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what kind of crazy "balancing"

vigor#8801 vigor Member Posts: 196 Arc User
Causes me to have half as much pen as I do crit in Tiamat, or similarly my stats were messed up in SPC.

In SPC I was having huge swings in damage output. I hit for 200k with a power one shot and 10 or 20k with the same power in the next shot. I didn't look real close at my post-"balanced" stats there but then I did tiamat and again my damage was all wierd. I didn't even make the top 5 in DPS so I looked and sure enough, my pen was 19k and my crit was 35k. Prior to "balancing" they are both at about 90k.

How can I navigate this crazy environment of balanced content? In the past I have entered a dungeon private and solo to test and see how I was being balanced and how i performed. Why should I need to do that? I also used to keep 3 sets of equipment to balance myself before entering a dungeon. I am not gonna do that again. I might keep a piece of extra equipment or two for situational use but even if I tailored every one of my chars to each possible dungeon, the next day someone would complain I was too effective and the Dev team would alter the balancing formula (like they have done before)

Why aren't there tiers of dungeons any more? I.e. demogorgon begginner, demogorgon intermediate, demo master. Don't let 35k IL people in demo beginner. Problem solved.

Comments

  • sandukutupusandukutupu Member Posts: 2,285 Arc User

    If you launch this new system of yours it will probably be broken again. From what I hear it sounds like it will be similarly broken. We can all look forward to a new dev team 2 years from now to give us a new broken system. Maybe you could hire one of the old cleveland browns management teams to do the new breaking.

    Some of us, actually take the time to see the oncoming train. Others mill about the platform waiting to jump on it with no idea where it is headed other than speculation. I will have more words to share about this later.

    I am back,

    Happy 2021! <3
    wb-cenders.gif
  • vastano#2343 vastano Member Posts: 169 Arc User

    If you launch this new system of yours it will probably be broken again. From what I hear it sounds like it will be similarly broken. We can all look forward to a new dev team 2 years from now to give us a new broken system. Maybe you could hire one of the old cleveland browns management teams to do the new breaking.

    Some of us, actually take the time to see the oncoming train. Others mill about the platform waiting to jump on it with no idea where it is headed other than speculation. I will have more words to share about this later.

    I am back,

    Happy 2021!
    and some of us who have been in simaler positions before see the train wreck in progress
    i may be wrong (and i hope i am) but with what always seems to happen in old games when the devs try to change something big they break the core
    from what i can see there is 3 possible outcomes to the wreck in progress
    1 we adapt and by some miracle it acually works as intended (i know more chance of winning every lottery the world over in the same week)
    2 it totally breaks the game making it unplayable
    3 the devs come to their senses and break this update down into much smaller changes so people can acually plan ahead and roll with the changes as they come (like we did with mount changes)
    on a side note happy 2021 to you to

  • sandukutupusandukutupu Member Posts: 2,285 Arc User
    edited January 2021
    All I was eluding to was the fact vigor is listening to others on preview and not participating themselves. Most of the time, when the changes work on preview, they function on Live. However for some reason back on Ravenloft module 14, while the module functioned there, they had to take over two weeks to work out why the bugged instances. Sometimes you can even have a normal module go off course. Back when Thomas Foss worked on it, he stated it was like working on an old Harley. As for train wrecks, we cannot have one, since the train was derailed on module 16 and never put back on track. :lol:

    Have fun! <3
    wb-cenders.gif
  • vastano#2343 vastano Member Posts: 169 Arc User
    edited January 2021
    tbf i think anyone who hasnt been over to preview and tinkered their build is going to be at a huge disadvantage when mod 20 hits
    as you said on the post you wrote on other thread you need to test 3 or 4 diffent enchant setups 3 or 4 different runestone set ups same goes for insignia and artifacts
    i know it has been making my head hurt enough when its free to test things out
    but i also know when this hits live and you get 1 free exchange i will know exactly what i need to switch
  • dread4moordread4moor Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,154 Arc User

    tbf i think anyone who hasnt been over to preview and tinkered their build is going to be at a huge disadvantage when mod 20 hits
    as you said on the post you wrote on other thread you need to test 3 or 4 diffent enchant setups 3 or 4 different runestone set ups same goes for insignia and artifacts
    i know it has been making my head hurt enough when its free to test things out
    but i also know when this hits live and you get 1 free exchange i will know exactly what i need to switch

    THIS. Right here.
    This is why most of us veteran NW players stopped playing.
    For a game this old with such a small player base, you should not HAVE to waste a dozen hours trying out a half dozen different builds on preview just to be an AVERAGE player in a mediocre lame duck MMORPG.
    That's insane. There are a dozen better MMORPGs out now with far lower "keep-up" costs.

