Update on the Dungeon Key Change

frozenfirevr · October 2016

rekhyt15#7011 said:
Personally, I would like to see occasional large drops of Astral Diamonds, though I understand this is unlikely. In lieu of that, I would like to see lockbox keys. As of this moment the only way I know of to get these keys is through the Zen store. I consider this unfair because I have well over 50 Runic lockboxes that I can't do anything with because I don't have the real world money for the keys. I will admit I haven't been playing for long and just had my first character hit level 34, so I don't know if there is a free way already or not. If there is, please let me know. I'd really like to open these boxes.

P.S: I understand that the devs need to make, but no matter what you do there isn't a single intelligent player out there who's going to spend more than what they feel the game would be worth if they had to buy it to begin with. For example, I've found that nearly all FtP games, of any kind, are really worth no more $65 TOTAL. I'll grant you that this is a fantastic game, but still only worth $100 max in my opinion(game+"DLC"). A game is meant to be fun, not bankruptingly expensive.

P.S.S: Absolutely FANTASTIC job with the Masquerade of Liars event. Halloween is my favorite, and it's been quite some time since I've seen such a good theme event for it. just a suggestion for next, a whole dedicated quest line would be amazing, not just 3 daily repeat quests.

No, Zen Store is the only way to get enchanted keys.

PS. Runic Lockboxes are the worst ever lockboxes, capable of giving rewards, often, worth <800 AD. Open any other lockbox when you get to. And, an Epic Mount and VIP are must buy items from the Zen Store.

frozenfirevr · October 2016

excat56#5321 said:

u4310h55a#2650 said:
As a player on the PS4( not sure if that matters) but I agree with the op that needing to open a ton of chests and having junk drop, it would be a shame to have to use a key to look. for example when I farmed out my Twisted set, I used about 25 dragon keys, and the rest I used greater demonic, that I was able to make. I did not mind the twisted farm, since I knew that I would get 1 twisted ichor on a silver run and 2 for gold. If we had to farm Demo for a chance for a twisted main hand or off hand drop, I would have quit.

I think if your going to make the keys used on open, than we need something like twisted.

For example, on running Lostmouth, you would open the chest and get a Lostmouth token, that could be exchanged for bind on pick up gear, ( account bound) and Leaving bind of Equip gear to chance.

I feel this way would honor people who want to play and get the gear they want, and keeping the Boe gear would let people who dont have time to grind to still buy the gear with AD.
Hate to say this, but this is a horrible idea.

It would be exactly like edemo then. Run it until you get what you want, then never go back unless you are helping someone. As most other's have all agreed on, BOP should NOT exist after this change is implemented.

This would make que'ing for anything harder after the first month or two of this change, as a majority of ppl that got what they wanted would never go back, then you're left with a few farmers trying to make AD. Then once you do have what you're after, what is even the point of the token if everything you get from it is BOP?

No thanks.

Not right, people will continue to farm it for AD and a chance at BoE. Also, people didn't stop farming Demo, the +5s are still out there. Demo is less farmable (if you have your +5s) since it doesn't give BoE Twisted set, if there's a chance for that too, then it'll go on.

excat56#5321 said:
Then once you do have what you're after, what is even the point of the token if everything you get from it is BOP?

u4310h55a#2650 said:
For example, on running Lostmouth, you would open the chest and get a Lostmouth token, that could be exchanged for bind on pick up gear, ( account bound) and Leaving bind of Equip gear to chance.

???
Where did he say chance at BoP?

trgluestickz · October 2016

kitkathd said:

strumslinger said:
As you may have heard, we recently announced, and put up on Preview, a new system for dungeon keys wherein viewing rewards would no longer be an option without using the key. Then you spoke to us: loudly, clearly and - amazingly so and in many ways - that this breaks something in the game that you have relied upon. A fail safe for checking to see if you are going to use your keys on loot - at least loot that is a return on investment on the key and time in the dungeon. Our forward looking goal has always been to be able to create better rewards tables in those (and other) chests, but we needed to secure the dungeon chest system first. We totally put the cart before the horse here. We’re all sorry for the heartache such a half move has caused.

What good is first change without the second part?! I think you all were pretty clear on that, and you are right! When I’m reading on the forums that Aulduron opened 1,000 chests and used only a dozen keys on rewards he liked, this made me get my team really looking into the bigger issue here. The Rewards. Not just the rewards but the percentage chances of getting them.

We hear you. I hear you. We are going to fix this.

