For The Love Of God Nerf Sins/warriors x2

24

Comments

  • stew675
    stew675 Posts: 250 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    People who are complaining are doing so with good reason.

    When a moderately gemmed lvl 78-79 sin (fort 9's with lvl 3 gems and ~100 chroma) can take down many lvl 80 toons with level 3 wings, then there's an inherent imbalance afoot. ..and before y'all argue that the toons the sins are going up against aren't PvP based, that's not the case. I've seen many PvP based toons go down to way less specced sins, due to being stunned/silenced into inaction until death. It ain't a fair challenge and it ain't fun.

    Highly specced ele wars basically get 15 secs of free attacks on you when they pop BoR, 'cos hitting them back does massive damage that bypasses all resistances and defenses unless you're so strongly specced that you can 1-2 shot them in return.

    Sins though are broken. They can re-stealth when they're not meant to be able to. They can break an MM's hunter mark and re-stealth. They ignore a Vamp's feast, and re-stealth. The cool-down on the stealth is crazy low. I've been in fights with sins that stealth, wait around, then attack 3-4 times, and then re-stealth while you're still stunned/silenced, and all while under the effect of a hunter's mark (after de-stealthing), or just repeatedly wait, destealth, attack, and then re-stealth. If you follow the "code" of not potting, it's basically just wait until you die because there's nothing you can do.

    Ele Wars I have less of an issue with. With a proper build you can generally withstand their onslaught until BoR drops, and then come back at them.

    Dark Vamps are silly, 'cos they heal as they attack when in vamp form.

    The game appears to have its PvP crutch-classes that plenty of people use and hold onto and will swear black and blue that they're not imbalanced, all while the rest of us find ourselves in parties comprising of little other than dark vamps, sins, and ele wars when running instances.

    If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it's probably a duck, despite all the ducks saying that they're not ducks! lol
  • foxondrugs
    foxondrugs Posts: 114 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    tornathien wrote: »
    I agree war needs some nerfing, if you start beating one up after u get out of stun lock they just pop bor. you got 2 options 1. keep attacking and die to bor, or 2. sit and do nothing and wait for bor to drop and be killed by the war. even if BoR would get nerfed by 50% it would still be OP..

    Yeah only BoR hits you for fixed amount of damage. It's based on the wars attack, sure on RH DU and Soul devour it goes up. But it's still fixed amount of damage. Say it reflects 6k damage at you. If you do high amount of damage you can kill the war before he gets you. It doesn't nerf your damage towards them at all. War's stun you up on crit after the initial assult sequence. If you pack enough dodge or eva it wont hurt you.

    As for comment above of decent geared sin's killing lvl 3 wings.... I seen rebel priest without wings killing lvl 3 winged vampire. There's a lot of people with lvl 2-3 winged who are paper do little to no damage. If you are packing 700+ res, crit dodge crit def sins will take a hella long time to kill you. Besides mostly sins use silence - run around from them they are ranged, and well if pitch can kill you... That's hardly their problem if one can't survive.
    As for stealth, I've personally, stunned slept transformed them just before going into stealth. I seen those decently geared sins run into aoes and get whipped on one hit.
    Obviously its harder to kill them if they are full eva. But then they lose out on crit chance and damage. So whatever they hit on you out of stealth wont hurt that much.
    Again provided if you have any sort of ability to survive.
    There are plenty of ways how not to die/kill wars and sins you just need to think instead of hoping that mindless button clicking will keep you above the pack.
    That's why pvp is fun - it's a challenge. It's not brainless button clicking and praying. You think you react on the spot and hopefully win. You lose - you learn from your mistakes.
    Of course if the person is not geared for pvp - why expect freebies? Everyone wants to kill everything with a click of a button.
    Well it doesn't work that way. Tho some say that wars (for example) are brainless button class its a lie. You need plan ahead what to use, what happens if it's on cd still etc.
    Certain tree's on certain classes don't work for pvp without putting half a life and an arm in the char. But in the end every class can pvp either by going for the kill or being support/unkillable.
    ~The time of the ''EL Gato'' ~
  • ladypsyber
    ladypsyber Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    riotz24 wrote: »
    The reason i started the 1st one vauge is so u can see what the population thinks about it.

    so please stop deleting valid threads for lame reasons.


