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I never thought I'd say this...

hustin1hustin1 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,458 Arc User
I'm in the midst of a quest and I actually wish there was scaling, albeit using an implementation that is better than what we currently have.

I'm doing the final half-orc race quest, the details of which I'll keep to myself so as not to spoil the story for anyone else. Suffice to say, the central premise behind the story is honorable combat between worthy foes. It feels cheap to be annihilating them with my level 80 half-orc. It doesn't feel 'honorable'. From a purely story standpoint, not having scaling really detracts from how it should feel. Victory should feel earned given the story, and it doesn't. Just throwing this out there. Hopefully we'll see a better scaling implementation in the future.

As a side note, it's too bad that the race and class quests end so soon. Having a character-specific storyline is really refreshing.
Harper Chronicles: Cap Snatchers (RELEASED) - NW-DPUTABC6X
Blood Magic (RELEASED) - NW-DUU2P7HCO
Children of the Fey (RELEASED) - NW-DKSSAPFPF
Buried Under Blacklake (WIP) - NW-DEDV2PAEP
The Redcap Rebels (WIP) - NW-DO23AFHFH
My Foundry playthrough channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/Ruskaga/featured
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Comments

  • hotfrostwormhotfrostworm Member Posts: 447 Arc User
    I just test the game when I am bored out of my skull. I do understand where you are coming from, there is no element of losing or danger from dying multiple times. I just respawn and instantly get back into action. In fact, today I commented on that making a video. All anyone need do, is press and hold the left mouse button and they will win. The only way to lose is should this cause your index finger to fall off.

    Other than that, it is a pretty cool game.
  • alfared#9239 alfared Member Posts: 38 Arc User
    edited May 2020
    Bah i made a post on that yesterday...this game is sooo boring now...everyone is far too powerful...especially in the dungeons...you try a run...and every enemy is dead before you can run your encounter 2x sometimes once...this game is deeply ill...everything about the end game dungeon...forcing peeps to be overpowered to participate in IC...making the rest of the content absolutely boring to run...this game is ill...no need for skills anymore...the only fun i have is when i run a low level with brand new players...at least the battles last longer than 5 seconds!....not fun at all! (I actually prefered the crappy scaling that made it impossible to kill bosses...at least there was a challenge!
  • gradiigradii Member Posts: 280 Arc User
    Scaling is more required in dungeons, but I want to see it in most instanced story quests and ALL heroic encounters to some degree.

    No one should be killing a group dungeon boss in 5 seconds or less. the experience is ruined for newer players- and if we dont retain them the game is doomed.

    the scaling should not make us as weak as we were at that level, but we should not be able to do so much damage we burn thru everything like dry paper in a furnace.
  • jules#6770 jules Member Posts: 709 Arc User
    edited May 2020
    I don't care about scaling (other than thinking that scaling in a place like Lomm is weird and that the extent is off) but what I personally believe is wrong IS the incentive to and the relation between
    - run endgame dungeons and trials and
    - run anything else.

    Beyond capping RAD the only thing people seem to do for worthy drops out of 2x madness is Zok/Juma and this is completely frustrating and boring in my opinion. Its not real group content.
    There is a whole bunch of players running IC (more or less successfully) that has no idea about half of the dungeons. "Ok why would I run it? What's the drops?"

    So - if its not worth running, it shouldn't be scaled on top of it.
    Post edited by jules#6770 on
    - bye bye -
  • durugudesudurugudesu Member Posts: 555 Arc User

    tom#6998 said:

    no endgame character should have any incentive to run leveling dungeons. Why do ppl even do that?

    I miss the old 40 45 minutes CN runs...with alliance and drowcraft gear...where at the end you were getting this great satisfaction of a job well done and where your SKILLS were the determining factor!!

    Skills are not needed in this game anymore!

    That is the main issue! Learn how to deal with the control powers of the new bosses...by watching a video on YT...then spend stupid amount of $ (or unrealistic amount of time grinding) to get 10x level 15 enchantments and 3x max runestones...voila!...you are a great player!

