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personal feelings about mod 16

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  • dionchidionchi Posts: 783Member Arc User
    kvet said:

    I compare m16 to this:

    You release a video game and people enjoyed it. Over the years, the team that built it turns over a few times and updates and changes over that time start to conflict and the game eventually reaches a point where you can no longer tweak it back into balance. So, you cut your losses and make a massive shift to add both better balance to the game between classes, reduce server load caused by all the inefficient stuff built in over the years, and to increase the ability to control balance going forward. You do this knowing it will upset some players, but the overhaul is necessary for the health of the game going forward.

    That's what I compare it to.

    For those of you who are quitting the game: Please send me your stuff. thanks. bye.

    People can try to compare the upcoming changes to spouses turning into elephants, cars or whatever, but it isn't a spouse, an elephant or car it's a game released with the Advertised title of "Neverwinter"...

    That being the case Neverwinter as it was originally released is no more and Neverwinter 2.0 is replacing it.

    You can't (well actually I guess you can if you’re Cryptic), release a game called Neverwinter, change almost everything about it as far as how gear works, enchantments and runestones work, buffs – debuffs, companion stats, powers, feats, etc. and still call it Neverwinter - especially if it no longer tends to resemble much of how the game was when it was originally released….

    Small changes, tweaks and "improvements", fine a lot of people may grumble but most players will addapt and carry on. But when so much of what previously made the game what it was is altered - it's just no longer the same game in my opinion.

    To seemingly pretend this is the natural progression of things instead of a near crisis intervention attempt to fix things that have been broken for a long time, or existed since their introduction and expect people to believe “this is the same game as it’s always been”… That didn’t work after Mod 6 and I suspect it isn’t going to go over well this time either. But I hope I'm wrong.

    The ‘new and improved’ Neverwinter seems to me to have little resemblance to the previous Neverwinters, so far as the things I mentioned are concerned but as I already said: “I fully understand the need for upgrades and even agree that occasionally there needs to be changes made to ensure the future Survivability of an existing platform.” and “Granted, all things change...” and this too shall pass... or at least I hope it does and the game survives and despite the demise of, first Gateway, invoking for AD's, being able to run dungeons and skirmishes solo for AD's, then salvage and now the Foundry, along with the so far announced "changes", I hope Neverwinter survives considerably better than it did following the release of Mod 6 and some of the other "improvements" we've seen.

    Again, just my 2¢
    DD~
  • dionchidionchi Posts: 783Member Arc User
    edited March 21

    what stuff do you need for neverwinter?

    If you are going to leave before we actually discover 'what's - what', might I suggest you put the stuff you intend to dispose of on the Auction House at ridiculously low prices.

    It could be that even though you’re gone, you are going to tick off enough people – and conversely make some people very happy that you’ll be remembered and talked about, even after you stop playing…

    Just a thought ~ :)
    DD~
  • demonmongerdemonmonger Posts: 3,349Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    > @dionchi said:
    > what stuff do you need for neverwinter?
    >
    > If you are going to leave before we actually discover 'what's - what', might I suggest you put the stuff you intend to dispose of on the Auction House at ridiculously low prices.
    >
    > It could be that even though you’re gone, you are going to tick off enough people – and conversely make some people very happy that you’ll be remembered and talked about, even after you stop playing…
    >
    > Just a thought ~ :)

    That always happens
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  • dionchidionchi Posts: 783Member Arc User
    edited March 27
    Mod 16 - Delver's Expedition Pack 15,000 Zen ($150 US)?

    Really?!?
    Post edited by dionchi on
    DD~
  • plasticbatplasticbat Posts: 6,406Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    dionchi said:

    Mod 16 - Delver's Expedition Pack 15,000 Zen ($150 US)?

    Really?!?

    And that is on sale price.
  • cabar1cabar1 Posts: 124Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    And the Money Grab is already in Full Swing!
    99 lines of code on the wall, 99 lines of code, add one line, compile it again....... 113 lines on code on the wall
    113 lines of code on the wall, 113 lines of code, rewrite one line, compile it again.......
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  • demonmongerdemonmonger Posts: 3,349Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    > @cabar1 said:
    > And the Money Grab is already in Full Swing!

