Tank,Heal,Dps trinity not needed in endgame.. (LOMM)

tardbath
tardbath Member Posts: 80 Arc User
in Player Feedback (PC)
3 dps, 2 heals or 4 dps and 1 heal, should not be able to steamroll endgame content..
I know we have only 1 dungeon but the trinity is not even needed in the only one we got! There are no aggro checking mechanisms in the dungeon although there are some Heal and Dps checks!(this is great! good healers are needed).

Suggestion:

1.Add some Powerfull attacks on elite mobs and bosses through the dungeon with fixed 400k or 450k true damage(you can fix that number) that cannot be dodged or Scrolled after dying(like coocoon)

2.Remove the ability to swap roles in private Q.

I know there must be better suggestions and solutions so let's work this out !

Sorry for my bad English :/

Best

Comments

  • vorphied
    vorphied Member Posts: 1,870 Arc User
    tardbath said:

    3 dps, 2 heals or 4 dps and 1 heal, should not be able to steamroll endgame content..
    I know we have only 1 dungeon but the trinity is not even needed in the only one we got! There are no aggro checking mechanisms in the dungeon although there are some Heal and Dps checks!(this is great! good healers are needed).

    Suggestion:

    1.Add some Powerfull attacks on elite mobs and bosses through the dungeon with fixed 400k or 450k true damage(you can fix that number) that cannot be dodged or Scrolled after dying(like coocoon)

    2.Remove the ability to swap roles in private Q.

    I know there must be better suggestions and solutions so let's work this out !

    Sorry for my bad English :/

    Best

    I don't think it's necessarily a good idea to enforce the trinity with too many cheap measures (if players can't find a decent tank and want to do Arcturia with 2 healers, why not?), and the tank role already does bring value through more consistent boss positioning and removing some stress from other players to make runs more efficient.

    Where the tank role has a challenge is that a tank is either useful and can hold threat or cannot hold threat and is nearly useless. Not much of a happy medium.
    Sacrilege - Warlock
    Contagion - Cleric
    Testament - Wizard
    Pestilence - Ranger
    Dominion - Paladin

    NIGHTSWATCH

  • tardbath
    tardbath Member Posts: 80 Arc User
    edited May 2019
    It's ok to think that playing an MMO with no tank is a "choise"! for me after playing several years, REAL mmo games, there is no group content with NO TANK in endgame pve ! The problem here is real and we can find a solution ! Private Qs were just a suggestion, they can leave them as it is ! The fact is that the game remains a joke after forcing a huge rework like m16 did to acomplice the "trinity" and in the end the trinity not be needed at all.


    You can have both your opinions and i accept them!

    I will not going to comment the "5 healers should be able to steamroll endgame "

    Btw @vorphied the only reason you "need" a second heal in the specific boss is cause you don't have a good healer at the first place, the tank has nothing to do with that in acturia.. no aggro checks at all in this boss just need a decend healer! The tank has only to offer some dps and this exactly is the problem we have here!Since there is 0 punishment in losing aggro the tank easily get replaced by a second heal since a dps can offer more damage for the mimics! I have more than 40 runs completed as a tank, (with no second healer) to know that i just offer my damage in this fight and that i need no
    second healer if the one i got can heal player to max hp when coocooned!I can accept that you might have differnt experience in your runs ! this is my point of view as a tank in this fight

    Best
    Post edited by tardbath on
  • vorphied
    vorphied Member Posts: 1,870 Arc User
    edited May 2019
    tardbath said:


    Btw @vorphied the only reason you "need" a second heal in the specific boss is cause you don't have a good healer at the first place, the tank has nothing to do with that in acturia.. no aggro checks at all in this boss just need a decend healer! The tank has only to offer some dps and this exactly is the problem we have here!Since there is 0 punishment in losing aggro the tank easily get replaced by a second heal since a dps can offer more damage for the mimics! I have more than 40 runs completed as a tank, (with no second healer) to know that i just offer my damage in this fight and that i need no
    second healer if the one i got can heal player to max hp when coocooned!I can accept that you might have differnt experience in your runs ! this is my point of view as a tank in this fight

    I said nothing about needing a second heal, because you don't. What I said was that an ineffective or non-existent tank can be replaced by a second healer, and that's not necessarily a bad thing.

    The punishment in losing aggro is that it's annoying and inefficient. Not impossible, but annoying. I've ripped aggro from enough tanks as DPS to know what a pain it can be to have to deal with constant boss aggro on top of trying to maintain your optimal DPS, and then the healer is having to spend extra resources to keep you up rather than a dedicated tank. If a tank is there and holding threat, everyone else's jobs become easier.