    Sorry, too long to quote everything, but if you miss CN 45 min dungeon, and want a feeling of satisfaction, then why not go do IC with other people like you who know nothing of its mechanics yet?

    I do this for every new dungeon that comes out (except for tomm since i sadly cant get 9 other players with me back then) and have fun figuring out mechanics and spending an hour or 5 in that dungeon with the same players to figure out stuff.

    and before you say you need 10xlevel 15 enchants 3x max runestones, well if youve been playingfor 3 years and not at least have a decent set of bondings and runestones, then i suggest starting with a smaller feat like shores of tuern to CN and work your way up.

  • tom#6998 tom Member Posts: 952 Arc User

    tom#6998 said:

    no endgame character should have any incentive to run leveling dungeons. Why do ppl even do that?

    Well im not an end game character (im "only" a 24.8 IL player of 3 and a half year) i dont qualify to run the latest re-skin dungeon IC with its dumb maxed out requirements! (and dont really care for it either)

    My incentive is to have fun...strategise and socialize with the party!

    I want to be able to run all the epic dungeons Skirmishes and Trials and have my skills challenged and kept sharp!!!

    No can do...when u got 2 or 3 27ks and 28ks ILs (freaking tanks and healers are killing everything in seconds) who vaporize the enemy parties before you can even reach the fray!

    I got all the toys already...i dont need anyone to give me an easy ride to the coffer...i play cause i like(d) the combat system and team strategy required to succeed as well as the DnD lore in 3d!

    I miss the old 40 45 minutes CN runs...with alliance and drowcraft gear...where at the end you were getting this great satisfaction of a job well done and where your SKILLS were the determining factor!!

    Skills are not needed in this game anymore!

    That is the main issue! Learn how to deal with the control powers of the new bosses...by watching a video on YT...then spend stupid amount of $ (or unrealistic amount of time grinding) to get 10x level 15 enchantments and 3x max runestones...voila!...you are a great player!

    they wanted to make $...so they created the need to reach ridiculous level of power requirement for their new dungeon...not caring about the impact it would have on the overall game experience...that is the truth!

    Add to that the extreme simplification and absolute uniformity of the setups....and companions (we all have tons of cool companions...but cant use them cause they leave you too weak)...so everyone is using the same 4 or 5...(really only augs or iouns)

    ...the meaningless easy way they dish the new gear (as opposed to the times when you would inspect strong players and see that rare piece of armor and couldnt wait to get that drop in a coffer...you might need 6 months to get it...not like now...2 days into the mod everyone was fully dressed in 1250 gear!)...

    ...and there is not much left as far as im concerned! (a sterile experience)

    I have put plenty of $ through the years in this game....and as a mid tier player (not in skills!...but in build!)...i really feel left out and let down!

    I hear they are listening to the end gamer elite community for their planning....and it shows!....it is all about end game now! Oh man they love this overpower feel...but for the rest of us...their very presence in a run (the 27 and 28k IL)...sabotages the whole experience!
    https://youtube.com/watch?v=Gbkzqwfzd3A&t=1872s

    If you want its totally possible to have your skills challenged and do the newest content with bad/mediocre gear, without spending any amount of money on the game. To me it looks like you talk alot of words, but in the end you choose to not be challenged, its not the games fault.

  • rev#7881 rev Member Posts: 343 Arc User

    tom#6998 said:

    no endgame character should have any incentive to run leveling dungeons. Why do ppl even do that?

    Well im not an end game character (im "only" a 24.8 IL player of 3 and a half year) i dont qualify to run the latest re-skin dungeon IC with its dumb maxed out requirements! (and dont really care for it either)

    My incentive is to have fun...strategise and socialize with the party!

    I want to be able to run all the epic dungeons Skirmishes and Trials and have my skills challenged and kept sharp!!!

