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It feels like the devs are "far" from the game.
oxyma
Member Posts: 30 Arc User
And by far i bet they don't even play their game...
I would like to see 5 devs play 1 of these dungeons with the minimum required item lvl and with 1 devoted cleric:
Fangbreaker island
Spellplague Caverne master
Tomb of The Nine Gods
Assault on Svardborg
If the players can't do it then, the devs should show us it's possible... if you can't, make those dungeons free to play and not pay to win.
I would like to see 5 devs play 1 of these dungeons with the minimum required item lvl and with 1 devoted cleric:
Fangbreaker island
Spellplague Caverne master
Tomb of The Nine Gods
Assault on Svardborg
If the players can't do it then, the devs should show us it's possible... if you can't, make those dungeons free to play and not pay to win.
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Comments
To your point, sure, the devs play their game. Do they play every class, 24 hours a day? No, they need to do their jobs and to expect that they are putting in a 40 hour work week, and then spending 4-5 hours in the game to stay at the level of the top players in knowledge and experience....that's not reasonable.
The min required item level does not mean that a group that consists entirely of the minimum level can complete the content. It does not mean that at all and it is never said that it is. It is simply the minimum level you need to get in - the obvious consequence of that is that in most cases, you will be less likely to complete the dungeon and may need others to carry you.
I'm betting you just started recently, and are looking at all the campaigns and the fact that new content is for basically BIS players. I could see why a new player would think it a pay to win game, as that grind does seem extreme (I don't disagree). That said, every game requires you to "catch up" in some way. MMOs are not going to be around long if they simply let you skip years of content.....
Devs that test these dungeons at recommended item levels with 1 Tank and 1 DC are successful because they designed the mechanics and know exactly what to do and when to do it
Both have major advantages over average players, first and foremost being that they know exactly how to build and what to do and they are planning and communicating with each other effectively
Build a group of skilled players that are willing to work at it and practice until they learn the mechanics, and you will feel good about what you accomplished as a team... that's what the content is designed to give you
I am also quite sure that this game does not have any pay walls like some games have. This game is clearly a "Pay for Convenience" game though. Want a full set of Artifact Weapons day one you turn 70, sure you can buy them. But you can also grind for them and not pay a penny. To be transparent here, I have paid money, I enjoy the QoL benefits VIP brings me and I do not want to grind for the AD to transmute into Zen to buy VIP. So I plunk down the cash. But that is a choice not a requirement. I could have done it with AD.
Bottom line for me, I disagree with your point of view. Sorry.
As said, no pay wall in the game. You can speed things up by buying bazillions of AD, but it's pay to accelerate, not to progress.
2. What it has to do with paywalls ? How minimal entrance to a dungeon determines p2w or not?
3. You are not skilled enough to complete it with minimal gear? It's ok most of us aren't. Go farm and progress.
4. Every thread you do is whining. Less whining on the forums is more time spent progressing in the game, you should try that.
Some people choose to ask for help when needed. Try to overcome the challenge ahead of them, or to change their environment when needed. While others complain.
While there is a content gap between CN and FBI that should be plugged with something and RQ seperated for t3 and bellow, if you think that you can pug at 11k tank and go through FBI, you are mistaken, and it's not P2W or paywall as you can overcome this issue with grind, skill or help.
Why do we need 2 devoted cleric to complete the dungeons I mentioned above?
Why can't we complete these dungeons on public queues?
I dont care pay to win, just show me u can do these dungeons with just 1 Devoted Cleric and on Public Queue
Mod edited out SHOUTY caps and edited our rule violation.
Serious answers:
- You don't need 2 DC to complete the dungeons you mentioned above
- You can complete these dungeons on public queue
A1: You can finish the above mentioned dungeon without 2 DC.
A2: If all the 5 random players know what they are doing, they can complete those dungeons.
However, there is some merit in this thread, it is true that, to complete a dungeon at minimum IL, "key" (generally the tank) roles must be played by people who know the dungeon like their own pockets (ie alts of higher IL mains).
And, to be fair, I've never seen 5 12ks do TONG from the public queue, honestly I don't think that is possible. Ras Nsi has a dps check with the souls. DPSers with that low IL can't manage to handle the souls, imho.
Sure 4x 16K could carry a 12K through but that is not realistically going to happen without a privately created carry group which is not the public queue. In essence I think the public Q requirements are misleading. I have seen people say in chat, "Hooray! I made it to 12K, can you take me to Tong now?" That doesn't usually end well unless the character at 12K are also basically built to the meta or the carry group could have run the content without the player to begin with.
I have done all but one of those done with only one cleric, including MSVA. I have not personally seen TONG done that way yet but a DC in my guild has done it for sure. I have done FBI with no cleric and it went fairly well.
I dont think the mix of the group is the only factor, I think it is a combination of things. IL entry requirements are too low, or at least misleading, to be successful in the public Q thus lowering the desire to use it and allowing groups that are not 1DC/1Tank/3DPS to mix and match their own groupings, also lowers the use of the public Q in order to speed up the runs.
Because the players at max level mix and match powers to form an ideal group they can cause content that is hard to clear with a random group to be trivial and then we need harder content and class nerfs. I would much rather see higher IL requirements, the removal of meta combinations and realistic difficulties rather than bosses with a billion HP and class nerfs to drop the so called power creep.
OP - Sunshine: 16000 IL
Casual Dailies
There are things that even two DC can't heal.
And seriously, tell me who of the below 2 groups of people do YOU think they are going to cater to:
Group A - 16-17-18K IL folks who are constantly pushing the envelope to remain at the top, and probably have spent some cash, and who are BEGGING for harder content.
Group B - 11-12k IL players who can't be bothered to gear up and have no interest in spending money..who want the entire game nerfed down so they don't need to progress.
Group A, every time. Sorry. I don't really see this changing.
And BTW, People have SOLOED FBI. People have 5 MAN, 1 rounded Tiamat. If you have a clue, this game is not that hard. But yes, it does take some effort and they are unlikely to nerf things down so that people who aren't willing to put in the effort, can do what tose who do put in the effort can do.
Just that .
Also it is not that was not done before: after mod6 release at least two changes were made to the Hp and outgoing damage of the adds in dungeons.The one was reduce of the damage of the mobs by 66%.And shortly after a week or two ,a new reduce of their damage and increase of their HP(if i rememmber corectly)
The issue actually is that it's a haves and have nots thing, if you're a 14-15K DPS, you don't tend to get invited to the fast ToNGs and nobody wants to spend 3 hours doing it.
I remember an argument like this in an older Cryptic game, which just got ended by a dev explaining they were not going to balance stuff around the equivalent of the 17.5K+s because only a TINY fraction of accounts had one (I can't remember how many zeroes were after the 0. and before the % but it was at least one and I think more).
The problem is that ToNG is end game content, but it also drops stuff that really helps to GET to end game content.
Lets see the Devs do those dungeons with minimum IL characters and 1 DC in the group.
I don't believe they can do it.
All the BS about high level BiS players spending the most on the game is unimportant. Quite frankly I disagree completely with this nonsense thought. The idea that the minority of the gaming community puts in the majority of the money is just total guesswork and an outright fabrication unless you have some company financing records at your disposal.
I'll also say that almost all of the high 16k players I know haven't spent a dime on this game in a very long time since they were smart enough to take advantage of double events, etc to make tons of AD and have no need to put actual money into the game.
Do I know a few guys that dropped $1000+ into the game? Yes. But they are the extreme minority in my experience and more often than not the guys dropping cash are the ones playing catchup.