Developer Blog: Level Cap Increase

pitmonster · February 2019

Starting a discussion on each of these MASSIVE announcements.

Developer Blog: Level Cap Increase

Each one of these would be significant in a single mod but packing them all in one plug content?!?!

ghoulz66 · February 2019

Ok.... but are you guys bloody going to give the CW fireball or buff shard of endless avalanche then? Who really cares about new powers when the majority of them have been gimmicky garbage.

jonkoca · February 2019

Can you please break HRs, but in a good way. C'mon, it's our turn goshdarnit.

pitmonster · February 2019

ghoulz66 said:
Ok.... but are you guys bloody going to give the CW fireball or buff shard of endless avalanche then? Who really cares about new powers when the majority of them have been gimmicky garbage.

The CW needs to be renamed "Elementalist", not "Wizard" because that is what they are with Magic Missile bolted on.

I want Fireball, Cloud Kill, Polymorph Self and Other. Turn Invisible, Knock, etc and so on. And there most defiantly needs to be a Familiar power that maybe runs like Shield in that you slot it and turn it on.

I am not holding my breath for this. Instead I expect the next new class to be something lame like a Druid or Bard.

ghoulz66 · February 2019

Would love to get the Thayan's fireball that they charge up. Hold it down to build up the damage and destroy a mob. That sounds like fun. Not.... stupid imprisonment....

wisper2048 · February 2019

Will this mod make all lv70 content obsolete except for boons? Or it will be uplifted to lv80 like in mod6?

rikitaki · February 2019

Honestly I don't see any point in rising or even decreasing a level cap. It really does not mean a thing to the game. (so I really do not understand why they bother)
The only important thing is how many maps and areas are on the highest reachable level (or scale to it) and how many of those drop anything usable for players on the highest level. The first thing is for not making most of the content trivial after we get our level to the cap again, the second is related to motivation...

majorcharvenak · February 2019

wisper2048 said:
Will this mod make all lv70 content obsolete except for boons? Or it will be uplifted to lv80 like in mod6?

That last is the big one for me. That and all the latest gear becoming complete garbage (instead of garbage over time) once the cap was raised. I wish they would place some kind of equipment upgrade you could craft in the professions so you could increase the stats of your current gear to just below any BiS items they introduce with the new module. Otherwise, you might as well run to level 80 naked imho.

malignantmind · February 2019

pitmonster#5684 said:

ghoulz66 said:
Ok.... but are you guys bloody going to give the CW fireball or buff shard of endless avalanche then? Who really cares about new powers when the majority of them have been gimmicky garbage.
The CW needs to be renamed "Elementalist", not "Wizard" because that is what they are with Magic Missile bolted on.

I want Fireball, Cloud Kill, Polymorph Self and Other. Turn Invisible, Knock, etc and so on. And there most defiantly needs to be a Familiar power that maybe runs like Shield in that you slot it and turn it on.

I am not holding my breath for this. Instead I expect the next new class to be something lame like a Druid or Bard.

I've always thought the CW is more like a sorcerer from D&D, rather than a wizard. Wizards are more of the utility belt of the classes, with a spell for every situation. Sorcerers are generally more blasty, because they have such a limited number of spells they can learn, they generally have to sacrifice utility for combat effectiveness. However I do agree that they need to give wizards fireball and lightning bolt. If they keep the same paragon paths, those damned well better be two of the unique encounters.

craegha · February 2019

With all the new roll outs, what's this gonna do to my toon? The power point system is going out the window.. Is that gonna mean that powers I wanted to max out and use are now maxed out and usable? Or am I just going to have to start all over to get the desired effect the devs are hoping for?

luffyhaki123 · February 2019

man people whine and cry for no reason gotta love it. if you think the level cap to 80 is bad then u should go play a game that has no content and never gets anything. If you think all the gear u got now will always be what u will have forever then stop playing mmorpgs. Always gotta find something to cry about. This game is getting what it needs, and if you can;t see that , thats your problem.

kiraskytower · February 2019

craegha#9303 said:
With all the new roll outs, what's this gonna do to my toon? The power point system is going out the window.. Is that gonna mean that powers I wanted to max out and use are now maxed out and usable? Or am I just going to have to start all over to get the desired effect the devs are hoping for?

