test content
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc

Neverember Incentive points no longer included in AI Campaign?

vendoodvendood Member Posts: 77 Arc User
edited February 2019 in General Discussion (PC)
I started a new SW during the Neverember Incentives event, and was receiving Neverember Incentives up until this week. I have 75, from Adventurers Reward boxes as well as the first stages of the AI campaign. I had read somewhere that the final 25 Incentives (making 100, for the Runic Bag) comes from completing the Renaer's Salvation campaign unlock.

Completed Salvation today and turned it in, still at 75 Incentives - no new points earned.

Did they somehow advertise "Start a Neverember Recruit, earn these rewards on it", and then turn off the rewards part-way through? Since they time-gated the campaign to only one possible unlock per week, it seems odd to then turn off the rewards before someone can complete them.

Comments

  • inugurlinugurl Member Posts: 60 Arc User
    When the event ended it was supposed to stop. For some it went abit further.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 10,103 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    The "incentive" period was supposed to end in early January (I think it was Jan 3).
    They specified when it started and when it ended.
    However, they did not end that on that day and "somehow" extended (the earning incentive) for 2 more weeks.

    If you started that late, no, you wouldn't be able to get 100 incentive "within one character".
    The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will.
  • vendoodvendood Member Posts: 77 Arc User
    Actually, unless you guys have some sort of dev reference for Incentives ending, that does not appear to be the case.

    The blog:
    https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/neverwinter/news/detail/11012733-developer-blog:-neverember's-recruitment-event

    Quote:
    " Any new characters who log in during this event will earn extra rewards while leveling as well as Neverember Incentives which can be exchanged for account wide rewards. Note: Characters who log in as a level 1 during the event are eligible, they do not have to be created during the event but must be level 1. "

    The event will run from November 6 at the launch of The Heart of Fire on PC until Tuesday, January 1 at 7:30am PT.

    While leveling, eligible characters will earn the following additional rewards from their Adventurer’s Reward boxes:"

    The time period listed is the time period to create an eligible character. Once eligible, those characters are specifically said to gain the listed rewards while levelling and doing AI campaign tasks.

    It would be somewhat foolish to create an eligible character, and then have the rewards turned off before you can complete them because they time-gated the campaign tasks.

    STO also has Recruit events... when you create a Recruit, that recruit can always finish all the tasks/rewards from the event, so long as he is eligible.

    This looks to me like another case of Cryptic simply ending rewards early without notice, much as they did with the Acquired Treasure Chest event, which they ended 2 days early (Dec.4th) without notice.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 10,103 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    vendood said:

    Actually, unless you guys have some sort of dev reference for Incentives ending, that does not appear to be the case.

    The blog:
    https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/neverwinter/news/detail/11012733-developer-blog:-neverember's-recruitment-event

    Quote:
    " Any new characters who log in during this event will earn extra rewards while leveling as well as Neverember Incentives which can be exchanged for account wide rewards. Note: Characters who log in as a level 1 during the event are eligible, they do not have to be created during the event but must be level 1. "

    The event will run from November 6 at the launch of The Heart of Fire on PC until Tuesday, January 1 at 7:30am PT.

    While leveling, eligible characters will earn the following additional rewards from their Adventurer’s Reward boxes:"

    The time period listed is the time period to create an eligible character. Once eligible, those characters are specifically said to gain the listed rewards while levelling and doing AI campaign tasks.

    It would be somewhat foolish to create an eligible character, and then have the rewards turned off before you can complete them because they time-gated the campaign tasks.

    STO also has Recruit events... when you create a Recruit, that recruit can always finish all the tasks/rewards from the event, so long as he is eligible.

    This looks to me like another case of Cryptic simply ending rewards early without notice, much as they did with the Acquired Treasure Chest event, which they ended 2 days early (Dec.4th) without notice.

    The event will run from November 6 at the launch of The Heart of Fire on PC until Tuesday, January 1 at 7:30am PT.

