problem with the barbarian tank

halfredo · August 2019

the barbarian build tank needs a power to protect the party.

at the moment this makes the barbarous tank in dungeon as lomm useless

wilbur626 · August 2019

At what point do you need to protect the party in LOMM?

sobi · August 2019

My best friend is a barb main and he does half the damage of the dps whilst tanking in Lomm. Barbs are the best tank in the game right now. That's one way a barb tank is different to fighter since they can dish out more damage at the cost of maybe being less tanky.

halfredo · August 2019

wilbur626 said:
At what point do you need to protect the party in LOMM?

in the last boss

sobi#1980 said:
My best friend is a barb main and he does half the damage of the dps and tanks. Barbs are the best tank in the game right now. Sorry but you really need to practice your class more.

the barbarian is a great tank, but in the last boss of lomm you need an aoe skill that protects the party from the explosion.

fyrstigor · August 2019

Barbies have no issues tanking anything. And they dont need something to protect the party. Having those AoE protects, paladin sigil, fighter daily, cleric daily, while they are all nice they are not needed.

If u die to the blast u killed pillars to slow. Or u dont have enough HP. If a DPS is running around with low HP its their own fault they die. They made a choice to be squishy and die.

werdandi · August 2019

I somehow agree with the original poster: I checked all the feats, powers and class features and none of them can help the party in surviving or doing more damage. Just selfish options compared to the options of other tanks (even if the choice there is not fantastic either).

halfredo · August 2019

fyrstigor said:
Barbies have no issues tanking anything. And they dont need something to protect the party. Having those AoE protects, paladin sigil, fighter daily, cleric daily, while they are all nice they are not needed.

If u die to the blast u killed pillars to slow. Or u dont have enough HP. If a DPS is running around with low HP its their own fault they die. They made a choice to be squishy and die.

The role of the tank in a party is to protect. If the dps survives by itself, what's the use of the tank?

The build tank must have party member protection skills

arazith07 · August 2019

There isn't a whole lot that you need to protect the party from as a tank. Most of being a tank is holding aggro and positioning. Most things with unavoidable damage won't one shot dps and then it's the healers job to react to that damage. Assuming the dps aren't spreading out.

plasticbat · August 2019

halfredo#5859 said:

fyrstigor said:
Barbies have no issues tanking anything. And they dont need something to protect the party. Having those AoE protects, paladin sigil, fighter daily, cleric daily, while they are all nice they are not needed.

If u die to the blast u killed pillars to slow. Or u dont have enough HP. If a DPS is running around with low HP its their own fault they die. They made a choice to be squishy and die.

The role of the tank in a party is to protect. If the dps survives by itself, what's the use of the tank?

The build tank must have party member protection skills

The role of the tank in a party is not about direct protection.
It is about getting the beating (so that it won't hit others) and takes the aggro away.

cherryman1 · August 2019

halfredo#5859 said:

fyrstigor said:
Barbies have no issues tanking anything. And they dont need something to protect the party. Having those AoE protects, paladin sigil, fighter daily, cleric daily, while they are all nice they are not needed.

If u die to the blast u killed pillars to slow. Or u dont have enough HP. If a DPS is running around with low HP its their own fault they die. They made a choice to be squishy and die.

The role of the tank in a party is to protect. If the dps survives by itself, what's the use of the tank?

The build tank must have party member protection skills

While the role of the tank doesn't require you to protect other members in the team, being a class that can will make you more valuable in the content and asked more frequently than classes that don't have those options.

cherryman1 · August 2019

sobi#1980 said:
My best friend is a barb main and he does half the damage of the dps whilst tanking in Lomm. Barbs are the best tank in the game right now. That's one way a barb tank is different to fighter since they can dish out more damage at the cost of maybe being less tanky.

Unfortunately, that isn't true. A paladin and fighter can push out just as much damage as the tank barb.

callumf · August 2019

cherryman1 said:

sobi#1980 said:
My best friend is a barb main and he does half the damage of the dps whilst tanking in Lomm. Barbs are the best tank in the game right now. That's one way a barb tank is different to fighter since they can dish out more damage at the cost of maybe being less tanky.
Unfortunately, that isn't true. A paladin and fighter can push out just as much damage as the tank barb.

Yup. Ive seen plenty Fighters out DPS barbies.

sobi · August 2019

Barb tank just does more damage, anyone disagreeing to that and actually confirming that fighters and pallies can match its tank dps are obviously deluded and totally forgot to take player skill into account. By more i actually really mean a lot more than fighters and pallies. This is comparing them in the same gear as well.

