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Ubiquituous shield pve vs pvp

jaime4312#3760 jaime4312 Member Posts: 844 Arc User
Hey there,

I have a pv built tac GF and I have always had that heroic feat, however I don't know how good (or bad) it really is, how it does work and how much its effectinevess compares in pve vs pvp. Can anyone help me out with this?

@michela123 please can you tell me the way that feat powers and whether is good or not?

@rjc9000 @kallephi#0836 @kemi1984 do you guys know if it's any good in pve or am I better off spending my points somewhere else?

I'm also interested in pvping someday, probably not ayntime soon but I rather know about ubiquitious shield before I get to do anything that involves making my toon being full pvp built so spending a lot of ad there.

@xsayajinx1 is that feat any good or is it worthless? It sounds like a must have due to pvp nature but eh I'm just guessing.

Thanks in advance and everyone else's opinion is welcome.

Comments

  • rjc9000rjc9000 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,351 Arc User
    edited March 2017
    It literally reduces your foe's CA bonus by 25%, as per Michela's calculations. I think. (haven't been playing this game much, been playing a lot of Mass Effect).

    So, in PvE, the basic CA bonus damage is 15%. Since mobs have no external CA damage boosting sources like we do, it remains 15% for enemy mobs. If you throw Ubiquitous Shield...

    15 * (1-0.25)
    15* (0.75)
    11.25

    The basic 15% CA bonus damage gets dropped down to 11.25%, which, imo, is not that big of a difference in PvE.

    Sure, it buffs your survivability, but not by much. And besides, smart positioning of your GF will ensure mobs never get CA on you, which is why I generally don't like it in PvE.

    For PvP, can't say. It might be of use against Shocking Executioner Rogues (where every little bit of survivability helps), but I can't say for certain.
    Post edited by rjc9000 on

  • kemi1984kemi1984 Member Posts: 849 Arc User
    I know nothing about PVP, but this feat could have some use in PVP due to the fact @rjc9000 mentioned.

    I will mostly second what he said, so in PVE you should always keep the bad guys in front of you as a GF.
    Per above it's a bit of waste to take in for strict PVE setup.

    Need to go to preview and look exactly how lodouts will work. I must say this IS the best thing that happened in this game for a bit - mor mea at least.

    Being able to switch from a turtle style HAMSTER into a "monstah killa" GF is easilly said - EPIC !
    Nancy - Dragonborn, SM Guardian Fighter
    A proud member of "mythical horde of DPS GFs"

    1). Is SW more dps or tank based?
    2). Yes. I am panzer!
    3). Get ACT if you want to celebrate your epeen.
    4). Horniness will not stand between me and what I believe - "MM"
  • kallephi#0836 kallephi Member Posts: 281 Arc User
    My GF is totally offensive. I know only a bit about tanking but I don't think it would be a good deal for PVE.
    For PVP I can't really answer you, sorry.
    Ly'saaera, Hellbringer Fury Scourge Warlock of Thieves World
    Hælja, Swordmaster Conqueror Guardian Fighter of Thieves World
  • jaime4312#3760 jaime4312 Member Posts: 844 Arc User
    rjc9000 said:

    It literally reduces your foe's CA bonus by 25%, as per Michela's calculations. I think. (haven't been playing this game much, been playing a lot of Mass Effect).

    So, in PvE, the basic CA bonus damage is 15%. Since mobs have no external CA damage boosting sources like we do, it remains 15% for enemy mobs. If you throw Ubiquitous Shield...

    15 * (1-0.25)
    15* (0.75)
    11.25

    The basic 15% CA bonus damage gets dropped down to 11.25%, which, imo, is not that big of a difference in PvE.

    Sure, it buffs your survivability, but not by much. And besides, smart positioning of your GF will ensure mobs never get CA on you, which is why I generally don't like it in PvE.

    For PvP, can't say. It might be of use against Shocking Executioner Rogues (where every little bit of survivability helps), but I can't say for certain.

    kemi1984 said:

    I know nothing about PVP, but this feat could have some use in PVP due to the fact @rjc9000 mentioned.

    I will mostly second what he said, so in PVE you should always keep the bad guys in front of you as a GF.
    Per above it's a bit of waste to take in for strict PVE setup.

    Need to go to preview and look exactly how lodouts will work. I must say this IS the best thing that happened in this game for a bit - mor mea at least.

