schweifer1982Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,662Arc User
edited April 2016
Feedback: Those changes are a nice addon nothing gamebreaking . But the new clave hit animation is uncontrollable when i started to press the at-will it just hit and move around & across my target and i must turn back to my target ,it is an issue cuz i never hit the 3th clave on my target.
The hoard (lol) set was gamebreaking(bug) but i lost more then 30%-40% of my dps i just realized this so it will have a huge inpact on pve and pvp .
Thats all fine but you need to nerf the x2 damage of some skills and the dps of GF in general. GFs always had more dps then paladins and better buffs, now that you are nerfing paladins you need to nerf GF dps.
Why would some need nerf x2 GF dps in general except motivated by jealousy? Nor GF neither OP don't compete for Paingiver. ITF alone is not better than Vow of Enmity/Bane and auras of Courage/Wisdom.
I wish the activation time of Villain's Menace was reduced. Or - even better - let the CC immunity start earlier. It is annoying to see a red area, active the daily and yet get kicked to the ground because I was some milliseconds too late.
I second that and also would add, to be able to use it while under CC. The other melee (TRs, GWF) and Pally have that capability, GF should too. i would also like them to have more HP like in the old days, right now they dont have that much more HP than the other classes and normally as GF one has to manage our health and dailies much better. Not sure how a GF with 160K HP can compare with a 300K HP paladin with 360 block. I use my GF just for PvP while I tank with my Pally. Unless my party needs buff I dont see me playing tank as a GF. Great Start though.
ScyLent PvE GF Main S C Y L E N T PvE DC Alt ScyLent Lux PvE OP Alt Unrepentantgaming.com
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ghoulz66Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,748Arc User
Thats all fine but you need to nerf the x2 damage of some skills and the dps of GF in general. GFs always had more dps then paladins and better buffs, now that you are nerfing paladins you need to nerf GF dps.
Why would some need nerf x2 GF dps in general except motivated by jealousy? Nor GF neither OP don't compete for Paingiver. ITF alone is not better than Vow of Enmity/Bane and auras of Courage/Wisdom.
Will a tank OP use bane and vow...? Probably not.
Devotion sure, but a DC's buffs are a superior DPS buff for the entire party. So there, GF/DC wins yet again.
Thank you very much. Can you do something about reducing Iron Warrior's activation time? It's a bit too slow...
Iron Warrior is very situational I would rather see an increase of casting time for Villain's Menace.
Nancy - Dragonborn, SM Guardian Fighter A proud member of "mythical horde of DPS GFs"
1). Is SW more dps or tank based? 2). Yes. I am panzer! 3). Get ACT if you want to celebrate your epeen. 4). Horniness will not stand between me and what I believe - "MM"
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
Seems like an opportune time to mention that Martial Mastery (Tactician capstone feat) does not work as allegedly intended, as documented here:
I have also noticed that temp hitpoints that I am relatively certain are generated by Into the Fray are not dropping off when combat ends. It's not a large amount, but it's not consistent with the recent changes to temp HP.
Most of you might not of been playing NWO at the time, but the conqueror tree got a major nerf. It used to be a flat (and large) buff to your power. They changed that to have stacks of dmg and crit, ok, but not nearly as good as the original. Also, the GF shield used to block 100% of damage. That not only got nerfed to 80%, but it was also semi-broken for a long time. It also only blocks right in front of you. A lot of GF skills or feats are totally bugged. 3 I've confirmed myself and reported. Another major capstone bug post BeckyL just posted (I've known this one all along and left the tac tree 5 mods ago). From mod3/4/5, GFs were often not wanted even before the OP class got released and put PvE GF's out of a job for another mod (make that 2 mods).
And I have GF and a GWF. And that anvil of doom is not even close to the power of a GWF's indomitable battle strike. Anvil, you have to wait for the target to get to below 40% (and very close and stands still), IBS is fair game all the time. I have a GF with 24k power, a GWF with 9k power. The GWF IBS's is almost always higher with almost 1/3 the power rating.
ITF does have a high dmg buff. I've tested it myself. It's over-performing by 200%. I'd be ok with that being lowered for more temp hitpoints to the party. Keep the speed and AP the same, switch the dmg for more temp HPs. The amount of temp HP it gives is useless.
EDIT: or/are
Post edited by deathbeez on
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mamalion1234Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,415Arc User
^^ A SW with the same bufs would do 200m damage.We have seen it in edemo.Someone else stepped that 200m is not normal ,but the normal should be in the 45-50m range.And you complain about this hit?
My friends hit 310k Sure Strikes in elol with out none of the party wearing any legacy set.
Sharp's parties are always well picked and work in synergy with each other. This vid demonstrates what a current geared good party can do,and nothing more.it cannot be taken ad-hoc ,by CWs (what they want in a Gf thread talking about att wills faster animations-nvm) to advocate a nerf..on the pve Gf.
PVE GFs is not your "enemy" in paingiver you know it we know it.it is SWs and GWFs.
I'm not complaining, I'm just saying that GFs can deal decent damage. The comparison in this thread was between CWs and GFs anyways. It's kind of laughable that CWs are going to be so bad that they won't be able to compete with GFs on damage.
Look freya is in Gutbusters Brigade with lvl 20 SH(GZ btw) 8000(+20%) power 8000(itf+20%dmg) this alone is on top of the point he have full legendary and mythic stuff on top LOL set+ T.vorpal and god knows what pets she/he have .