    No can do...when u got 2 or 3 27ks and 28ks ILs (freaking tanks and healers are killing everything in seconds) who vaporize the enemy parties before you can even reach the fray!

    I got all the toys already...i dont need anyone to give me an easy ride to the coffer...i play cause i like(d) the combat system and team strategy required to succeed as well as the DnD lore in 3d!

    I miss the old 40 45 minutes CN runs...with alliance and drowcraft gear...where at the end you were getting this great satisfaction of a job well done and where your SKILLS were the determining factor!!

    Skills are not needed in this game anymore!

    That is the main issue! Learn how to deal with the control powers of the new bosses...by watching a video on YT...then spend stupid amount of $ (or unrealistic amount of time grinding) to get 10x level 15 enchantments and 3x max runestones...voila!...you are a great player!

    they wanted to make $...so they created the need to reach ridiculous level of power requirement for their new dungeon...not caring about the impact it would have on the overall game experience...that is the truth!

    Add to that the extreme simplification and absolute uniformity of the setups....and companions (we all have tons of cool companions...but cant use them cause they leave you too weak)...so everyone is using the same 4 or 5...(really only augs or iouns)

    ...the meaningless easy way they dish the new gear (as opposed to the times when you would inspect strong players and see that rare piece of armor and couldnt wait to get that drop in a coffer...you might need 6 months to get it...not like now...2 days into the mod everyone was fully dressed in 1250 gear!)...

    ...and there is not much left as far as im concerned! (a sterile experience)

    I have put plenty of $ through the years in this game....and as a mid tier player (not in skills!...but in build!)...i really feel left out and let down!

    I hear they are listening to the end gamer elite community for their planning....and it shows!....it is all about end game now! Oh man they love this overpower feel...but for the rest of us...their very presence in a run (the 27 and 28k IL)...sabotages the whole experience!


    3 and half years but you talk like a new player to be honest, you can buy rank 11 bondings/empowered for 240k, thats 2 and a half days of grind for each and getting them all to rank 14 will take you at most 1 and half month of farming, less if you get lucky during a dungeon run, you don't need to spend unrealistic ammounts of money like you say (yeah to 15 it may take you longer because of the coals, but you will still be at a great place with full 13/14), you just need to know how to invest, what to farm (i would advise todg, if do not know what that is or why you should run it at elast once a day, forget i ever said something) and not spend it on stupid HAMSTER.

    You say people have to watch youtube vids to learn how to dodge bosses, well learning the mechanics and still do dmg you would do on normal stuff without dying... i call that skill. There's a lot of people that watch the same vids and play for a long time that still can't dodge for HAMSTER

    You don't need ridiculous ammounts of power to do the latest stuff, it becomes easier if you have it at a huge number but you technically don't need it, go on youtube and search... people can do IC with 140-150k power and that ammount not that hard to get if you played for 3 years (HAMSTER i created a new rogue during neverember's event last month and i already have 132k without taking enchants or ad from other chars)

    And about melting stuff.. why shouldn't i be able to melt stuff if i'm lvl 80 with everything capped doing lvl 70 or lower content? (btw the forum had this discussion already)

    And why should we have 40 min runs on old content? to get a peridot? again... we talked about this on the mod 16 preview topic and on one of the cdps recently, you should go read that


    And scalling is getting a rework mod 19 in case people didn't know
  • durugudesudurugudesu Member Posts: 555 Arc User



    Ultimately....IDC about what u guys are saying and stand by everything i said!

    And i dont doubt for a second that everyone of you guys who replied are part of those overpowered peeps...that is why i ruffled your feathers....so be it....IDC!

    I don't know why you feel so "attacked" but I gave you a decent reply that I spent my time to type, and your reply is "IDC"

    Thanks for letting me know to not waste my time anymore on whatever you comment from now on since clearly "you don't care".
  • alfared#9239 alfared Member Posts: 38 Arc User
    micky1p00 said:

    IDC about what u guys are saying and stand by everything i said!

    You can stand behind it and not care, but nothing there still makes sense...