    The maintenance costs (time AND/or money) are way too high from module to module in this game.
    Glad I came back to check. Still dying a sloooooow death? Yep.
    Too bad. I use to love this game.
    Sad.
    JrUzbQw.jpg?1
    I am Took.
    "Full plate and packing steel" in NW since 2013.
  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,508 Arc User

    tbf i think anyone who hasnt been over to preview and tinkered their build is going to be at a huge disadvantage when mod 20 hits
    as you said on the post you wrote on other thread you need to test 3 or 4 diffent enchant setups 3 or 4 different runestone set ups same goes for insignia and artifacts
    i know it has been making my head hurt enough when its free to test things out
    but i also know when this hits live and you get 1 free exchange i will know exactly what i need to switch

    THIS. Right here.
    This is why most of us veteran NW players stopped playing.
    For a game this old with such a small player base, you should not HAVE to waste a dozen hours trying out a half dozen different builds on preview just to be an AVERAGE player in a mediocre lame duck MMORPG.
    That's insane. There are a dozen better MMORPGs out now with far lower "keep-up" costs.

    The maintenance costs (time AND/or money) are way too high from module to module in this game.
    Glad I came back to check. Still dying a sloooooow death? Yep.
    Too bad. I use to love this game.
    Sad.
    21st most populated MMO of 2020 isn't small. You really don't need to pay anything in time or money to be average. You can have a completely bonkers build and be average.
  • dread4moordread4moor Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,154 Arc User
    edited January 2021
    arazith07 said:

    tbf i think anyone who hasnt been over to preview and tinkered their build is going to be at a huge disadvantage when mod 20 hits
    as you said on the post you wrote on other thread you need to test 3 or 4 diffent enchant setups 3 or 4 different runestone set ups same goes for insignia and artifacts
    i know it has been making my head hurt enough when its free to test things out
    but i also know when this hits live and you get 1 free exchange i will know exactly what i need to switch

    THIS. Right here.
    This is why most of us veteran NW players stopped playing.
    For a game this old with such a small player base, you should not HAVE to waste a dozen hours trying out a half dozen different builds on preview just to be an AVERAGE player in a mediocre lame duck MMORPG.
    That's insane. There are a dozen better MMORPGs out now with far lower "keep-up" costs.

    The maintenance costs (time AND/or money) are way too high from module to module in this game.
    Glad I came back to check. Still dying a sloooooow death? Yep.
    Too bad. I use to love this game.
    Sad.
    21st most populated MMO of 2020 isn't small. You really don't need to pay anything in time or money to be average. You can have a completely bonkers build and be average.
    LOLs
    Not naysaying. Loved the game and played it for 7 years. But... ur dead wrong.
    First, everything you said directly refutes the @vastano#2343 's whole point.
    I was a dedicated preview stalker for 15 modules.

    Was early preview selected for several. Followed the great researchers and theorycrafters religiously. Tested builds 2-4 hours per week for 7 years.
    Posted a dozen builds on 3 classes since 2013 (all preview tested).
    All that to say, I wasn't the best, but I went over and beyond what the "average" player invests (TIME, not momney... I stopped reqrding NW's lazy writing with ZEN 2 years ago).
    Took aint no wallet warrior. I did the grind. I did the preview more than most.
    AND...
    'It is no longer worth it.
    This game is NOT dead, but it is very lame for the time cost JUST to be above average.
    I speak from 7 years experience.
    But hey, some people like counting sand.
    Keep playing if you liker the ay it is.
    More power to you.

    EDIT:
    Oh, as for humble bragging about bein g "number 21 MMO"...
    I checked all the top 5 MMO sites. It's more like 22nd...
    AND beneath ALL of these games in revenue, player # AND critical/player review:
    1 World of Warcraft 4,281,939
    2 Destiny 2 889,547
    3 Old School RuneScape 1,674,237
    4 World of Warcraft Classic 691,150
    5 FINAL FANTASY XIV: A Realm Reborn 1,998,970
    6 The Elder Scrolls Online 1,290,212
    7 ROBLOX 617,664
    8 Elite Dangerous 669,597
    9 Guild Wars 2 790,189
    10 RuneScape 781,508
    11 Star Citizen 476,024
    12 Black Desert Online 766,714
    13 Star Wars: The Old Republic 408,312
    14 EVE Online 464,681
    15 Conan Exiles 298,020
    16 World of Tanks 213,852
    17 MapleStory 410,045
    18 Realm of the Mad God 139,335
    19 Phantasy Star Online 2 273,577
    20 Albion Online 95,017
    21 Blade & Soul 47,467
    22 Neverwinter

    Alot of crappy games in there.
    Wouldn't brag about 22nd place myself.
    JrUzbQw.jpg?1
    I am Took.
    "Full plate and packing steel" in NW since 2013.
  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,508 Arc User

    arazith07 said:

    tbf i think anyone who hasnt been over to preview and tinkered their build is going to be at a huge disadvantage when mod 20 hits
    as you said on the post you wrote on other thread you need to test 3 or 4 diffent enchant setups 3 or 4 different runestone set ups same goes for insignia and artifacts
    i know it has been making my head hurt enough when its free to test things out
    but i also know when this hits live and you get 1 free exchange i will know exactly what i need to switch

    THIS. Right here.
    This is why most of us veteran NW players stopped playing.
    For a game this old with such a small player base, you should not HAVE to waste a dozen hours trying out a half dozen different builds on preview just to be an AVERAGE player in a mediocre lame duck MMORPG.
    That's insane. There are a dozen better MMORPGs out now with far lower "keep-up" costs.