    People expected that will ended on Jan 1st.
    There are ways to earn the max 200 incentives within an account within one day (if one is crazy enough). We have many 'creative' players. You could earn 200 max account wide incentive without doing AI.
    The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will.
  • vendoodvendood Member Posts: 77 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    Again, you are incorrect. It does not state that players will only earn rewards during the event, nor did the rewards actually end at that time. They simply state that the Event time period is the time to create an eligible character. Earn rewards on an eligible character is a separate thing.

    What is the point of creating an eligible character on January 1 if the rewards turn off the next day? What is the point of creating an eligible character, time-gating the rewards to take at least 7 weeks on that character (the campaign), and then turning the rewards off after 5 and a half weeks?

    And again, STO recruit events are the same thing... you create the character during the event eligibility period. Once the eligible character is created, it can unlock all the rewards available to it.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 10,103 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    vendood said:

    Again, you are incorrect. It does not state that players will only earn rewards during the event, nor did the rewards actually end at that time. They simply state that the Event time period is the time to create an eligible character. Earn rewards on an eligible character is a separate thing.

    What is the point of creating an eligible character on January 1 if the rewards turn off the next day? What is the point of creating an eligible character, time-gating the rewards to take at least 7 weeks on that character (the campaign), and then turning the rewards off after 5 and a half weeks?

    And again, STO recruit events are the same thing... you create the character during the event eligibility period. Once the eligible character is created, it can unlock all the rewards available to it.

    I guess it depends on how you interpret it. I interpret when the event ENDs, it ends. You can interpret your way and I cannot say you are incorrect because it did not say it would not allow you to earn incentive (but it also did not say you would be allowed neither).

    Yes, I expected if you made character(s) on Jan 1 at midnight PST, you had less than 7 hours to earn as much incentive as you could.

    What happened in STO is irrelevant to me because I know nothing about STO.
    What I know is about NW pattern. When a NW events ends, it ends. You need N tokens to get a mount from an event and you can only get 1 token per day. Now, I start to earn token on the last day of the event. Should I expect I will get the mount? I don't expect that.
    When the incentive event did not actually ended on the specified day, I was surprised.
    The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 10,103 Arc User
    edited February 2019

    vendood said:

    Again, you are incorrect. It does not state that players will only earn rewards during the event, nor did the rewards actually end at that time. They simply state that the Event time period is the time to create an eligible character. Earn rewards on an eligible character is a separate thing.

    What is the point of creating an eligible character on January 1 if the rewards turn off the next day? What is the point of creating an eligible character, time-gating the rewards to take at least 7 weeks on that character (the campaign), and then turning the rewards off after 5 and a half weeks?

    And again, STO recruit events are the same thing... you create the character during the event eligibility period. Once the eligible character is created, it can unlock all the rewards available to it.

    This was also my interpretation of this event. Thats why i focused to do the AI campaign on my main characters first to realize later, that i don't get any Incentives for the AI campaign after the 3rd January on the new character. So, stuck at 55. maybe my fault, maybe they should describe their events, so an idiot like me can understand it.

    Actually, you could still earn incentive in AI campaign in the first 2 weeks of January. It did not end on January 3rd as I expected but it did end later.
    The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will.
  • tribbulatertribbulater Member Posts: 179 Arc User
    Checked my characters, also stopped receiving Neverember Incentives a week or more ago.

    For the people who don't get the difference:

    A Recruit event is different from a normal event. This is something new to Neverwinter but has been done for several years in Star Trek Online. For a Recruit event, the listed dates of the event are the dates to create an eligible character. Once created, the eligible character receives certain bonuses from levelling and completing tasks.

    The dev blog announcing it is also quite clear on this. "While levelling (and completing AI campaign tasks), eligible characters will receive". That's pretty clear.

    If you are going to create an event which requires using up a character slot, levelling and gearing a new character, and advertising in clear text that "eligible characters will receive X", then if you plan to turn off X at some point, you better be pretty clear in advance just how and when you are turning it off.

    For my money, this is just another case of Cryptic either turning stuff on/off by accident, or not publishing end dates, or simply not giving a damn what happens to players once they have sold a character slot to them.