    You blame the people who ask for more challenging and team oriented content for lack of challenging team oriented content?! How that makes sense?
    Buddy you dont make sense nowhere in there do i blame anyone for asking for more challenging content or team interaction...idk what message you read...

    The only thing i said is that overpowered players who kill everything too fast sabotages the enjoyment of an epic dungeon run
    and that the game lacks diversity in the setups and and companions and stuff....whatever you understood is not what is written there!

    I ll take u all on i dont give...

    I dont know where u saw that....certainly not in the part u quote!


  • micky1p00micky1p00 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,594 Arc User
    edited May 2020


    Buddy you dont make sense nowhere in there do i blame anyone for asking for more challenging content or team interaction...idk what message you read...

    The only thing i said is that overpowered players who kill everything too fast sabotages the enjoyment of an epic dungeon run
    and that the game lacks diversity in the setups and and companions and stuff....whatever you understood is not what is written there!

    I ll take u all on i dont give...

    I dont know where u saw that....certainly not in the part u quote!

    Here you go

    tom#6998 said:

    no endgame character should have any incentive to run leveling dungeons. Why do ppl even do that?

    Well im not an end game character (im "only" a 24.8 IL player of 3 and a half year) i dont qualify to run the latest re-skin dungeon IC with its dumb maxed out requirements! (and dont really care for it either)

    My incentive is to have fun...strategise and socialize with the party!

    I want to be able to run all the epic dungeons Skirmishes and Trials and have my skills challenged and kept sharp!!!

    No can do...when u got 2 or 3 27ks and 28ks ILs (freaking tanks and healers are killing everything in seconds) who vaporize the enemy parties before you can even reach the fray!

    I got all the toys already...i dont need anyone to give me an easy ride to the coffer...i play cause i like(d) the combat system and team strategy required to succeed as well as the DnD lore in 3d!

    I miss the old 40 45 minutes CN runs...with alliance and drowcraft gear...where at the end you were getting this great satisfaction of a job well done and where your SKILLS were the determining factor!!

    Skills are not needed in this game anymore!

    That is the main issue! Learn how to deal with the control powers of the new bosses...by watching a video on YT...then spend stupid amount of $ (or unrealistic amount of time grinding) to get 10x level 15 enchantments and 3x max runestones...voila!...you are a great player!

    they wanted to make $...so they created the need to reach ridiculous level of power requirement for their new dungeon...not caring about the impact it would have on the overall game experience...that is the truth!

    Add to that the extreme simplification and absolute uniformity of the setups....and companions (we all have tons of cool companions...but cant use them cause they leave you too weak)...so everyone is using the same 4 or 5...(really only augs or iouns)

    ...the meaningless easy way they dish the new gear (as opposed to the times when you would inspect strong players and see that rare piece of armor and couldnt wait to get that drop in a coffer...you might need 6 months to get it...not like now...2 days into the mod everyone was fully dressed in 1250 gear!)...

    ...and there is not much left as far as im concerned! (a sterile experience)

    I have put plenty of $ through the years in this game....and as a mid tier player (not in skills!...but in build!)...i really feel left out and let down!

    I hear they are listening to the end gamer elite community for their planning....and it shows!....it is all about end game now! Oh man they love this overpower feel...but for the rest of us...their very presence in a run (the 27 and 28k IL)...sabotages the whole experience!
    You blame all the above on the highlighted here. Yet if you would have followed the requests of the end gamers, it is for challenging team oriented content, which is usually met with tears, screams and pitchforks, with the claims that all content should be available to everyone bar none.

    You may follow/read that on the multitude of ToMM related threads around.

    Btw, are you running ToMM? What is your opinion about that? No DPS that runs ahead there I'm sure.
  • alfared#9239 alfared Member Posts: 38 Arc User
    edited May 2020
    micky1p00 said:


    Buddy you dont make sense nowhere in there do i blame anyone for asking for more challenging content or team interaction...idk what message you read...