    The maintenance costs (time AND/or money) are way too high from module to module in this game.
    Glad I came back to check. Still dying a sloooooow death? Yep.
    Too bad. I use to love this game.
    Sad.
    21st most populated MMO of 2020 isn't small. You really don't need to pay anything in time or money to be average. You can have a completely bonkers build and be average.
    LOLs
    Not naysaying. Loved the game and played it for 7 years. But... ur dead wrong.
    First, everything you said directly refutes the @vastano#2343 's whole point.
    I was a dedicated preview stalker for 15 modules.

    Was early preview selected for several. Followed the great researchers and theorycrafters religiously. Tested builds 2-4 hours per week for 7 years.
    Posted a dozen builds on 3 classes since 2013 (all preview tested).
    All that to say, I wasn't the best, but I went over and beyond what the "average" player invests (TIME, not momney... I stopped reqrding NW's lazy writing with ZEN 2 years ago).
    Took aint no wallet warrior. I did the grind. I did the preview more than most.
    AND...
    'It is no longer worth it.
    This game is NOT dead, but it is very lame for the time cost JUST to be above average.
    I speak from 7 years experience.
    But hey, some people like counting sand.
    Keep playing if you liker the ay it is.
    More power to you.

    EDIT:
    Oh, as for humble bragging about bein g "number 21 MMO"...
    I checked all the top 5 MMO sites. It's more like 22nd...
    AND beneath ALL of these games in revenue, player # AND critical/player review:
    1 World of Warcraft 4,281,939
    2 Destiny 2 889,547
    3 Old School RuneScape 1,674,237
    4 World of Warcraft Classic 691,150
    5 FINAL FANTASY XIV: A Realm Reborn 1,998,970
    6 The Elder Scrolls Online 1,290,212
    7 ROBLOX 617,664
    8 Elite Dangerous 669,597
    9 Guild Wars 2 790,189
    10 RuneScape 781,508
    11 Star Citizen 476,024
    12 Black Desert Online 766,714
    13 Star Wars: The Old Republic 408,312
    14 EVE Online 464,681
    15 Conan Exiles 298,020
    16 World of Tanks 213,852
    17 MapleStory 410,045
    18 Realm of the Mad God 139,335
    19 Phantasy Star Online 2 273,577
    20 Albion Online 95,017
    21 Blade & Soul 47,467
    22 Neverwinter

    Alot of crappy games in there.
    Wouldn't brag about 22nd place myself.
    I think you are overestimating what average is. Average is not endgame, the average player cannot complete ToMM/ZC unless they are being carried. The fact that you are putting more time in than the average player means you should be above average, if you aren't that is more on you than with the game itself. The upkeep for being average is not time intensive at all. Since campaigns were moved to being more weekly, you really only need to play for an hour to complete the campaigns, so like maybe 6 good log in sessions, anything on top of that is just money making time, be it dungeon grinding or market sales. Note that anything else is simply BiS chasing. Everything that an average player can access is scaled, so being undergeared really isn't a problem.

    As far as Vastano's point, that is for players who care about being BiS or are more than just casual players. A 30k iL player can perform just fine in Avernus (and if they are under 30k they get upscaled). The average player usually waits for guidance from their guild mates or from the theory crafters before spending time to exchange stuff, so they aren't really going through as many complete reworks like those on preview are doing.
  • vastano#2343 vastano Member Posts: 169 Arc User
    edited January 2021
    arazith07 said:


    I think you are overestimating what average is. Average is not endgame, the average player cannot complete ToMM/ZC unless they are being carried. The fact that you are putting more time in than the average player means you should be above average, if you aren't that is more on you than with the game itself. The upkeep for being average is not time intensive at all. Since campaigns were moved to being more weekly, you really only need to play for an hour to complete the campaigns, so like maybe 6 good log in sessions, anything on top of that is just money making time, be it dungeon grinding or market sales. Note that anything else is simply BiS chasing. Everything that an average player can access is scaled, so being undergeared really isn't a problem.