Balance a Class cuz of items and asking for nerf cuz of items is just a stupid idea . Balance a Class cuz overbuffed overdebuffed boss figth is a bad idea to.
The point is GF need those buffs not becuz pvp cuz pve GF community asking for it cuz they cant tank CN really well (and not becuz they are bad players ).
: |
Oh please. Tanking CN just means you use SM/tac and run with a DC. If you can't tank as SM/tac it really does mean that you're bad.
So you mean all GF's shoud go SM/tac run with dc (AP gain heavy nerfed). Then why do y ask for nerf's to GF SM/tac they cannot do dmg also TANKING and managing agro is two separate things.
OFC there is a broken legendary pet hou can tank CN and buff us with 40 power etc etc and cannot die.
Who cares about ap gain? 1hit from orcus on shield and ur AP is full, its not why we r taking DCs, tho its for sure nice for dps spamming dailies. Endgame GF dont anyway. SM is rly nice protector, but u dont need it, u just need to have skill and some heal on ur back if u refuse to use FR, i personally think conq is over tact for simple reason, he hits harder = more heal from FR, also harder hits more aggro. so when ur agregative strike hits for 80k and gwfs for 800k, u still keep aggro, when ur aggragative hits for 40, well...
This is endgame party with no SD, and im conq. The thing about endgame is we come in prepared, in this case we r strong players, but none of us is BiS, maybe i am at 90% to BiS, rest is lower. I guarantee u it was reproduced with 2k GF, ofc took longer. Waste i was not in that party, u should ask @thefabricant.
"broken pet" is a utter lie, it just has 100% aoe resist, as every other Master Defender pet, orcus still has his "fist bump" which is single target and can get any defender down, but thats for what lliira bell is. There is nothing broken, u just need to "compile ur playstyle with label --thinking-on" . Not my fault u dont test stuff and dont know how it works. Best option is to say "its broken" while u didnt even had a glance on pets abilities, if u did, u would know its not "broken legendary pet" but its any master defender, which is r35+ (epic included).
But its better to spread utter nonsense. How we say it in polish, "lie will run around the world twice, before the truth puts on boots."
(Sin)cerely Kain
can we agree you should do that job take the hit and shouldnt exist a companion do that job?
This is endgame party with no SD, and im conq. (Sin)cerely Kain
That was a very impressive 19 seconds of tanking...
No flame intended, but your video in the changes to the guardian fighter thread show how useless the class is to a very high DPS/ end game party, even in the hardest fight in the game. The fight lasted 20'ish seconds and not a single ball dropped. You literally didn't even need to be there.
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zekethesinnerMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 805Arc User
This is endgame party with no SD, and im conq. (Sin)cerely Kain
That was a very impressive 19 seconds of tanking...
No flame intended, but your video in the changes to the guardian fighter thread show how useless the class is to a very high DPS/ end game party, even in the hardest fight in the game. The fight lasted 20'ish seconds and not a single ball dropped. You literally didn't even need to be there.
Thats a mistaken assumption, first of all at that point (when i recorded that video) effectiveness of my buff/debuffs was around 110%, which means if i would not be there those 20s would be around 40s (also there were dc buffs to my ITF, so final outcome could be around 50s even when adding 1 more dps in my spot ) Still a bit short for an endgame fight, but my toon is semi-build for buffing (im still conqueror, coz i refuse doing my dailies 2x longer it should take). Anyway longer the fight, more chances to faill, and chances to fail should be restricted to minimum.
-offtopic- Why parties should have balanced squads. lets make small assumption that all dps r similiar lvl and deal similiar dps 5 dps party each having 100 000 dmg per second
second option:
3 dps each having 100 000 dmg per second average gf making dmg of dps x2 (80% ITF + 20% debuff tide is already +100%, then there is mark) average buffer dc making dmg of dps x2 (multiplication not even included).
final result: 1 option 5x 100 000 = 500 000 dmg per second 2 option 100 000 x3 x2 x2: 1 200 000 dmg per second.
Additional survivability and buffers personal dmg not even taken into account.
Also that team was build for endgame players, but for sure not BiS ones.
EDIT HERE: My whole point about this offtopic is, having 3 dps and 2 good buffers equals to having 12 dps (in this case, hope u get my point) -/offtopic-
This is endgame party with no SD, and im conq. (Sin)cerely Kain
That was a very impressive 19 seconds of tanking...
No flame intended, but your video in the changes to the guardian fighter thread show how useless the class is to a very high DPS/ end game party, even in the hardest fight in the game. The fight lasted 20'ish seconds and not a single ball dropped. You literally didn't even need to be there.
Thats a mistaken assumption, first of all at that point (when i recorded that video) effectiveness of my buff/debuffs was around 110%, which means if i would not be there those 20s would be around 40s (also there were dc buffs to my ITF, so final outcome could be around 50s even when adding 1 more dps in my spot ) Still a bit short for an endgame fight, but my toon is semi-build for buffing (im still conqueror, coz i refuse doing my dailies 2x longer it should take). Anyway longer the fight, more chances to faill, and chances to fail should be restricted to minimum.
-offtopic- Why parties should have balanced squads. lets make small assumption that all dps r similiar lvl and deal similiar dps 5 dps party each having 100 000 dmg per second
second option:
3 dps each having 100 000 dmg per second average gf making dmg of dps x2 (80% ITF + 20% debuff tide is already +100%, then there is mark) average buffer dc making dmg of dps x2 (multiplication not even included).
final result: 1 option 5x 100 000 = 500 000 dmg per second 2 option 100 000 x3 x2 x2: 1 200 000 dmg per second.
