test content
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc

"Neverwinter is a true Dungeons & Dragons experience" Really?

ivesx2ivesx2 Member Posts: 9 Arc User
edited June 2013 in General Discussion (PC)
"Neverwinter is a true Dungeons & Dragons experience, brought to life with the dynamic Cryptic game engine." Really?

I playing this RPG since it was AD&D, I played Baldur's Gate, Pool of Radiance and even Neverwinter Nights, and I must say I expected more loyalty to D&D. Why Guardian Fighter and Great Weapon Fighter? In D&D there is only one class "Fighter". We will have two Rangers too? Or two Druids?

In my view this was a big mistake, because in addition to limiting the gameplay, distorted a basic concept of D&D. Sad...
Expect the best, prepare for the worst, and face whatever comes!
Post edited by ivesx2 on
«1345

Comments

  • hkiewahkiewa Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 379 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    Don't forget a cleric that can't raise the dead, and a wizard that can't cast fireball
  • mconosrepmconosrep Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    hkiewa wrote: »
    Don't forget a cleric that can't raise the dead, and a wizard that can't cast fireball

    Although 'luckily' there is a ZEN Store item that can......
  • wholyhandgrenadewholyhandgrenade Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    hkiewa wrote: »
    Don't forget a cleric that can't raise the dead, and a wizard that can't cast fireball

    I'd be happy if clerics could heal.
  • nullwolf1nullwolf1 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    ivesx2 wrote: »
    "Neverwinter is a true Dungeons & Dragons experience, brought to life with the dynamic Cryptic game engine." Really?

    I playing this RPG since it was AD&D, I played Baldur's Gate, Pool of Radiance and even Neverwinter Nights, and I must say I expected more loyalty to D&D. Why Guardian Fighter and Great Weapon Fighter? In D&D there is only one class "Fighter". We will have two Rangers too? Or two Druids?

    In my view this was a big mistake, because in addition to limiting the gameplay, distorted a basic concept of D&D. Sad...

    Using 4e rules I believe you don't play "JUST" fighter... you have to choose one of the paths? (I've only just started looking into 4th Edition, so I may not have the new terms down...)

    Edit - I guess if this was PnP 4e, you could play "Fighter" and pick and choose. Since this isn't PnP, they elected to used the Optional Builds instead...
    You can choose any fighter powers you like for your
    character, but fighters naturally fall into two basic
    groups: the great weapon fighter and the guardian
    fighter.
    hkiewa wrote: »
    Don't forget a cleric that can't raise the dead, and a wizard that can't cast fireball

    4e clerics can't raise dead until Epic levels, and then it's a 4 hour ritual.
  • hkiewahkiewa Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 379 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    nullwolf1 wrote: »
    Using 4e rules I believe you don't play "JUST" fighter... you have to choose one of the paths? (I've only just started looking into 4th Edition, so I may not have the new terms down...)

    Edit - I guess if this was PnP 4e, you could play "Fighter" and pick and choose. Since this isn't PnP, they elected to used the Optional Builds instead...




    4e clerics can't raise dead until Epic levels, and then it's a 4 hour ritual.

    4e blows which is why it is already being ditched by WoTc.
  • osiabunnyosiabunny Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Wizards don't feel wizardy enough to be called Wizards, instead lets call them Stage magicians. Slight of hand smoke and mirrors type :P
  • nullwolf1nullwolf1 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    hkiewa wrote: »
    4e blows which is why it is already being ditched by WoTc.

    Well, NW is based on 4e... Whenever the next "D&D" MMO comes out, it'll be based on whatever is "current". (Which half the ppl will probably think sucks etc...)

    Since I moved away from my core group, and aren't a social person, I never made the transition from 3e to 4e... Never really had a reason. It's just since I started playing NW that I started even looking into it.
  • osiabunnyosiabunny Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    My friends and I still play TSR's ad&d we hated 3rd edition, and didn't bother looking into these newer versions since.
  • kwequakwequa Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Newer editions are for these games..;)
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • kilo418kilo418 Member Posts: 823 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    LMAO, per WotC website, 4e has more players than any previous version. Not sure why people are saying it's bad. It's just different.
  • revmalrevmal Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    3rd ed was the power gamers version, 4ed is the mmo version, Next is so far a blend of 2nd and 3rd, with just a a dash of 4th, trying to make it more a tabletop game again, you can get the playtest kit free online.
  • nullwolf1nullwolf1 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    kilo418 wrote: »
    LMAO, per WotC website, 4e has more players than any previous version. Not sure why people are saying it's bad. It's just different.

