I think there are two different issues here: * Yes, game is harder. It is supposed to be harder. It has become too easy over time. You are not *supposed* to be able to solo small HE's, for instance. Adapt and carry on. * But obviously game has become too hard in places. When people complain about not being able to do their level-appropriate quests, game has become way too hard. Level-appropriate quests should be doable with relative ease with the gear provided by those quests. Cryptic obviously missed some testing here.
Agreed. I have a feeling that some people may be complaining because they cant faceroll anymore, but some people are complaining because they are legit stuck on a bugged area or bugged enemies. And you have to call it "bugs" because it makes no logical sense for those problem mobs to be they way they are in comparison to the other mobs in their zone. We know for a fact that kobold hurlers and orc axe hurlers are not configured right. They just aren't.
I'm probably going to keep leveling my trash GWF (I have a lot of spare time right now and its been like 3 years since I played a GWF) and see if I can root any more of them out as I go, and if I run into other kinds of issues I'll alert people here about that stuff as well. I hope anyone who feels like they can contribute decides to post here as well. Even if you're just frustrated, sometimes it helps to vent somewhere.
@sakhsft Too many keep saying "they try to destroy the game" or "they wrecked the game"... this was done already and it was done almost 2 years ago. But they had a lot of help from the players. The players who come here and say one liners, the players who don't follow through, the players who don't play the game on preview, the endless bickering with each other instead of helping each other, and the players who are just spoiled by their own godhood because this game is all about them.
If you were not here 2 years ago, then you missed a wonderful funeral. They burned the library and all the books, people acted like it didn't matter, they danced in the street, and this was the game. Welcome to Neverwinter 3.0 and you will just play it as they intend or not at all. Maybe 2 or 3 years from now, if you are still here, you can learn play their next version of this game.
This thread was created to help other players overcome the new system. Very few people came to talk strategy and they get bickering, insults, and debate instead. Help your fellow players stop talking to them as if they created this game.
@ultramath#3953 Good job on the topic, I hope others will follow your example. That was a good thing you caught with the new GWF and the ranged mobs. I only tested my level 80s on preview and was disappointed by my companions. Players need to come to terms with their companions are nothing more than the secondary artifacts you carry. They will not fight and win the battle for you, while you trot off to the bathroom. I didn't make any vast changes on my builds or companions. I am running eight level 80s and my wizards are not suffering deaths in Avernus, as they did prior to these changes, but I suspect that was the developer's main focus. I would say somebody dropped the ball on the whole new player coming into the game fresh. I barely had a month on preview, after I returned to the game, to even think about doing a new character, let alone check my current ones.
Well, i did another Cloak Tower run with my Fighter, we had 2 level 80 in there with decent equipment/IL, and we really struggled to finish it. So, if a group with way above the required IL players is having problems with getting through this dungeon, how on gods green earth are a group of level 20 with IL around 5k going to finish it for their main quest line?
And the rewards are still as crappy as they were before the change - the rewards (from the dungeon itself and the RDQ) were fine before, when we could simply blast through the dungeon, but now they're only adding insult to injury.
Well, i did another Cloak Tower run with my Fighter, we had 2 level 80 in there with decent equipment/IL, and we really struggled to finish it.
Thanks for posting an update. And I have to ask: did you notice if it was just the axe hurlers that were making it so hard, or was it just all the mobs no matter what?
> @"ultramath#3953" said: > Wow, that was good man. After going through that area myself yesterday, i have to give props to anyone who finishes it lol. A shame that they didn't get that one in the hotfix, but there's no way that they are done with this patch as it is now. More fixes are coming for sure.
I was curious as to how difficult the boss fight would be :) I am new to this game but i have played a lot of rpgs in the past, like nwn, nwn2, dragon age etc and I always play on very hard, nightmare or whatever is equivalent because in single player games i have time and I can pause, move to strategic positions and think things through. But for an mmo i think it should not be like playing on hard mode doing trash mobs and like very easy doing boss fights.. In fact, The other way around would be much more appealing to me 🤔 For a boss fight i dont mind struggling, but since mmos by nature is a bit ( a lot) repetative, it just takes sooo much time and effort to do regular content and advance, and the rewards for the struggle is terribly low.
Well i logged in to get my key and do the event after the patch.
Event - seems OK. Things hurt more, but it wasnt too awful.
Ran a daily skirmish - sharandar wolves and fairies. Took about 10 times longer than before for the same crapawful rewards. People died from add swarms.
Ran a RTQ to see what it was like - thankfully demogorgon (tried CODG yesterday - just dont). Again took longer - good team can get phase one to silver, not a chance in hell of gold. Everything takes longer to kill, people died to adds. Same crapawful reward, took about 2-3 times as long as normal.
Economy is completely fekked for now - AH has doubled prices.
I can't face lomm or TIC yet. So im just on key picked and raw conversion minimum till fixed or vip runs out...
I worked my HAMSTER off to collect fallen gear, enchanting stones, marks of potency, refined barkshield and weapons enchantment, etc..... suddenly I make the first diamond run "dungeon run" it's graig mire.... yeah! I think.
3 deaths later and 40 minutes i get 6,3 thousand astrals. I thought by mistake I was playing Epic dungeon. the AD is not worth that much time for so little a reward.
What will it take to get my trial run. 39 thousand AD would be some kind of mythic god fight. taking anything from 1 day to 1 month to finish. the reward system is now basically to hard for so little. Even when I paid VIP I feel b**t f**k!
I play Neverwinter for the wizards of the coast books and feel of D&D, not just fighting for fightings sake. it looks more like Neverwinter has become a money machine, because without paying I will never finish upgrading my character. Since I will need to spend money on this, I might as well see whats out there.
Well, i did another Cloak Tower run with my Fighter, we had 2 level 80 in there with decent equipment/IL, and we really struggled to finish it.
