test content
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc

TR Compiled Balance Suggestions

sirjimbofrancissirjimbofrancis Member Posts: 348 Arc User
After discussing and polishing suggestions in the first thread we decided to create a new thread to more easily keep track and simplify these suggestions for the devs. As explained in old thread, Trickster Rogue (TR) class is encountering many issues and it has been long since the class has been adjusted and because of that it doesnt scale well with content and falls short when it comes to competing with other classes. Thanks to everyone involved in the ongoing discussion! Please continue suggestions there so we can keep this one easily readable.

Known Bugs:

Stealth - When Soulforged activates under the effect of Lurker's Assault our Stealth gets stuck and will not recharge unless we change instance or relog.

Duelist's Flurry Bleeds - When Bleeds are re-applied only the timer is refreshed. Damage from the Bleeds is not refreshed to benefit from buffs of the moment when they were re-applied. This causes the Bleeds not to receive buffs such as Demon Lord's Immortality set and many other which were not active when Bleeds were applied the first time. Are the Bleeds separated when applied to same target, or do all TRs share the same stack?

Also, currently Bleeds stack to 11 instead fo 10. We dont know if this was a intended hidden buff, but Bleed icon and ACT show different numbers.

Also, the number of bleed ticks after the bleed is applied seems to be random. For example, with two bleeds, we got 5 ticks. With one bleed, we got 7 ticks. With one rotation (about 5 bleeds), we got anywhere from 9-11 ticks. The word "random" really ought to be in the tooltip a lot...;)

Duelist's Flurry (DF) - The ability is unforgiving, with lag, particularly. But, whatever is causing it, the hits of the Flurry part, which are supposed to apply Bleeds, are skipping and when that happens, fewer bleeds are applied. The maximum number of hits in a full DF is 9, but as shown in a screenshot in the old thread, it drops to as few as 2.

Shadow of Demise (SoD) - This capstone in Executioner tree doesn't register the owner correctly. If more than one TR applies SoD to the same target only one TR gets the credit for the damage. Also, during the SoD 6 seconds up time, some damage is not calculated in. For example, weapon enchantment except Vorpal and damage from Aura of Courage.

Impossible to Catch (ITC) - If struck as it is enabled or if pressed in conjunction with a dodge, ITC will fail to work although it will go on cool down.

Path of the Blade (PotB) - This power does NOT proc weapon enchantments or the owlbear cub.

Bait and Switch (BnS) - The bait doesn’t hold agro.

Smoke Bomb (SB) - This power does NOT proc weapon enchantments, and does NOT grant Combat Advantage against enemies under control from it. Also, it’s buggy with its interactions with Feytouched. Sometimes it will proc the +18% damage, and sometimes not. Also, it is buggy when dealing damage to test dummies as it stops hitting them altogether after a short time.

Shadowborn - This feat states that it is buffing our next attack, however any damage is calculated as the next attack including at will hits, Bleed ticks or Smoke Bomb ticks. Due to this it is wasted most of the time.

One with the Shadows - This Saboteur capstone is stacking and buffing Dailies where it is supposed to work only with encounters.

Vengeance's Pursuit (VP) - This encounter can be activated many times if the button is pressed fast.

Razor Action (RA) - We're not sure if this is intended, but this class feature is dealing piercing damage. It is also double proccing.

Tab Mechanic (Stealth) Issue:

The stealth mechanic is the primary TR skill, and it has a unique problem. Although, the main advantage granted by stealth is automatic critical strike and combat advantage, it doesn't last long enough for TRs to abandon allocating points in critical strike, because a high percentage of TR damage comes from attacks performed outside of stealth. This creates a situation where stealth provides very little in PVE since most of time TRs already have combat advantage, and already have a high critical strike percentage. Because of this, the TR's tab mechanic grants the smallest advantage when compared to every other class in PVE content.

Proposed Stealth Solutions:

As of now, stealth adds 100% critical chance as a direct rating modifier. For example, when the stealth button is pressed, a TR with a 70% critical chance will then have a 170% critical chance. Obviously, 170% critical chance is in no way better than 100%.