That brings me to the next point. If barbs are chosen as a tank that can dish out some pretty nice dps, and fighers and pallies as more tanky, party protecting tanks, then i think that a barb needs no more help. Considering the aforementioned, i see maybe 80% of my lomm runs with barb tanks so content wise they have no issue and barbs are not considered as best tanks right now for nothing. They bring a certain niche as a tank and it seems to be working like a charm for them, they can't expect to out dps other tank classes by a long margin and still be same or better at protecting the party.

As for party protection then it sure is a nice thing to have as a tank, but that really is a healer's job. A dps must be able to survive one shots, this will become more apparent in Tower of the mad mage. So i really do advise other dps' out there to start stacking HP.

cherryman1 · August 2019

sobi#1980 said:
Barb tank just does more damage, anyone disagreeing to that and actually confirming that fighters and pallies can match its tank dps are obviously deluded and totally forgot to take player skill into account. By more i actually really mean a lot more than fighters and pallies. This is comparing them in the same gear as well.

That brings me to the next point. If barbs are chosen as a tank that can dish out some pretty nice dps, and fighers and pallies as more tanky, party protecting tanks, then i think that a barb needs no more help. Considering the aforementioned, i see maybe 80% of my lomm runs with barb tanks so content wise they have no issue and barbs are not considered as best tanks right now for nothing. They bring a certain niche as a tank and it seems to be working like a charm for them, they can't expect to out dps other tank classes by a long margin and still be same or better at protecting the party.

As for party protection then it sure is a nice thing to have as a tank, but that really is a healer's job. A dps must be able to survive one shots, this will become more apparent in Tower of the mad mage. So i really do advise other dps' out there to start stacking HP.

The barb tank doesn't do more damage in game or is so negligible that you would hardly ever tell. There are several tanks in my alliance that are paladin/fighter that can kill reliably their first 2 mimics in the arcturia fight without issues. This is really helpful when it comes to getting new players through that content. I've even seen the tier 2 dps classes get out dps'ed in game by a paladin/fighter tank. \

Barbs can only tank when the entire rest of the party knows how to play their classes. When you have dps that are new to a dungeon being able to give them some help instead of saying "play better" or moral support as the tank is much more appreciated than the miniscule amount of damage more you think the tank barb does over a fighter sentinel or paladin.

sobi · August 2019

cherryman1 said:

sobi#1980 said:
Barb tank just does more damage, anyone disagreeing to that and actually confirming that fighters and pallies can match its tank dps are obviously deluded and totally forgot to take player skill into account. By more i actually really mean a lot more than fighters and pallies. This is comparing them in the same gear as well.

That brings me to the next point. If barbs are chosen as a tank that can dish out some pretty nice dps, and fighers and pallies as more tanky, party protecting tanks, then i think that a barb needs no more help. Considering the aforementioned, i see maybe 80% of my lomm runs with barb tanks so content wise they have no issue and barbs are not considered as best tanks right now for nothing. They bring a certain niche as a tank and it seems to be working like a charm for them, they can't expect to out dps other tank classes by a long margin and still be same or better at protecting the party.

As for party protection then it sure is a nice thing to have as a tank, but that really is a healer's job. A dps must be able to survive one shots, this will become more apparent in Tower of the mad mage. So i really do advise other dps' out there to start stacking HP.
The barb tank doesn't do more damage in game or is so negligible that you would hardly ever tell. There are several tanks in my alliance that are paladin/fighter that can kill reliably their first 2 mimics in the arcturia fight without issues. This is really helpful when it comes to getting new players through that content. I've even seen the tier 2 dps classes get out dps'ed in game by a paladin/fighter tank. \

Barbs can only tank when the entire rest of the party knows how to play their classes. When you have dps that are new to a dungeon being able to give them some help instead of saying "play better" or moral support as the tank is much more appreciated than the miniscule amount of damage more you think the tank barb does over a fighter sentinel or paladin.

You are very wrong my friend, if you think that burst = dps.
Take Arbiter cleric with no cooldowns as an example. It can probably out burst any class in the game until it starts to get divinity issues. That is why, a minute long damage calculations will show you that AC's actually do much less damage than rogues for example over an extended fight.

Barbs also do not have a very high burst but a more reliable sustained damage. You have no idea how much potential a barb tank has as a dps. In my 50 odd Lomm runs, 80% has been with Barb tanks and i am just 20.2k and i've seen no issues in terms of damage and needing help. All the issues i see are with healers not doing their job and i think that the challenge there gives you a reason to play. Imagine giving one class all the tools for a successful guaranteed run. Every individual in the team needs to bring something to the table and the tank's job is not to protect the party. If other tank classes have this then there is one reason to pick them over barb, if your dps is low then you should go barb tank. It is not the matter of fact what you saw in your runs, do some damage calculations and then tell me who does more damage.