Additional survivability and buffers personal dmg not even taken into account.
Also that team was build for endgame players, but for sure not BiS ones.
EDIT HERE: My whole point about this offtopic is, having 3 dps and 2 good buffers equals to having 12 dps (in this case, hope u get my point) -/offtopic-
Also @mamalion1234 i have no idea what did u want to say.
(Sin)cerely Kain
i am clear TANK SHOULD tank and not the companions and the companion if dies need to have a cooldown whatever is even if is my active to join again the battle lets say 30 Seconds.
I KNOW is bad design those bosses also the scorpions in elol they stand and watch a defender companion, my question is if they have so bad design does your tank need defender companion? no. so go tank byyourself( i am not refering to you:P)
JUST poeple want when you fight orcus a pt without gf or op should struggle like happens in lostmauth lair. even a bis player can go down very easy vs all the bosses in epic lol.;p if party doesnt have a tank.
Ok, but now please add any way to GWF to not die in pvp versus GF. Now just GF have alltime shield, so you can't control him(GWF can't go in back of tank in 1vs1), and GWF have no escape from GF combo(if you are near to GF shift doesn't help usually), why i need to run from GF everytime i see him without chances to kill him? I want balance in PVP!
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mamalion1234Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,415Arc User
at least bane will increase lostmauth vegenance it is debuff;p
i am clear TANK SHOULD tank and not the companions and the companion if dies need to have a cooldown whatever is even if is my active to join again the battle lets say 30 Seconds.
I KNOW is bad design those bosses also the scorpions in elol they stand and watch a defender companion, my question is if they have so bad design does your tank need defender companion? no. so go tank byyourself( i am not refering to you:P)
JUST poeple want when you fight orcus a pt without gf or op should struggle like happens in lostmauth lair. even a bis player can go down very easy vs all the bosses in epic lol.;p if party doesnt have a tank.
Did you just try to imply that you need a tank for elol? Because you really don't.
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zekethesinnerMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 805Arc User
i am clear TANK SHOULD tank and not the companions and the companion if dies need to have a cooldown whatever is even if is my active to join again the battle lets say 30 Seconds.
I KNOW is bad design those bosses also the scorpions in elol they stand and watch a defender companion, my question is if they have so bad design does your tank need defender companion? no. so go tank byyourself( i am not refering to you:P)
JUST poeple want when you fight orcus a pt without gf or op should struggle like happens in lostmauth lair. even a bis player can go down very easy vs all the bosses in epic lol.;p if party doesnt have a tank.
Did you just try to imply that you need a tank for elol? Because you really don't.
Thats whole another story, i said it already somewhere else. Elol is mod4 dungeon, u can just speed cut through it, and its how its should be, after all its 5 mods-old content. Its 1 and a half of a year now. There should not be anything challenging about it, coz of 2 things, players had 5 mods to learn it, and thus even slowpokes should already catch up with it, and secondly our gear is outperforming content like elol by miles.
Actually, sadly no content we have here is creating a need for tank in party. Everything can be solved by kiting or, ironically to what some claims, control, all u need is skilled player, and everything is double. Having tank/heal for buffs is whole different story i already explained.
And yes, ppl without tank struggle in t1/t2 or higher, but if they r going with that composition (without tank/heal) and fail i would just say they overestimated they skills and payed price in form of wasted time.
I just copied over my freshly level 60 GF over so I could test both the "new" EE and the GF tweaks at the same time.
The most immediate thing that sticks out is the slightly clipped look of Cleave's animations with the new faster attack speed. The animation doesn't seem to finish before it enters the next step in the combo.
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lantern22Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,111Arc User
Another vote here for more aggro. The last mod or so I've noticed it being harder to keep aggro with the damage being done by the DPS classes. This might sort itself out with the LOL set nerf tho. Its irritating when a GF rushes ahead, grabs all the aggro and then your playing catch up for the whole fight.
I'd like it if Threatening Rush not only marked but also applied a hard taunt if enhanced mark was slotted (nice synergy), that would give the IV's out there something special that we could call our own.
I'd like to say give us a little more DPS to make dailies more enjoyable, but not too much otherwise what's the point of going a squishy DPS class (i.e. CW) if a GF does nearly as much damage . . . . . not sure really.
Finally, whilst you might want to tone it down a bit, please don't remove the synergies between things like Astral Shield etc. with ITF. Those types of intricacies associated with skill combinations and the synergies between classes give the game depth and make it sooooo much more enjoyable and complex - particularly for the support classes. At the moment I am really enjoying running with DC's and seeing the party benefits when we get our HAMSTER together and time our encounts right.
Offtopic: I've tanked CN including the final name on my GF with very little issues zonewide...and I'm at best slightly over 2.7 IL and by no means BIS. I'm not exactly sure the gripe....yeah Oc can be very punishing if you don't pay attention which I didn't at one point but doable.
On Topic...I like the proposed changes from what I read but I'd also like all our marks to stay for a set time not just drop off once we're hit which tbh is usually within a second or so. Our HP could use a pass to increase it. All I got for the moment until I can get on and test the changes.
Should be fixed Knight Valor too, even with patch OP's Divine protector is still incomparable and all the people would choose an OP instead of a GF.
