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Casual Gamer frustration

kalamabakalamaba Member Posts: 1 Arc User
I am playing MMRPG for 25 years, and Neverwinter with a lot of break time since the beginning. I think I was something like a founder when it was not even released.
In all the time play those games, I never had a patch, that was frustrating me so much.
I am a casual gamer. I don't care much for the My of DPS and all of this. I had a good time, before the patch, could spent my time. Somethings were hard for me, but after some tries, I did it.
Now, I am dying all the time, whatever I do. Call me a bad player, but I am a player and pay, because I want people to earn money for their work.
My biggest issue is that I can't do random dungeons anymore. Only my character which are over 70 have an item level high enough to play it. But I can play the dungeon out of the random system and this doesn't make any sense to me. It takes ten time more time to enter a dungeon. For what, please? For those little percentage of player who are "professional"?
Even if I am the worst player in town, shouldn't even I have a chance to play a little?
This is so frustrating, then I can't, yes can't and not "don't want" play any longer.
For me playing is fun, I use it to go into another world, have some adventures and so on.
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Comments

  • araneaxaraneax Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 639 Arc User

    This is what you get when you want to do a balance patch with a sledge hammer. Also it does not help that Cryptic does not listen to any of the casual gamers out there. I am one of them. I don't do random elite dungeon queues simply because I don't like having to memorize so many mechanics and therefore let down my team. Does that make me unwanted? I guess it does, because with the last patch I am unable to do what I liked most about this game. That was to just log in after a hard day of work and kill things! Ok so maybe those "things" were my substitute for bad customers, but now that they can be a total pain it feels more like real life.

    If I wanted abuse like that I would just work a double shift!

    I agree. I came onto the forums to see what happened that broke the game. Hopefully tomorrow's patch will fix it. In a "Perfect World" those responsible would be punished.
    Yeah... nah...
    It will take them longer time to fix this mess.
    There is too many " oversights " that happened.
    Even with people being on preview and helping with pointing things out.
    Some of the things people pointed out where not fixed yet at all.
    So it was a discovered error, by players, pointed out and somehow neglected.

    If you do a job with the help of others who do not need to do it for you.
    At least be fair enough to at least check what was pointed out to you.
    I would have lost my job if i did such a thing.
    Imagine me doing such an oversight with millions of euros in question. Whoopsy would not cut it.

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  • reg1981reg1981 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,435 Arc User
    edited January 2021
    The biggest issue is that people don't understand the system. If you do, it works! I have a 25k TR that can do avernus stuff now without running for his life. It's not because he super geared and built, it's because he's balanced in the new system! He can do randoms again with no enchants in and function pretty good. He's not capped at 90% everything, but mid 70s-mid 80s and I'm happy with his performance at the moment.

    The idea is balance, not R15 everything anymore. If you have all R15s in before your pets and mounts are done you might have an inflated item level making it harder to play and further from caps. Also chosing top enchants before the pets are done might require new enchants when the pets are done. Just depends on what you need. I wish I could simplify and put into words what I'm doing with characters but it makes the functional again with little to no investment. I have enchantment choice packs from the exchange for later when I get him dialed in more and figure out what enchants he needs!
  • baronstragenbaronstragen Member Posts: 197 Arc User
    edited January 2021
    reg1981 said:

    The biggest issue is that people don't understand the system. If you do, it works! I have a 25k TR that can do avernus stuff now without running for his life. It's not because he super geared and built, it's because he's balanced in the new system! He can do randoms again with no enchants in and function pretty good. He's not capped at 90% everything, but mid 70s-mid 80s and I'm happy with his performance at the moment.

    The idea is balance, not R15 everything anymore. If you have all R15s in before your pets and mounts are done you might have an inflated item level making it harder to play and further from caps. Also chosing top enchants before the pets are done might require new enchants when the pets are done. Just depends on what you need. I wish I could simplify and put into words what I'm doing with characters but it makes the functional again with little to no investment. I have enchantment choice packs from the exchange for later when I get him dialed in more and figure out what enchants he needs!

    Umm, yeah. So we penalize a player for having R15's in his slots. That REALLY makes me want to upgrade my toon. Like I said before, I have 0 interest in a system that penalizes players for upgrading. Let's all run around naked because that's what Cryptic wants us to do. That makes as much sense to me as trying to shovel water off the beach back into the sea. As a side note, the lower your IL, the less damage you do. So you really don't win, unless you're smart enough to find the balance between damage, stat distribution and Item Level. I'm a math major and even I find that extremely tedious. No thanks.