So, here’s what we are going to do. We are pulling back the dungeon key change for our upcoming update, Sea of Moving Ice, and scheduling time to evaluate and rebuild the rewards for the dungeon chests. This change will still happen, but when it does it will be with better rewards and a much better chance of actually getting the chase loot. Once the change is in, the plan is to schedule updates to these rewards each major expansion so that there is reason to revisit the dungeons.

With that in mind, we would love to hear from you. What do you want to see in your Dungeon chests? I’m serious about this. Your feedback is important. Reply in this post!

Regards,
Thomas “Mimic King” Foss
I want to see on every single lockbox, dungeon chest, and game mechanic, "a chance" replaced with exact percentages. Especially when my money is coming into play. Until you start showing us the odds, this game is nothing but an unregulated gambling scam hidden behind smoke and mirrors. As for putting the wagon before the horse, maybe you should take a step back and look at all your methods of changes cause you have repeatedly destroyed the game then tried to salvage after the fact. For the love of god, either fail so we can get a real DnD game or start being an actual game developer instead of a digital Scratch ticket company exploiting peoples weakness for gambling.

+1

A lot of things in this game vaguely state you have a "chance" to get X or for X to happen. This doesn't just make it hard for us to figure out our odds for obtaining loot or for testing the new key system, it also make it difficult to craft builds because players have to go in and try to test what the numbers are for things like feats, boons, and powers. Then those people pass that info down to others via word of mouth and its just a ton of hassle to go through for something that should not be hidden from players to begin with. This game has a huge problem with vague or inaccurate tool tips as well as keeping the loot tables secret for some monumentally stupid reason.

lordseth1985 · October 2016

greyhawk#1973 said:
If they want to monetize why the heck can't they monetize fashion, mounts, cool effects etc?

Well... what was the last fashion/cosmetics that devs bring to the game? It seems that they don't even care about this.

trgluestickz · October 2016

pitshade said:
Thank you.

I would like to see rewards redone for other aspects of the game. It's been done before. When I played before, I referred to the second chest in Dread Ring lairs as the Coffer of Arcane Peridots. Came back to the game in August to find Greater and even the new Superior marks in it. Its a rare chance and I don't run those lairs every day, but it is a joy to get something good.

Make it so every player gets a drop from dungeon bosses, even if it is a relatively low value item like a peridot.

As far as dungeon loot goes, don't forget about the old armor and weapon skins from pre-mod 6: Armor of Lolth, Sharpened Ice Axe, pirate hats etc... These skins still exist in the game. Put them to use again. Make them account bound (Or if BOP they should only drop for a class that van use them) so that they

actually mean something. The game needs more customization though.

This may be a little unrelated but I've been itching for an excuse to mention this: Not all of the transmutes from the old gear sets are back yet and I'd personally like to have the old PVP sets back in as transmutes in addition to the rest of the old PVE gear. The old profound PVP gear for example, looked pretty HAMSTER awesome.

trgluestickz · October 2016

hanniballa#2401 said:
No more HAMSTER peridots!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

lol I only like peridots when there is 5 or more of them... Which is never unless you are buying from AH.

tripsofthrymr said:

mcxanatos said:
The main goal on the business side of things here is to make more money. I mean, let's be honest, that's the bottom line for a game company. Keeping players happy and giving them good rewards that make them want to spend money goes hand-in-hand with you guys making money and sitting pretty in a bathtub full of George Washingtons.
That's some visual

Here's a thought for a Zen market item that reduces the grind for those that want to pay money but doesn't disadvantage free-to-play players other than they have to play more for the same rewards:

Bag of Four Leaf Clovers
Use a clover from the bag for a buff that gives you two rolls on the loot table for the next chest you open, keep the best of the two rolls.

+1 on that clover Idea, that would be great addition to the zen market.

ijonum · October 2016

@sturmslinger GJ! Good to know, that you - as a team - are able to listen to the community. Much wrong was done with the planned change, some players left already, but maybe some of them will be back. I think you avoided a major catastrophe, but it's still tense, as you basically shattered the trust of your customer base. But the HAMSTERstorm thread had a lot of interesting insight from the people who love the game, it's like a bunch of free expert advisors

The most important advice tho was to you - as the devs - play the game, and try, just try to build a BiS character in the way like we, the players, have to. Just go the the class forums, pick a class, and build a toon like the ones that guys post there without spending more then, let's say, 100$ on Zen.

frozenfirevr said:
PS. Runic Lockboxes are the worst ever lockboxes, capable of giving rewards, often, worth <800 AD. Open any other lockbox when you get to. </p>

Thou shalt not feed false info to new players. For a steady, but solid AH gain Runics are the best, cause you get at least 30k, with a chance of something much more valuable.

trgluestickz · October 2016

lowendus said:
While you're at it....bring back the old dungeons.