    Warriors BoR+Insane amount of stuns+High dmg+ High base HP needs fix

    Sins having the ability too 1hit the most geared of players out of stealth, and if in failing re- stealth try again, or if u suck at that just chain stun them, BETTER YET, why not roll a lycan wich is soley devoted to making sins more op


    just saying

    in saying that mages need a buff

    Totally agree. Warrior with crit up will one hit almost anything. With their rush skill that starts them out of range of most people, the current build of them is much too OP.

    Don't know if I agree about the sin issue though...too busy getting 1 hitted by warriors even though i have fairly decent character.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • riotz24
    riotz24 Posts: 37 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Your post was not deleted. It was closed for 1. Wrong section, and 2. lack of a proper body for a topic discussion. I told you you could remake the thread with a better thread body for proper discussion, and post it in the proper section. You did one of those things. I don't mind the topic at all. I never said you couldn't start it. I just wanted a more filled out thread so people had a better idea what to discuss.

    i put this in apart of the forum that people actually read, seeing as people "invest" money into this game i thinking its only fair that the problems of this game are looked at.

    and a major problem in this game, isnt the lack of badass fashion. btw the designer of the fashion needs too ................ RE THINK his definition of badass, i mean the fresh fasion wtf. but

    the MAJOR problem is the massive class imbalance. yes Vamps are OP for PvE, Warriors and Sins are op for PvP. but you cnt say re-roll differ class too wen someone has spent alot of money on a toon.

    90% of the Reason people quit is because of the crashing and the class imbalance.

    so the PROFESSIONAL thing to do would be too take the players concerns and give it too the Devs ....................... if they exist
  • stew675
    stew675 Posts: 250 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    foxondrugs wrote: »
    As for comment above of decent geared sin's killing lvl 3 wings.... I seen rebel priest without wings killing lvl 3 winged vampire. There's a lot of people with lvl 2-3 winged who are paper do little to no damage.

    This is specifically why I qualified my statement to being against lvl 3 winged toons that ARE gemmed for PvP, and still having trouble with lvl 1 winged sins.
    foxondrugs wrote: »
    If you are packing 700+ res, crit dodge crit def sins will take a hella long time to kill you. Besides mostly sins use silence - run around from them they are ranged, and well if pitch can kill you... That's hardly their problem if one can't survive.

    So what I hear you saying is that it takes a toon with 700+resistances, and maxed crit dodge and crit def, to survive a fort 9/lvl 3 gemmed lvl 78-79 sin. Uh, that's precisely my point. Yes, with ENOUGH resistances, eva, crit dodge/def, you can survive sins. The exact issue here is the RELATIVE gear that is required to do so.
    As for stealth, I've personally, stunned slept transformed them just before going into stealth.

    Sounds like you got lucky with lag/latency. Most sins I've dueled will stealth before the fight starts.
    I seen those decently geared sins run into aoes and get whipped on one hit.
    So what if you're one of the classes has doesn't have targetless AoE's to combat stealthed sins?
    Obviously its harder to kill them if they are full eva. But then they lose out on crit chance and damage. So whatever they hit on you out of stealth wont hurt that much.
    Again provided if you have any sort of ability to survive.

    ...and here we're back to the core issue. In order to survive even a moderately specced sin, your own toon has to be specced to the max on resistances and dodges/def, just to have a chance to even strike back.
    There are plenty of ways how not to die/kill wars and sins you just need to think instead of hoping that mindless button clicking will keep you above the pack.
    GvG sins are much easier because they'll get caught in the AoE cross-fire against non-stealthing toons, or get de-stealthed by a number of the toons/classes that have that ability. The issue I'm talking about here is that there are a number of classes for which said class has next to no answer to for a sin, unless said class is specced to the max like you're suggesting just to survive long enough to have a chance to even strike back.
    That's why pvp is fun - it's a challenge. It's not brainless button clicking and praying. You think you react on the spot and hopefully win. You lose - you learn from your mistakes.
    Of course if the person is not geared for pvp - why expect freebies? Everyone wants to kill everything with a click of a button.

