You've commonly posted that people who disagree aren't understanding the issue. The part of the issue you are not understanding is that if they make the ban something spammers don't care about, like simply a zone silence, they will just keep spamming. Make it something spammers do care about and they either stop spamming, or they keep getting silenced.
What needs to happen is this - they need to make an actual auction house that is its own zone. You walk into the auction house, auction spam is what you expect. You leave the auction house, and there should not be any auction spam whatsoever. Everyone who actually wants to see auction spam will be in the separate auction house zone. -fixed.
If they are spamming zone, and get banned from zone for 24 hours, the spamming stops. I fail to see how you need to ban them from every form of chat possible. Unless you're actually suggesting they would invite people to a party just to spam them? Seriously?
Also do you really believe the way it is now discourages people from spamming? Because it doesn't, the same people that spam will spam after the ban. However the people that really want to use zone chat for positive reasons might reconsider if they've been banned previously (myself included)
This is an MMO, every single MMO's main city's zone chat is filled with spam. Most use real solutions like rate limiters.
You're telling people not to use zone chat for trading, but there's no auction house right now and even before that, how would they sell items for gold?
Here's a solution for your zone spam problem: Create a simple tab just for tells, party chat, guild chat, and any other chat that isn't zone. Then when you're in the main city open that.
The gripe I have isn't with a zone chat ban, it's with an entire chat ban for 24 hours. I will make that clear again.
If someone is annoying someone, why use report spam? There's an ignore function that works well. People use report spam because it exists with no repercussions for a report on someone doing nothing wrong.
Also you're telling people to keep chatter down in zone???? This is an MMO, not a single player game.
I get what your saying.... this is an "MMO" and its supposed to be like the back alley of a 3rd world flea market. I get it. I just think I and many others, those being the 20+ people who are silencing you.. don't agree with you. Sounds to me like there are at least 20 people across the 20,000 people in the enclave who want you to be quiet. I really don't think there is any abuse of the system going on at all. I asked some questions and I got answers... all systems seem to be working fine on this end.
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ph4ng4nMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 14Arc User
edited May 2013
1. Trade Chat
2. LFG Chat
2. Multiples Undockable Chat Windows
3. Report should only mute general and tell. who spam party and guild chat really?
If they are spamming zone, and get banned from zone for 24 hours, the spamming stops. I fail to see how you need to ban them from every form of chat possible. Unless you're actually suggesting they would invite people to a party just to spam them? Seriously?
Yes, third party web site gold sellers will whisper, blind invite, hit up channels, etc....
If the penalty isn't steep enough, they will keep doing it. Its not hard to understand.
A separate auction zone will fix this. People who WANT to trade will be there, everyone else wont be. Simple enough,
Haha, this is perfect. The Cryptic and PWE puppet masters pull all the strings and make the proles tear at each other's throats with this stuff.
Fellas, this is Cryptic's fault. They don't give us the right chat channels. Then they make a barbaric chat ban system. So everyone is frustrated and noone is happy.
We shouldn't be fighting with each other, we should be yelling at Cryptic.
I also want to pose this question for the people who still think this type of ban is reasonable.
A new player to the game, or MMOs in general, enters the main city and sees other people listing items for sale. He has found this super awesome level 20 item that he lists for gold. People report him for "spam" when in fact he only listed the item once, because he doesn't understand all the currencies and how the auction house works yet.
This new player is now royally screwed. People are messaging him to help him out and he has no way of responding. He's confused.
Now, if that **** happened to you, how would you feel about the game? How would you feel about MMOs in general? Would you want to keep playing this game?
Yes, third party web site gold sellers will whisper, blind invite, hit up channels, etc....
If the penalty isn't steep enough, they will keep doing it. Its not hard to understand.
A separate auction zone will fix this. People who WANT to trade will be there, everyone else wont be. Simple enough,
Or.... IGNORE. BOOM. You are making an argument that it stops gold spammers. They email you anyway, ban or not. Gold spammers aren't going away, they have been in every MMO spamming since the dawn of creation.
This hurts legitimate users.... Gold spammers just make new accounts.
There are FAR better options that other MMOs use to get rid of gold spam.
Haha, this is perfect. The Cryptic and PWE puppet masters pull all the strings and make the proles tear at each other's throats with this stuff.
Fellas, this is Cryptic's fault. They don't give us the right chat channels. Then they make a barbaric chat ban system. So everyone is frustrated and noone is happy.
We shouldn't be fighting with each other, we should be yelling at Cryptic.