An other fix is GF's guard: is only in front, if we take damage on side or from back we get full damage (this is not a problem), OP's Guard block damage e Control resist at 360°. Sometime if we get damage through shield we get full damage now I don't know if is a bug or not but the chance is a bit 'too high, I'll die 4-6 because i get full damage from blocked hit (that is a problem, if tank die all party die)
Steel defense from daily activation is bugge too, but only vs demon like Demongorgon and all CN boss, I get killed even buff actived.
I think in PVP GF now is overpower, especially using temp HP bug, but in PVE is... well is useless as a tank
I've found a strange mechanics of new guardian-fighter's mark. My english isn't so well that is why I'll write in points: 1) Without shield block press Tab to start activation of new mark. 2) Immediately press and hold Shift (like for interrupt cast of mark and get ready to blocking). 3) In spite of that you still hold Shift your shield block will be deactivated after few moments while you still hold Shift.
4) Shield block will not be activated while you still hold Shift. 5) To activate shield block again you need to press and hold Shift key one more time.
Not sure what do you mean, but it's probably the delay in blocking that we've described times before. Sometimes no matter what you do, the block will just not work, and it needs a bit of time before you can put the shield up again.
Nancy - Dragonborn, SM Guardian Fighter A proud member of "mythical horde of DPS GFs"
1). Is SW more dps or tank based? 2). Yes. I am panzer! 3). Get ACT if you want to celebrate your epeen. 4). Horniness will not stand between me and what I believe - "MM"
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
Instead we were from mod6 seeing all time in our chat in PE "lfg OP tank".Sure the ones we had friends/guilds we carried on.But lesser geared GFs swapped class or worst left the game.
You do know the bubble mode is broken and produced a generation of players with gameplay reflexes and positioning far worse than in those pre Mod6.
I posted in the OP forums and asked for DPS buffs.RA to be reworked for pve ,neutralising its ridicoulous knock affect and replacing with something else.Also Divine Touch to be viable and not hit 2/3 of a damage of an Oath Strike. Funny enough i was the only one that asked these obvious things.Most Ops continue to defend a broken mechanism-Bubble Mode.This tells something that want really care and want.Easy Mode.Or worst ,what they learned from that class,so far.
As @stretch611 said tanks are still in low numbers and in order NW to thrive(and all to continue have fun of this game) we need both classes.
As for you you are a good gamer ,i remember you when you were playing your HR.You will have 0 problem to adapt. If you post in the Op feedback thread and ask for reasonable things,the devs seem to have a whole new fresh view of the game. it is a golden opportunity to fine tune some lacking gameplay aspects of OP class.DivP would go ,time to move on and make OP a different,yet effective, defender class of NW,still able to excell in the game.
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Peace \o/
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ghoulz66Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,748Arc User
I have already wrote here suggestion about GF's daily power [Fighter's recovery]. But now I would like to write feedback about it more concretely.
Wth, why would GFs want their only means to stay alive in PVE nerfed? If that happens then nerf the @#$% out of the OP's temp HP and ability to soak up large amounts of damage...
So what that the tank OP and tank GF can actually survive? If the party wipes they may as well allow themselves to die.
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zekethesinnerMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 805Arc User
I haven't understood everything that all you wrote. But in PvE now my GF with just 3k il is immortal (I am protector in iron vanguard). [Fighter's recovery]+[Guarded assault] make GF able to ignore all incoming damage and make him have no care about monsters mechanics. It makes game very boring.
Ps: if we want to make game balanced we also need to balance overpower mechanics and in our class. Balancing doesn't mean that we are going to nerf as much as possible other classes and to improve as much as possible our class. I am trying to change imbalanced game mechanics of GF that I've found after 2 years of playing for my GF.
U know, OP can have Oath 100% up and temp hp will still sulk in every kind of incoming dmg (also they shield is better, more cc resistant than GFs, im not only saying of degrees, they CC resistance is literały 1 lvl higher) So first of all, if OP dont need healer, also GF should have right to play without heal. Second thing is 80% DR, when u take some healing boons and high rec/LS u dont rly need heal at all (in T1/T2 i this case), do u want to nerf it too?
And do u think how many buffing DCs actually can outheal orcus? Coz Op will still dont bother with him, and will be able to take dps + de/fbuffers and u want to take away safeskill (FR) from GF, so he will be forced to take healer, and coz of that GF position will drop in party (yes yes, ITF, we all know nerfhammer is comming, coz of QQers like u).
I haven't understood everything that all you wrote. But in PvE now my GF with just 3k il is immortal (I am protector in iron vanguard). [Fighter's recovery]+[Guarded assault] make GF able to ignore all incoming damage and make him have no care about monsters mechanics. It makes game very boring.
Ps: if we want to make game balanced we also need to balance overpower mechanics and in our class. Balancing doesn't mean that we are going to nerf as much as possible other classes and to improve as much as possible our class. I am trying to change imbalanced game mechanics of GF that I've found after 2 years of playing for my GF.
U know, OP can have Oath 100% up and temp hp will still sulk in every kind of incoming dmg (also they shield is better, more cc resistant than GFs, im not only saying of degrees, they CC resistance is literały 1 lvl higher) So first of all, if OP dont need healer, also GF should have right to play without heal. Second thing is 80% DR, when u take some healing boons and high rec/LS u dont rly need heal at all (in T1/T2 i this case), do u want to nerf it too?
And do u think how many buffing DCs actually can outheal orcus? Coz Op will still dont bother with him, and will be able to take dps + de/fbuffers and u want to take away safeskill (FR) from GF, so he will be forced to take healer, and coz of that GF position will drop in party (yes yes, ITF, we all know nerfhammer is comming, coz of QQers like u).
