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  • kythelion#3210 kythelion Member Posts: 348 Arc User


    The stack duration should refresh after each Encounter use. So if you have 2 stacks with 7 seconds of duration left, then use an Encounter power, you should have 3 stacks with 15 seconds of duration left. Did you test the item and this functionality was broken?

    This doesn't address the discrepancy probem AT ALL. Some classes will get Divine Fury two or three times faster than others. (DC and CW come to mind) These classes will be able to stack it and fire off a dozen *at least* encounters during the time frame of Divine Fury while it's stacked. Other classes will struggle to get one Divine Fury even with the refresh. (TR and GF come to mind) They will never, ever stack it and will get at most six encounters in the time frame. If they're lucky and don't have to move. And while they're working on their first Divine Fury, the previously mentioned classes will be working on round two of Divine Fury and starting to stack it again. The resulting difference between the additional damage each class will get out of the this set bonus is ridiculous. How did no one look at this math? If you're only going to offer one weapon set at a given IL, then it needs to be something universally usable and accessible like Lionheart and Burnished were.
  • thefiresidecatthefiresidecat Member Posts: 4,441 Arc User
    adinosii said:

    In the tradebar store we can now buy bonding runestones, and most enchants. However, we cannot buy other runestones (Empowered etc). This seems a somewhat poinless omission - an oversight perhaps? Why not add those as well?

    I hope they do not. I think it's a bright point that they haven't. it means something will still hold some value. something will still need to be upgraded. not having to upgrade enchants is going to be huge for the ward market, the mop market the enchanting stone market the rp market etc. there will never be a reason to upgrade an enchant again.


  • admiralwarlord#3792 admiralwarlord Member Posts: 406 Arc User
    Still on this bonus gear of + 1% against devils ... does this bonus work in the new Trial of Zariel trial? When discussing with a friend about the build of the GF tank, he told me that this bonus was not working, along with the set that drops in IC and other bonuses like that of fellow Hezrou. Does this proceed? From what I read about Zariel, she is an ArchDevil and would soon fit into buffs and debuffs.
  • coolgor28#5062 coolgor28 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 79 Arc User
    Please change the new trial weapon set there is a difference on how many encounters one class can do and this set will make some classes have bonus damage more then the others.

    Can we think it with atwill also procing the bonus and make maybe you need more stacks to get bonus.
    Guild

    The imaginary Friends

    Main Kingslayer.jr(barb)
  • adinosiiadinosii Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,294 Arc User
    edited May 2020


    The stack duration should refresh after each Encounter use. So if you have 2 stacks with 7 seconds of duration left, then use an Encounter power, you should have 3 stacks with 15 seconds of duration left. Did you test the item and this functionality was broken?

    No, I did not test it ... the weapon set is not available in the special store, is it? (It would actually have been a good idea to add it there, so people could test this), and obtaining the set in the few days since the mod opened on Preview is not realistic for me, sorry.

    However, if the bonus works like this, the description is a bit misleading. I suggest rephrasing it slightly to clarify. I am not going to suggest a phrasing - English is not my primary language (or my second either, for that matter), so I will leave that to others, but a more clear description would eliminate a lot of potential confusion.

    Just consider my complaint to be "The description of the Celestial set bonus is misleading, as many people will understand it to mean you have to do 10 encounters/dailies within a single 15-second window. Please rephrase."

    This still does not fully solve the issue of the bonus being better for some classes than others - which is a problem when there is a lack of alternatives, but at least it is not half as bad as it looked originally.

