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Forums > Home› Neverwinter Discussion › The Foundry

Death Traps/Player Surrenders

keylord02keylord02 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
edited May 2013 in The Foundry
I want good ol' fashioned death traps, and I figured I'd see if anyone could help me out here. So far, the best I've come up with is to use interaction objects to represent things you shouldn't fiddle with that teleport you to a "You died." room that has an abort door.

I'd really like to use this in conversations too, but haven't been able to figure out a good way to do so. For example, you meet a couple of gnolls and they demand surrender. If you choose surrender, you get knocked out and moved somewhere else, basically.

If I can find a way to have a conversation teleport you somewhere(same map or different map, either way!), then I'll be set for life here.

My backup plan is to just have multiple invisible interaction object teleporters that you select to represent your decisions, but handling it that way seems too "OOC" to me.
Tomb of Wernar by @Lya
Short code: NW-DJGYNI7NH

In this old school-style adventure, the hero(es) explore an old ruined castle while searching for a fabled magic item at the behest of a wizard.
Post edited by keylord02 on

Comments

  • keylord02keylord02 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Anyone have any ideas on this?
    Tomb of Wernar by @Lya
    Short code: NW-DJGYNI7NH

    In this old school-style adventure, the hero(es) explore an old ruined castle while searching for a fabled magic item at the behest of a wizard.
  • boydzinjboydzinj Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    At this time... this is not possible. Cryptic and the foundry believes in this rule:

    Reward the player and don't punish the player.

    There are no forced teleports... the player has to interact with an object to be teleported. However, most players will probably wont like being forced to die.

    “The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs, He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own.” ― Gary Gygax (Ernest Gary Gygax was an American writer and game designer, best known for co-creating the pioneering role-playing game Dungeons & Dragons (D&D) with Dave Arneson in 1974, and co-founding the company Tactical Studies Rules (TSR, Inc.) with Don Kaye in 1973.)
  • hercul33thercul33t Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 190 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    boydzinj wrote: »
    At this time... this is not possible. Cryptic and the foundry believes in this rule:

    Reward the player and don't punish the player.

    There are no forced teleports... the player has to interact with an object to be teleported. However, most players will probably wont like being forced to die.

    “The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs, He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own.” ― Gary Gygax (Ernest Gary Gygax was an American writer and game designer, best known for co-creating the pioneering role-playing game Dungeons & Dragons (D&D) with Dave Arneson in 1974, and co-founding the company Tactical Studies Rules (TSR, Inc.) with Don Kaye in 1973.)


    I have a couple dialogue checks which can kill the player. One is when a non-mage class tries to use a certain magical object. It gives a couple warnings and if the player still decides to play with it then they get zapped. I have no problem killing my guests in this fashion.
    Dr. Herc trilogy NWS-DHDPDVTMA
  • boydzinjboydzinj Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    How does the player get zapped?
  • hercul33thercul33t Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 190 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    boydzinj wrote: »
    How does the player get zapped?

    Spellplague floor tiles spawn under him.
    Dr. Herc trilogy NWS-DHDPDVTMA
  • keylord02keylord02 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Yes, I love that quote! That's exactly the kinda stuff I had in mind, honestly. If a player chooses to surrender to an opponent, then something relevant happens. Wake up in a trash heap somewhere else, get transferred to a jail cell, etc.

    Also I kinda wanted to make a thinking person's dungeon like Tomb of Horrors(also written by Gary Gygax, unsurprisingly!) I know the Foundry will never support a misty archway that reverses your alignment and gender, but I'm glad that it at least supports a misty archway that teleports you to the beginning of the dungeon and other fun teleportation stuff through interactions.

    I don't plan on doing anything mean, but I definitely want to provide a lot of options for players if possible!
    Tomb of Wernar by @Lya
    Short code: NW-DJGYNI7NH

    In this old school-style adventure, the hero(es) explore an old ruined castle while searching for a fabled magic item at the behest of a wizard.
  • keylord02keylord02 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Also wow, thanks for the tip, hercul33t! I firmly believe that stuff like that's perfectly reasonable as long as the dialogue offers a warning about the dangers. ;)
    Tomb of Wernar by @Lya
    Short code: NW-DJGYNI7NH

    In this old school-style adventure, the hero(es) explore an old ruined castle while searching for a fabled magic item at the behest of a wizard.
  • keylord02keylord02 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    So I believe I have an idea then, but I might not use it for my first Foundry module. If there's a way to create an insta-kill situation, then I just need to put the respawn fire in an empty room with nothing but the Abort door.

    I don't imagine it'd be popular amongst the average player, but I'm willing to bet that there's a niche audience for extra challenging modules out there.
    Tomb of Wernar by @Lya
    Short code: NW-DJGYNI7NH

    In this old school-style adventure, the hero(es) explore an old ruined castle while searching for a fabled magic item at the behest of a wizard.
  • coanunncoanunn Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 368 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    Well, I have REAL pits in one room. It's the cave tile set and if the player falls off the path to the bottom of the room the game auto-kills them. No damage, no surviving by sliding/rolling/etc at the right moment, a full on dead toon due to fall. I have a HUGE warning about it on the intro and it is very obvious that the walkway falls away into nothing. If a player decides to walk off into thin air he deserves to be rewarded for that with an appropriate response.