Thanks for posting an update. And I have to ask: did you notice if it was just the axe hurlers that were making it so hard, or was it just all the mobs no matter what?
It doesn't matter if the enemy is a range or a melee one in the dungeon, they do similar damage to your character, 1 or 2 enemies hitting you'll be fine for a few seconds, but 3 or 4 on you will be your end directly.
We had a level 17 Warlock in our group, she was to close to a gate when it was opened, dead within a second with no chance for even drinking a potion... i'm not saying that a dps or healer should be able to tank a group of enemies, but there should be some time for evades or potions.
And even as a tank staying alive vs. several enemies is a constant struggle, and not a fun one...
Just to be clear, the dungeon bosses aren't the problem anymore, but their minions are - everything can be going fine while fighting a boss, then adds spawn and your whole team is dead within seconds.
It doesn't matter if the enemy is a range or a melee one in the dungeon, they do similar damage to your character, 1 or 2 enemies hitting you'll be fine for a few seconds, but 3 or 4 on you will be your end directly.
We had a level 17 Warlock in our group, she was to close to a gate when it was opened, dead within a second with no chance for even drinking a potion... i'm not saying that a dps or healer should be able to tank a group of enemies, but there should be some time for evades or potions.
And even as a tank staying alive vs. several enemies is a constant struggle, and not a fun one...
Just to be clear, the dungeon bosses aren't the problem anymore, but their minions are - everything can be going fine while fighting a boss, then adds spawn and your whole team is dead within seconds.
Well, it seems that scaling in queued content is borked all over the place. You're not the only one reporting extraordinary issues with dungeons. It's all of it, too... skirmishes are not working right, either. Can't blame this on a couple bugged mobs this time, there's a bigger problem with whatever multiple they used for either mob damage or player defense.
Yeah, that would be the point we're trying to get through to the Devs at the moment... it starts with not being able to do Random Dungeon Queues anymore because of the increased IL requirement, but even when your IL is finally high enough to join the queue, you still won't be able to finish the run, and that's just not right.
I think there are two different issues here: * Yes, game is harder. It is supposed to be harder. It has become too easy over time. You are not *supposed* to be able to solo small HE's, for instance. Adapt and carry on. * But obviously game has become too hard in places. When people complain about not being able to do their level-appropriate quests, game has become way too hard. Level-appropriate quests should be doable with relative ease with the gear provided by those quests. Cryptic obviously missed some testing here.
When you purchase a god like character of course it will be easy...you purchased a god like character. Characters starting from lvl1 with no gear or boosts from money spent, however, do not have an easy time under the previous patch. It took a long time for me to clear the Chasm and Mt Hottenow(sp?) areas solo. I died a lot whether I used health stones or not.
As it stands now, that same character cannot even fight mobs in BlackLake, Ebon Downs or any other area as I cannot even get to boss fights. I spent $10 for character slots and at this point with the game this unplayable I want my money back.
I dont know if some people are simple stupid or just a..licker of cryptic, but here is the fact: today i join 5x tiamat fight il 39K char all 14-15 enchant and we fail 5 times becouse cant hold clerics in second phase, game supose to be hard yes, game supose to be tactical yes , but game now just HAMSTER, if u get stuned or lag for a sec u die, if u in insta where red area folow u one shot die, if u tank lose agro for 2 sec and u short ragr char u die.I dont die so often in all f..ing 2020 year like now in 2 days, so pls if u good with this changes its ok if u enjoy the game i happy for u but stop bul...iting about how its playable and fun and nice ok?
> @"flyball#6248" said: > When you purchase a god like character of course it will be easy...you purchased a god like character. Characters starting from lvl1 with no gear or boosts from money spent, however, do not have an easy time under the previous patch. It took a long time for me to clear the Chasm and Mt Hottenow(sp?) areas solo. I died a lot whether I used health stones or not. > > As it stands now, that same character cannot even fight mobs in BlackLake, Ebon Downs or any other area as I cannot even get to boss fights. I spent $10 for character slots and at this point with the game this unplayable I want my money back.
Exactly. I didnt find the game so easy before this patch.. I just managed to get som decent gear from ME for my wizard, and I only have a couple of Green mounts with a few blue insignias, i have the Duergar (Green) companion with gear from ME. It wasnt easy, it was challanging enough before.. Not everyone have played for years with several mythic/legendary companions/mounts and good insignias. I died sometimes during ME before the patch, now its unplayable.
Update: just cleared Neverdeath Graveyard with trashGWF (I should have named him that). I think I found some more bugged mobs, and yes, they are the kobold hurlers. Specifically, the ones in the instances. The Monini Crypt (yikes so many of them), the Clockwork Guild Tomb at the end. The ones in the open world area were hitting pretty hard but not like the ones in the instances, so if you're going through there, watch out.
I have to say that being 6.8K TIL at lev31 is not the worst thing in the world right now, and really, the lack of potions isn't hurting me as much as the extreme disadvantage of having almost no AoE ability against hordes of dangerous mobs. You never really noticed it, I must imagine, when the mobs just went down with one hit, but now that they are so much tougher, the missing pieces in the early GWF toolbox are really obvious and inconvenient. I took so much more damage in Neverdeath than I would have if I had been playing ANY other class. Lots of running back and hiding behind obstacles. Sure, potions would have alleviated some of that, but I still would have been overwhelmed with no real way to fight back the way I could have as a GF or a ranged. I have to think that the Rogues can probably kill the groups of bugged mobs so fast they hardly notice that they're bugged. lol Plus, they can evade so easily with stealth! Man, that would have been nice.
Here's the thing though: at lev32 this all changes. I would love to just queue a cragmire or whatever and hit 32 like that, but the way the patch is right now, I wouldn't advise anyone to go into scaled content unless they are just morbidly curious. lol
As an aside, I saw some wizards running around while I was grumbling my way through the graveyard. I watched them. They were not having any trouble like I was. Must be nice.