    Being able to switch from a turtle style HAMSTER into a "monstah killa" GF is easilly said - EPIC !

    @rjc9000 @kemi1984 @kallephi#0836 thanks for the answers guys, it makes sense how ubiquituous shield would be mediocre in pve, a good thing I guess, I mean, I can spend my feats somewhere else next time I respec my GF, not sure when but I've been thinking of it a lot lately.

    Kemi and rjc, please correct me if I'm wrong, but the feat in question being bad for a tank pve build like mine should mean my best option is to max out the one that increases my encounter and at-will damage, correct(I think I currently have 1 point in it and my toon is human)? In case it matters, I maxed out potent challenge as I deal next to no damage, I need every bit of extra threat I can get (my RI in combat is capped, legendary con artist's base armour pen and axe beak's bonus take care of that, that way I can keep my tanking stuff everywhere). I have like 29k - 32k power in combat (I use guild power boon) I believe, (unless my memory is trolling me, I've made quite a few changes regarding my toon's items so I may be wrong) not a lot but not horrible either. Anyway, that's about the only feat I'd want to take, the one that's top on t1 sounds like a waste to me (gain 10% more action points when guarding attacks) unless I'm missing something, am I?

    @kemi1984 I second your statement regarding loadouts, I'm very excited about it. I know it would be off topic but, do you think you could write here on this thread your opinion on the way loadouts work? Being able to finally do daylies without feeling like shooting myself with a banana due to lulz low dps sounds awesome. @rjc9000 and @kallephi#0836 perhaps you guys could tell me your opinion on loadouts too? That would be highly appreciated!


    Oh how could I forget that! @rjc9000 please can you tell me whether it will be possible to just buy the stronghold weapons mk 2 once they're crafted and posted on the trade house? If do, do I need to do anything else (like farming fangs, etc) or do I just buy them?

    Sorry for the long text guys and thanks for your help!
  • rjc9000rjc9000 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,351 Arc User
    Meh on trying to increase your aggro. I can do just fine in aggro with my Tactician build. I have like ~10k Power and use the Guild ArmorPen boon, but I can keep aggro decently well, despite me having less weapon damage than my team. I can simply keep it with marking and spamming a lot of Aggravating Strike.

    I assume you already have the staple feats, such as Toughness, Distracting Shield, Strength Focus, and Armor Specialization. Tbh I can't see many other alternatives, so the extra aggro should be nice.

    Since loadouts arent live, I would actually suggest a Conq build for you. Keep your tank gear and play your GF like a tank. This gives you better solo-time and much easier aggro than the Protector/Tactician.

    When loadouts go to live, I was thinking about 3 different loadouts.

    SM Tactician: My bread and butter build for when I'm feeling lazy or need to focus on tanking duties only.
    Conqueror SM: For WMS/Steel Grace mob destroying goodness as well as a fun general purpose loadout.
    Conqueror IV: Trample + Knee for specific bosses only (ex: FBI bosses).

    I might run an IV Tactician build for Threatening Rush fun, but it's not going to be part of my permanent kit.

    Yes, according to the devs, the Titansteel Set (SH Set v2) will be available to purchase on the AH as a fully completed weapon, no need to muck around with the armanents, seals, etc. Just buy your weapon and be done with it.

  • mitty#8178 mitty Member Posts: 30 Arc User
    rjc9000 said:


    Conqueror IV: Trample + Knee for specific bosses only (ex: FBI bosses).

    I was under the impression that Trample, unlike Crushing Pin, requires the debuff to be active on the mob to function? Does knee breaker work on bosses? I may have just assumed that they were immune, so Trample would not work.
  • rjc9000rjc9000 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,351 Arc User

    rjc9000 said:


    Conqueror IV: Trample + Knee for specific bosses only (ex: FBI bosses).

    I was under the impression that Trample, unlike Crushing Pin, requires the debuff to be active on the mob to function? Does knee breaker work on bosses? I may have just assumed that they were immune, so Trample would not work.
    The advantage Trample has is that the damage bonus lasts as long as your CC effect, compared to Crushing Pin, which only has a 3 second duration regardless of your CC effect.

    So if you use Knee Breaker, the first 2-3 hits will benefit from Crushing Pin, but the rest wont. However, Trample will be up for the entire duration of the slow effect.