This suggestion originally outlined in this post by @hoperuby, offered an interesting solution. In short, it suggests taking the extra percentage in stealth over 100%, and add that to the critical severity percentage. So a player with 70% crit would receive 70% crit severity when they enter stealth. A more simple solution would be to simply add 50% crit severity while using stealth. This also allows a nice scaling as it will help lower leveled and lower geared TRs much more than BIS TRs.
Lilia Drakon - PVE Executioner TR
She Looked Lvl 18

Here is my Blog

Comments

  • sirjimbofrancissirjimbofrancis Member Posts: 348 Arc User
    edited May 2017
    At-will: Duelist's Flurry (DF):

    The biggest proportion of the damage TRs do in PVE comes from duelist's flurry. Depending on the build, even conservatively, it accounts for greater than 30% of TR's overall damage. Some bosses like FBI (Drufi and Hati), or mSVA, or 2nd boss in mSP, either move a lot, or appear for short phases of time, limiting the effectiveness of this power. No other class is as handicapped with their at-wills, and consequently their damage, as TRs are by this mechanic.

    The reason for this problem is because it takes long time to set up a full stack of bleeds on a target (about 3 flurries). In addition, the randomness of the flurry bleed stacking, as outlined in the known bugs section, makes it much more difficult, when compared to other classes, to have a single rotation. It forces TRs to try to watch for the stack numbers, which is nearly impossible with the tiny text in the moving debuff list. Also, the length of the mechanic is unforgiving for mistakes or extended dodges. For example, if the TR is caught in ice, the full bleed is not applied. Or, if the TR dodges too far, or makes a rotation mistake, the full bleed is not applied.

    Our suggestion is to make a single flurry add all 10 stacks of bleed. This makes adding bleeds not a "chance", but a reliable system. This allows TRs to have higher overall burst, less time to set up the damage, and an easier mechanic as TRs can make a fixed rotation.

    Another suggestion is to change 10 bleeds into one single Bleed which is damage wise equal to current 10(11). Any hit of the Flurry can apply it and once applied it doesn't stack.

    Also to prevent the skipping Flurry hits issue we are suggesting to reduce number of Flurry hits from 9 to 3 and triple their damage to make it even, animation time would stay the same. This will also be useful for another suggestion we have for Razor Action.

    Whisperknife (WK) Issues:

    The biggest challenge the Whisperknife Path has is that it doesn’t have access to the excellent passive powers available to Master Infiltrators, namely Invisible Infiltrator and Infiltrator’s action. If they could have a passive power or other source to grant a similar buff, that would go a long way to making this paragon path on equal footing to MIs.

    Advantageous Position - After activating a Daily power you gain CA and increase Deflect chance by 20% and Damage resistance by 30% for 6 seconds.

    Razor Action (RA) - Similar to GWF's Unstoppable, this class feature should make WK close to Master Infiltrator (MI). Increase attack speed for 6 seconds after Daily activation. We don't have a precise number of the speed % increase in mind, but it should be equal to a 20% damage increase, or just grant 20% damage buff after the Daily for 6 seconds if the first suggestion is too complicated. Also, this is why DF reduction of Flurry hits would be useful. It's already fast and this would make it faster.

    Dagger Threat (DT) - Increases ranged damage (21'+ range) and reduces melee damage (under 20' range). Suggested number to increase was 50% and melee reduction was 20%.This suggestion requires Vengeance's Pursuit (VP) bug to be fixed otherwise it is too much.


    Feat Trees: Saboteur Suggestions

    Grinning Steel - Increase crit from 5% to 10% for attacks from behind.

    Gutterborn's touch - Change current power Power increase from 10% to 20%.

    Ambusher's Haste - Change damage increase from 25% to 30% while in Stealth. This bonus diminishes as your Stealth meter drains.


    Feat Trees: Scoundrel Suggestions

    The biggest challenge the Scoundrel tree has in PVE is that the top feat is useless against enemies immune to control effects. At end game, that’s mostly all bosses, and some mobs, too.