Just a heads up about the final boss if running Cloak tower. Be ready to die often. Since taking much longer to kill her, her reinforcements go from being a nuisance to turn the battle into a massacre. I'm not even sure if lvl appropriate toons can take her down before the reinforcements show. You can Dodge,Duck, Dip, Dive and Dodge all you want to stay alive but that effectively takes you out the fight when it comes to supporting your party.
And once one player goes down, it basically becomes this irreversible slide to defeat as each death means more drudges to focus on fewer players. We had the party completely wiped out like 3-4 times. And the last time it took a glitch to win since she came through the gate, into the campfire area and we could just fight here w/o the drudges trying to have very uncomfortable relations with where I sit down. It would honestly worth holding out for a sec to set some plan or something before rushing in.
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louchristanMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 50Arc User
edited January 2021
I am an old player. I had spend thousands of dollars and hours in this game. I went through mod 16 and I didn't quit and so I guess I won't quit now eventhough it is just as bad, but that doesn't mean I am happy with the new patch and changes. Three of my toons are above IL 50K with one max out all mounts and companions. She still got killed easily by mobs in some area if not careful and did not had an easy time doing any combat. She had 37K IL before the patch and got scale down to 22k whenever she did random dungeons but still acceptable. Now every combat just took three times longer and harder but did not provide any fun, The worst thing is that you had the kind of feeling that your progress is pointless, you money and time spend are not worth it, you are getting weaker instead of stronger. I play this game for fun outside real life and as it is, this game don;t provide much even I had pour tons of money and time into it. As I said before I won't quit, I had invested too much time and money and just wish that someday it will become better. For now I better hold onto my wallet and wait for things to change for the better, LOL
Take heart, Lou. This is not the final form of the changes. There are bugged zones, bugged mobs, bugged dungeons, bugged skirmishes... things are not going to stay like this forever, or probably even that long.
It's not going to go back to exactly how it was before all this, but that doesn't mean the new system will be bad. It's just messed up right now.... really messed up in some places. And in some places, it's NOT messed up. They have to work on it still. I'm treating this like the beta release for live. LOL
Just a heads up about the final boss if running Cloak tower. Be ready to die often. Since taking much longer to kill her, her reinforcements go from being a nuisance to turn the battle into a massacre. I'm not even sure if lvl appropriate toons can take her down before the reinforcements show. You can Dodge,Duck, Dip, Dive and Dodge all you want to stay alive but that effectively takes you out the fight when it comes to supporting your party.
And once one player goes down, it basically becomes this irreversible slide to defeat as each death means more drudges to focus on fewer players. We had the party completely wiped out like 3-4 times. And the last time it took a glitch to win since she came through the gate, into the campfire area and we could just fight here w/o the drudges trying to have very uncomfortable relations with where I sit down. It would honestly worth holding out for a sec to set some plan or something before rushing in.
The boss isn’t bad, actually. It’s the adds. They are much tougher to kill than before, and the longer the fight goes, the more adds come. When I did it earlier today, when we finally burned the boss after multiple deaths, there were probably 20 adds in there. Anyone who tries to revive a player who is down will quickly get obliterated by the adds.
Good thing is, if they ratchet it back a bit, it will actually require some tactics and strategy to run it rather than face rolling it with overwhelming firepower.
It’s the adds. They are much tougher to kill than before, and the longer the fight goes, the more adds come.
This is the issue with leveling areas as well, not just in the dungeons. I'm in Helm's Hold right now and taking down the Shepherd of the Damned was a nightmare to manage because she summons so much. Meanwhile, the next boss - Halas the Pure - no sweat. He doesn't summon, he only buffs. If you burn down his trash mob escort he has nobody to buff up to help him. I am not looking forward to Rohini.
EDIT: Rohini was a problem, as I had guessed. I ended up just going kamikaze and sprinting up to her and unloading everything I had and kept swinging until she or I hit the dirt. Got her on my second try, and of course all the Add swarm just tore me to pieces immediately. The fun part is that they despawn after she is dead and so are you, so.... win?
Ebon Downs is next. The fun part of that area is probably going to be watching the slow spell from Giggles essentially root the zombies into place for me. Don't think there are demihuman hurler mobs in that area either, so probably going to be smooth sailing, especially when I finally get Avalanche of Steel at lev38.
Just a heads up about the final boss if running Cloak tower. Be ready to die often. Since taking much longer to kill her, her reinforcements go from being a nuisance to turn the battle into a massacre. I'm not even sure if lvl appropriate toons can take her down before the reinforcements show. You can Dodge,Duck, Dip, Dive and Dodge all you want to stay alive but that effectively takes you out the fight when it comes to supporting your party.
And once one player goes down, it basically becomes this irreversible slide to defeat as each death means more drudges to focus on fewer players. We had the party completely wiped out like 3-4 times. And the last time it took a glitch to win since she came through the gate, into the campfire area and we could just fight here w/o the drudges trying to have very uncomfortable relations with where I sit down. It would honestly worth holding out for a sec to set some plan or something before rushing in.
The boss isn’t bad, actually. It’s the adds. They are much tougher to kill than before, and the longer the fight goes, the more adds come. When I did it earlier today, when we finally burned the boss after multiple deaths, there were probably 20 adds in there. Anyone who tries to revive a player who is down will quickly get obliterated by the adds.
Good thing is, if they ratchet it back a bit, it will actually require some tactics and strategy to run it rather than face rolling it with overwhelming firepower.
Yeah, pretty much what I was getting at. Not bad by herself, just takes awhile to kill and by then those fracking adds hop in. I'm not even sure how many adds were in there when she glitched in but enough that it was an insta-death after healing. I barely saw him stand back up lol. Haven't ran others yet but slight tweaks to things like that and making rewards fit the time invested in running them could make it interesting.