Spoken like a true Gf that advocate for Op nerfs, flawless logic as usal.....
Thank u.
(Sin)cerely Kain
So in your logical world its ok for Gf to be immortal to damage but not OPs, but that is a matter for solo play when you talk about group play agro control and buffs/debuffs are the important thing(beside surviving to be able to tank ofc).
##If u want healer take OP, they r perfect, brainless heal totems.
(Sin)cerely Kain ##
How about just agree to agree that not much are gained by asking for nerfs and talk down each others classes mkay.
Hello. Dear developers I ask once again think, that you want to make an imbalance in PvP even more noticeable. Once again I ask study material of recently taken place informal tournament (the server Drider) and draw conclusions. The situation with the guards ground in drawing damages really causes attacks of an acute pain. And it is time to change this situation already now, otherwise even more players will leave because of this imbalance. References to information on a tournament (many GF behave very incorrectly in these discussions and video, I apologize for their behavior) : prech0me.ru/nw/bracket_all.html -table of matches of a tournament.
(Оригинал: Доброго времени суток. Уважаемые разработчики прошу ещё раз подумайте ,над тем что вы хотите сделать дисбаланс в пвп ещё более заметным. Ещё раз прошу изучите материал недавно состоявщегося неофициального турнира( сервер Дридер) и сделайте выводы. Ситуация со стражами заточенными в нанесение повреждений действительно вызывает приступы острой боли. И эту ситуацию пора менять уже сейчас, иначе ещё больше игроков уйдут из-за этого дисбаланса. Далее выложена информация о межклассовом турнире и даны ссылки на оный)
"-Temp HP/absorbing damage shields will fall very fast without high defence like GF shield block or bubble."
Two wrongs here. First temp hp never drops.i have tested it with a boonless 1,9k IL OP with the worst build around.You just have to activate Binding Oath and the Templar's wrath in that order.You will never drop your hit points.How many hit points we are talking here? 2k as Gf gets from feats?Nope.we are talking about 96k temp hit points min. Second.with out high defense?We wear the same exact armors and you have access as Op to all same GF defences.Both classes are able to gain benefir from investing in high defence.problem is most OPs at the moment have low defense cause in DivP mode did not needed it.Not Gfs problem though.
"like GF shield block".So....you make it show like OP shield is 20% and Gf shield 120%.In reality is 60% for OP plus more cc and 360 degrees coverage and 80% with less cc and only 180 cov erage for GFs.Hardly any superiority for Gf. reality is i have not have seen prot Ops to use effectivelly shield in the past year.Cause they did not needed it.Well time to learn. Gfs and OP shield duration is exactly the same at base level.
"Paladin can't do shield blocking all over the time to protect themselves like GF (now my shield stamina while blocking even doesn't falls)."
You are wrong here.it is exact same duration.You cannot compare your toon which i suspect has invest in stamina gain gear ,with the OPs that walk around that have invested 0.
"Also paladins much less resistant to knock back effects because their shield block doesn't work all over the time and they can't clean knock back effect (for example in icewind dale it will be much less comfortable for paladin to do tanking on crowd of trolls that knocks back about all over the time)."
GF and OP shield are exactly the same as concerning knock back effects.Actually OP shield is superior that it offers 360 degrees.
"After a bubble change I think that paladin will become much more balanced and will not be as immortal as it was."
Binding oath and templar's wrath combo is the cultprint of its Immortallity.And these remained untouched.
"But GF with good all over the time shield blocking still can ignore all incoming into block damage and CC effects while healing himself."
They can't ignore all damage as you claim.Gf shield block 80% of damage.While healing?We have one daily for that FR.It is not as easy as you think.
"I think that this change will not be catastrophic for GF's self healing. Because you still can use wheel of elements and water artifact weapon to have very high health regeneration. "
well...i don't use Wheel of elements cause i need instant healing most of the times and not walk around in a circle to find i don't know what.Ι use Blood Crystal.(ok i am the exception in that) As for water weapons i am not the exception in Dragon server most PVe Gfs use Twisted weapon set cause it is superior,PVP GFs use the drowned one.(And some Gfs know use Fire Set).
So you want to nerf a global skill-ability of GFs and then to recompensate you say to us to refine an wheel and a drowned set. So you will dictate us our gear and what to equip.Well ,i 'll pass
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All these proposals of yours it is because you as an indivindual you do not find FR adequate cause you are tank specced and you do little damage.So FR is not very viable for you.So you came up with the proposal ,instead of you to gain some power an Arp,to nerf Gfs survivability i two servers ,so the changes to suit you.Great!!!
Hey guys prot pally here and I'll say that I'm glad the bubble nerf is coming as it made pve far 2 easy mode for everything. My main focus is pvp and this should really make pvp more enjoyable as the haste bubble combo is far 2 broken you can have very low gs of this combo topple other team if they don't have it and the fact it makes whole teams invincible is just 2 strong. I look forward 2 the nerfs and have games where dailys are not perma and people can die more regularly. In the whole it will make players play better and learn game mechanics better and hopefully more enjoyable for all. 4 he people who say pally is dead that is just ridiculous it's just more in line with other classes now and not op 2 death.
I did not meant anything personal nor we implied that you should not speak!
