...
I think we should expect to see Turbine do some great things with DDO that it might not have felt the need to do in the past.
...
I agree with you there, the devs of turbine did awesome job handling DDO crisis successfully so they can pull anything out of the hat. But there are severe limitations irrespective of what they do. Their servers are very old. Their graphics were also not good. If they make graphics better, they will have to increase system specifications.
So instead of devs working on patching up DDO, it would be easier for them to start working on DDO-2. But with the introduction of epic paths in the game, they have mostly run out of things to do.
If I was in their place, I would milk DDO with a few regular paid campaigns released now and then and spend the resources on a DDO-2.
Turbine share the same background as cryptic. The A word almost had sunk turbine which survived somehow on their own and sued the a word. (Ni Ni Ni Ni Ni Ni....)
Now NW will have UGC while DDO won't have but DDO will have character multiclassing and stuff. And 3.5e, world before spellplague is different than 4e. Apart from the fact that few good D&D games exist. But DDO has been there for many years already, its not going to die in two or three years. Most probably it will die natural death.
DDO already made a big mistake but trying to attract more new MMO based crowd at the cost of its PnP crowd. This is the crowd which NW will also pull. DDO has its campaigns which are paid, classes which are paid, races which are paid - so another threat to DDO is those who just want to play (say) monk will come to NW.
So even in a scenario where they co-exist, DDO is in more of a danger to be eclipsed slowly.
I don't know.... I really think Neverwinter will hurt DDO but certainly not kill it. DDO really needs a reboot if they want to compete. But they are owned by WB and hear they are making a Harry Potter Online *rolls eyes* so don't see that likely happening. DDO was one of themost popular F2P games. But with GW2 (while it not D&D it is a great game and is the same concepts of D&D that all fantasy games share) and Neverwinter coming onto the scene it might hurt em pretty bad.
Having to pay for every little adventure pack I think is going to bite them in the <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> big time. Neverwinter content if free, GW2 is free after the box purchase which might put some severe pressure for Turbine to change up their cash shop model.
DDO's biggest perk was that it was the only D&D MMO on the market which now is going to be changed. While Neverwinter is 4e which is not so popular edition from some threads it does so far have more to offer with the Foundry system and a more polished game which I felt DDO was never polished up with the constant laggy combat at times (or whatever that jittery stuff is) or when a mob is paralyzed yet it still moves half way across the room.
While DDO won't die (no MMO really dies) but I do believe that this will hurt Turbine. Especially if Neverwinter can deliver an immersive experience through game play and their campaigns, no matter how I tried I could never get immersed with DDO nor could see it there.
FEAR, fear of this game being the dark horse, now Aandre/Pilf3r(knee Asmodeas) maybe able to answer this best, comeing from a guild leaders perspective, Is there a real fear that NW will overshadow the other d&d titled MMo, i mean i left 2009 and have never been tempted to go back under there F2P model (free to pay), but is there a general fear, that guildies/ friends are going to be broken up ect, i understand its 2 diferent rulesets, 2 different games, i see it as a real threat, to the other, and i feel that them needing to aquire a FR setting to maintain its playerbase was something thay need to stop the straying to NW. I understand that this is straying from the thread topic, but we have acouple of times here and rather than starting a new one, what are the thoughts here.
I have stumpled across some ddo forums while searching for info, some have said Worry, after demoing NW... MAybe! is anyone else experienceing pre NW jitters?whats the talk?
Where is Jendrak by the way???? lost into the abyss, i like that brothers views as well
Heya ryvvik! Ok great commentary. I'll answer mostly to those who might not know what you and I know about DDO. Hope you enjoy the answer
I have spoken to many current DDOers on the DDO forums, privately. Some have pmed me inquiring about NW. Across DDOs playerbase, at this point I'd say there is near-zero "fear" that NW could somehow "eclipse" DDO.
Many had no clue there even was an NW, and when told, often blew it off. My guildies however are well educated on current events and are generally excited about NW, but know of PW and Cryptic's past, and for some their reputations have created issues of trust with the publisher and developer.
Some thoughts I hear floated about on the NW forums when this topic has come up is that "DDO is too old and can't compete." "It's had its time." "The bugs have killed the game." Many here right now have already left DDO, some years ago. Some still play, and are hoping NW is better. Some, like me, plan to play both.