Agreed. +1
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randomone777Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 28Arc User
edited May 2013
I get what the initial poster is saying; it is pretty inequitable to be banned from ALL chat for this. What I think the inital poster doesn't realize is that they are suffering the unilateral punishment because gold spammers and the like CAN and WILL just switch to /tell spam, /party spam, etc.
Ultimately, the "problem" is that there is no real community on these servers as yet. Were such a thing present, each server would have already defined, socialized, and taken to rigid enforcement of channel use:
- trade for buy/sell/trade messages
- lfg for groups and raids
- roleplay for public roleplay
etc.
Frankly, PWE/Cryptic should have instituted these channels from the "get go" to make things easier. But, as they have not, it's up to each of US to do it.
Beholder has a trade channel [trade] and it is largely ignored. If you're on Beholder, you should use this channel and encourage your friends and guild mates to do the same.
I'd recommend this for the other servers as well. That way, /zone chat could be for help, questions, and related stuff and everyone would be much happier.
As it stands, I only /report gold sell spam and, when it gets too much, I just turn off zone chat entirely; this is not the optimum outcome, but since I really don't have time to do more...
Recap:
1. Guild Leaders - encourage your members to use /trade and NOT /zone
2. Players - use /trade and not /zone; do your best to popularize /trade on your server
3. Understand that /report, if consistently misused such as seen in this thread, will ultimately lead to us losing it. That is NOT the result you want, I promise.
My $0.02 worth.
Maniacal mage making magical messes; mercifully, made mostly of menaces.
I also want to pose this question for the people who still think this type of ban is reasonable.
A new player to the game, or MMOs in general, enters the main city and sees other people listing items for sale. He has found this super awesome level 20 item that he lists for gold. People report him for "spam" when in fact he only listed the item once, because he doesn't understand all the currencies and how the auction house works yet.
This new player is now royally screwed. People are messaging him to help him out and he has no way of responding. He's confused.
Now, if that **** happened to you, how would you feel about the game? How would you feel about MMOs in general? Would you want to keep playing this game?
Yeah Mr. Innocent Naive New Player is selling items in the wrong channel and gets silenced for 24 hours. Boo hoo... what is he going to think of MMOs? Or life in general for that matter? Unless he's an idiot he's going to realize that he irritated the *** out of people and will be more careful before he broadcasts his garbage into the wrong channel. In fact he will probably think twice before he types anything into zone and will strongly consider whether his abbreviated gibberish is truly something that 10,000+ people need to be subjected to.
I get what your saying.... this is an "MMO" and its supposed to be like the back alley of a 3rd world flea market. I get it. I just think I and many others, those being the 20+ people who are silencing you.. don't agree with you. Sounds to me like there are at least 20 people across the 20,000 people in the enclave who want you to be quiet. I really don't think there is any abuse of the system going on at all. I asked some questions and I got answers... all systems seem to be working fine on this end.
20 people out of 20,000. That sounds like the majority.
Again, let the report spam ban from zone chat for 24 hours.... All chat is way to excessive. You can't really play for 24 hours after a ban like that. Might as well blindly ban accounts for 24 hours.
I kind of find it cute that people here actually think any of this matters and that anything is going to change. Do you honestly think a few complaint posts in the newest game compares to the YEARS of complaints in the other two games? Nothing was done in CO, nothing was done in STO, and nothing has been promised here. Just a statement meant to placate.
Sometime in the future, when Cryptic releases its newest 4th game. A few grizzled vets will laugh and cry as the cycle repeats itself once again.
Yeah Mr. Innocent Naive New Player is selling items in the wrong channel and gets silenced for 24 hours. Boo hoo... what is he going to think of MMOs? Or life in general for that matter? Unless he's an idiot he's going to realize that he irritated the *** out of people and will be more careful before he broadcasts his garbage into the wrong channel. In fact he will probably think twice before he types anything into zone and will strongly consider whether his abbreviated gibberish is truly something that 10,000+ people need to be subjected to.
Jesus christ you're toxic. And the exact type of player this game doesn't need.
20 people out of 20,000. That sounds like the majority.
Again, let the report spam ban from zone chat for 24 hours.... All chat is way to excessive. You can't really play for 24 hours after a ban like that. Might as well blindly ban accounts for 24 hours.
No it will make the offender think twice before he types ANYTHING into zone. He will realize that Zone crosses all the instances and that anything he says or does can and will be used against him, so he better think twice before he pulls the trigger.
3. Understand that /report, if consistently misused such as seen in this thread, will ultimately lead to us losing it. That is NOT the result you want, I promise.