    And yes, regardless of whether you can actually freeze or slow or actually meaningfully CC your enemy, as long as you apply CC power to enemy the damage bonus will apply.

  • kemi1984kemi1984 Member Posts: 849 Arc User
    Every since I started to play my GF (which was my 2nd serious char) I wanted to have the ability to go full HAMSTER DPS and a full blown tank/party utility player.

    Than it took YEARS of whining and begging Cryptic to finally implement this...I was so freaking happy seeing this announced lol.

    You should find more about the miracle thing (!) here:

    http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/comment/12946023

    I will probably choose a similar setup like @rjc9000 :

    1. Tact utility setup based on his build, it's great! (SM)
    2. Total DPS oriented son of a gun GF (SM)
    3. DPS IV ? I was IV for sooo long, but WMS is still too good to pass by.

    When I was IV I always used Trample and I had it feated. Frankly those were the times when I did not test stuff nor did I thought much about it. It was kind of a natural deal after reading the tooltip (yes yes I know! :))

    I would drop the Ubiquitious Shield for Potent Challenge, if you do not have it.
    I'm taking guild arpen boon over power, while tanking to shoot the resistance ignored way up.

    Combination of the two above will help you generate, and keep more threat.
    Nancy - Dragonborn, SM Guardian Fighter
    A proud member of "mythical horde of DPS GFs"

    1). Is SW more dps or tank based?
    2). Yes. I am panzer!
    3). Get ACT if you want to celebrate your epeen.
    4). Horniness will not stand between me and what I believe - "MM"
  • jaime4312#3760 jaime4312 Member Posts: 844 Arc User
    rjc9000 said:

    Meh on trying to increase your aggro. I can do just fine in aggro with my Tactician build. I have like ~10k Power and use the Guild ArmorPen boon, but I can keep aggro decently well, despite me having less weapon damage than my team. I can simply keep it with marking and spamming a lot of Aggravating Strike.

    I assume you already have the staple feats, such as Toughness, Distracting Shield, Strength Focus, and Armor Specialization. Tbh I can't see many other alternatives, so the extra aggro should be nice.

    Since loadouts arent live, I would actually suggest a Conq build for you. Keep your tank gear and play your GF like a tank. This gives you better solo-time and much easier aggro than the Protector/Tactician.

    When loadouts go to live, I was thinking about 3 different loadouts.

    SM Tactician: My bread and butter build for when I'm feeling lazy or need to focus on tanking duties only.
    Conqueror SM: For WMS/Steel Grace mob destroying goodness as well as a fun general purpose loadout.
    Conqueror IV: Trample + Knee for specific bosses only (ex: FBI bosses).

    I might run an IV Tactician build for Threatening Rush fun, but it's not going to be part of my permanent kit.

    Yes, according to the devs, the Titansteel Set (SH Set v2) will be available to purchase on the AH as a fully completed weapon, no need to muck around with the armanents, seals, etc. Just buy your weapon and be done with it.

    @rjc9000 thanks for your answer mate! Your pve tank setup sounds like mine was a few days ago, I was using the guild armour pen boon but I ended up trading for a legacy axebeak so, at the cost of 8k hp from the high forest bear, I got 4k armour pen + the ability of using the power boon so soloing is a bit less horrible now. I secon what you stated, marking + spamming aggravating strike is good enough to hold aggro decently, I just wanted to deal a bit more damage so I can kill things a tad faster when doing daylies.

    Your guess is right, I do have the staple feats but I also have potent challenge as my power was like 5k and my RI was like 40% in combat for a long time (when my toon was barely at 2k il) + I somehow didn't use enhanced mark which caused me to have quite terrible aggro issues (dungeon bosses constantly ignoring me and one shotting my dps teammates). I feel very tempted to take the feat that increases at-will and encounter damage, with potent challenge + marking that should help me to have enough aggro without needing to lot enhanced mark.

    I have been considering run as conqueror for a while now, as martial mastery is quite meh because of reasons you explained on other threads + virtually every class having decent or very high action point on their own it makes me want to try reckless attacker to see how I do with it, I may like it, I guess. I currently running a mitigation build of my own but I'm still updating it and always thinking how to improve it, I'm still missing the rust monster as I'm quite low on ad to buy an epic one or purchasing a green version on the tradebar store then upgrading it (plus I used all my companion tokens to get con artist to legendary).