    (And yes, I was also hit by the "Acquired Treasure chest ending 2 days early, unannounced" thing, and I ticketed it, and Support basically said "too bad, no chest for you!". They also would not admit the event ended early, they would only say "Chests were available for pickup during the event only".)
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 10,103 Arc User
    edited February 2019

    Checked my characters, also stopped receiving Neverember Incentives a week or more ago.

    For the people who don't get the difference:

    A Recruit event is different from a normal event. This is something new to Neverwinter but has been done for several years in Star Trek Online. For a Recruit event, the listed dates of the event are the dates to create an eligible character. Once created, the eligible character receives certain bonuses from levelling and completing tasks.

    The dev blog announcing it is also quite clear on this. "While levelling (and completing AI campaign tasks), eligible characters will receive". That's pretty clear.

    If you are going to create an event which requires using up a character slot, levelling and gearing a new character, and advertising in clear text that "eligible characters will receive X", then if you plan to turn off X at some point, you better be pretty clear in advance just how and when you are turning it off.

    For my money, this is just another case of Cryptic either turning stuff on/off by accident, or not publishing end dates, or simply not giving a damn what happens to players once they have sold a character slot to them.

    (And yes, I was also hit by the "Acquired Treasure chest ending 2 days early, unannounced" thing, and I ticketed it, and Support basically said "too bad, no chest for you!". They also would not admit the event ended early, they would only say "Chests were available for pickup during the event only".)

    Yes, it is quite clear about what they said but you probably read a different blog. You may vision they act like STO but it does not mean they would. I just read their plain text without pre-existing assumption.
    The following link was provided by OP.

    https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/neverwinter/news/detail/11012733-developer-blog:-neverember's-recruitment-event


    Any new characters who log in during this event will earn
    extra rewards while leveling as well as Neverember Incentives which can be exchanged for account wide rewards.

    In STO, they said out loud there is no time limit. It is not the case here.

    Q: What happens if I create a Delta Recruit, but do not complete all of the listed Tasks?

    A: Once a Delta Recruit completes their special Tutorial and receives their “Tesseract Communications Device” they will be free to complete the assigned tasks at any point in the future. Although Delta Recruit characters can only be created while the event is running, there is no time limit on the completion of the tasks, or their associated rewards.
    The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will.
  • tribbulatertribbulater Member Posts: 179 Arc User
    I think you are cherry-picking a single line of text to support your own pre-existing assumption that events only have effects during the event date.

    I also stated, if you are going to limit the rewards of eligible characters, you should be clear on the reward termination date or lack thereof. STO specified it, Neverwinter did not.

    To refer to more than one line of text:

    "Any new characters who log in during this event will earn extra rewards while leveling as well as Neverember Incentives which can be exchanged for account wide rewards. Note: Characters who log in as a level 1 during the event are eligible, they do not have to be created during the event but must be level 1."

    To me this is pretty clear that you make an eligible character by logging in as level 1 during the event. You need to log in as level 1 during the event to become eligible. "New characters will earn extra rewards while levelling"... not "extra rewards during this event".

    "While leveling, eligible characters will earn the following additional rewards from their Adventurer’s Reward boxes:"

    No mention of 'during event', time limits, or expiries... only "eligible characters while levelling"

    "On top of the above rewards for leveling up, characters will also earn Neverember Incentives from Adventurer Reward boxes and completing campaign tasks in the Acquisitions Incorporated campaign. Incentives can be used to purchase the following items:
    •Companion Upgrade Token
    •100,000 50% Bonus Rough Astral Diamonds
    •Neverember Guard epic companion
    •Heavy Worg epic mount
    •Runic Bag of Holding"

    Only eligible characters can receive rewards. Again, no mention of "you only receive these rewards during the event". The Runic Bag of Holding is listed as a reward you can purchase. You cannot purchase it without 100 Incentives, which you can only earn by getting as far as Renaer's Salvation task in AI campaign. They time-gate the campaign so it takes at least 7 weeks to get that far, but turn off the rewards before 6 weeks have passed (for an eligible character).

    In marketing terms, this is known as "false advertising".
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 10,103 Arc User
    edited February 2019

    I think you are cherry-picking a single line of text to support your own pre-existing assumption that events only have effects during the event date.

