I don't know, right now my stance on the state of the game is more different then it's ever been. My general stance is pro elitism, but given recent events it's evident that they need to turn off the gear gap, allow people to catch up, but still award the people who've been commuted to a class for a long time. An update to the power point system will help that.
None of the above. Rewards need to be improved or eliminated across the board. Get rid of the XP tomes (big middle finger to the no-sell no-discard flag combo, in particular); if you give enchants make them epic enchants--we're legendary heroes, those blues are insulting scrub-tier that we literally find all over the ground, and giving us some rank 7's and 8's on leveling isn't going to hurt the higher tiers that much--; make it give refined AD, not rough. And put a cap on how many overflow rewards you can get without getting a power point. You know, so if you get gypped 4 times in a row then you're guaranteed that power point the next time, or something. Or, hell, just put the rewards in a rotation so you always know what you're getting next.
The amount of Overflow EXP needed needs to be reduced; Power Points should be awarded after EVERY Level.
...it'd all be way less insulting if it weren't for the fact that those Powerpoints have been been "cheapo" stuff foor so long.
So the knowledge that many old chars with >> 100 PP got them almost like cookies with ther cappucinoes adds insult to injustice whenever you draw the blank after the XP quad whopper... ...even more so when you're looking from a PvP viewpoint where those 100+ oldies rip your rear end up.
The current system for Power Points is fine, Does not need adjustment.
Meh, i have gotten 6 power points from 14 level ups, after the exp pool - change. The chance of getting one seems to be around 50%, which is either yes or no. I find the current exp needed to be ok. A guaranteed power point after each level up, would just encourage people to bot in foundry missions, until they can max out all of their skills (with ill gotten exp, so to say). Judging by the fact how ruthless and selfish (idgaf attitude) certain individuals who are still a part of the NW community can be, we have to factor in, that nothing's keeping said people from exploiting and abusing the proposed changes. And that's a huge no-no, in my opinion.
Considered who the poll starter is and what he has done in the past, it doesn't surprise me to hear such a suggestion coming from him.
[...] A guaranteed power point after each level up, would just encourage people to bot in foundry missions, until they can max out all of their skills (with ill gotten exp, so to say). [...]
...and making i a random event makes a difference how exactly?
...and making i a random event makes a difference how exactly?
Please elaborate...
I'm not here to discuss. I merely stated the obvious. But if you insist me to go into detail, sure, here we go. The current system discourages botting because of several reasons. One is the fact that power points are not guaranteed, but random. Another one is the fact, that it takes a boatload of EXP to actually get a chance at a power point. Both of these aspects combined are the reason it may very well take ages to earn a power point. The notorious botters have been botting in the past, already. Not for Power points, but enchantments. Botting enchantments didn't take them that long and once they were done, they happily continued doing, what they were doing before they started botting. They are obviously doing it, to gain an unfair advantage over other players. The botters actually play the game. Since it takes quite long to obtain enough power points, it would hinder said people from playing. Meaning they are not able to utilize their 'ill gotten power points', because their toons are busy trying to obtain the points. And because PvP is oh so important to this category of 'gamer', they'd rather not bot, but PvP with what they have. This makes sense, i know that and i hope you understand what i'm trying to say.
Tl,dr: Lowering the EXP needed to get a lvl up and making power points a guaranteed drop, would speed up the process of botting, enormously. I believe this is the least thing, NW needs, at the moment.
...and making i a random event makes a difference how exactly?
Please elaborate...
[...] Tl,dr: Lowering the EXP needed to get a lvl up and making power points a guaranteed drop, would speed up the process of botting, enormously. I believe this is the least thing, NW needs, at the moment.
I'd argue just the other way around:
The more tedium there is in acquiring these Power Points, the higher the incentive to use botting.
As you're referring to the "well known botters" - these don't even have to cross the first-time-transgression threshold, so IMHO quite the opposite is true:
High XP demand => greater advantage (other "manuals" are slowed down) with even more work => let's just do the script do it...
Honestly: Botters will bot, and the steeper the cliff, the greater their advantage.
...and making i a random event makes a difference how exactly?
Please elaborate...
I'm not here to discuss. I merely stated the obvious. But if you insist me to go into detail, sure, here we go. The current system discourages botting because of several reasons. One is the fact that power points are not guaranteed, but random. Another one is the fact, that it takes a boatload of EXP to actually get a chance at a power point. Both of these aspects combined are the reason it may very well take ages to earn a power point. The notorious botters have been botting in the past, already. Not for Power points, but enchantments. Botting enchantments didn't take them that long and once they were done, they happily continued doing, what they were doing before they started botting. They are obviously doing it, to gain an unfair advantage over other players. The botters actually play the game. Since it takes quite long to obtain enough power points, it would hinder said people from playing. Meaning they are not able to utilize their 'ill gotten power points', because their toons are busy trying to obtain the points. And because PvP is oh so important to this category of 'gamer', they'd rather not bot, but PvP with what they have. This makes sense, i know that and i hope you understand what i'm trying to say.