    Bordering on straw man argument there. No one said anything about wanting to win everything with the click of a few buttons. What makes PvP fun is a series of attack and counter-attacks, a duel of talents, someone throwing something at you, and you managing your skills wisely to have an answer when required. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, but hey, you gave it a shot and learned something. That's what make PvP fun.

    What makes PvP not fun is when there are classes for which other classes simply have no answer for, and just end up stuck in a repeated sequences of stuns and silences unable to do anything, until death. What makes it not fun is when you are required to throw thousands of dollars or thousands of hours (this game's inherent currency is either money or game-time spent farming for in-game acquired trade-gold) just to remain competitive against yet another johnny-come-lately sin/dark-vamp in 1 v 1 who has spent one-tenth as much (either $$ or game-time).

    Oh, and you didn't address my other point, that being that sins can re-stealth when powers are being applied against them that specifically say "prevents stealth" in the power description.
  • riotz24
    riotz24 Posts: 37 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    stew675 wrote: »
    This is specifically why I qualified my statement to being against lvl 3 winged toons that ARE gemmed for PvP, and still having trouble with lvl 1 winged sins.



    So what I hear you saying is that it takes a toon with 700+resistances, and maxed crit dodge and crit def, to survive a fort 9/lvl 3 gemmed lvl 78-79 sin. Uh, that's precisely my point. Yes, with ENOUGH resistances, eva, crit dodge/def, you can survive sins. The exact issue here is the RELATIVE gear that is required to do so.



    Sounds like you got lucky with lag/latency. Most sins I've dueled will stealth before the fight starts.


    So what if you're one of the classes has doesn't have targetless AoE's to combat stealthed sins?



    ...and here we're back to the core issue. In order to survive even a moderately specced sin, your own toon has to be specced to the max on resistances and dodges/def, just to have a chance to even strike back.


    GvG sins are much easier because they'll get caught in the AoE cross-fire against non-stealthing toons, or get de-stealthed by a number of the toons/classes that have that ability. The issue I'm talking about here is that there are a number of classes for which said class has next to no answer to for a sin, unless said class is specced to the max like you're suggesting just to survive long enough to have a chance to even strike back.



    Bordering on straw man argument there. No one said anything about wanting to win everything with the click of a few buttons. What makes PvP fun is a series of attack and counter-attacks, a duel of talents, someone throwing something at you, and you managing your skills wisely to have an answer when required. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, but hey, you gave it a shot and learned something. That's what make PvP fun.

    What makes PvP not fun is when there are classes for which other classes simply have no answer for, and just end up stuck in a repeated sequences of stuns and silences unable to do anything, until death. What makes it not fun is when you are required to throw thousands of dollars or thousands of hours (this game's inherent currency is either money or game-time spent farming for in-game acquired trade-gold) just to remain competitive against yet another johnny-come-lately sin/dark-vamp in 1 v 1 who has spent one-tenth as much (either $$ or game-time).

    Oh, and you didn't address my other point, that being that sins can re-stealth when powers are being applied against them that specifically say "prevents stealth" in the power description.


    so all i saw here was max everything too beat a sin with lv1 wings

    and as for the stealth, if a sins stealth is broken by aoe they just re-stealth swift eva.

    every point u rebbuted was so void and makes it look like u have a sin

    the only skill a sin needs is ID scrolls too id crit dmg
  • im2gr84u
    im2gr84u Posts: 695 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    tornathien wrote: »
    I agree war needs some nerfing, if you start beating one up after u get out of stun lock they just pop bor. you got 2 options 1. keep attacking and die to bor, or 2. sit and do nothing and wait for bor to drop and be killed by the war. even if BoR would get nerfed by 50% it would still be OP..

    Omg you just suck really bad, elemental warriors are the weakest of all the warriors tree, their damage is so low vs a tankish build, they can't do anything 1vs2, not even solo a tankish divine priest without decent crits. Quit QQ and boost defensive stats, ignorant ppl :D BoR? Quit being dumb and don't hit them then.

    And for the sins, you have no chance no matter what if you don't have anti cc or outheal em.

