for a scoreboard like that, i bet you were the top-geared character in that fight.
Check Ratharim's sig and observe how you are sorely mistaken. He has a link to his character in there. I've played with Rath and he's definitely a good player.
The video you posted just shows what i expected to see: people going in pvp just to kill stuffs no matter points from nodes. To judge a build i have to see you holding a node 2vs1, to fight a gwf with brain, how you do use of stealth and regen. How many times people in your team need to give you a hand. All i see instead is derping around throwing knifes and encounters to the first in your way. More over.. a bilethorn with this game style? I dont want to be the mainstream guy in here but just watch kelz0r to see some differences.
Ok stop im italian and this t9 does not help
I'm only going to say this -- bias warps your ability to see the reality.
If that's all you saw from the video, I pity you. I really do.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
The fact that he almost broke 5000 points shows he was also capping nodes And/or defending them
True, 21 kills itselves is only 1050 points. I scored so many points by capturing enemy home base and chain wins of 1v1 fights vs. people who came to recover the node alone (+300 for capture, +100 bonus for each kill while defending).
for a scoreboard like that, i bet you were the top-geared character in that fight. sometimes i get teams all below 10k gearscore and up against 15k~ average teams.
Well, I'm 12.2K myself, so it's not that I was totally OP because of gear. Unless guys were 7-8K. Is there a way to check GS of your opponents in PvP? But indeed, after that match I was for sure thrown into the higher tier as next fights were much harder. Still going quite well, postive of equal kill:deaths ratio, I feel like contributing to the overall score by keeping nodes longer than before the patch.
Now when I loose fight/match in majority of cases I feel it's because opponents were better in individual skill/team tactics not because it was hopeless 3v5, 40K HP monster GWFs vs. team consisting of fresh 60s.
I'm surprised how many terribly bad players show up now. Not that I am trying to position myself as an elite player, really good guys from PvP guild would wipe the floor with me anyway. But all those leavers who were jumping from match to match to get lucky to be put into a team with good 16K CW/GWFs who would win a match fom them now must stay and fight. They are just cannon fodder.
Those really bad players do things like I'm in ITC and CW is wasting CC encounters on me, GWFs is kind enough to stay calm when I land duelist's flurry on him, HR which stands in place not running nor dodging when I land 5 gloaming cuts in a row, GF does not see me thus he is not putting his shield up but running in circles around the pylon... And they not learn from what they see. Everyone starts sometimes and does not have a full knowledge about other classes, but FFS if your approach fails 3 times in a row and you insist on doing it the same way for the 4th time? Yesterday case with CW wasting encounters on me while in ITC happend 3 times in a row (so I got 3 kills while he tries to recover his home base alone, I'm with more HP after 3 fights than when I initially captured the node, lol). I receive PW with insults "cheater" being the most pleasant one. Priceless.
I think majority of recent boom of "nerf TR into oblivion" topics in general forums are coming from previous "leavers class" of players.
And stealth is really not so OP. Against really good players I feel like I'm not in stealth at all, LOL. I'm sure that it's not the case they used Lantern. Sometimes opponents predict my moves so well that I tell myself "it's ****ing impossible". I try to play in more unpredictible way but I start to wonder if there is a secret drop of perma true seeing helmet from some dungeon ;-) Really hate those guys for negating the strongest side of my class, yet I'm still in respect for their skills ;-)
Check Ratharim's sig and observe how you are sorely mistaken. He has a link to his character in there. I've played with Rath and he's definitely a good player.