Barbs can just about match my damage but forget a pally or fighter tank every coming close to it. These are all LOMM runs i am talking about.

sobi · August 2019

sobi#1980 said:

cherryman1 said:

sobi#1980 said:
Barb tank just does more damage, anyone disagreeing to that and actually confirming that fighters and pallies can match its tank dps are obviously deluded and totally forgot to take player skill into account. By more i actually really mean a lot more than fighters and pallies. This is comparing them in the same gear as well.

That brings me to the next point. If barbs are chosen as a tank that can dish out some pretty nice dps, and fighers and pallies as more tanky, party protecting tanks, then i think that a barb needs no more help. Considering the aforementioned, i see maybe 80% of my lomm runs with barb tanks so content wise they have no issue and barbs are not considered as best tanks right now for nothing. They bring a certain niche as a tank and it seems to be working like a charm for them, they can't expect to out dps other tank classes by a long margin and still be same or better at protecting the party.

As for party protection then it sure is a nice thing to have as a tank, but that really is a healer's job. A dps must be able to survive one shots, this will become more apparent in Tower of the mad mage. So i really do advise other dps' out there to start stacking HP.
The barb tank doesn't do more damage in game or is so negligible that you would hardly ever tell. There are several tanks in my alliance that are paladin/fighter that can kill reliably their first 2 mimics in the arcturia fight without issues. This is really helpful when it comes to getting new players through that content. I've even seen the tier 2 dps classes get out dps'ed in game by a paladin/fighter tank. \

Barbs can only tank when the entire rest of the party knows how to play their classes. When you have dps that are new to a dungeon being able to give them some help instead of saying "play better" or moral support as the tank is much more appreciated than the miniscule amount of damage more you think the tank barb does over a fighter sentinel or paladin.

You are very wrong my friend, if you think that burst = dps.
Take Arbiter cleric with no cooldowns as an example. It can probably out burst any class in the game until it starts to get divinity issues. That is why, a minute long damage calculations will show you that AC's actually do much less damage than rogues for example over an extended fight. Barbs also do not have a very high burst but a more reliable sustained damage which may not suit the mimic phase but they can easily manage with a daily.

In terms of heal checks against the worm or torbriand then that is the healer's job. Any other tank bringing in the tools to help the healer is a good niche but barbs damage is not in any way negligible to other tank classes that they need more help. From all my calculations and 80% of my LOMM runs with barbs, i have seen barbs out dps any other tank and easily match dps with other dps classes. Bring in rough calculations on the table instead of what you saw. They are by far the best tank class in the game right now and you see too many of them to be able to ignore this fact. especially LOMM.

What you and the OP wants is, a tank that has all the tools to guarantee a successful run. Regardless of the fact that the healer or 1 of the dps sucks and has no skill. That way, there will be no challenge and satisfaction for the end game players. Every class needs to bring something to the table, you just cannot expect to give one class all the tools that other classes have as well.

sobi · August 2019

barbie#2808 said:
If the tank deals more dmg than the dps, it means that the dps doesnt know how to build their class

Don't twist the topic. Barb tanks can do much more dps than other tanks and do the calculations art your leisure. If barbs tank are given the tools of a healer with what they bring to the table currently, then i want AC's to be able to heal as a DPS and not lose their dps in return.

cherryman1 · August 2019

sobi#1980 said:

barbie#2808 said:
If the tank deals more dmg than the dps, it means that the dps doesnt know how to build their class
Don't twist the topic. Barb tanks can do much more dps than other tanks and do the calculations art your leisure. If barbs tank are given the tools of a healer with what they bring to the table currently, then i want AC's to be able to heal as a DPS and not lose their dps in return.

There isn't any AC left in the game. Second, they can throw out heals at a minor loss to dps.

sobi · August 2019

cherryman1 said:

sobi#1980 said:

barbie#2808 said:
If the tank deals more dmg than the dps, it means that the dps doesnt know how to build their class
Don't twist the topic. Barb tanks can do much more dps than other tanks and do the calculations art your leisure. If barbs tank are given the tools of a healer with what they bring to the table currently, then i want AC's to be able to heal as a DPS and not lose their dps in return.
There isn't any AC left in the game. Second, they can throw out heals at a minor loss to dps.

Are you sure you know what AC means? Secondly, you do know what is the cost of Bastion for AC? Thirdly, i am an AC main and i do agree that i've never come across AC dps in LOMM and i am probably the only one there.

bitcrusher · August 2019

The only problem i personally have with my Barb-tank is with pulling trash-mob-groups, i always lose aggro or even dont get it and have to run to every single mob to get his attention, that takes too long so i gave up trying to pull trash mobs together. besides that i think the Barb can tank very good. DPS-wise my tank isnt that good but keeping aggro from bosses rarely had issues.

problem with the barbarian tank

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