    Not today.... not even for 50% off
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  • mentinmindmakermentinmindmaker Posts: 877Member Arc User
    edited March 27
    dionchi said:

    Mod 16 - Delver's Expedition Pack 15,000 Zen ($150 US)?

    Really?!?

    Yeah, interesting that Cryptic chose that price point. It is *rather* high. I think that just signals that those buying the packs are the extreme competitive crowd that cares more about getting a head start than about money. Then the high price point will mean little lost sales and much increased income.

    There is an old history about the Concorde jets: They were losing money. Then they doubled the ticket price, and the number of tickets sold actually increased. They were not perceived as exclusive enough at the low price point.
  • demonmongerdemonmonger Posts: 3,349Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    It's just neverwinter 2.0 and the new hero of the north pack
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  • pitshadepitshade Posts: 4,291Member Arc User
    The weapons aren't BIS, a very short lived boost. The pet and mount are for vanity purposes only. There is no campaign boost because m16 doesn't work that way. The rank 15s may be worth something but a guildie said they aren't that hard to make. I may try and snag the pet on the AH but this doesn't seem worth buying.
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  • kemnimtarkaskemnimtarkas Posts: 671Member Arc User
    edited March 27

    dionchi said:

    Mod 16 - Delver's Expedition Pack 15,000 Zen ($150 US)?

    Really?!?

    Yeah, interesting that Cryptic chose that price point. It is *rather* high. I think that just signals that those buying the packs are the extreme competitive crowd that cares more about getting a head start than about money. Then the high price point will mean little lost sales and much increased income.

    There is an old history about the Concorde jets: They were losing money. Then they doubled the ticket price, and the number of tickets sold actually increased. They were not perceived as exclusive enough at the low price point.
    The fact that the new expedition pack is MORE expensive, rather than less, shows that the decision makers at Cryptic are a little out of touch with their audience.

    Just a little.

    Though now that I think about it - they do need more funding for an expanded advertising budget, to attract new players to replace all the ones who've sworn they are leaving the game in these forum posts.
  • silence1xsilence1x Posts: 1,503Member Arc User

    The fact that the new expedition pack is MORE expensive, rather than less, shows that the decision makers at Cryptic are a little out of touch with their audience.

    Just a little.

    Though now that I think about it - they do need more funding for an expanded advertising budget, to attract new players to replace all the ones who've sworn they are leaving the game in these forum posts.

    Keep in mind though that pricing is set by the higher-ups and/or the marketing department. I doubt if either group actively, or even sporadically, reads this forum.

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  • mebengalsfan#9264 mebengalsfan Posts: 3,166Member Arc User

    i can compare mod 16 to this..

    you get married to a lovely woman/man and 5 years later they wake up and say in a few months they will be turning into an elephant.
    then they say.. please don't be angry, they understand they can no longer go to dinner with us at our favorite places or even ride in the car with us, but they love us and want us to stay. please dont get angry but we can no longer make love or have children because they are changing into a creature that is no longer human.

    so what do you do?

    stay married and be unhappy and unfruitful?
    or get divorced?

    My first ever build was stealth based regeneration build.... then lifesteal and regen got nerfed.
    My second build was stealth based + lifesteal + mobility and guess what...
    stealth is broken/revealed if you attack in pvp you are seen
    lifesteal is being removed from the game as is
    mobility is being nerfed into the ground for me
    stealth feats i used are bring removed from the game.

    (looks at the neverwinter ring on his finger)

    I want stealth reveal to be removed from pvp in mod 16
    that is my demand.

    In D&D lore typically if you hit an enemy while in stealth you were taken out of stealth. The current setup in PVP fits that model I see no issues. You simply want to gank people while not being hit, that is far from fair in PVP. There is a reason why other games that may have invisibility potions make them not usable in PVP or make it so that invisibility last for X amount of time usually very short or until you hit a target.

    Your request is nothing more than you wanting to win more at PVP, which is not why this update happened; it happened mainly do to PVE complaints from DPS players upset that most groups were 4 buffers and one DPS. Soon we will hear from the support roles stating that they are rarely used in groups as the game gets easier you tend to not need support players for healing or tanking.
  • silverkeltsilverkelt Posts: 4,232Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    The price is outrageous for what you get back..
    But so wasnt some of the old packs.. very few of them were worth even 20% of their price.

