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would you like for artifact equipment to go away?

reiwulfreiwulf Member Posts: 2,687 Arc User
I'd like to hear your opinions on this. I absolutely despise artifact equipement. I think it's a horrible artificial way to make us grind more to get better stats and overall item level. I would really like if with the next few mods they make regular equipment that equals at least purple versions of artifact equipment and start removing them, maybe progressively. But that's also because I haven't taken the time to upgrade it, i hate grinding and refining, maybe others who have put more effort into it actually like artifact equipment? what would you prefer? to keep adding new artifact equipement or just regular equipement dropped by bosses and stuff like that?
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  • lirithiellirithiel Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,482 Arc User
    It's an easy way for Cryptic to make money off the whales, who absolutely must have all their artifact gear refined up to legendary on day one.

    I abhor artifact gear in every shape and form. It is lazy design just like most aspects of this game of late. It would be less tedious if they didn't replace our gear every 3-4 months. But alas it is here to stay, just like HEs. I can think of a 100 better ways to get us to run content on a daily basis instead of farming for a gazillion RP but what is the point of listing them when Cryptic ignore our feedback and suggestions?
    Our pain is self chosen.

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  • mynaammynaam Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 892 Arc User

    lirithiel said:

    It's an easy way for Cryptic to make money off the whales, who absolutely must have all their artifact gear refined up to legendary on day one.

    First, the above. I think it's pretty obvious that it's meant as a huge "pay2skip" thing where people will definitely "pay to skip".

    With regards to the OP:
    If you ask me not to take into account anything else in this game my answer would be simple: Get rid of the lot. Rather yesterday than tomorrow. Not only is it a horrible way to make money from players, the power creep that comes with them is ruining 100% of PvP and 80% of PvE. It's a travesty. Growing gear, if you want to implement such a risky thing in the first place, should grow by using it. Not an RP grind. But alas, as with everything Cryptic does these days, it's not that simple. And money isn't the only reason they keep them coming.

    We all know that Cryptic has no assets -or no will, I can't tell the difference- available to deliver us proper content anymore since mod3. Which means they have to find other ways to keep us busy. As Andy said a while ago, and I quote (although I can't find the original post this quickly) "what would players do if they were not refining?" end quote. My answer was "play the content?". But no. There's no new content coming unless it's another grind. Just look at SH. 100% grinding of old content, boons that are way out of whack for PvP -as if PvP wasn't gated by a high enough paywall already- and all they boost about is their "largest map yet". They have no way -or are unwilling to- deliver us proper content. If they could, they would offer us that instead of more pointless grinds that only postpone the inevitable complains and leaving players.

    And that's exactly what they are doing: Postponing the inevitable. 70%+ of my guild (full 300 man roster, been here almost since launch) barely plays long enough to do a few eDemo's to grind for the twisted weapons. Not even Simril seems to be able to keep them online for more than 2 hours a day. I myself haven't even done Demo once. I refuse to touch another RP grind all together. The only question is, how long can they keep postponing things before people just give up on the game? If they haven't figured out yet that we do not want more HEs and more RP grinds posed as new content, there's little hope for Neverwinter.
    +1 Brilliantly said
    There are more than BIS players in this game
    It has been 5 YEARS since last new class this is getting ridiculous
    FORCING the majority of your player base to play 4 mod old dungeons and trial will have a bad result on player base
    Please do master/normal version of dungeons. This way content for all MOD 19 have nothing new for vast majority of player base. Giving an EVENT is not same thing as permanent content for non BIS. As we suggested in CDP
    Changes are getting so bad i would rather prefer no new changes (RIP ICE FISHING in winter fest)



  • fantasycharacterfantasycharacter Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 675 Arc User
    edited December 2015
    I am tired of everything being a massive grind.

    The game was most fun to me when i felt i could do what i wanted with my time. Play some PvP or dungeons all day, that's just fine player you do that.

    Now I feel a slave to RP and stronghold contributions, and getting some rings, or twisted weapons...so may grinds i didn't even list 1/4 of them :(
  • santralafaxsantralafax Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,896 Arc User
    reiwulf said:

    I'd like to hear your opinions on this. I absolutely despise artifact equipement. I think it's a horrible artificial way to make us grind more to get better stats and overall item level. I would really like if with the next few mods they make regular equipment that equals at least purple versions of artifact equipment and start removing them, maybe progressively. But that's also because I haven't taken the time to upgrade it, i hate grinding and refining, maybe others who have put more effort into it actually like artifact equipment? what would you prefer? to keep adding new artifact equipement or just regular equipement dropped by bosses and stuff like that?

