From what I've seen, people are saying they want to spend money but feel the prices are too high and that certain MMO staples (respecs) are locked away in the cash shop. They aren't "whining and crying or threatening to firebomb cryptic" they are simply voicing their concerns in the hope that PWE makes the prices more reasonable.
Then there's the other end of the spectrum, that not only blindly accepts any and all nickle and diming, but actively defends it and attacks those who voice concerns.
That's not to say there aren't people who don't want to pay for anything and just complain for the sake of complaining, but they seem to be in the minority here.
^ This guys sums up what is going on here. The most aggressive, rude and 'here, my fist in your mouth' members are the ones who actually defend the game/devs blindly.
Let me tell you people, this is not GOD, this is not RELIGION, you don't have to follow it and throw your money at it, it wont help you!
But...but I just had to spend the kids college fund on those strippers, "They coerced me!!" and they should be liable for tempting me!!!
or
I just had to buy that eightball, the dealer coerced me!!
:rolleyes:
All you are saying is the cash shop kicks so much *** you feel like you have to buy, that isn't PWE problem, that means they are very good marketers.
This game has power over people... achievement unlocked for Cryptic.
I like the way you talk, you have some right ideas but some things you just don't get or don't want too, you are one of those blinded guys I was talking above. I have been sitting idle, just reading the forum, but i had to reply, because people like you, "the defenders of faith, of truth and justice" actually only make things worse around here. For me, you are more hurtful to this forum and the community in general than those winners and 12 years you are complaining about. Because all you use in your comments, is irony and maybe some...humor if you wanna call it that.
Now, about the coercion above, its like comparing apples to A bombs. "shanxtadeu" was actually right.
Neverwinter got a ton of advertising, everywhere i went on the web i saw an advert, just like that stripper who shoves her <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> in your mouth, and urges you to play with her! Get it? You still didn't pay a dime...but you still want more. The game also shows you all the SHINIES...and teases you. But like some guys said, the game will die in the long run if they keep up with this prices.
Look at any other game, you wont see this kind of prices. I am talking about very big games, not this small ones.
0
tribeca76Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Just like in any other F2P MMORPG, there has been a lot of controversy surrounding Neverwinter's Zen shop. I will try to shed some light on the current state of Neverwinter's F2P model by assuming a neutral stance. I hope this helps when you formulate some of your own opinions about this game.
1. Introduction
There are three immediate currency types in Neverwinter: Gold, Astral Diamonds, and Zen. Gold is obatained through normal means and buys the general necessities to play this game such as potions, basic profession items, basic mounts, and basic companions. Astral Diamonds are obtained through special tasks such as special daily quests, skirmish events, invoking your deity, and the Leadership profession. It buys a wide variety items ranging from Identify Scrolls to rare companions to mid-level gear. It is also the only currency usable in the Auction House. Zen is obtained through paying money. It buys many luxuries that helps give paying players a better experience overall. It may also be traded for Astral Diamonds and vice versa. For simplicity's sake, I will list the price of items in terms of USD instead of Zen.
2. Mounts
As a non-paying player of Neverwinter, you get three tokens at level 20 for a standard 50% speed horse that lasts for 5 hours. These horses can also be bought for 5 gold which is entirely manageable. To get a faster mount, you can buy Mount Training which upgrades any horse you own to 80% for 768,000 Astral Diamonds and 110% for 2,064,000 Astral Diamonds. This is progressive so you must buy them in order.
If you decide to drop some Zen for some fancier mounts, a standard 50% mount goes for 5-8 dollars, a rare 80% mount goes for 20-30 dollars, and an epic 110% mount goes for 30-40 dollars. The more expensive mounts of their respective tier has a unique model, such as the Worg and the Howler.
3. Inventory Space
You get a free bag at approximately level 10 and 30. They are 18 and 12 slots respectively. There are no craftable bags. For a free player, that means spending Astral Diamonds to buy extra inventory space. A 12 slot bag costs 6 dollars and a 24 slot bag costs 10 dollars.
A player starts out with 16 bank space. An extra 16 slots of bank space can be bought for 6 dollars.
4. Companions
Starting at level 16, a player is rewarded a free basic companion. These companions have two skills and have a rank cap of 15. An additional companion costs 2 gold each and may be switched anytime out of combat. All companions are disabled in PvP.
Zen buys a couple of companions which have a completely unique aesthetic. 15 dollars nets you an animal of your choice which have a rank cap of 15. 20 dollars hires a friend which has a rank cap of 20. 30-35 dollars gets you an epic quality pet that has a rank cap of 30 and three unique skills.
5. Professions
In Neverwinter, you gain Assets (workers) to do the work for you. Every profession starts you off with the most basic type of worker. You can have them do various amount of tasks on top of hiring more workers. Eventually you can combine 4 workers into an upgraded worker which allows you to tackle harder tasks. On top of these worker Assets, there are also tools Assets. These can be bought for 50s-1g each and have an 8% quality boost. Crafted items have a total of 4 slots for tools and 3 tiers for bonuses that is reached at 100% each.
In the Zen Shop, two different Profession packs exist: Professions Booster Pack and Professions Assets Pack. In the Booster Pack, there is 1 random (both quality and type) worker and random assortments of crafting items. In the Asset pack, there are 1 Purple or Blue Asset, 2 Purple Blue or Green Asset, 1 blue or green Asset and 1 green Asset (for a total of 5 guaranteed Assets). Any player may make any item, but paying customers will get an upwards of 20% stat increase on their crafted equipment.