    As far as Vastano's point, that is for players who care about being BiS or are more than just casual players. A 30k iL player can perform just fine in Avernus (and if they are under 30k they get upscaled). The average player usually waits for guidance from their guild mates or from the theory crafters before spending time to exchange stuff, so they aren't really going through as many complete reworks like those on preview are doing.

    on live i am 35k il 191 base pwr there i run bbz tic quite regulary atm dont do tomm or master z only because my ping is to high for those and i dont really like stand here move to here hit some move to here and on and on
    on preview i am 50k il in avernus the mobs in harumans instead of runing through them like a hot knife through butter never needing to use a heal pot
    Now they take time and resources (heal post running back from shrine) and thats after hours and hours of tinkering with my build, items, gear, companions, mounts, i changed each and every enchantment (all r15) each and every runestone (r15) and each and every insignia (Legendary)
    ok on preview tradebars are free it still cost me over 100k tradebars and that was to make my toon playable
    so from endgame to avarage in 1 hit
    ok i know before this goes live there will be even more changes to come but i am not going to go from being able to run TIC happily back to not being able to complete lomm without being carried
    would rather find another game

  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,508 Arc User

    arazith07 said:


    I think you are overestimating what average is. Average is not endgame, the average player cannot complete ToMM/ZC unless they are being carried. The fact that you are putting more time in than the average player means you should be above average, if you aren't that is more on you than with the game itself. The upkeep for being average is not time intensive at all. Since campaigns were moved to being more weekly, you really only need to play for an hour to complete the campaigns, so like maybe 6 good log in sessions, anything on top of that is just money making time, be it dungeon grinding or market sales. Note that anything else is simply BiS chasing. Everything that an average player can access is scaled, so being undergeared really isn't a problem.

    As far as Vastano's point, that is for players who care about being BiS or are more than just casual players. A 30k iL player can perform just fine in Avernus (and if they are under 30k they get upscaled). The average player usually waits for guidance from their guild mates or from the theory crafters before spending time to exchange stuff, so they aren't really going through as many complete reworks like those on preview are doing.

    on live i am 35k il 191 base pwr there i run bbz tic quite regulary atm dont do tomm or master z only because my ping is to high for those and i dont really like stand here move to here hit some move to here and on and on
    on preview i am 50k il in avernus the mobs in harumans instead of runing through them like a hot knife through butter never needing to use a heal pot
    Now they take time and resources (heal post running back from shrine) and thats after hours and hours of tinkering with my build, items, gear, companions, mounts, i changed each and every enchantment (all r15) each and every runestone (r15) and each and every insignia (Legendary)
    ok on preview tradebars are free it still cost me over 100k tradebars and that was to make my toon playable
    so from endgame to avarage in 1 hit
    ok i know before this goes live there will be even more changes to come but i am not going to go from being able to run TIC happily back to not being able to complete lomm without being carried
    would rather find another game

    I have no idea what you are spending 100k tradebars on that you would actually do on live though. Use the enchantment exchange. The Enchantments and runestone are for your character's use, why would you sell something you are going to use to have to worry about it being bound to account.

    It honestly sounds like to me, you just don't understand the new system, or you never really understood your class, where you could just rely on stacking massive amounts of power to brute your way through the game.
  • vastano#2343 vastano Member Posts: 169 Arc User
    the trade bars were spent on several itinerations of enchants and insignia and runestones untill i found the ones that balanced the best and i agree you can cut a lot of that down with enchant exchange ONCE you know what you need to change to and dont forget atm on preview it is changing every cpl of days also every thime you change one piece of gear that can throw everything out and you need to change some enchants again
    BUT by far the biggest outlay was making my comps to mythic you have to take 10 to mythic just to get bolster
    luckily i didnt need to get mounts up to mythic as already have 100% bolster on mounts
  • vastano#2343 vastano Member Posts: 169 Arc User
    edited January 2021
    arazith07 said:



    I have no idea what you are spending 100k tradebars on that you would actually do on live though. Use the enchantment exchange. The Enchantments and runestone are for your character's use, why would you sell something you are going to use to have to worry about it being bound to account.

    It honestly sounds like to me, you just don't understand the new system, or you never really understood your class, where you could just rely on stacking massive amounts of power to brute your way through the game.

    and to be honest after learning my class spending hundreds of thousands of ad after maxing my toon to the best it can be why SHOULD i have to relearn
    Why should i carry on playing a game where on live i can quite happily do zariel tic etc etc and after changes i cant get through first 3 mobs in the cloack tower
    i would much rather go back to doing the 20 past lives on my monk on ddo
    i am sure ddo would rather my monthly sub


  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,508 Arc User

    arazith07 said:



    I have no idea what you are spending 100k tradebars on that you would actually do on live though. Use the enchantment exchange. The Enchantments and runestone are for your character's use, why would you sell something you are going to use to have to worry about it being bound to account.