    Also, I should mention that Avernus seems fine content wise. Try going back to some of the lower levels and see if you still feel the same. I suggest AI - that's a classic. Or Chult.
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  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 654 Arc User
    reg1981 said:

    The biggest issue is that people don't understand the system. If you do, it works! I have a 25k TR that can do avernus stuff now without running for his life. It's not because he super geared and built, it's because he's balanced in the new system! He can do randoms again with no enchants in and function pretty good. He's not capped at 90% everything, but mid 70s-mid 80s and I'm happy with his performance at the moment.

    The idea is balance, not R15 everything anymore. If you have all R15s in before your pets and mounts are done you might have an inflated item level making it harder to play and further from caps. Also chosing top enchants before the pets are done might require new enchants when the pets are done. Just depends on what you need. I wish I could simplify and put into words what I'm doing with characters but it makes the functional again with little to no investment. I have enchantment choice packs from the exchange for later when I get him dialed in more and figure out what enchants he needs!

    So basically no point to go above the IL you already have. They scale the damage total to whatever content you run, regardless of IL. 20k and 50k do the same damage now minus some slottable bells and whistles. The problem is as your IL goes up, your %'s drop...so someone at 40k IL has better % than someone 50K, and when they scale, they only scale damage and HP, so the 40k has higher %'s than the 50k person...again, why get stronger?
  • reg1981reg1981 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,435 Arc User
    stark760 said:

    again, why get stronger?

    Comes down to the content you want to run. Tomm and Zariel Master are unscaled. Everything else is. Scaled content you aim for balance of %s IL will be adjusted with HP and Base Damage anyways. Unscaled content you need the high IL + that balance.

    The other side of the scaling is that if you are scaled up, you meet the minimum. If you are scaled down, your scaled ABOVE the minimum so you do end up stronger than the scaled up people PROVIDED your stats are somewhat balanced!
  • thany#4351 thany Member Posts: 267 Arc User
    reg1981 said:


    Comes down to the content you want to run. Tomm and Zariel Master are unscaled. Everything else is.

    So if you don't want to play tomm and zariel master, don't waste any money on this game. Right now this game looks that way.

  • reg1981reg1981 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,435 Arc User

    reg1981 said:

    The biggest issue is that people don't understand the system. If you do, it works!


    Quote from combat rework announcement:
    ---------------
    GOALS

    Easier to Understand – The live setup of our ratings leaves a lot of players asking others what numbers they should be aiming for in different content. It wasn’t easy to know what your percentages were.

    Easier to Gear Up – It can be a challenge for a lot of players to get the correct mix of stats with their different gearing options. Players should be able to equip gear to get to a given item level and be able to complete that content without having to micromanage all of their individual stats.
    ---------------

    So here is the problem, why don't people understand the new system if it were supposed to be "easier to understand"? Not to mention that people have to make more micromanagement to find the "balance" of gearing up, this is the part where rework has been considered as a fail even disaster to a lot of players, devs made some promises but it turned out these promises are just some bounced checks.
    My honest answer to why many don't understand it, it's because they don't want to or aren't ready to. Many are outraged with the changes and haven't accepted/opened up to them yet. When it first hit preview I visited and raged out too. My first post on the forums about this stuff included the quote "If this is what your coming live with, you better be ready for the pitch forks and torches". Many players are dealing with this now because not everyone can spend time on preview, there is nothing extra in your bags on live from time spent on preview.

    It's going to take more than a few days to figure out the system and get things working again. It's also going to take continued tuning by the Devs on various content and items. For what it's worth, they are listening! I see many adjustments happening based on feedback threads provided they are written half decent. For the most part we're not past the "Fix it or I'm quitting" stage of the forum posts. Once we pass that I think we'll see more constructive posts and information start to flow.

    To comment on the "Easier to understand" part. The last 2 systems I had to be walked through everything. This system I'm up and running in a few days. But all minds are different and maybe I was just able to adapt to this system but not the others.
  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 654 Arc User
    reg1981 said:

    stark760 said:

    again, why get stronger?

    Comes down to the content you want to run. Tomm and Zariel Master are unscaled. Everything else is. Scaled content you aim for balance of %s IL will be adjusted with HP and Base Damage anyways. Unscaled content you need the high IL + that balance.