The fact of the matter is DDO keeps re-inventing itself. It has been underestimated since its birth in '06. It's rarely been anything but the underdog in comparison to its competition. But Turbine has been dedicated to its playerbase, and has kept its flagship game relevant.
Recent bugs aside,
The Eveningstar update was considered a huge win for Turbine, showing Elminster and the Forgotten Realms to the masses before Cryptic was able to. Without question Turbine beat Cryptic to the punch. I honestly believe it was one reason why Cryptic rerolled its beta, and pushed back debuting the game.
DDOs most loyal playerbase is large and strong, both on the forum and in game. The sheer number of guilds are the screws that hold the DDO foundation in place for Turbine. I'd say as high as 95% of the accounts are guilded in some way. Communication through the Eberron Chronicle, the DDO website and launch screen are generally excellent. Communication flows fast throughout the player base. The large majority of the DDO world are happy, albeit with a bit of sticker shock of the new mod and a bit of angst because of the recent rash bugs. In all the bugs haven't made many stop playing, surprisingly.
Through every new game threat, Conan, Neverwinter 2, Guild Wars, WoW updates, Skyrim, Warhammer, the hook of Dungeons & Dragons has pulled them right back after a few weeks or months. Other reasons: It was the combat, the friends made, the D&D feel, their characters, et al.
Cryptic is starting Neverwinter at -5 degrees Fahrenheit.. Even our small but growingNW forum community, that has persevered through a forum change of address to a "lesser" forum, knows we have been fed one broken promise after another.
Let's be honest. There still is no beta, no game. We have no idea how the cash shop/f2p model will work (just fluff cash shop? I'll believe it when I see it.) Some still say the game is vaporware. Remember Duke Nukem?
So....... come on Aandre!! Give us some GOOD news!
Cryptic has FINALLY had a GREAT month. The Foundry was a big, big hit. Communication has had a slight uptick on the forums. Better videos have proven that Cryptic can create a great looking and playing demo. All in all, the best month PW/Cryptic has had since PW has taken over.
Another plus: WoTC needs DDO and Neverwinter to continue to prosper. It's in their best interest to keep as many people in the D&D universe... until Next arrives.
Another plus: Turbine and Cryptic have SO much in common. Turbine was exactly where Cryptic is now. Cryptic has a chance to make its name on Neverwinter's shoulders, and the vybe comming from the shows is that they realize this and wish to duplicate Turbine's successes while avoiding some of the pitfalls.
Another plus: The community here is very loyal. We are shaping up to be as tight as the DDO community has been.
So cut to the chase Aandre!! Neverwinter will kick DDO <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> right!?!?
I think this will go 15 rounds. DDO will release an enhancement overhaul, before NW sees the light of day. I believe Turbine will try to wait however, until Cryptic releases beta, then attempt to out-develop them. Nevewinter needs to prove that 4e translates great into an mmo. I think they eventually will prove that. DDO will highlight the strength of 3.5 character customization and multiclassing over 4es approach.
In other words BOTH Cryptic and Turbine have begun to fight. They already know the outcome. The winners will be BOTH player bases.
My wish is that WE can all get along. DDO and Neverwinter will provide many more good years of entertainment.
So, instead of fear and doubt and doom,
lets cross our fingers Cryptic can come out swinging, prove to the world they ARE contenders, and put on a hell of a show!!
FEAR, fear of this game being the dark horse, now Aandre/Pilf3r(knee Asmodeas) maybe able to answer this best, comeing from a guild leaders perspective, Is there a real fear that NW will overshadow the other d&d titled MMo, i mean i left 2009 and have never been tempted to go back under there F2P model (free to pay), but is there a general fear, that guildies/ friends are going to be broken up ect, i understand its 2 diferent rulesets, 2 different games, i see it as a real threat, to the other, and i feel that them needing to aquire a FR setting to maintain its playerbase was something thay need to stop the straying to NW. I understand that this is straying from the thread topic, but we have acouple of times here and rather than starting a new one, what are the thoughts here.
I have stumpled across some ddo forums while searching for info, some have said Worry, after demoing NW... MAybe! is anyone else experienceing pre NW jitters?whats the talk?