Oh, stop complimenting me I remember those fights when I was learning and TR community guys were kind enough to take me into PvP. No one sad a bad word when You were scoring 10th kill, and I was still struggling for my first one! It's yours build, seeing XynTrynZia in action, hints from Snow and bitter yet motivating words from kweassa to stop whinning and man up made this monster :P Yeah, your words about human nature in PvP made me think about how to outplay opponents outside of the game mechanics. For example sometimes I do martyr strategy - I'm alone, 3 guys on the node, so I irritate opponents on the node so much that they leave it and chase me. Of course, they will finally kill me, but they leave the post, 60% team engaged just to chase me off the node, 30 or even 40 seconds lost for them and when they come back to the node it's already taken over and guarded by the rest of my resurrected team :P
Ratharel - stealthy backstabber from the Myth Drannor
Check Ratharim's sig and observe how you are sorely mistaken. He has a link to his character in there. I've played with Rath and he's definitely a good player.
and how exactly am i mistaken? i don't debate that he's a good player, that's entirely irrelevant. the fact is, he's using that screenshot to state that rogues are killing machines if well-played, where i would argue that screenshot is from a match where the other players are either awful or awfully-geared cause he's really dominating them and as you point out his gear is not the absolute best.
4 GWF's in that match, if any of them were good they'd have better than 1:1 kills:deaths, but they don't, cause they ALL SUCK maybe they're fresh 60's? it wouldn't surprise me at all considering i, myself, yesterday, had 3/5 of my team declare when we first entered that they had JUST hit level 60 within the last 1-2-3 hours rofl. the other on my team in that game was around 12k gearscore while the enemy team were average around 14k from what i could see. needless to say it was a roflstomp :P top player on the enemy team was 15:0 at finish.
TR's are still a good class but properly-geared GWF is way more of a killing machine, especially in groups, along with hr's and cw's easily outmatch the utility of a rogue if played correctly in medium-scale fights (5v5). i would argue that smoke bomb makes tr's better than hr's in GG huge groups though but then most TR's still just go hunting for killing blows amidst the zerg flock in GG and only a few use smoke bomb here.
Hi. Like Xyn said, Rath doesn't have any of the BiS gear but he makes up for it in playing smart. So what I meant by you being sorely mistaken is you being mistaken about Rath being uber-geared.
0
dysillusionBanned Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 30Arc User
edited March 2014
i said i bet he's the top-geared in that fight.. that doesn't mean he's uber-geared in general. he stated 12k gearscore while the GWF's in that match could be up to 5k lower if they're fresh, brand new 60's. had a game today with a 7k gs rogue on my team
well xyn, any class can be good for pressure-capping, while tr's and gwf's are the best for it, perma-tr's and high gear gwf's being sometimes unstoppable there. so that's irrelevant of class and entirely down to individual playstyle
I see what you mean. Nonetheless, we'll never really know. All I can do is vouch for Rath, and while the GWF's in the opposing team may or may not have adequate GS to contend against a 12k TR, Rath's lack of BiS gear for his build (not to mention weapon and armor enchants) shows that gear isn't always everything. I'm sure you understand what I mean.
0
dysillusionBanned Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 30Arc User
edited March 2014
yes i can definitely understand, especially for a class like ours.. generally the squishier classes with high output are the most skill-sensitive. oddly though, imo hr is the most skill-sensitive class atm.. they can be untouchable if they're really good, while a hr with poor reactions and forward planning is a sitting duck. i think it's because rather than being so squishy they rely on a wide variety of encounters for different situations, so they have a lot of options to pick between.
LOL, so I made a lot of mayhem with my screenshot.
I feel like my ELO, (whetever its value is) is rising, since day after day each next match is harder. 3 matches yesterday, 1 win and 2 times loss. My score was nothing near the one I posted. Still, positive kill:ratio is what's I'm able to keep.
Worst result was 6:6 yesterday. Got a really bad team, one of GWFs was more concerned QQing and insulting in a chat how bad the other party members are instead of fighting. Also opponents were good, none of them moving alone, using good tactics on the node.
I relay more on Shocking Execution to score kills. Start to encounter opponents with higher tenacity, it means much. Even some wizards feel tanky. If I'm thrown against even stronger players that may be a problem. Priority for the next week is to aquire +250 ArPen boon, because currently in PvP I have something around 2K ArPen and it is clearly not enough.
Sadly, weapon/armor enchants nor skulker/profound set on the horizon so next weeks in PvP may be hard :P
Are there any means to check opponent GS in a PvP match other than asking "whats your GS dude"?