  • EvilSheep - Illyfue
    EvilSheep - Illyfue Posts: 780 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    meh, didn't read most of the stuff since it's pointless... the needed class balancing will NOT happen because than the game would stop sucking.

    If it actually did happen in like 100 years from now, maybe our grand-grand children might enjoy it in which case I would say, Bloodlust warriors/ that sacrifice skill and assault needs to be nerfed. Because if I can get assaulted from millions of miles away, get stunned and disabled to do anything at all and then get 1shot from sacrifice from some warrior with basic wrath even though I have like 230-240% crit defense and 80-85k hp (depending on vamp form), then that is just not normal or balanced or anything for that matter.

    Now imagine all the average geared folks in 12v12... with like 40k hp xD getting assaulted by bloodlust noobs that only know 2 skills, assault + sacrifice... lol... Seems pretty fair, yeaaaaaah rightttttt.... :D
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    ~ ★ EvilSheep® - Dark Vampire - Lv80 since March 2012 ★ ~
    Lv80 Divine Priest - Lv80 Wind Bard - Lv80 Frost Mage
    Breath of Life - Florence + The Machine
    Because my Vamp comes with her own Theme Song.
    I'm not amoosed by the default forum font.
  • riotz24
    riotz24 Posts: 37 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    im2gr84u wrote: »
    Omg you just suck really bad, elemental warriors are the weakest of all the warriors tree, their damage is so low vs a tankish build, they can't do anything 1vs2, not even solo a tankish divine priest without decent crits. Quit QQ and boost defensive stats, ignorant ppl :D BoR? Quit being dumb and don't hit them then.

    And for the sins, you have no chance no matter what if you don't have anti cc or outheal em.

    i would like too know what u have been smoking?

    agreed with the sin part, but BoR warrior pop BoR and stand in a grp gudbye mages, mm,s and the person that the warrior assulted
  • im2gr84u
    im2gr84u Posts: 695 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    riotz24 wrote: »
    i would like too know what u have been smoking?

    Antinubshrooms, yummy

    You are talking about group wise now? It all depends on the team... a decent geared game will have 60k+ hp and in a group there will be a priest to heal him...

  • riotz24
    riotz24 Posts: 37 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    im2gr84u wrote: »
    Antinubshrooms, yummy

    i also see ur a warrior, so ur point about warriors are void
  • im2gr84u
    im2gr84u Posts: 695 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    riotz24 wrote: »
    i also see ur a warrior, so ur point about warriors are void

    No, you just seem to not understand the limitations of each class and tree endgame? Don't expect to be tanking a warrior with your op mage with 30k hp. Wanna know whats op? Getting hit 30k rh from sacrifice when you have 29% dmg reduction and 964 res :D Not some lame reflector you can avoid / outheal /cc / bleed immune

  • riotz24
    riotz24 Posts: 37 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    im2gr84u wrote: »
    No, you just seem to not understand the limitations of each class and tree endgame? Don't expect to be tanking a warrior with your op mage with 30k hp. Wanna know whats op? Getting hit 30k rh from sacrifice when you have 29% dmg reduction and 964 res :D Not some lame reflector you can avoid / outheal /cc / bleed immune

    tell me how ... as a mage .. how u avoid reflect wen just about every crit stuns u?

    if ur a ele warrior and ur being killed so ez, i wouldnt call other people noobs. maybe it might be u?

    fyi u cnt out heal a 1 hit on reflect
  • Romkin - Lionheart
    Romkin - Lionheart Posts: 512 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    love how all you all complain bout sins and warriors lol i know an ele war who dont use BoR unless he has to or if he wants to be an **** so BoR pops up run oh wait assault? has like a 15 second cd in combat so when he can use it again BoR is down for you to attack again so just keep running or if your a mage or have a mage on your team transform that or if your a vamp use dark bonds war lol

    on the sin piece they need their stun/silence in pvp since they have a lower base attack highest i seen was a sin with i believe up to roughly 5.5k atk lvl 3 wings etc. put that up against a war with 7k atk? sins are squishy end of story so they do need the silence stun to stay alive i do play a war i do play a sin i also play a vamp well not anymore lol messed it up badly lol also played pretty much every class up to at least lvl 50