Where is Jendrak by the way???? lost into the abyss, i like that brothers views as well
I'm in Srtg a founders guild in ddo and we play many games while playing ddo i've found quite a few games to play sto,dcuo,vindictus,rust hearts etc etc but i always go back to ddo and end up with just not playing the other games till one day i just delete em from my hdd.
Our guild always has a core group we can play with even when some are playing other games. What i want is a game that can and will be a main game i can play along side ddo that i won't get bored with after a a certain amount of time.
I'm hoping Neverwinter will be that game i even plan on starting chapter in Neverwinter of our guild.
I may have complained some about certain things but im actually looking forward to play something that will be different combat wise to how ddo plays.
DDO certainly has it's fair share of issues namely old code that breaks when they tack on new code or make drastic changes to the game.
The amount of bugs with the expansion and new adv pack is astounding even for turbine, it's sad how when you go to fight abbot ( is a raid btw)and he decides he doesn't want to play and so doesn't show up lol.
Personally im glad they have Neverwinter and gw2 to compete with maybe it'll force em to fix some things but I'm not really worried about our guild.
Much of my previous complaints in these forums is because i want Neverwinter to be better than ddo in the areas ddo is lacking but i don't want this to be at the expense of depth of game-play (dumbing down) the game. I don't want Neverwinter to be a simple game you jump in and mash buttons and voila that's it.
I like to have 2 games i can play, i got one which is ddo im looking for another. Hopefully it will be Neverwinter.
So i can't really say there is any kind of fear within our guild seeing as we all tend to rejoin each other eventually at some point.
I would say though that right now ddo is its own worst enemy. They need to get on the bug fixing because even the hardcore fanboys are getting sick of them bugs.
I don't want Neverwinter to be a simple game you jump in and mash buttons and voila that's it.
I like to have 2 games i can play, i got one which is ddo im looking for another. Hopefully it will be Neverwinter.
So i can't really say there is any kind of fear within our guild seeing as we all tend to rejoin each other eventually at some point.
I would say though that right now ddo is its own worst enemy. They need to get on the bug fixing because even the hardcore fanboys are getting sick of them bugs.
I'm sitting in the exact same seat as you are Asm0deus. Neverwinter has enough going for it already, it just needs to get its rear in gear and get the beta to the people, so we know this thing really exists. Closed beta hopefully will start October/November '12.
I bought that fear topic up, as Gilly already know while trying to promote the game in Oz, for most of the posters they were appreciative, but ol Steenky Pete, decided to respond, in such a negative way, again on what we have all heard already, even my guildies, were yep Cryptic=Fail, based on there pursuit of STO, but back to steeenky Pete, and from reading the posts at bottom of web pages, other forums, that there was a real Fear. Steenky Pete's analysis i believe was all wrong in my opinion, and i felt that i have been unbiased of my efforts to promote the game, I never said YOU MUST PLAY THIS GAME ect ect, it has always maintained the most important information for people to view, even making a few of you famous in the land of OZ, give credit where credits due.
Watching both those videos, as professional as they were Jack and Eric, there were parts that looked like they both, um, were abit jittery, (spot check, Jack tapping the microphone base while Eric was talking, i do not intentionally think it was on purpose, nervousness perhaps, played with phone alot) as for Eric (listen skill, Picked up in the 1st video, that UCG is risky, and he looked uneasy saying that) but this is what this game is about for Neverwinter as they are hopefully going to try an attract that NWN fanbase over.
I can also say that ive seen advertising now on Aussie gaming websites, for neverwinter, which as discussed by Aandre before, with regards to promotion needing to be Right out there. Not the 2 i would have chosen, as i dont really follow there websites but nonetheless they are on the marketing train.
there were some really fantastic posts there, by the way
Comments
I agree with you there, the devs of turbine did awesome job handling DDO crisis successfully so they can pull anything out of the hat. But there are severe limitations irrespective of what they do. Their servers are very old. Their graphics were also not good. If they make graphics better, they will have to increase system specifications.
So instead of devs working on patching up DDO, it would be easier for them to start working on DDO-2. But with the introduction of epic paths in the game, they have mostly run out of things to do.
If I was in their place, I would milk DDO with a few regular paid campaigns released now and then and spend the resources on a DDO-2.
