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Holy News Dump, Batman! Barbarians *confirmed*!

cdnbisoncdnbison Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 806 Arc User
Wow... lots to take in from all the news dropping today...

For those not checking:
1. GWFs are being renamed 'Barbarians'.
2. Cap to level 80
3. Distinct paragon paths, with more distinction in powers
4. Goodbye to recovery and lifesteal
5. Different crit / def mechanics (and crit / deflect getting capped at 50%)
6. ilevel getting reworked to be more accurate.

Now, if we could just get some sort of confirmation on rumored rAD changes... ;-)
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Comments

  • dheffernandheffernan Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 207 Arc User
    NOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooo.....

    *17 pages later*

    ....ooooooooooooooooo!
    @Venture-1 @Venture from City of Heroes if you remember that far back. Yes, *that* Venture. Yes, I probably trashed your MA arc. For me it was Tuesday.
  • wemerywemery Member Posts: 190 Arc User


    time to get out my trusty sword of light


  • sandukutupusandukutupu Member Posts: 2,253 Arc User
    Do you think this is to sell us more training tokens? It doesn't bode well, chat in the game is on fire. I looked at the math and it appears to be a global nerf for all classes. CWs and SWs survive on recovery and lifesteal. Maybe they are going to sell bandages? I am not happy to hear level cap raised to 80, I am getting flashbacks to Mod 6 here people. Someone come outside and talk me off the ledge.
    wb-cenders.gif
  • wemerywemery Member Posts: 190 Arc User
    what about guild level caps?
  • mebengalsfan#9264 mebengalsfan Member Posts: 3,169 Arc User
    cdnbison said:

    Wow... lots to take in from all the news dropping today...

    For those not checking:
    1. GWFs are being renamed 'Barbarians'.
    2. Cap to level 80
    3. Distinct paragon paths, with more distinction in powers
    4. Goodbye to recovery and lifesteal
    5. Different crit / def mechanics (and crit / deflect getting capped at 50%)
    6. ilevel getting reworked to be more accurate.

    Now, if we could just get some sort of confirmation on rumored rAD changes... ;-)

    You forgot crit is capped at 50% as well... yeah...
  • greywyndgreywynd Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 6,083 Arc User
    All we need now is a date beyond "this Spring".
    I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
  • rjc9000rjc9000 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,345 Arc User

    NOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooo.....

    *17 pages later*

    ....ooooooooooooooooo!

    So, let me try and translate that:

    I am looking forward to it.

    Yes yes we get it, DC and or CW is bugged to be ultra mega top DPS so we can have the return of the 5x CW.

    What's next, they'll bring back the set bonus on High Vizier and High Prophet alone?

  • auron#6793 auron Member Posts: 325 Arc User
    why are they removing lifesteal and recovery? are they replacing it with something else? i can see this breaking alot of builds.
    <div align="center"><img src="https://i.imgur.com/YH9QCXK.png" alt="" /></div></img>
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    ..../ __ \_________ ______
    .../ / / / ___/ __ `/ ___/
    ../ /_/ / / / /_/ / /__
    /_____/_/ \__'_/\___/
    There is supposed to be an image here, but the hamsters took it.
    <div align="center">AKA Draconis of Luskan</div>

    Maybe it is stupid, but it's also dumb! ~ Patrick Star

    RIP Foundry: On that day, when the sky fell away, our world came to an end. ~Lifelight
  • wemerywemery Member Posts: 190 Arc User


    we will see Soon™
  • wylonuswylonus Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,367 Arc User
    dont forget "Herculoids", wish i could post a pic.
  • greywyndgreywynd Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 6,083 Arc User

    why are they removing lifesteal and recovery? are they replacing it with something else? i can see this breaking alot of builds.

    Recovery to slow down usage of Dailies.

    Lifesteal to make Healing relevant again.
    I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
  • c3rb3r3c3rb3r3 Member Posts: 277 Arc User
    wait and see.

    At least I can suppose GWF will finally have diverse options ...

    inb4 bArBaRiAnS aRe Op pLeAsE nErF
  • c1k4ml3kc3c1k4ml3kc3 Member Posts: 1,257 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    "Players shall be shaken, builds be splintered,
    a 16MOD-day, a red day, ere the Sun rises!"