6. Character
You can make up to 2 characters. Two additional character slots may be purchased for 5 dollars. You may also rename your character for 4 dollars.
Respeccing your skills costs 6 dollars. Respeccing your Feats costs Astral Diamonds determined by your current level.
Warning:
7. Runes
If nothing else, please read this part. This is potentially their biggest cash grab scheme and everyone should know how it works.
Players are given the option to add additional stats/effects to their equipment in Neverwinter. These come in the forms of Runestones (pets) and Enchantments (Armor/Weapon). For pets, the Runestones are split into Offense and Defense. For Enchantments, they are split into Offense, Utility, and Defense. A single Runestone/Enchantment provides different bonuses depending on which slot there are equipped to. These also have ranks and start from 1 and ends at 9. Four of the same kind may also fuse to move up a tier. The chance of success starts at 95% at rank 1 and 10% at rank 8. You will lose a single Runestone/Enchantment upon failure.
There are two ways to circumvent failure: Preservation Ward and Coalescent Ward. Preservation Wards cost 10 cents each and prevent the loss of materials upon failure. They are also only consumed upon failure. Coalescent Wards cost 10 dollars and guarantees success of fusion. Both these wards may also be obtained on a weekly basis through Celestial Coins (the latter being rarer). Now you may be wondering why there's a huge discrepancy between the two Wards. I was wondering for a while too until I stepped my foot into endgame and found out there was an entirely different type of Enchantments: The Armor/Weapon Enchantments.
Armor/Weapon Enchantments are for specific slots in your weapon/chest and grant special effects. They come in shards and have a chance to drop from Epic Dungeon bosses. You must combine 4 shards to create a Lesser version of the Enchantment. [However, the success chance of fusion is at a staggeringly low 1%](http://imgur.com/RSHW1mJ). To compensate, they have very strong effects. An example would be the [Thunderhead Enchantment](http://imgur.com/ZMBmsME). However, the real kicker here is that these "Lesser" versions may be fused again to gain a stronger version. Those may also be fused again to create the strongest version. Ultimately, the Greater Thunderhead Enchantment will have a 30% on crit to damage and stun foes. To create the strongest Enchantment possible, it will cost 160 dollars and 64 shards. Unlike companions, these can be used in PvP.
8. Conclusion
Cryptic wasn't lying when they said this game was 100% F2P. I have done all content on a GF and a DC without fancy Enchantments or Scrolls of Mass Life. However, I fear that a few weeks down the road, players who have paid vast amounts of money will have an incredibly unfair advantage in PvP, including the Gauntlgrym content they have yet to release. And while it is true that you can always buy Zen with Astral Diamonds, simply doing quests/professions/skirmishes is nowhere enough to realistically sustain yourself. I have tried and it is far too difficult to reach 24,000 rough astral diamonds on a daily basis. On Mindflayer, it currently costs 435,000 Astral Diamonds for 10 dollars worth of Zen. I'm sure the market will stabilize soon, but even then it will take non-paying players to take upwards of two weeks to upgrade a single Enchantment.
^ This guys sums up what is going on here. The most aggressive, rude and 'here, my fist in your mouth' members are the ones who actually defend the game/devs blindly.
Let me tell you people, this is not GOD, this is not RELIGION, you don't have to follow it and throw your money at it, it wont help you!
I like the way you talk, you have some right ideas but some things you just don't get or don't want too, you are one of those blinded guys I was talking above. I have been sitting idle, just reading the forum, but i had to reply, because people like you, "the defenders of faith, of truth and justice" actually only make things worse around here. For me, you are more hurtful to this forum and the community in general than those winners and 12 years you are complaining about. Because all you use in your comments, is irony and maybe some...humor if you wanna call it that.
Now, about the coercion above, its like comparing apples to A bombs. "shanxtadeu" was actually right.
Neverwinter got a ton of advertising, everywhere i went on the web i saw an advert, just like that stripper who shoves her <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> in your mouth, and urges you to play with her! Get it? You still didn't pay a dime...but you still want more. The game also shows you all the SHINIES...and teases you. But like some guys said, the game will die in the long run if they keep up with this prices.
Look at any other game, you wont see this kind of prices. I am talking about very big games, not this small ones.
Just like in any other F2P MMORPG, there has been a lot of controversy surrounding Neverwinter's Zen shop. I will try to shed some light on the current state of Neverwinter's F2P model by assuming a neutral stance. I hope this helps when you formulate some of your own opinions about this game.
1. Introduction
There are three immediate currency types in Neverwinter: Gold, Astral Diamonds, and Zen. Gold is obatained through normal means and buys the general necessities to play this game such as potions, basic profession items, basic mounts, and basic companions. Astral Diamonds are obtained through special tasks such as special daily quests, skirmish events, invoking your deity, and the Leadership profession. It buys a wide variety items ranging from Identify Scrolls to rare companions to mid-level gear. It is also the only currency usable in the Auction House. Zen is obtained through paying money. It buys many luxuries that helps give paying players a better experience overall. It may also be traded for Astral Diamonds and vice versa. For simplicity's sake, I will list the price of items in terms of USD instead of Zen.
