Remove Demogorgon from the RTQs, please.

faldaril#4027
faldaril#4027 Member Posts: 42 Arc User
Today I tried for about two hours to do an RTQ, but in two hours only that came out. Most of the time it was an abandoned instance, when it wasn't, people ran to avoid it. Please remove it or at least lower the frequency with which it occurs. By now people are only looking for lot level 60K and above to do this. It is not possible that one instance of this difficulty is among those that occur most frequently at the moment.
"Siamo solo delle piadine in mano hai potenti della terra" (Cit. Complottista Anonimo Facebook)
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Comments

  • faldaril#4027
    faldaril#4027 Member Posts: 42 Arc User
    I totally agree with you. As if that weren't enough, 9 times out of 10 people abandon the instance that I don't know why remains open and accessible. Yesterday for two hours we tried to make a rtq without being able to find even one that was not an "abandoned" Demogorgon where at most we were three or four desperate. I understand you have to put it on the list, but hell, there's no way that just that is going out for two hours :'(
    "Siamo solo delle piadine in mano hai potenti della terra" (Cit. Complottista Anonimo Facebook)
  • rjc9000
    rjc9000 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,398 Arc User

    As much as it would make most peoples' lives easier to expunge Demo out of RTQ, it is sadly not going to happen.

    Random queues are serving the purpose the developers wanted: as a way to get "unpopular" instances filled for people who use the public queue, not as a way to hand out free AD.


  • arazith07
    arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,441 Arc User
    If you can't complete all the options in a random queue why are you queueing for it? Sounds like skill levels of players are being overestimated by themselves. If you are looking for AD, there are a ton of other options.
  • faldaril#4027
    faldaril#4027 Member Posts: 42 Arc User
    arazith07 said:

    If you can't complete all the options in a random queue why are you queueing for it? Sounds like skill levels of players are being overestimated by themselves. If you are looking for AD, there are a ton of other options.

    I am happy for you that you are one of the chosen few who can do everything. Even I can do everything but in a queue where there are 10 characters, the success of the instance cannot depend only on me. The question I ask myself is why they allow people to max level in 12 hours and then we find characters with a 70K lot who don't even know how to use WASD.
    To improve the character (especially after the recent changes) you need diamonds, to make diamonds the best way is random queues, but if newcomers can't do them because they can't deal with something like Demogorgon, they will be stuck forever where they are ( unless they use a credit card). Maybe you who can happily do everything doesn't matter but that's also one of the reasons why this game loses people every day. Yes, there are queues for minor dungeons, but by the time you manage to get enough resources out of those, another mod has come out that changes the whole gameplay again.
    If they do not want to remove Demogorgon from the random queues they must at least lower the difficulty, moreover it is not possible that this dungeon will come out ten times out of eleven, yesterday two and a half hours to make a single RTQ, for those who have a life it becomes impossible.
    "Siamo solo delle piadine in mano hai potenti della terra" (Cit. Complottista Anonimo Facebook)
  • namelesshero347
    namelesshero347 Member Posts: 2,109 Arc User
    It took me like 3 hours to complete RTQ yesterday because I kept getting demo. I think it was just unfortunate timing. On weekdays, I usually queue up my OP and most of the time I get Tiamat on the first hit. Makes sense since people need Linu's Favor for boons. Sometimes I get CoDG or even Svardborg. But getting demo is actually rarer than CoDG/svd for me on weekdays. Even if I do get demo, my OP is prepared to tank by running around like a clown (even have the jester outfit for it!). Only on weekends when I have more time do I queue up a dps.
  • faldaril#4027
    faldaril#4027 Member Posts: 42 Arc User
    Zero RTQ again tonight, after three hours of trying. No diamonds, no seals, no objects, nothing and we were a 60/70 K group. Don't tell me it's normal. Take this damn thing off :angry:
    "Siamo solo delle piadine in mano hai potenti della terra" (Cit. Complottista Anonimo Facebook)
  • arieswytch#9832
    arieswytch#9832 Member Posts: 98 Arc User
    I'd like to see them create a new Epic RTQ and put Demo, TOMM, and ZC there with a higher item level requirement. They can then replace Demo in RTQ with baby Zariel.
  • werdandi#8366
    werdandi#8366 Member Posts: 332 Arc User
    One main point of failure is when the low-level dps are not able to destroy the portals and get killed by the creatures that spawn from them, especially the glabrazus (sorry if wrong spelling).
    If there is something to change, it is not the tank part, but reducing just a tad bit the hit points of the portals.
  • admiralwarlord#3792
    admiralwarlord#3792 Member Posts: 545 Arc User
    Many players took advantage of the temporary enchants to spend the re-rolls in the alts and I believe that's what made this week that by glory ends tomorrow having been so difficult for any content. Tomorrow when their time runs out, there will also be a decrease in most of the game's supports, which will be a negative factor despite being anxious for the characters' real item level to be equalized soon.
  • irene#2829
    irene#2829 Member Posts: 99 Arc User
    I'm a high level player who can farm demo. My immediate thought is the same - take out demo from random, allow RTQ to be cleared, and those who want demo can queue up under trial. On further thought, I realize this will create a bigger problem.