    I also stated, if you are going to limit the rewards of eligible characters, you should be clear on the reward termination date or lack thereof. STO specified it, Neverwinter did not.

    To refer to more than one line of text:

    "Any new characters who log in during this event will earn extra rewards while leveling as well as Neverember Incentives which can be exchanged for account wide rewards. Note: Characters who log in as a level 1 during the event are eligible, they do not have to be created during the event but must be level 1."

    To me this is pretty clear that you make an eligible character by logging in as level 1 during the event. You need to log in as level 1 during the event to become eligible. "New characters will earn extra rewards while levelling"... not "extra rewards during this event".

    "While leveling, eligible characters will earn the following additional rewards from their Adventurer’s Reward boxes:"

    No mention of 'during event', time limits, or expiries... only "eligible characters while levelling"

    "On top of the above rewards for leveling up, characters will also earn Neverember Incentives from Adventurer Reward boxes and completing campaign tasks in the Acquisitions Incorporated campaign. Incentives can be used to purchase the following items:
    •Companion Upgrade Token
    •100,000 50% Bonus Rough Astral Diamonds
    •Neverember Guard epic companion
    •Heavy Worg epic mount
    •Runic Bag of Holding"

    Only eligible characters can receive rewards. Again, no mention of "you only receive these rewards during the event". The Runic Bag of Holding is listed as a reward you can purchase. You cannot purchase it without 100 Incentives, which you can only earn by getting as far as Renaer's Salvation task in AI campaign. They time-gate the campaign so it takes at least 7 weeks to get that far, but turn off the rewards before 6 weeks have passed (for an eligible character).

    In marketing terms, this is known as "false advertising".

    I guess I don't interpret your way.

    For your interpretation, it should be written as:

    "Any new characters will earn extra rewards while leveling as well as Neverember Incentives which can be exchanged for account wide rewards. Note: Characters who log in as a level 1 during the event are eligible, they do not have to be created during the event but must be level 1."

    Since it was written as:

    "Any new characters who log in during this event will earn extra rewards while leveling as well as Neverember Incentives which can be exchanged for account wide rewards. Note: Characters who log in as a level 1 during the event are eligible, they do not have to be created during the event but must be level 1."

    The first "who log in during this event" applies to earning extra reward for me because it would be pointless to mention that "who login during this event" in your interpretation. I guess the argument comes down to how to interpret "who login during this event" means. You interpret that more or less like what the "Note" said like a repeated statement. I interpret it as something else.
    The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will.
  • forcemajeureforcemajeure Member Posts: 69 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    Actually I also read it as "log in during event to create an eligible character, then your character will get these rewards while levelling or doing AI campaign".

    I could easily have completed the 100 Incentives for the AI campaign during the holidays... except they time-gated it.

    Then I had some non-gaming time because of work and family... came back, found out "no more incentives for you!"

    Basically, Cryptic can get away with incorrectly advertised events, dev blogs that can't get the date correct, bugs on event release, and giving out rewards that you don't even know what they do (CTA weapon sets)… because very few people complain
    and they all keep playing and paying no matter how badly Cryptic and the community manager ignores them.

    That sound you just heard, Cryptic? That's the sound of one wallet closing.
  • octonionsrule#4355 octonionsrule Member Posts: 13 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    The description was rather clear, the implementation did not reflect the description.

    "Any new characters who log in during this event will earn extra rewards while leveling as well as Neverember Incentives which can be exchanged for account wide rewards. Note: Characters who log in as a level 1 during the event are eligible, they do not have to be created during the event but must be level 1.

    The event will run from November 6 at the launch of The Heart of Fire on PC until Tuesday, January 1 at 7:30am PT.

    While leveling, eligible characters will earn the following additional rewards from their Adventurer’s Reward boxes:"


    In the first paragraph the term "eligible" is defined and the definition of the term eligible is tied to the prerequisite "log in during the event" (as new character or level 1)

    In the second paragraph the time period for the duration of the "event" is specified. However, due to the connection between the term "eligible" and and its prerequisite "log in during the event" in the first paragraph, this must be understood by any person who can understand basic logic, that event duration specifies the time period for the creation of eligible characters.