2. Mounts
As a non-paying player of Neverwinter, you get three tokens at level 20 for a standard 50% speed horse that lasts for 5 hours. These horses can also be bought for 5 gold which is entirely manageable. To get a faster mount, you can buy Mount Training which upgrades any horse you own to 80% for 768,000 Astral Diamonds and 110% for 2,064,000 Astral Diamonds. This is progressive so you must buy them in order.
If you decide to drop some Zen for some fancier mounts, a standard 50% mount goes for 5-8 dollars, a rare 80% mount goes for 20-30 dollars, and an epic 110% mount goes for 30-40 dollars. The more expensive mounts of their respective tier has a unique model, such as the Worg and the Howler.
3. Inventory Space
You get a free bag at approximately level 10 and 30. They are 18 and 12 slots respectively. There are no craftable bags. For a free player, that means spending Astral Diamonds to buy extra inventory space. A 12 slot bag costs 6 dollars and a 24 slot bag costs 10 dollars.
A player starts out with 16 bank space. An extra 16 slots of bank space can be bought for 6 dollars.
4. Companions
Starting at level 16, a player is rewarded a free basic companion. These companions have two skills and have a rank cap of 15. An additional companion costs 2 gold each and may be switched anytime out of combat. All companions are disabled in PvP.
Zen buys a couple of companions which have a completely unique aesthetic. 15 dollars nets you an animal of your choice which have a rank cap of 15. 20 dollars hires a friend which has a rank cap of 20. 30-35 dollars gets you an epic quality pet that has a rank cap of 30 and three unique skills.
5. Professions
In Neverwinter, you gain Assets (workers) to do the work for you. Every profession starts you off with the most basic type of worker. You can have them do various amount of tasks on top of hiring more workers. Eventually you can combine 4 workers into an upgraded worker which allows you to tackle harder tasks. On top of these worker Assets, there are also tools Assets. These can be bought for 50s-1g each and have an 8% quality boost. Crafted items have a total of 4 slots for tools and 3 tiers for bonuses that is reached at 100% each.
In the Zen Shop, two different Profession packs exist: Professions Booster Pack and Professions Assets Pack. In the Booster Pack, there is 1 random (both quality and type) worker and random assortments of crafting items. In the Asset pack, there are 1 Purple or Blue Asset, 2 Purple Blue or Green Asset, 1 blue or green Asset and 1 green Asset (for a total of 5 guaranteed Assets). Any player may make any item, but paying customers will get an upwards of 20% stat increase on their crafted equipment.
6. Character
You can make up to 2 characters. Two additional character slots may be purchased for 5 dollars. You may also rename your character for 4 dollars.
Respeccing your skills costs 6 dollars. Respeccing your Feats costs Astral Diamonds determined by your current level.
Warning:
7. Runes
If nothing else, please read this part. This is potentially their biggest cash grab scheme and everyone should know how it works.
Players are given the option to add additional stats/effects to their equipment in Neverwinter. These come in the forms of Runestones (pets) and Enchantments (Armor/Weapon). For pets, the Runestones are split into Offense and Defense. For Enchantments, they are split into Offense, Utility, and Defense. A single Runestone/Enchantment provides different bonuses depending on which slot there are equipped to. These also have ranks and start from 1 and ends at 9. Four of the same kind may also fuse to move up a tier. The chance of success starts at 95% at rank 1 and 10% at rank 8. You will lose a single Runestone/Enchantment upon failure.
There are two ways to circumvent failure: Preservation Ward and Coalescent Ward. Preservation Wards cost 10 cents each and prevent the loss of materials upon failure. They are also only consumed upon failure. Coalescent Wards cost 10 dollars and guarantees success of fusion. Both these wards may also be obtained on a weekly basis through Celestial Coins (the latter being rarer). Now you may be wondering why there's a huge discrepancy between the two Wards. I was wondering for a while too until I stepped my foot into endgame and found out there was an entirely different type of Enchantments: The Armor/Weapon Enchantments.
Armor/Weapon Enchantments are for specific slots in your weapon/chest and grant special effects. They come in shards and have a chance to drop from Epic Dungeon bosses. You must combine 4 shards to create a Lesser version of the Enchantment. [However, the success chance of fusion is at a staggeringly low 1%](http://imgur.com/RSHW1mJ). To compensate, they have very strong effects. An example would be the [Thunderhead Enchantment](http://imgur.com/ZMBmsME). However, the real kicker here is that these "Lesser" versions may be fused again to gain a stronger version. Those may also be fused again to create the strongest version. Ultimately, the Greater Thunderhead Enchantment will have a 30% on crit to damage and stun foes. To create the strongest Enchantment possible, it will cost 160 dollars and 64 shards. Unlike companions, these can be used in PvP.
8. Conclusion
Cryptic wasn't lying when they said this game was 100% F2P. I have done all content on a GF and a DC without fancy Enchantments or Scrolls of Mass Life. However, I fear that a few weeks down the road, players who have paid vast amounts of money will have an incredibly unfair advantage in PvP, including the Gauntlgrym content they have yet to release. And while it is true that you can always buy Zen with Astral Diamonds, simply doing quests/professions/skirmishes is nowhere enough to realistically sustain yourself. I have tried and it is far too difficult to reach 24,000 rough astral diamonds on a daily basis. On Mindflayer, it currently costs 435,000 Astral Diamonds for 10 dollars worth of Zen. I'm sure the market will stabilize soon, but even then it will take non-paying players to take upwards of two weeks to upgrade a single Enchantment.