    Sacrilege - Warlock
    Contagion - Cleric
    Testament - Wizard
    Pestilence - Ranger
    Dominion - Paladin

    NIGHTSWATCH

  • tgwolf
    tgwolf Member Posts: 497 Arc User
    Just force the Roles in both Public and Private and do not allow for switching unless there are 2 classes present that can trade roles.

    1 Tank
    1 Healer
    3 DPS

    or

    Add an enemy Buff called Unfocused Fury to Boss Fights:

    Unfocused Fury:

    At the start of the fight the target is Immune and deals increasing amounts of Damage until struck with an Encounter from a Tank Role player. If at any point there is no longer a Tank Role present, the target deals 50% more damage and takes 50% less damage (after Mitigation) for the remainder of the fight.

    People need to learn not to mess with the intended game dynamic and if that requires severe punishment for doing so, so be it.
  • yperkeimenos
    yperkeimenos Member Posts: 334 Arc User
    They should increase difficulty even more , it's way too easy as is, and impose specific team compositions even in private queues. In fact they should prohibit parties from ,entering dungeons unless they have at least a healer,a tank and a dps snd i'm not just talking about public queues, i'm refering to chat and friend invites as well. Also they should increase level cap every 2 years so that players never get comfortable with what they have and always strive for new equipment. They should remove the ad cap from the Zen market completely so that zen finds its true value at around 10000 ads per zen. Also leveling should be extremely hard so that new players can appreciate their character development ,once they eventually reach level 80, and good loot drops should have around 0.0000000001% of getting because the players will never feel accomplished otherwise. Finally the campaigns should be 5 times harder to complete otherwise players will loose interest and have nothing to do.
    It's BUGS bunny i tell you.
  • finmakin
    finmakin Member Posts: 401 Arc User
    Then Dev's should make LoMM much harder
    Ogguk The Beholder… Justicar Paladin
    Puny Tank

    Guildleader of NWLC Alpha
  • dennizonn
    dennizonn Member Posts: 21 Arc User
    edited May 2019
    yperkeimenos said:

    They should increase difficulty even more , it's way too easy as is, and impose specific team compositions even in private queues. In fact they should prohibit parties from ,entering dungeons unless they have at least a healer,a tank and a dps snd i'm not just talking about public queues, i'm refering to chat and friend invites as well. Also they should increase level cap every 2 years so that players never get comfortable with what they have and always strive for new equipment. They should remove the ad cap from the Zen market completely so that zen finds its true value at around 10000 ads per zen. Also leveling should be extremely hard so that new players can appreciate their character development ,once they eventually reach level 80, and good loot drops should have around 0.0000000001% of getting because the players will never feel accomplished otherwise. Finally the campaigns should be 5 times harder to complete otherwise players will loose interest and have nothing to do.

    This is the type of opinion that resulted in scaling. Whatever solution is introduced, allowing players freedom of choice is the way to go in my opinion. You can have a discussion about making certain choices more VIABLE than others, but to remove options entirely is not a good idea.

    Furthermore, not everyone who plays the game appreciates difficulty for the sake of difficulty, and not everyone burns through content like their hair is on fire. I agree that there needs to be areas that are hard, but you don't make the whole game that way, and you don't make ALL dungeons and ALL ways to get decent loot that way either; the fact is a successful game needs both casual and elitist players to be successful, and have a thriving community and economy. Newsflash: casuals don't play for needless difficulty, and elitists only find the game easy because they spend enough time, or money, in it to get top rated gear; therefore, for some players the game feels TOO difficult in it's current state regardless of your experience that it is too easy.

    Experience should be fast enough to see regular progress, and not so fast that one feels no sense of accomplishment.

    Loot should be tied to difficulty, with more than one tier of possibilities to allow one to play solo, or in teams, and still receive satisfying and useful drops
    Post edited by dennizonn on
  • kangkeok
    kangkeok Member Posts: 1,123 Arc User
    If the dev could lower the effective defense and deflect cap for dps and healer from 50% to 30% while increase Tank stat cap to 60 or 70% damage resist, tank role might be valid again. So when player switch role from a tank role to non tank role, those stat will cap at 30% max. Of course tank aggro need to be increase as well since dps has no need to invest much point into defense and deflect, they sure convert those point into offensive stat. There is no need to make mob hit harder just tweak the stat cap for each role.

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