    Speaking of alternatives, (and yea, I know this is a bit off-topic) I really hope you will at some point rework (masterwork) crafting to make it possible to produce viable gear. Crafting is one of my primary interests, and would love to see it improved (and to contribute to the improvement process)

    Finally, I see that my report on equipment being of type "Feet" has been noted - fine ... but the complaint about re-using the same bonuses on multiple gear pieces is a much bigger and more serious one....I really hope some action will be taken on that.
    Hoping for improvements...
  • kythelion#3210 kythelion Member Posts: 348 Arc User
    Dude, nobody said nerf wizard. What was said was that the Celestial bonus is by design more favorable to certain classes than others because of the speed with which encounters can be used. CW is among those who will receive a much higher buff rate from the weapons. I play a DC, so I actually stand to gain probably the most from this bonus if I use it correctly, and even I can admit that this is extremely unfair to like half the classes. What your current DPS position on the board is has little to do with the idea that if there is only one weapon set of a given iL it should be universally useful to all classes. Which is the what is being asked for. If you want to complain about the balance of various classes, this is not the place for that discussion and you should take that argument up in an appropriate thread. This is about items.
  • vcttethiasvcttethias Member Posts: 9 Arc User


    It's not that the refresh is broken, it's that the end result - a 30 second 5% damage boost, is overwhelmingly favorable to classes that can spam encounters - like an arcanist wizard during arcane empowerment. Or DC Arbiter. Or Warden Ranger (kinda).

    - Wizard is not even the top DPS class right now in either Single Target or AoE.

    snip...

    Ty
    You are speaking to the choir here, my wizard is my main, so I know all of these things, and all of these issues. "Elminster was a cleric" is what I like to say here given arbiter ridiculous performance (when they play without mistakes).
  • thefiresidecatthefiresidecat Member Posts: 4,441 Arc User
    edited May 2020

    rev#7881 said:

    I'm sure everyone is going to post about how all loot is horrible so I will start with a super important issue. ;)


    GreenMount: 3 hits in 5 sec, 50% mount speed
    Blue Mount: 4 hits in 5 sec, 80% mount speed
    Epic Mount: 5 hits in 5 sec, 110% mount speed
    Legg Mount: 6 hits in 5 sec, 140% mount speed

    Extrapolating the current data I expected:
    Myth Mount: 7 hits in 5 sec, 170% mount speed

    what I actually got was:
    Myth Mount: 6 hits in 5 sec, 140% mount speed

    I think they said some time ago something about not being able to increase mount speed because the game runs on a old engine and it would decrease the performance and that's why mythic mounts weren't coming, but eh what do i know
    Modern consoles can't render fast enough. Basically you have a problem of sight-lines and visibility, and being able to load, store, and display that information takes a lot of memory and processing power. You can sacrifice frame-rate to help, but that's not a good sacrifice to ask of the player, so the alternative is to limit movement speed or modify level design. Being that a lot of NW is open areas with large vistas, the logical conclusion is to try and limit movement speed.
    we know more speed is possible than straight up what is available with legendary mounts because of the strong hold speed boost. it would be nice if the mythic mounts had a conditional speed boost equal to the stronghold speed boost. basically rendering so you can take that off the stronghold boon and use a different stronghold boon if you have a mythic mount or if you don't have a guild with a speed boon (many of us don't now with the increased viability of crit sev boon) we can have that extra speed boost. but if you have speed boost boon equipped it does nothing extra if you have a mythic mount.


  • skpalantirskpalantir Member Posts: 38 Arc User
    I'm interesting what about hidden things, which only seen if mark "Show by location" in collections on The Redeemed Citadel page. The Redeemed Set and The Blessed Blades Set. Both looks good to me, but the thing that they are hidden in the collections make me worry about will they gonna be available with the start of m19.
  • theraxin#5169 theraxin Member Posts: 353 Arc User
    edited May 2020
    The Blessed icon of the companion has a defense slot while all other offensively statted rings have 2 offense There might be a chance that it's intended, in this case, I still suggest to change it, because we already can get a free single stat CA ring just by doing the mandatory quests to get into ToMM and it's just works better. If you think it's just too good for the story mode, then put it into the Zariel trial as reward.

    The mod19 armor rewards are a huge disappointment.