So many players who remember them want them back, new players will appreciate more content and in the meantime, as suggested by other fellas in this post, make dungeon loot (more loot) relevant and unique to the dungeon / skirmish ( like haarl's, the books for boons from Underdark etc etc) so that there is a reason to run more than 2 things in this game.

It's the same loot everywhere (save for the salvageable gear and the uber rare arti drops)

+1 for everything in this post. I would also like to add that the old version of castle never should be included among the dungeons brought back. This new version of castle never is ok but I know a lot of people that want the old castle never back and it would be pretty cool to have both versions in the game. Plenty of places in this game where you are stepping into the past and already know what happens next because you've done the next piece of content in that series before.

trgluestickz · October 2016

uptondarkdiamond said:
Thanks for listening to us!

I have to say this might be a first time I have seen the community point out flaws with a system your planning on changing and your quick turn around to halt the change. Again, thanks for listening to us. As long as we have communications going both ways they will be hope for future positive changes!

Ok, first I will say this about how I would like chests and loot in general to work.

If what your introducing is a intricate part of the game (i.e. the new armor in SKT) you absolutely have to give us a non-RnG method through which to obtain this gear. This non RnG method can be by using seals (old and new). I don't know why we don't see new seals added with each new mod. This is the prefect system through which to get new gear. You have to play the game to get seals. As long as seals continue to go in our currency tab and not in our inventory this should be a problem. Also, when i say new and old seal, I mean both should be required to get this gear. Obviously, the new seal should make up the majority of the cost, but i have no issue having to get a small portion of the cost of the new gear with old seals.

You don't need to re-invent the wheel whenever you do something like this, after all you already have a system in play that support getting gear through a non-RnG method.

1. You have a spot in Protector's Enclave called the Seven Suns Coster Marker. Here, you will find all kinds of vendors. These vendors probably don't sell many items because the stuff they sell becomes obsolete really fast. I would recommend revitalizing this critical part of the City of Neverwinter by using these already in place vendors as place where you can trade or upgrade your hard fought for and won dungeon loot or even exchange it for currency to buy upgrades for that gear.(or other item you need to exchange).

The below merchants have not be updated with new stuff in quite sometime:

Seal Trader: Phileas Gram (Good place to put catch all new stuff)
Weapon Merchant: Slade Hackman (OP, GWF, GF, TR, and HR), weapon exchange merchant.
Armor Merchant: Rolf Hamersmith, armor exchange merchant.
Jewelery Merchant: Quin Carnelian, jewelery exchange merchant.
Implement Merchant: Ria Talisman (CW, SW, and DC), weapon exchange merchant.
Potion and Kit Merchant: Nan Redbrew, put armor kit removal solvents here.
Stronghold Outfitter: Stronghold Outfitter(this guy should have a name he a friend of mine ;p), don't want to use seals or makes more sense to put stuff here to exhange new gear for dragon fangs, gives us another option. It also will keep dragonflight a thing for those High level guilds...

Absolutely, we need and exhange merchant to help smooth/normalize RnG that is present for gear that is considered to be intricate to the new module. I can not stress this enough... you did great with underdark with demonic ichor requirements and getting the new weapons but then completely went astray from that idea with mod 10...

2. Next, please consider that you have crafting that can help with the requirements of a new module being released.

Crafting should be updated every mod and should have obtainable recipes (zen market, trade bar, wondrous bazaar...), or why even bother having such a system???.

An example I have pointed out in other parts of the forum are items like the pants/shirts. Why they are only obtainable from campaign store is beyond me. We can already craft pants and shirts (probably ones still better campaign store) but can not craft them... I mean comon.... keep crafting relevant!!! Adding those recipes would go along way to keeping crafting relevant.

Another spot I think Cryptic missed the mark with is Lanolin. You can wiki Lanolin and see what it is made of. With that said, they should have made available to the Leatherworking profession the ability to make Lanolin. Use Elemental Evils template for making Unified elements (Alchemy) and apply it to making lanolin. Even use the same time requirements, sure there would be some objections, but at least you would have another path to getting that stuff beyond mindlessly running those dead horse HE's we have endured since Mod 3 and yet somehow they seem to have multiplied since our dungeon selection was eliminated.

Again, I can't stress this enough, you guys have said there is only so much time and money to do things. I completely understand that, I have worked in a job where time was critical (sometimes a matter of life or death) and money was short, you have to prioritize correctly or things go south fast. But, if you have a system in place already (crafting/merchants) wouldn't updating some of these old aspects save you time and money??? Just saying.

