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[Suggestion] Multiple Spec's

jetahjetah Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
edited April 2013 in General Discussion (PC)
It would be wonderful if Cryptic would give us the ability to purchase multiple spec tabs from the Zen Store. Multi Spec would be designed to allow to spec for certain play styles.

While leveling I'll be spec'd for healing (Cleric) for our group. If I want to solo my damage would be horrible. Right now I'd have to buy a respec token for solo play. If another spec could be purchased for say 500 Zen, I could have one spec for the group leveling and one spec for Solo. The nice thing about multi spec tabs is it could be an unlimited number or just be limited to 5 or 10.

Looking at the current UI setup for Paragon Paths, I can see Cryptic will add new paths for each current class. If my cleric can become a battle cleric I could use a multi spec tab for that. I will say that I wouldn't spend 500z to respec to it. I would, however, respec a spec tab to use the new Paragon Path.

What are you thoughts and idea's. Would you respec to a new Paragon Path leaving behind the previous or you would want multiple spec tabs introduced so you could switch between them? Would you respec often? Will you respec at all?

[edited to add]
How would we switch specs?
The UI would have a button to click. select the Tab you wanted, click the switch button and this tab would become your active spec.

Where could we switch?
At portable altars, at campfires. As long as you were not taking damage you could switch.

Would there be a cast time on the switch?
Yes. This way you couldn't switch while fighting. Cryptic would have to find a good time for the switch.



Note I'm not talking about using the free Respec Token in the Founders' Pack. I'm excluding that for right now. I know I'll use it after I hit 60 and start experimenting.
Open the Launcher. Click Options near the top. Check Disable on-demand patching. This will download another couple of gigs.

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Post edited by jetah on
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    richardseatonrichardseaton Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 87
    edited April 2013
    Other games do have separate specs for PVE and PVP. I would be ok with that.
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    zovyazovya Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    It really is easy enough to have 2 characters. I'd like to see this feature too, but just in case they never implement it.
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    jetahjetah Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    zovya wrote: »
    It really is easy enough to have 2 characters. I'd like to see this feature too, but just in case they never implement it.

    if every class has 5 paragon paths, you'd have 25 characters? or more if you want to pvp, solo, group (maybe raid), etc.
    Open the Launcher. Click Options near the top. Check Disable on-demand patching. This will download another couple of gigs.

    Ability Scores || All Attribute Roll Combinations || My Cleric Stream \o/
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    colhatickcolhatick Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    I wouldn't mind it once more paths are put into the game. Probably a good feature for them to add in the future.
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    jetahjetah Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    colhatick wrote: »
    I wouldn't mind it once more paths are put into the game. Probably a good feature for them to add in the future.

    I wasn't implying that come open beta start this should be in. but something down the line (but earlier than 3 years).
    Open the Launcher. Click Options near the top. Check Disable on-demand patching. This will download another couple of gigs.

    Ability Scores || All Attribute Roll Combinations || My Cleric Stream \o/
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    jkaplan92jkaplan92 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 111 Bounty Hunter
    edited April 2013
    I doubt they will, they'd rather force you to have to respec every time thus forcing you to pay for a respec token every single time even though you're switching between 2 builds.
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    jetahjetah Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    jkaplan92 wrote: »
    I doubt they will, they'd rather force you to have to respec every time thus forcing you to pay for a respec token every single time even though you're switching between 2 builds.

    I'm not paying 10$ per switch (to new spec, then back).

    Also note that you could respec inside the tab if you wanted to change something.
    Open the Launcher. Click Options near the top. Check Disable on-demand patching. This will download another couple of gigs.

    Ability Scores || All Attribute Roll Combinations || My Cleric Stream \o/
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    morvek01morvek01 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 118 Bounty Hunter
    edited April 2013
    we really do need one skillset for pvp and another for pve. please.
    If you can't be constructive in your criticism, go back to world-of-whiners.
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    kilo418kilo418 Member Posts: 823 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Game is free. Have separate characters, or even separate accounts, for your specs.
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    jetahjetah Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    kilo418 wrote: »
    Game is free. Have separate characters, or even separate accounts, for your specs.

    true, however if each class has 5 paragon paths. and there are 5 classes, that would 25 total combinations. I'm not rolling 12 accounts to accommodate all these. Now when they add in new classes and/or new paths.. yeah wont happen.
    Open the Launcher. Click Options near the top. Check Disable on-demand patching. This will download another couple of gigs.