Is your signature a announcement for the Diablo 3 expansion pack?
^ This guys sums up what is going on here. The most aggressive, rude and 'here, my fist in your mouth' members are the ones who actually defend the game/devs blindly.
Let me tell you people, this is not GOD, this is not RELIGION, you don't have to follow it and throw your money at it, it wont help you!
I like the way you talk, you have some right ideas but some things you just don't get or don't want too, you are one of those blinded guys I was talking above. I have been sitting idle, just reading the forum, but i had to reply, because people like you, "the defenders of faith, of truth and justice" actually only make things worse around here. For me, you are more hurtful to this forum and the community in general than those winners and 12 years you are complaining about. Because all you use in your comments, is irony and maybe some...humor if you wanna call it that.
So because I make solid points with humor, I should stop talking because, it doesn't further the revolution?
Now, about the coercion above, its like comparing apples to A bombs. "shanxtadeu" was actually right.
Neverwinter got a ton of advertising, everywhere i went on the web i saw an advert, just like that stripper who shoves her <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> in your mouth, and urges you to play with her! Get it? You still didn't pay a dime...but you still want more. The game also shows you all the SHINIES...and teases you. But like some guys said, the game will die in the long run if they keep up with this prices.
It's called willpower, I am faced with temptations every day, acting on them is the difference.
^ This guys sums up what is going on here. The most aggressive, rude and 'here, my fist in your mouth' members are the ones who actually defend the game/devs blindly.
Let me tell you people, this is not GOD, this is not RELIGION, you don't have to follow it and throw your money at it, it wont help you!
I like the way you talk, you have some right ideas but some things you just don't get or don't want too, you are one of those blinded guys I was talking above. I have been sitting idle, just reading the forum, but i had to reply, because people like you, "the defenders of faith, of truth and justice" actually only make things worse around here. For me, you are more hurtful to this forum and the community in general than those winners and 12 years you are complaining about. Because all you use in your comments, is irony and maybe some...humor if you wanna call it that.
Now, about the coercion above, its like comparing apples to A bombs. "shanxtadeu" was actually right.
Neverwinter got a ton of advertising, everywhere i went on the web i saw an advert, just like that stripper who shoves her <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> in your mouth, and urges you to play with her! Get it? You still didn't pay a dime...but you still want more. The game also shows you all the SHINIES...and teases you. But like some guys said, the game will die in the long run if they keep up with this prices.
Look at any other game, you wont see this kind of prices. I am talking about very big games, not this small ones.
Thank god no one forces you to play sheesh, that would be terrible no?
It's called willpower, I am faced with temptations every day, acting on them is the difference.
Allods, Second Life, and Vindictus would like to have a word with you.
A person could owns a strong willpower, but could it be unbreakable? You can resist some temptations, but can you resist all? Do you never ate a chocolate bar after days being tempted even knowing you shouldn't?
I haven't met any person with a unbreakable willpower yet ...
This game is a lot of fun. If you don't believe something is worth the money don't buy it. That is the way the world works. Companies exist to make money. To say a company is greedy is silly. No one is entitled to anything. It is also silly to say a company will fail if they don't listen to people ranting on a forum. Only the people running the company know what their business plan is and if the plan is working or not. If people pay the price being asked it will remain the same or go up. If people don't pay the price asked it will go down. I really don't see what all the fuss is about.
Ok, I have issues with the cash shop and monetization, but 'unbreakable willpower' isn't needed.
You can certainly budget $15/month + $60 in 'savings' for cash shop, treat it as a sub game, except with the freedom of *when* to pay.
Or, if you have the money and think it's worth it, put in $100+, whatever. IF you think it's worth it for your pixels -_-
Otherwise, don't spend money. Or just $10 for the bag. Or forget about the bag (on principle) and keep the quest-given bags until you have the AD to convert (in a less inflated market weeks from now) to Zen for it.
The only things I've seen that may be utterly P2W are the runes, and I'll have to wait til Lv 60 to see if that's hyperbole, and just requires some grinding + dailies whenever you're playing + praying in game + a good Foundry for tips + smart use of the Auction House (especially this one) to thrive.
Because it seems with people's calculations, it doesn't put into play the possibly massive amounts of AD you might make from AH, the lowering of AD/Zen conversion rates that WILL happen and already ARE happening, and how Cryptic WILL pull sales, lower prices, offer more bundles, and more ways to even get AD.
I'm totally against cash shops + F2P games but when I look at Neverwinter, ultimately, I'm seeing P4Convienience (aka getting to the top faster), instead of P2W (unless your goal is first server kill for a boss, ahem).
0
felixng2013Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 10Arc User
edited May 2013
I don't understand how people don't get the concept that you can buy Zen with astro diamonds. Keep in mind the Zen to astro diamond ratio will get better over time. A lot of people have astro diamonds from founder packs.
The F2p games I have played have never been limited in any way. I only have one major issue and that is the pay to respec aspect of the game. You basically have to save up an absurd amount of AD to respec, pay real money or start over. Never had to pay for this feature since its so restrictive to game play. Eitherway, it's a good game I have enjoyed myself but I just cant play a game that I can't have the freedom of altering my spec without dishing out cash to do it. It's an obvious money grab and alot of people agree with me. Those who have alot of disposable income tend not to care. The current buisness model is way overboard and is making me feel untrusting with Cryptic. When you see obvious greed in a F2P it's a bad sign. No one begrudges Cryptic from cashing in but if you truely look at the game and its mechanics its actually funny what you will see. They will claim bug but its not to many things steer you to feeling as if you have to buy this or that.