    To be fair, I'd say 4e is quite a bit more accessible, what with the Internet being around and all...

    And it's less of a stigma for people to be found playing D&D or other RPGs... Back in high school ('90s), there were closet D&D players... -_-
    You know how hard it is to find someone to play with when they're all afraid of being ostracized by their friends for playing? LOL
    revmal wrote: »
    3rd ed was the power gamers version, 4ed is the mmo version, Next is so far a blend of 2nd and 3rd, with just a a dash of 4th, trying to make it more a tabletop game again, you can get the playtest kit free online.
    I will definitely be taking a look into that...
  • revmalrevmal Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    kilo418 wrote: »
    LMAO, per WotC website, 4e has more players than any previous version. Not sure why people are saying it's bad. It's just different.

    because they made online tools for 4th ed, and an online tabletop, made it easier to play without having to get together physically. Thanks to internet you can play with a group from all over the world.
  • thestoryteller01thestoryteller01 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    After doing some research on 4e it seems like WoTC tried to reinvent D&D as some kind of paper MMO that everyone can play without much preparation, effort or studying the rulebook.

    I am sure that the MMO generation of RPG players is a big potential market for a pen&paper WoW clone but why they had to (ab)use the D&D franchise for this, is completely beyond me.

    Wait.....what if WoTC created 4e ONLY for the reason to have a dumbed-down ruleset, that can be transfered more or less 1:1 to an MMO? No.....uhm, thats absurd....has to be!
    In case you find my grammar or spelling weird ---> native german speaker ;)
  • bidvarbidvar Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    I really can't describe with words how much disappointment I have for this game.

    Really? Truly? This is the best the MMO industry can do with the Neverwinter IP? Are there any Dungeons and Dragons fans out there who feel insulted by this game? It takes every great idea that you might expect from Dungeons and Dragons, and does the complete opposite. Immersion, complex systems, meaningful and significant choices... none of it exists in Neverwinter.

    Dungeons and Dragons is about organizing a group of friends, exploring a vast world of adventure and mystery, immersing yourself in a unique story that grows with your characters and unfolds over time. Neverwinter isn't Dungeons and Dragons... Neverwinter is what Dungeons and Dragons would be if it was turned into an amusement park for children.

    As a game for cheap thrills and short spouts of meaningless entertainment, Neverwinter works. But tying the names "Dungeons and Dragons" and "Neverwinter" to this shallow title is an insult to fans across the globe. I feel anger for the developers and publishers who bastardize a great IP by turning it into a joke like this. Neverwinter will never be the same, it is forever scarred by insignificance and mediocrity.

    All of that aside, lets not forget the music. I played Champions Online on day one, and in beta. I became very familiar with the music in that title. When Star Trek Online officially launched, I found it odd that Cryptic would recycle the music from CO and use it in STO. But I forgave them, because the music was slightly relevant in a science fiction setting. But then, to my horrible and bewildered surprise... I heard that same recycled music in Neverwinter! WHAT!!?!?! Why am I hearing guitar riffs in a dungeon in a fantasy game?! Seriously guys! This was the last straw for me. I have lost respect for Cryptic. They are a lazy studio, they skimp at every corner, emphasizing systems which maximize profits while maintaining minimal effort to produce a mediocre product. Yes yes, it's in the best interest of any company to maximize profits. But there has to be a limit. Certain expectations need to be met. The vast majority of the world's consumers (in any market) are simply enchanted when they see shinies and hear fancy words like "action," "beta," "exclusive" and "innovative."

    Games today aren't about gaming, they're about profiting. Neverwinter is a clear indication of this. It's further indication of the complete and unashamed contempt the developers and publishers feel for their customers. They have no respect for you, they only want your money. They will use every cheap trick in the book to get your money (exclusive VIP beta access anyone? By the way, it's non-refundable and under NDA so you can't tell anyone how disappointed you are with your purchase. Oh, and that buyer's remorse you're feeling? Forget about it! It'll pass... here, take some exclusive digital items which cost pennies for our programmers to <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> into existence... trust me, you'll love it!).