    You can play alot with the y axis in the editor to create actual pits, which I have planned for the next wing of my current dungeon. The catch is you can't use the pregen rooms for this as easily. It's much easier to build your own room from scratch. Thus my suggestion is place a pit with a teleport in it under where the player talks to the mob. If they surrender, the floor disappears (along with it's collision) and drops the player in the pit. Only way out is the teleport which takes them to the cell area elsewhere on the map. The only drawback, they will be able to travel back to the pit from the cell so make sure it is deep enough they can't simply jump out and continue as if they hadn't surrendered.
    Do you crave a good old fashioned dungeon crawl? One where the dungeon tells it's own story? The Dungeon Delves campaign is just for you! Start with my first release: NW-DQF4T7QYH Any cave can lead to adventure!
  • keylord02keylord02 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    The cave tileset definitely seems good for this, so I might try out in the near future! I'm curious how you'd "build your own room from scratch" though. Do you use the interior map for this or one of the outdoor ones?

    Again, thanks for all the awesome ideas!
    Tomb of Wernar by @Lya
    Short code: NW-DJGYNI7NH

    In this old school-style adventure, the hero(es) explore an old ruined castle while searching for a fabled magic item at the behest of a wizard.
  • coanunncoanunn Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 368 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    keylord02 wrote: »
    The cave tileset definitely seems good for this, so I might try out in the near future! I'm curious how you'd "build your own room from scratch" though. Do you use the interior map for this or one of the outdoor ones?

    Again, thanks for all the awesome ideas!

    Either one, you can create a room from scratch by adding your own floor, wall and ceiling tiles very easily. Now add that to being able to raise the floor as high as you want and you can effectively drop players down pits. Now fall damage can be completely avoided by a talented player, but even so the pit if deep enough is still a trap that forces them to use your teleport to get out. Place pressure plates in the trap and it becomes even deadlier.

    The biggest issue with using an outdoor map in this way is that if you leave an opening players will find it and be "outside" the map. So you have to either make sure there is an outside graphic to cover the exterior of the map or plug all the holes so they can't "escape" if you use an outdoor map for this. Either way the premade rooms have solid collision floors that can't be altered, so you MUST use a custom room for the rooms with pit traps or fall back on the cave maps where it is either obvious it's a cave or you have to worry about building your rooms in ways to intersect with the caves existing transitions, etc.

    Lots of work but it is in fact possible and to me gives a far more rewarding feel to the player to have survived something that isn't strictly speaking designed for their survival.
    Do you crave a good old fashioned dungeon crawl? One where the dungeon tells it's own story? The Dungeon Delves campaign is just for you! Start with my first release: NW-DQF4T7QYH Any cave can lead to adventure!
  • keylord02keylord02 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    That sounds fantastic! I'll have to try this out next chance I get some time with the Foundry. Thanks, coanunn!
    Tomb of Wernar by @Lya
    Short code: NW-DJGYNI7NH

    In this old school-style adventure, the hero(es) explore an old ruined castle while searching for a fabled magic item at the behest of a wizard.
  • darkaninddarkanind Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 72
    edited May 2013
    A problem I've found, and not sure if it's just in the foundry or a bug, but if I fall into a pit in the cave tileset by falling off, and try to respawn, it respawns me where my character is in the pit and I just die again. It won't put me back at a campfire.
  • coanunncoanunn Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 368 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    darkanind wrote: »
    A problem I've found, and not sure if it's just in the foundry or a bug, but if I fall into a pit in the cave tileset by falling off, and try to respawn, it respawns me where my character is in the pit and I just die again. It won't put me back at a campfire.

    Are you talking about during the preview or is this after you publish the quest to live? I know it does that in preview but I've never had that happen in live.
    Do you crave a good old fashioned dungeon crawl? One where the dungeon tells it's own story? The Dungeon Delves campaign is just for you! Start with my first release: NW-DQF4T7QYH Any cave can lead to adventure!
  • darkaninddarkanind Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 72
    edited May 2013
    coanunn wrote: »
    Are you talking about during the preview or is this after you publish the quest to live? I know it does that in preview but I've never had that happen in live.

    Preview. I wasn't sure if it happened during live or not, so it's nice to know that the death pit will work for live.
  • coanunncoanunn Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 368 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    darkanind wrote: »
    Preview. I wasn't sure if it happened during live or not, so it's nice to know that the death pit will work for live.

    Nope, live it puts the player back at the spawn.
    Do you crave a good old fashioned dungeon crawl? One where the dungeon tells it's own story? The Dungeon Delves campaign is just for you! Start with my first release: NW-DQF4T7QYH Any cave can lead to adventure!
  • keylord02keylord02 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I'm glad to hear that, because I was having this issue too in a test map I made!
    Tomb of Wernar by @Lya
    Short code: NW-DJGYNI7NH

    In this old school-style adventure, the hero(es) explore an old ruined castle while searching for a fabled magic item at the behest of a wizard.
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