From what we have been told, all the powers will be unlocked as you level up to the point you can use them and will be at their max potency. So no need to start over or worry about power points any longer.

sandukutupu · February 2019

Don't beat me up for saying this but, I am not for a level increase. My reasons are simple. Leveling up from 60 to 70 in module 6 was a terrible experience. The level means nothing without some kind of benefit behind it. Otherwise this is just for elite gamers to feed their ego. Finally instead of 80, why not say cap at 100, 200, or 1000? They are doing this because a few players want more because more means better.

Level 80 doesn't happen in life. Do you run about with a level on you? I know the table top game uses level, but it actually means something when your DM asks you, What is your level again? Then tells you to make your saving throw versus drinking all that poison. You know they were checking tables and not making you feel better about yourself.

kiraskytower · February 2019

sandukutupu said:
Don't beat me up for saying this but, I am not for a level increase. My reasons are simple. Leveling up from 60 to 70 in module 6 was a terrible experience. The level means nothing without some kind of benefit behind it. Otherwise this is just for elite gamers to feed their ego. Finally instead of 80, why not say cap at 100, 200, or 1000? They are doing this because a few players want more because more means better.

Level 80 doesn't happen in life. Do you run about with a level on you? I know the table top game uses level, but it actually means something when your DM asks you, What is your level again? Then tells you to make your saving throw versus drinking all that poison. You know they were checking tables and not making you feel better about yourself.

You have completely missed all of the reasons we are having a level increase ....

The level increase is kind of a "Reset" for the game. It's a way to get rid of all the old gear and sets that have been unbalancing the game since Mod 6. After all, the devs are hoping nobody will pick the old gear when you now need 100's of K in HP and 10's of K in stats to survive just as a solo player. It's a way to remove lifesteal and recovery and to change the game mechanics to put a crimp on the insane power creep that we have now. It's a way to even out the insane imbalance we have now between a 9K level 70 and an 18K level 70. It has nothing to do with player ego .... and everything to do with trying to bring a bit of balance to the game.

It's what they tried with Mod 6, to stop the insane imbalance in the game already back then. Then it DID manage to restore some balance and make the game challenging again for a few mods .... but it was also handled badly and nearly killed the game. Lets hope this time around they have learned from the past ....

rannxeroxx · February 2019

malignantmind#3340 said:

pitmonster#5684 said:

ghoulz66 said:
Ok.... but are you guys bloody going to give the CW fireball or buff shard of endless avalanche then? Who really cares about new powers when the majority of them have been gimmicky garbage.
The CW needs to be renamed "Elementalist", not "Wizard" because that is what they are with Magic Missile bolted on.

I want Fireball, Cloud Kill, Polymorph Self and Other. Turn Invisible, Knock, etc and so on. And there most defiantly needs to be a Familiar power that maybe runs like Shield in that you slot it and turn it on.

I am not holding my breath for this. Instead I expect the next new class to be something lame like a Druid or Bard.
I've always thought the CW is more like a sorcerer from D&D, rather than a wizard. Wizards are more of the utility belt of the classes, with a spell for every situation. Sorcerers are generally more blasty, because they have such a limited number of spells they can learn, they generally have to sacrifice utility for combat effectiveness. However I do agree that they need to give wizards fireball and lightning bolt. If they keep the same paragon paths, those damned well better be two of the unique encounters.

Mostly the big difference between wizards and sorcerers in D&D is how they acquire spells. Wizards learn to casts, study books, transcribe scrolls, etc vs. sorcerers have innate abilities and spells just come to them. Warlocks get theirs from the blood link to their master. Outside side quests with the warlock, this does not really play any role in NW.

ghoulz66 · February 2019

Mod 16 is just going to repeat the mistake of mod 6 and make all prior modules obsolete and serve no real purpose than an empty boon/key grind.

What the game needs is more equalized content, so you feel like there's something to work for. Seriously, why suffer grinding to unlock SVA? for outdated gear? Why are they outdated? The road there is long and painful. It's an opportunity to have more usable gear in the game with their own unique stat combos and effects.

pterias · February 2019

The reason NW Wizards look so much like D&D Sorcerers is because in 4E, Wizards were turned into flamethrowers instead of their classic "I've got a spell for every situation" selves. When Sorcerers came out in 4E, they were basically Wizards with a small extra damage bonus.