If my tone seemed aggressive to you,then i apologize. You are in Drider server ,right?here in dragon there is a wide spread hatred towards GF since at least mod3.Everything said in forums that might enhances the "image" if a Gf that is overperforming(such as your statements that you are immortal),can be used ad-hoc by other known haters of GF class,to advocate for a nerf.
To all the points you said ,i answered with valid ,solid arguments.GF with out FR is dead meat in Orcus fight. you made a comparison between OP and GF,i answered to all your arguments with my own.
Nothing personal, i greet and enjoy talking to all fellows GFs.
Wish you happy gaming and good loot!!!!
Peace!!!! \o/
edit:greetings to brother Russia from Greece!!! \o/
0
jiubiizeekkMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 144Arc User
I haven't understood everything that all you wrote. But in PvE now my GF with just 3k il is immortal (I am protector in iron vanguard). [Fighter's recovery]+[Guarded assault] make GF able to ignore all incoming damage and make him have no care about monsters mechanics. It makes game very boring.
Ps: if we want to make game balanced we also need to balance overpower mechanics and in our class. Balancing doesn't mean that we are going to nerf as much as possible other classes and to improve as much as possible our class. I am trying to change imbalanced game mechanics of GF that I've found after 2 years of playing for my GF.
U know, OP can have Oath 100% up and temp hp will still sulk in every kind of incoming dmg (also they shield is better, more cc resistant than GFs, im not only saying of degrees, they CC resistance is literały 1 lvl higher) So first of all, if OP dont need healer, also GF should have right to play without heal. Second thing is 80% DR, when u take some healing boons and high rec/LS u dont rly need heal at all (in T1/T2 i this case), do u want to nerf it too?
And do u think how many buffing DCs actually can outheal orcus? Coz Op will still dont bother with him, and will be able to take dps + de/fbuffers and u want to take away safeskill (FR) from GF, so he will be forced to take healer, and coz of that GF position will drop in party (yes yes, ITF, we all know nerfhammer is comming, coz of QQers like u).
Spoken like a true Gf that advocate for Op nerfs, flawless logic as usal.....
Thank u.
(Sin)cerely Kain
So in your logical world its ok for Gf to be immortal to damage but not OPs, but that is a matter for solo play when you talk about group play agro control and buffs/debuffs are the important thing(beside surviving to be able to tank ofc).
##If u want healer take OP, they r perfect, brainless heal totems.
(Sin)cerely Kain ##
How about just agree to agree that not much are gained by asking for nerfs and talk down each others classes mkay.
We aren't immortal, we have at least 50% of us unguarded from the back. it takes strategic angling to block the heavy hits. unlike pally who takes all hit all directions and only needs a second to daily and encounter to be immortal.
Comments
But the new clave hit animation is uncontrollable when i started to press the at-will it just hit and move around & across my target and i must turn back to my target ,it is an issue cuz i never hit the 3th clave on my target.
The hoard (lol) set was gamebreaking(bug) but i lost more then 30%-40% of my dps i just realized this so it will have a huge inpact on pve and pvp .
ITF alone is not better than Vow of Enmity/Bane and auras of Courage/Wisdom.
— (The unwritten rule)
ScyLent PvE GF Main
S C Y L E N T PvE DC Alt
ScyLent Lux PvE OP Alt
Unrepentantgaming.com
Devotion sure, but a DC's buffs are a superior DPS buff for the entire party. So there, GF/DC wins yet again.
A proud member of "mythical horde of DPS GFs"
1). Is SW more dps or tank based?
2). Yes. I am panzer!
3). Get ACT if you want to celebrate your epeen.
4). Horniness will not stand between me and what I believe - "MM"
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1214258/some-new-maybe-info-on-tactician-capstone
I have also noticed that temp hitpoints that I am relatively certain are generated by Into the Fray are not dropping off when combat ends. It's not a large amount, but it's not consistent with the recent changes to temp HP.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
It used to be a flat (and large) buff to your power. They changed that to have stacks of dmg and crit, ok, but not nearly as good as the original.
Also, the GF shield used to block 100% of damage. That not only got nerfed to 80%, but it was also semi-broken for a long time. It also only blocks right in front of you.
A lot of GF skills or feats are totally bugged. 3 I've confirmed myself and reported. Another major capstone bug post BeckyL just posted (I've known this one all along and left the tac tree 5 mods ago).
From mod3/4/5, GFs were often not wanted even before the OP class got released and put PvE GF's out of a job for another mod (make that 2 mods).
And I have GF and a GWF. And that anvil of doom is not even close to the power of a GWF's indomitable battle strike. Anvil, you have to wait for the target to get to below 40% (and very close and stands still), IBS is fair game all the time.
I have a GF with 24k power, a GWF with 9k power. The GWF IBS's is almost always higher with almost 1/3 the power rating.
ITF does have a high dmg buff. I've tested it myself. It's over-performing by 200%.
I'd be ok with that being lowered for more temp hitpoints to the party. Keep the speed and AP the same, switch the dmg for more temp HPs. The amount of temp HP it gives is useless.
EDIT: or/are
No flame intended, but your video in the changes to the guardian fighter thread show how useless the class is to a very high DPS/ end game party, even in the hardest fight in the game.
The fight lasted 20'ish seconds and not a single ball dropped. You literally didn't even need to be there.