    It honestly sounds like to me, you just don't understand the new system, or you never really understood your class, where you could just rely on stacking massive amounts of power to brute your way through the game.

    and to be honest after learning my class spending hundreds of thousands of ad after maxing my toon to the best it can be why SHOULD i have to relearn
    Why should i carry on playing a game where on live i can quite happily do zariel tic etc etc and after changes i cant get through first 3 mobs in the cloack tower
    i would much rather go back to doing the 20 past lives on my monk on ddo
    i am sure ddo would rather my monthly sub


    Why do you think you have to relearn with this combat rework? Aside from magnitude increases, most classes have been unchanged in how they play. Yes stats have changed, but all this is behind the scenes stuff. My point is that power creep was removed, so some who think they were doing well beforehand may find that they were being carried by that power creep. If everything can kill in one shot, does it really matter what rotation you have? You say you have 50k iL on preview and can't deal with mobs in Avernus without pots, and yet there are people who can do that with 30k iL against the elite mobs...
  • samerikersameriker Member Posts: 169 Arc User
    I know you are working for the classification of MMO and not all game genres. I always felt this game never fit the MMO classification. For the rank of MMO, I thought the number was much higher than top 20, more like top 50.



    @dread4moor I am still here.
    Fame is a vapor, popularity an accident; the only earthly certainty is oblivion. ~ Mark Twain
  • jrfbrunetjrfbrunet Member Posts: 388 Arc User
    arazith07 said:



    You say you have 50k iL on preview and can't deal with mobs in Avernus without pots, and yet there are people who can do that with 30k iL against the elite mobs...

    Yeah, something ain't right. I went to Haruman's with my 31k ilvl Ranger and didn't see a real difference in mob difficulty. Did I balance my stats better? Do I dodge better? I don't know, but something ain't jiving.
    Where'd my blinky-blinky path go?
  • rosh#3730 rosh Member Posts: 76 Arc User
    edited January 2021
    Guys you know what let us put it like that when redeemed citadel (Limited Event - Season Pass) was running it was not over 100 instance

    for benefit of doubt let us say it was 400 instance X 20 players = 8000 Players (your level 80 Gamers)

    Which is most of your gamers who are playing this game let us add another 3000 for players who are new and trying this game
    so in essence this game has no more than 11,000 players total

    So set aside metric and everything the game is not in good state by any means and that Mod 20 is make it or break it for them

    So we will wait and see, but right now I am looking on preview and i tried the new dungeon they just released
    Art wise looks stunning , Combat wise it is bad , super bad, horrendously bad

    Let me put it like that when you see Holy Grail End Gamers getting one shotted by Mobs at 1st Boss
    So what about your Average Joe who wants to do the dungeon

  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,508 Arc User

    Guys you know what let us put it like that when redeemed citadel (Limited Event - Season Pass) was running it was not over 100 instance

    for benefit of doubt let us say it was 400 instance X 20 players = 8000 Players (your level 80 Gamers)

    Which is most of your gamers who are playing this game let us add another 3000 for players who are new and trying this game
    so in essence this game has no more than 11,000 players total

    So set aside metric and everything the game is not in good state by any means and that Mod 20 is make it or break it for them

    So we will wait and see, but right now I am looking on preview and i tried the new dungeon they just released
    Art wise looks stunning , Combat wise it is bad , super bad, horrendously bad

    Let me put it like that when you see Holy Grail End Gamers getting one shotted by Mobs at 1st Boss
    So what about your Average Joe who wants to do the dungeon

    It's a brand new dungeon, people are going to get one shot by the bosses, once we learn the mechanics you will see less of that. Also, how much time have these "Holy Grail End Gamers" had with the new system? Those of us who have spend a lot of time on preview this past month and a half seem to be having a different experience than people just hoping on for the new module sneak peak. Was the tank able to gain aggro? What were the stats of those dying all the time? Average Joe likely won't be doing end game dungeons right away, they are likely just now getting to the point where TIC is doable without being carried.

    We had leaderboards that shows us the number of characters who participated in the campaign milestones, which I believe was close to 15k, PS and XBOX had 8-10k each iirc. It's not WOW or Guild Wars 2 by any means but it's enough to be considered one of the more popular MMOs, and enough to where they can spend money on ads.
  • blargskullblargskull Member Posts: 513 Arc User
    To be fair, the game's population really doesn't reflect quality of any game. Goat Simulator is a buggy mess on purpose and yet is a very popular game. The other extreme can be said with niche games. Sometimes smaller games can get buried in bigger announcements or AAA hype. I play a lot of games that don't make the popular lists or never hear about. Sometimes those are the best games.