    Dislike artifact grind intensely. Until they forced us to swap gear in Mod 6 only acqired the Dragon mainhand. All others I sold or refined into sword.

    Now no other jewelry or main/off hand makes sense. Other than Mulhorand vs purple or lower, nothing else comes near the stats. I remember @strumslinger's quote about "what would you do if you had nothing to refine", but I didn't refine anything ever for the first six months I played the game.
  • generaldiomedesgeneraldiomedes Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 207 Arc User
    The alternative .. grind dungeons until your piece drops .. has limited re-playability.
  • reiwulfreiwulf Member Posts: 2,687 Arc User
    they could have a mix of a certain % of drop from the boss AND having it being able to be bought with a certain amount of dungeon tokens that you get everytime. so even if you run out of luck you know you can get it at the end.
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  • bioshrikebioshrike Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,729 Arc User
    I would like to see an enchantment added, which when slotted, generates RP for the artifact it's slotted in, as some % of XP gained.
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  • reiwulfreiwulf Member Posts: 2,687 Arc User
    that wouldn't solve the problem itself though and if they did it would still be a pain in the a** to get it to epic.
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  • reiwulfreiwulf Member Posts: 2,687 Arc User
    oh I read that wrong, I thought he was saying that it would give more RP than regularly, not that it was based on a % of EXP.
    If artifacts are going to use exp to level up (which is a good idea indeed) you should not need a specific item slotted into it it should be automatic. If we take the idea a bit farther, they should again, eliminate RP for artifact equipment and make it level up ONLY on exp. want to level them faster? buy 2x exp items. they could still get people to buy things if they want it faster and we could get our equipement improved without spending hours in PE sitting down refining and filling our bags with useless HAMSTER.
    I still prefer non artifact equipmenet but this would be indeed a better situation than the one we have now.
    2e2qwj6.jpg
  • feanor70118feanor70118 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,154 Arc User
    bioshrike said:

    I would like to see an enchantment added, which when slotted, generates RP for the artifact it's slotted in, as some % of XP gained.

    That is a really good idea. Unfortunately, if they implemented it, soon enough they'd screw it up with internal cooldowns and daily limits like they did to DHEs. And, of course, they'd gate it behind some huge, pointless AD sink to start with.
  • santralafaxsantralafax Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,896 Arc User
    edited December 2015
    bioshrike said:

    I would like to see an enchantment added, which when slotted, generates RP for the artifact it's slotted in, as some % of XP gained.

    It would work for a month and then generate pearls twice a day. This would be implemented as an "improvement" if ever commented on at all by management/devs.
  • bioshrikebioshrike Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,729 Arc User
    reiwulf said:

    oh I read that wrong, I thought he was saying that it would give more RP than regularly, not that it was based on a % of EXP.
    If artifacts are going to use exp to level up (which is a good idea indeed) you should not need a specific item slotted into it it should be automatic. If we take the idea a bit farther, they should again, eliminate RP for artifact equipment and make it level up ONLY on exp. want to level them faster? buy 2x exp items. they could still get people to buy things if they want it faster and we could get our equipement improved without spending hours in PE sitting down refining and filling our bags with useless HAMSTER.
    I still prefer non artifact equipmenet but this would be indeed a better situation than the one we have now.

    My thoughts are that they are unlikely to scrap the current RP system, so by implementing an XP -> RP enchantment, it could work within that system.
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  • zibadawazibadawa Member Posts: 1,266 Arc User
    lirithiel said:

    It's an easy way for Cryptic to make money off the whales, who absolutely must have all their artifact gear refined up to legendary on day one.

    I abhor artifact gear in every shape and form. It is lazy design just like most aspects of this game of late. It would be less tedious if they didn't replace our gear every 3-4 months. But alas it is here to stay, just like HEs. I can think of a 100 better ways to get us to run content on a daily basis instead of farming for a gazillion RP but what is the point of listing them when Cryptic ignore our feedback and suggestions?