Because people are generally bitter, nasty mean little things. That is why they are complaining!
I was eating some Lucky Charms the other day..I was offended. My marsh mellow to cereal ratio was completely out of whack. I went to their forums and gave them hell.
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adamaantMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
A lot of players are being unrealistic in their complaints, that's true. But you can't write off all the people complaining about the prices. Some players do acknowledge that Cryptic and Perfect World need to make money, but still feel strongly that certain items in the game are too expensive.
I think that, and I bought a founder's pack. I've bought Zen. I've spent that Zen. I can afford the current prices for the things I really want.
But I still wish some things were cheaper.
I completely agree. I too have spent money and bought founders pack, but there needs to be more balance in the shop prices. Part of the problem is they do not seem to pattern their prices based on what other MMOs charge for things. We are used to seeing bags being fairly cheap or free if you make them yourselves. We are used to Pets and Hirelings/Mercs being fairly cheap too, at least ones you rent. Many other basic items are just too expensive for a lot of us. There are ways around it. Have some cash shop stuff drop as loot. Keys, professional assets, stuff like that would go a long way. That would at least reward dedicated players. All in all a fun game, but I really hope that some changes happen in the shop.
0
tykytysMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Man, if level 1-20 is "awesome," then I'm worried about lvls 21-60. My experience at low levels is that this game is positively bog standard. If I have to watch one more ogre/orc/undead thing start its really long, slow, tedious attack animation- giving me five seconds to move out of its way- I think I'll cry.
I shudder to think about what it'll be like to level another character when, eventually, new classes are released. Since I see _no_ indication that more low-level official content is in the works, it'll be the same "kill ten foozles, now kill ten more in a slightly different sewer/basement/attic system" all over again.
Then again, for the grand total of "free," the game's just fine.
Sigh...because it is only "free" to people who feel that leeching off of the work of others is an OK thing to do. If you enjoy the game...you spend money on it. If you don't...you quit playing. Thus the rationale of a cash shop containing "must have" items like bags makes sense. Frustrate anyone who likes the game enough with very little inventory space and they'll eventually pony up to support the game you spent so much time and effort making. Thats all fine and dandy.
The problem is the COST of the things in the cash shop are completely out of whack with what you are receiving...and with many (I can't say all) other FTP games on the market...an obvious exception being every other Perfect World game since the problem is company wide.
Hundreds of dollars into this game and I don't feel like I got a freaking thing worth having. Ten bucks for a bag?
Thirty for a working companion...because they can't be bothered to fix the ones you get in game for free?
$15 for a random...and nearly always useless...profession bag which is the ONLY way to get VITAL items for use in professions?
Sorry...not the only way...you can spend obscene amounts of real money on getting them from other players in the AH too...
A consumer...and those of us who bought founder packs ARE consumers and not freeloaders...has the obligation to make his displeasure with a company known. A significant portion of the blame obviously lies with us for buying blindly into a game...but if the devs want the game to survive they need to listen. This ain't Star Trek with a significant number of older and more affluent fans so attached to the IP that they can and will keep the game afloat financially...its a dime a dozen fantasy game which does some things right...and some wrong...
We all know how fickle the fantasy MMO crowd can afford to be with the glut in the market of quality games...
Man, if level 1-20 is "awesome," then I'm worried about lvls 21-60. My experience at low levels is that this game is positively bog standard. If I have to watch one more ogre/orc/undead thing start its really long, slow, tedious attack animation- giving me five seconds to move out of its way- I think I'll cry.
I shudder to think about what it'll be like to level another character when, eventually, new classes are released. Since I see _no_ indication that more low-level official content is in the works, it'll be the same "kill ten foozles, now kill ten more in a slightly different sewer/basement/attic system" all over again.
Then again, for the grand total of "free," the game's just fine.
Look...no disagreements from me on your post...but I do have to ask if you've ever played an MMO before? And if so...why you expected this one to be any different from all the rest?
So, they give us a free game to play and there is still a bunch of complaints about the cash store? When was the last time a game came out without any cash out of pocket from its gamers? Much less a game of this quality? Anything you can buy with real money is obtainable in the game for free with a little thing called playing the game. It may take you longer to get it......but you can do it. All i see are a bunch of gimme gimme and why does it cost so much! There is NO subscription, there are people always on, it looks great, you don't have to search for parties to do the dungeons, I mean come on! So you don't wanna pay $35 for a Honey Badger, then go for the dog, cat or cleric that they give you in game. You don't have enough bag space? Well in the tabletop game you can't even carry that many things without an encumbrance penalty! The things in the Zen store are mostly vanity and cosmetic things. (I have spent money in the Zen Store and I swore I wouldn't, but I had to have a Honey Badger companion...but I didn't need it.) I am a registered DM with Wizards of the Coast. I really think that this game captures a little of that tabletop goodness mixed with MMO style. Much better than the previous D&D MMO. I for one will be playing this game for some time to come and I have recommended it to a few of my weekly adventurers. Now we have one pen and paper day and three online days. IT'S FREE PEOPLE! You gotta expect them to make some kinda money! I swear, you can't even give people anything. see ya on the Sword Coast!