Well, just checked out the hotfix with my GWF. I wish I could go back to the sewers or plague tower, but the areas are done now, so I reverted back to 5.2K TIL by putting back on all my old tutorial gear and messed around with some orc axe hurlers. And it looks like they haven't "fixed" the damage back to what most people are going to be happy with yet. A single axe hurler ranged attack is still hitting for more than the Ogre's slow overhead smash, and they are more durable and take longer to kill than an ogre as well. They seem to have been nerfed somewhat compared to yesterday, but probably still need to get adjusted if they want the patch to make logical sense to players. Either make the Ogres tougher (unlikely), or tone the hurlers down some more than they have already. You can still get overwhelmed pretty fast if you pull a bunch of axe hurlers and then ignore them while you attack a melee mob. Unless you prioritize ranged trash, you're in trouble with the Tower District still.
But I am happy to report that Blackdagger Ruins pirate archers are nowhere near the threat that other ranged trash are. Archers can be safely put on the back burner, for the most part, unless you pull a BUNCH of them. I did have to pick a fighter player up near the Xalliana area, but I think he was lagging because I saw him later and he was doing fine.
I don't think people are going to have a super-hard time with the blackdagger area at all, just from my poking around you can tell it's not as intense as the Tower district at all. Those axe hurlers... it's like the hurlers from the kobold sewers. For some reason whoever is in charge of this stuff made a few of the ranged trash mobs super-deadly. I bet there's a decimal point missing from some number in their server config file or something. I can't believe that they want axe hurlers to be more powerful than ogres like this on purpose.
I'm not going to lvl a new toon because they broke the game, and have to play a new toon in early content to even have a chance.
Vallenhas and Avernus feel more or less the same, took a IL 26k Paladin there, and it wasn't too bad - there were some tough fights, but nothing compared to what i saw during those dungeon runs.
Ape in Vallenhas did die pretty quickly, didn't try any heroics or hunts in Avernus, so there might still be some bad news in there for me, have to wait and see...
Anyway, dungeon and probably skirmish runs are just broken for low and mid level players now.
I do believe in killing the messenger...
Want to know why?
Because it sends a message!
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arazith07Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,719Arc User
Well, i did another Cloak Tower run with my Fighter, we had 2 level 80 in there with decent equipment/IL, and we really struggled to finish it. So, if a group with way above the required IL players is having problems with getting through this dungeon, how on gods green earth are a group of level 20 with IL around 5k going to finish it for their main quest line?
And the rewards are still as crappy as they were before the change - the rewards (from the dungeon itself and the RDQ) were fine before, when we could simply blast through the dungeon, but now they're only adding insult to injury.
I did it myself, we had 2 30s, 2 50s, and me (healer) at level 80. It seemed very easy to me. Vansi died in maybe 20 seconds tops. Yeah the Orcs had more HP, but it wasn't crazy amount or anything. We weren't spending more than 20 seconds with each group and no one was getting hurt that much. I was hardly healing.
I'm not going to lvl a new toon because they broke the game, and have to play a new toon in early content to even have a chance.
Well, you have to understand that I am leveling a GWF through bugged content with no potions and only found gear. My TIL is very low, even now at lev 35 I have under 7k. Every fight I have to carefully plan and control or my health will be near zero by the end. It is a constant harrowing struggle. This is almost like when I soloed the Throne of Idris with only white gear as a TR back in 2014 or more recently, trying to solo an ME with 2 runes attached and no decent gear. I gimped myself on purpose to see if the "worst class to level" could manage this patch with limited resources and a lot fewer options than most folks get stuck with. The answer is "barely".
Just one thousand extra TIL from say, some decent mount insignias and maybe a couple of companions or better mounts than the freebies would even turn my bad situation around dramatically. Also, it would be an entirely different situation for me if I was ANY other class. If you are able to regularly heal yourself in a fight like a pally or cleric you will not be in trouble. If you have some good control abilities like a Rogue (smoke bomb) or Wizard (everything) it is WAY easier to not get overwhelmed like I am constantly trying to avoid as a GWF.
Combat Advantage isn't a joke anymore. Most of the time, the mobs are jockeying for position to get it on you or avoid it from you, and it HURTS now. There is no clear indication for you to know when you are vulnerable that I have seen other than my health bar plummeting drastically in response to being between two mobs. And they don't have to be close, either. CA works at range, all they care about is the angles. Same for you --> you don't have to be close to the mobs to get CA you just need a comp or any other ally to be in combat and generally on the other side from you, and you will be hammering them.
While I am evaluating if a mob is bugged or not during my travels here I am careful to not be in CA to them because everything hits so much harder in that situation, and everything seems too strong to you to be fair. In other words, everything looks bugged and OP if they have CA on you. That's one of the main reasons why control abilities that slow, stun, root, or KD (less so for KB except as a "get out of trouble" button) are so valuable right now. You can maintain or avoid CA so much easier.
When you purchase a god like character of course it will be easy...you purchased a god like character. Characters starting from lvl1 with no gear or boosts from money spent, however, do not have an easy time under the previous patch. It took a long time for me to clear the Chasm and Mt Hottenow(sp?) areas solo. I died a lot whether I used health stones or not.
As it stands now, that same character cannot even fight mobs in BlackLake, Ebon Downs or any other area as I cannot even get to boss fights. I spent $10 for character slots and at this point with the game this unplayable I want my money back.
You have no reason to accuse me of buying my way. Actually I never spent any real money on this game, I am completely F2P. I have played since 2013 though, stuff tends to accumulate. And while my main character is 52k IL now, I DO have lesser geared characters I play, for instance my 30k IL Rogue. Same thing on him, he get his kills.
My experience with the level 80 content is that it is harder but doable. Some things are no longer possible: Soloing HEs, soloing dungeons. That is as it should be. Kills are somewhat slower, but not by much in my experience.