-offtopic-
Why parties should have balanced squads. lets make small assumption that all dps r similiar lvl and deal similiar dps
5 dps party each having 100 000 dmg per second
second option:
3 dps each having 100 000 dmg per second
average gf making dmg of dps x2 (80% ITF + 20% debuff tide is already +100%, then there is mark)
average buffer dc making dmg of dps x2 (multiplication not even included).
final result:
1 option 5x 100 000 = 500 000 dmg per second
2 option 100 000 x3 x2 x2: 1 200 000 dmg per second.
Additional survivability and buffers personal dmg not even taken into account.
Also that team was build for endgame players, but for sure not BiS ones.
EDIT HERE: My whole point about this offtopic is, having 3 dps and 2 good buffers equals to having 12 dps (in this case, hope u get my point)
-/offtopic-
Also there is this:
Which proves that skill and no lag is everything.
But i guess its whole different topic.
Also @mamalion1234 i have no idea what did u want to say.
(Sin)cerely
Kain
I KNOW is bad design those bosses also the scorpions in elol they stand and watch a defender companion, my question is if they have so bad design does your tank need defender companion? no. so go tank byyourself( i am not refering to you:P)
JUST poeple want when you fight orcus a pt without gf or op should struggle like happens in lostmauth lair. even a bis player can go down very easy vs all the bosses in epic lol.;p if party doesnt have a tank.
Actually, sadly no content we have here is creating a need for tank in party. Everything can be solved by kiting or, ironically to what some claims, control, all u need is skilled player, and everything is double. Having tank/heal for buffs is whole different story i already explained.
And yes, ppl without tank struggle in t1/t2 or higher, but if they r going with that composition (without tank/heal) and fail i would just say they overestimated they skills and payed price in form of wasted time.
(Sin)cerely
Kain
The most immediate thing that sticks out is the slightly clipped look of Cleave's animations with the new faster attack speed. The animation doesn't seem to finish before it enters the next step in the combo.
I'd like it if Threatening Rush not only marked but also applied a hard taunt if enhanced mark was slotted (nice synergy), that would give the IV's out there something special that we could call our own.
I'd like to say give us a little more DPS to make dailies more enjoyable, but not too much otherwise what's the point of going a squishy DPS class (i.e. CW) if a GF does nearly as much damage . . . . . not sure really.
Finally, whilst you might want to tone it down a bit, please don't remove the synergies between things like Astral Shield etc. with ITF. Those types of intricacies associated with skill combinations and the synergies between classes give the game depth and make it sooooo much more enjoyable and complex - particularly for the support classes. At the moment I am really enjoying running with DC's and seeing the party benefits when we get our HAMSTER together and time our encounts right.
On Topic...I like the proposed changes from what I read but I'd also like all our marks to stay for a set time not just drop off once we're hit which tbh is usually within a second or so. Our HP could use a pass to increase it. All I got for the moment until I can get on and test the changes.
An other fix is GF's guard: is only in front, if we take damage on side or from back we get full damage (this is not a problem), OP's Guard block damage e Control resist at 360°. Sometime if we get damage through shield we get full damage now I don't know if is a bug or not but the chance is a bit 'too high, I'll die 4-6 because i get full damage from blocked hit (that is a problem, if tank die all party die)
Steel defense from daily activation is bugge too, but only vs demon like Demongorgon and all CN boss, I get killed even buff actived.
I think in PVP GF now is overpower, especially using temp HP bug, but in PVE is... well is useless as a tank
Sometimes no matter what you do, the block will just not work, and it needs a bit of time before you can put the shield up again.
A proud member of "mythical horde of DPS GFs"
1). Is SW more dps or tank based?
2). Yes. I am panzer!
3). Get ACT if you want to celebrate your epeen.
4). Horniness will not stand between me and what I believe - "MM"
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
None Gf,wants OP class to suffer.
Instead we were from mod6 seeing all time in our chat in PE "lfg OP tank".Sure the ones we had friends/guilds we carried on.But lesser geared GFs swapped class or worst left the game.
You do know the bubble mode is broken and produced a generation of players with gameplay reflexes and positioning far worse than in those pre Mod6.
I posted in the OP forums and asked for DPS buffs.RA to be reworked for pve ,neutralising its ridicoulous knock affect and replacing with something else.Also Divine Touch to be viable and not hit 2/3 of a damage of an Oath Strike.
Funny enough i was the only one that asked these obvious things.Most Ops continue to defend a broken mechanism-Bubble Mode.This tells something that want really care and want.Easy Mode.Or worst ,what they learned from that class,so far.
As @stretch611 said tanks are still in low numbers and in order NW to thrive(and all to continue have fun of this game) we need both classes.
As for you you are a good gamer ,i remember you when you were playing your HR.You will have 0 problem to adapt.
If you post in the Op feedback thread and ask for reasonable things,the devs seem to have a whole new fresh view of the game.
it is a golden opportunity to fine tune some lacking gameplay aspects of OP class.DivP would go ,time to move on and make OP a different,yet effective, defender class of NW,still able to excell in the game.
-------------
Peace
So what that the tank OP and tank GF can actually survive? If the party wipes they may as well allow themselves to die.
And do u think how many buffing DCs actually can outheal orcus? Coz Op will still dont bother with him, and will be able to take dps + de/fbuffers and u want to take away safeskill (FR) from GF, so he will be forced to take healer, and coz of that GF position will drop in party (yes yes, ITF, we all know nerfhammer is comming, coz of QQers like u).
So to ur idea: NO.
Go back on OP forum or whatever. Thank u.
(Sin)cerely
Kain
##If u want healer take OP, they r perfect, brainless heal totems.