    The disappointment only increases the longer I think about this sham of a MMO. Let's not forget the latest trend of "action combat." Why? Why action combat? Why is it so amazing now? Do players really want action combat in a game like this? It was interesting in TERA.. then in GW2.. then RaiderZ.. and what others are doing it now? Cryptic didn't even do a good job implementing action combat! Admit it! Both GW2 and RaiderZ do it better. When I played GW2 after a weekend of Neverwinter, I couldn't help but think "Wow, this is what action combat is supposed to feel like. I can actually move while attacking! This is amazing!"

    Then there's the Foundry... the one thing that Neverwinter might have done right, and it's the one thing I couldn't possibly care less about. Cryptic doesn't need to create content now, enabling them to be even more lazy than they were before. "Just let the players make the game, we'll charge them for it too." -- gigat


    I've been trying for days to express how I feel about this title, but just could not put my thoughts into words. Then I read the above post and understood, "This is EXACTLY how I feel!"
  • kiralynkiralyn Member Posts: 1,440 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    bidvar wrote: »
    Are there any Dungeons and Dragons fans out there who feel insulted by this game?

    If so, they're taking "games" far too seriously.

    (And yes, I've played D&D since blue-book Basic.)



    ...oh, hey, for more classic digital D&D play, check out the PC & PS3 (maybe XBox?) demo for the re-release of those old D&D arcade games. Man, that brought back memories, we played that in the campus arcade all the time! :D
  • nullwolf1nullwolf1 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    kiralyn wrote: »
    If so, they're taking "games" far too seriously.

    (And yes, I've played D&D since blue-book Basic.)



    ...oh, hey, for more classic digital D&D play, check out the PC & PS3 (maybe XBox?) demo for the re-release of those old D&D arcade games. Man, that brought back memories, we played that in the campus arcade all the time! :D

    Someone needs to do the old SSI D&D games with updated graphics... that'd be amusing... (especially if still able to hex edit the save game to change your race to Tribble...)
  • ancientwolfgr808ancientwolfgr808 Member Posts: 163 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    bidvar wrote: »
    I really can't describe with words how much disappointment I have for this game.

    Really? Truly? This is the best the MMO industry can do with the Neverwinter IP? Are there any Dungeons and Dragons fans out there who feel insulted by this game? It takes every great idea that you might expect from Dungeons and Dragons, and does the complete opposite. Immersion, complex systems, meaningful and significant choices... none of it exists in Neverwinter.

    Dungeons and Dragons is about organizing a group of friends, exploring a vast world of adventure and mystery, immersing yourself in a unique story that grows with your characters and unfolds over time. Neverwinter isn't Dungeons and Dragons... Neverwinter is what Dungeons and Dragons would be if it was turned into an amusement park for children.

    As a game for cheap thrills and short spouts of meaningless entertainment, Neverwinter works. But tying the names "Dungeons and Dragons" and "Neverwinter" to this shallow title is an insult to fans across the globe. I feel anger for the developers and publishers who bastardize a great IP by turning it into a joke like this. Neverwinter will never be the same, it is forever scarred by insignificance and mediocrity.

    All of that aside, lets not forget the music. I played Champions Online on day one, and in beta. I became very familiar with the music in that title. When Star Trek Online officially launched, I found it odd that Cryptic would recycle the music from CO and use it in STO. But I forgave them, because the music was slightly relevant in a science fiction setting. But then, to my horrible and bewildered surprise... I heard that same recycled music in Neverwinter! WHAT!!?!?! Why am I hearing guitar riffs in a dungeon in a fantasy game?! Seriously guys! This was the last straw for me. I have lost respect for Cryptic. They are a lazy studio, they skimp at every corner, emphasizing systems which maximize profits while maintaining minimal effort to produce a mediocre product. Yes yes, it's in the best interest of any company to maximize profits. But there has to be a limit. Certain expectations need to be met. The vast majority of the world's consumers (in any market) are simply enchanted when they see shinies and hear fancy words like "action," "beta," "exclusive" and "innovative."

    Games today aren't about gaming, they're about profiting. Neverwinter is a clear indication of this. It's further indication of the complete and unashamed contempt the developers and publishers feel for their customers. They have no respect for you, they only want your money. They will use every cheap trick in the book to get your money (exclusive VIP beta access anyone? By the way, it's non-refundable and under NDA so you can't tell anyone how disappointed you are with your purchase. Oh, and that buyer's remorse you're feeling? Forget about it! It'll pass... here, take some exclusive digital items which cost pennies for our programmers to <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> into existence... trust me, you'll love it!).