    The other side of the scaling is that if you are scaled up, you meet the minimum. If you are scaled down, your scaled ABOVE the minimum so you do end up stronger than the scaled up people PROVIDED your stats are somewhat balanced!
    Newest dungeon yet to come is scaled at 51k. Maybe they scale its higher, but all content is scaled now it looks like.
  • thany#4351 thany Member Posts: 267 Arc User
    stark760 said:



    Newest dungeon yet to come is scaled at 51k. Maybe they scale its higher, but all content is scaled now it looks like.

    It looks like this game is "HAMSTER" right now. Everything is "scaled" so there is no point to put money into it. Looking forward, my 30K ilvl wizard upscaled to 51K.
  • reg1981reg1981 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,435 Arc User
    stark760 said:



    Newest dungeon yet to come is scaled at 51k. Maybe they scale its higher, but all content is scaled now it looks like.

    Except tower and zariel, yes.
  • bruce55bruce55 Member Posts: 49 Arc User
    edited January 2021
    The scaling isnt working. I dont have problems with my main character at all, but alts are a different story. I have a decently geared level 80 cleric going into a chult patrol. Shouldnt be a problem right? Wrong. You run into a group consisting of a mob that constantly summons more mobs, and 2 shaman that is healing everthing to almost full health. This is no fun at all. Most of the time i end up dead at least once sometime 2 times
  • reg1981reg1981 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,435 Arc User
    edited January 2021
    bruce55 said:

    The scaling isnt working. I dont have problems with my main character at all, but alts are a different story. I have a decently geared level 80 cleric going into a chult patrol. Shouldnt be a problem right? Wrong. You run into a group consisting of a mob that constantly summons more mobs, and 2 shaman that is healing everthing to almost full health. This is no fun at all. Most of the time i end up dead at least once sometime 2 times

    Things are still being adjusted in game and many players are still adjusting themselves. The shaman have been reported, they've been tuned down in Merchant Prince Folley, but I'm not sure if it adjusts them in other areas as well. But yes, Shamans have been a pain so far in the new system. Actually there are more as well but they need to be tested and reported.

    As for alts, I originally expected these changes to be an alt killer for me. Turns out I was wrong. It took my alts out of end game, but all scaled content is still on the table! I ripped out all enchants, insignias, runestones, and pet gear. Drank my potions and stated adjusting things with no investment. Just what they had. I put enough pets on them over the years to have some options with crit sev, crit, and CA pets not BIS pets, but usable. They mainly offer like 0.25%-0.75% to these stats. The trick was bringing my IL down and my stats up.

    Wild Storm Elixir & Superior flask of potency = 17.5% of my crit sev.

    My alts run approx the following %s. And are 25k-35k in item level depending on what I've done with them in the past. They do not have Avernus hunt gear. Mainly older stuff like ebonized chest, some have lions guard arms/head others have undermountian arms.

    Power=90%
    Accuracy=50%
    CA=60%
    Crit=70%-75%
    Crit sev=80%-90%

    And again, no investment other than time and previous game play. Winter event gave all my alts an alchemist expermenter for CA/Crit % bonus. I did get the dragonborn pack years ago and it gives black dragon ioun stone account wide for 3% crit strike.
  • jules#6770 jules Member Posts: 709 Arc User
    I logged in an unslotted everything that cost a fortune. I am okay to go. Looking at the empty slots makes me log off again.
    No need to understand it better imo - my shittiest toon is doing as well as my main. Cool?
    - bye bye -
  • reg1981reg1981 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,435 Arc User

    I logged in an unslotted everything that cost a fortune. I am okay to go. Looking at the empty slots makes me log off again.

    No need to understand it better imo - my shittiest toon is doing as well as my main. Cool?

    And this proves my point exactly above, not constructive comments as most of the community is still in the "fix or I quit" stage. I agree it sucks at first, but doesn't suck anymore for lots of players now.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,183 Arc User
    edited January 2021
    My current problem is few pieces my toons are using giving wrong stat. i.e. if I spend time/resource to balance them now, in the near future (such as next week), it will be messed up again. Anyway, for the limited and far from ideal adjustment, my 6 toons was able to do what they usually were doing on day 1 of combat change (in a slower pace). And, their bonding runestone are still in the inventory and not yet converted to 'something else'.
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  • reg1981reg1981 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,435 Arc User

    My current problem is few pieces my toons are using giving wrong stat. i.e. if I spend time/resource to balance them now, in the near future (such as next week), it will be messed up again. Anyway, for the limited and far from ideal adjustment, my 6 toons was able to do what they usually were doing on day 1 of combat change (in a slower pace). And, their bonding runestone are still in the inventory and not yet converted to 'something else'.