    Skullcracker – Every 15 seconds the next encounter activates Skullcracker effect. Skullcracker effect: Increase damage done by 30% and speed increase of 15% for 7 seconds. The same encounter which activates Skullcracker also dazes the target for 4 seconds. Your attacks extend this daze by additional 0.5 seconds up to a maximum of 2 additional seconds.

    Savage Blows - Dealing damage to foes increases Life steal and Damage by 1% for 3 seconds. Stacks up to 5 times.

    Low Blows - Deal 40% more damage to foes who are affected by Control effects.


    Feat Trees: Executioner Suggestions

    Shadows of Demise (SoD) - The problem with this capstone feat is that it doesn't have a chance to proc in highly geared parties, because most things die in less than 6 seconds. This makes the executioner path not scale well into Endgame BIS.

    One solution is to make SoD work in 1 sec ticks after the initial proc, and extend SoD an extra second. This way, it applies the extra 50% damage accumulated each second at the end of each second for the duration of SoD. So, for the 7 seconds SoD lasts, it will be 7 ticks. Another option is 3 ticks total, 2 seconds each.

    A more simple option would be to grant a flat +50% damage for 6 seconds from when SoD is procced. This is essentially what it does now, only on a 6 second delay and with piercing damage. This would be an easier option if the other two are too difficult to implement.

    Shadowborn - This top tear feat is easily wasted on a single at will hit, bleed, smoke bomb tick or any attack. This makes it impossible to use consistently after the first attack in combat. Change this feat so entering stealth gives you 100% power for 2 seconds.

    Deathknell and Last Moments - These are much less useful than they seem, because most things die too quickly. One ice knife or IBS and your points in these feats are useless. In addition, since the introduction of the Orcus set, which operates similarly to these feats, and most endgame DPSers are using now, they have become even less useful.

    Both of these feats should start at 1% damage increase and reach maximum of 25%, Deathknell reaching the maximum when the enemy is at 30% HP, Last moments reaching it at 40% of targets HP.

    Dying Breath / Twisted Grin - The "died near you" / "killed by you" feats create a situation where it forces the TR to run fast to the next mob pack to use the buff from the last dead mob before it expires which Makes it a formula race and not a dungeon crawl. These are also useless for most bosses as most bosses don't have any mobs at all.

    Every feat can't be great, but if we tied these to doing a crit, being in stealth, having combat advantage, or some other mechanic, it would help make these much more useful.

    Lilia Drakon - PVE Executioner TR
    She Looked Lvl 18

    Here is my Blog
  • sirjimbofrancissirjimbofrancis Member Posts: 348 Arc User
    edited May 2017
    Power Suggestions:

    Blitz: Add an additional 5% damage buff for 5 seconds to its current effect, when used from Stealth.

    Lashing Blade: Reduce cooldown by 1 sec per rank.

    Wicked reminder: TRs need a buff/debuff that is more useful with parties so they will have more utility in groups. Right now, WR applies a debuff which is limited by the defense reduction cap which means when compared to debuffs from other classes, it has limited use as the cap can be reached so easily, that there isn't a consistent need for it.
    Our solution is to make this encounter have 3 charges, where each charge gives a 10% damage bonus for the party, instead of a defense reduction. Stealth applies 3 charges. When 3 charges are applied to target the buff lasts 6 seconds and has a maximum +30% damage bonus regardless of the number of WR hits applied after the 30% is reached.

    Talisman of Shadows: Additionally to current effect increases your Life steal by 5%.

    Oppressive Darkness: Damage it deals should be doubled.

    Tenacious Concealment - Rank 4 of this power prevents Stealth regeneration from being affected by incoming damage when out of Stealth. While in Stealth incoming damage should still consume Stealth as it already does.

    General increase in attack speed animations for all slow clunky abilities, check page 8 and 9 in old thread for detailed explanation why speed increase is needed.