    and for the person that mentioned swift eva as a stealth that skill only increases evasion your thinking of shadow protection or better yet all of you complaining about it these classes you all must be pretty bad at pvp so instead of complaining why dont you actually do something about it just beat em end of story so what if they are eva? always have a gear set for any encounter you have trouble with so if you dont like crits get crit dodge/crit defense if you dont like eva go acc im sure its not hard to get 8 pieces with some kind of crit def or better yet go with crit def/dodge gear with acc id's >.> might help a bit there :P

    also mages are scary in which they can steal all your mana for wars and sins oh no they cant do anything DX >.> scary mages and they also got ice block and if your human on any class use pray skill to get out of stun/silence

    btw the numbers in there is just an estimate cant tell since not ingame to say for sure lol
    -Don't hate on Henry. He has grand plans for all that burnt meat, cod and metal rings. GRAND PLANS! -GreyjoyKraken
  • riotz24
    riotz24 Posts: 37 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    natsss wrote: »
    sin 5.5k atk ?

    they have at least 7-8k
    as MM or mage you have ~7k5
    war 9k+

    but yeah it's pretty easy to counter a BoR ( as mage you can just ice block and sit LOL )

    yea, thats one way but while u wait they just prepare for a assult, then we are bck at square 1
    then theres transform and they only have too change stance too get outta that.

    and i like it how ppl say sins have a low base attack and they are squishy etc, wen a every time they crit they scilence or some **** like that, everything too do with crit goes up like 80%, lv3 wing sin vs a lv3 winged mage same masterys + res, mage will loose all the time.

    yes they are squishy, wen they are attacking someone else.

    imo BoR would be better if it was dispellable and changing stance didnt break everything.
    as it stands BoR is like 19sec of "HA U CNT TOUCH ME"
  • shonx
    shonx Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    a little class ballancing is comming soon (3- months?) to FW ;):
  • shonx
    shonx Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Part of translated chinese patch notes

    [...]
    4. Aggro System
    Taunt state effect improved. Taunting a mob will give the skill user the highest aggro level
    of 110% and will not decrease back to pre-taunt levels. This enables warriors and
    protectors to maintain aggro easier, and also more likely to protect their teammates on
    PVE first hit aggro. (Note: Mob drops remains unchanged, belonging to the highest DPS
    individual/team. Having the highest aggro level have no effect whatsoever on drops.)


    5. Class Changes
    Warrior:
    a) Modified Aegis talents and skills, improving their capabilities on aggroing multiple
    mobs.
    b) Aegis Talent Crushing Roar skill change, increasing 20-50% atk power and
    gives higher level of threat(aggro).
    c) Skill Crushing Roar cooldown reduced to 10 seconds, and every talent level will
    further decrease 2 seconds of cooldown.


    d) Within the 5 seconds of using Crushing Roar, casting Sword Cyclone and
    Lightning Wings will have no cooldowns, but skills attack will be reduced to 50% and also will not have any crowd control effects (CC:stun/silence etc). Threat granted will be 300% of attack power.

    Protector:
    a) Mass Taunt skill cooldown will be reduced from 120 seconds>60 seconds,
    Infamous Scourge talent will now decrease the skill cooldown by 12/24/36 seconds instead of 20/40/60 seconds.

    Assassin:
    a) Venom talent tree final skill Mutilation changed from single target to a cone(Half-
    angle 45 degrees)AoE attack.

    Marksman:
    a) Burst tree talent Burning Rage attack and crit chance effect will be lost after 3
    attack cast and not after 3 attack hits. (So miss counts too)
    b) Precision tree talent Power Surge will grant 50%/100% chance to stun a target
    for 3 seconds with the talent skill Aimed Shot. Aimed Shot accuracy can be
    increased with the support of talent Precise Aiming, granting in addition 15/30/45/60 accuracy.
    c) Precision tree skill Dazing Shot now added a 75% slow effect, lasting 15 sec.
    d) Precision tree talent Full Analysis now also reduce target
  • riotz24
    riotz24 Posts: 37 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    im2gr84u wrote: »
    Antinubshrooms, yummy