I'm liking the game right to spend money but not the amount they are asking for. It's great for a FTP but the prices are outrageous. Right now this game is only a small time sink until a certain game comes out in 2014.
So, they give us a free game to play and there is still a bunch of complaints about the cash store? When was the last time a game came out without any cash out of pocket from its gamers? Much less a game of this quality? Anything you can buy with real money is obtainable in the game for free with a little thing called playing the game. It may take you longer to get it......but you can do it. All i see are a bunch of gimme gimme and why does it cost so much! There is NO subscription, there are people always on, it looks great, you don't have to search for parties to do the dungeons, I mean come on! So you don't wanna pay $35 for a Honey Badger, then go for the dog, cat or cleric that they give you in game. You don't have enough bag space? Well in the tabletop game you can't even carry that many things without an encumbrance penalty! The things in the Zen store are mostly vanity and cosmetic things. (I have spent money in the Zen Store and I swore I wouldn't, but I had to have a Honey Badger companion...but I didn't need it.) I am a registered DM with Wizards of the Coast. I really think that this game captures a little of that tabletop goodness mixed with MMO style. Much better than the previous D&D MMO. I for one will be playing this game for some time to come and I have recommended it to a few of my weekly adventurers. Now we have one pen and paper day and three online days. IT'S FREE PEOPLE! You gotta expect them to make some kinda money! I swear, you can't even give people anything. see ya on the Sword Coast!
The reason, for me at least, is that the game is decent enough on it's own merit that it doesn't really need to stoop to this despicable model. Has nothing to do with entitlement or gimme gimme, or else I can just go hang out with my kiwi on Path of Exile (if you don't understand, those were given to early paid supporters of the free to play game).
I have spent money on F2P games before, one was PoE like I said and the other was LOTRO. One of those I felt good about supporting, and would do it again. The other left me feeling like a cheap and dirty two bit ***** and guilty- and will not do it again. I'm sure you can figure out which is which.
well, still. most of the game is free and bags aren't $1000. you can pay if you want to. but it actually isn't required. The complaints come about things you want to have not need.
gonna repeat to you what i have said a dozen times to other people
JUST BECAUSE WE DO NOT NEED IT DOES NOT MEAN YOU CAN OVER PRICE IT!
you guys NEED to understand that, other companys are chaging LESS per bag, or inventory slot, or giving out a ton more for far far far far cheaper. Can name any subscription game on the market and you get 20x's more stuff for that 15 a month, you can not subsist on 15 dollars a month in this game. Its impossible to do it...and that is the bottom line!
Its not that they are charging for this stuff, its that the inherent price is far far far higher then the competition. We arent talking a 10% mark up here we are talking 100-200% markup... that is ABSURD!
Comments
^ This guys sums up what is going on here. The most aggressive, rude and 'here, my fist in your mouth' members are the ones who actually defend the game/devs blindly.
Let me tell you people, this is not GOD, this is not RELIGION, you don't have to follow it and throw your money at it, it wont help you!
I like the way you talk, you have some right ideas but some things you just don't get or don't want too, you are one of those blinded guys I was talking above. I have been sitting idle, just reading the forum, but i had to reply, because people like you, "the defenders of faith, of truth and justice" actually only make things worse around here. For me, you are more hurtful to this forum and the community in general than those winners and 12 years you are complaining about. Because all you use in your comments, is irony and maybe some...humor if you wanna call it that.
Now, about the coercion above, its like comparing apples to A bombs. "shanxtadeu" was actually right.
Neverwinter got a ton of advertising, everywhere i went on the web i saw an advert, just like that stripper who shoves her <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> in your mouth, and urges you to play with her! Get it? You still didn't pay a dime...but you still want more. The game also shows you all the SHINIES...and teases you. But like some guys said, the game will die in the long run if they keep up with this prices.
Look at any other game, you wont see this kind of prices. I am talking about very big games, not this small ones.
Just like in any other F2P MMORPG, there has been a lot of controversy surrounding Neverwinter's Zen shop. I will try to shed some light on the current state of Neverwinter's F2P model by assuming a neutral stance. I hope this helps when you formulate some of your own opinions about this game.
1. Introduction
There are three immediate currency types in Neverwinter: Gold, Astral Diamonds, and Zen. Gold is obatained through normal means and buys the general necessities to play this game such as potions, basic profession items, basic mounts, and basic companions. Astral Diamonds are obtained through special tasks such as special daily quests, skirmish events, invoking your deity, and the Leadership profession. It buys a wide variety items ranging from Identify Scrolls to rare companions to mid-level gear. It is also the only currency usable in the Auction House. Zen is obtained through paying money. It buys many luxuries that helps give paying players a better experience overall. It may also be traded for Astral Diamonds and vice versa. For simplicity's sake, I will list the price of items in terms of USD instead of Zen.
2. Mounts
As a non-paying player of Neverwinter, you get three tokens at level 20 for a standard 50% speed horse that lasts for 5 hours. These horses can also be bought for 5 gold which is entirely manageable. To get a faster mount, you can buy Mount Training which upgrades any horse you own to 80% for 768,000 Astral Diamonds and 110% for 2,064,000 Astral Diamonds. This is progressive so you must buy them in order.