    If they take out demo from random queue, it means demo is dead. Just like tomm and zc, it can no longer be run without a premade of 10 people. The chances of 2 people queueing up at the exact same time when a group of 8 wanted demo is little to none. Overtime, people will stop demo queue up. If you queue up demo under trial, your game will no longer start.

    Currently, thanks to demo being in random queue, the chances of you forming a team to run demo is still high. There will still be people who join, but sometimes you might miss 1 or 2. With players in random queue, you can get 2 players to fulfil that spot. If your team gets stronger (which it should be with time), you can fulfil more spots and carry more new players.

    In this sense, I think having demo in random is a better concept and design. New players can now queue for demo, and senior players can still face a good challenge by carrying a few. It is not advisable to queue solo queue for demo if you're a strong player as you will face disappointment, you have a bigger responsibility - to make a team of 6-7 players and to run demo. Maybe if demo is successful in this fashion, they could just add tomm and zc into random queue. This will then bring in more benefits in the long run for both old and new players.
  • irene#2829
    irene#2829 Member Posts: 99 Arc User

    I'd like to see them create a new Epic RTQ and put Demo, TOMM, and ZC there with a higher item level requirement. They can then replace Demo in RTQ with baby Zariel.

    Strongly agree
  • faldaril#4027
    faldaril#4027 Member Posts: 42 Arc User


    If they take out demo from random queue, it means demo is dead. Just like tomm and zc, it can no longer be run without a premade of 10 people

    Not necessarily. For example, it would be possible to create a new category for these particularly difficult dungeons, increasing the amount of AD they give, or the quality of the drops, or putting some incentive to push high-level players to do them. In this way, they are pushing all the mid-level players away from all the queues, because in order not to make Demogorgon people don't even try and this means that they limit the queues to a small audience of super experienced players, who continue to improve, increasing the gap with the mass of people who cannot make it. The problem is also that (as happened last night), now only Demogorgon comes out, I hated CODG and now I pray that it comes out. Demogorgon is not infeasible, but it takes a group of ten really strong people and in a random queue it is practically impossible to find them, keeping Demogorgon as it is now in a random queue means making most of the players escape and in the end even the strong ones will be too few to make it.

    "Siamo solo delle piadine in mano hai potenti della terra" (Cit. Complottista Anonimo Facebook)
  • armadeonx
    armadeonx Member Posts: 4,952 Arc User
    I've completed it in premades pretty easily but soloing in random queue is a very different experience.

    The updated demo is as much an Item Level check as it is an experience check. Experience will get you through phases 1 & 2 but you need big hitters to get through the 3rd due to the HP on the portals (and them spawning across a wide area).

    Just lower the HP on the portals!
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  • admiralwarlord#3792
    admiralwarlord#3792 Member Posts: 545 Arc User
    Putting Demo on the same level as ToMM and Zariel is a joke. Demo is a rework that kept many of the same mechanics (excellent job, congratulations) that it already had. ToMM and Zariel is much more complex, so much so that discord is recommended for players with more experience to sing the next mechanic's move.
  • faldaril#4027
    faldaril#4027 Member Posts: 42 Arc User

    Putting Demo on the same level as ToMM and Zariel is a joke. Demo is a rework that kept many of the same mechanics (excellent job, congratulations) that it already had. ToMM and Zariel is much more complex, so much so that discord is recommended for players with more experience to sing the next mechanic's move.