I'm really, really curious what's my GS compared to my opponents.
Ratharel - stealthy backstabber from the Myth Drannor
Are there any means to check opponent GS in a PvP match other than asking "whats your GS dude"?
I'm really, really curious what's my GS compared to my opponents.
Nope. I heard that there used to be a way to do it, but not anymore.
Nope. I heard that there used to be a way to do it, but not anymore.
You can inspect them in the middle of combat
Happens to me all the time when I am trying to kick someone.
The new system blows.
Today I got in a couple of games in which 4 of my team mates had sub 10K GS.
How is that fair to anyone?
All that happened was I did my stuff and they got pounded due to the other team being significantly tougher due to their armor alone.
I personally think that the match making should be more based on GS and location to minimize lag and leave the game decided on skill with comparable equipped toons
Today I got in a couple of games in which 4 of my team mates had sub 10K GS.
How is that fair to anyone?
All that happened was I did my stuff and they got pounded due to the other team being significantly tougher due to their armor alone.
I am almost definitely certain that the developers have tweaked the ratings matching to be a bit more 'lenient' to shorten the queue times.
Is it better to suffer a few mismatched individuals every now and then, as a price for having very fast queue times? Or, is it better to apply the ratings more strictly so that never happens, at the price of very slow queues? Despite the complaints on how the ELO seems to be "weaker" than we expected, I think most people already have an answer after they've all witnessed how dreadful 50 minutes of waiting for one match is.
I personally think that the match making should be more based on GS and location to minimize lag and leave the game decided on skill with comparable equipped toons
Here's something interesting.
Nowadays I really do see that PuG teams have less gear gaps in between members. I really do.
But the thing is, now, more then ever, I find myself wondering, "How in the world can they be so weak, with that much GS...??"
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Sorry, kweassa I hijack the thread, it's now my PvP blog :P
So, 3 fights yesterday - 1 win, 2 lost. Soo much harder opponents. I think I've "overELOed" my gear in earlier fights since now I definitely fight people with higher GS and tenacity, they are very tanky.
I approach in stealth GWF running to health pot with something like 10% HP (I'm at ~60%HP). Oh well, I think that I will save my SE for better use, let's just LB him. *Critted LB from stealth doing <3K damage* Emm... Ups... *Takedown* Sorry Sir, was just kidding. I'm really sorry Mr. Half-Orc! Ouch stop smashing me, I want to stand up and fight! Aaaaagh! I'm dead. XD
Note to self: Tanky GWF is tanky.
Observation: Where are all those GWFs I prepared myself for? :-( 2 matches I had yesterday were without ANY GWF, third one - one GWF. Red just turned to green, 4-5 HRs is nothing unusual.
One such very interesting match against 3xHR+2xCW. Opponents from mixed guilds although two were from the same one, so not sure if premade (were cooperating really well, so I think yes). Our team was 2xTR + 2xHR + DC. Man, that was one of the most intense matches in NWO I had. I ended with laughable 3:11 kill:deaths ratio, around 2K score (a little bit of point caping, all the kills were with "node defender" bonus).
2 kills on weakened targets from SE critted from stealth, third one quite funny - post-mortem kill.
Really intense 1v1 duel with HR on enemy home base (both parties started at 100% health), we both ended with nearly zero HP, he kills me but I managed to land DF bleed on him and while I'm already laying dead with an arrow in the chest I see him falling 2 seconds after me because of DF bleed, LOL.
After initial raids to the home bases, most of the fight on the central node. They used tactics really hard to counter for me to score kills. 3 HRs - lots of Red, CW pushing from the node area and AoEing, second one CCing, so many Roots you feel like fighting in a jungle, HR striking hard. Suddenly I feel like I want to slot not one but 2 ITCs ;-] If I managed to reach them, well HR are quite tanky now.
Quite surprising, we won 1000:950. My contribution was pathetic in term of points (2nd place... but looking from the bottom). We won because of two amazing players on our side - 2 HRs with 15:1 and 15:3 kills:deaths ratio, both were backed up by cleric and nuking like crazy from afar. So yeah, that was really HR pew-pew battle with other classes supporting/disturbing.