    The only thing i said is that overpowered players who kill everything too fast sabotages the enjoyment of an epic dungeon run
    and that the game lacks diversity in the setups and and companions and stuff....whatever you understood is not what is written there!

    I ll take u all on i dont give...

    I dont know where u saw that....certainly not in the part u quote!

    Here you go

    tom#6998 said:

    no endgame character should have any incentive to run leveling dungeons. Why do ppl even do that?

    Well im not an end game character (im "only" a 24.8 IL player of 3 and a half year) i dont qualify to run the latest re-skin dungeon IC with its dumb maxed out requirements! (and dont really care for it either)

    My incentive is to have fun...strategise and socialize with the party!

    I want to be able to run all the epic dungeons Skirmishes and Trials and have my skills challenged and kept sharp!!!

    No can do...when u got 2 or 3 27ks and 28ks ILs (freaking tanks and healers are killing everything in seconds) who vaporize the enemy parties before you can even reach the fray!

    I got all the toys already...i dont need anyone to give me an easy ride to the coffer...i play cause i like(d) the combat system and team strategy required to succeed as well as the DnD lore in 3d!

    I miss the old 40 45 minutes CN runs...with alliance and drowcraft gear...where at the end you were getting this great satisfaction of a job well done and where your SKILLS were the determining factor!!

    Skills are not needed in this game anymore!

    That is the main issue! Learn how to deal with the control powers of the new bosses...by watching a video on YT...then spend stupid amount of $ (or unrealistic amount of time grinding) to get 10x level 15 enchantments and 3x max runestones...voila!...you are a great player!

    they wanted to make $...so they created the need to reach ridiculous level of power requirement for their new dungeon...not caring about the impact it would have on the overall game experience...that is the truth!

    Add to that the extreme simplification and absolute uniformity of the setups....and companions (we all have tons of cool companions...but cant use them cause they leave you too weak)...so everyone is using the same 4 or 5...(really only augs or iouns)

    ...the meaningless easy way they dish the new gear (as opposed to the times when you would inspect strong players and see that rare piece of armor and couldnt wait to get that drop in a coffer...you might need 6 months to get it...not like now...2 days into the mod everyone was fully dressed in 1250 gear!)...

    ...and there is not much left as far as im concerned! (a sterile experience)

    I have put plenty of $ through the years in this game....and as a mid tier player (not in skills!...but in build!)...i really feel left out and let down!

    I hear they are listening to the end gamer elite community for their planning....and it shows!....it is all about end game now! Oh man they love this overpower feel...but for the rest of us...their very presence in a run (the 27 and 28k IL)...sabotages the whole experience!
    You blame all the above on the highlighted here. Yet if you would have followed the requests of the end gamers, it is for challenging team oriented content, which is usually met with tears, screams and pitchforks, with the claims that all content should be available to everyone bar none.

    You may follow/read that on the multitude of ToMM related threads around.

    Btw, are you running ToMM? What is your opinion about that? No DPS that runs ahead there I'm sure.


    Buddy you dont make sense at all!

    ....YOU and only your little brain gives that interpretation (read:translation) of the "request of the end gamers" line..

    ...it is certainly NOT written by me up there!

    "if you would have followed the demands of the end gamers you would know that they are asking for team based and challenges"

    What are you 1 of the end gamers being consulted? I certainly am not...and dont geek my life following this stuff...

    Regardless....

    Nowhere in my rant do i contradict myself..

    You are putting words in my mouth that i didnt type...

    Nowhere in the highlighted part of my comment (or anywhere for that matter) do i rant about (against) people asking for that...

    NOWHERE!!!

    ...opposite i clearly state that that is the part of the game i miss the most...

    ...what was implied by the line was....

    ....after crying that you (the end gamers) were not powerful enough anymore in dungeons (after the original implementation of the dungeon scaling)...you have been granted your lollipop and now get to ruin the fun for mid level players by carrying that absurd levels of power in old dungeons and killing everything too fast for anyone else to even enjoy it a little bit!