    The disappointment only increases the longer I think about this sham of a MMO. Let's not forget the latest trend of "action combat." Why? Why action combat? Why is it so amazing now? Do players really want action combat in a game like this? It was interesting in TERA.. then in GW2.. then RaiderZ.. and what others are doing it now? Cryptic didn't even do a good job implementing action combat! Admit it! Both GW2 and RaiderZ do it better. When I played GW2 after a weekend of Neverwinter, I couldn't help but think "Wow, this is what action combat is supposed to feel like. I can actually move while attacking! This is amazing!"

    Then there's the Foundry... the one thing that Neverwinter might have done right, and it's the one thing I couldn't possibly care less about. Cryptic doesn't need to create content now, enabling them to be even more lazy than they were before. "Just let the players make the game, we'll charge them for it too." -- gigat


    I've been trying for days to express how I feel about this title, but just could not put my thoughts into words. Then I read the above post and understood, "This is EXACTLY how I feel!"

    Sums it up. Prepare for onslaught of calvary wearing white robes. Nicely put too. Sharing this because I wont even bother to type it anymore. :o
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Still trying to find a reference to AD in my AD&D Manuals.
  • ordensmarschallordensmarschall Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 1,060 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    This game is most certainly lacking the D&D feel. There are so many options with D&D, and considering the level of development of today's gaming hardware and software a much more faithful representation could be made. Those of us who came here because of the D&D logo attached to the game can try to influence the direction this game takes, but only if we stick around. Quitting will solve nothing. I was hoping for much more, but for now I will take what is offered, however only for so long. If Cryptic wants to keep the audience they claim they are going for then they will need to start incorporating some real D&D into the game. The trick will be what they decide to do this Fall when 5th Edition comes out.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • leshil40leshil40 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 157 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    If it were "True" we would have many more classes and more paragon paths per class to choose from. Customization is key to DnD, yet this game has little to none.
  • nullwolf1nullwolf1 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    leshil40 wrote: »
    If it were "True" we would have many more classes and more paragon paths per class to choose from. Customization is key to DnD, yet this game has little to none.

    I'm willing to give them time on this one...
  • osiabunnyosiabunny Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Customization is key to MMORPGs also, a thing these companies forget in the recent years..
  • skyofwormsskyofworms Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    bidvar wrote: »
    I really can't describe with words how much disappointment I have for this game.

    Really? Truly? This is the best the MMO industry can do with the Neverwinter IP? Are there any Dungeons and Dragons fans out there who feel insulted by this game? It takes every great idea that you might expect from Dungeons and Dragons, and does the complete opposite. Immersion, complex systems, meaningful and significant choices... none of it exists in Neverwinter.

    Dungeons and Dragons is about organizing a group of friends, exploring a vast world of adventure and mystery, immersing yourself in a unique story that grows with your characters and unfolds over time. Neverwinter isn't Dungeons and Dragons... Neverwinter is what Dungeons and Dragons would be if it was turned into an amusement park for children.

    As a game for cheap thrills and short spouts of meaningless entertainment, Neverwinter works. But tying the names "Dungeons and Dragons" and "Neverwinter" to this shallow title is an insult to fans across the globe. I feel anger for the developers and publishers who bastardize a great IP by turning it into a joke like this. Neverwinter will never be the same, it is forever scarred by insignificance and mediocrity.

    All of that aside, lets not forget the music. I played Champions Online on day one, and in beta. I became very familiar with the music in that title. When Star Trek Online officially launched, I found it odd that Cryptic would recycle the music from CO and use it in STO. But I forgave them, because the music was slightly relevant in a science fiction setting. But then, to my horrible and bewildered surprise... I heard that same recycled music in Neverwinter! WHAT!!?!?! Why am I hearing guitar riffs in a dungeon in a fantasy game?! Seriously guys! This was the last straw for me. I have lost respect for Cryptic. They are a lazy studio, they skimp at every corner, emphasizing systems which maximize profits while maintaining minimal effort to produce a mediocre product. Yes yes, it's in the best interest of any company to maximize profits. But there has to be a limit. Certain expectations need to be met. The vast majority of the world's consumers (in any market) are simply enchanted when they see shinies and hear fancy words like "action," "beta," "exclusive" and "innovative."