3. The UGC and D&D aspect of this game has a lot of draw. With that said I honestly believe that foundry is not support near as much as it should be. This should not be the case. I know the risks of adding good loot to a foundry quest but you should find someway to make this happen. The old way was to run foundry 4(i think that was the number) time to get 8k (RAD). Ok, RAD was enough to get me into the content but AD only goes so far with enjoying content. Please consider adding a process which reviewed and approved foundries gets some teeth that the helps smooth/normalize RnG . I don't know maybe a voucher that improves RnG in your next dungeon run, or a foundry seals that can be used at the seal trader to get a unique look for your character... just give foundry some teeth. Again, people would be more involved in the game and it would save you time and money by utilizing a passionate and talented group of folks that love story telling.

4. Not everything in the game need to have an RoI based of astral diamonds completely boring and unimaginative (IMHO). Here is an idea I like contained within this thread! However, they should be BoE, that way if the person doesn't want desire said item they can sell it on the auction house.. comon rare drops don't happen everyday (I still i have never seen a +5 ring drop despite my valiant efforts ;p)

....continued.....

+1 to all of this stuff. I particularly like the idea of utilizing the merchants in the Seven Suns Coster Market.

Good to see some people mentioning the Heroic Encounters here. I hope they take in our feedback for He's too, everyone hates them but because many people torture themselves grinding them, it gives the illusion to those looking at the numbers that we actually like that HAMSTER XD.

polaris1986 · October 2016

Dear developers, it's what I want.

Companions upgrade tokens (even if it'll be only 2 tokens).

it's a good opportunity for newbies to upgrade their pets and for oldplayers to have a few packs of epic companions for different situations.
Companion's item,

maybe not so strong as loyal items (if you have where return it) but something like SH pet's equipment will be OK.
Rare companions or mounts.

good enough companions are in Solodeine Tower and Cultists Prison but if you not going there you haven't chance to get it (chance in prison is too low). And in Valindra's Tower was a companion from end chest but it's lost for now. Mounts could be blue and without bonuses. It's Ok.
Epic mount's insignias, no comments.
Add campaign resurses to VT, LoL, MC.

Not just regular campaign value like check's of Avanguard, but needed for boons like in Genie's Gifts. Should have a chance as books for boons in LoL/skirmishes. When new one have reached 70 level he should go to DR or Sharandar to get boons, its bored, but if he will play VT or MC he will take boons fastly. Also who have boons already can use this value for key crafting or other campaign tools.
SH coupons (also for such resurces as SH influence).

Why should i take it in Stronghold only? Should be some alternative possibility for SH influence. And people without guilds can easy sold it.
Superios mark of potency
Wards

but blue one will be too much and green Isn't interesting. So you can add new median green-blue ward, that will increase the chance of upgrade for 10-30%.
Scrolls of life, scrolls of mass life.
RP stones (not 1 peridont), for 10 000 -50 000 RPoints in end chest.
Delete runestones drop from CN and add it to ToS, CC, GWD (with the same chance of enchantment's R8 drop)

in ToS, CC and GWD (also we want all old dangeons):
old specific armor (as Dark Armor of Lolth), can be without states only for transmute.
fashion items (absolutely new),

it was logical if you open a chest in CC and see a pirate's wear, for ToS it can be some dark priest's dress and some shaman's wear in GWD
Lesser random armon/weapon enchantment.

Why we always got a shards of stone's but never a full stone? If it will have a chance as articaft it will be Ok.
also i want Eye of Lathander, emblem of Seldarine, maybe Oghma's token, rod of imperial restraint, horn of lostmaunt in drop list of Temple of Tiamat (because only Tiamat's sphere isn't enough)

Thank you,

And finally.

TURN TO. FOUNDRY, RECOMMENDATED QUESTS, AND. ADD. DROP. TO. IT"S CHEST.

with much love. Michelle.

genjundead · October 2016

i will do 200+ throne runs or pom runs and only get +1 to +3 rings maybe even a +4 if i am lucky.

genjundead · October 2016

@strumslinger
i think not just i but many others here really want loyal gear asap. getting it was easy on gateway and a good way to earn ad. now everyone needs it for companions and they are way to pricey on ah.

mikal · October 2016

You guys have got to get your act together or im out. This money grabbing isn't going to fly. Right now im paying for VIP at £7 a time and what do i get? access to facilities that i can go to the enclave for anyway? some identification scrolls and 1 single key for a lockbox that i am garaunteed to never see a legendary mount out of because of the 0.000000003 chance of a drop.
I was able to accept the invoke changes because people SHOULD be playing content to get rewards, but you offer no rewards whatsoever with the flood of +1 rings that now only salvage for 2k.