    Ability Scores || All Attribute Roll Combinations || My Cleric Stream \o/
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    jkaplan92jkaplan92 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 111 Bounty Hunter
    edited April 2013
    jetah wrote: »
    I'm not paying 10$ per switch (to new spec, then back).

    Also note that you could respec inside the tab if you wanted to change something.

    I agree with you completely, I just don't see it happening in the near future... I feel the need to have a pvp an d pve spec, and because of the way things are setup currently i will be forced to use one spec for both which makes me feel less than optimal in both. I don't think cryptic will make a change until people realize how messed up this system is. Right now everyone has their hype glasses on and is pumped for the 25th... I think in a few months this will probably be one of the biggest issues in this game/most complained about. I think its sad that Cryptic feels the need to constrict their players this severely in an effort to generate profit instead of having confidence in their ability to continually create compelling content to sell to the players. There's too much negative reinforcement in this game. Too many situations where players will feel the need to buy things because of the constrictions built into the game rather than buying things because they just want them, because they look cool, or because they add depth to the game.

    The bottom line is that cryptics strategy is to cut standard MMO features out of their game and make them purchaseable. Identification scrolls, having to buy rez stones instead of having rez abilities, having to pay to respec, etc are all examples of this. In my opinion its a better strategy to build a core game that is complete and then to sell positive additions to that game and cosmetic options. Theres a reason why league of legends is taking over gaming.
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    deathssickledeathssickle Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Im a big DnD fan, I like to play with my Characters skills, feats, etc. It doesnt produce the most streamlined, min maxed character but it makes things interesting, and I like that and interesting character that, once you know how to play the way it is built can be very BA at times. Its one reason I loved the Diablo franchise(before D3) I like to customize and try to "balance" or unbalance my character as I please. Im not worried about dual specing, but I will make use of it if it makes it ingame sometime.
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    jetahjetah Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Im a big DnD fan, I like to play with my Characters skills, feats, etc. It doesnt produce the most streamlined, min maxed character but it makes things interesting, and I like that and interesting character that, once you know how to play the way it is built can be very BA at times. Its one reason I loved the Diablo franchise(before D3) I like to customize and try to "balance" or unbalance my character as I please. Im not worried about dual specing, but I will make use of it if it makes it ingame sometime.

    My problem is I cannot test out different builds w/o spending 10$. I'll have to spec back if the new build I tried didn't work out. If the current one doesn't work out, i'll have to try something different. I do believe we can respec feats (the paragon path tab). Yes, just checked it and we can respec feats with AD, unless it changes for head start. So the only thing to respec would be Powers (tab) and Attribute Points.

    I'd like to see multi spec within the first 3-6 months but I'm not holding my breath.
    Open the Launcher. Click Options near the top. Check Disable on-demand patching. This will download another couple of gigs.

    Ability Scores || All Attribute Roll Combinations || My Cleric Stream \o/
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    kublaiexkublaiex Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 3 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    This is very important to me. People saying use different characters don't really understand the issue. You shouldn't be forced to struggle through PvE just because you like PvP and specced primarily for PvP. It's not like this is a game like Guild Wars 2 where you can level/gear-up to cap easily doing just PvP.

    It will be a weird omission if they don't have the feature to switch specs, almost every other game that has some form of PvP also lets you switch specs or respec for free.
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    bpphantombpphantom Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Agreed that multi-spec is a standard feature of MMO's at this point.

    I don't even mind if each spec above the default is only available in the store for a cost. That at least makes it available if we want it. Ideally 2 packs, one for per character and another for per account (at around triple the cost of the per character one).
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    somebobsomebob Member Posts: 1,887 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    bpphantom wrote: »
    Agreed that multi-spec is a standard feature of MMO's at this point.

    But not in Cryptic games.