    Tu ru tu tu tuuu tuuu tuuu tuuuu


    Why the negativity, though? 50% Crit chance to me makes sense. 51% would make it crit always, no? That's how I was raised up on DnD rules since I remember.

    And this was to be expected, too. All your builds are temporary, especially if you micromanage. Things in MMOs change all the time. It is a dynamic, living process that goes back and forth between developers and players.

    50% Deflect chance for players? That's crazy amount. That will get taken down to 25% sooner or later. Otherwise it might be BiS for all those who do not want to bring in any tanks/healers into pt.

    So do the rolls per enemy's Crit Avoidance. So does the name "Barbarian" that's de facto D&D name concept. It also makes sense to make Rogues, Wizards and Ranges the typical DPS-only classes.
    All of that is good on paper, but how will it translate in-game? I doubt that it will be exactly as devs envisioned or proposed here. There will be bugs. There will be adjustments.
    And, yes, this is the same feeling like back in MOD5's end, but I do not see it hitting as hard as MOd6, tbh.
    I, for one, salute developer's note that there won't be increases each mod like "20% less hitting for players and 200% more HP and Hitting for bosses".
    What is frightening is the amount of crit/ca/power which might be needed to fill the cap. 10.000 Crit for 6% chance at a starting point? Holy!
    What is frightening is the way Enchantments might get overhauled, especially those with Life-Steal and Recovery.
    Newer enchantments with CA/CRIT bonuses might be Cryptic's way of hinting us how to prepare for the upcoming mod.

    RNG in fights.

    I don't know, but all of that sounds FUN to me. And I can't wait to tinker around. I understand that some people are afraid of changes and prefer to have a lot of stability as well as that this is a rather unexpected move, but before giving such NEGATIVE COMMENTS, please abstain from trying to find something to QQ about every single time and be just slightly more positive and try to find a solution to a problem. That's what we've been doing all this time, that's what we'll be doing onward after MOD16 hits.

    Thank you.
    True Neutral
    Left the Game due to heavy Damage Control & Missing Spanish Language
  • cdnbisoncdnbison Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 806 Arc User

    why are they removing lifesteal and recovery? are they replacing it with something else? i can see this breaking alot of builds.

    @auron#6793 They explain in the newspost, but TL;DR version:
    Recovery - was hitting a point where Encounter / Daily spam was outnumbering At-will use, which wasn't the intended mechanic. Tough to argue when most DC rotations include "and throw an at-will in somewhere in there."
    Lifesteal - made healing unnecessary, which made two DC trees pretty much useless. Who needs a healer when you can heal yourself?

  • award9award9 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 87 Arc User
    I'm excited to see where all these changes will take NW. I remember Mod 6 and will remain optimistic.
  • c3rb3r3c3rb3r3 Member Posts: 277 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    pitshade said:

    but it won't be a continuation of what we currently have.

    that's, for the least, better
  • jonkocajonkoca Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,586 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    And to think I'd just gotten my build exactly where I wanted it....

    ....at least the runspeed will be good for escaping those lvl 83 goblins.
    No idea what my toon is now.
  • lowjohnlowjohn Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,061 Arc User

    Why the negativity, though? 50% Crit chance to me makes sense. 51% would make it crit always, no? That's how I was raised up on DnD rules since I remember.

    .... uh, how is 51% equal to 100%? And *when* on earth has any version of D&D, even the broken D20 versions, ever said that "crit on 9+(55%) is crit always on every roll"?

    Currently, people stack crit to 100% so that every attack is a critical hit. In Mod16+, this will be capped to 50% (one in two hits is a crit) and will go up and down based on how good your enemy is at avoiding crits.

    50% Deflect chance for players? That's crazy amount. That will get taken down to 25% sooner or later. Otherwise it might be BiS for all those who do not want to bring in any tanks/healers into pt.

    ....uh. I don't think you understand.

    Someone who stacks Deflect out the yingyang, who so outclasses the enemy that they have a Deflect of 22,500 higher than the enemy Accuracy, will, 50% of the time, ignore 50% of the incoming damage.

    (75% of incoming if they're a Rogue and that class feature sticks around)

    That is not "crazy" and it's certainly not going to make you not need a healer.

