test content
Logo
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
TR Issues in M15
@noworries#8859 My apologies if i am tagging the wrong person.
1. Impossible to Catch - What has been recently done to this power's activation made it arguably the most awful power to use. It is more clunky than any other power in our arsenal. Not only is it interrupting other powers in process but its activation is no longer instant, its queued and activated after other power's animations are finished. Its unable to activate quite some time after dodging and it also prevents activation of other powers coming after ITC if we try to activate them instantly. I am not sure if you understand how critical this is. Also, the animation is not instant even if there is no other animation going on.
2. Smoke Bomb replacement - Smoke Bomb's damage was never overpowered in PvE, if we exclude the AoC multiproc bug and it was still nerfed. What did you give us instead? Blade Flurry? Another clunky and slow power. With Blade Flurry we lose the control which Smoke Bomb gave us and without ITC we have nothing to mitigate incoming attacks. While the AP gain from Path of the Blade is great the damage it gives is laughable. Blitz's damage is laughable.
3. The class in general feels a lot less fluid, not that it was extremely fluid before either but now its terrible. Even before, in mod14 when our Dailies were great we were the class that probably needed the longest to prepare and buff up. Even tho we were quite powerful, it took a while before we buffed up and our damage started to kick in. More fluid classes were able to beat us thanks to our slow preparation time. Now it takes even longer and damage is half of what it was. What is your logic behind this TR rework?
4. The balance was never needed for PvE TR, all you had to do is to fix the bugs. AoC+Smoke Bomb bug and reduce SoD from 75% to 50%, as well as to fix CB and ITC to give normal power instead double amount when used after WoB. That's all what was needed to bring TR in line.
You didnt bring Saboteur and Scoundrel to Executioners level, you brought Executioner down and have them meet somewhere in the middle. While that is good balance among the feat trees the damage output just from feats was lowered and then on top of that comes the most important part - our daily powers. Both CB and WoB are 60% weaker than they were in mod 14. That's the main problem, our core buffing mechanism was lowered by 60% or even more considering both losing 2 seconds of their duration.
We reported the Lurkers Assault AP gain block and no response has been given regarding that.
With buffing mechanism drastically nerfed, how do you see TR class as competitive in PvE? I am interested in your thought process, what do you think you gave us back while you took away 60% of the buffs?
5. Loadouts and switching between them. This is useful for other classes which have the option to run either as dps or support however for TR, this means switching between setup for single target and setup for many targets(Boss vs mobs). While this sounds nice on paper its not practical in real runs. Either there are no Campfires between mob and boss phase like in Cradle so we are forced to fight mobs with a single target loadout or there are campfires but since our Artifact is still on cooldown from the boss fight we arent able to switch the loadout and again encounter mobs with single target loadout. Since we are able to switch them in Enclave and Stronghold without campfires i dont see a reason why we shouldnt be able to do the same in Dungeons as well, also regardless if Artifact is on cooldown or not. As long as we are not in combat we should be able to switch them out.
@kreatyve I guess this feedback didnt insult anyone and was polite enough. Let's see what kind of response will the dev team give to this constructive feedback.
1. Impossible to Catch - What has been recently done to this power's activation made it arguably the most awful power to use. It is more clunky than any other power in our arsenal. Not only is it interrupting other powers in process but its activation is no longer instant, its queued and activated after other power's animations are finished. Its unable to activate quite some time after dodging and it also prevents activation of other powers coming after ITC if we try to activate them instantly. I am not sure if you understand how critical this is. Also, the animation is not instant even if there is no other animation going on.
2. Smoke Bomb replacement - Smoke Bomb's damage was never overpowered in PvE, if we exclude the AoC multiproc bug and it was still nerfed. What did you give us instead? Blade Flurry? Another clunky and slow power. With Blade Flurry we lose the control which Smoke Bomb gave us and without ITC we have nothing to mitigate incoming attacks. While the AP gain from Path of the Blade is great the damage it gives is laughable. Blitz's damage is laughable.
3. The class in general feels a lot less fluid, not that it was extremely fluid before either but now its terrible. Even before, in mod14 when our Dailies were great we were the class that probably needed the longest to prepare and buff up. Even tho we were quite powerful, it took a while before we buffed up and our damage started to kick in. More fluid classes were able to beat us thanks to our slow preparation time. Now it takes even longer and damage is half of what it was. What is your logic behind this TR rework?
4. The balance was never needed for PvE TR, all you had to do is to fix the bugs. AoC+Smoke Bomb bug and reduce SoD from 75% to 50%, as well as to fix CB and ITC to give normal power instead double amount when used after WoB. That's all what was needed to bring TR in line.
You didnt bring Saboteur and Scoundrel to Executioners level, you brought Executioner down and have them meet somewhere in the middle. While that is good balance among the feat trees the damage output just from feats was lowered and then on top of that comes the most important part - our daily powers. Both CB and WoB are 60% weaker than they were in mod 14. That's the main problem, our core buffing mechanism was lowered by 60% or even more considering both losing 2 seconds of their duration.