    I totally get it! I made that mistake with my main, got 9 tacticals for CA then needed to swap them for assassins. Won't make that mistake again, that taught me that enchants, runes, pet gear, and to a degree even mount stats are used to fine tune our builds, not make alts monsters in content.

    Nice job on adapting! Miss playing with you guys! Hope all is well!
  • jules#6770 jules Member Posts: 709 Arc User
    edited January 2021
    reg1981 said:

    I logged in an unslotted everything that cost a fortune. I am okay to go. Looking at the empty slots makes me log off again.

    No need to understand it better imo - my shittiest toon is doing as well as my main. Cool?

    And this proves my point exactly above, not constructive comments as most of the community is still in the "fix or I quit" stage. I agree it sucks at first, but doesn't suck anymore for lots of players now.
    Eh, sure. The others will leave. The thing is, while this proves your point for you, it also proves mine for me. Fix or I quit because we already have been here several times, and I don't see why it will not continue like that, because it works fine in terms of HAMSTER people over. (Somehow reworks always end with big sales for things we didn't need before)
    If I was interested into rebuilding my toons I would need to spend, which defies that we weren't supposed to "have to" spend to get back to where we were. (And we aren't yet back to where we were, even if applied to the new system.)
    There is also
    - the complete disregard of previous time spent on toons if it so easy to dismiss that?
    - the need to switch guild boons which is just not ez pz for everybody, and also costs a fortune
    - the idiotic idea that "progression" means undressing and lowering my IL to apply myself for lower content

    The problem is not only the system. I could figure it out if I wanted to. The problem is that this happens so often and screws you over if you are not somebody that already has a big fund or a repository of things to switch to. I have been on breaks over the duration of playing NW over this, but everybody was riding the "this game will improve so much now" train so hard that I believed it too. Here we are, running in cycles. Good for you that you are having fun - good luck.
    - bye bye -
  • reg1981reg1981 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,435 Arc User

    reg1981 said:

    I logged in an unslotted everything that cost a fortune. I am okay to go. Looking at the empty slots makes me log off again.

    No need to understand it better imo - my shittiest toon is doing as well as my main. Cool?

    And this proves my point exactly above, not constructive comments as most of the community is still in the "fix or I quit" stage. I agree it sucks at first, but doesn't suck anymore for lots of players now.
    Eh, sure. The others will leave. The thing is, while this proves your point for you, it also proves mine for me. Fix or I quit because we already have been here several times, and I don't see why it will not continue like that, because it works fine in terms of HAMSTER people over. (Somehow reworks always end with big sales for things we didn't need before)
    If I was interested into rebuilding my toons I would need to spend, which defies that we weren't supposed to "have to" spend to get back to where we were. (And we aren't yet back to where we were, even if applied to the new system.)
    There is also
    - the complete disregard of previous time spent on toons if it so easy to dismiss that?
    - the need to switch guild boons which is just not ez pz for everybody, and also costs a fortune
    - the idiotic idea that "progression" means undressing and lowering my IL to apply myself for lower content

    The problem is not only the system. I could figure it out if I wanted to. The problem is that this happens so often and screws you over if you are not somebody that already has a big fund or a repository of things to switch to. I have been on breaks over the duration of playing NW over this, but everybody was riding the "this game will improve so much now" train so hard that I believed it too. Here we are, running in cycles. Good for you that you are having fun - good luck.
    I understand, I really do. I felt like this when Mod 16 hit preview and left for a long time. The difference I see this time is there are boundaries now in game that will allow this system to work, and continue working. The example I'll use is tomm. It's currently unscaled and wide open to the power creep of our IL. What I suspect will happen is at some point it will get hit with a cap and a set difficulty. Scaled up, you'll meet the min, scaled down you should be above the min so your stronger than someone scaled up. And that will be where it stays. New content coming out might come out uncapped but at some point can be capped and thus eliminating the power creep we've always seen in the past and cutting out the need to do this again.
  • ziggerlinziggerlin Member Posts: 57 Arc User
    edited January 2021
    Another thing I've noticed since the changes is that the RDG is almost ALWAYS Cloak Tower. The lowest level dungeon in theory, and the perhaps hardest RDG in reality (particularly the adds on the last boss) since the changes. It's a wonder why I bother any more, other than trying to pick up some rAD.
  • rosh#3730 rosh Member Posts: 76 Arc User
    I got my toon adjusted to do the majority of content and I am at the stage of getting my key and log off and do house chores or go out with my girl friend