    What is frightening is the amount of crit/ca/power which might be needed to fill the cap. 10.000 Crit for 6% chance at a starting point? Holy!

    That's for an enemy with 7000 Crit Avoidance - by being 3000 higher, you get +6%.

    Enemies in the new zone will have 16,000 Crit Avoidance. So if you have 16,000 Critical Hit Chance, you get +0% = the base 5%. If you have 20,000 Crit you'll have 4,000 more, so 8%, so a 13% crit chance.

    In order to cap out your critical hit chance at 50%, you'll need 45% * 500 = 22,500 critical MORE THAN their avoidance, so 38,500 Critical Hit Chance against the new mobs in the new zone.

    I don't know, but all of that sounds FUN to me. And I can't wait to tinker around. I understand that some people are afraid of changes and prefer to have a lot of stability as well as that this is a rather unexpected move, but before giving such NEGATIVE COMMENTS, please abstain from trying to find something to QQ about every single time and be just slightly more positive and try to find a solution to a problem. That's what we've been doing all this time, that's what we'll be doing onward after MOD16 hits.

    Here, I agree with you. I'm excited, this sounds like it could be good. It also could be bad. It'll definitely be different.
  • ghoulz66ghoulz66 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,748 Arc User
    Is that a damn joke? 50% crit cap, but you need MORE crit now?
  • emilemoemilemo Member Posts: 1,718 Arc User
    The only thing I rly dont like is having stats in the high thousands. The only stat reaching super high should be HP. Things like 40000 crit or 50000 arm pen are kinda silly imo.
    Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream.
    Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
  • c1k4ml3kc3c1k4ml3kc3 Member Posts: 1,257 Arc User
    lowjohn said:


    .... uh, how is 51% equal to 100%? And *when* on earth has any version of D&D, even the broken D20 versions, ever said that "crit on 9+(55%) is crit always on every roll"?

    If you have a 50% chance to crit, that makes each 2nd hit a Crit. With effective 51% to crit, you already have enough amount to constantly crit since each hit you do will have a 51% chance to succeed against the enemy on each roll. Rolls won't be calculated by purely your math, but math between you and mob. If you can attain 51% to hit a mob with a crit, you are effectievly hitting for 100% crit on each roll. That's how it should be.
    This is more in-tune with DnD rolls and many MMOs than anything else I've seen implemented and I used to talk about this back in the days, too. I'm happy to see it being implemented as it will make builds so much easier to look at.
    lowjohn said:

    Currently, people stack crit to 100% so that every attack is a critical hit. In Mod16+, this will be capped to 50% (one in two hits is a crit) and will go up and down based on how good your enemy is at avoiding crits.

    Perhaps that may be so, but we do not know that yet, unless you have some insight and can say so with such certainty? IF you are certain, then do please share more, I want to hear lol.

    For me things are still at the point of speculation until I can go to preview servers. Same goes for abovementioned quote.
    If what you state is true, then Owlbear cub may be back into action, and powershare, too. Point is - still a speculation.
    lowjohn said:

    That's for an enemy with 7000 Crit Avoidance - by being 3000 higher, you get +6%.
    Enemies in the new zone will have 16,000 Crit Avoidance. So if you have 16,000 Critical Hit Chance, you get +0% = the base 5%. If you have 20,000 Crit you'll have 4,000 more, so 8%, so a 13% crit chance.
    In order to cap out your critical hit chance at 50%, you'll need 45% * 500 = 22,500 critical MORE THAN their avoidance, so 38,500 Critical Hit Chance against the new mobs in the new zone.

    I do not see the problem with what I've stated. Crit/CA will need to be much higher than now in order to be as useful.
    lowjohn said:

    Here, I agree with you. I'm excited, this sounds like it could be good. It also could be bad. It'll definitely be different.