Tl,dr: Lowering the EXP needed to get a lvl up and making power points a guaranteed drop, would speed up the process of botting, enormously. I believe this is the least thing, NW needs, at the moment.
They're farming enchants because anyone that wanted to bot exp already did it or they didn't need to in the first place because they're not actually playing the game.
...and making i a random event makes a difference how exactly?
Please elaborate...
I'm not here to discuss. I merely stated the obvious. But if you insist me to go into detail, sure, here we go. The current system discourages botting because of several reasons. One is the fact that power points are not guaranteed, but random. Another one is the fact, that it takes a boatload of EXP to actually get a chance at a power point. Both of these aspects combined are the reason it may very well take ages to earn a power point. The notorious botters have been botting in the past, already. Not for Power points, but enchantments. Botting enchantments didn't take them that long and once they were done, they happily continued doing, what they were doing before they started botting. They are obviously doing it, to gain an unfair advantage over other players. The botters actually play the game. Since it takes quite long to obtain enough power points, it would hinder said people from playing. Meaning they are not able to utilize their 'ill gotten power points', because their toons are busy trying to obtain the points. And because PvP is oh so important to this category of 'gamer', they'd rather not bot, but PvP with what they have. This makes sense, i know that and i hope you understand what i'm trying to say.
Tl,dr: Lowering the EXP needed to get a lvl up and making power points a guaranteed drop, would speed up the process of botting, enormously. I believe this is the least thing, NW needs, at the moment.
They're farming enchants because anyone that wanted to bot exp already did it or they didn't need to in the first place because they're not actually playing the game.
Botting EXP is profitless, but lets please stick on topic. This is a serious issue that needs to be addressed
...and making i a random event makes a difference how exactly?
Please elaborate...
I'm not here to discuss. I merely stated the obvious. But if you insist me to go into detail, sure, here we go. The current system discourages botting because of several reasons. One is the fact that power points are not guaranteed, but random. Another one is the fact, that it takes a boatload of EXP to actually get a chance at a power point. Both of these aspects combined are the reason it may very well take ages to earn a power point. The notorious botters have been botting in the past, already. Not for Power points, but enchantments. Botting enchantments didn't take them that long and once they were done, they happily continued doing, what they were doing before they started botting. They are obviously doing it, to gain an unfair advantage over other players. The botters actually play the game. Since it takes quite long to obtain enough power points, it would hinder said people from playing. Meaning they are not able to utilize their 'ill gotten power points', because their toons are busy trying to obtain the points. And because PvP is oh so important to this category of 'gamer', they'd rather not bot, but PvP with what they have. This makes sense, i know that and i hope you understand what i'm trying to say.
Tl,dr: Lowering the EXP needed to get a lvl up and making power points a guaranteed drop, would speed up the process of botting, enormously. I believe this is the least thing, NW needs, at the moment.
They're farming enchants because anyone that wanted to bot exp already did it or they didn't need to in the first place because they're not actually playing the game.
Botting EXP is profitless, but lets please stick on topic. This is a serious issue that needs to be addressed
It's not profitless if your aim is to max out your character's powerpoints : |
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klangeddinMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 882Arc User
edited October 2015
The amount of Overflow EXP needed needs to be reduced; Power Points should be awarded after EVERY Level.
...and making i a random event makes a difference how exactly?
Please elaborate...
I'm not here to discuss. I merely stated the obvious. But if you insist me to go into detail, sure, here we go. The current system discourages botting because of several reasons. One is the fact that power points are not guaranteed, but random. Another one is the fact, that it takes a boatload of EXP to actually get a chance at a power point. Both of these aspects combined are the reason it may very well take ages to earn a power point. The notorious botters have been botting in the past, already. Not for Power points, but enchantments. Botting enchantments didn't take them that long and once they were done, they happily continued doing, what they were doing before they started botting. They are obviously doing it, to gain an unfair advantage over other players. The botters actually play the game. Since it takes quite long to obtain enough power points, it would hinder said people from playing. Meaning they are not able to utilize their 'ill gotten power points', because their toons are busy trying to obtain the points. And because PvP is oh so important to this category of 'gamer', they'd rather not bot, but PvP with what they have. This makes sense, i know that and i hope you understand what i'm trying to say.