    THAT you can quote me on! That was the meat of the rant!
    (+ the fact that everyone runs basically the same setups and companions)


    But enough of this...

    You are just wasting my time....trying to be the white knight....NOW you are p me off....take a hike Charlie...

    This is going nowhere....just let it go!




    Post edited by alfared#9239 on
  • gradiigradii Member Posts: 280 Arc User
    I have not actually participated in ToMM yet but I dont understand what the big deal is, having studied guides and videos- the mechanics are about the same level of the EASIEST endgame content in Final Fantasy 14 which I spent years doing endgame in.

    FFXIV Savage raids make ToMM look like a joke, and Ultimate raids make Savage look like a joke.

    I'm sure the hardest part of ToMM is other players, getting people who are used to buttrushing everything solo even when they pug in teams to actually grasp the concept of basic fundamental teamwork and paying attention.

    the mechanics? they're honestly not hard at all. I know he has a very hard hitting tank buster which tanks need to switch aggro every now and then for, but thats a numbers and gear/build thing, not content mechanics.
  • gradiigradii Member Posts: 280 Arc User

    kreatyve said:

    In my opinion, scaling should exist in certain questlines, but I don't like it in dungeons. Part of the fun of the game pre-mod 6 was solo running low level dungeons. I really miss that.

    Soloing dungeons is one of the best things in the game. I really enjoy it and find it very relaxing as I can do it at my own pace. In previous mods I soloed each single dungeon up to FBI and Epic Spellplague. In mod 17 I solo'ed a few dungeons (FBI, ECC, Valindra, Lostmauth, EGWD, Kessell) but in general everything became harder as self healing resources are scarcer and stat caps with scaling basically mean you cannot optimize a character for soloing (for example getting more defense for my HR). By the way fire damage is out-of-whack with everything else in Epic Spellplague (and the whole River district where firebombs on the ground melt level 80 characters in a level 70 area).

    I would welcome Solo versions of each dungeons and a solo queue for those, with different rewards from those you get in the group version but of similar "power".
    Scaling could be disabled if you had a premade team or chose to go solo. it would only be mandatory in pugs.
  • hustin1hustin1 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,458 Arc User
    Only here can a post about a level-59 solo race quest turn into a P'ing contest about dungeons. Please take the measuring of e-phalli somewhere else. My post was about *story*, not about who can thump his chest harder.
    Harper Chronicles: Cap Snatchers (RELEASED) - NW-DPUTABC6X
    Blood Magic (RELEASED) - NW-DUU2P7HCO
    Children of the Fey (RELEASED) - NW-DKSSAPFPF
    Buried Under Blacklake (WIP) - NW-DEDV2PAEP
    The Redcap Rebels (WIP) - NW-DO23AFHFH
    My Foundry playthrough channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/Ruskaga/featured
  • gradiigradii Member Posts: 280 Arc User
    hustin1 said:

    Only here can a post about a level-59 solo race quest turn into a P'ing contest about dungeons. Please take the measuring of e-phalli somewhere else. My post was about *story*, not about who can thump his chest harder.

    Calm down, there is no pissing match anywhere but your own head. I was responding to where the conversation ended up going. nothing wrong with that.
  • hotfrostwormhotfrostworm Member Posts: 447 Arc User
    Not sure about all of this talk about rank 14 bondings and whatnot. But I posted a video on YT about running this game on Linux. I did happen to comment on there, I don't play the game I just test this for Linux OS. Meanwhile my half baked characters can run most content without dying. Since none of them have boons they can't play those elitist dungeons but everything else is just hack and slash. I imagine, if I were to load them up with the best equipment, I would be able to just look at enemies to make them die.

