I think you guys are sore crazy to put any kind nerf to TRs right now. I don't play much 70s PvP BECAUSE I'm farming ADs and Glory from 60-69 PvP, of which I have a DC, HAd a GWF, GF, OP, TR, had a HR and DC.
Bearing in mind even in 60-69 PvP with 21k Power going full 1shot, anyone who isn't a pug basically isn't one-shottable period.
My other toons have never been 1shot by a TR because the damage flatlines at 90k. Pretty much all DCs, SWs, GWFs, OPs and HRs have between 99-125k HP in 60-69, CWs shield mitigates the daily damage.
And ffs, 90% of the time it misses anyway! Honestly if I were to put across a fails montage on YouTube for all the times I went to his SE and missed or had it dodged, just from PvPing lvl 60-61, it would be HOURS long.
The only people I ever 1shot in this PvP bracket are noobs, pugs, or people who forget to dodge or get pinned down by debuffs and CC (But to be honest EVERY class does stupid damage when we gank people so who cares if SE does as well? You'd die anyway).
But onto the thing that should be worrying, me and a couple mates heard about this and thought "Okay let's have a look at some other dailies and rotations and see what works". The best damage we could do on single rotation was 150k (in 6 second burst) as opposed to 300k otherwise. We fought a OP who died only when we both hit SE (shields and stuff and he had like 130k HP), who was now unkillable even with 2 TRs with debuffs, a GF, CW and DC.
My point is, you think you're doing yourself a huge favor by nerfing this ability, but for regular gameplay that is PvP spec vs PvP Spec games the SE performs as expected. Only when debuffed or fighting pugs or ganking do TRs 1shot anybody. If this is different in 70s PvP then hazzar good for you. But that doesn't negate the fact that for every other form of PvP you're transforming the class into another CW. But single target. And without the TAB shield.
I really have no problem if they decide to buff other skills. Like honestly Duelists Flurry underperforms in PvP (PvE it's fine). So do all those abilities that nobody uses like Shadow Strike (unless you're Sabo). What I think they should have done to fix this all along is change the way the SE works, rather than the way Piercing Damage works.
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Also, the Feat Shadow of Demise that contributes to exactly 1/3 of a TRs damage with SE (unerfed) is also receiving a penalty here because it does piercing equal to 50% of the damage you just did over the last 6 seconds after hitting an encounter (some encounters not all) from stealth.
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Just accept that you're wrong and that in a month's time the same people upset with this will be upset with being 1shot by GF.
@bvira that guy is the one who suggested that SE should ignore CW and GF shields and bases his suggestions mostly from a level 60 - 69 pvp experience o.O he also said something like "GF shield can mitigate SE but just a bit as it blocks incoming damage from the front but SE hits from above" xD
6 mods of Shocking-BS is enough imho, I really can´t find any sympathy for those crying about it. No matter what happens, this class will go on overperforming in PVP, so dry your tears and look forward.
Just prepare for more CB spam. But who isn't already used to it by now.
it was harder to kill with a shocking execution. I have played many times with rogues and they prefered to use courage breaker which is the only daily you cant avoid . And now they will have just that because previous the point was to slow your enemy and do a shocking. Now a rogue what will do courage and then better do not hit enemy because he will get heal from deflection ( if use duelist flurry)>
Just prepare for more CB spam. But who isn't already used to it by now.
it was harder to kill with a shocking execution. I have played many times with rogues and they prefered to use courage breaker which is the only daily you cant avoid . And now they will have just that because previous the point was to slow your enemy and do a shocking. Now a rogue what will do courage and then better do not hit enemy because he will get heal from deflection ( if use duelist flurry)>
Honestly Im not so sure about that point either. Spamming daily after daily is pretty broken gameplay too.
Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
> @xsayajinx1 said: > I will still complain about ITC because I fought on preview a TR with 27k (30k+ buffed) recovery that can chain ITC, smokebomb + CB back to back. There is no window to attack, there is no window to escape from smokebomb because before the 1st SB is down the 2nd is already set. > There is no way to attack because all you see is a black TR and you move like a snail (also you are perma dazed) > > I prefered to fight TRs that were able to deal some good burst damage. > > But I guess this change will force TRs to go as CCancerous as possible.