    In the third paragraph the rewards for "eligible" characters are specified.

    Nowhere is it mentioned, explicitly or implicitly, that the time period for the creation of eligible characters also covers the time period, during which rewards are handed out. From a strict logical point of view, there is only one correct interpretation, namely that eligible characters created (or logged in as level 1) during the event will receive rewards, independent of the time period of the event itself (which specifies the time period for the creation of an eligible character)

    Furthermore, even if there had been doubts about the correct interpretation, these doubts were silenced when it became clear after the event ended, that eligible characters created during the event were still getting rewards after the specified end date of the event !

    Due to the
    - original wording, and
    - the confirmation that my interpretation of the wording was correct after the event officially ended and I was still receiving rewards

    I stopped opening my level-up boxes on my eligible characters, because I wanted to get to the 100 token per character limit by doing the campaign. I created 4 characters, two of which were at 55 tokens each (from the levelling boxes) and two other characters, which were already level 70 but where I did not open up the levelling boxes.

    Guess my surprise, when I found out, that two weeks after the event ended, I did not receive any rewards - neither from the boxes of my eligible characters (that were already in my possession, but not opened), nor from completing campaign tasks.

    In the best of all worlds the wording of the original event and its implementation (which handed out rewards after the event) were misleading. Likely Cryptic did not care about a precise and reliable wording / implementation. In the worst case it was intentionally misleading, hoping to create additional income by selling character slots. In fact, I bought my character slots for the four eligible characters created during the event from ZEN, which was bought via real money.

    I really like this game, and because I like it I am willing to spend real money on it, because the developers deserve to be paid for their efforts. However, the execution of this event created a serious dent in my willingness to spend real money. I guess I will still spend money, because the game is - on the grand total - still enjoyable. But seriously, it is a very bad idea to massively annoy your paying customers with such an ill-conceived design. In fact, it would have been better if you hadn't created this event at all!

    It is up to you to think about measures to reinstate customer satisfaction, for instance by allowing eligible characters created during the event to receive the rewards they were promised. Or you can continue to give the impression that you just don't care, in which case you might lose paying customers in the long term.

    I think it would be good if the Community Manager would comment and show us, that at least she cares.

    Post edited by octonionsrule#4355 on
  • regenerderegenerde Member Posts: 2,976 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    Well, the real question is, why even disable the option to earn Incentives and/or the other extra rewards for characters created during this event in the first place?

    They manage to come up with something great to draw in more new players and to even get former players to give NWO another chance, but then they pull some HAMSTER like this and drive those players away again.

    This makes no sense...
    I do believe in killing the messenger...
    Want to know why?
    Because it sends a message!
  • nunya#5309 nunya Member Posts: 933 Arc User
    @nitocris83 You really need to read @octonionsrule#4355's post. This is something that Cryptic really needs to take to heart.
  • lowjohnlowjohn Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,061 Arc User
    I'm with the OP, the event says that if you create the character during the event, the character will receive tokens. It doesn't say that the character will stop receiving tokens when the event ends. The only listed deadline is when you have to create the character by.

    (And, again, when the similar Recruitment Events run in the other game by the same company, using the same engine, running on the same servers, using similar language? The rewards don't stop when the deadline to create the character by passes. So not only is it what the announcement actually says, it's also how *this group of people* have run *this event* before. If it was going to be different than what the anouncement said and how the other identical events worked, they should have said so.)
  • vendoodvendood Member Posts: 77 Arc User

    Checked my characters, also stopped receiving Neverember Incentives a week or more ago.

    For the people who don't get the difference:

    A Recruit event is different from a normal event. This is something new to Neverwinter but has been done for several years in Star Trek Online. For a Recruit event, the listed dates of the event are the dates to create an eligible character. Once created, the eligible character receives certain bonuses from levelling and completing tasks.

    The dev blog announcing it is also quite clear on this. "While levelling (and completing AI campaign tasks), eligible characters will receive". That's pretty clear.