My $0.02 worth.
This would actually be the perfect result assuming they implement new strategies to deal with the problem. If you can list any other MMO not made by Cryptic that let's players blindly ban another player for 24 hours (chat or game) i'd like to know. It's an insane policy and any company that isn't trying to use a game as a cash grab would never use it. There are far better options to dealing with gold spam.
People are switching the issue from "players" to "gold spammers"
That isn't the topic. It's about legitimate users getting banned for 24 hours from playing (essentially) because any other player can hit report on them without repercussions.
No it will make the offender think twice before he types ANYTHING into zone. He will realize that Zone crosses all the instances and that anything he says or does can and will be used against him, so he better think twice before he pulls the trigger.
Yes because chatting in an MMO or listing items for sale in an MMO is a crime..... Go back to COD
Sure limit the amount of reports you can submit to one every 5-10 minutes... after that you can go on your way or stop paying attention right?
WRONG... this was implemented to SUBSTANTIALLY cut off the flow of garbage in the Zone... and it seems to be working. Pretty soon, the zone will be a clear, calm place for important communications. And if what you have to say doesn't fit within the Zone.. you'll find out about it pretty quick. If you are worried about getting silenced for 24 hours, here's an easy solution for you.. STOP BLATHERING into a channel where 10,000+ people can hear you. So you think that people are abusing it and your going to get silenced unjustly? KEEP QUIET THEN AND DON"T DRAW ATTENTION TO YOURSELF. And soon enough, presto, the Zone will be a clean, quiet and calm place, the 'silencing' will wear off and the problem will be solved.
Sure limit the amount of reports you can submit to one every 5-10 minutes... after that you can go on your way or stop paying attention right?
WRONG... this was implemented to SUBSTANTIALLY cut off the flow of garbage in the Zone... and it seems to be working. Pretty soon, the zone will be a clear, calm place for important communications. And if what you have to say doesn't fit within the Zone.. you'll find out about it pretty quick. If you are worried about getting silenced for 24 hours, here's an easy solution for you.. STOP BLATHERING into a channel where 10,000+ people can hear you. So you think that people are abusing it and your going to get silenced unjustly? KEEP QUIET THEN AND DON"T DRAW ATTENTION TO YOURSELF. And soon enough, presto, the Zone will be a clean, quiet and calm place, the 'silencing' will wear off and the problem will be solved.
But it's not working at all.....
Also the report spam is "supposed" to be used for ... SPAM (according to the few that support it). Imagine that? Not to report everyone you want....
"Participation in PVP-related activities is so low on an hourly, daily, weekly, and monthly basis that we could in fact just completely take it out of STO and it would not impact the overall number of people [who] log in to the game and play in any significant way." -Gozer, Cryptic PvP Dev
Go make your own **** game if you want something to work a certain way. Most of us are fine with this system.
Or they could go play RaiderZ, and see what it's like if there's no way to report a spammer easily. No barrier to entry; your existing PWE account for this game gets you in.
Or they could go play RaiderZ, and see what it's like if there's no way to report a spammer easily. No barrier to entry; your existing PWE account for this game gets you in.
Which means they have no system in place at all, which i'm not saying should happen. Derp.
I quoted you in a previous post that you completely ignored.
Moving on, it seems that EVERYONE agrees that zone spam is annoying. But this report spam doesn't stop anything, go look at zone in the main city at any time and you'll see it's always the same. There needs to be new methods in place to stop it.
Banning people from chatting completely is not a solution.
I also want to pose this question for the people who still think this type of ban is reasonable.
A new player to the game, or MMOs in general, enters the main city and sees other people listing items for sale. He has found this super awesome level 20 item that he lists for gold. People report him for "spam" when in fact he only listed the item once, because he doesn't understand all the currencies and how the auction house works yet.
This new player is now royally screwed. People are messaging him to help him out and he has no way of responding. He's confused.
Now, if that **** happened to you, how would you feel about the game? How would you feel about MMOs in general? Would you want to keep playing this game?
So where did this brand new player find this super awesome lvl 20 item to sell? On the bridge? Did somebody drop it for an alt?