    BTW @horus#3657 anytime I recite the low population about this game, be it PC, XB or PS, I get told by other players how wrong I am. Welcome to being wrong too. :trollface:

    Just killing time...
  • vastano#2343 vastano Member Posts: 169 Arc User
    edited January 2021



    Let me put it like that when you see Holy Grail End Gamers getting one shotted by Mobs at 1st Boss
    So what about your Average Joe who wants to do the dungeon

    that is the nub of the problem with this combat rework
    your endgame player with 35k il on live fully stat capped can run tic or pretty much any dungeon with ease
    your avarage player with maybe 25k il on live probably isnt stat capped and fully boosted to best of abilities
    suddenly that same endgamer has hit combat rework got 50k+ il struggelling to get even the main combat stats balanced let alone trying to do any defensive stats so is getting absolutly destroyed by normal mobs
    whereas your avarage player is probably sat at around 30k il much easier to get all stats ballanced (after all 50k person has an extra 20k on EVERY stat to find and 20k = 20%) which makes them 100% easier to survive long enough to kill mobs
    after all that loss of 2 k dmg dont mean a lot when endgamers are strugelling to hit the 90% and joe is at 90% on everything

  • rosh#3730 rosh Member Posts: 76 Arc User
    arazith07 said:


    We had leaderboards that shows us the number of characters who participated in the campaign milestones, which I believe was close to 15k, PS and XBOX had 8-10k each iirc. It's not WOW or Guild Wars 2 by any means but it's enough to be considered one of the more popular MMOs, and enough to where they can spend money on ads.

    First of all that leader board was for characters not account

    I myself did the redeemed citadel on 2 accounts with total of 10 characters, so Leaderboard is not a solid metric to say game is doing fine

    This Next Mod it is all on NoWorries if it goes bad
    Mr. Chris is doing fine the Team is pushing more content and more interactive with community there is a real change we can all see because of him

    But this time the whole thing is on NoWorries this is a system issue we are having so if players raise the pitch fork point it to No Worries, not to Chris because Chris has no hands on system issues that is No Worries responsibility

  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,508 Arc User

    arazith07 said:


    We had leaderboards that shows us the number of characters who participated in the campaign milestones, which I believe was close to 15k, PS and XBOX had 8-10k each iirc. It's not WOW or Guild Wars 2 by any means but it's enough to be considered one of the more popular MMOs, and enough to where they can spend money on ads.

    First of all that leader board was for characters not account

    I myself did the redeemed citadel on 2 accounts with total of 10 characters, so Leaderboard is not a solid metric to say game is doing fine

    This Next Mod it is all on NoWorries if it goes bad
    Mr. Chris is doing fine the Team is pushing more content and more interactive with community there is a real change we can all see because of him

    But this time the whole thing is on NoWorries this is a system issue we are having so if players raise the pitch fork point it to No Worries, not to Chris because Chris has no hands on system issues that is No Worries responsibility

    I did say characters.

    This next mod isn't just Noworries, while he's been busy with the combat rework, others have been working on M20. I would argue that Noworries has had even less of a hand in it than Chris.

    Please do not confuse M20 with that of the combat system, especially if you are seeking to assign blame. Even beyond that, the damage of stuff may change, maybe the mobs are doing more damage than intended, if so, it will be drawn to a more reasonable level. It could also just be that players are still building their characters wrong. or lack of aggro control. It's day one of it being available to the public, people will be having troubles, and is pretty early to be saying that it will be a terrible dungeon.

  • rosh#3730 rosh Member Posts: 76 Arc User
    arazith07 said:


    I did say characters.

    This next mod isn't just Noworries, while he's been busy with the combat rework, others have been working on M20. I would argue that Noworries has had even less of a hand in it than Chris.

    Please do not confuse M20 with that of the combat system, especially if you are seeking to assign blame. Even beyond that, the damage of stuff may change, maybe the mobs are doing more damage than intended, if so, it will be drawn to a more reasonable level. It could also just be that players are still building their characters wrong. or lack of aggro control. It's day one of it being available to the public, people will be having troubles, and is pretty early to be saying that it will be a terrible dungeon.

    Let me rephrase this

    in Mod 16 Thomas Foss(Lead Designer) was pushing combat system and scaling that players did not like and in return players raised the pitch fork to the devs with decline in population

    Who got the blame for this ? it was Foss when it was a system's issue

    Now in Mod 20, I said the Dungeon looks beautiful and content is being pushed and art level is going up
    But Combat Rework (which is part of Mod 20) is bad , when on preview you are maxed out and balanced your stats as DPS getting one shotted what about your average joe who is queueing up

    If you remember NoWorries when he released this combat system he said we are doing this change because we are not using HP bars and essentially if you don't dodge mechanics you die

    well guess what this is what the current combat rework is still doing so where is the real change other than Good User Interface with Percentage


    This is repeat of Mod16 and i don't want Chris to be blamed because that is not his fault , if players say it is anyone's fault it is a system issue not lead issue and this is what i mean

    if you think the combat rework is looking good , sorry it is not by any means and i have send multiple bugs already that are not still addressed to this day and will get pushed to live when this mod releases

    so i am not confusing anything in fact i am just separating responsibility
    because here is the thing system designers don't like to take the blame and bad at handling stuff with the community (most of programmers are introverts)

    I know that and i see how my senior programmer is so i know what is happening exactly

    All that Chris does is relaying to No Worries things if he notices or gets mail about it and it is NoWorries who is handling the game combat which is what 90% of players care about to put their judge on upcoming Mod because in Mod 16 Art Wise it is magnificent but Combat Wise it was Horrible and you know what the player base did afterwards
  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,508 Arc User

    arazith07 said:


    I did say characters.

