one merchant house interior map. Build all your maps first and add as much detail as possible. Once you copy the maps, adding more detail is difficult. Once you have all the maps copied, start adding objectives and NPC's .. on the appropriate map.
`Street Map 1 (quest starts... travel to tavern)
`Tavern Interior Map 1 (map transition to interior map. Character meets npc and gets quest)
`Street Map 2 (map transition to new street map.. travel to next objective)
`Merchant House Map 1 (map transition to house interior map. Character performs some action here on this map)
`Street Map 3 (after completing objective in the house, the character exits and head back to the tavern)
`Tavern Interior Map 2 (Character meets with the npc and completes the quest)

Solution 2)
All the buildings/shops/dungeons etc. are built on the same map using teleporters from the exterior doors (or cave entrances, etc.) on your outdoor map, then the teleport leads to an unused portion of your map, where you hand-build your interior areas. This simulates what you are trying to do without actually reloading a different map. By carefully selecting maps, and with careful use of invisible walls, the player cannot see or get into the areas where you hand-build the building interiors. Instead of using map transitions to go to a new interior map, the player interacts with an invisible sparkly teleporter that moves the character to a normally in-accessible area of the same exterior map.

Conclusion:
I have experimented with both of these methods and they both have good points and bad. Method 1, is easier, but it takes much longer to play because the map transitions take a long time loading. It can also give you lots of headaches trying to keep track of the many maps needed for a longer quest. My own published quest using this style of design uses 17 or 18 map transitions (it spends a LOT of time on loading screens). There are actually like 4 maps, but each using several copies. One really good thing I was able to accomplish using this method, is that you can have the background change from day to night, or you can change weather from sunshine to rain, fog can roll in as night falls... gardens can die.. buildings can be ruined or repaired. There are lots of options here because you can show a particular setting or environment at different times with different conditions.
Method 2, is much more difficult to build but the results can be spectacular. You can build some really impressive maps this way.... BUT you have to play-test this type of map a lot to make sure you can't see or get to the hidden areas. And you have to build this map with no object or npc's so you need to think ahead and determine how many maps you will need BEFORE you begin.

I have found it best to use a combination of both methods at once.
I use method 2 as much as possible, building as much as I can on one map. I use teleporters for most of the entering and exiting and I use Method 1 to re-enter areas during different times or conditions.

Below is an example of what I'm trying to describe ...
In this quest, all the building interiors are built on an exterior city map. I only use map transitions to change from day to night. I built the map, in it's entirety with no interactables or dialogs, then made one copy. I added all the npc's and interactions needed as I build the story-board. When the plot had progressed to the proper place, I used a map transition to move the player to a copy of the same adventure area.... "at night". I used invisible walls to block off areas at the beginning of the story. As the player progresses through the plot, I remove some of the invisible walls to open up play areas as they become available.

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I hope this helps you and answers your questions.

question about copying a map

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