    Gawd.. I hate this game sometimes.. I dont really know why I play it.. other then some of the people and what was a more fluid combat experience.

    They are so out of touch.
  • cherryman1cherryman1 Posts: 303Member Arc User


    Your request is nothing more than you wanting to win more at PVP, which is not why this update happened; it happened mainly do to PVE complaints from DPS players upset that most groups were 4 buffers and one DPS. Soon we will hear from the support roles stating that they are rarely used in groups as the game gets easier you tend to not need support players for healing or tanking.

    The issue is that those dps characters still won't get their wish. Since they created so much content in the game that is meant to split up the team all it is going to do is create this multi healer setup so we will see 2 or more healers in the content and better yet if they can swap between healing / dps in the middle of the run. This means they will have to make the content so easy it can be soloed by 1 dps class so that 1 healer is needed. Looking at you Many Coin Bank Heist, merchant prince folly, pretty much all of the skirmishes, Castle Ravenloft, Castle Never, etc...
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  • hustin1hustin1 Posts: 2,951Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    dionchi said:

    Mod 16 - Delver's Expedition Pack 15,000 Zen ($150 US)?

    Really?!?

    $150?

    OH. HELL. NO.
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  • kiraskytowerkiraskytower Posts: 425Member Arc User
    hustin1 said:

    dionchi said:

    Mod 16 - Delver's Expedition Pack 15,000 Zen ($150 US)?

    Really?!?

    $150?

    OH. HELL. NO.
    The mount and companion are not even account-wide, instead they are single copy (and tradeable/sellable). If they were account-wide it might make this pack a little more reasonable in price (but still expensive), but as it is, you get a lot less with this pack than many of the previous packs.
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  • mebengalsfan#9264 mebengalsfan Posts: 3,166Member Arc User

    hustin1 said:

    dionchi said:

    Mod 16 - Delver's Expedition Pack 15,000 Zen ($150 US)?

    Really?!?

    $150?

    OH. HELL. NO.
    The mount and companion are not even account-wide, instead they are single copy (and tradeable/sellable). If they were account-wide it might make this pack a little more reasonable in price (but still expensive), but as it is, you get a lot less with this pack than many of the previous packs.
    This pack is way over priced. Prior packs gave us rare weapons, 5 coalwards, VIP, etc.. this pack is horribly overpriced.

    Is Cryptic that hard up for cash they have to charge $200 standard price on a similar pack that we paid $75 on last year.

    Even with the 25% discount of it being $150 you get buy three standard games or two games at deluxe edition at minimum. Also time in NWO won't equate to a good game that can take hours to complete, looking at your Divinity Original Sin 2.

    I'm sorry but mod 16 is bad and this pricing on this package is just crazy. Whoever is running the show seriously over priced this package big time.

    $35 mount - account wide
    Green level companion - under $10
    Weapon package with key bundle is $20
    Two coal wards $20
    Refinement package $4

    Adding all of this up and we get a nice price of $80 of stuff plus campaign help for one week. Is the campaign one week worth $120 at standard pricing. NOPE and this package is not worth more than $75 tops.

    Old package was similar but we got 5 coal wards in addition to other things that was around $100 worth of stuff.

    Ugh....
  • dionchidionchi Posts: 783Member Arc User

    It's just neverwinter 2.0 and the new hero of the north pack

    It is Neverwinter 2.0 (which bears only a modicum of resemblance to the Neverwinter I started playing and kept playing because I liked it) and as for the Delver’s Expedition Pack being "just neverwinter 2.0’s Hero of the North pack"… it’s more than half again as the old Hero of the North pack – and although it doesn’t specify, I’m guessing most of the items (if not all) are only able to be claimed by a single character instead of account wide as was the case for the Hero of the North pack.

    Do not only does the DE pack cost more, but it seems to me to offer players less than the HoN pack, Neverwinter 2.0 or not. To me especially since as I mentioned the DE pack is more than half again as much as the old HoN pack AND I suspect items are only able to be claimed by a single character instead of every character in the account... I think the price of the new DE pack should be less, not more than the most expensive pack previously... especially if the items from that pack are not available to every character on the account.