    This next mod isn't just Noworries, while he's been busy with the combat rework, others have been working on M20. I would argue that Noworries has had even less of a hand in it than Chris.

    Please do not confuse M20 with that of the combat system, especially if you are seeking to assign blame. Even beyond that, the damage of stuff may change, maybe the mobs are doing more damage than intended, if so, it will be drawn to a more reasonable level. It could also just be that players are still building their characters wrong. or lack of aggro control. It's day one of it being available to the public, people will be having troubles, and is pretty early to be saying that it will be a terrible dungeon.

    Let me rephrase this

    in Mod 16 Thomas Foss(Lead Designer) was pushing combat system and scaling that players did not like and in return players raised the pitch fork to the devs with decline in population

    Who got the blame for this ? it was Foss when it was a system's issue

    Now in Mod 20, I said the Dungeon looks beautiful and content is being pushed and art level is going up
    But Combat Rework (which is part of Mod 20) is bad , when on preview you are maxed out and balanced your stats as DPS getting one shotted what about your average joe who is queueing up

    If you remember NoWorries when he released this combat system he said we are doing this change because we are not using HP bars and essentially if you don't dodge mechanics you die

    well guess what this is what the current combat rework is still doing so where is the real change other than Good User Interface with Percentage


    This is repeat of Mod16 and i don't want Chris to be blamed because that is not his fault , if players say it is anyone's fault it is a system issue not lead issue and this is what i mean

    if you think the combat rework is looking good , sorry it is not by any means and i have send multiple bugs already that are not still addressed to this day and will get pushed to live when this mod releases

    so i am not confusing anything in fact i am just separating responsibility
    because here is the thing system designers don't like to take the blame and bad at handling stuff with the community (most of programmers are introverts)

    I know that and i see how my senior programmer is so i know what is happening exactly

    All that Chris does is relaying to No Worries things if he notices or gets mail about it and it is NoWorries who is handling the game combat which is what 90% of players care about to put their judge on upcoming Mod because in Mod 16 Art Wise it is magnificent but Combat Wise it was Horrible and you know what the player base did afterwards
    The combat rework will be going live before M20, therefore they are separate.

    WHO is being one shot, and what were their stats? You keep saying that it's happening but you aren't providing more information so maybe it can be fixed. People have beaten the dungeon already btw. I myself, do not experience this one-shotting you are referring to. There is either a bug, or a lack of understanding about the new system.

    You say you've written multiple bug reports, where are they? Are you using a separate account for those, because all I see are a bunch of opinion discussions.
  • rosh#3730 rosh Member Posts: 76 Arc User
    arazith07 said:



    The combat rework will be going live before M20, therefore they are separate.

    WHO is being one shot, and what were their stats? You keep saying that it's happening but you aren't providing more information so maybe it can be fixed. People have beaten the dungeon already btw. I myself, do not experience this one-shotting you are referring to. There is either a bug, or a lack of understanding about the new system.

    You say you've written multiple bug reports, where are they? Are you using a separate account for those, because all I see are a bunch of opinion discussions.

    I already said before i have been sending to Q&A and i am not putting it to the public forums these bugs

    Let me say this I have already reported bugs with Weapon Enchants that are still to this recent build not fixed
    Stronghold Bug with Boons
    Companion Bugs some are being deflected on Target Dummies


    In Regards to New Dungeon
    Rangers within Dungeon on random single shot that insta kills
    Maze Phase sometimes you get teleported solo
    In the last phase of Maze you get more sprouts after you kill it and still bugged
  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,508 Arc User

    arazith07 said:



    The combat rework will be going live before M20, therefore they are separate.

    WHO is being one shot, and what were their stats? You keep saying that it's happening but you aren't providing more information so maybe it can be fixed. People have beaten the dungeon already btw. I myself, do not experience this one-shotting you are referring to. There is either a bug, or a lack of understanding about the new system.

    You say you've written multiple bug reports, where are they? Are you using a separate account for those, because all I see are a bunch of opinion discussions.