    The mod18 armors were a disappointment already, but they at least had some saving grace. The Rusted boots shook up the community, it was irrealistic to give the Ebony armor a competitor, but a nerf (on which, thanks, it was fully needed). And I suprisingly liked the Spiked defender Vambrace.

    But now the gear seems to be just reused from old and provide no interest at all, except trivial realizations of "yeah, this gives more power, so let me fiddle with my stats to compensate for the extra 2500 def instead of XY"

    My actual suggestion for a more interesting armor is similar something that was removed essentially after mod16 hit.



    Nowadays it would look like this:



    Is it perfectly balanced? Probably not, but it can be tweaked and it's actually something that I'd compare against the Ebony armor or the Seer of the Star robes or just being an useful tool to be kept. Also, it will naturally fade away by new IL level rewards, because the stat sum is the same as other things in it's IL level.

  • seveninchbladeseveninchblade Member Posts: 75 Arc User

    I'm interesting what about hidden things, which only seen if mark "Show by location" in collections on The Redeemed Citadel page. The Redeemed Set and The Blessed Blades Set. Both looks good to me, but the thing that they are hidden in the collections make me worry about will they gonna be available with the start of m19.

    That's because they're from Mod 20, from what I understand. They aren't supposed to be visible, same as the companion gear.
    Charisma was my dump stat.
  • gromovnipljesak#8234 gromovnipljesak Member Posts: 1,042 Arc User
    Huh, someone has a foot fetish judging by those new "Feet" items.

    Anyways, I'd like to see weapon and armor enchants separated in a different way. If you have say 10-12 enchants total per slot, so maybe buffing 1/3 of those enchants for each slot in terms of DPS, 1/3 for support and 1/3 for defense.

    Most classes aren't reliant on the bonuses you get from stuff like flaming enchant, but the on hit extra, or rather the buffs that come with them. The bonuses like flaming are more support-esque, so maybe give them upon activation of the bonus an AP gain increase or a flat increase of like 20% or 50% - on a cooldown of course.

    Make defensive enchantments give you a bit of temp HP, depending on the enchant level - or something similar.

    And make offensive enchantments move you past the limit for instance - vorpal enchant gives you 10% higher crit chance than possible with stats for instance, make another increase damage taken by 15% for the user or something - basically stuff that benefits the user, not the group. Benefiting the group should fall onto support enchants' shoulders.
  • admiralwarlord#3792 admiralwarlord Member Posts: 406 Arc User
    @gromovnipljesak#8234 I made a topic to discuss exactly that.https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter#/discussion/1254873/something-about-balancing-or-adjusting-enchants

    I believe the game is taking us so that enchants and class powers are useful for the whole group. Many who are in the preview are having trouble reaching the numbers with perfect status, but I think the current state of the enchants deserves to be reviewed. How can one enchant of proc critical damage and another not being that the 2 have the same magnitude?
  • c1k4ml3kc3c1k4ml3kc3 Member Posts: 1,256 Arc User

    Dude, nobody said nerf wizard. What was said was that the Celestial bonus is by design more favorable to certain classes than others because of the speed with which encounters can be used. CW is among those who will receive a much higher buff rate from the weapons. I play a DC, so I actually stand to gain probably the most from this bonus if I use it correctly, and even I can admit that this is extremely unfair to like half the classes. What your current DPS position on the board is has little to do with the idea that if there is only one weapon set of a given iL it should be universally useful to all classes. Which is the what is being asked for. If you want to complain about the balance of various classes, this is not the place for that discussion and you should take that argument up in an appropriate thread. This is about items.

    "Dude" there is no GAIN to be had with a class such as Wizard and I show you that disparity among DPS classes is so big that virtually it wouldn't have a big effect on Wizard in General content and/or Trials. It's not my problem you don't understand how little effect it'd have on Wizards, but there you go placing said Wizzies right next to Clerics as if both are on equal ground in the terms of damage potential.