(Sin)cerely
Kain ##
How about just agree to agree that not much are gained by asking for nerfs and talk down each others classes mkay.
Dear developers I ask once again think, that you want to make an imbalance in PvP even more noticeable.
Once again I ask study material of recently taken place informal tournament (the server Drider) and draw conclusions. The situation with the guards ground in drawing damages really causes attacks of an acute pain. And it is time to change this situation already now, otherwise even more players will leave because of this imbalance.
References to information on a tournament (many GF behave very incorrectly in these discussions and video, I apologize for their behavior) :
prech0me.ru/nw/bracket_all.html -table of matches of a tournament.
arcgames.com/ru/forums/nwru#/discussion/201711/eksperimentalnyy-mezhklassovyy-turnir-nefritovaya-lineyka -discussion, I ruled also other.
video of a match(at record of video the author places had ruptures of communication and some matches haven't got on record.):
https://youtu.be/za75_1cOHC4
https://youtu.be/yZBiMSt5rDk
https://youtu.be/BZ0mPLaz8AI
https://youtu.be/Vc7QnQ-V2KU
(Оригинал:
Доброго времени суток.
Уважаемые разработчики прошу ещё раз подумайте ,над тем что вы хотите сделать дисбаланс в пвп ещё более заметным.
Ещё раз прошу изучите материал недавно состоявщегося неофициального турнира( сервер Дридер) и сделайте выводы. Ситуация со стражами заточенными в нанесение повреждений действительно вызывает приступы острой боли. И эту ситуацию пора менять уже сейчас, иначе ещё больше игроков уйдут из-за этого дисбаланса.
Далее выложена информация о межклассовом турнире и даны ссылки на оный)
Yours faithfully and the best regards.
"-Temp HP/absorbing damage shields will fall very fast without high defence like GF shield block or bubble."
Two wrongs here.
First temp hp never drops.i have tested it with a boonless 1,9k IL OP with the worst build around.You just have to activate Binding Oath and the Templar's wrath in that order.You will never drop your hit points.How many hit points we are talking here? 2k as Gf gets from feats?Nope.we are talking about 96k temp hit points min.
Second.with out high defense?We wear the same exact armors and you have access as Op to all same GF defences.Both classes are able to gain benefir from investing in high defence.problem is most OPs at the moment have low defense cause in DivP mode did not needed it.Not Gfs problem though.
"like GF shield block".So....you make it show like OP shield is 20% and Gf shield 120%.In reality is 60% for OP plus more cc and 360 degrees coverage and 80% with less cc and only 180 cov erage for GFs.Hardly any superiority for Gf.
reality is i have not have seen prot Ops to use effectivelly shield in the past year.Cause they did not needed it.Well time to learn.
Gfs and OP shield duration is exactly the same at base level.
"Paladin can't do shield blocking all over the time to protect themselves like GF (now my shield stamina while blocking even doesn't falls)."
You are wrong here.it is exact same duration.You cannot compare your toon which i suspect has invest in stamina gain gear ,with the OPs that walk around that have invested 0.
"Also paladins much less resistant to knock back effects because their shield block doesn't work all over the time and they can't clean knock back effect (for example in icewind dale it will be much less comfortable for paladin to do tanking on crowd of trolls that knocks back about all over the time)."
GF and OP shield are exactly the same as concerning knock back effects.Actually OP shield is superior that it offers 360 degrees.
"After a bubble change I think that paladin will become much more balanced and will not be as immortal as it was."
Binding oath and templar's wrath combo is the cultprint of its Immortallity.And these remained untouched.
"But GF with good all over the time shield blocking still can ignore all incoming into block damage and CC effects while healing himself."
They can't ignore all damage as you claim.Gf shield block 80% of damage.While healing?We have one daily for that FR.It is not as easy as you think.
"I think that this change will not be catastrophic for GF's self healing. Because you still can use wheel of elements and water artifact weapon to have very high health regeneration. "
well...i don't use Wheel of elements cause i need instant healing most of the times and not walk around in a circle to find i don't know what.Ι use Blood Crystal.(ok i am the exception in that)
As for water weapons i am not the exception in Dragon server most PVe Gfs use Twisted weapon set cause it is superior,PVP GFs use the drowned one.(And some Gfs know use Fire Set).
So you want to nerf a global skill-ability of GFs and then to recompensate you say to us to refine an wheel and a drowned set.
So you will dictate us our gear and what to equip.Well ,i 'll pass
-------------------------
All these proposals of yours it is because you as an indivindual you do not find FR adequate cause you are tank specced and you do little damage.So FR is not very viable for you.So you came up with the proposal ,instead of you to gain some power an Arp,to nerf Gfs survivability i two servers ,so the changes to suit you.Great!!!
I did not meant anything personal nor we implied that you should not speak!
If my tone seemed aggressive to you,then i apologize.
You are in Drider server ,right?here in dragon there is a wide spread hatred towards GF since at least mod3.Everything said in forums that might enhances the "image" if a Gf that is overperforming(such as your statements that you are immortal),can be used ad-hoc by other known haters of GF class,to advocate for a nerf.
To all the points you said ,i answered with valid ,solid arguments.GF with out FR is dead meat in Orcus fight.
you made a comparison between OP and GF,i answered to all your arguments with my own.
Nothing personal, i greet and enjoy talking to all fellows GFs.
Wish you happy gaming and good loot!!!!
Peace!!!! \o/
edit:greetings to brother Russia from Greece!!! \o/