    I already said before i have been sending to Q&A and i am not putting it to the public forums these bugs

    Let me say this I have already reported bugs with Weapon Enchants that are still to this recent build not fixed
    Stronghold Bug with Boons
    Companion Bugs some are being deflected on Target Dummies


    In Regards to New Dungeon
    Rangers within Dungeon on random single shot that insta kills
    Maze Phase sometimes you get teleported solo
    In the last phase of Maze you get more sprouts after you kill it and still bugged
    The in-game bug system feeds into PWE and doesn't get forwarded to Cryptic Studios, so they just aren't going to see them unless you write them out on these forums.
  • mentinmindmakermentinmindmaker Member Posts: 1,396 Arc User
    arazith07 said:

    arazith07 said:



    The combat rework will be going live before M20, therefore they are separate.

    WHO is being one shot, and what were their stats? You keep saying that it's happening but you aren't providing more information so maybe it can be fixed. People have beaten the dungeon already btw. I myself, do not experience this one-shotting you are referring to. There is either a bug, or a lack of understanding about the new system.

    You say you've written multiple bug reports, where are they? Are you using a separate account for those, because all I see are a bunch of opinion discussions.

    I already said before i have been sending to Q&A and i am not putting it to the public forums these bugs

    Let me say this I have already reported bugs with Weapon Enchants that are still to this recent build not fixed
    Stronghold Bug with Boons
    Companion Bugs some are being deflected on Target Dummies


    In Regards to New Dungeon
    Rangers within Dungeon on random single shot that insta kills
    Maze Phase sometimes you get teleported solo
    In the last phase of Maze you get more sprouts after you kill it and still bugged
    The in-game bug system feeds into PWE and doesn't get forwarded to Cryptic Studios, so they just aren't going to see them unless you write them out on these forums.
    And it is more than 3 weeks to release, so I would not hold open and documented bugs against Cryptic at this time.
  • vastano#2343 vastano Member Posts: 169 Arc User
    arazith07 said:

    arazith07 said:


    I did say characters.

    This next mod isn't just Noworries, while he's been busy with the combat rework, others have been working on M20. I would argue that Noworries has had even less of a hand in it than Chris.

    Please do not confuse M20 with that of the combat system, especially if you are seeking to assign blame. Even beyond that, the damage of stuff may change, maybe the mobs are doing more damage than intended, if so, it will be drawn to a more reasonable level. It could also just be that players are still building their characters wrong. or lack of aggro control. It's day one of it being available to the public, people will be having troubles, and is pretty early to be saying that it will be a terrible dungeon.

    Let me rephrase this

    in Mod 16 Thomas Foss(Lead Designer) was pushing combat system and scaling that players did not like and in return players raised the pitch fork to the devs with decline in population

    Who got the blame for this ? it was Foss when it was a system's issue

    Now in Mod 20, I said the Dungeon looks beautiful and content is being pushed and art level is going up
    But Combat Rework (which is part of Mod 20) is bad , when on preview you are maxed out and balanced your stats as DPS getting one shotted what about your average joe who is queueing up

    If you remember NoWorries when he released this combat system he said we are doing this change because we are not using HP bars and essentially if you don't dodge mechanics you die

    well guess what this is what the current combat rework is still doing so where is the real change other than Good User Interface with Percentage


    This is repeat of Mod16 and i don't want Chris to be blamed because that is not his fault , if players say it is anyone's fault it is a system issue not lead issue and this is what i mean

    if you think the combat rework is looking good , sorry it is not by any means and i have send multiple bugs already that are not still addressed to this day and will get pushed to live when this mod releases

    so i am not confusing anything in fact i am just separating responsibility
    because here is the thing system designers don't like to take the blame and bad at handling stuff with the community (most of programmers are introverts)

    I know that and i see how my senior programmer is so i know what is happening exactly

    All that Chris does is relaying to No Worries things if he notices or gets mail about it and it is NoWorries who is handling the game combat which is what 90% of players care about to put their judge on upcoming Mod because in Mod 16 Art Wise it is magnificent but Combat Wise it was Horrible and you know what the player base did afterwards
    The combat rework will be going live before M20, therefore they are separate.

    WHO is being one shot, and what were their stats? You keep saying that it's happening but you aren't providing more information so maybe it can be fixed. People have beaten the dungeon already btw. I myself, do not experience this one-shotting you are referring to. There is either a bug, or a lack of understanding about the new system.

    You say you've written multiple bug reports, where are they? Are you using a separate account for those, because all I see are a bunch of opinion discussions.
    i would be very very surised if combat rework comes before mod 20 to be fair with the mess it is in atm i would acually be suprised if it comes with mod 20
    one small example is ribcage devs have said there is a typo in the description thaty says +2.5 power instead of what it should now give
    however with much testing the ribcage is giving 2.5% power so not a typo
    as horus said there is problems with weapon enchants companions gear not giving right % gear not giving right stats
    last team that allowed something this broken out to live was a little company called flagship with a absolutly awsome game called hellgate london which was so broken you couldnt even play it before the patch

    ask were flagship are now lol
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