Also courage breaker needs a cool down like hallowed ground to make it far less attractive for use.
TBH, I think it would not be terrible for the game if all dailies were given this treatment so that any that still have a durational AP lockout could have that removed, and the balance problems of chaining certain dailies is reduced.
Mind you, the intent of the daily with a cooldown is that you still CAN chain it, but this is based on the character having sufficient sources of recovery and cooldown reduction. For example, in a big HE situation, it's no great feat for my average-ish DC to cast back-to-back Hallowed Ground because of paladins on the scene and so forth. I don't quite have the recovery to pull that off when I'm alone.
I'm not sure why it's ok for cb to cause a target to become pseudo "rooted" by reducing a players run speed to 0% through slow stacking. It never used to be this way until a few mods ago when they released SKT after they nerfed ambush rings. Before that you actually could still move, just at a reduced speed so it could be overcome with enough movement speed.
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demonmongerMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,350Arc User
I'm not sure why it's ok for cb to cause a target to become pseudo "rooted" by reducing a players run speed to 0% through slow stacking. It never used to be this way until a few mods ago when they released SKT after they nerfed ambush rings. Before that you actually could still move, just at a reduced speed so it could be overcome with enough movement speed.
thats not true.... bilethorn cloud of steel with artifact slow bonus+ courage breaker = you go no where
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I hate paying taxes! Why must I pay thousands of dollars in taxes when everything I buy is taxed anyways!
I'm not sure why it's ok for cb to cause a target to become pseudo "rooted" by reducing a players run speed to 0% through slow stacking. It never used to be this way until a few mods ago when they released SKT after they nerfed ambush rings. Before that you actually could still move, just at a reduced speed so it could be overcome with enough movement speed.
thats not true.... bilethorn cloud of steel with artifact slow bonus+ courage breaker = you go no where
Yes it is. CB alone at times completely inflicts a person to a run speed of 0%. I've had it happen to me numerous amounts of times. Your only way to move is STUCK IN PLACE and you end up spinning like a merry go round with nowhere to go until the CB debuff is gone. It is a bug that should not be there.
Thanks for the videos. It is hard to tell what other ability is causing you to go to 0 after courage breaker hits. Do you have an idea of what other debuff may be causing the stacking issue?
2
kalina311Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 2,082Arc User
@sgrantdev also reducing courage breaker to 5 seconds from 10 does not help your proposed design philosophy of reducing cc spam in PvP when it can be cast multiple times in succession anyways
as with most powers/ dailies (not just on Tr) It is not the courage break / smoke bomb duration / cc element that is the problem but the frequency that they can be applied ...
I believe the interaction that @theguiido is talking about has something to do with stealth smokebomb slow effect and possibly the artifact weapon cloud of steel feature (25% slowing effect) stacking movement speed down to 0%.
Thanks for the videos. It is hard to tell what other ability is causing you to go to 0 after courage breaker hits. Do you have an idea of what other debuff may be causing the stacking issue?
As @sh00termcl0vin mentioned, It is a combination of the Courage Break slow and a stealth Smoke Bomb. It also occurs with the Cloud of Steel Artifact Power.
It is also worth mentioning that you get CC'd while in Villain's Menace as seen in the videos.
You need to make something with kicks from PvP. Cuz very often players kick other players until they have a strong team.
So this right here, it is seriously annoying how easily you can just sit and kick players in a match never being able to finish the match at all. Especially if you are already in a fight and half half way done with it... Out of nowhere you just get kicked out for no reason EVEN WHEN YOUR TEAM IS WINNING!
The believe the best thing you could of done with the CC issue was make a player totally immune to CC for 5-10 seconds only once they would get a CC power on them. This would give multiple casting (from Trapper built Hunter Rangers and Control Wizard) a better fighting edge.
kalina311Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 2,082Arc User
edited September 2017
I asked the devs if the new global 4 hour kick timer applies to pvp ... and no answer .. i think it does tho only 1 kick allowed every 4 hours ...
Still no changes For CC or any feedback from the devs at all!!
The lastest dev blog for pvp STILLs lists CC as a 15 second cool down ........ no tweaks nothing on our feedback 1 month to go before launch of mod12b and still no word on one of the most controversial changes .. and little time left to put builds on preview to test
Been playing Dps DC in pvp since Mod5, just tested changes with astral shield. and i can tell that DPS DC is DEAD ) i know it wasnt so much of a popular choice) but now its officially DEAD
Literally we got nothing to damage, nothing to defent ourself and nothing to heal with the nurfed healing.
RIP DPS DC.
p.s. - i hope Devs will revert the astral shield back to what it is now on Live.
As mentioned in some previous posts, I strongly believe that the recovery stat needs a cap. Most of the CC problems are a direct result of classes running over 100% or more cooldown reduction in conjunction with artifacts such as the sigil of the devoted, which substantially increases AP gain. Placing a cap of some sort on recovery will make it more difficult for classes like TR to abuse smoke bomb and courage breaker. With a recovery hard cap, we probably would not even need to have these CC changes proposed by the developer.
Shadow of Demise needs to be looked into. There are certain TR builds where it can easily do more than 200,000 damage. It almost looks like shadow of demise is procing off of smoke bomb, which is usually preceded by courage breaker and followed by blood bath.