    Dying in the game has no repercussion either. I spawn in at a campfire and start killing again. Injuries don't seem to stop you much either. I don't know about the game mechanics, because my primary concern is for the audio and video aspects when I do testing. As I said in the video, it isn't a bad game, I just don't see it as a challenge. Unless getting lost is the challenge?
  • gradiigradii Member Posts: 280 Arc User
    Onerous death penalties are worse than none at all. Death Penalties are a stupid "Feature" in most MMOs, only a few make it work and they are very different from NWO.

    If you want challenge, perhaps you should look for another game? ToMM is a start for mechanical challenge, since its roughly the same level of mechanics as a FF14 Extreme trial, but until more like that is added you will never find enough challenge in this game.

    Until more ToMM style encounters are added, NWO is a game for relaxation and fun with buddies. Not everything has to be hard. Fun and Hard are 2 different concepts, and fun does not need to mean difficult.

    If the only way you can enjoy yourself in game is with a stiff challenge, the Dark Souls series says hi.
  • thefabricantthefabricant Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 5,248 Arc User
    gradii said:

    Onerous death penalties are worse than none at all. Death Penalties are a stupid "Feature" in most MMOs, only a few make it work and they are very different from NWO.

    If you want challenge, perhaps you should look for another game? ToMM is a start for mechanical challenge, since its roughly the same level of mechanics as a FF14 Extreme trial, but until more like that is added you will never find enough challenge in this game.

    Until more ToMM style encounters are added, NWO is a game for relaxation and fun with buddies. Not everything has to be hard. Fun and Hard are 2 different concepts, and fun does not need to mean difficult.

    If the only way you can enjoy yourself in game is with a stiff challenge, the Dark Souls series says hi.

    Death penalties are not, "stupid," their purpose is to make players think about what killed them and to prevent them from just corpse rushing whatever their objective happens to be. Neverwinter is unfortunately in a state where there is no truly meaningful death penalty and so for the "hardest content" corpse rushing is very much a tactic used by many players. IE, instead of learning the fight, you throw corpses at it until you win. This is facilitated by the fact that you can just use a resurrection scroll whenever you die to bring yourself back.

    A death penalty does not necessarily need to be something which heavily penalizes character development, it just needs to achieve the objective of, "making you think about why you died." In a massive open world game with no way to quickly travel having, "respawn at some random location very far away from where you currently are" could be a death penalty even though it does not penalize you at all aside from wasting your time. Its goal is to make you think about why you died and the time you spend walking back to where you were before, is time that will be spent thinking.

    Now, Neverwinter is not a massive open world game so that specific example is obviously not relevant, but the fact that there should be some mechanic which exists to make player death meaningful is still true because right now it is not.

    And as for the subject of scaling, I detest any form of scaling which violates the world's verisimilitude. It makes perfect sense that, when a player becomes stronger, encounters become easier. A world in which scaling "unifies" everyone is a world in which progress does not exist and holds no interest to me as it is not a world which you can believe in.
  • gradiigradii Member Posts: 280 Arc User
    We already have something like that in NWO, similar to how FFXIV does it, dying and being revived in combat applies a debuff.

    the FFXIV version is 25% less damage for 1 minute, and if you die in that minute- it becomes 50% which is a HUGE crippling debuff
  • greywyndgreywynd Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 7,083 Arc User
    And Neverwinter is 20% of your stats for each stack of revive sickness.
    I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
  • gradiigradii Member Posts: 280 Arc User
    greywynd said:

    And Neverwinter is 20% of your stats for each stack of revive sickness.

    Then we already have plenty death penalty, issue resolved.
  • thefabricantthefabricant Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 5,248 Arc User
    1. Its 10% per stack not 20%.
    2. This is reduced to 7.5% with a boon.
    3. This debuff is removed by standing next to a campfire or waiting 1 minute.
    4. It clearly is not sufficient because "throwing your corpse at something until you succeed" is a popular tactic.

    In a game where scrolls exist in my opinion a harsh death penalty is required, for example item degradation (your items have durability and can break/degrade in combat) or some other significant penalty that clearly makes you NOT want to die in the first place.

    I would prefer if scrolls were simply removed from the game but clearly that will never happen.
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