Tl,dr: Lowering the EXP needed to get a lvl up and making power points a guaranteed drop, would speed up the process of botting, enormously. I believe this is the least thing, NW needs, at the moment.
They're farming enchants because anyone that wanted to bot exp already did it or they didn't need to in the first place because they're not actually playing the game.
Botting EXP is profitless, but lets please stick on topic. This is a serious issue that needs to be addressed
It's not profitless if your aim is to max out your character's powerpoints : |
Why would bots care about power points? They go after tradable stuff or AD. And surely there's a reason behind that (making real money). I doubt they care about playing the game as intended, or they wouldn't bot in the first place. Even in the wildest scenario, these would be "harmless bots". They would be a bit more powerful in combat (still unlikely to pass unnoticed in pve or to pose any serious threat in pvp), so what?
If anything, the current system may be an incentive to botting over one where power points are always awarded if we consider the case of account selling (if someone wants to buy an account with powered up characters, but still a huge risk for such a small gain of power points only, surely there'd have to be a lot else bundled in as well, and power points would just be the icing on the cake), and the reason is simple: the amount of exp needed would be drastically reduced and require less farming, and if less farming is needed then bots are less desirable.
...and making i a random event makes a difference how exactly?
Please elaborate...
I'm not here to discuss. I merely stated the obvious. But if you insist me to go into detail, sure, here we go. The current system discourages botting because of several reasons. One is the fact that power points are not guaranteed, but random. Another one is the fact, that it takes a boatload of EXP to actually get a chance at a power point. Both of these aspects combined are the reason it may very well take ages to earn a power point. The notorious botters have been botting in the past, already. Not for Power points, but enchantments. Botting enchantments didn't take them that long and once they were done, they happily continued doing, what they were doing before they started botting. They are obviously doing it, to gain an unfair advantage over other players. The botters actually play the game. Since it takes quite long to obtain enough power points, it would hinder said people from playing. Meaning they are not able to utilize their 'ill gotten power points', because their toons are busy trying to obtain the points. And because PvP is oh so important to this category of 'gamer', they'd rather not bot, but PvP with what they have. This makes sense, i know that and i hope you understand what i'm trying to say.
Tl,dr: Lowering the EXP needed to get a lvl up and making power points a guaranteed drop, would speed up the process of botting, enormously. I believe this is the least thing, NW needs, at the moment.
They're farming enchants because anyone that wanted to bot exp already did it or they didn't need to in the first place because they're not actually playing the game.
Botting EXP is profitless, but lets please stick on topic. This is a serious issue that needs to be addressed
It's not profitless if your aim is to max out your character's powerpoints : |
Why would bots care about power points? They go after tradable stuff or AD. And surely there's a reason behind that (making real money). I doubt they care about playing the game as intended, or they wouldn't bot in the first place. Even in the wildest scenario, these would be "harmless bots". They would be a bit more powerful in combat (still unlikely to pass unnoticed in pve or to pose any serious threat in pvp), so what?
If anything, the current system may be an incentive to botting over one where power points are always awarded if we consider the case of account selling (if someone wants to buy an account with powered up characters, but still a huge risk for such a small gain of power points only, surely there'd have to be a lot else bundled in as well, and power points would just be the icing on the cake), and the reason is simple: the amount of exp needed would be drastically reduced and require less farming, and if less farming is needed then bots are less desirable.
I'm so confused as to how you completely ignored the context of my post and essentially parroted my sentiments.
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ironzerg79Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,942Arc User
Power Points should be awarded after EVERY Level.
I don't get why this is a big deal. You get a power point every time you level up. Why does that magically stop when you hit 70?
Absolutely no reason why post-70 overflow levels should not continue to reward power points until the player is maxed out.
I don't get why this is a big deal. You get a power point every time you level up. Why does that magically stop when you hit 70?
Absolutely no reason why post-70 overflow levels should not continue to reward power points until the player is maxed out.
I agree 98%, the other 2% being that I think the power points shouldn't stop coming even if you get maxed out.. that way if level 80 ever becomes a thing... it's just fill in for legacy players..
This overflow XP and powerpoints is why I will never leveling up a new toon again. I was lucky enough to get alot of power points before mod 6 when XP wasn't insane. power points are not overpowered, and should be obtained easily.
silverkeltMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,235Arc User
The amount of Overflow EXP needed needs to be reduced; Power Points should be awarded after EVERY Level.
Just another crazy gating to people who think we will be here for 5 years or something.. news flash.. the amount of retention over that rate is really small, considering what you have done lately, you made it even worse!