At the end I started contributing indirectly. Swapped powers to maximize AP generation and trolololing with PoB/Whirlwind. Stealth -> run and position so I have 3-4 enemy in range, whirlwind from stealth, I could do 3-5 x 4-6K damage. So summarizing damage 12-30K, but distributed. PoB did not do significant damage but people were probably suspecting I have Bile slotted so they moved anyway (todesfaelle's "psychological warfare" FTW! I do not have any weapon enchant slotted ). Result: their rotations were disturbed and our HRs kept nuking 'em. After AoE: ITC -> SS -> stealth -> run away.
Yeah, that did not gave me any individual points to the score, but indirectly allowed team to win.
I feel like now I have reached the wall. Can adjust some tactics/slotted powers, but without getting better gear it's not possible to be significantly effective anymore. Upgrading daggers to better ones and slotting weapon enchant is the next step.
And yeah, finding a good tactics for dealing with HRs is a MUST.
About the daggers, I'm now using Murderous Jester's Long Dagger in the main hand, 393-481 damage range.
I'm thinking about spending my glory/seals of triumph on Profound Dagger of the Scoundrel, 402-492 damage range, but for both PvP and PvE. For PvP it's an obvious upgrade, but I wonder how it is with PvE? Of course tenacity is useless, but I've compared the stats:
* +9 base damage (my main pro for upgrade)
* power/deflection/recovery loss is 3-5 rating points, so completly unimportant
* 198 ArPen instead of 217 Crit Rating. So far I do not have +250 ArPen boon (but it's only a matter of days), for PvP it's cool the have high ArPen on base gear, for PvE I'll unslot +ArPen runestone from my stone and put +Crit intead, so no loss from overcapping ArPen in PvE and I cover Crit loss from current dagger.
Basing on this, I think it's something worthy to consider, but how this base damage scales to damage done by powers? +9 is around +2% weapon damage, so do I get flat +2% on powers damage, or it's influenced by bonus from STR, stealth combat advantage, etc. and formulas will make something like +5% damage on normal hits, +7,5% on crits? Is it worth glory/seals or should I buy PvP neckless or keep accumulating for armor? Would appricate some advice here :-)
EDIT: Anyone with good gear and Greater/Perfect Vorpal/Bilethorn interested in checking out how 3 point Whirlwind of Blades behaves for them in clustered on the node combat? Judging from my quite nice damge I think that it may be situational but really powerful for more geared TRs.
Ratharel - stealthy backstabber from the Myth Drannor
Anyone with good gear and Greater/Perfect Vorpal/Bilethorn interested in checking out how 3 point Whirlwind of Blades behaves for them in clustered on the node combat? Judging from my quite nice damge I think that it may be situational but really powerful for more geared TRs.
15.7k tr, perfect lightning. Whirldwind is pretty good in group combat, near instantaneous cast time at fairly wide range, especially stronger with Scoundrel Brutal Wounds feat, 250% weapon damage DoT. Criticals can compare to weak lashing crits and non crit SE. Single target, SE is hands down my choice--and no, my SE isn't even that good.
I approach in stealth GWF running to health pot with something like 10% HP (I'm at ~60%HP). Oh well, I think that I will save my SE for better use, let's just LB him. *Critted LB from stealth doing <3K damage* Emm... Ups... *Takedown* Sorry Sir, was just kidding. I'm really sorry Mr. Half-Orc! Ouch stop smashing me, I want to stand up and fight! Aaaaagh! I'm dead. XD
Note to self: Tanky GWF is tanky.
well i'm running with a perfect vorpal and lashing crits going no higher than 6k vs gwf/gf with high tenacity. sometimes i've done a stealthed LB on a GWF with 5% health and unstoppable active, and it's crit for less than 1k. if they have really top gear, including regen, and i keep myself going that long, then it's a struggle to kill them within a minute unless i get SE. on the other hand, i'm not perma-stealth so if they're any good and manage to catch me with a prone then i can be killed by even gf's in less than 5 seconds from full health (crits, no deflects), while from GWF's more like 3 seconds with GWF's crazily-good mobility and unstoppable, they will definitely catch me with a prone before they die, unless they're a terrible player. of course though, these are not the average GF/GWF.