It's no accident that you guys announced the invoke change at the same time as the dungeon key changes, you know that less people will be playing dungeons to make use of the new bonus diamonds system, so less diamonds in the economy to transfer into zen. Under those circumstances simply buying from the zen store looks like the most atractive option. For me this is not a free to play game, i pay for VIP which i now treat as a subscription, sort this out or i cancel.

spideymt · October 2016

This weekend i made my 520th edemo Run and i made my 75th FBI run. No legendary rings and no set armor in FBI. I guss you know what kind of better loot i wish for.

bitt3rnightmar3 · October 2016

lordseth1985 said:

greyhawk#1973 said:
If they want to monetize why the heck can't they monetize fashion, mounts, cool effects etc?
Well... what was the last fashion/cosmetics that devs bring to the game? It seems that they don't even care about this.

Masterwork Fashion? Summer Fashion?

draftingdave · October 2016

Part of the solution would be adding a currency (similar to Trade Bars) that is a guaranteed drop. The vendor that takes this currency would have +5 Rings, parts of sets (if not whole sets), and maybe some other Group Focused items. This way, we're not in the frustrating state of "I've used 200+ rings and have gotten HAMSTER."

bratleyray · October 2016

Please no more currency... we have plenty. How about a +5 ring box? With increased drop rates. Make the box unbound. Keep the rings bound. You could even do a defensive and offensive box. No key to unlock either... kinda like weapon packs.

kreatyve · October 2016

draftingdave said:
Part of the solution would be adding a currency (similar to Trade Bars) that is a guaranteed drop. The vendor that takes this currency would have +5 Rings, parts of sets (if not whole sets), and maybe some other Group Focused items. This way, we're not in the frustrating state of "I've used 200+ rings and have gotten HAMSTER."

I personally like this idea, though while @bratleyray has a point that we have plenty of currencies already, as long as that currency is in the currency tab and not taking up room in our inventory, I don't mind having more.

kreatyve · October 2016

Another idea, I just thought about, and maybe it's been suggested here and my skimming over everything is why I thought about it, idk...

How about letting PC players earn the Legendary Dragon keys through the Foundry, and maybe giving the consoles some other way of earning them too. I realize that the consoles don't have the Foundry, and probably never will, but it is one of the current best things about the PC game, or well, SHOULD BE, but it needs so much love.

I don't pretend to know the reasons why the consoles don't have the Foundry, but maybe if Cryptic gave the Foundry enough love and support, Microsoft and Sony would allow the consoles to have the Foundry (if indeed that is what's holding it back).

rafaelda · October 2016

First of all tks a lot !!
That's how you turn a bad move in something realy good, a really nice response and a good oportunity to do something good from this broken Drop+Mechanic, and make some money from this too...

There's another point i haven't mentioned in my other post, a lot of members have said that cosmetics are a good way to make money, so that's to a possible drop from dungeons BOE Fashion stuff...
I know that is not something easy to implement but is at least something to think about...

Again tks a lot and good luck !

excat56 · October 2016

frozenfirevr said:

excat56#5321 said:

u4310h55a#2650 said:
As a player on the PS4( not sure if that matters) but I agree with the op that needing to open a ton of chests and having junk drop, it would be a shame to have to use a key to look. for example when I farmed out my Twisted set, I used about 25 dragon keys, and the rest I used greater demonic, that I was able to make. I did not mind the twisted farm, since I knew that I would get 1 twisted ichor on a silver run and 2 for gold. If we had to farm Demo for a chance for a twisted main hand or off hand drop, I would have quit.

I think if your going to make the keys used on open, than we need something like twisted.

For example, on running Lostmouth, you would open the chest and get a Lostmouth token, that could be exchanged for bind on pick up gear, ( account bound) and Leaving bind of Equip gear to chance.

I feel this way would honor people who want to play and get the gear they want, and keeping the Boe gear would let people who dont have time to grind to still buy the gear with AD.
Hate to say this, but this is a horrible idea.

It would be exactly like edemo then. Run it until you get what you want, then never go back unless you are helping someone. As most other's have all agreed on, BOP should NOT exist after this change is implemented.

This would make que'ing for anything harder after the first month or two of this change, as a majority of ppl that got what they wanted would never go back, then you're left with a few farmers trying to make AD. Then once you do have what you're after, what is even the point of the token if everything you get from it is BOP?