    Games today aren't about gaming, they're about profiting. Neverwinter is a clear indication of this. It's further indication of the complete and unashamed contempt the developers and publishers feel for their customers. They have no respect for you, they only want your money. They will use every cheap trick in the book to get your money (exclusive VIP beta access anyone? By the way, it's non-refundable and under NDA so you can't tell anyone how disappointed you are with your purchase. Oh, and that buyer's remorse you're feeling? Forget about it! It'll pass... here, take some exclusive digital items which cost pennies for our programmers to <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> into existence... trust me, you'll love it!).

    The disappointment only increases the longer I think about this sham of a MMO. Let's not forget the latest trend of "action combat." Why? Why action combat? Why is it so amazing now? Do players really want action combat in a game like this? It was interesting in TERA.. then in GW2.. then RaiderZ.. and what others are doing it now? Cryptic didn't even do a good job implementing action combat! Admit it! Both GW2 and RaiderZ do it better. When I played GW2 after a weekend of Neverwinter, I couldn't help but think "Wow, this is what action combat is supposed to feel like. I can actually move while attacking! This is amazing!"

    Then there's the Foundry... the one thing that Neverwinter might have done right, and it's the one thing I couldn't possibly care less about. Cryptic doesn't need to create content now, enabling them to be even more lazy than they were before. "Just let the players make the game, we'll charge them for it too." -- gigat


    I've been trying for days to express how I feel about this title, but just could not put my thoughts into words. Then I read the above post and understood, "This is EXACTLY how I feel!"


    This. This is exactly how I feel about Neverwinter online. I think this also applies to gaming in general. Detail, customization, depth...these concepts are now gone forever, forgotten. Now it's the age of amusement park games with superficial entertainment.
  • vyldorvyldor Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 16 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    I'd be happy if clerics could heal.



    yeah, its kinda messed up that you can buy a rez but a cleric cant rez you. If I leave, it will most likely be because its one thing to charge for convenience but to charge for something that defies the very nature of the world of DnD shows a really high level of greed
  • skalt112skalt112 Member Posts: 1,089 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    I don't understand why games always have to destroy the world. It seems every game I play is about some post apocolyptic remake of an existing world. I will never understand why companies spend years creating rich, vibrant, and lore filled worlds, only to destroy them and start over.
  • nullwolf1nullwolf1 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    vyldor wrote: »
    yeah, its kinda messed up that you can buy a rez but a cleric cant rez you. If I leave, it will most likely be because its one thing to charge for convenience but to charge for something that defies the very nature of the world of DnD shows a really high level of greed

    I think in the 4e of D&D you can buy resurrection scrolls for like 680 Gold... they could probably implement that...
    (Clerics would have to perform a 4 hour ritual to resurrect you, and be above a level you can't get to yet to to use them without scrolls...)

    skalt112 wrote: »
    I don't understand why games always have to destroy the world. It seems every game I play is about some post apocolyptic remake of an existing world. I will never understand why companies spend years creating rich, vibrant, and lore filled worlds, only to destroy them and start over.

    In Forgotten Realms case I think they did it so they had a "good" reason to adapt to 4e rules LOL. -_-
  • alecstormalecstorm Member Posts: 142 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    True D&D experience? This is a mmorpg. Wanna a real D&D experience? Turn off the PC. Find some friends in real life and get a bunch of dices. The real D&D is not AD&D nor 3 ed, 3.5 or Pathfinder. In real D&D there were warriors, wizards, clerics, rogues, halfling, elves and dwarves. Yes, demi humans were classes. You cannot create a dwarf cleric. So don't complain too much... this is only hipstering :D 4ed is perfect for a mmorpg, even if is terrible for a real rpg.
  • xhritxhrit Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    It might not be a true D&D experience, but it sure is a true QQ experience.
  • llfritzllllfritzll Member Posts: 215 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    to me it is just another video game.

    the obvious limitation they face is time and money.

    play rift then play this game. the graphics and gameplay are on two separate worlds. what takes them a week in rift to create with those 1990's graphics probably takes them a month in neverwinter.


    i realize this is nothing like the 2nd edition ad&d i played when i was a kid, but it is what it is. its a video game, it can be fun at times, and that is that.
  • bluedarkybluedarky Member Posts: 1,232 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    kilo418 wrote: »
    LMAO, per WotC website, 4e has more players than any previous version. Not sure why people are saying it's bad. It's just different.

    People hate it because it's different, sounds dumb I know but each update to the rules has caused an outcry since AD&D.
Sign In or Register to comment.