Observation: Where are all those GWFs I prepared myself for? :-( 2 matches I had yesterday were without ANY GWF, third one - one GWF. Red just turned to green, 4-5 HRs is nothing unusual.
And yeah, finding a good tactics for dealing with HRs is a MUST.
i'm still getting a lot of gwf's in most matches, usually at least 3 per game, though sometimes i get a match with 0 or 1 but it's rare. still a lot of cw too in most of my games though agreed on noticing more and more hr's. honestly, good hr's have always been amazingly hard to kill, but the majority of them are not amazing or even close to it. hr have loads of encounters to make them 'immune/dodge' on top of 6 shift-dodges. i honestly think as more and more of them get good, the class will become too strong, but for now only a handful are so adept with their dodges.
it can be tough to ambush hr's cause a lot of them use fox's cunning, so i have to throw a dagger or two at them first before i hit with lashing. otherwise, if i know the hr is a crazy-op dodger with great timing, i will often shadow strike before i use lashing blade, to guarantee they won't dodge it. fox shift gives me issues as well, making the hr unhittable while it's in action, and also damages my health 60%+ if i'm alone, despite my 1k tenacity. i do note that fox shift states in the tooltip that it isn't supposed to hit a single target more than once, but it does, resulting in the crazy high burst damage we take from it. this sounds like a bug though i cannot be clear. if i do use my shadow strike initially to ensure my lashing hits cleanly, then i usually have the hr panicked enough that i can finish them off, but with so many dodges and such distance they can cover using things like marauder's escape.. the top hr's can recover from practically anything.
EDIT: Anyone with good gear and Greater/Perfect Vorpal/Bilethorn interested in checking out how 3 point Whirlwind of Blades behaves for them in clustered on the node combat? Judging from my quite nice damge I think that it may be situational but really powerful for more geared TRs.
i can certainly see the potential in this idea, just a little risky and not sure i would want to give up either SE or LA for it when it's hard to foresee whether an ideal situation for this will arise. if i get the chance i'll test it but i make no promises. what i do notice when i use whirlwind of blades in PvE is that i think it ignores defense mitigation, which is what really gives the initial hits their potency. i'm not 100% convinced that it does this and considering it doesn't state it anywhere in the tooltip, it could be a bug but, when fighting for example, the riders in FC, a lashing blade might crit for 3-4k, while whirlwind crits more like 10-12k (these numbers are a bit out of date, i haven't done FC in quite a while).
Comments
Check Ratharim's sig and observe how you are sorely mistaken. He has a link to his character in there. I've played with Rath and he's definitely a good player.
I'm only going to say this -- bias warps your ability to see the reality.
If that's all you saw from the video, I pity you. I really do.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Well, I'm 12.2K myself, so it's not that I was totally OP because of gear. Unless guys were 7-8K. Is there a way to check GS of your opponents in PvP? But indeed, after that match I was for sure thrown into the higher tier as next fights were much harder. Still going quite well, postive of equal kill:deaths ratio, I feel like contributing to the overall score by keeping nodes longer than before the patch.
Now when I loose fight/match in majority of cases I feel it's because opponents were better in individual skill/team tactics not because it was hopeless 3v5, 40K HP monster GWFs vs. team consisting of fresh 60s.
I'm surprised how many terribly bad players show up now. Not that I am trying to position myself as an elite player, really good guys from PvP guild would wipe the floor with me anyway. But all those leavers who were jumping from match to match to get lucky to be put into a team with good 16K CW/GWFs who would win a match fom them now must stay and fight. They are just cannon fodder.