As you can see from other posts here, others agree with me on that. Then some people complain they get massacred. (And note: There seems to be some hard tuning problems in the leveling content, I am not disagreeing with that part)
So the question I ask is why do some people have problems? Bad builds? Bad skills? It is always hard for people to admit the fault might be theirs. Everyone is a hero in their own mind. It is my impression most people are doing OK in the level 80 content.
I think the content will be easier in a few days without any changes from Cryptic: * People will tune their builds better (Why did people put 7.500 million AD from bonding stones into the ZAX queue when they should use those monies to upgrade their pets to mythic??) * People will adapt to the higher threat level * People will develop the defensive skills they maybe never had a reason to develop while content was so easy.
Let me end this by mentioning the old defensive stuff: * Never stay in red * Let tank go first where applicable * Attack mobs from behind where applicable * If you cannot go behind mob, never stand still and let the mob whack on you. Move, move move. When a mob is running at you, it takes 1-2 seconds for the mob to stop and start swinging. You better be gone before that swing can connect. * Heal potions are massively upgraded. Use them, love them. * Where applicable, learn the tactics of the encounter and follow it
right, so queue for merchant princes folly, hold everyone up while you read all that to them, then if they havent kicked you by the time you finish, try to explain a tactic to them, and if they still havent kicked you, go in and discover that the best laid battle plan falls apart when you engage the enemy.
if they listened to all that then someone dies and quits, hold everything and explain it all again?
even when there are no issues, how many times in demogorgon have you heard 'only the purples' only to see people open everything? or throne of the dwarven gods, someone say 'dont kill the thoons' or 'thoons to the shield - not the gates', only to facepalm while it descends into a thoon killing contest.?
this idea only has a chance to work if you use a guild or alliance team that will stay and not quit, and work together regardless.
for committed augment users whose paragon and powers preclude the use of dps/control companions none of the tips are useful. the issue isnt about finding a workaround via tactics, the issue is simply that they have set trash mobs hp and dmg far higher than the bosses. its a simple enough thing to resolve and that needs to be done by cryptic, but they need to listen to the players.. to lower the trash mobs ratings..bit by bit until its acceptable, yes maybe 4-5 times in a day, not tell us they will resolve it with a patch in the coming week. they need to be focus on the issue and if it means several 'emergency' server restarts in a day then so be it. people are leaving the game today, they will leave tomorrow, and everyday until this gets sorted out.
i know the mystic times in the past you mentioned, mod 6 and mod 16, i was here for both of those and stayed, but so many left, yes new players came in bit by bit, but none of them then knew the dungeon mechanics and even after the issues were resolved it took a long time for 'noobs' to have some general idea what they were doing.
we shouldnt have to keep going through all of this when all thats required is changing a damage multiplier from .6 to .3 or however much it is. and if we find workarounds and change tactics instead of complaining,- they will assume we are content with the game the way it is, and do nothing.
Well, i did another Cloak Tower run with my Fighter, we had 2 level 80 in there with decent equipment/IL, and we really struggled to finish it. So, if a group with way above the required IL players is having problems with getting through this dungeon, how on gods green earth are a group of level 20 with IL around 5k going to finish it for their main quest line?
And the rewards are still as crappy as they were before the change - the rewards (from the dungeon itself and the RDQ) were fine before, when we could simply blast through the dungeon, but now they're only adding insult to injury.
I did it myself, we had 2 30s, 2 50s, and me (healer) at level 80. It seemed very easy to me. Vansi died in maybe 20 seconds tops. Yeah the Orcs had more HP, but it wasn't crazy amount or anything. We weren't spending more than 20 seconds with each group and no one was getting hurt that much. I was hardly healing.
Well, congratulation on having one hell of a magical group there, since normally characters do get hurt and even die when they rush forward into enemy groups in that dungeon.
And for burning down Vansi within 20s you need some serious dps plus either someone killing her minions really fast too, or at least someone kiting the adds around like a maniac, but that's going to stop working that well, when Vanis jumps right into the middle of her followers and you can't even target her properly anymore or some of the adds start ganging up on you...
Safe to say that i haven't seen that kind of magic happen to me, and i run that dungeon at least once per day right now for testing and hoping that they fix this HAMSTER at some point.
> @mentinmindmaker said: > You have no reason to accuse me of buying my way. Actually I never spent any real money on this game, I am completely F2P. I have played since 2013 though, stuff tends to accumulate. And while my main character is 52k IL now, I DO have lesser geared characters I play, for instance my 30k IL Rogue. Same thing on him, he get his kills. > > My experience with the level 80 content is that it is harder but doable. Some things are no longer possible: Soloing HEs, soloing dungeons. That is as it should be. Kills are somewhat slower, but not by much in my experience. > > As you can see from other posts here, others agree with me on that. Then some people complain they get massacred. (And note: There seems to be some hard tuning problems in the leveling content, I am not disagreeing with that part) > > So the question I ask is why do some people have problems? Bad builds? Bad skills? It is always hard for people to admit the fault might be theirs. Everyone is a hero in their own mind. It is my impression most people are doing OK in the level 80 content. > > I think the content will be easier in a few days without any changes from Cryptic: > * People will tune their builds better > (Why did people put 7.500 million AD from bonding stones into the ZAX queue when they should use those monies to upgrade their pets to mythic??) > * People will adapt to the higher threat level > * People will develop the defensive skills they maybe never had a reason to develop while content was so easy. > > Let me end this by mentioning the old defensive stuff: > * Never stay in red > * Let tank go first where applicable > * Attack mobs from behind where applicable > * If you cannot go behind mob, never stand still and let the mob whack on you. Move, move move. When a mob is running at you, it takes 1-2 seconds for the mob to stop and start swinging. You better be gone before that swing can connect. > * Heal potions are massively upgraded. Use them, love them. > * Where applicable, learn the tactics of the encounter and follow it
For level 80 chars, yes, tuning is needed. I noticed on my wizard that he had capped critical severity by many thousand from items so had to buy and change a couple of enchantments. But i have a very limited supply of AD so thats what i was able to do (still capped om critical severity but not by as much). To "fine tune" stats you have to adjust gear, for me to find new gear in the vicinity of my present gear i have to do stuff that are currently to difficult. To me it is obvious that Cryptic wants to increase the need to buy Zen. I totally understand that, as a company needs income to survive. If I could get my hands on some Epic, legendary or mythic mounts and companions together with some nice insignias i bet it would be a lot more doable. Im simply not going to do that though.. I was thinking about buying VIP to get some keys and loot lockboxes but when calculating on how much was needed to only loot a portion of my now 900 lockboxes... 🥴 I think they simply wants to reduce the number of F2P players and i think they have succeeded greatly, by the looks of it here though, they have lost many paying customers also.