    Glad to hear that. Cheers!
    True Neutral
    Left the Game due to heavy Damage Control & Missing Spanish Language
  • sandukutupusandukutupu Member Posts: 2,253 Arc User
    Here I was about to go shopping in the AH and pick up some of the neat mounts and companions. Epic Phoera has +1000 Recovery on it as an attribute... do you think it will sell now with the uncertain future of it? People who can download Preview better report issues and those who can't better pay attention to forums. I really hope we are not about to get a replay of mod 6, I am hoping for the best. I imagine we should have it to test on Preview sometime next month.
    wb-cenders.gif
  • sgtpostal#4408 sgtpostal Member Posts: 371 Arc User
    my concerns are wht happens with the enchants that give the stats they are removing?? wht gets put in place of said recovery or lifestel stat the enchant gives?
  • lowjohnlowjohn Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,061 Arc User

    lowjohn said:


    .... uh, how is 51% equal to 100%? And *when* on earth has any version of D&D, even the broken D20 versions, ever said that "crit on 9+(55%) is crit always on every roll"?

    If you have a 50% chance to crit, that makes each 2nd hit a Crit. With effective 51% to crit, you already have enough amount to constantly crit since each hit you do will have a 51% chance to succeed against the enemy on each roll. Rolls won't be calculated by purely your math, but math between you and mob. If you can attain 51% to hit a mob with a crit, you are effectievly hitting for 100% crit on each roll. That's how it should be.
    I am completely not following you.

    If you have a 50% crit chance and make 1000 hits, you expect 500 crits.
    If you have a 51% crit chance and make 1000 hits, you expect 510 crits, not 1000.

    I *think* you're assuming that a player is rolling 1d20, needs a 9+ to crit, and also needs that same 9+ to hit (which is a possible degenerate result in badly designed games like D&D3[1]), so if they don't crit, they will miss, thus every hit will be a crit. Is that what you're saying?

    That's not an intuitive or normal result, at all, and it's not even common in D&D: If you have gotten your crit to 9+, you probably hit on a 4 or 5. And you can get to "100% of hits are crits because non-crits are misses" much earlier, too, against some opponents.

    [1]: And doesn't even hold true in D&D3, because then you'd need to roll to confirm the crit and would do a normal non-crit hit on 8-

    lowjohn said:

    Currently, people stack crit to 100% so that every attack is a critical hit. In Mod16+, this will be capped to 50% (one in two hits is a crit) and will go up and down based on how good your enemy is at avoiding crits.

    Perhaps that may be so, but we do not know that yet, unless you have some insight and can say so with such certainty? IF you are certain, then do please share more, I want to hear lol.
    .... it's in the Developer blog post? It's literally spelled out right here?

    " for every 500 rating points you are above your opponent’s opposing rating gains you 1% to a stat.
    Let’s look at an example where you have 10,000 Critical Strike and the opponent has 7,000 Critical Avoidance.
    Critical Chance = (10,000 – 7,000) / 500 = 6%"

    "Critical Strike gets a bonus 5% chance by default. My example up above showed how any given set of opposing ratings work, but since Critical Strike gets a 5% bonus, the player would actually have an 11% chance to crit instead of a 6%."

    "Critical Strike is now capped at 50%."

    "Jared Sears Lead Systems Designer"

    If what you state is true, then Owlbear cub may be back into action, and powershare, too. Point is - still a speculation.

    If you leave your Critical Hit score at 0 then you'll never crit against anyone with at least a 2500 Crit Avoidance, which will be ~100% of level 70+ enemies. That's not speculation, that's in the developer blog. And yeah, I think leaving crit at zero and using an Owlbear Cub might be a really good choice - that IS speculation but certainly seems worth trying.

  • pteriaspterias Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 661 Arc User
    I've been advocating for GWFs being Barbs for years! I'm glad to see the class alignment with 5E.
  • empalasempalas Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 783 Arc User
    cdnbison said:



    Now, if we could just get some sort of confirmation on rumored rAD changes... ;-)

    I forgot that we still had more to go there...

  • drconnor#7239 drconnor Member Posts: 15 Arc User

    Do you think this is to sell us more training tokens? It doesn't bode well, chat in the game is on fire. I looked at the math and it appears to be a global nerf for all classes. CWs and SWs survive on recovery and lifesteal. Maybe they are going to sell bandages? I am not happy to hear level cap raised to 80, I am getting flashbacks to Mod 6 here people. Someone come outside and talk me off the ledge.

    You don't know about the power changes in the new mod? How can you claim his will be a nerf. Relax Francis, It is too early to HAMSTER and moan and complain about a cash grab.
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