Those really bad players do things like I'm in ITC and CW is wasting CC encounters on me, GWFs is kind enough to stay calm when I land duelist's flurry on him, HR which stands in place not running nor dodging when I land 5 gloaming cuts in a row, GF does not see me thus he is not putting his shield up but running in circles around the pylon... And they not learn from what they see. Everyone starts sometimes and does not have a full knowledge about other classes, but FFS if your approach fails 3 times in a row and you insist on doing it the same way for the 4th time? Yesterday case with CW wasting encounters on me while in ITC happend 3 times in a row (so I got 3 kills while he tries to recover his home base alone, I'm with more HP after 3 fights than when I initially captured the node, lol). I receive PW with insults "cheater" being the most pleasant one. Priceless.
I think majority of recent boom of "nerf TR into oblivion" topics in general forums are coming from previous "leavers class" of players.
And stealth is really not so OP. Against really good players I feel like I'm not in stealth at all, LOL. I'm sure that it's not the case they used Lantern. Sometimes opponents predict my moves so well that I tell myself "it's ****ing impossible". I try to play in more unpredictible way but I start to wonder if there is a secret drop of perma true seeing helmet from some dungeon ;-) Really hate those guys for negating the strongest side of my class, yet I'm still in respect for their skills ;-)
Oh, stop complimenting me
I'm on a trial period now in a guild, and guys are rather PvE oriented ;-) But we can talk in-game
and how exactly am i mistaken? i don't debate that he's a good player, that's entirely irrelevant. the fact is, he's using that screenshot to state that rogues are killing machines if well-played, where i would argue that screenshot is from a match where the other players are either awful or awfully-geared cause he's really dominating them and as you point out his gear is not the absolute best.
4 GWF's in that match, if any of them were good they'd have better than 1:1 kills:deaths, but they don't, cause they ALL SUCK
TR's are still a good class but properly-geared GWF is way more of a killing machine, especially in groups, along with hr's and cw's easily outmatch the utility of a rogue if played correctly in medium-scale fights (5v5). i would argue that smoke bomb makes tr's better than hr's in GG huge groups though
The GWFs are killing machines, but I constantly out point them and end up on the winning side.
So I beg to differ on the utility aspect.
There is more to this game than clicking the left mouse button as fast as possible
Leaving dead question marks everywhere
Hi. Like Xyn said, Rath doesn't have any of the BiS gear but he makes up for it in playing smart. So what I meant by you being sorely mistaken is you being mistaken about Rath being uber-geared.
well xyn, any class can be good for pressure-capping, while tr's and gwf's are the best for it, perma-tr's and high gear gwf's being sometimes unstoppable there. so that's irrelevant of class and entirely down to individual playstyle
I feel like my ELO, (whetever its value is) is rising, since day after day each next match is harder. 3 matches yesterday, 1 win and 2 times loss. My score was nothing near the one I posted. Still, positive kill:ratio is what's I'm able to keep.
Worst result was 6:6 yesterday. Got a really bad team, one of GWFs was more concerned QQing and insulting in a chat how bad the other party members are instead of fighting. Also opponents were good, none of them moving alone, using good tactics on the node.
I relay more on Shocking Execution to score kills. Start to encounter opponents with higher tenacity, it means much. Even some wizards feel tanky. If I'm thrown against even stronger players that may be a problem. Priority for the next week is to aquire +250 ArPen boon, because currently in PvP I have something around 2K ArPen and it is clearly not enough.
Sadly, weapon/armor enchants nor skulker/profound set on the horizon so next weeks in PvP may be hard :P
Are there any means to check opponent GS in a PvP match other than asking "whats your GS dude"?
I'm really, really curious what's my GS compared to my opponents.
Nope. I heard that there used to be a way to do it, but not anymore.
You can inspect them in the middle of combat
Happens to me all the time when I am trying to kick someone.
The new system blows.
Today I got in a couple of games in which 4 of my team mates had sub 10K GS.
How is that fair to anyone?
All that happened was I did my stuff and they got pounded due to the other team being significantly tougher due to their armor alone.
I personally think that the match making should be more based on GS and location to minimize lag and leave the game decided on skill with comparable equipped toons
Leaving dead question marks everywhere
I am almost definitely certain that the developers have tweaked the ratings matching to be a bit more 'lenient' to shorten the queue times.