I agree 110% with you. I am tired of going against a TR and not be able to attack at all while a smokebomb is down. Trying to get out of the smoke very slow only to walk into another smokebomb..... it is getting really old and annoying.
I'm no expert in stats or classes, but in my pvp exp TR and HR played and stated properly can nuke most classes. The effective TR I see never jump in the fight, always playing the situation, and smoke bomb stunlock and drop you quickly. HR done properly will out maneuver, trap, dps and heal up faster before your first hit. The classes seem very situational as neither can face tank. Pick your battles I suppose.
@i540thlonewiso Be aware oft the "New" TR in mod 12. Those guys run up to 80% deflectchance combined with 85% deflectseverity... Even if you land a hit it doesn't matter Due to Boons, insignia- and setboni deflection becomes a broken stat somehow. No CC, no damage and tons of deflection DPS same as HP regain on deflect. There will be no PVP with all that power-<font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> tbh.
In all honestly, I'm hearing a lot of "BUT I CAN'T KILL CERTAIN PEOPLE 1V1 ANY MORE!"... Well, tough luck. Time to change your perspective.
Playing a support class you realize one thing - you aren't ever going to be killing BiS types, or even equivalently geared types, in PvP. That being said, without killing many people at all, you can be a match's MVP. Rogues can kill people post patch - maybe not 1 v 1 VS top geared competition of certain classes, but they still can bring some damage which will either kill people or tip the scale on a tough target in a mixed battle. This in itself is an asset. On top of they, they have some *very* powerful CC abilities which can be tide turners in a pitched node battle if used by an intelligent player. A lot of rogues are so fixated on their *obviously* broken one shot potential that they can't see they are playing a class that has some awesome utility abilities in PvP. Again, time to change your perspective, and stop thinking about one-shotting and start thinking about using some of your nasty CC to turn the tides at node battles.
Many rogues, right now, are complaining because they can't one shot any more. Well, maybe it's time to look past your ability to be DPS 1V1 one shot bros and look at what you can add to a team's win chances. Yes you're a DPS class, but you bring a lot more to the table - and let me tell you, a good rogue is someone I bloody *hate* being in a match whether I'm playing my DC or my GF, even aside from their one shot potential.
Just scrap the TR completely and let me trade my TR for a HR. Apparently the TRs in PvP are unstoppable and the complete opposite in Pve. Honestly im tired of these PvP nerfs messing with my pve build. and reading all these overpowered complaints do not sound good at all for pve. It sounds like you're trying to remove the only thing the TRs have going in pve the utility of smoke and cb. Lowering the time on cb would destroy the move in pve. The list goes on.... reading the TR PvP forum page gives me a headache. :[
they need to nerf CB obviously, let them nerf it till ground butttt also nerf Smoke Bomb and plssss
buff more our dps on some atwills and dailys, which makes us choose daze strike and another dps dailys like lurkers or bb.
buff dazing strike which is really hard to predict on combat, and deserve high dps really.
let the eazy peazy trs who plays with smoke bomb and lock down all combo from enemy team, let them die, and give out trs who actually 7x24 fight with enemy with a chance of missing some encounter,
Comments
I don't play much 70s PvP BECAUSE I'm farming ADs and Glory from 60-69 PvP, of which I have a DC, HAd a GWF, GF, OP, TR, had a HR and DC.
Bearing in mind even in 60-69 PvP with 21k Power going full 1shot, anyone who isn't a pug basically isn't one-shottable period.
My other toons have never been 1shot by a TR because the damage flatlines at 90k. Pretty much all DCs, SWs, GWFs, OPs and HRs have between 99-125k HP in 60-69, CWs shield mitigates the daily damage.
And ffs, 90% of the time it misses anyway! Honestly if I were to put across a fails montage on YouTube for all the times I went to his SE and missed or had it dodged, just from PvPing lvl 60-61, it would be HOURS long.
The only people I ever 1shot in this PvP bracket are noobs, pugs, or people who forget to dodge or get pinned down by debuffs and CC (But to be honest EVERY class does stupid damage when we gank people so who cares if SE does as well? You'd die anyway).
But onto the thing that should be worrying, me and a couple mates heard about this and thought "Okay let's have a look at some other dailies and rotations and see what works". The best damage we could do on single rotation was 150k (in 6 second burst) as opposed to 300k otherwise.