I don't spam chat wanting to sell stuff, buy stuff or join groups. In fact, since you brought it up, I'll point it out again; spam Zone chat all you want, I already have it turned off. I have it turned off because, as in almost every other MMO it is full of gold spammers, trade spammers which really aren't much better, and 12 year olds who's parents aren't home, so they can throw out all the abusive language/racial slurs they want because, as I said, the parents aren't home, and you can't reach through the monitor to slap the taste out of their mouths. So I shut it off, as soon as I log in. I'll even make a private channel where it's possible, if I'm not in a guild. So I say, yeah, everyone should take your advice, and turn Zone chat off. Then the only ones posting will be people trying to sell stuff. It really truly is a novel idea, there would only be gold spammers the occasional new player, and a bunch of people that can't understand why nobody is responding to their sales.
Reading comprehension is essential in a medium that requires reading for communication.
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keeganfoxMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
I did read your first post. My statement stands. Nearly response I've seen here disagrees with you. This thread is only still going because you're the only one replying to everyone for your side of it. Don't spam. There's no "Well you should have the ability to spam this much." Just don't ****ing spam. End of story.
I don't think you understand how the system works. The marks don't necessarily get erased until you're muted. You may have gathered them over time.
If you really want to see how much everyone feels about it, create a poll and we'll express our opinions in number.
Comments
If they are spamming zone, and get banned from zone for 24 hours, the spamming stops. I fail to see how you need to ban them from every form of chat possible. Unless you're actually suggesting they would invite people to a party just to spam them? Seriously?
Also do you really believe the way it is now discourages people from spamming? Because it doesn't, the same people that spam will spam after the ban. However the people that really want to use zone chat for positive reasons might reconsider if they've been banned previously (myself included)
I get what your saying.... this is an "MMO" and its supposed to be like the back alley of a 3rd world flea market. I get it. I just think I and many others, those being the 20+ people who are silencing you.. don't agree with you. Sounds to me like there are at least 20 people across the 20,000 people in the enclave who want you to be quiet. I really don't think there is any abuse of the system going on at all. I asked some questions and I got answers... all systems seem to be working fine on this end.
2. LFG Chat
2. Multiples Undockable Chat Windows
3. Report should only mute general and tell. who spam party and guild chat really?
Yes, third party web site gold sellers will whisper, blind invite, hit up channels, etc....
If the penalty isn't steep enough, they will keep doing it. Its not hard to understand.
A separate auction zone will fix this. People who WANT to trade will be there, everyone else wont be. Simple enough,
Fellas, this is Cryptic's fault. They don't give us the right chat channels. Then they make a barbaric chat ban system. So everyone is frustrated and noone is happy.
We shouldn't be fighting with each other, we should be yelling at Cryptic.
A new player to the game, or MMOs in general, enters the main city and sees other people listing items for sale. He has found this super awesome level 20 item that he lists for gold. People report him for "spam" when in fact he only listed the item once, because he doesn't understand all the currencies and how the auction house works yet.
This new player is now royally screwed. People are messaging him to help him out and he has no way of responding. He's confused.
Now, if that **** happened to you, how would you feel about the game? How would you feel about MMOs in general? Would you want to keep playing this game?
Or.... IGNORE. BOOM. You are making an argument that it stops gold spammers. They email you anyway, ban or not. Gold spammers aren't going away, they have been in every MMO spamming since the dawn of creation.
This hurts legitimate users.... Gold spammers just make new accounts.
There are FAR better options that other MMOs use to get rid of gold spam.
Ultimately, the "problem" is that there is no real community on these servers as yet. Were such a thing present, each server would have already defined, socialized, and taken to rigid enforcement of channel use:
- trade for buy/sell/trade messages
- lfg for groups and raids
- roleplay for public roleplay
etc.
Frankly, PWE/Cryptic should have instituted these channels from the "get go" to make things easier. But, as they have not, it's up to each of US to do it.
Beholder has a trade channel [trade] and it is largely ignored. If you're on Beholder, you should use this channel and encourage your friends and guild mates to do the same.
I'd recommend this for the other servers as well. That way, /zone chat could be for help, questions, and related stuff and everyone would be much happier.
As it stands, I only /report gold sell spam and, when it gets too much, I just turn off zone chat entirely; this is not the optimum outcome, but since I really don't have time to do more...
Recap:
1. Guild Leaders - encourage your members to use /trade and NOT /zone
2. Players - use /trade and not /zone; do your best to popularize /trade on your server
3. Understand that /report, if consistently misused such as seen in this thread, will ultimately lead to us losing it. That is NOT the result you want, I promise.
My $0.02 worth.