    Other suggestions:

    Battlewise heroic feat renamed into Fatal Wounds - Your Bleeds apply a stacking debuff (max 10/20/30 stacks) to targets reducing their healing from all sources by 1% per stack. In PvE targets affected by this debuff take 2/4/6% more damage from you. Each second only 1 stack can be applied.

    In PvE enemies should not be able to see TRs in Stealth until TR starts dealing damage.


    A note about PvP:

    Armor Penetration is not very effective currently for PvP TRs so a suggestion to add Resistance Ignored to STR or DEX might make it work.

    Due to all other suggestions Shocking Execution (SE) would be too powerful so it needs to be taken under the loupe and adjusted accordingly. One of the suggestions was to put a limit on max damage it can deal to 90% of targets Max HP but we couldnt agree on that one. Another suggestion was to make current SE respect Tenacity.
    SE as physical damage suggestion - Base damage to be at least by 50% higher compared to Lashing blade. The ability animation stays the same as it is now, maybe a bit faster. The ability deals 50% lower damage to targets above 50% HP (almost removes the buff it can get from First Strike) and it deals 50% higher damage to targets under 50% HP. For 10 seconds after activation increases your run speed by 10% and reduces AP gain by 50%.

    Courage Breaker (CB) - Debuff duration versus players should be lowered.



    Link to old thread - https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1229772/trickster-rogue-class-balance-suggestions/p1

    Please keep discussing and suggesting in the old thread.

    @terramak
    @dreadnaught#5263
    @chaidrin#2320
    @nitocris83
    @asterdahl
    @mimicking#6533

    To the great TRs that have helped to put all this together, Thank You!! To the devs, and on behalf of all those same TRs, Thank you for reading our suggestions!
    Lilia Drakon - PVE Executioner TR
    She Looked Lvl 18

    Here is my Blog
  • sirjimbofrancissirjimbofrancis Member Posts: 348 Arc User
    Placeholder
    Lilia Drakon - PVE Executioner TR
    She Looked Lvl 18

    Here is my Blog
  • sirjimbofrancissirjimbofrancis Member Posts: 348 Arc User
    I should have said but @blur#5900 deserves most of the credit for this compilation. We all owe him a big thanks!
    Lilia Drakon - PVE Executioner TR
    She Looked Lvl 18

    Here is my Blog
  • blur#5900 blur Member Posts: 490 Arc User
    @sirjimbofrancis Thank you, all i did was collect the suggestions which seemed to be agreed on. I hope i included them all, my apologies if i missed something.
    Everyone did a great job and these suggestions have grown and improved a lot and are hopefully of use to the devs when they decide to adjust the TR class.
    image
  • trgluestickztrgluestickz Member Posts: 1,136 Arc User
    edited May 2017
    blur#5900 said:

    @sirjimbofrancis Thank you, all i did was collect the suggestions which seemed to be agreed on. I hope i included them all, my apologies if i missed something.
    Everyone did a great job and these suggestions have grown and improved a lot and are hopefully of use to the devs when they decide to adjust the TR class.

    @sirjimbofrancis @blur

    Nice job,

    I have posted 5 posts in the old thread that contain needed updates, corrections, other bugs, and good suggestions that were not included in this post. I would like you two to take a look at them and add them to these posts.
    --
    PVP Rogue,
    --[----- "Your friendly neighborhood spawn of Satan." -----]--
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    Main Character: Hurricane Marigolds (Rogue WK & Assassin)
    Ingame Handle: trgluestickz
    Discord Name: Hurricane🌀Marigolds#2563
    Guilds: She Looked LVL 18 & Essence of Aggression
    Alliances: Imperium & Order of the Silent Shroud
    Platform: PC
  • demonmongerdemonmonger Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,350 Arc User
    Shadow strike damage should be increased, it also does not grant combat advantage on daze.

    There are a few correction that need to be made in the list of explanations and fixes as well... not all of the info is 100% correct
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    I hate paying taxes! Why must I pay thousands of dollars in taxes when everything I buy is taxed anyways!
  • thegurupandit#0671 thegurupandit Member Posts: 22 Arc User
    +10
    >:) Life is like a train journey. Someone gets in, someone gets off and someone switches the wagon > :)
  • trgluestickztrgluestickz Member Posts: 1,136 Arc User
    edited May 2017

    Shadow strike damage should be increased, it also does not grant combat advantage on daze.