    CO doesn't have it (been asked for for years). STO doesn't have it (don't play so no idea). NW doesn't (and I doubt it's going in).
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    leomutretaleomutreta Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    I agree this idea looks good, but as a F2P game, I dont think it will be ever implemented.
    They need to make money on something and for that, some things we take for granted must be taken from the game and explored on a cash shop. This is the down side of F2P and we cannot do anything about it.
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    colhatickcolhatick Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    They can easily make money off this. Charge for dual spec and then make more money off respec tokens because now people will have 2 specs.
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    matzeramatzera Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    This was suggested in the AMA on reddit with the lead combat Devs. They really liked the idea and suggested they may look to implement this when the time is right.
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    psychicslugpsychicslug Member Posts: 210 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    For one you are looking at this from the wrong way it is an mmo but its D&D and if you create a character the person is either a mighty healer helping the warriors in a group or a damage mod helper helping in combat as well as patching up when he can. A fireman can not change who he is he is a fireman and if that character is good at something than that is what he does. I for one hate the let me load a group hear list or whatever I for one am going to play my character the way I made him from his back story to the way the personality of what the character is. my point make a healer if you want one make a none healer don't try to do everything thats whats wrong with these mmo's now days. by the way I miss my COH :(
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    boerewors2boerewors2 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    by the way I miss my COH :(

    Me too, I wonder when next I will see an MMO where a respec can be earned by doing a grouped trial instance. As for dual spec, I would gladly pay very good money for the ability. I always play healers and I get a bit tired wading through the mud of solo PVE, slowly, bogged down by low damage and high survivability just to participate in grouped content.

    It is even worse in NW, the cleric has a very very small self heal. I probably will have to invest in buying the BEST tank companion so I can actually experience PVE content outside of groups without tearing out what little of my hair remains.

    In a game like SWTOR, you could happily play a healer with your companions tanking, sure it was a little slower than DPS role, but hey it could be done with little or no frustration.
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    leomutretaleomutreta Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    For one you are looking at this from the wrong way it is an mmo but its D&D and if you create a character the person is either a mighty healer helping the warriors in a group or a damage mod helper helping in combat as well as patching up when he can. A fireman can not change who he is he is a fireman and if that character is good at something than that is what he does. I for one hate the let me load a group hear list or whatever I for one am going to play my character the way I made him from his back story to the way the personality of what the character is. my point make a healer if you want one make a none healer don't try to do everything thats whats wrong with these mmo's now days. by the way I miss my COH :(

    I see your point, but this is not D&D. This is a D&D based MMO and as a MMO people expect some features to be in place. You cannot be as rigid here than you are on a table top scenario, where theres no respec at all and people are happy with it this way.
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    argantisargantis Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    I would like to have separate specs as well. I tend to favor playing one character up and when playing another I would rather play a different class. But my one main, I want to do everything with that one. It would be nice to be able to have 3 different specs. Solo, Group, and PvP. IMO though this should be an account unlock. So once you buy it, it effects all of your characters. I would happily pay $25 for dual spec, $40 for tri spec.
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    skullklovnskullklovn Member Posts: 26 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Respec is a double edge sword. I can see why some people make their character excel at something with a group in mind i.e going full on tank or healing leaving the solo that much more vunerable. But we just have to see how that works out. On the other hand, it can also lead to some frustration always having to respec in order to fit in. Maybe you can't afford a respec right then and there and it drags down your fun meter quite abit. Rift is a good example of buying different roles where you can respec or swap at will. I ended up spending quite some time, just going through all the trees mixing and matching and not really be couraged to play a typical role.
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    argantisargantis Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    One thing they need to add to the group finder, speaking of specs and roles, is to let the player determine their role.

    It may not seem so smart with some classes. Obviously the Guardian Fighter is only going to be able to queue up as a Defender, Devoted Clerics as Leaders, Tirckster Rogues as Strikers, and Control Wizards as Controllers. However the Great Weapon Fighter, and possibly other hybrid classes down the road, are build with either defender or AoE damage in mind. As such we should be queuing up accordingly, as either a defender or as a controller / striker, however Cryptic wants to define that second role.
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    rohk007rohk007 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Silverstars Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    argantis wrote: »
    I would like to have separate specs as well. I tend to favor playing one character up and when playing another I would rather play a different class. But my one main, I want to do everything with that one. It would be nice to be able to have 3 different specs. Solo, Group, and PvP. IMO though this should be an account unlock. So once you buy it, it effects all of your characters. I would happily pay $25 for dual spec, $40 for tri spec.