We reported the Lurkers Assault AP gain block and no response has been given regarding that.
With buffing mechanism drastically nerfed, how do you see TR class as competitive in PvE? I am interested in your thought process, what do you think you gave us back while you took away 60% of the buffs?
5. Loadouts and switching between them. This is useful for other classes which have the option to run either as dps or support however for TR, this means switching between setup for single target and setup for many targets(Boss vs mobs). While this sounds nice on paper its not practical in real runs. Either there are no Campfires between mob and boss phase like in Cradle so we are forced to fight mobs with a single target loadout or there are campfires but since our Artifact is still on cooldown from the boss fight we arent able to switch the loadout and again encounter mobs with single target loadout. Since we are able to switch them in Enclave and Stronghold without campfires i dont see a reason why we shouldnt be able to do the same in Dungeons as well, also regardless if Artifact is on cooldown or not. As long as we are not in combat we should be able to switch them out.
@kreatyve I guess this feedback didnt insult anyone and was polite enough. Let's see what kind of response will the dev team give to this constructive feedback.
Post edited by blur#5900 on
9
Comments
-Duelist fury final combo now only does 6 attacks, instead of 9 (33% nerf)
-Duelist fury bleed damage is reduced by 40%
Of course after you've used Lurker Assault you can't build any action points for another Daily, because some "Genius" though to put an action point block to the daily.
The developers had actually admitted that these nerf are so extreme that they were going to remove them from the two page long list of nerfs. Yet ... in the end they did include the duelist fury nerf ...
That was the only reply from the developer in that 23-page thread of horrified TRs, and they didn't even kept that promise ...
Myself I've lost all motivation in re-inventing my TR. Now he'll be a retired adventurer now and an active workshop master. At least they didn't introduce special penalties to masterworks if your class is a TR ... yet :P
Duelists Flurry is fine, from what i know dmg nerf was reverted and bleeds stacks are 100%, so more or less same like it was. I dont know if they kept that promise about removing DF Bleed nerf or not...
Lurker's Assault AP block is a relic of the past and it made sense back then but no reason for it now.
Give them time
If they didn't nerf the DF bleed damage like they said then there may be some hope, maybe enough hope for me to actually give it a try
To be fair, I haven't tried to re-spec and run a few test dungeons yet, because just by looking at the math of the nerfs the situation looked very bad ... If they did revert the DF nerf then it would still be bad but not as bad as it originally seemed.
Meh what the heck i'll give it a try
I think they reverted Bleed damage back to normal because all other changes mentioned at that time went through. From my point of view, DF is only useful at Arcolith and maybe Orcus in end game parties.
Two things are crucial:
1. Reverting ITC's activation to how it was, this new version is messing up both Powers activated before and after it.
2. Removal of AP gain block from Lurkers Assault because on long boss fights this is our to go Daily and the AP block hurts us a lot, even making it stack with itself is advisable since it is only for short period and it wouldnt be higher benefit than WoB+LA on Orcus fight. Fighting Arcolith without permanent buff from Daily is a terrible thing for good parties and i wont imagine how it is for average and weaker parties and using WoB or CB or combining those two is not an option, buff amount is just too low.
3. The AP block from Lurkers Assault also ruins another encounter - Path of the Blade. This encounter doesnt give AP at the time of activation like majority of others but it gives over time so if you activate PotB and LA right after then you would get 0 AP.
As a Bis TR (18.2k), I should be able to bring something to lower level parties, but I really can’t, without buffs on my cool downs and AP, I feel like I spend most of the time doing nothing, waiting for stealth or ap, spamming slow/single target at-wills.
I agree with all that blur said (itc is a joke), and I also feel like path of blades (tried it for the ap gain) is also slow to activate. It seems that some powers are cancelling each other, meaning that if we press two powers in a quick succession, only one or none will activate, and we need to keep pressing the same buttons. Terrible.
It just doesn’t feel right. I have played this game for almost 5 years and this is the only time that I feel that I won’t put up with it. Mainly because I don’t feel like I am playing TR anymore. This revamped thing that you gave us is slow and frail.
I won’t spend ADs or money to level another char, because I have some pride and you guys should somehow see the consequences of your actions. I always charged ZEN at this time of the year, not this year. It honestly makes me sad because Neverwinter is quite unique in its gameplay but I was buying something that seems to have been discontinued.
Please just give us a hint that you are seriously looking into this. Some acknowledgement that you understand (or not) what is wrong. As already mentioned, the ITC and Lurkers assault are priorities, but unfortunately they won’t solve the actual crippled position of the TR.
I dont understand why PvP TR's are not complaining about ITC's activation, for them its even more important that it activates instantly and that it doesnt cancel previous powers and powers coming after it.
Is anyone in the dev team playing TR and understanding how clunky the new ITC is?
Why does Lurker's Assault have Action Points gain block at this point?
@noworries#8859
@terramak
@mimicking#6533
@nitocris83
@percemer
@kreatyve
But I suspect it will be another 3 years before TRs are welcome again in dungeons. It is a class the devs just cannot choreograph. I should make some witty joke here but it is just too, too sad.