    There are a few correction that need to be made in the list of explanations and fixes as well... not all of the info is 100% correct

    I agree, there are a few mistakes and quite a lot of stuff that didn't get put in yet.

    I'm not sure why you want to give shadowstrike a damage upgrade though, its meant to be a pure utility power, not something you are suposed to kill things with. I did sugest a speed increase for it though, its a little slow.

    As for your mention of CA daze issues, I've requested the following correction and expansion:

    The section on smoke bomb mentions that the daze does not apply combat advantage. This is actually part of a larger issue with TR dazes in general. It is listed in the new post as being smoke bomb specific and the other dazes subject to this issue are not mentioned. Dazing strike is the only TR daze that applies combat advantage. It is really important that all TR dazes be changed to once again grant combat advantage. This problem includes TR feats with daze effects, its not just passives and powers.

    There is plenty more where this came from in the 5 posts I placed in the old thread.
    --
    PVP Rogue,
    --[----- "Your friendly neighborhood spawn of Satan." -----]--
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    Main Character: Hurricane Marigolds (Rogue WK & Assassin)
    Ingame Handle: trgluestickz
    Discord Name: Hurricane🌀Marigolds#2563
    Guilds: She Looked LVL 18 & Essence of Aggression
    Alliances: Imperium & Order of the Silent Shroud
    Platform: PC
  • trgluestickztrgluestickz Member Posts: 1,136 Arc User
    @sirjimbofrancis @blur

    I have just added another post to the old thread with a sugested change to your section on talisman of shadows.
    --
    PVP Rogue,
    --[----- "Your friendly neighborhood spawn of Satan." -----]--
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    Main Character: Hurricane Marigolds (Rogue WK & Assassin)
    Ingame Handle: trgluestickz
    Discord Name: Hurricane🌀Marigolds#2563
    Guilds: She Looked LVL 18 & Essence of Aggression
    Alliances: Imperium & Order of the Silent Shroud
    Platform: PC
  • sherifftrumansherifftruman Member Posts: 26 Arc User
    I think we need to make clear that WK is a such a minority in end game content due to how difficult it is for WK to compete with MI damage. I would really like to see WK and MI as equally competitive.

    Improving Dagger Threat and Disheartening Strike are probably the heart of where these improvements can be made. I don't personally agree that a decrease in melee damage is needed if Dagger Threat is active as we're giving up a passive slot to use it, and that could be a big disincentive for people who may want to use WK but mix close-range and mid to far range attacks. In any event, there is fertile ground for testing with Dagger Threat and Disheartening Strike.

    There was also wide agreement that improving the pushback on Impact Strike as you get closer to targets felt like a good improvement that should be made.
    Guild Officer of Greycloaks

    Kaelyx - TR: Whisperknife
    Kae'lyxstra - OP: Protection
    Kae-lyxa - DC: Divine Oracle
    Kael Blazebeard - GWF: Iron Vanguard
  • mageddo#6766 mageddo Member Posts: 60 Arc User
    Since​ ​we​ ​already​ ​have​ ​to​ ​stack​ ​crit​ ​like​ ​any​ ​class​ ​that​ ​wants​ ​to​ ​consistently​ ​produce​ ​a​ ​critical
    strike​ ​we​ ​need​ ​to​ ​adjust​ ​our​ ​stealth​ ​mechanic.

    It​ ​needs​ ​to​ ​have​ ​enough​ ​time​ ​to​ ​cover​ ​all​ ​of​ ​duelist​ ​flurry​ ​until​ ​it​ ​empties​ ​on​ ​at​ ​will​ ​use.​ ​​ ​Still​ ​refills
    at​ ​same​ ​speed​ ​and​ ​still​ ​fully​ ​empties​ ​on​ ​encounter​ ​use.​ ​​ ​You​ ​can​ ​use​ ​stealth​ ​at​ ​any​ ​time​ ​you
    would​ ​just​ ​have​ ​a​ ​shorter​ ​duration​ ​and​ ​less​ ​damage​ ​output.