That said, in 5E, Wizards look a lot more like 3E Sorcerers while 5E Sorcerer's look like 5E Wizards with slightly fewer spells and a couple extra class features. They are sadly rather redundant.

majorcharvenak · February 2019

kiraskytower said:

sandukutupu said:
Don't beat me up for saying this but, I am not for a level increase. My reasons are simple. Leveling up from 60 to 70 in module 6 was a terrible experience. The level means nothing without some kind of benefit behind it. Otherwise this is just for elite gamers to feed their ego. Finally instead of 80, why not say cap at 100, 200, or 1000? They are doing this because a few players want more because more means better.

Level 80 doesn't happen in life. Do you run about with a level on you? I know the table top game uses level, but it actually means something when your DM asks you, What is your level again? Then tells you to make your saving throw versus drinking all that poison. You know they were checking tables and not making you feel better about yourself.
You have completely missed all of the reasons we are having a level increase ....

The level increase is kind of a "Reset" for the game. It's a way to get rid of all the old gear and sets that have been unbalancing the game since Mod 6. After all, the devs are hoping nobody will pick the old gear when you now need 100's of K in HP and 10's of K in stats to survive just as a solo player. It's a way to remove lifesteal and recovery and to change the game mechanics to put a crimp on the insane power creep that we have now. It's a way to even out the insane imbalance we have now between a 9K level 70 and an 18K level 70. It has nothing to do with player ego .... and everything to do with trying to bring a bit of balance to the game.

It's what they tried with Mod 6, to stop the insane imbalance in the game already back then. Then it DID manage to restore some balance and make the game challenging again for a few mods .... but it was also handled badly and nearly killed the game. Lets hope this time around they have learned from the past ....

This level increase wouldn't be so bad if we could SALVAGE all the soon-to-be outdated gear. As it stands now, once it hits we'll be left with junk we can't really do anything with besides vendor, refine, donate to guild coffers (if there is space) or use for cosmetics.

feanor70118 · February 2019

jonkoca said:
Can you please break HRs, but in a good way. C'mon, it's our turn goshdarnit.

Seriously. Even in the good old days of this game you'd see people forming groups in the LFG channel and saying, "No HRs."

grogthemagnif · February 2019

pitmonster#5684 said:

ghoulz66 said:
Ok.... but are you guys bloody going to give the CW fireball or buff shard of endless avalanche then? Who really cares about new powers when the majority of them have been gimmicky garbage.
The CW needs to be renamed "Elementalist", not "Wizard" because that is what they are with Magic Missile bolted on.

I want Fireball, Cloud Kill, Polymorph Self and Other. Turn Invisible, Knock, etc and so on. And there most defiantly needs to be a Familiar power that maybe runs like Shield in that you slot it and turn it on.

I am not holding my breath for this. Instead I expect the next new class to be something lame like a Druid or Bard.

Those are all Wizard spells. Many have been Wizard spells since 'The Beginning'.

havlocke · February 2019

ghoulz66 said:
Mod 16 is just going to repeat the mistake of mod 6 and make all prior modules obsolete and serve no real purpose than an empty boon/key grind.

What the game needs is more equalized content, so you feel like there's something to work for. Seriously, why suffer grinding to unlock SVA? for outdated gear? Why are they outdated? The road there is long and painful. It's an opportunity to have more usable gear in the game with their own unique stat combos and effects.

Then you kinda didn't read anything they said. They are TRYING to do exactly what you have just asked for. To rebalance the equipment from level 1 to 70. I got no idea if they will succeed. In fact, most of us are pretty jaded about their success rate. But at least they are going to give it a go.

pitmonster · February 2019

havlocke said:

ghoulz66 said:
Mod 16 is just going to repeat the mistake of mod 6 and make all prior modules obsolete and serve no real purpose than an empty boon/key grind.

What the game needs is more equalized content, so you feel like there's something to work for. Seriously, why suffer grinding to unlock SVA? for outdated gear? Why are they outdated? The road there is long and painful. It's an opportunity to have more usable gear in the game with their own unique stat combos and effects.
Then you kinda didn't read anything they said. They are TRYING to do exactly what you have just asked for. To rebalance the equipment from level 1 to 70. I got no idea if they will succeed. In fact, most of us are pretty jaded about their success rate. But at least they are going to give it a go.