No thanks.
Not right, people will continue to farm it for AD and a chance at BoE. Also, people didn't stop farming Demo, the +5s are still out there. Demo is less farmable (if you have your +5s) since it doesn't give BoE Twisted set, if there's a chance for that too, then it'll go on.
excat56#5321 said:
Then once you do have what you're after, what is even the point of the token if everything you get from it is BOP?

u4310h55a#2650 said:
For example, on running Lostmouth, you would open the chest and get a Lostmouth token, that could be exchanged for bind on pick up gear, ( account bound) and Leaving bind of Equip gear to chance.
???
Where did he say chance at BoP?

I guess you're not on ps4. Sorry, I'm in the 2nd or 3rd largest guild on PS4, and those that have their twisted spend their time in CN unless you beg and plea enough, or they simply don't play. The drop rates of a useful ring is so much lower than the drop chance of enchants in CN. Players spend time where some type of advancement can be may even somewhat consistently, be it ad or rp.

Thanks for quoting that for me. If you would have read it, you would have answered your own question

u4310h55a#2650 said:
For example, on running Lostmouth, you would open the chest and get a Lostmouth token, that could be exchanged for bind on pick up gear, ( account bound) and Leaving bind of Equip gear to chance.

Just as I said, the tokens would be pointless once you had what you needed, then once again, left only to rng. Great, cash your tokens in, then there's no reason to go back. Once you're BiS, there's no point to go back. A token system for anything other than ring selection is a band-aid to the real problem. Their rng system is bogus, and they don't have enough items in game that are actually desirable, but PLENTY in the zen store, which is were the real problem is.

The economy on ps4 is HAMSTER, and i mean utter HAMSTER. They have screwed us over giving us 3 x2 ad and rp's in the first 3 months of the game. All it has done is rocket the adx in their favor, and majority of players are not dumb to this fact.

One thing that ppl must remember, console's are more than likely NEVER getting foundry. Anyone see how much of a headache it was for Bethesda to even simply get mod's implemented? Sorry, PWE is not AAA, and will never come close to being AAA because of their pay to play model. It's very clear they have zero interest in becoming even slightly competitive in the entertainment value to $$ with any other game one console, including other F2P's. I'm also willing to bet, console's make up a MAJORITY of their active players, especially ones that pay. I understand PC's been around 3 years, but sorry, you don't fix a problem for one side, and leave the other two hanging.

It's fine though, because at the end of the day, when ppl stop playing, they will only have their selves to blame. Soo many of us have stopped paying for anything. 20 days left on vip, oh well, on both mine and my wife's. Yeah. Not spending a DIME unless they come out with their plan before their black friday sale, IF console's even get it.

I personally tell people that ask me now, to stay away from NW unless they are willing to spend hundreds upon hundreds of dollars to pay to advance in the game. Until they, PWE, or whoever, make a product where you can realistically EARN everything in game, aside from items that give you ZERO stat value, the game will be that way to me, not worth the investment. Paying is an OPTION in a F2P game, not a requirement, thus, when a customer feels like the time they have to spend is better paid, they will pay, but not forced to pay. Or, stop lying that the game is F2P, and call it what it is.

beckylunatic · October 2016

ironzerg79 said:

lordseth1985 said:
@lordseth1985 special rewards chest should be opened with zen keys or currencies keys
Why?

Why indeed.

Movement from getting loot just for beating the content to a key-based system is something that happened so gradually, we didn't entirely notice it happening. To be fair, some content still gives you a keyless reward. Yet... a lot doesn't. And not everyone has VIP for "free" keys either, which means that if your dungeon bosses drop you a big fat nothing, how unfortunate for you. The keys that are for a "bonus" reward have been a buffer against really bad, horrible, terrible loot and even worse odds.

Crafting campaign keys means consciously deciding you're going to use that currency to make a key and not put it into SH resources. That conflicting demand bothers me a lot, the more I think about it.

bitt3rnightmar3 said:

lordseth1985 said:

greyhawk#1973 said:
If they want to monetize why the heck can't they monetize fashion, mounts, cool effects etc?
Well... what was the last fashion/cosmetics that devs bring to the game? It seems that they don't even care about this.
Masterwork Fashion? Summer Fashion?

Intern outfit too (from Portobello). But the devs have essentially washed their hands of attempts to monetize fashion when they removed all cosmetic items from direct Zen purchase. And I will continue to call that a huge fail, because we have the same problem with fashion that we had with mounts... plenty of neato stuff available but nowhere to put it (except in our regular storage, which is crammed with other hamsters). If they'd built the infrastructure to make it easy and desirable to collect fashion, how many more people would have every outfit just because they can? I avoid buying more fashion items and avoid claiming/opening fashions the game gives me because I don't have room. I have no interest in creating more storage problems for myself than what the game generates all on its own.