    So I will Wait for sharandar to come and do the campaign and see if it is any different or not

    Because remember guys Sharandar is the first mod that is done according to Chris's vision, I only played 1st map of sharandar and did not go further to enjoy it when it comes out

    so we will know the direction of this game in general and what they have in store for this game is it shelving the game and just maintaining it or reviving it

    The only thing for me personally keeping me playing this game is the promise of new class

    Even if it is next year but this mod is their deal breaker in essence

    For me redeemed citadel was not fun because Heroic Encounters is not content

    I want quests this is D&D guys that does not have quests with choices and different paths and rewards for choices , I love the under dark quests and we need something similar but with higher quality

    This game went from 3 mods to 1 mod per year so I am expecting quality content that is worth 1 year of wait at this point
  • blargskullblargskull Member Posts: 514 Arc User
    Everything is working just fine for me in Neverwinter, I don't see any issue with these game mechanics at all. I will miss the old Sharandar, the Arcane Reservoir, the old Quickling hunts, but this thread is about Player Frustration. Obviously I misunderstood the title, or the thread is titled incorrectly and should be, "I am holding my breath, until you make it the way I want... it. Hey, I am turning blue over here!".

    No one quits these games, at least of all the ones who come here into the forums and rages about "I am quitting or else....", just like the ones that say, "I am not spending another dollar on this..." I often wonder, if they ever spent any money at all playing here. I can't and won't say I am quitting, I may lose interest for a time and come back later. I spend money on Zen and will again, but I only spend it on Champions. Cryptic has 3 games going on 4 to spend Zen on these days, if the company arranges their ducks correctly, they can afford to have one slump for a while.

    If you were seriously going to quit, you would just leave without telling, no demands. Otherwise you would say good-bye to your friends, then you would go to your Arc account settings and delete it. Cortez burned his own ships to prevent retreat. Over the years, I have yet to see anyone burn their account.

    I came into this thread expecting to see players with issues to be solve, nothing here to solve.

    Just killing time...
  • vaultingfrog#2497 vaultingfrog Member Posts: 185 Arc User
    > @blargskull said:
    > Everything is working just fine for me in Neverwinter, I don't see any issue with these game mechanics at all. I will miss the old Sharandar, the Arcane Reservoir, the old Quickling hunts, but this thread is about Player Frustration. Obviously I misunderstood the title, or the thread is titled incorrectly and should be, "I am holding my breath, until you make it the way I want... it. Hey, I am turning blue over here!".
    >
    > No one quits these games, at least of all the ones who come here into the forums and rages about "I am quitting or else....", just like the ones that say, "I am not spending another dollar on this..." I often wonder, if they ever spent any money at all playing here. I can't and won't say I am quitting, I may lose interest for a time and come back later. I spend money on Zen and will again, but I only spend it on Champions. Cryptic has 3 games going on 4 to spend Zen on these days, if the company arranges their ducks correctly, they can afford to have one slump for a while.
    >
    > If you were seriously going to quit, you would just leave without telling, no demands. Otherwise you would say good-bye to your friends, then you would go to your Arc account settings and delete it. Cortez burned his own ships to prevent retreat. Over the years, I have yet to see anyone burn their account.
    >
    > I came into this thread expecting to see players with issues to be solve, nothing here to solve.

    As a matter of fact I have abandoned games with forum posts expressing as such. Halo Wars is an example.... I literally put my hardcopy into my microwave and nuked it because I was so throughly disgusted with it...

    So it does happen. And I'm pretty upset with the current changes but I will work with them in the end as I have friends that are important to me on here and worth enduring this stupidity.
  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 4,952 Arc User
    @reg1981 you are missing the point and I predict you will become less happy with the changes once Cryptic realise what they need to do to deliver what they promised - which is to have scaling that respects a players stat percentages when unscaled.

    In other words; 90% power/Crit/Defence etc when unscaled still puts you at 90% when scaled, even though your HP and base damage is adjusted for the content.

    This is not only fair - it is the core of most of the feedback.
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  • cisticolacisticola Member Posts: 17 Arc User

    Everything is working just fine for me in Neverwinter, I don't see any issue with these game mechanics at all.

    Just very curious what you like and don't like about the new mechanics. Why it is working for you and not me. Have been stuck at Level 61 with a Paladin since the change.
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