    I would much rather have visible, incremental progress to my getting better gear than to be subjected to vicious RNG and a monstrously unforgiving queue system to get my gear. Because you do realize that if they figure it takes a typical player 6 months to get one artifact equipment up to legendary, then any replacement for it is inherently going to be designed to take you ~6 months to get from doing dedicated farming of bosses the entire time? Indicators are not that great that they're willing to significantly reduce this, so you really should expect it to take about the same amount of time as it does now to get the best gear; if not longer.
  • oldbaldyoneoldbaldyone Member Posts: 1,840 Arc User
    Just put the "Dungeons" back in to Dungeons and Dragons.....

    Just to give a new flavor, I don't really mind artifacts. What I don't like is the lack of options. Artifact MH/OH should be one of several options available. Now, its basically a few sets of armor, a few viable rings, one or 2 viable sets of weapons.....I'm sorry, but thats a pretty pathetic selection. Gearing is the MAIN thing people do in games like this...thats what keeps people going. Limiting the selection to what...40 items per class essentially (unless you want blues.......yea, right). Pretty sure most MMOs have that many viable options PER SLOT for each class.

    Anyways, my big thing is the NUMBER of RP items. With 3 bind types, and enchantments that are partially refined not stacking....you can have a HUGE number of slots taken for just RP. I think I counted over 160 last time I checked. That is insane and necessary. Reduce it to 1 set of RP items of different values, and be done with it.
  • feanor70118feanor70118 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,154 Arc User
    kalindra said:

    Since so many people have invested so much effort and / one cash in their artifacts, that it would be cruel to remove them from game.
    But it would be nice to stop the power creep and the treatmill of ever new slightly better artifact weapons.
    They can try to sell items to change aspects of artifacts, and introduce slightly better artifact versions for helmets, etc, but not again a ever more powerful latter of the same item class.

    Please don't encourage them to add even more artifacts and long, tedius grinds to the game. They want to introduce better gear, fine. But we are DONE with artifacts.
  • bioshrikebioshrike Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,729 Arc User

    kalindra said:

    Since so many people have invested so much effort and / one cash in their artifacts, that it would be cruel to remove them from game.
    But it would be nice to stop the power creep and the treatmill of ever new slightly better artifact weapons.
    They can try to sell items to change aspects of artifacts, and introduce slightly better artifact versions for helmets, etc, but not again a ever more powerful latter of the same item class.

    Please don't encourage them to add even more artifacts and long, tedius grinds to the game. They want to introduce better gear, fine. But we are DONE with artifacts.
    I really wish they'd reintroduce epic main and off-hand items to dungeons...
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  • grimahgrimah Member Posts: 1,658 Arc User
    its really too late now, no chance it would ever be removed.

    I do agree it's subtracts from the game more than adds, and likely one of the turn-off for newer players.
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  • santralafaxsantralafax Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,896 Arc User
    kalindra said:

    Since so many people have invested so much effort and / one cash in their artifacts, that it would be cruel to remove them from game.
    But it would be nice to stop the power creep and the treatmill of ever new slightly better artifact weapons.
    They can try to sell items to change aspects of artifacts, and introduce slightly better artifact versions for helmets, etc, but not again a ever more powerful latter of the same item class.

    They could slowly re-introduce newer, better non-artifact weapons, etc., without making them obsolete overnight. I wouldn't mind the artifact equipment drying up in an upgrade rather than having to feed another few hundred thousand RP to ANOTHER upgrade to make it legendary again...., Why can't we have items that just work? We used to.
  • reposterzreposterz Member Posts: 293 Arc User
    I think having the main weapon as artifact equipment is ok, but other items is not ideal to have artifact equipment cause it promotes grinding to level them up. Basically a few artifact equipment is ok, for all items for a character to become artifact equipment is a bit too much.
  • rollingonitrollingonit Member Posts: 1,322 Arc User
    edited December 2015
    It's too late for such an idea to completely remove, and the refine system is completely integrated in the f2p business model Cryptic/PWE runs. I was honestly pleasantly surprised when I first starting playing it wasnt implemented with gear at the start (only refine were enchants). I figured though since this was PWE/Cryptic it was in the cards, just a matter of time.