Helpful links:
Morbic's channel list - Guide - Custom Channels and List
Yeah Mr. Innocent Naive New Player is selling items in the wrong channel and gets silenced for 24 hours. Boo hoo... what is he going to think of MMOs? Or life in general for that matter? Unless he's an idiot he's going to realize that he irritated the *** out of people and will be more careful before he broadcasts his garbage into the wrong channel. In fact he will probably think twice before he types anything into zone and will strongly consider whether his abbreviated gibberish is truly something that 10,000+ people need to be subjected to.
20 people out of 20,000. That sounds like the majority.
Again, let the report spam ban from zone chat for 24 hours.... All chat is way to excessive. You can't really play for 24 hours after a ban like that. Might as well blindly ban accounts for 24 hours.
Sometime in the future, when Cryptic releases its newest 4th game. A few grizzled vets will laugh and cry as the cycle repeats itself once again.
Jesus christ you're toxic. And the exact type of player this game doesn't need.
No it will make the offender think twice before he types ANYTHING into zone. He will realize that Zone crosses all the instances and that anything he says or does can and will be used against him, so he better think twice before he pulls the trigger.
This would actually be the perfect result assuming they implement new strategies to deal with the problem. If you can list any other MMO not made by Cryptic that let's players blindly ban another player for 24 hours (chat or game) i'd like to know. It's an insane policy and any company that isn't trying to use a game as a cash grab would never use it. There are far better options to dealing with gold spam.
People are switching the issue from "players" to "gold spammers"
That isn't the topic. It's about legitimate users getting banned for 24 hours from playing (essentially) because any other player can hit report on them without repercussions.
Yes because chatting in an MMO or listing items for sale in an MMO is a crime..... Go back to COD
WRONG... this was implemented to SUBSTANTIALLY cut off the flow of garbage in the Zone... and it seems to be working. Pretty soon, the zone will be a clear, calm place for important communications. And if what you have to say doesn't fit within the Zone.. you'll find out about it pretty quick. If you are worried about getting silenced for 24 hours, here's an easy solution for you.. STOP BLATHERING into a channel where 10,000+ people can hear you. So you think that people are abusing it and your going to get silenced unjustly? KEEP QUIET THEN AND DON"T DRAW ATTENTION TO YOURSELF. And soon enough, presto, the Zone will be a clean, quiet and calm place, the 'silencing' will wear off and the problem will be solved.
But it's not working at all.....
Also the report spam is "supposed" to be used for ... SPAM (according to the few that support it). Imagine that? Not to report everyone you want....
PS : Your age is showing.
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/forumdisplay.php?688-General-Discussion
I love how his solution is "This isn't working the way I want; everyone else should turn off Zone chat so it works the way I do."
Go make your own **** game if you want something to work a certain way. Most of us are fine with this system.
Yes, I realize it's +50 pages and I'm replying to the first; this speaks for the entire argument.
And now we're back to making things up.
Or they could go play RaiderZ, and see what it's like if there's no way to report a spammer easily. No barrier to entry; your existing PWE account for this game gets you in.
Use the trade channel or something else.
Higurashi no Naku Koro ni - Go watch it alone
Which means they have no system in place at all, which i'm not saying should happen. Derp.
I quoted you in a previous post that you completely ignored.
Moving on, it seems that EVERYONE agrees that zone spam is annoying. But this report spam doesn't stop anything, go look at zone in the main city at any time and you'll see it's always the same. There needs to be new methods in place to stop it.
Banning people from chatting completely is not a solution.
That's a bold statement.
I also don't think you understand how the system works if you ignored my entire first post.
So where did this brand new player find this super awesome lvl 20 item to sell? On the bridge? Did somebody drop it for an alt?
I don't spam chat wanting to sell stuff, buy stuff or join groups. In fact, since you brought it up, I'll point it out again; spam Zone chat all you want, I already have it turned off. I have it turned off because, as in almost every other MMO it is full of gold spammers, trade spammers which really aren't much better, and 12 year olds who's parents aren't home, so they can throw out all the abusive language/racial slurs they want because, as I said, the parents aren't home, and you can't reach through the monitor to slap the taste out of their mouths. So I shut it off, as soon as I log in. I'll even make a private channel where it's possible, if I'm not in a guild. So I say, yeah, everyone should take your advice, and turn Zone chat off. Then the only ones posting will be people trying to sell stuff. It really truly is a novel idea, there would only be gold spammers the occasional new player, and a bunch of people that can't understand why nobody is responding to their sales.
I don't think you understand how the system works. The marks don't necessarily get erased until you're muted. You may have gathered them over time.
If you really want to see how much everyone feels about it, create a poll and we'll express our opinions in number.
In fact, to hell with it. I'll make one.