I bought all of two mounts before the stable launched (epic shadow wolf and the cube at the introductory sale price), and almost never picked up event mounts. A few of my characters ended up with a vanity mount, but most of them rode the horse from the Guardian pack because I could not justify anything more than that. I admired the art of many mounts, but wasn't prepared to take the trouble of curating them. I now own about half of the mounts that have ever been released in the Zen store (and am willing to collect more), and grab what I can from events. Complete turnaround, and not only because of the insignia system, but because the storage problem disappeared.

bratleyray · October 2016

They could expand VIP and give us a daily legendary key. since many of the current VIP uses dont get used. that way they still make money and we get more chances on loot. could also add a seal vendor and the stronghold vendors as well. maybe have increased drop rates to various items as part of vip as well.

mimicking · October 2016

wylonus said:
pretty much samething with those "Stronghold Keys", that is also very wrong.
we killed the dragons and cant open for rewards???????????

many guild leaders are upset with that, and it also cost players many donations to "Rebuilt", it seem a bait and switch after buying stonghold to be only to find out.

see why some buying the bells and see why buying the keys to claim the prizes? that is both "doubled-blade" money-grabs.

wylonus We are looking into this as well, thanks for the confirmation.
M.K.

greyhawk · October 2016

I really hate the idea of making VIP cash only, and wish people would quit suggesting it. Up until now I've used money to buy VIP but moving forward I'm going to try using ad converted to zen, because I'm not about to spend more until there are noticeable improvement in several aspects of the game.

I like the idea of a legendary key as part of VIP. I think it should be part of the current ranks though. Not sure they need to or should add more ranks.

But, in order to entice those that feel utterly betrayed by this whole fiasco, they really need to pull out all the stops on rewards. If they're too stingy they will most likely not bring those people back, and could actually lose more players.

And, make no mistake.. they have lost a lot of players, and more are hanging up their swords everyday. They need to make great announcements soon IMO. Don't wait longer, or this animosity will just fester...

uptondarkdiamond · October 2016

bratleyray said:
Please no more currency... we have plenty. How about a +5 ring box? With increased drop rates. Make the box unbound. Keep the rings bound. You could even do a defensive and offensive box. No key to unlock either... kinda like weapon packs.

Look, I can understand that some don't desire more currency. If it doesn't take up inventory space I don't know how there can be a problem with have a different currency every Mod... ohh, wait that already happens. Anyway, I think the many problems with the currency atm, is more associated with the UI and known when your at max for the different currency type, and this is something that should be absolutely addressed. It is a QoL thing and beyond the discussion of this thread (IMHO).

I will not stop trying to push for a non-RnG way to get gear that is intricate (new armor sets, +5 rings) to the game play of Neverwinter. For my perspective the DEV's have lots of assets in the game that just need to be updated with this non-RnG process that help to minimize the amount of RnG that seems to have overrun the process for obtaining and upgrading the new and intricate gear.

If you don't think there is a problem with RnG here is a quick read that will help you understand the frustration that some players have to deal with:

1. http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1221259/a-story-of-boots
2. http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter#/discussion/538394/black-ice-glove-grind?sso=eyJuYW1lIjoiIiwicGhvdG91cmwiOiIiLCJjbGllbnRfaWQiOiIxNDQzOTY4OTgxIn0=+b151ca7c488a0cfeca83cd9b9e7c2b77bd2ed5a0+1477942699+hmacsha1 (for the new school players that never had to deal with trying to be BI gloves)

So, some appear to be lucky with getting RnG, will others (me included in this) just don't seem to get those items to drop. There are 2 ways that I can see that would help with this.

1. Using campaign currency make available to get the required components to craft (yep, one of those assets that seldom ever see and update), or immediately purchase from the campaign store. This will help players by knowing that there is light at the end of the tunnel and they will eventually get that gear through game play and not RnG. Cryptic did a good job with this when they introduced the twisted weapons set... we knew that eventually we would get the weapons set even if RnG did not favor us.

2. Make those items (the intricate gear) BoE. Some people are just lucky with RnG why should they not beable to make a little dough on the side for there luck? This will also ease how much RnG players have to deal with. Lets face it, there are some players that really enjoy farming HE and whatnot (more power to them), why shouldn't they be rewarded for playing the game the way they want to play it. Also, having more BoE gear I think will go a long way to reducing the Zax backlog.

Doing both of above things, I think will have a immediate and positive impact for all players in neverwinter.

Ok, back to currency....

One the problem with currency is that they only apply to certain campaigns which may or may not hold any interest to players. One, of the things that I think Cryptic should look at implementing is a:

Currency Exchange Vendor

What you say, a currency exchange vendor? Sounds interesting tell us more!