I have pasted a link to a YouTube video demonstrating the TR build. The players name in this video is RecoveRyu, ironically. When watching this video, please note how quickly he is able to build up his AP and spam smoke bomb, courage breaker, and blood bath. Count how many blood baths and courage breakers this player was able to use in this match. You should also notice how Shadow of Demise is destroying everyone. Even the player that recorded this titled the video, "Most Broken Build, Trickster Rogue."
I rewatched the video I tagged above in my previous post. I counted at least 39 dailies used by the TR in that single match (courage breaker + blood bath). I hope that this brings to light some of the imbalances as it relates to recovery and TRs. Thanks.
Sorry, I didn't read the prior 9 pages. I just wanted to comment that CW took major DPS nerfs because "we're supposed to be controllers / support function". Then all the bosses got control immunity, and now PVPers get control immunity. What exactly are we supposed to control? Are we really the trash men of the dungeons?
Here's a good test whether a change is sane: if you applied it to the equivalent feature of another class, does it make sense? For example, if we added the same 'diminishing returns' to healing, melee damage and ranged damage, would that make the game more fun? If you've been healed, next heal doesn't work so well...4th hit from GWF does 0 damage? Rogue invisibility distance shrinks on each hide?
Heh. Watch the 'disagree' button light up. Let me guess 'CW dosen't require any skill'...heh.
Comments
Mind you, the intent of the daily with a cooldown is that you still CAN chain it, but this is based on the character having sufficient sources of recovery and cooldown reduction. For example, in a big HE situation, it's no great feat for my average-ish DC to cast back-to-back Hallowed Ground because of paladins on the scene and so forth. I don't quite have the recovery to pull that off when I'm alone.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
5 seconds is enough time for the spammers to spam again.
But for those of us that don't do the spam.. we suffer....
It's like banning people who don't bot and letting botters bot freely...
Guardian Fighter
TLO
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1221446/the-future-of-the-gf/p1 Existing Problems Still In The Guardian Fighter
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/comment/12984912m
Feat Changes I'd like to see in The Guardian Fighter
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https://xboxclips.com/The+Guiido/d949ab39-8faa-4d0c-81ff-81650e3eb021
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https://xboxclips.com/The+Guiido/df04134e-e6d5-46c4-858e-fa7ca4434da0
Guardian Fighter
TLO
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1221446/the-future-of-the-gf/p1 Existing Problems Still In The Guardian Fighter
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/comment/12984912m
Feat Changes I'd like to see in The Guardian Fighter
as with most powers/ dailies (not just on Tr) It is not the courage break / smoke bomb duration / cc element that is the problem but the frequency that they can be applied ...
I believe the interaction that @theguiido is talking about has something to do with stealth smokebomb slow effect and possibly the artifact weapon cloud of steel feature (25% slowing effect) stacking movement speed down to 0%.
As @sh00termcl0vin mentioned, It is a combination of the Courage Break slow and a stealth Smoke Bomb. It also occurs with the Cloud of Steel Artifact Power.
It is also worth mentioning that you get CC'd while in Villain's Menace as seen in the videos.
Guardian Fighter
TLO
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1221446/the-future-of-the-gf/p1 Existing Problems Still In The Guardian Fighter
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/comment/12984912m
Feat Changes I'd like to see in The Guardian Fighter
The believe the best thing you could of done with the CC issue was make a player totally immune to CC for 5-10 seconds only once they would get a CC power on them. This would give multiple casting (from Trapper built Hunter Rangers and Control Wizard) a better fighting edge.
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only 1 kick allowed every 4 hours ...
Still no changes For CC or any feedback from the devs at all!!
The lastest dev blog for pvp STILLs lists CC as a 15 second cool down ........ no tweaks nothing on our feedback
1 month to go before launch of mod12b and still no word on one of the most controversial changes .. and little time left to put builds on preview to test
I was thinking the same. Why not ALL dailies have such a long CD like HG does? Its a DAILY power, shouldnt be used every second
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Casual Dailies
Lets see now europe time zone.
xm things seem better we see 10 poeple in rivenscar.
and 10 poeple in hotenow.
impressed that beats the 0 rivenscar 0 hotenow us time zone.
Literally we got nothing to damage, nothing to defent ourself and nothing to heal with the nurfed healing.
RIP DPS DC.
p.s. - i hope Devs will revert the astral shield back to what it is now on Live.
Shadow of Demise needs to be looked into. There are certain TR builds where it can easily do more than 200,000 damage. It almost looks like shadow of demise is procing off of smoke bomb, which is usually preceded by courage breaker and followed by blood bath.
I have pasted a link to a YouTube video demonstrating the TR build. The players name in this video is RecoveRyu, ironically. When watching this video, please note how quickly he is able to build up his AP and spam smoke bomb, courage breaker, and blood bath. Count how many blood baths and courage breakers this player was able to use in this match. You should also notice how Shadow of Demise is destroying everyone. Even the player that recorded this titled the video, "Most Broken Build, Trickster Rogue."
Here's a good test whether a change is sane: if you applied it to the equivalent feature of another class, does it make sense? For example, if we added the same 'diminishing returns' to healing, melee damage and ranged damage, would that make the game more fun? If you've been healed, next heal doesn't work so well...4th hit from GWF does 0 damage? Rogue invisibility distance shrinks on each hide?
Heh. Watch the 'disagree' button light up. Let me guess 'CW dosen't require any skill'...heh.