    same here....I would not be surprised to see them add this in as an option. I would like to have a pvp, PVE group and PVE solo spec
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    saintxiisaintxii Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 100
    edited April 2013
    i can it being something they add down the road. They probably just more focus on having something that works for launch
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    silvergryphsilvergryph Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 740 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    We already have the ability to do multiple specs. At least with powers. And feats can be reset with AD. Here's a repost of something I've said before because I don't feel like rephrasing it:

    In Neverwinter, you absolutely have multiple specs for PvE and PvP. AND IT IS COMPLETELY FREE. You have 2 At-Will power slots, 3 Encounter power slots, and 2 Daily power slots. Your character learns many more powers than this. You can swap out your slotted powers whenever you like. You can adjust your build with no respec, easily having the powers necessary for PvE, PvP, Dungeons, Skirmishes, or whatever.

    In fact, being able to freely swap out your powers is key to the Neverwinter experience. In Neverwinter, versatility is not about re-speccing for every circumstance. Versatility is about choices and sacrifice. You can choose to go with a few core powers at Rank 3 and be best in a limited set of circumstances. Or, you can sacrifice Rank 3 in exchange for more versatility by learning more powers at Rank 1 or 2. Heck, even if you bring all 7 of those powers to Rank 3, that's only 21 points. The other 39 points are for class features and extra powers to swap to for your different builds.

    Finding your preferences and learning the powers will take some experimentation, but not necessarily any respecs. In the current point buy system, you are required to have bought every power and class feature at Rank 2 by the time you reach level 30. Aside from the order in which you learn them, there are no power choices to make until after that point. By level 30, you will have a good idea of which of the Heroic Tier powers you want to Rank up to 3. It will most likely not be all of them. That leaves plenty of points for you to experiment with 1 Rank at a time in the Paragon Tier powers. You will have so many more powers than slots to put them in that having a power or two sit unused at Rank 1 will be irrelevant.

    If you really want to get rid of that 1 Rank in a power you dislike, or want to move around some points then you will need a respec. But, there is no reason for respecs to be necessary as often as some people have stated. If they give us 1 at level 60 that will probably be enough for most people. And by level 60 you will probably be able to sell a handful of blue or purple drops on the AH to make enough AD to buy 500 ZEN.

    Lastly, Cryptic has an excellent track record of giving out free respecs whenever changes are made. If they nerf you or add a new option then they will give you a respec token.
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    psychicslugpsychicslug Member Posts: 210 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    We already have the ability to do multiple specs. At least with powers. And feats can be reset with AD. Here's a repost of something I've said before because I don't feel like rephrasing it:

    In Neverwinter, you absolutely have multiple specs for PvE and PvP. AND IT IS COMPLETELY FREE. You have 2 At-Will power slots, 3 Encounter power slots, and 2 Daily power slots. Your character learns many more powers than this. You can swap out your slotted powers whenever you like. You can adjust your build with no respec, easily having the powers necessary for PvE, PvP, Dungeons, Skirmishes, or whatever.

    In fact, being able to freely swap out your powers is key to the Neverwinter experience. In Neverwinter, versatility is not about re-speccing for every circumstance. Versatility is about choices and sacrifice. You can choose to go with a few core powers at Rank 3 and be best in a limited set of circumstances. Or, you can sacrifice Rank 3 in exchange for more versatility by learning more powers at Rank 1 or 2. Heck, even if you bring all 7 of those powers to Rank 3, that's only 21 points. The other 39 points are for class features and extra powers to swap to for your different builds.

    Finding your preferences and learning the powers will take some experimentation, but not necessarily any respecs. In the current point buy system, you are required to have bought every power and class feature at Rank 2 by the time you reach level 30. Aside from the order in which you learn them, there are no power choices to make until after that point. By level 30, you will have a good idea of which of the Heroic Tier powers you want to Rank up to 3. It will most likely not be all of them. That leaves plenty of points for you to experiment with 1 Rank at a time in the Paragon Tier powers. You will have so many more powers than slots to put them in that having a power or two sit unused at Rank 1 will be irrelevant.

    If you really want to get rid of that 1 Rank in a power you dislike, or want to move around some points then you will need a respec. But, there is no reason for respecs to be necessary as often as some people have stated. If they give us 1 at level 60 that will probably be enough for most people. And by level 60 you will probably be able to sell a handful of blue or purple drops on the AH to make enough AD to buy 500 ZEN.