I don't know.... I really think Neverwinter will hurt DDO but certainly not kill it. DDO really needs a reboot if they want to compete. But they are owned by WB and hear they are making a Harry Potter Online *rolls eyes* so don't see that likely happening. DDO was one of themost popular F2P games. But with GW2 (while it not D&D it is a great game and is the same concepts of D&D that all fantasy games share) and Neverwinter coming onto the scene it might hurt em pretty bad.
Having to pay for every little adventure pack I think is going to bite them in the <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> big time. Neverwinter content if free, GW2 is free after the box purchase which might put some severe pressure for Turbine to change up their cash shop model.
DDO's biggest perk was that it was the only D&D MMO on the market which now is going to be changed. While Neverwinter is 4e which is not so popular edition from some threads it does so far have more to offer with the Foundry system and a more polished game which I felt DDO was never polished up with the constant laggy combat at times (or whatever that jittery stuff is) or when a mob is paralyzed yet it still moves half way across the room.
While DDO won't die (no MMO really dies) but I do believe that this will hurt Turbine. Especially if Neverwinter can deliver an immersive experience through game play and their campaigns, no matter how I tried I could never get immersed with DDO nor could see it there.
Heya ryvvik! Ok great commentary. I'll answer mostly to those who might not know what you and I know about DDO. Hope you enjoy the answer
I have spoken to many current DDOers on the DDO forums, privately. Some have pmed me inquiring about NW. Across DDOs playerbase, at this point I'd say there is near-zero "fear" that NW could somehow "eclipse" DDO.
Many had no clue there even was an NW, and when told, often blew it off. My guildies however are well educated on current events and are generally excited about NW, but know of PW and Cryptic's past, and for some their reputations have created issues of trust with the publisher and developer.
Some thoughts I hear floated about on the NW forums when this topic has come up is that "DDO is too old and can't compete." "It's had its time." "The bugs have killed the game." Many here right now have already left DDO, some years ago. Some still play, and are hoping NW is better. Some, like me, plan to play both.
The fact of the matter is DDO keeps re-inventing itself. It has been underestimated since its birth in '06. It's rarely been anything but the underdog in comparison to its competition. But Turbine has been dedicated to its playerbase, and has kept its flagship game relevant.
Recent bugs aside,
The Eveningstar update was considered a huge win for Turbine, showing Elminster and the Forgotten Realms to the masses before Cryptic was able to. Without question Turbine beat Cryptic to the punch. I honestly believe it was one reason why Cryptic rerolled its beta, and pushed back debuting the game.
DDOs most loyal playerbase is large and strong, both on the forum and in game. The sheer number of guilds are the screws that hold the DDO foundation in place for Turbine. I'd say as high as 95% of the accounts are guilded in some way. Communication through the Eberron Chronicle, the DDO website and launch screen are generally excellent. Communication flows fast throughout the player base. The large majority of the DDO world are happy, albeit with a bit of sticker shock of the new mod and a bit of angst because of the recent rash bugs. In all the bugs haven't made many stop playing, surprisingly.
Through every new game threat, Conan, Neverwinter 2, Guild Wars, WoW updates, Skyrim, Warhammer, the hook of Dungeons & Dragons has pulled them right back after a few weeks or months. Other reasons: It was the combat, the friends made, the D&D feel, their characters, et al.
Cryptic is starting Neverwinter at -5 degrees Fahrenheit.. Even our small but growingNW forum community, that has persevered through a forum change of address to a "lesser" forum, knows we have been fed one broken promise after another.
Let's be honest. There still is no beta, no game. We have no idea how the cash shop/f2p model will work (just fluff cash shop? I'll believe it when I see it.) Some still say the game is vaporware. Remember Duke Nukem?
So....... come on Aandre!! Give us some GOOD news!
Cryptic has FINALLY had a GREAT month. The Foundry was a big, big hit. Communication has had a slight uptick on the forums. Better videos have proven that Cryptic can create a great looking and playing demo. All in all, the best month PW/Cryptic has had since PW has taken over.
Another plus: WoTC needs DDO and Neverwinter to continue to prosper. It's in their best interest to keep as many people in the D&D universe... until Next arrives.