Is it better to suffer a few mismatched individuals every now and then, as a price for having very fast queue times? Or, is it better to apply the ratings more strictly so that never happens, at the price of very slow queues? Despite the complaints on how the ELO seems to be "weaker" than we expected, I think most people already have an answer after they've all witnessed how dreadful 50 minutes of waiting for one match is.
Here's something interesting.
Nowadays I really do see that PuG teams have less gear gaps in between members. I really do.
But the thing is, now, more then ever, I find myself wondering, "How in the world can they be so weak, with that much GS...??"
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
So, 3 fights yesterday - 1 win, 2 lost. Soo much harder opponents. I think I've "overELOed" my gear in earlier fights since now I definitely fight people with higher GS and tenacity, they are very tanky.
I approach in stealth GWF running to health pot with something like 10% HP (I'm at ~60%HP). Oh well, I think that I will save my SE for better use, let's just LB him. *Critted LB from stealth doing <3K damage* Emm... Ups... *Takedown* Sorry Sir, was just kidding. I'm really sorry Mr. Half-Orc! Ouch stop smashing me, I want to stand up and fight! Aaaaagh! I'm dead. XD
Note to self: Tanky GWF is tanky.
Observation: Where are all those GWFs I prepared myself for? :-( 2 matches I had yesterday were without ANY GWF, third one - one GWF. Red just turned to green, 4-5 HRs is nothing unusual.
One such very interesting match against 3xHR+2xCW. Opponents from mixed guilds although two were from the same one, so not sure if premade (were cooperating really well, so I think yes). Our team was 2xTR + 2xHR + DC. Man, that was one of the most intense matches in NWO I had. I ended with laughable 3:11 kill:deaths ratio, around 2K score (a little bit of point caping, all the kills were with "node defender" bonus).
2 kills on weakened targets from SE critted from stealth, third one quite funny - post-mortem kill.
Really intense 1v1 duel with HR on enemy home base (both parties started at 100% health), we both ended with nearly zero HP, he kills me but I managed to land DF bleed on him and while I'm already laying dead with an arrow in the chest I see him falling 2 seconds after me because of DF bleed, LOL.
After initial raids to the home bases, most of the fight on the central node. They used tactics really hard to counter for me to score kills. 3 HRs - lots of Red, CW pushing from the node area and AoEing, second one CCing, so many Roots you feel like fighting in a jungle, HR striking hard. Suddenly I feel like I want to slot not one but 2 ITCs ;-] If I managed to reach them, well HR are quite tanky now.
Quite surprising, we won 1000:950. My contribution was pathetic in term of points (2nd place... but looking from the bottom). We won because of two amazing players on our side - 2 HRs with 15:1 and 15:3 kills:deaths ratio, both were backed up by cleric and nuking like crazy from afar. So yeah, that was really HR pew-pew battle with other classes supporting/disturbing.
At the end I started contributing indirectly. Swapped powers to maximize AP generation and trolololing with PoB/Whirlwind. Stealth -> run and position so I have 3-4 enemy in range, whirlwind from stealth, I could do 3-5 x 4-6K damage. So summarizing damage 12-30K, but distributed. PoB did not do significant damage but people were probably suspecting I have Bile slotted so they moved anyway (todesfaelle's "psychological warfare" FTW! I do not have any weapon enchant slotted
Yeah, that did not gave me any individual points to the score, but indirectly allowed team to win.
I feel like now I have reached the wall. Can adjust some tactics/slotted powers, but without getting better gear it's not possible to be significantly effective anymore. Upgrading daggers to better ones and slotting weapon enchant is the next step.
And yeah, finding a good tactics for dealing with HRs is a MUST.
About the daggers, I'm now using Murderous Jester's Long Dagger in the main hand, 393-481 damage range.