    But that's just my 2¢ - or $200 worth, depending on one's perspective.
    hustin1 said:

    dionchi said:

    Mod 16 - Delver's Expedition Pack 15,000 Zen ($150 US)?

    Really?!?

    $150?

    OH. HELL. NO.
    $150... that's the "limited time "SALE" price ~ :o
    silence1x said:

    Keep in mind though that pricing is set by the higher-ups and/or the marketing department. I doubt if either group actively, or even sporadically, reads this forum.

    Or likely play the game and most likely have little or no idea the financial status (or intelligence) of the majority of people who do play the game...

    I’m not really sure who they think they are targeting with a $200 (US) player pack, with items that are probably only able to be claimed by a single character for that account but it sure as fire isn’t me or most of the people I know who play the game.

    My thoughts are given the pack is for sale on the Zen market instead of by direct purchase as the old packs used to be, this might be someone's idea of an "AD sink"... getting some of those game "whales" to convert a bunch of their stockpiled AD's to Zen then buy this pack.

    Not even in my most inebriated state, after falling and receiving a head trauma that kills off a third of my brain cells and getting a bigger than expected raise on my work paycheck… would I consider paying that much, for what appears to me to be so little…

    Perhaps though that’s just me ~




    DD~
  • kemnimtarkaskemnimtarkas Posts: 671Member Arc User

    hustin1 said:

    dionchi said:

    Mod 16 - Delver's Expedition Pack 15,000 Zen ($150 US)?

    Really?!?

    $150?

    OH. HELL. NO.
    The mount and companion are not even account-wide, instead they are single copy (and tradeable/sellable). If they were account-wide it might make this pack a little more reasonable in price (but still expensive), but as it is, you get a lot less with this pack than many of the previous packs.
    No, I think this new pack is in a league all its own. No previous pack is REMOTELY as over priced as this one.

    I thought the AI pack for M15 was at the absolute bottom of the pack barrel - but this one?

    It makes the AI pack look like an absolute steal in comparison.

  • wylonuswylonus Posts: 2,360Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    i agree with Dionchi, old edition is gone, as he said, this will be NWO 2.0 version, it is also all part of EULA that we all signed and "agreed", so they can make unexpected changes, either we like it or not.
    i ran thru test for hours, and had good time, but skills and boons will take some time to adjusting.

    only thing that i dont agree with Zen market, it hurt some players who invested alot for last 5 years and seeing Mod 16 take away. i only invested some zen when needed. mostly for bags, extra slots, and often feel have to buy coal wards that is still expensive., it was on merchant for years and it was cheaper then took away.

    what make me sad, foundery will be gone, players like to create and make new stories.

    so, i offer suggestion if they need to make money, instead of Mod series or campaign episodes, make some 'exclusive' DCL, story base sort of like EQ2's Southpaw Saga and Bloodlines.
    just simple collection of DCL packs, only for exclusive adventure packs and cheap for players to get.
    story about vampire cultists, story about dragonborn folks, story about drows, throw in some interesting culture themes.
    maybe let the players buy adventure pack and design them and submit for test before going to DCL on zen market.
  • auron#6793 auron Posts: 256Member Arc User
    with the foundry shutting down and if mod 16 goes live without core elements (Stat rolls) i'm not spending a cent on this game. removing stat rolls is like selling a TV to someone and giving them a box of rocks.
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  • minotaur2857minotaur2857 Posts: 1,138Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User

    hustin1 said:

    dionchi said:

    Mod 16 - Delver's Expedition Pack 15,000 Zen ($150 US)?

    Really?!?

    $150?

    OH. HELL. NO.
    The mount and companion are not even account-wide, instead they are single copy (and tradeable/sellable). If they were account-wide it might make this pack a little more reasonable in price (but still expensive), but as it is, you get a lot less with this pack than many of the previous packs.
    No, I think this new pack is in a league all its own. No previous pack is REMOTELY as over priced as this one.

    I thought the AI pack for M15 was at the absolute bottom of the pack barrel - but this one?

    It makes the AI pack look like an absolute steal in comparison.

    It seems to grant a lot less than my small founders pack did, for the price of the large one.
  • adinosiiadinosii Posts: 3,924Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    edited March 28


    Yeah, interesting that Cryptic chose that price point. It is *rather* high. I think that just signals that those buying the packs are the extreme competitive crowd that cares more about getting a head start than about money.