for committed augment users whose paragon and powers preclude the use of dps/control companions none of the tips are useful.
With regard to the stuff about CA, this is very true if you intend to solo -- which ppl should be able to do. Is there a class or build that REQUIRES an augment companion, though? I'm just saying, if you take fighting comps off the table for yourself while soloing, you are kinda gimping yourself in the new system. And I don't just mean defensively, on account of mob damage being split between you and a comp who could be helping take some shots for you, I mean really gimping yourself OFFENSIVELY --> CA can just about double your damage output with no special statting for it. It's very noticeable on scrubGWF, and even Giggles does noticeably more damage when I am on the other side of the enemies from him, and he's a white ranked freebie companion!
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I'm probably going to keep leveling my trash GWF (I have a lot of spare time right now and its been like 3 years since I played a GWF) and see if I can root any more of them out as I go, and if I run into other kinds of issues I'll alert people here about that stuff as well. I hope anyone who feels like they can contribute decides to post here as well. Even if you're just frustrated, sometimes it helps to vent somewhere.
Too many keep saying "they try to destroy the game" or "they wrecked the game"... this was done already and it was done almost 2 years ago. But they had a lot of help from the players. The players who come here and say one liners, the players who don't follow through, the players who don't play the game on preview, the endless bickering with each other instead of helping each other, and the players who are just spoiled by their own godhood because this game is all about them.
If you were not here 2 years ago, then you missed a wonderful funeral. They burned the library and all the books, people acted like it didn't matter, they danced in the street, and this was the game. Welcome to Neverwinter 3.0 and you will just play it as they intend or not at all. Maybe 2 or 3 years from now, if you are still here, you can learn play their next version of this game.
This thread was created to help other players overcome the new system. Very few people came to talk strategy and they get bickering, insults, and debate instead. Help your fellow players stop talking to them as if they created this game.
@ultramath#3953 Good job on the topic, I hope others will follow your example. That was a good thing you caught with the new GWF and the ranged mobs. I only tested my level 80s on preview and was disappointed by my companions. Players need to come to terms with their companions are nothing more than the secondary artifacts you carry. They will not fight and win the battle for you, while you trot off to the bathroom. I didn't make any vast changes on my builds or companions. I am running eight level 80s and my wizards are not suffering deaths in Avernus, as they did prior to these changes, but I suspect that was the developer's main focus. I would say somebody dropped the ball on the whole new player coming into the game fresh. I barely had a month on preview, after I returned to the game, to even think about doing a new character, let alone check my current ones.
Thank you for your support!
Thanks Wendy. You're a nice person.
And the rewards are still as crappy as they were before the change - the rewards (from the dungeon itself and the RDQ) were fine before, when we could simply blast through the dungeon, but now they're only adding insult to injury.
> Wow, that was good man. After going through that area myself yesterday, i have to give props to anyone who finishes it lol. A shame that they didn't get that one in the hotfix, but there's no way that they are done with this patch as it is now. More fixes are coming for sure.
I was curious as to how difficult the boss fight would be :)
I am new to this game but i have played a lot of rpgs in the past, like nwn, nwn2, dragon age etc and I always play on very hard, nightmare or whatever is equivalent because in single player games i have time and I can pause, move to strategic positions and think things through. But for an mmo i think it should not be like playing on hard mode doing trash mobs and like very easy doing boss fights.. In fact, The other way around would be much more appealing to me 🤔 For a boss fight i dont mind struggling, but since mmos by nature is a bit ( a lot) repetative, it just takes sooo much time and effort to do regular content and advance, and the rewards for the struggle is terribly low.
Event - seems OK. Things hurt more, but it wasnt too awful.
Ran a daily skirmish - sharandar wolves and fairies. Took about 10 times longer than before for the same crapawful rewards. People died from add swarms.
Ran a RTQ to see what it was like - thankfully demogorgon (tried CODG yesterday - just dont). Again took longer - good team can get phase one to silver, not a chance in hell of gold. Everything takes longer to kill, people died to adds. Same crapawful reward, took about 2-3 times as long as normal.
Economy is completely fekked for now - AH has doubled prices.
I can't face lomm or TIC yet. So im just on key picked and raw conversion minimum till fixed or vip runs out...
3 deaths later and 40 minutes i get 6,3 thousand astrals. I thought by mistake I was playing Epic dungeon. the AD is not worth that much time for so little a reward.
What will it take to get my trial run. 39 thousand AD would be some kind of mythic god fight. taking anything from 1 day to 1 month to finish. the reward system is now basically to hard for so little. Even when I paid VIP I feel b**t f**k!
I play Neverwinter for the wizards of the coast books and feel of D&D, not just fighting for fightings sake. it looks more like Neverwinter has become a money machine, because without paying I will never finish upgrading my character. Since I will need to spend money on this, I might as well see whats out there.