    "Oh, no, I'll deal 500.000 more damage if I'm lucky".
    "Oh, no, this piece of equipment is more favorable to Wizards and Clerics that die in 1-2 hits".

    I mean, can you SHOW data of this? In Practice? Something tangible? Do you have that available? What if it doesn't work the way you think it does? Would that be so far off considering the history of NWO?

    If we have same damage, that's it. Would you be making the same argument during the Riverside campaign when there were four different sets of weapons? Will I be bringing Mirage orb to a Dungeon that is far more favorable for my proc rates in contrast to others?
    I literally can't see your point, at all. Like, zero point. Same damage is same damage, bonus was always questionable and changed in time. Nobody cares about bonus if a weapon has like 20% more damage. I never had two weapon sets that gave me same 2xbonus and this wouldn't be the first time that one class benefits more. Also, in fact, you should worry more about the MAGNITUDE of said encounters and powers used by everyone, which is class based, rather than how fast said encounters can be used. Because magnitude is what makes it actually potent in the longer run. Not how fast a Wizard can slap you with a feather.

    "universally useful to all classes"
    "don't complain about disparity among the classes"

    Aha. Because only YOU can do that? :# Don't like truth taken to the next level? Yea, sure. You have no valid point by bringing up Wizard into the equation as if a Wizard can BENEFIT MORE than a Cleric or any other class that has way more MAG powers.

    "Oh no, Rogue can't hit fast enough" <--- You are joking, right? Tell me that you are joking? A class that literally have a skill to get 50% more AP casually and MAG 1700 strike & 1500 Hateful knives that apply twice will be left in dust by a Wizard? In WHAT universe would that happen? :# I literally have shown data of average rogue dailies vs a highly skilled wizard ones in previous post, yet you still go with "Wizards will benefit more". No, Wizard won't benefit more. Wizard is struggling as it is right now and class is having broken Daily/Encounter/CD rate, and recently even lost an ability to critically proc on Storm Spell. Wizard RN are going BACK to debuff meta. We are going BACK to previous MODS in order to remain so-so viable. We'd rather spec as DEBUFFERS just so that others can maybe dish out more damage. DO you understand HOW STUPID it looks when you say that Wizard will benefit more from this set?
    At least get yourself FAMILIAR with the class you willingly take into your mouth before you ask for changes on a weapon. So now when a Wizard can get a bit more hypothetical benefit, and ONLY during a Daily, in contrast to other classes, you start going like it's the worst idea ever. Ha, splendid!

    Just. Stop.

    Many classes have DoTs that can apply various types of bonuses that can trigger various mechanics. Some classes always benefited more, some classes less. That's the reality of this game. That's the reality of all mechanics in this game. And their dynamic changes in time with various weapons and such. So, how can it be that ONLY NOW it is a problem? Do you think that a vast majority of players is even remotely ready for Trial right next to a fact that so many people never even completed 1st phase of ToMM? Do you think that suddenly 3000 wizards will pop out behind Zariel's wings and do a little dance with fully charged Arcane Empowerment?

    If you don't want aggro, don't spread false info based on hypothesis because stuff like that constantly keeps wizards nerfed for no reason at all just because one piece of equipment that will get forgotten in the next three months leaves a class broken for two years. <----------- This is real and this happened in the past, a lot. Stop doing that. You're not helping us, you'ren ot helping yourself.

    Thanks for reading, ciao.
    True Neutral
    Left the Game due to a heavy Damage Control
  • micky1p00micky1p00 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,391 Arc User
    edited May 2020