    If you are going to create an event which requires using up a character slot, levelling and gearing a new character, and advertising in clear text that "eligible characters will receive X", then if you plan to turn off X at some point, you better be pretty clear in advance just how and when you are turning it off.

    For my money, this is just another case of Cryptic either turning stuff on/off by accident, or not publishing end dates, or simply not giving a damn what happens to players once they have sold a character slot to them.

    (And yes, I was also hit by the "Acquired Treasure chest ending 2 days early, unannounced" thing, and I ticketed it, and Support basically said "too bad, no chest for you!". They also would not admit the event ended early, they would only say "Chests were available for pickup during the event only".)

    <...snipped...>

    Q: What happens if I create a Delta Recruit, but do not complete all of the listed Tasks?

    A: Once a Delta Recruit completes their special Tutorial and receives their “Tesseract Communications Device” they will be free to complete the assigned tasks at any point in the future. Although Delta Recruit characters can only be created while the event is running, there is no time limit on the completion of the tasks, or their associated rewards.
    Thank you for finding and quoting Cryptic's own FAQ about how Recruit events work. Once eligible, a Recruit can earn all rewards. STO also has 2 classes of events - general events, where only during the event are rewards earned. And Recruit events, where you use up a paid character slot to create a new Recruit during the event, but once created, the Recruit can earn all the Recruit rewards.

    This is NW's first 'Recruit' event, but obviously, if they are going to time-gate the campaigns, and then arbitrarily turn off Recruit rewards without announcement or warning before an eligible Recruit can possibly finish them, then future Recruit events will not be very well received. And I will personally make certain that everyone is aware on future Recruit events that Cryptic can and will turn off the rewards without announcement or warning.

  • vendoodvendood Member Posts: 77 Arc User
    (May be a re-post, as usual, one single edit deleted the entire reply)

    Checked my characters, also stopped receiving Neverember Incentives a week or more ago.

    For the people who don't get the difference:

    A Recruit event is different from a normal event. This is something new to Neverwinter but has been done for several years in Star Trek Online. For a Recruit event, the listed dates of the event are the dates to create an eligible character. Once created, the eligible character receives certain bonuses from levelling and completing tasks.

    The dev blog announcing it is also quite clear on this. "While levelling (and completing AI campaign tasks), eligible characters will receive". That's pretty clear.

    If you are going to create an event which requires using up a character slot, levelling and gearing a new character, and advertising in clear text that "eligible characters will receive X", then if you plan to turn off X at some point, you better be pretty clear in advance just how and when you are turning it off.

    For my money, this is just another case of Cryptic either turning stuff on/off by accident, or not publishing end dates, or simply not giving a damn what happens to players once they have sold a character slot to them.

    (And yes, I was also hit by the "Acquired Treasure chest ending 2 days early, unannounced" thing, and I ticketed it, and Support basically said "too bad, no chest for you!". They also would not admit the event ended early, they would only say "Chests were available for pickup during the event only".)

    <...snipped...>

    Q: What happens if I create a Delta Recruit, but do not complete all of the listed Tasks?

    A: Once a Delta Recruit completes their special Tutorial and receives their “Tesseract Communications Device” they will be free to complete the assigned tasks at any point in the future. Although Delta Recruit characters can only be created while the event is running, there is no time limit on the completion of the tasks, or their associated rewards.
    Thank you for finding and quoting Cryptic's own FAQ about how Recruit events work. Once eligible, a Recruit can earn all rewards. STO also has 2 classes of events - general events, where only during the event are rewards earned. And Recruit events, where you use up a paid character slot to create a new Recruit during the event, but once created, the Recruit can earn all the Recruit rewards.

    This is NW's first 'Recruit' event, but obviously, if they are going to time-gate the campaigns, and then arbitrarily turn off Recruit rewards without announcement or warning before an eligible Recruit can possibly finish them, then future Recruit events will not be very well received. And I will personally make certain that everyone is aware on future Recruit events that Cryptic can and will turn off the rewards without announcement or warning.
Sign In or Register to comment.