    But you are not even getting a head start.

    Some of the earlier campaign packs gave you a companion that would give you a boost on campaign currency, so you could maybe finish the campaign a week before anyone else, but you can finish the M16 campaign in a day or two - there is no campaign currency with a weekly limit that holds you back.

    The weapons are questionable - I mean, you cannot use them during the campaign, as they require level 80, and by the time you finish the campaign and hit 80, you can start grinding for better weapons anyhow.

    The companion and mount - sure great "vanity" items - cool, rare and all that, but nothing more - not BiS and not account wide, so really just for showing that you have more money than good sense.

    The coalescent wards - keep in mind that the recent ward cap basically reduces their value - they are now equivalent to 78 Preservation wards, not 100.

    The Rank 15 enchants - sure, nice, but anyone even remotely interested in buying this pack probably has a full set of R14s already, so this is not a major boost (but it does have decent value, as you can sell the R14s they replace).

    I could afford the pack without blinking an eye, but I like getting my money's worth, and this pack just does not measure up, sorry...
    Make NWO great again, please....
  • ron#1747 ron Posts: 65Member Arc User
    I would stay happy with the elephant because I don't judge people by their outside, but for their inside. But mod 16? Terrible! Ill still play the game, but just because there are no more D&D based NOT old school rpg's
  • demonmongerdemonmonger Posts: 3,349Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    edited March 28
    Let's stop for a minute
    ... if you want to buy the masterwork obsidian weapons it will cost you about 50.00 usd.

    The mount at least what 25.00 usd.

    The rank 15 enchantments are 30.00 each that's 60.00 for 2.

    The coal wards are 10 each... mmm yeah it will all add up in your favor..

    I did a search on live at least 10 people have the pack and are selling mounts from it.

    The question is can you really get any enchantment of your choice or is the choice limited to the basic enchantment drops... I might want dragons hoard or fey from my enchantment pack. Without knowing I don't care to gamble
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  • wylonuswylonus Posts: 2,360Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    i just woke up, and want to add.

    OMG! there few characters riding around on the Worms, I see Paul Atriedies, Paul Maud'dib, Stilgar, and few others in PE
  • wylonuswylonus Posts: 2,360Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    ESO was so much better, they sell as account wide, you get those and later you make new alts, it all already there for new alts, so look like NWO make another epic fail, only restricted for 1 character. price like that is too extremely costly and it scream at me "please save my job and buy this!"

    seem they forget, overprices only get some stupid and those who dont care and threw money since they are too rich and full of narcissist., zen market aiming so limited, making gap wider instead of going cheaper and would get lot more buyers.
    everyone know it is only pixels and most refused to blow the money and once it get unplugged, we lost money on nonexistanance pixels.
    just my opinion, 4,000 zens sound better, but 15,000 zens? my budget wasnt built for that. what NWO need to do, fire that greedy whoever that did crazy pricing.
  • demonmongerdemonmonger Posts: 3,349Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    > @wylonus said:
    > ESO was so much better, they sell as account wide, you get those and later you make new alts, it all already there for new alts, so look like NWO make another epic fail, only restricted for 1 character. price like that is too extremely costly and it scream at me "please save my job and buy this!"
    >
    > seem they forget, overprices only get some stupid and those who dont care and threw money since they are too rich and full of narcissist., zen market aiming so limited, making gap wider instead of going cheaper and would get lot more buyers.
    > everyone know it is only pixels and most refused to blow the money and once it get unplugged, we lost money on nonexistanance pixels.
    > just my opinion, 4,000 zens sound better, but 15,000 zens? my budget wasnt built for that. what NWO need to do, fire that greedy whoever that did crazy pricing.

    Bro.... you get two rank 15's mod 16 weapons (even if the bonus is only good for archers) a mount skin, coal ward, 30 days vip, more stuff like a companion plus extras... it is worth more than the price listed.

    However, I at the moment don't want to spend until they promise the module is ready and all needs are complete and I have tested them to see if my projected build is still viable.
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  • darkheart#6758 darkheart Posts: 270Member Arc User
    Nothing in this game is worth a $150 real money. Now if you have saved up that much zen from ad exchange, fine go for it, but even then I personally think it's a ripoff.
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