Np, a couple of points first:

1. There are a lot of assets in neverwinter that don't see much interaction or updates. Like I already pointed out in this thread, the Seven Suns Coster Market has assets just sitting around waiting to be a intricate part of never winter. The problem is that they have absolutely nothing that would interest a level 70 player.... to bad. Instead of having to completely design new assets Cryptic really should use these assets and just update their wares. Using this approach I think would save the Dev's time and money. So, we have the vendors figured out.
2. Because, there are already so many different campaign's that are part of neverwinter and also because people enjoy playing the different parts for so many different reasons we end up with a lot of different campaign currencies. Some people like T1/T2 dungeon delving, some like doing Sharandar/Dread Ring, some like doing CN/FBI, and some like doing the bigger encounters like eDeMo/Tiamat. At, some point we run out of useful things to by with that campaign currency and then mostly just figure out which experience gives us the most RoI in the form of AD generation, BORING imho.

So, what does this all mean? Ok, there are lots of suggestions out there for how to upgrade the chest opening experience and make it better. Many players, many different suggestions. Because we are individuals, we have a different take on how we want to experience the game, no problem. But, how can the DEVs make sure that they use the time/money wisely to ensure players get what they desire while journeying through neverwinter.... Hard task to be sure.

I can not say this enough... There are already a Ton of Assets in Neverwinter
Don't recreate the wheel.... use what you have...

Example

Lots are looking at fashion rewards as good use of there neverwinter playing experience.... guess what we have a system in play for this....

The Gauntlgym Supplier

He is part of the Maze Engine campaign and his inventory includes armor and weapon fashion sets.

The problem is, he only takes alliance supplies to by the gear. Alliance supplies are completed by doing quest obtained from Bruenor Battlehammer in Mantol-Derith. Yep, you have to grind this experience out... I guess on the plus side there is no daily limit on how many quests you can get, but its the same ole same ole experience..... So, it could be a painful somewhat short experience or its going to take you awhile to get a set. I'm in the - It's going to take me awhile - group.

But, what if there was a vendor that exchanged currency for Alliance supplies? If you like doing dungeons then you could use your protector/elemental seals to buy alliance supplies to by that fashion set that your chasing after by doing what you enjoy doing as part of your neverwinter experience.

IMHO, this is a good idea that will target almost all players in neverwinter, while saving the Devs time/money by using systems already in play. Think about it this way, if the Devs want to add an updated fashion set all they have to do is add it to the Maze engine campaign vendor and viola, new content added quickly with minimal time and money....

Just saying,

beckylunatic · October 2016

uptondarkdiamond said:

1. There are a lot of assets in neverwinter that don't see much interaction or updates. Like I already pointed out in this thread, the Seven Suns Coster Market has assets just sitting around waiting to be a intricate part of never winter. The problem is that they have absolutely nothing that would interest a level 70 player.... to bad. Instead of having to completely design new assets Cryptic really should use these assets and just update their wares. Using this approach I think would save the Dev's time and money. So, we have the vendors figured out.

Those marketplace vendors sell a ton of my favorite items for transmuting, unavailable anywhere else. Anyone hamsters with that and I am going to have to start cutting people.

trgluestickz · October 2016

beckylunatic said:

uptondarkdiamond said:

1. There are a lot of assets in neverwinter that don't see much interaction or updates. Like I already pointed out in this thread, the Seven Suns Coster Market has assets just sitting around waiting to be a intricate part of never winter. The problem is that they have absolutely nothing that would interest a level 70 player.... to bad. Instead of having to completely design new assets Cryptic really should use these assets and just update their wares. Using this approach I think would save the Dev's time and money. So, we have the vendors figured out.
Those marketplace vendors sell a ton of my favorite items for transmuting, unavailable anywhere else. Anyone hamsters with that and I am going to have to start cutting people.

They should just move those older items to the adventurer's seal traders. Problem solved.

beckylunatic · October 2016

I'd much rather pay the current 14 silver than any quantity of adventurer seals, thx.

Incidentally, those same vendors also sell nice rare gear for level-10 and -20 characters, but since their inventory updates as you level, a lot of players likely never find that.

If someone wants to add more vendors back to the marketplace, start with the two corners where seal vendors were outright removed. The AD vendors were also outright removed, which was fair because their wares were a rip-off (not unique inventory, but grossly overpriced). Put some discontinued NPCs back before monkeying with the inventory of the ones that remain.

Preview the necklaces from the jewelry vendor and see how many examples of unique art for chokers there are. A lot of work went into making different equipment appearances for the game's launch, and most of the systems for delivering them have been gutted.

Update on the Dungeon Key Change

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