    "Oh no, Rogue can't hit fast enough" You are joking, right? Tell me that you are joking? A class that literally have a skill to get 50% more AP casually and MAG 1700 strike & 1500 Hateful knives that apply twice will be left in dust by a Wizard? In WHAT universe would that happen? :# I literally have shown data of average rogue dailies vs a highly skilled wizard ones in previous post, yet you still go with "Wizards will benefit more". No, Wizard won't benefit more. Wizard is struggling as it is right now and class is having broken Daily/Encounter/CD rate, and recently even lost an ability to critically proc on Storm Spell. Wizard RN are going BACK to debuff meta. We are going BACK to previous MODS in order to remain so-so viable. We'd rather spec as DEBUFFERS just so that others can maybe dish out more damage. DO you understand HOW STUPID it looks when you say that Wizard will benefit more from this set?
    At least get yourself FAMILIAR with the class you willingly take into your mouth before you ask for changes on a weapon. So now when a Wizard can get a bit more hypothetical benefit, and ONLY during a Daily, in contrast to other classes, you start going like it's the worst idea ever. Ha, splendid!

    nvm, not going into this 150k EndDps rabbit hole.
    Guild: The Imaginary Friends
    If you disagree with me: My opinions are my own and do not reflect on my guild and friends.
    If you agree with me: My opinions are totally the guild official policy !
    ;)
  • gabrieldourdengabrieldourden Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,212 Arc User
    Mythic mount disappeared after yesterday's patch
    Le-Shan: HR level 80 (main)
    Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
  • liadan1984#8734 liadan1984 Member Posts: 209 Arc User
    edited May 2020
    Chest rewards from CODG give 50 Seals of the Adventurer (pretty sure it was 50, it was DEFINITELY Seals of the Adventurer.
    While it was amusing on preview, please do not allow THIS to go to live.


    Everyone in the group (and those who watched the discord stream), however, liked the change to the rAD rewards in the chests for the LOMM run and the CODG run that we did.
    Assuming that all rAD rewards for all chests have had the same rework.

  • milehighxr#1299 milehighxr Member Posts: 388 Arc User
    adinosii said:

    In the tradebar store we can now buy bonding runestones, and most enchants. However, we cannot buy other runestones (Empowered etc). This seems a somewhat poinless omission - an oversight perhaps? Why not add those as well?

    I feel like the cost in tradebars for these is bit on the high side as well. Also are any older weapons sets going to be in TB store anymore? All I saw in equipment was the Undermoutain weapons. What about older armors sets?
  • rhroudadev#5641 rhroudadev Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 10 Cryptic Developer
    Made some changes to the Celestial Artifact Weapon set bonus after your feedback.

    You now must only generate 5 stacks of Divine Charge before it transforms into Divine Fury. You may only have 1 stack of divine fury, and there is a 30 second lockout that inhibits generation of Divine Charge once Divine Fury ends. The bonuses have been increased to 7.5% for Divine Fury.
    -Neverwinter Systems Designer
  • tempus86#1158 tempus86 Member Posts: 164 Arc User
    so, if im reading that correctly. you can have the buff for 7.5% that lasts 15seconds, and then it goes on CD for 30seconds. and it takes 5 encounters to stack it up in the first place, which is still gonna take some classes much longer than others to get 5 stacks.
    But lets say on average it takes 15 seconds for most classes to get off 5 encounters
    So this new buff is only active for 15 seconds every minute?,
    Seems like a lot of effort for an unpredictable buff, that averages out to less than 2% bonus
  • tempus86#1158 tempus86 Member Posts: 164 Arc User
    edited June 2020
    even reducing it to 1 encounter would only give it a 33% uptime, resulting in a 2.5% bonus overall, but at least it would be eqaully mediocre for everyone

    If this goes live, Im not even sure people will bother using it except maybe the healers. The flat damage increase makes the weapon about 9% over the lionheart, which gives an extra 10% bonus based on stamina, so they effectively cancel each other out. a potential 2% increase, with little to no extra rewards coming from the trial is making this new trial sound less and less appealing by the day, other than the satisfaction of beating it once.
  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,035 Arc User

    so, if im reading that correctly. you can have the buff for 7.5% that lasts 15seconds, and then it goes on CD for 30seconds. and it takes 5 encounters to stack it up in the first place, which is still gonna take some classes much longer than others to get 5 stacks.
    But lets say on average it takes 15 seconds for most classes to get off 5 encounters
    So this new buff is only active for 15 seconds every minute?,
    Seems like a lot of effort for an unpredictable buff, that averages out to less than 2% bonus

    That seems about right, remember that the weapon has the highest base damage out of everything by a large amount. Even without a bonus, the weapon set is better than literally anything else in the game.