    Lastly, Cryptic has an excellent track record of giving out free respecs whenever changes are made. If they nerf you or add a new option then they will give you a respec token.

    Have not played this game yet but if this is true it is very much the way d&d is in that if you have a priest he can swop out healing for damage if going solo but in a group he would just mem a different spell list with fighters could be same with their powers not sure but if it is the case then no need for respect, unless changing class just want to redo character, which i do not go for anyway. But I am not a wow baby who needs this I play a character not a class or who get to top level wins or master of the fattest loot WOW has ruined alot of what makes immersion and role play or the focus of what the game or setting is about. with power gamers and leveler farmers and boting sometimes I miss the simple things like exploration, story and character development sometimes it just irks me to see someone spamming looking for group when his name is ICFATL00t or whatever, which brings up a name generator would be good for this for those who lack the creative ability to make one or those just lacking. I personally who enforce appropriate names at avoid the latter but thats me, any way we will just have to put those people on ignore lists just make sure you can put a lot of them had many on COH on mine
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    argantisargantis Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    We already have the ability to do multiple specs. At least with powers. And feats can be reset with AD. Here's a repost of something I've said before because I don't feel like rephrasing it:

    In Neverwinter, you absolutely have multiple specs for PvE and PvP. AND IT IS COMPLETELY FREE. You have 2 At-Will power slots, 3 Encounter power slots, and 2 Daily power slots. Your character learns many more powers than this. You can swap out your slotted powers whenever you like. You can adjust your build with no respec, easily having the powers necessary for PvE, PvP, Dungeons, Skirmishes, or whatever.

    In fact, being able to freely swap out your powers is key to the Neverwinter experience. In Neverwinter, versatility is not about re-speccing for every circumstance. Versatility is about choices and sacrifice. You can choose to go with a few core powers at Rank 3 and be best in a limited set of circumstances. Or, you can sacrifice Rank 3 in exchange for more versatility by learning more powers at Rank 1 or 2. Heck, even if you bring all 7 of those powers to Rank 3, that's only 21 points. The other 39 points are for class features and extra powers to swap to for your different builds.

    Finding your preferences and learning the powers will take some experimentation, but not necessarily any respecs. In the current point buy system, you are required to have bought every power and class feature at Rank 2 by the time you reach level 30. Aside from the order in which you learn them, there are no power choices to make until after that point. By level 30, you will have a good idea of which of the Heroic Tier powers you want to Rank up to 3. It will most likely not be all of them. That leaves plenty of points for you to experiment with 1 Rank at a time in the Paragon Tier powers. You will have so many more powers than slots to put them in that having a power or two sit unused at Rank 1 will be irrelevant.

    If you really want to get rid of that 1 Rank in a power you dislike, or want to move around some points then you will need a respec. But, there is no reason for respecs to be necessary as often as some people have stated. If they give us 1 at level 60 that will probably be enough for most people. And by level 60 you will probably be able to sell a handful of blue or purple drops on the AH to make enough AD to buy 500 ZEN.

    Lastly, Cryptic has an excellent track record of giving out free respecs whenever changes are made. If they nerf you or add a new option then they will give you a respec token.

    Well first of all, there are not enough points to get all of the powers. I can manage two specs, but not three with the current system.

    Secondly that whole redo feats with AD, that is not going to cut it. That is WAY too expensive. I will be playing this game on a daily basis, and if I want to flip around from running a dungeon, to farming up some ID scrolls or possibly doing Foundry, then flip to PvP to finish my session out, there is NO WAY I am going to pay AD for that and 500 Zen for a power respec on a daily basis. I have no idea what a feat reset was but I would wager that it is near if not over 50k AD at level 60. You expect me to spend $5 a day in Zen and 50-100k AD to enjoy the game as I wish when I wish?

    Sounds like a bad MMO to me. I don't give a hoot about what PnP is. I am not playing PnP Online here. If I am limited to one spec all that means is I am only going to do one part of the game, which means I will grow bored of it sooner and that is Cryptics loss. If they are so shortsighted about multiple character specs then they deserve to be a niche game rather than an industry leader. Somewhere along the way Cryptic has to decide if it is more important to be a successful MMO or if they want to put up Neverwinter Persistent Worlds 2.0. That will surely draw them a solid couple of hundred thousand players, if that.
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