The more tedium there is in acquiring these Power Points, the higher the incentive to use botting.
Exactly this. Tedium always encourages botting. Because human players generally hate tedium, and computers are really good at tedious tasks (in part because they don't get bored). Absolutely anything you add to a game that increases tedium will just incentivize bots.
If you could bot up the xp for power point when it's a 100% chance then you can bot it up when it's a .000001% chance. But what are you more likely to see people want to bot: twenty levels, or a billion levels?
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rickcase276Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,404Arc User
Power Points should be awarded after EVERY OTHER Level.
I think it should be guaranteed every other level, but still have a chance to get it at the in-between level too.
I think it should be guaranteed every other level, but still have a chance to get it at the in-between level too.
Id be fine with this even... It requires a TON of EXP to get a level... I feel really bad for new players most of all.... Even some sort of "internal" thing where its maybe like a 50% chance each level but then boosted by some factor for each level you DONT get a power point.
I think it should be guaranteed every other level, but still have a chance to get it at the in-between level too.
Id be fine with this even... It requires a TON of EXP to get a level... I feel really bad for new players most of all.... Even some sort of "internal" thing where its maybe like a 50% chance each level but then boosted by some factor for each level you DONT get a power point.
New players have 0 chance to catch up now, this is another gap that needs a bridge.
I think it should be guaranteed every other level, but still have a chance to get it at the in-between level too.
Id be fine with this even... It requires a TON of EXP to get a level... I feel really bad for new players most of all.... Even some sort of "internal" thing where its maybe like a 50% chance each level but then boosted by some factor for each level you DONT get a power point.
New players have 0 chance to catch up now, this is another gap that needs a bridge.
Absolutely.
I had suggested a ramping chance several months ago...
...like 100% chance up t0 81 - the old cap, then gradually decreasing to e.g. 25% at 111. Just some numbers for illustration purposes...
The amount of Overflow EXP needed needs to be reduced; Power Points should be awarded after EVERY Level.
Well, i voted for the first option, but since i'm looking more realistic at this now, with the XP boosters on sale, that's probably not going to happen.
Anyway, it would be a start to reward Power Points with every level up, and i would like to add, that the reward from the overflow should really be improved to something more worthy.
Some experiences tomes for that much XP is just...
Post edited by regenerde on
I do believe in killing the messenger...
Want to know why?
Because it sends a message!
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theycallmetomuMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,861Arc User
Power Points should be awarded after EVERY Level.
I already had a truckload of power points from before the level cap was raised, but, well, I switched what powers I rely heavily on, and now I have a power I only have 1 point in that's factored into my rotation. It's pretty awful. So it'd be nice if I could get more points!
A guaranteed power point after each level up, would just encourage people to bot in foundry missions, until they can max out all of their skills (with ill gotten exp, so to say).
The amount of XP you can get from foundries was limited a long time ago. It probably is a daily limit.
I actually wouldn't mind this so much if the alternative rewards for overflow levels weren't so ridiculous. Rewards like superior/greater marks of potency, coal/preservation wards, unique game service coupons, rare or unique gear/companions/mounts/knicknacks/whatever would be nice and might even convince me to keep doing quests, especially since the devs are apparently working on ways to improve them. They could be account bound, for all I care. If I'm playing a completely maxed out character item-wise then I would be too busy having fun killing things to worry about power points unless I have OCD.
As things currently are though, yes, being denied a power point given the amount of time and effort (I'd imagine weeks, for casual players) it takes to gain an overflow level (and instead being given AD equivalent to roughly how much I make during a slow day) understandably makes one feel like kicking a kitten.
You there. New to the game? Feeling overwhelmed? Maybe you think getting to end-game is impossible for a casual player like yourself, or maybe you just need to be around a community that helps each other stay sane and competitive with the latest news, current trends, random chitchat and most of all LEGIT (that is, we try to keep things fair) gameplay. If you don't mind being around quirky people and the rare occasional drama (one of our prominent TR members is apparently a mafia godfather) join nw_legit_community at http://www.nwlegitcommunity.shivtr.com/forum_threads/2330542.
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silverkeltMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,235Arc User
The amount of Overflow EXP needed needs to be reduced; Power Points should be awarded after EVERY Level.
One of my issues is the lack of experience you get for running DDS.. you should be rewarded more for participating in group content, just like other mmos do. I run dozens and dozens if not up to 100 a week on 5-6 toons.. and I barely ever see my poor levels flip.. I avoid questing like a plague.. its boring after you do it once and only do those items that get items for my guild coffer honestly.