    As for loadouts and paragon paths, the only thing I truly miss brom SM is WMS for soloing (I agree with you, cleave is HAMSTER), I can see myself having a conqueror SM build for soloing and a IV tac for tanking, I can't wait to start messing around with different set ups, it's going to be fun for sure! My toon currently is IV and I never use TR for soloing, I find it better or at least more fun to go yolo rambo with powers. My rotation for daylies is combat superiority + trample the fallen, cleave + crushing surge, fray + knee breaker and frontline surge, for daylies is villain's menace only pretty much as mob's can't do much damage (distracting shield, daunting challenge, united, trans negation and trans feytouched, valhalla set, combat superiority and eventually rust monster too) to me so fighter's recovery is overkill and indomitable strenght is a waste as well, I believe.

    I have a question though, as I don't have crushing pin yet, taking out united for it would be a good idea, wouldn't it? If I remember well, you once stated that united simply grants 5% dr so it doesn't do much if anything to protect squishy teammates and for my toon not having it wouldn't affect my survability much if at all, correct? Here comes another question, if crushing pin is a capped debuff, how often will it become kind of useless when I run with other 2 supports on fbi or even more in msva?

    Oh that's sweet about the Titansteel set, I know I'll try to get mine for my GF and my SW if I can afford it, there's no way I'm gonna try mastercrafting anytime soon if at all.
    kemi1984 said:

    Every since I started to play my GF (which was my 2nd serious char) I wanted to have the ability to go full HAMSTER DPS and a full blown tank/party utility player.

    Than it took YEARS of whining and begging Cryptic to finally implement this...I was so freaking happy seeing this announced lol.

    You should find more about the miracle thing (!) here:

    http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/comment/12946023

    I will probably choose a similar setup like @rjc9000 :

    1. Tact utility setup based on his build, it's great! (SM)
    2. Total DPS oriented son of a gun GF (SM)
    3. DPS IV ? I was IV for sooo long, but WMS is still too good to pass by.

    When I was IV I always used Trample and I had it feated. Frankly those were the times when I did not test stuff nor did I thought much about it. It was kind of a natural deal after reading the tooltip (yes yes I know! :))

    I would drop the Ubiquitious Shield for Potent Challenge, if you do not have it.
    I'm taking guild arpen boon over power, while tanking to shoot the resistance ignored way up.

    Combination of the two above will help you generate, and keep more threat.

    @kemi1984 indeed, I always wanted to be able to kill things without needing to smash them for like half a hour when I was like 2k+ - 3.5k. Rank 12 bondings, legendary con artist, 32k power in combat and trans feytouched made soloing less horrible but still... I know my toon could hit a lot harder with some gear/build tweaks here and there, now that loadouts will be a thing in a few months (I'm on console, platform of ap/stamina drain troll lords and where people laugh/get cocky every time you tell them about ACT or how you top dogs pc in pve/pvp are the best of the best in the game, if I could I'd have switched to pc a long time ago xD)

    Yeah, those were the days, trusting cryptic tooltpis :):no_mouth:

    SM is overall better for soloing in pve, not doubt about it! I formely ran that paragon but then gave a try to IV and enver looked back. Although I miss WMS when doing daylies, I love when I go to dwarven valley with a few friends who also are pve specced (mostly GWFs), we take out our summoned and active companions then fight (without pvp gear lol), it's very fun! I love how I was like consistently 3 - 4 shotting one when holding back while with the most powerful one I had to try hard although because of my mitigation build his damage was debuffed to hilarious amounts :D

    Even though SM is very good I would argue that IV is better for single target damage against other players though, can't hate that indomitable strenght daily + trample the fallen with griffon's wrath (especially if feated).

    As I already have potent challenge I guess my best option is the one that increases at-will and encounter damage for better aggro and soloing, or not? :open_mouth: I think I will go with that one :smile:

    I'm still considering options for further increasing my base armour pen as I want to try pvp someday, I'm considering to get the sigil of the GWF for the 1k power and arp, I may even get another artifact with the similar stat's, kessell's spheres and lostmauth's horn sound like viable options for that :)

    Even after increasing my power while keeping the RI to 60% I still notice other tanks can outaggro me even though I contantly mark, spam aggravating strike and have enhanced mark on too, it's very weird o.O When I'm the only tank I can aggro stuff well so I guess it's a non issue!

    Thank you 2 for the answers, they helped me a lot!
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