We had a level 17 Warlock in our group, she was to close to a gate when it was opened, dead within a second with no chance for even drinking a potion... i'm not saying that a dps or healer should be able to tank a group of enemies, but there should be some time for evades or potions.
And even as a tank staying alive vs. several enemies is a constant struggle, and not a fun one...
Just to be clear, the dungeon bosses aren't the problem anymore, but their minions are - everything can be going fine while fighting a boss, then adds spawn and your whole team is dead within seconds.
As it stands now, that same character cannot even fight mobs in BlackLake, Ebon Downs or any other area as I cannot even get to boss fights. I spent $10 for character slots and at this point with the game this unplayable I want my money back.
> When you purchase a god like character of course it will be easy...you purchased a god like character. Characters starting from lvl1 with no gear or boosts from money spent, however, do not have an easy time under the previous patch. It took a long time for me to clear the Chasm and Mt Hottenow(sp?) areas solo. I died a lot whether I used health stones or not.
>
> As it stands now, that same character cannot even fight mobs in BlackLake, Ebon Downs or any other area as I cannot even get to boss fights. I spent $10 for character slots and at this point with the game this unplayable I want my money back.
Exactly. I didnt find the game so easy before this patch.. I just managed to get som decent gear from ME for my wizard, and I only have a couple of Green mounts with a few blue insignias, i have the Duergar (Green) companion with gear from ME. It wasnt easy, it was challanging enough before.. Not everyone have played for years with several mythic/legendary companions/mounts and good insignias. I died sometimes during ME before the patch, now its unplayable.
I have to say that being 6.8K TIL at lev31 is not the worst thing in the world right now, and really, the lack of potions isn't hurting me as much as the extreme disadvantage of having almost no AoE ability against hordes of dangerous mobs. You never really noticed it, I must imagine, when the mobs just went down with one hit, but now that they are so much tougher, the missing pieces in the early GWF toolbox are really obvious and inconvenient. I took so much more damage in Neverdeath than I would have if I had been playing ANY other class. Lots of running back and hiding behind obstacles. Sure, potions would have alleviated some of that, but I still would have been overwhelmed with no real way to fight back the way I could have as a GF or a ranged. I have to think that the Rogues can probably kill the groups of bugged mobs so fast they hardly notice that they're bugged. lol Plus, they can evade so easily with stealth! Man, that would have been nice.
Here's the thing though: at lev32 this all changes. I would love to just queue a cragmire or whatever and hit 32 like that, but the way the patch is right now, I wouldn't advise anyone to go into scaled content unless they are just morbidly curious. lol
As an aside, I saw some wizards running around while I was grumbling my way through the graveyard. I watched them. They were not having any trouble like I was. Must be nice.
And once one player goes down, it basically becomes this irreversible slide to defeat as each death means more drudges to focus on fewer players. We had the party completely wiped out like 3-4 times. And the last time it took a glitch to win since she came through the gate, into the campfire area and we could just fight here w/o the drudges trying to have very uncomfortable relations with where I sit down.
It would honestly worth holding out for a sec to set some plan or something before rushing in.
It's not going to go back to exactly how it was before all this, but that doesn't mean the new system will be bad. It's just messed up right now.... really messed up in some places. And in some places, it's NOT messed up. They have to work on it still. I'm treating this like the beta release for live. LOL
Good thing is, if they ratchet it back a bit, it will actually require some tactics and strategy to run it rather than face rolling it with overwhelming firepower.
EDIT: Rohini was a problem, as I had guessed. I ended up just going kamikaze and sprinting up to her and unloading everything I had and kept swinging until she or I hit the dirt. Got her on my second try, and of course all the Add swarm just tore me to pieces immediately. The fun part is that they despawn after she is dead and so are you, so.... win?
Ebon Downs is next. The fun part of that area is probably going to be watching the slow spell from Giggles essentially root the zombies into place for me. Don't think there are demihuman hurler mobs in that area either, so probably going to be smooth sailing, especially when I finally get Avalanche of Steel at lev38.
I'm not even sure how many adds were in there when she glitched in but enough that it was an insta-death after healing. I barely saw him stand back up lol.
Haven't ran others yet but slight tweaks to things like that and making rewards fit the time invested in running them could make it interesting.
Ape in Vallenhas did die pretty quickly, didn't try any heroics or hunts in Avernus, so there might still be some bad news in there for me, have to wait and see...
Anyway, dungeon and probably skirmish runs are just broken for low and mid level players now.
Just one thousand extra TIL from say, some decent mount insignias and maybe a couple of companions or better mounts than the freebies would even turn my bad situation around dramatically. Also, it would be an entirely different situation for me if I was ANY other class. If you are able to regularly heal yourself in a fight like a pally or cleric you will not be in trouble. If you have some good control abilities like a Rogue (smoke bomb) or Wizard (everything) it is WAY easier to not get overwhelmed like I am constantly trying to avoid as a GWF.
Combat Advantage isn't a joke anymore. Most of the time, the mobs are jockeying for position to get it on you or avoid it from you, and it HURTS now. There is no clear indication for you to know when you are vulnerable that I have seen other than my health bar plummeting drastically in response to being between two mobs. And they don't have to be close, either. CA works at range, all they care about is the angles. Same for you --> you don't have to be close to the mobs to get CA you just need a comp or any other ally to be in combat and generally on the other side from you, and you will be hammering them.
While I am evaluating if a mob is bugged or not during my travels here I am careful to not be in CA to them because everything hits so much harder in that situation, and everything seems too strong to you to be fair. In other words, everything looks bugged and OP if they have CA on you. That's one of the main reasons why control abilities that slow, stun, root, or KD (less so for KB except as a "get out of trouble" button) are so valuable right now. You can maintain or avoid CA so much easier.