    The problem with Demo is not its beauty as a dungeon, or its complexity as a mechanic, the problem is that putting it as RTQ basically prevents anyone from queuing. It comes out too frequently (I gave up yesterday, after the seventh attempt), people come in and leave, but there are very few who manage to finish it. It is an immense waste of time, resources (potions and resurrection scroll) and patience, the drop makes even the chickens laugh. I don't care where they can place it, as long as they take it out of the random queues or find a way to make it feasible for anyone who can queue and get in the way, not just a handful of Pro-players.

    "Siamo solo delle piadine in mano hai potenti della terra" (Cit. Complottista Anonimo Facebook)
  • eniallis#8107
    eniallis#8107 Member Posts: 5 Arc User
    I totally agree with the removal. It bad for the game to have players logging in to play something that is supposed to be a common daily event, and just abandon it over and over again. If that is not possible (to remove it) then at least raise the level requirement to 60+ or even 65+ so that we can at least have a chance to finish it, if we start it. As I understand, this is supposed to be a challenging trial, at least make it accesable only to those who can complete it and not have low level players waste their time and get furstrated.
  • venuslightheart
    venuslightheart Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 48 Arc User
    My suggestion: Reduce the Portal HP by 33% and monster spawn from it by 25%.
  • faldaril#4027
    faldaril#4027 Member Posts: 42 Arc User

    My suggestion: Reduce the Portal HP by 33% and monster spawn from it by 25%.

    It would be a perfect solution, so I'm afraid they never will :/

    "Siamo solo delle piadine in mano hai potenti della terra" (Cit. Complottista Anonimo Facebook)
  • admiralwarlord#3792
    admiralwarlord#3792 Member Posts: 545 Arc User
    The solution would be for players to stop entering content without decent equipment for their classes and buy enchants for their alts. Many have a 75k+ character and join random groups with alts without the minimum investment. Another problem is that the item level was inflated and the minimum requirements for certain content became obsolete after the enchants changes.

    Yesterday I created a group for RTQ saying that it was required to have exp in Demo, it was a success even with players not having great item level. Today it was a huge failure that made me reflect on citing minimum numbers of requirements for joining the group (which I think is an elitist mania), finally I saw that I have RAD for some time without having to do randoms and that's what I plan do until the game returns to normal.
  • mystar#5733
    mystar#5733 Member Posts: 179 Arc User
    keeping demo in RTQ should give players an incentive to get better. There are other ways to get RAD...like the practical regal collar and traveler's treasure insignia bonus. Sure, those aren't the only solution but sure does help when doing the mindless grind. There's also the other random ques can be done multiple times and the 1k RAD for seals or currency.

    It is a drag getting demo when the group isn't strong enough or know what they're doing and abandon right away just cuz it's demo, it;s always nice when someone takes the penalty and gives us the opportunity to abandon without penalty lol. I usually give up after getting it 3x in a row...i figure someone didn't abandon and looked for reinforcements being part of the reason it pops so many times in a row. Haven't tested that though, but usually after 3 tries and waiting about 15min tiamat or cradle of the death god will pop.
  • admiralwarlord#3792
    admiralwarlord#3792 Member Posts: 545 Arc User
    I logged back in at night and looked for RTQ while doing a quest and I fell back into Demo, in a very weak group to be honest and we managed to finish it with a little over 29 min, all thanks to everyone's effort and especially the tank that was sensational. Note that it was the time to complete VoS in a group with exp and almost triple the time in a pt really prepared to run this content that I've done several times in 10 min.
  • faldaril#4027
    faldaril#4027 Member Posts: 42 Arc User
    Blaming "low profile" players for not being "pro" players will not solve the problem. Not everyone has the whole day to stay and play to improve their character, many people work and maybe log in just long enough to do a dungeon and I say this because as an officer in a guild I see them all the time and I do everything to help them to improve. I've been playing for six years and I'm not an elitist person, for me public dungeons must be accessible to everyone, not just those with the hyper-pro-wow character. This is why I argue that Demogorgon as it is now must be removed from the RTQs and I will support it as long as I can.
    Among other things, the fact that this dungeon comes out so often implies that many people who can't do it abandon it and after the tenth time they find themselves in it they give up, so no astral diamonds, therefore no improvements and therefore no possibility of improve as long as you don't buy stuff with Zen. I find it shabby.
    "Siamo solo delle piadine in mano hai potenti della terra" (Cit. Complottista Anonimo Facebook)
  • admiralwarlord#3792
    admiralwarlord#3792 Member Posts: 545 Arc User