    Im pretty sure the feedback was to make the buff equally easy for all classes to stack up/maintain, not make it worse

    How does it make it worse?...looks like a buff from 2 different angles to me. You need half and many stacks and you get a 50% buff to the damage/healing bonus.
  • ph33rm3ph33rm3 Member Posts: 535 Arc User
    edited June 2020

    Im pretty sure the feedback was to make the buff equally easy for all classes to stack up/maintain, not make it worse

    Ha .. haha ... hahaha

    Classic NW Dev move. Ask for fix, get a nerf instead. At least they are consistent.

    However, in this case I think it is justified. As soon as I saw the original design, I said to myself, "This is too powerful. It will be nerfed".

    The original design was far too powerful. Forcing them into the "need" category instead of the "want" category.

    They already have the highest weapon damage. They should just give them the same bonus as the Lionheart set.

    They would still be BIS.
  • theraxin#5169 theraxin Member Posts: 353 Arc User
    edited June 2020

    Made some changes to the Celestial Artifact Weapon set bonus after your feedback.

    You now must only generate 5 stacks of Divine Charge before it transforms into Divine Fury. You may only have 1 stack of divine fury, and there is a 30 second lockout that inhibits generation of Divine Charge once Divine Fury ends. The bonuses have been increased to 7.5% for Divine Fury.

    So, to convert it into Arcanist, I just use my regular encounter rotation to set up to 4, start up my daily and my first encounter out of the 12 will proc the bonus on the top of the daily bonus damage and then I just do regular for 35 seconds, with 5 seconds buffed. After the CD is over (45. sec) I use 4 encounters, wait the remaining 15 sec to get the normal artifact call and do this again, which is perfect timing for my encounter CD-s as the 2. disintegrate can start off the next minute and I rotate into my insane DPS daily again fully buffed.

    I want to say some bad stuff, but... just make it some bland damage bonus. The idea is fundamentally broken in a class balance sense and the only fix is to just make it genericly approvable for all classes.
  • tempus86#1158 tempus86 Member Posts: 164 Arc User
    Its worse because the original buff could stack twice, so the maximum buff was 10% which lasted 30 seconds with no lockout.
    So unless the tooltip is really bad, and the stacks couldnt be refreshed once you had 2, the only issue was building up to it in the first place.

    So unless I totally miss understood the tooltip, which is posted earlier, and once the 2stacks of divine fury you have to start all over again, it is definitely worse, and it still favours classes that have fast encounter CDs which is pretty much the main complaint in the first place
  • sekosek#5740 sekosek Member Posts: 97 Arc User
    It is good that you are listening to us, but you are still not giving us what we have wanted. You reduced the amount of encounter needed to proc the bonus, but it is still not balanced over classes. While Wizards and Clerics are gonna be able to proc it in their first rotation, other classes need to wait for second rotation, which would be over 15 seconds in general. So it would miss the artifacts window. And then bonus gets procced while there is no buff/debuff left, while Wizards and Clerics can proc it right in the artifacts window. General idea of "more encounters = more damage", just does not fit on weapons. Because every class should benefit it the same way.

    Also uptime of the bonus is very low, most of the time we wont even have the buff active.

    You still did not fix the potential unbalance issue here. And as most of the players say here, it is still not worth investing to get proper gear/items/stats to run trial and farm it. You say weapons are the only unique thing from this trial, and since its being awful, do not expect people to give attention to this trial and run it. Tomm would still be preferred over this.

    Either drop the encounter amount to 3, so every class can proc it in their first rotation, or change the bonus completely.
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