    Ironzergs idea or reverting DHs to their original implementation, but then just binding them to account would help ease a ton of the anxiety about the turrible grind. (except to those with lots of AD or money already, who buy botted RP off AH)

    IBut then again its bank for this company to keep its terrible design, til they shut the game down and repeat the process with another title. Consumers supporting bad practices that's what it comes down to.

    http://massivelyop.com/2015/12/29/tree-of-saviors-hairstyles-cost-more-in-game-than-in-real-life/

    "Bugs, shaky servers, and controversial cash shop prices are plaguing Tree of Savior’s South Korean launch this week.

    According to commenters, the release of Tree of Savior was rushed and didn’t include fixes for many issues that trouble the game. To add insult to injury, apparently the publisher instituted expensive cash shop items that flipped microtransactions over into macrotransaction territory. "

    Quote from article. Does this sound familiar to anyone? O yah the start of Neverwinter. How many times will this repeat till consumers figure out, stop throwing money at these people.
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  • lldtlldt Member Posts: 197 Arc User
    Can't understand how someone can spend so much time playing the game and then have even more time to spend creating these bad videos of them playing the game (which no one else cares about except themselves) and then to spam it all over the place - including as replies to threads that have nothing to do with the video.
  • smulchsmulch Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 625 Arc User
    I like artifact equipement, as long as we stay at a total of 4. There's a real need for more customization on items though. Also, more weird stuff. Mod 8 rings are a step in the right direction (although the way to obtain legendary rings needs to be improved).
  • rayrdanrayrdan Member Posts: 5,410 Arc User
    Leadership and more leadership
  • wylonuswylonus Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,368 Arc User
    i rather have XP based items than grinding with RP items. it need something new and unique like concept.

    let call those weapons as "Relics".

    as a new dungeon released, or have older dungeons get newer relic updates whenever there is new "level cap" raised.
    so, let go back to older dungeons, we get epic relic weapons, with possiblity of new level cap, we go back to older dungeon and get relic shards when devs add them, and just to give new life and new weapon tier raised.

    also, it must have profession dealing with upgradings, Weaponsmiths we have, are back to being semi useful, for example, Shard of Union and a rare gem shard of different kinds of choice we pick.

    huh? what am i saying? ok, let go back a bit.
    once we get relic weapon from end-zone dungeon chest after the final bosses defeated, we pick up blank state weapon form, just better damage base.
    then we chose any choice of gems only looted from chest from newly created "Vault Dungeon", different dungeon of gem mining zone concept, with cooldown visit timer to prevent fast crafting or exploits.
    once you pick a chosen gem a day or a week, and later you would need Shard of Union to be use in craftings to fuse a gem you picked and add to relic weapon you owned, and up to 3 selected fused gems to give a new weapon modifiers.

    list of gems
    examples...
    Amber of Penteration, to cut thru some armor defenses
    Sapphire of Power, add +200 power, next tier would be +220 if new level cap raised.
    Ameythyst of Movements
    Topaz of Extra Heal recovery
    etc, etc, etc, and so on.
    all these can be upgraded in future new tiers.
    with concepts of future released mod expansions for standard gems (current level), greater gems (for 80 lvl), superior gems (for 90 lvl), and Mythical gem (for 100 lvl).

    then again, with newer union shards (Standard, Greater, Superior, and Mythical) for new crafting tiers.

    once we have Relic weapons with 3 selected fusions, with new expanded slots for defense, attack, and unique as a new personal "customization" weapon.

    later, at last, when there is new tier unlocking, new quest, we go back to original relic dungeon and get new shard of upgrading as "Greater", and later add for Superior and Mythical versions whenever the new tier get raised. just to keep old dungeon still be useful and save lot of times for devs not to create new dungeons for upgradings, it helps recycle and not to abandoning the outdated dungeons.

    devs dont need to make new weapon skins, we got plenty of "transmute weapons" for appearances.

    why same old dungeon? it would make mobs weak as we have upgraded weapons, fear not, it is mostly puzzle maze and levers, just like we have with our first artifact dungeon.

    concept of puzzle maze, one with letter tiles and must correctly walk on each letter, and another puzzle for multiple mirrors to reflect light beams to unlock doors, and statues with missing item parts and place on them correctly, and moving the boxes as weight counters.
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