    Blaming "low profile" players for not being "pro" players will not solve the problem. Not everyone has the whole day to stay and play to improve their character, many people work and maybe log in just long enough to do a dungeon and I say this because as an officer in a guild I see them all the time and I do everything to help them to improve. I've been playing for six years and I'm not an elitist person, for me public dungeons must be accessible to everyone, not just those with the hyper-pro-wow character. This is why I argue that Demogorgon as it is now must be removed from the RTQs and I will support it as long as I can.
    Among other things, the fact that this dungeon comes out so often implies that many people who can't do it abandon it and after the tenth time they find themselves in it they give up, so no astral diamonds, therefore no improvements and therefore no possibility of improve as long as you don't buy stuff with Zen. I find it shabby.

    I'm not blaming low profile players, I'm blaming players who don't invest in their alternate characters and this is different. And I'm not talking about investing in enchants, companions and mounts, I'm talking about having the experience to know that X equipment is bad and using it to acquire item level. This week I found 3 players (I have a habit of observing the char of others) using a glove that drops in mini VoS which is horrible, one that has bonus status of control and summons some fey creature when using daily. There must be at least 10 gloves in the game better than this one and the player with this one has a high level item. I've even seen many other players with a glove that gives control resistance and stamina, with 1800 item level, it's a great glove if you're a Tank, not DPS, but for a beginner player it helps a lot to reach the minimum item level for the random.

    These are simple things for experienced players that are noticed when recruiting others to assemble a group. I suffer from this myself, I use Avernus' Milestone weapons for aoe and I'm often ignored by party creators just that. In a way they're right, the weapon should do about -25% damage compared to Mirage, which even though it's BIS, is ignored by me and many others because of having to grind old content and still suffer from the RNG in this .
  • faldaril#4027
    faldaril#4027 Member Posts: 42 Arc User


    I'm not blaming low profile players, I'm blaming players who don't invest in their alternate characters and this is different.

    But if we are already ruined with the main after mod 22, how do you invest in the alt?


    And I'm not talking about investing in enchants, companions and mounts, I'm talking about having the experience to know that X equipment is bad and using it to acquire item level.

    Quite right, I think this too but to get the right equipment you need diamonds, which are made with rtqs. If they don't make them accessible to everyone, the gap will only get worse.

    On the rest I agree with you, but consider that most of the players log in maybe two hours a day, I have dozens of them in the guild.

    Let's not get into the discussion people work and don't have time, there can be a thousand reasons for not being able to do things right.

    Even based on your observations, I remain convinced that Demo is not a dungeon suitable for everyone, for this reason it should be removed from rtqs or modified.

    My little off topic observation: a player who sees results is always motivated to improve himself, to find out about the game and his character, to choose one type of equipment instead of another and this inevitably leads to an overall improvement of the game, but it seems that Cryptic doesn't care much, that worries me.

    All the changes made to the game over the years tend to speed up the experiences of the players, to simplify everything to the point of make it ridicule and therefore it is almost inevitable that less experienced players aim for the endgame without even looking at the old content.

    It doesn't have much to do with the Demogorgon talk, but for example getting back to leveling a character over a longer time (not the twelve hours it takes now) could be a start. I remember when they had put on the Zen market the characters already leveled to the maximum, I think many remember them, a mass of people who did not even know how to use the W key to move. I hope we never go back to similar things.

    "Siamo solo delle piadine in mano hai potenti della terra" (Cit. Complottista Anonimo Facebook)
  • ezariel
    ezariel Member Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited January 23
    arazith07 said:

    If you can't complete all the options in a random queue why are you queueing for it? Sounds like skill levels of players are being overestimated by themselves. If you are looking for AD, there are a ton of other options.

    I just love how people always seem to say this, but never make any suggestions as to how to actually make RAD outside of random queues. I've played for years and there is no reasonable way to make your 100k a day without doing randoms.

    Current requirement for the RTQ is 40k. Demo as it is cannot be done with a group of 40k players. I would even be fine if they increased the requirement for RTQ to be higher so at least there was a chance that groups could succeed. But I am afraid that would be extremely detrimental to the game as well as that would only shut more people out from progressing.