I'm thinking about spending my glory/seals of triumph on Profound Dagger of the Scoundrel, 402-492 damage range, but for both PvP and PvE. For PvP it's an obvious upgrade, but I wonder how it is with PvE? Of course tenacity is useless, but I've compared the stats:
* +9 base damage (my main pro for upgrade)
* power/deflection/recovery loss is 3-5 rating points, so completly unimportant
* 198 ArPen instead of 217 Crit Rating. So far I do not have +250 ArPen boon (but it's only a matter of days), for PvP it's cool the have high ArPen on base gear, for PvE I'll unslot +ArPen runestone from my stone and put +Crit intead, so no loss from overcapping ArPen in PvE and I cover Crit loss from current dagger.
Basing on this, I think it's something worthy to consider, but how this base damage scales to damage done by powers? +9 is around +2% weapon damage, so do I get flat +2% on powers damage, or it's influenced by bonus from STR, stealth combat advantage, etc. and formulas will make something like +5% damage on normal hits, +7,5% on crits? Is it worth glory/seals or should I buy PvP neckless or keep accumulating for armor? Would appricate some advice here :-)
EDIT: Anyone with good gear and Greater/Perfect Vorpal/Bilethorn interested in checking out how 3 point Whirlwind of Blades behaves for them in clustered on the node combat? Judging from my quite nice damge I think that it may be situational but really powerful for more geared TRs.
15.7k tr, perfect lightning. Whirldwind is pretty good in group combat, near instantaneous cast time at fairly wide range, especially stronger with Scoundrel Brutal Wounds feat, 250% weapon damage DoT. Criticals can compare to weak lashing crits and non crit SE. Single target, SE is hands down my choice--and no, my SE isn't even that good.
well i'm running with a perfect vorpal and lashing crits going no higher than 6k vs gwf/gf with high tenacity. sometimes i've done a stealthed LB on a GWF with 5% health and unstoppable active, and it's crit for less than 1k. if they have really top gear, including regen, and i keep myself going that long, then it's a struggle to kill them within a minute unless i get SE. on the other hand, i'm not perma-stealth so if they're any good and manage to catch me with a prone then i can be killed by even gf's in less than 5 seconds from full health (crits, no deflects), while from GWF's more like 3 seconds
i'm still getting a lot of gwf's in most matches, usually at least 3 per game, though sometimes i get a match with 0 or 1 but it's rare. still a lot of cw too in most of my games though agreed on noticing more and more hr's. honestly, good hr's have always been amazingly hard to kill, but the majority of them are not amazing or even close to it. hr have loads of encounters to make them 'immune/dodge' on top of 6 shift-dodges. i honestly think as more and more of them get good, the class will become too strong, but for now only a handful are so adept with their dodges.
it can be tough to ambush hr's cause a lot of them use fox's cunning, so i have to throw a dagger or two at them first before i hit with lashing. otherwise, if i know the hr is a crazy-op dodger with great timing, i will often shadow strike before i use lashing blade, to guarantee they won't dodge it. fox shift gives me issues as well, making the hr unhittable while it's in action, and also damages my health 60%+ if i'm alone, despite my 1k tenacity. i do note that fox shift states in the tooltip that it isn't supposed to hit a single target more than once, but it does, resulting in the crazy high burst damage we take from it. this sounds like a bug though i cannot be clear. if i do use my shadow strike initially to ensure my lashing hits cleanly, then i usually have the hr panicked enough that i can finish them off, but with so many dodges and such distance they can cover using things like marauder's escape.. the top hr's can recover from practically anything.
i can certainly see the potential in this idea, just a little risky and not sure i would want to give up either SE or LA for it when it's hard to foresee whether an ideal situation for this will arise. if i get the chance i'll test it but i make no promises. what i do notice when i use whirlwind of blades in PvE is that i think it ignores defense mitigation, which is what really gives the initial hits their potency. i'm not 100% convinced that it does this and considering it doesn't state it anywhere in the tooltip, it could be a bug but, when fighting for example, the riders in FC, a lashing blade might crit for 3-4k, while whirlwind crits more like 10-12k (these numbers are a bit out of date, i haven't done FC in quite a while).