My experience with the level 80 content is that it is harder but doable. Some things are no longer possible: Soloing HEs, soloing dungeons. That is as it should be. Kills are somewhat slower, but not by much in my experience.
As you can see from other posts here, others agree with me on that. Then some people complain they get massacred. (And note: There seems to be some hard tuning problems in the leveling content, I am not disagreeing with that part)
So the question I ask is why do some people have problems? Bad builds? Bad skills? It is always hard for people to admit the fault might be theirs. Everyone is a hero in their own mind. It is my impression most people are doing OK in the level 80 content.
I think the content will be easier in a few days without any changes from Cryptic:
* People will tune their builds better
(Why did people put 7.500 million AD from bonding stones into the ZAX queue when they should use those monies to upgrade their pets to mythic??)
* People will adapt to the higher threat level
* People will develop the defensive skills they maybe never had a reason to develop while content was so easy.
Let me end this by mentioning the old defensive stuff:
* Never stay in red
* Let tank go first where applicable
* Attack mobs from behind where applicable
* If you cannot go behind mob, never stand still and let the mob whack on you. Move, move move. When a mob is running at you, it takes 1-2 seconds for the mob to stop and start swinging. You better be gone before that swing can connect.
* Heal potions are massively upgraded. Use them, love them.
* Where applicable, learn the tactics of the encounter and follow it
if they listened to all that then someone dies and quits, hold everything and explain it all again?
even when there are no issues, how many times in demogorgon have you heard 'only the purples' only to see people open everything?
or throne of the dwarven gods, someone say 'dont kill the thoons' or 'thoons to the shield - not the gates', only to facepalm while it descends into a thoon killing contest.?
this idea only has a chance to work if you use a guild or alliance team that will stay and not quit, and work together regardless.
for committed augment users whose paragon and powers preclude the use of dps/control companions none of the tips are useful.
the issue isnt about finding a workaround via tactics, the issue is simply that they have set trash mobs hp and dmg far higher than the bosses.
its a simple enough thing to resolve and that needs to be done by cryptic, but they need to listen to the players.. to lower the trash mobs ratings..bit by bit until its acceptable, yes maybe 4-5 times in a day, not tell us they will resolve it with a patch in the coming week.
they need to be focus on the issue and if it means several 'emergency' server restarts in a day then so be it.
people are leaving the game today, they will leave tomorrow, and everyday until this gets sorted out.
i know the mystic times in the past you mentioned, mod 6 and mod 16, i was here for both of those and stayed, but so many left, yes new players came in bit by bit, but none of them then knew the dungeon mechanics and even after the issues were resolved it took a long time for 'noobs' to have some general idea what they were doing.
we shouldnt have to keep going through all of this when all thats required is changing a damage multiplier from .6 to .3 or however much it is. and if we find workarounds and change tactics instead of complaining,- they will assume we are content with the game the way it is, and do nothing.
And for burning down Vansi within 20s you need some serious dps plus either someone killing her minions really fast too, or at least someone kiting the adds around like a maniac, but that's going to stop working that well, when Vanis jumps right into the middle of her followers and you can't even target her properly anymore or some of the adds start ganging up on you...
Safe to say that i haven't seen that kind of magic happen to me, and i run that dungeon at least once per day right now for testing and hoping that they fix this HAMSTER at some point.
> You have no reason to accuse me of buying my way. Actually I never spent any real money on this game, I am completely F2P. I have played since 2013 though, stuff tends to accumulate. And while my main character is 52k IL now, I DO have lesser geared characters I play, for instance my 30k IL Rogue. Same thing on him, he get his kills.
>
> My experience with the level 80 content is that it is harder but doable. Some things are no longer possible: Soloing HEs, soloing dungeons. That is as it should be. Kills are somewhat slower, but not by much in my experience.
>
> As you can see from other posts here, others agree with me on that. Then some people complain they get massacred. (And note: There seems to be some hard tuning problems in the leveling content, I am not disagreeing with that part)
>
> So the question I ask is why do some people have problems? Bad builds? Bad skills? It is always hard for people to admit the fault might be theirs. Everyone is a hero in their own mind. It is my impression most people are doing OK in the level 80 content.
>
> I think the content will be easier in a few days without any changes from Cryptic:
> * People will tune their builds better
> (Why did people put 7.500 million AD from bonding stones into the ZAX queue when they should use those monies to upgrade their pets to mythic??)
> * People will adapt to the higher threat level
> * People will develop the defensive skills they maybe never had a reason to develop while content was so easy.
>
> Let me end this by mentioning the old defensive stuff:
> * Never stay in red
> * Let tank go first where applicable
> * Attack mobs from behind where applicable
> * If you cannot go behind mob, never stand still and let the mob whack on you. Move, move move. When a mob is running at you, it takes 1-2 seconds for the mob to stop and start swinging. You better be gone before that swing can connect.
> * Heal potions are massively upgraded. Use them, love them.
> * Where applicable, learn the tactics of the encounter and follow it
For level 80 chars, yes, tuning is needed. I noticed on my wizard that he had capped critical severity by many thousand from items so had to buy and change a couple of enchantments. But i have a very limited supply of AD so thats what i was able to do (still capped om critical severity but not by as much). To "fine tune" stats you have to adjust gear, for me to find new gear in the vicinity of my present gear i have to do stuff that are currently to difficult. To me it is obvious that Cryptic wants to increase the need to buy Zen. I totally understand that, as a company needs income to survive. If I could get my hands on some Epic, legendary or mythic mounts and companions together with some nice insignias i bet it would be a lot more doable. Im simply not going to do that though.. I was thinking about buying VIP to get some keys and loot lockboxes but when calculating on how much was needed to only loot a portion of my now 900 lockboxes... 🥴 I think they simply wants to reduce the number of F2P players and i think they have succeeded greatly, by the looks of it here though, they have lost many paying customers also.
Edited for clarity