Another plus: Turbine and Cryptic have SO much in common. Turbine was exactly where Cryptic is now. Cryptic has a chance to make its name on Neverwinter's shoulders, and the vybe comming from the shows is that they realize this and wish to duplicate Turbine's successes while avoiding some of the pitfalls.
Another plus: The community here is very loyal. We are shaping up to be as tight as the DDO community has been.
So cut to the chase Aandre!! Neverwinter will kick DDO <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> right!?!?
I think this will go 15 rounds. DDO will release an enhancement overhaul, before NW sees the light of day. I believe Turbine will try to wait however, until Cryptic releases beta, then attempt to out-develop them. Nevewinter needs to prove that 4e translates great into an mmo. I think they eventually will prove that. DDO will highlight the strength of 3.5 character customization and multiclassing over 4es approach.
In other words BOTH Cryptic and Turbine have begun to fight. They already know the outcome. The winners will be BOTH player bases.
My wish is that WE can all get along. DDO and Neverwinter will provide many more good years of entertainment.
So, instead of fear and doubt and doom,
lets cross our fingers Cryptic can come out swinging, prove to the world they ARE contenders, and put on a hell of a show!!
TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Neverwinter Online Guild
No Drama. Camaraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!
Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | NEVERWINTER GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!
I'm in Srtg a founders guild in ddo and we play many games while playing ddo i've found quite a few games to play sto,dcuo,vindictus,rust hearts etc etc but i always go back to ddo and end up with just not playing the other games till one day i just delete em from my hdd.
Our guild always has a core group we can play with even when some are playing other games. What i want is a game that can and will be a main game i can play along side ddo that i won't get bored with after a a certain amount of time.
I'm hoping Neverwinter will be that game i even plan on starting chapter in Neverwinter of our guild.
I may have complained some about certain things but im actually looking forward to play something that will be different combat wise to how ddo plays.
DDO certainly has it's fair share of issues namely old code that breaks when they tack on new code or make drastic changes to the game.
The amount of bugs with the expansion and new adv pack is astounding even for turbine, it's sad how when you go to fight abbot ( is a raid btw)and he decides he doesn't want to play and so doesn't show up lol.
Personally im glad they have Neverwinter and gw2 to compete with maybe it'll force em to fix some things but I'm not really worried about our guild.
Much of my previous complaints in these forums is because i want Neverwinter to be better than ddo in the areas ddo is lacking but i don't want this to be at the expense of depth of game-play (dumbing down) the game. I don't want Neverwinter to be a simple game you jump in and mash buttons and voila that's it.
I like to have 2 games i can play, i got one which is ddo im looking for another. Hopefully it will be Neverwinter.
So i can't really say there is any kind of fear within our guild seeing as we all tend to rejoin each other eventually at some point.
I would say though that right now ddo is its own worst enemy. They need to get on the bug fixing because even the hardcore fanboys are getting sick of them bugs.
Neverwinter Thieves Guild
I'm sitting in the exact same seat as you are Asm0deus. Neverwinter has enough going for it already, it just needs to get its rear in gear and get the beta to the people, so we know this thing really exists. Closed beta hopefully will start October/November '12.
Bring your guild over man... it's a good time.
TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Neverwinter Online Guild
No Drama. Camaraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!
Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | NEVERWINTER GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!
Oh, and there is beta currently, but it's just at the level so restricted to non-employees....
it's like asking for NSA material when you applied to be a civil servant in the post office.
And I'd tell you more about that beta, but I'd have to kill you.
Kidding!
(Or am I?)
Watching both those videos, as professional as they were Jack and Eric, there were parts that looked like they both, um, were abit jittery, (spot check, Jack tapping the microphone base while Eric was talking, i do not intentionally think it was on purpose, nervousness perhaps, played with phone alot) as for Eric (listen skill, Picked up in the 1st video, that UCG is risky, and he looked uneasy saying that) but this is what this game is about for Neverwinter as they are hopefully going to try an attract that NWN fanbase over.
I can also say that ive seen advertising now on Aussie gaming websites, for neverwinter, which as discussed by Aandre before, with regards to promotion needing to be Right out there. Not the 2 i would have chosen, as i dont really follow there websites but nonetheless they are on the marketing train.
there were some really fantastic posts there, by the way