I am taking a wait and see on this. One of the problems is that they waited so long to raise the cap that the vast majority of stuff people use is all LV 70 so when they raise the cap, all of the hundreds of stuff at that level becomes almost worthless. I mentioned in another post that if I were raising a new toon, I would hit 70 and just get with a group of higher level players and hit undermountain, raise my toon to 80 and gear it up then go back and do all the LV 70 campaigns. I did not do EE till after hitting 70, there is so many things you can do outside of campaigns to earn XP that you can bypass them till max.

Edit - I thought about it after posting and if stuff drops like it does in Ravenloft, you do not even need to go to Undermountain, just buy it on the AD market and keep raising your toon via daily AD runs and running things like Dread. 70 gear becomes complete trash just like 60 LV gear is today. The only way it doesn't is if they make gear increase in level and stats like certain epic belts and items do today.

nunya · February 2019

craegha#9303 said:
With all the new roll outs, what's this gonna do to my toon? The power point system is going out the window.. Is that gonna mean that powers I wanted to max out and use are now maxed out and usable? Or am I just going to have to start all over to get the desired effect the devs are hoping for?

Well, if you read the blog about it, it clearly states that the powers will unlock based on your level and will be at maximum efficacy immediately.

havlocke · March 2019

pitmonster#5684 said:

havlocke said:

ghoulz66 said:
Mod 16 is just going to repeat the mistake of mod 6 and make all prior modules obsolete and serve no real purpose than an empty boon/key grind.

What the game needs is more equalized content, so you feel like there's something to work for. Seriously, why suffer grinding to unlock SVA? for outdated gear? Why are they outdated? The road there is long and painful. It's an opportunity to have more usable gear in the game with their own unique stat combos and effects.
Then you kinda didn't read anything they said. They are TRYING to do exactly what you have just asked for. To rebalance the equipment from level 1 to 70. I got no idea if they will succeed. In fact, most of us are pretty jaded about their success rate. But at least they are going to give it a go.
I am taking a wait and see on this. One of the problems is that they waited so long to raise the cap that the vast majority of stuff people use is all LV 70 so when they raise the cap, all of the hundreds of stuff at that level becomes almost worthless. I mentioned in another post that if I were raising a new toon, I would hit 70 and just get with a group of higher level players and hit undermountain, raise my toon to 80 and gear it up then go back and do all the LV 70 campaigns. I did not do EE till after hitting 70, there is so many things you can do outside of campaigns to earn XP that you can bypass them till max.

Edit - I thought about it after posting and if stuff drops like it does in Ravenloft, you do not even need to go to Undermountain, just buy it on the AD market and keep raising your toon via daily AD runs and running things like Dread. 70 gear becomes complete trash just like 60 LV gear is today. The only way it doesn't is if they make gear increase in level and stats like certain epic belts and items do today.

One of the things I thought they were trying to do was to make sure the items all scaled incrementally. Rather than massively exponentially like they do now. So using level 70 gear won't make you completely useless when levelling up to 80.

sandukutupu · March 2019

Lord Neverember gives you new gear at the start, when talking to him in Moonstone Mask. Also there are some odd items, I assume are just place holders until we get the real stuff in there. This is another campaign where they hand you gear and equipment to help you out. There is nothing to buy, but I imagine we are going to get the low end gear and have to work up from there. Currently everyone seems to be under the impression there are level 80's in the Undermountain. I been in a few levels and everything so far is easy kill 70's. It took some time to get to level 71, but no where near as bad as mod 6 was.

havlocke · March 2019

sandukutupu said:
Lord Neverember gives you new gear at the start, when talking to him in Moonstone Mask. Also there are some odd items, I assume are just place holders until we get the real stuff in there. This is another campaign where they hand you gear and equipment to help you out. There is nothing to buy, but I imagine we are going to get the low end gear and have to work up from there. Currently everyone seems to be under the impression there are level 80's in the Undermountain. I been in a few levels and everything so far is easy kill 70's. It took some time to get to level 71, but no where near as bad as mod 6 was.

Thats a good sign because from everything I've seen, Mod6 was an exponential increase in numbers. So the difference between a 59 and a 61 was pretty horrific. Essentially the classic case where new zone greens would be better than old zone purples kinda thing. I'm really really hoping that they are deliberately trying to avoid that here.

Developer Blog: Level Cap Increase

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