If you decide to drop some Zen for some fancier mounts, a standard 50% mount goes for 5-8 dollars, a rare 80% mount goes for 20-30 dollars, and an epic 110% mount goes for 30-40 dollars. The more expensive mounts of their respective tier has a unique model, such as the Worg and the Howler.
3. Inventory Space
You get a free bag at approximately level 10 and 30. They are 18 and 12 slots respectively. There are no craftable bags. For a free player, that means spending Astral Diamonds to buy extra inventory space. A 12 slot bag costs 6 dollars and a 24 slot bag costs 10 dollars.
A player starts out with 16 bank space. An extra 16 slots of bank space can be bought for 6 dollars.
4. Companions
Starting at level 16, a player is rewarded a free basic companion. These companions have two skills and have a rank cap of 15. An additional companion costs 2 gold each and may be switched anytime out of combat. All companions are disabled in PvP.
Zen buys a couple of companions which have a completely unique aesthetic. 15 dollars nets you an animal of your choice which have a rank cap of 15. 20 dollars hires a friend which has a rank cap of 20. 30-35 dollars gets you an epic quality pet that has a rank cap of 30 and three unique skills.
5. Professions
In Neverwinter, you gain Assets (workers) to do the work for you. Every profession starts you off with the most basic type of worker. You can have them do various amount of tasks on top of hiring more workers. Eventually you can combine 4 workers into an upgraded worker which allows you to tackle harder tasks. On top of these worker Assets, there are also tools Assets. These can be bought for 50s-1g each and have an 8% quality boost. Crafted items have a total of 4 slots for tools and 3 tiers for bonuses that is reached at 100% each.
In the Zen Shop, two different Profession packs exist: Professions Booster Pack and Professions Assets Pack. In the Booster Pack, there is 1 random (both quality and type) worker and random assortments of crafting items. In the Asset pack, there are 1 Purple or Blue Asset, 2 Purple Blue or Green Asset, 1 blue or green Asset and 1 green Asset (for a total of 5 guaranteed Assets). Any player may make any item, but paying customers will get an upwards of 20% stat increase on their crafted equipment.
6. Character
You can make up to 2 characters. Two additional character slots may be purchased for 5 dollars. You may also rename your character for 4 dollars.
Respeccing your skills costs 6 dollars. Respeccing your Feats costs Astral Diamonds determined by your current level.
Warning:
7. Runes
If nothing else, please read this part. This is potentially their biggest cash grab scheme and everyone should know how it works.
Players are given the option to add additional stats/effects to their equipment in Neverwinter. These come in the forms of Runestones (pets) and Enchantments (Armor/Weapon). For pets, the Runestones are split into Offense and Defense. For Enchantments, they are split into Offense, Utility, and Defense. A single Runestone/Enchantment provides different bonuses depending on which slot there are equipped to. These also have ranks and start from 1 and ends at 9. Four of the same kind may also fuse to move up a tier. The chance of success starts at 95% at rank 1 and 10% at rank 8. You will lose a single Runestone/Enchantment upon failure.
There are two ways to circumvent failure: Preservation Ward and Coalescent Ward. Preservation Wards cost 10 cents each and prevent the loss of materials upon failure. They are also only consumed upon failure. Coalescent Wards cost 10 dollars and guarantees success of fusion. Both these wards may also be obtained on a weekly basis through Celestial Coins (the latter being rarer). Now you may be wondering why there's a huge discrepancy between the two Wards. I was wondering for a while too until I stepped my foot into endgame and found out there was an entirely different type of Enchantments: The Armor/Weapon Enchantments.
Armor/Weapon Enchantments are for specific slots in your weapon/chest and grant special effects. They come in shards and have a chance to drop from Epic Dungeon bosses. You must combine 4 shards to create a Lesser version of the Enchantment. [However, the success chance of fusion is at a staggeringly low 1%](http://imgur.com/RSHW1mJ). To compensate, they have very strong effects. An example would be the [Thunderhead Enchantment](http://imgur.com/ZMBmsME). However, the real kicker here is that these "Lesser" versions may be fused again to gain a stronger version. Those may also be fused again to create the strongest version. Ultimately, the Greater Thunderhead Enchantment will have a 30% on crit to damage and stun foes. To create the strongest Enchantment possible, it will cost 160 dollars and 64 shards. Unlike companions, these can be used in PvP.
8. Conclusion
Cryptic wasn't lying when they said this game was 100% F2P. I have done all content on a GF and a DC without fancy Enchantments or Scrolls of Mass Life. However, I fear that a few weeks down the road, players who have paid vast amounts of money will have an incredibly unfair advantage in PvP, including the Gauntlgrym content they have yet to release. And while it is true that you can always buy Zen with Astral Diamonds, simply doing quests/professions/skirmishes is nowhere enough to realistically sustain yourself. I have tried and it is far too difficult to reach 24,000 rough astral diamonds on a daily basis. On Mindflayer, it currently costs 435,000 Astral Diamonds for 10 dollars worth of Zen. I'm sure the market will stabilize soon, but even then it will take non-paying players to take upwards of two weeks to upgrade a single Enchantment.
http://www.bulwarkclan.net/neverwinter
A PVE Guild
Or like a xvideoslive show lol =P
Is your signature a announcement for the Diablo 3 expansion pack?
So because I make solid points with humor, I should stop talking because, it doesn't further the revolution?