    When​ ​in​ ​stealth​ ​you​ ​have​ ​combat​ ​advantage​ ​and​ ​100%​ ​critical​ ​chance.​ ​​ ​Any​ ​attack​ ​from​ ​stealth
    gets​ ​up​ ​to​ ​an​ ​additional​ ​50%​ ​crit​ ​severity​ ​based​ ​on​ ​how​ ​much​ ​stealth​ ​you​ ​have​ ​remaining.
    Attacks​ ​at​ ​full​ ​stealth​ ​can​ ​daze​ ​enemy​ ​for​ ​1​ ​second.


    This​ ​will​ ​allow​ ​a​ ​lot​ ​of​ ​versatility​ ​at​ ​any​ ​level.

    1.Could​ ​replace​ ​the​ ​need​ ​for​ ​a​ ​vorpal​ ​to​ ​allow​ ​use​ ​of​ ​another​ ​enchant.​ ​​ ​Since​ ​stacking
    would​ ​have​ ​DR​ ​with​ ​base​ ​crit​ ​severity.
    2.At​ ​lower​ ​levels​ ​would​ ​aid​ ​in​ ​both​ ​pve​ ​and​ ​pvp​ ​since​ ​our​ ​crit​ ​chance​ ​is​ ​so​ ​low.
    3.Would​ ​not​ ​interfere​ ​with​ ​any​ ​feats​ ​or​ ​powers.
    4.Allow​ ​us​ ​to​ ​not​ ​have​ ​to​ ​stack​ ​as​ ​much​ ​crit​ ​since​ ​up​ ​time​ ​of​ ​stealth​ ​is​ ​more​ ​frequent.
    5.Make​ ​us​ ​create​ ​more​ ​unique​ ​rotations.

    Please​ ​let​ ​me​ ​know​ ​if​ ​you​ ​like​ ​any​ ​of​ ​this.​ ​​ ​Also​ ​any​ ​number​ ​in​ ​here​ ​can​ ​be​ ​adjusted.​ ​​ ​This​ ​alone
    could​ ​help​ ​push​ ​up​ ​WK​ ​to​ ​where​ ​MI​ ​is​ ​now.​ ​​ ​I​ ​know​ ​we​ ​need​ ​to​ ​get​ ​what​ ​is​ ​not​ ​working​ ​fixed.
    Even​ ​after​ ​that​ ​we​ ​would​ ​still​ ​come​ ​up​ ​short​ ​to​ ​other​ ​classes.​ ​​ ​A​ ​mechanic​ ​rework​ ​is​ ​needed
    and​ ​i​ ​think​ ​with​ ​this​ ​many​ ​people​ ​contributing​ ​ideas​ ​we​ ​could​ ​make​ ​something​ ​great.
  • mageddo#6766 mageddo Member Posts: 60 Arc User
    I appreciate who disagreed with my post. Please let me know which part or if you think the whole idea is incorrect.

    I value the feedback. Also please let me know your solution other than what we know needs fixed how we can make the TR better. Thank you.
  • wileecoyoteymwileecoyoteym Member Posts: 35 Arc User
    Smoke bomb activates Vicious pursuit on screen but does not activate the actual buff. this is madness..... this is why I will never recommend this game to my friends. Now can I have my respec token back? :smile: Nvm 230k ad stolen.
  • trentbail21trentbail21 Member Posts: 433 Arc User

    I appreciate who disagreed with my post. Please let me know which part or if you think the whole idea is incorrect.



    I value the feedback. Also please let me know your solution other than what we know needs fixed how we can make the TR better. Thank you.