If there is something I can do other then solo questing for those items..I do that instead. I wish every coffer requirement also dropped in a skirm or dd.. so I could do that as well.
I dont mind that there is a alternative path to solo players.. but I think people who just want to run group content wouldnt have to solo either.
Overflow XP should be a pool that I can choose to spend on the options I think will best serve my character's progression. Powerpoints should be one of those choices along with the other options people have listed here (e.g. marks of potency). RNG is a ridiculous and lazy mechanism to reward end-game players and some of the rewards in that random pool are just insulting. No one should get to an overflow 'level' and feel they've wasted their time in-game!
The amount of Overflow EXP needed needs to be reduced; Power Points should be awarded after EVERY Level.
I would suggest to remove the rng reward, and instead go with: 1x Power Point 1x Rank 7 Enchantment 21k rAD
It allready takes long enough to fill the overflow, at least reward the invested time with something good.
Highlights of the last few overflows on different characters, Flawless Saphire, some rank 6 enchantments and of course a handfull of old XP tomes again.
Comments
So the knowledge that many old chars with >> 100 PP got them almost like cookies with ther cappucinoes adds insult to injustice whenever you draw the blank after the XP quad whopper... ...even more so when you're looking from a PvP viewpoint where those 100+ oldies rip your rear end up.
Considered who the poll starter is and what he has done in the past, it doesn't surprise me to hear such a suggestion coming from him.
Please elaborate...
Tl,dr: Lowering the EXP needed to get a lvl up and making power points a guaranteed drop, would speed up the process of botting, enormously. I believe this is the least thing, NW needs, at the moment.
The more tedium there is in acquiring these Power Points, the higher the incentive to use botting.
As you're referring to the "well known botters" - these don't even have to cross the first-time-transgression threshold, so IMHO quite the opposite is true:
High XP demand => greater advantage (other "manuals" are slowed down) with even more work => let's just do the script do it...
Honestly: Botters will bot, and the steeper the cliff, the greater their advantage.
Botting EXP is profitless, but lets please stick on topic. This is a serious issue that needs to be addressed
They go after tradable stuff or AD. And surely there's a reason behind that (making real money). I doubt they care about playing the game as intended, or they wouldn't bot in the first place.
Even in the wildest scenario, these would be "harmless bots". They would be a bit more powerful in combat (still unlikely to pass unnoticed in pve or to pose any serious threat in pvp), so what?
If anything, the current system may be an incentive to botting over one where power points are always awarded if we consider the case of account selling (if someone wants to buy an account with powered up characters, but still a huge risk for such a small gain of power points only, surely there'd have to be a lot else bundled in as well, and power points would just be the icing on the cake), and the reason is simple: the amount of exp needed would be drastically reduced and require less farming, and if less farming is needed then bots are less desirable.
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CAcQjRxqFQoTCP-rw-nn1sgCFQwfGgodOFYHOw&url=https://www.tumblr.com/tagged/Charlie%3A-I-got-a-rock&psig=AFQjCNH2M0_HFIp-4542HtjJszzbrVTBfw&ust=1445628462304430
I'm old and cranky can someone tell me how to make that an image in the thread?
Absolutely no reason why post-70 overflow levels should not continue to reward power points until the player is maxed out.
and also the featured satirical comedic adventure "A Call for Heroes".
Dial it back by a factor of ten guys...
If you could bot up the xp for power point when it's a 100% chance then you can bot it up when it's a .000001% chance. But what are you more likely to see people want to bot: twenty levels, or a billion levels?
I had suggested a ramping chance several months ago...
...like 100% chance up t0 81 - the old cap, then gradually decreasing to e.g. 25% at 111. Just some numbers for illustration purposes...
Anyway, it would be a start to reward Power Points with every level up, and i would like to add, that the reward from the overflow should really be improved to something more worthy.
Some experiences tomes for that much XP is just...
As things currently are though, yes, being denied a power point given the amount of time and effort (I'd imagine weeks, for casual players) it takes to gain an overflow level (and instead being given AD equivalent to roughly how much I make during a slow day) understandably makes one feel like kicking a kitten.
If there is something I can do other then solo questing for those items..I do that instead. I wish every coffer requirement also dropped in a skirm or dd.. so I could do that as well.
I dont mind that there is a alternative path to solo players.. but I think people who just want to run group content wouldnt have to solo either.
1x Power Point
1x Rank 7 Enchantment
21k rAD
It allready takes long enough to fill the overflow, at least reward the invested time with something good.
Highlights of the last few overflows on different characters, Flawless Saphire, some rank 6 enchantments and of course a handfull of old XP tomes again.