Sorry I was never a useful idiot.
It's called willpower, I am faced with temptations every day, acting on them is the difference.
Allods, Second Life, and Vindictus would like to have a word with you.
Thank god no one forces you to play sheesh, that would be terrible no?
A person could owns a strong willpower, but could it be unbreakable? You can resist some temptations, but can you resist all? Do you never ate a chocolate bar after days being tempted even knowing you shouldn't?
I haven't met any person with a unbreakable willpower yet ...
The people who get the free 2 play option should pay instead.
You can certainly budget $15/month + $60 in 'savings' for cash shop, treat it as a sub game, except with the freedom of *when* to pay.
Or, if you have the money and think it's worth it, put in $100+, whatever. IF you think it's worth it for your pixels -_-
Otherwise, don't spend money. Or just $10 for the bag. Or forget about the bag (on principle) and keep the quest-given bags until you have the AD to convert (in a less inflated market weeks from now) to Zen for it.
The only things I've seen that may be utterly P2W are the runes, and I'll have to wait til Lv 60 to see if that's hyperbole, and just requires some grinding + dailies whenever you're playing + praying in game + a good Foundry for tips + smart use of the Auction House (especially this one) to thrive.
Because it seems with people's calculations, it doesn't put into play the possibly massive amounts of AD you might make from AH, the lowering of AD/Zen conversion rates that WILL happen and already ARE happening, and how Cryptic WILL pull sales, lower prices, offer more bundles, and more ways to even get AD.
I'm totally against cash shops + F2P games but when I look at Neverwinter, ultimately, I'm seeing P4Convienience (aka getting to the top faster), instead of P2W (unless your goal is first server kill for a boss, ahem).
I was eating some Lucky Charms the other day..I was offended. My marsh mellow to cereal ratio was completely out of whack. I went to their forums and gave them hell.
I completely agree. I too have spent money and bought founders pack, but there needs to be more balance in the shop prices. Part of the problem is they do not seem to pattern their prices based on what other MMOs charge for things. We are used to seeing bags being fairly cheap or free if you make them yourselves. We are used to Pets and Hirelings/Mercs being fairly cheap too, at least ones you rent. Many other basic items are just too expensive for a lot of us. There are ways around it. Have some cash shop stuff drop as loot. Keys, professional assets, stuff like that would go a long way. That would at least reward dedicated players. All in all a fun game, but I really hope that some changes happen in the shop.
Man, if level 1-20 is "awesome," then I'm worried about lvls 21-60. My experience at low levels is that this game is positively bog standard. If I have to watch one more ogre/orc/undead thing start its really long, slow, tedious attack animation- giving me five seconds to move out of its way- I think I'll cry.
I shudder to think about what it'll be like to level another character when, eventually, new classes are released. Since I see _no_ indication that more low-level official content is in the works, it'll be the same "kill ten foozles, now kill ten more in a slightly different sewer/basement/attic system" all over again.
Then again, for the grand total of "free," the game's just fine.
The problem is the COST of the things in the cash shop are completely out of whack with what you are receiving...and with many (I can't say all) other FTP games on the market...an obvious exception being every other Perfect World game since the problem is company wide.
Hundreds of dollars into this game and I don't feel like I got a freaking thing worth having. Ten bucks for a bag?
Thirty for a working companion...because they can't be bothered to fix the ones you get in game for free?
$15 for a random...and nearly always useless...profession bag which is the ONLY way to get VITAL items for use in professions?
Sorry...not the only way...you can spend obscene amounts of real money on getting them from other players in the AH too...
A consumer...and those of us who bought founder packs ARE consumers and not freeloaders...has the obligation to make his displeasure with a company known. A significant portion of the blame obviously lies with us for buying blindly into a game...but if the devs want the game to survive they need to listen. This ain't Star Trek with a significant number of older and more affluent fans so attached to the IP that they can and will keep the game afloat financially...its a dime a dozen fantasy game which does some things right...and some wrong...
We all know how fickle the fantasy MMO crowd can afford to be with the glut in the market of quality games...
Look...no disagreements from me on your post...but I do have to ask if you've ever played an MMO before? And if so...why you expected this one to be any different from all the rest?
Just curious...
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
The reason, for me at least, is that the game is decent enough on it's own merit that it doesn't really need to stoop to this despicable model. Has nothing to do with entitlement or gimme gimme, or else I can just go hang out with my kiwi on Path of Exile (if you don't understand, those were given to early paid supporters of the free to play game).
I have spent money on F2P games before, one was PoE like I said and the other was LOTRO. One of those I felt good about supporting, and would do it again. The other left me feeling like a cheap and dirty two bit ***** and guilty- and will not do it again. I'm sure you can figure out which is which.
gonna repeat to you what i have said a dozen times to other people
JUST BECAUSE WE DO NOT NEED IT DOES NOT MEAN YOU CAN OVER PRICE IT!
you guys NEED to understand that, other companys are chaging LESS per bag, or inventory slot, or giving out a ton more for far far far far cheaper. Can name any subscription game on the market and you get 20x's more stuff for that 15 a month, you can not subsist on 15 dollars a month in this game. Its impossible to do it...and that is the bottom line!
Its not that they are charging for this stuff, its that the inherent price is far far far higher then the competition. We arent talking a 10% mark up here we are talking 100-200% markup... that is ABSURD!