    Better? You want them to be better? They are top tier in PVP already along with gf, hr and cws. Alot of things need to change so they are same or worse in pvp and better in PVE. But I don't really see that happening.
    Find me in game if you want and send me a domination/ gaunt invite. If you are good and im not busy ill play with you. Im not an elitist ill play with almost anyone.
  • sherifftrumansherifftruman Member Posts: 26 Arc User


    As for PVE, almost anything a TR can do other classes can do better.
    TRs are close to the bottom when it comes to damage output. HRs, GWFs, CWs, SWs all tend to outdo similarly geared and skilled TRs consistantly.
    There was an epidemic of players not that long ago that considered TRs to be even worse damage dealers than they actually are and would often exclude them from pve groups because of this. Thankfully, this stigma against TRs has gotten less prevalant but it still happens from time to time.
    The learning curve for TR is sharp with only the best trs being able to keep up with similarly geared/skilled other classes at all.
    The meta just like in pvp is very narrow with only a few of our powers still being viable and with almost everyone stacking roughly the same stats.
    A lot of our damage is delayed so when we go against a class that can land its big damage quicker, the mobs or boss will usually die before we have a chance to catch up in strong groups.


    This is absolutely true. On lower-level dungeons this isn't such a problem, but it becomes much more apparent on the high-end dungeons. We are very clearly behind, esp. WK, and it is definitely time to make some adjustments to make TR more competitive with other dps classes.
    Guild Officer of Greycloaks

    Kaelyx - TR: Whisperknife
    Kae'lyxstra - OP: Protection
    Kae-lyxa - DC: Divine Oracle
    Kael Blazebeard - GWF: Iron Vanguard
  • trentbail21trentbail21 Member Posts: 433 Arc User
    Hey at least a rogue can use all 3 feat trees lol. GWFs can only use one.

    My suggestions for rogue rework:
    1. Make more things resistant to courage breaker. Like villains menace, unstoppable, wind on the wheel of elements.
    2. Make the game mechanics even. For example other classes can dodge, roll when they are courage broken. But for some reason GWFs and SWs just have to accept that they are locked in place.
    3. Rework shocking execution so that it does less damage then it currently does but more damage when the target is below half hp. That way there is no more one hits on maxed out people.
    4. Increase the damage of almost all of the rogues encounters and at-wills by like 25%.
    5. There is no reason that both dailies that are irresistible are available to one paragon path. My suggestion is to move courage breaker to exclusively a whisper knife daily. That way you would have to pick between one or the other.
    6. Maybe consider increasing the cooldown timer of smoke bomb and AP gain after a daily. So we cant be rained shockings every 6 seconds for over 150k would be nice.

    Find me in game if you want and send me a domination/ gaunt invite. If you are good and im not busy ill play with you. Im not an elitist ill play with almost anyone.
  • talon1970talon1970 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 152 Arc User

    Hey at least a rogue can use all 3 feat trees lol. GWFs can only use one.

    My suggestions for rogue rework:
    1. Make more things resistant to courage breaker. Like villains menace, unstoppable, wind on the wheel of elements.
    2. Make the game mechanics even. For example other classes can dodge, roll when they are courage broken. But for some reason GWFs and SWs just have to accept that they are locked in place.
    3. Rework shocking execution so that it does less damage then it currently does but more damage when the target is below half hp. That way there is no more one hits on maxed out people.
    4. Increase the damage of almost all of the rogues encounters and at-wills by like 25%.
    5. There is no reason that both dailies that are irresistible are available to one paragon path. My suggestion is to move courage breaker to exclusively a whisper knife daily. That way you would have to pick between one or the other.
    6. Maybe consider increasing the cooldown timer of smoke bomb and AP gain after a daily. So we cant be rained shockings every 6 seconds for over 150k would be nice.

    Uhm very biased from an Pvp point of view...

    May i ask you, have you read all the suggestions that were made?