We fought a OP who died only when we both hit SE (shields and stuff and he had like 130k HP), who was now unkillable even with 2 TRs with debuffs, a GF, CW and DC.
My point is, you think you're doing yourself a huge favor by nerfing this ability, but for regular gameplay that is PvP spec vs PvP Spec games the SE performs as expected. Only when debuffed or fighting pugs or ganking do TRs 1shot anybody. If this is different in 70s PvP then hazzar good for you. But that doesn't negate the fact that for every other form of PvP you're transforming the class into another CW. But single target. And without the TAB shield.
I really have no problem if they decide to buff other skills. Like honestly Duelists Flurry underperforms in PvP (PvE it's fine). So do all those abilities that nobody uses like Shadow Strike (unless you're Sabo). What I think they should have done to fix this all along is change the way the SE works, rather than the way Piercing Damage works.
================================================
Also, the Feat Shadow of Demise that contributes to exactly 1/3 of a TRs damage with SE (unerfed) is also receiving a penalty here because it does piercing equal to 50% of the damage you just did over the last 6 seconds after hitting an encounter (some encounters not all) from stealth.
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Just accept that you're wrong and that in a month's time the same people upset with this will be upset with being 1shot by GF.
Mod 12.5 PvP Power/Crit/Arp Optimization
Youtube channel (PvE/PvP)
No matter what happens, this class will go on overperforming in PVP, so dry your tears and look forward.
> TR was and will be strongest class in PVP so i wouldn't be worry
I think the HR can give a TR a good fight now. Might even be the better class since the revamp to HR.
Taylor DC/DO & AC Buff/Debuff - Guild Gutbusters Brigade - PVE
And now they will have just that because previous the point was to slow your enemy and do a shocking. Now a rogue what will do courage and then better do not hit enemy because he will get heal from deflection ( if use duelist flurry)>
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
> I will still complain about ITC because I fought on preview a TR with 27k (30k+ buffed) recovery that can chain ITC, smokebomb + CB back to back. There is no window to attack, there is no window to escape from smokebomb because before the 1st SB is down the 2nd is already set.
> There is no way to attack because all you see is a black TR and you move like a snail (also you are perma dazed)
>
> I prefered to fight TRs that were able to deal some good burst damage.
>
> But I guess this change will force TRs to go as CCancerous as possible.
I agree 110% with you. I am tired of going against a TR and not be able to attack at all while a smokebomb is down. Trying to get out of the smoke very slow only to walk into another smokebomb..... it is getting really old and annoying.
Be aware oft the "New" TR in mod 12.
Those guys run up to 80% deflectchance combined with 85% deflectseverity...
Even if you land a hit it doesn't matter
Due to Boons, insignia- and setboni deflection becomes a broken stat somehow.
No CC, no damage and tons of deflection DPS same as HP regain on deflect.
There will be no PVP with all that power-<font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> tbh.
Playing a support class you realize one thing - you aren't ever going to be killing BiS types, or even equivalently geared types, in PvP. That being said, without killing many people at all, you can be a match's MVP. Rogues can kill people post patch - maybe not 1 v 1 VS top geared competition of certain classes, but they still can bring some damage which will either kill people or tip the scale on a tough target in a mixed battle. This in itself is an asset. On top of they, they have some *very* powerful CC abilities which can be tide turners in a pitched node battle if used by an intelligent player. A lot of rogues are so fixated on their *obviously* broken one shot potential that they can't see they are playing a class that has some awesome utility abilities in PvP. Again, time to change your perspective, and stop thinking about one-shotting and start thinking about using some of your nasty CC to turn the tides at node battles.
Many rogues, right now, are complaining because they can't one shot any more. Well, maybe it's time to look past your ability to be DPS 1V1 one shot bros and look at what you can add to a team's win chances. Yes you're a DPS class, but you bring a lot more to the table - and let me tell you, a good rogue is someone I bloody *hate* being in a match whether I'm playing my DC or my GF, even aside from their one shot potential.
buff more our dps on some atwills and dailys, which makes us choose daze strike and another dps dailys like lurkers or bb.
buff dazing strike which is really hard to predict on combat, and deserve high dps really.
let the eazy peazy trs who plays with smoke bomb and lock down all combo from enemy team, let them die, and give out trs who actually 7x24 fight with enemy with a chance of missing some encounter,