    - CB is also a useful daily in Pve, if the Tank is too weak against some bosses, or in Fbi climbing up the hill, or even against Hatti, Drufi or in Spellplague.
    - SE, actually i don't care bc it is not that useful in Pve anymore.
    - increasing damage for xxxxxx% and done..., nope thats not the way we are asking for, we (Tr) know what will happen again, people from the Pvp side will complaining again, and the nerf hammer will strike again against us, and we will stand here worser than before.
    - May i ask how high is the impact with the loadouts are now in Pvp (just thoughts from me i don't do Pvp), someone starts as an Wk, stuns you with CB, smoke and maybe dazing strike, killing himself (through makro or shortcut, dunno if this is possible) and comes back as an Mi and finishing you bc you are still not able to move. (as far as i remember the maps for Pvp are really small)
    - increasing cooldowns? really?? We have actually the highest cooldowns of all classes with some encounters. Our Ap gain (biased from an Pve point of view, i know) is an joke against other classes..
    And these things made it most the times very hard to time exactly against an full debuffed target, to bring on the highest dps the class could made.

    long story short, there were suggestions made also from Pvp Tr's, wich fits better, so that maybe alot of pvp Tr change their Cb, smoke perma stun, or cheap first strike, SE combo behavior to something maybe more "fair play" style in Pvp.

  • shiva#4006 shiva Member Posts: 27 Arc User
    edited October 2017
    My suggestion is only a minor tweak, but i believe it can definitely help TR's atleast in pve, can't say about pvp.
    My suggestion is that blade flurry can be casted as fast as possible, or atleast much faster than the current. The main point of having two small weapon compared to a big one is mobility, it shouldn't hit hard but it should hit fast. Current blade flurry uses a lot of time for all of it to be used, which hinders mobility and speed of our attack. With my suggestion, we still won't be the top aoe dps and we shouldn't be, but it will definitely improve to a decent level. Hope this is also considered.
  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 4,952 Arc User

    My suggestion is only a minor tweak, but i believe it can definitely help TR's atleast in pve, can't say about pvp.
    My suggestion is that blade flurry can be casted as fast as possible, or atleast much faster than the current. The main point of having two small weapon compared to a big one is mobility, it shouldn't hit hard but it should hit fast. Current blade flurry uses a lot of time for all of it to be used, which hinders mobility and speed of our attack. With my suggestion, we still won't be the top aoe dps and we shouldn't be, but it will definitely improve to a decent level. Hope this is also considered.

    I do agree that the initial two strikes take too long, the flurry part is ok imo but they should (as suggested above) make the bleeds stack to 10 on a single flurry.
    Please Do Not Feed The Trolls

    Xael De Armadeon: DC
    Xane De Armadeon: CW
    Zen De Armadeon: OP
    Zohar De Armadeon: TR
    Chrion De Armadeon: SW
    Gosti Big Belly: GWF
    Barney McRustbucket: GF
    Lt. Thackeray: HR
    Lucius De Armadeon: BD


    Member of Casual Dailies - XBox
  • blur#5900 blur Member Posts: 490 Arc User
    @armadeonx I believe he meant Blade Flurry, not Duelist's Flurry :smile:
    image
  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 4,952 Arc User
    blur#5900 said:

    @armadeonx I believe he meant Blade Flurry, not Duelist's Flurry :smile:

    Oh, my mistake lol
    Please Do Not Feed The Trolls

    Xael De Armadeon: DC
    Xane De Armadeon: CW
    Zen De Armadeon: OP
    Zohar De Armadeon: TR
    Chrion De Armadeon: SW
    Gosti Big Belly: GWF
    Barney McRustbucket: GF
    Lt. Thackeray: HR
    Lucius De Armadeon: BD


    Member of Casual Dailies - XBox
  • reeenatureeenatu Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited December 2017
    The main thing that concerns me while playing with my TR is that the Shadow of Demise does not work as the tooltip description.
    While in Stealth, your Encounter powers now also add the Shadow of Demise effect to the target for 6 seconds.

    [Shadow of Demise]
    While in Stealth, your Encounter powers now also add the Shadow of Demise effect to the target for 6 seconds. This effect is powered up by further damage you deal. Additionally, you generate Stealth 20% faster and no longer have your regeneration interrupted when taking damage. The stealth regeneration is always gonna be interrupted if you take damage, fixing that would be a huge change because TR's would be able to apply SoD every 6-8 seconds.
Sign In or Register to comment.