    You are talking about group wise now? It all depends on the team... a decent geared game will have 60k+ hp and in a group there will be a priest to heal him...


    not just grp everything in general, 12v12 3v3 6v6. ...... its either be stunned or be reflected
  • Inzho - Eyrda
    Inzho - Eyrda Posts: 260 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    shonx wrote: »
    Part of translated chinese patch notes

    [...]
    4. Aggro System
    Taunt state effect improved. Taunting a mob will give the skill user the highest aggro level
    of 110% and will not decrease back to pre-taunt levels. This enables warriors and
    protectors to maintain aggro easier, and also more likely to protect their teammates on
    PVE first hit aggro. (Note: Mob drops remains unchanged, belonging to the highest DPS
    individual/team. Having the highest aggro level have no effect whatsoever on drops.)


    5. Class Changes
    Warrior:
    a) Modified Aegis talents and skills, improving their capabilities on aggroing multiple
    mobs.
    b) Aegis Talent Crushing Roar skill change, increasing 20-50% atk power and
    gives higher level of threat(aggro).
    c) Skill Crushing Roar cooldown reduced to 10 seconds, and every talent level will
    further decrease 2 seconds of cooldown.


    d) Within the 5 seconds of using Crushing Roar, casting Sword Cyclone and
    Lightning Wings will have no cooldowns, but skills attack will be reduced to 50% and also will not have any crowd control effects (CC:stun/silence etc). Threat granted will be 300% of attack power.

    Protector:
    a) Mass Taunt skill cooldown will be reduced from 120 seconds>60 seconds,
    Infamous Scourge talent will now decrease the skill cooldown by 12/24/36 seconds instead of 20/40/60 seconds.

    Assassin:
    a) Venom talent tree final skill Mutilation changed from single target to a cone(Half-
    angle 45 degrees)AoE attack.

    Marksman:
    a) Burst tree talent Burning Rage attack and crit chance effect will be lost after 3
    attack cast and not after 3 attack hits. (So miss counts too)
    b) Precision tree talent Power Surge will grant 50%/100% chance to stun a target
    for 3 seconds with the talent skill Aimed Shot. Aimed Shot accuracy can be
    increased with the support of talent Precise Aiming, granting in addition 15/30/45/60 accuracy.
    c) Precision tree skill Dazing Shot now added a 75% slow effect, lasting 15 sec.
    d) Precision tree talent Full Analysis now also reduce target

    Still not much love for my prot. Time to roll Aegis war?
  • shonx
    shonx Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Im marble so more aggro is good for me :P
  • CzarinaRose - Eyrda
    CzarinaRose - Eyrda Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    First nerf the sins and war, then nerf the bards, then the priests and everything else

    Oh, whilst we're at it, lets nerf the bosses in GoS and ToK, and then maybe the zodiac bosses too because they are too OP and take too long to kill....not to mention the pain in the pass elemental bosses

    AND whilst we're at it why not just nerf anything and everything we deem as challenging? :rolleyes:

    I've played vamp, priest, bard, lycan priest, elf priest, glacial priest, divine priest, rebel priest and currently have re-rolled to a warrior, all of which had been my main (winged etc etc)

    if you feel as though your toon can never compete with others, it is not up to the game to fix that for you, but rather you do the necessary thing is

    1. re-roll
    2. just find something else enjoyable
    3. know your toon better

    War's bor have a long **** CD and it only lasts for a few seconds, all of which as soon as you hit with their bor on, you would know and assuming you do see your screen, you would stop attacking until their bor dies.

    As for sins, as long as you pop them out before they use that out-of-stealth-super-op-1-hit-youre-dead-skill you can easily stun/lock/freeze them and kill them

    lastly, just because you think warriors or sins are OP, doesn't mean they win at everything, clearly if a class is seen as better, then more people would be playing it, therefore sins and warriors are the classes that most do play in pvp.
    We have disadvantages in pvp also, imagine warrior v warrior, sin v sin, it comes down to gears, resist/mastery and skill, we don't get it any easier than your other classes.

    Unless of course your toon is utterly under geared to even compete in pvp, in which case its not the class, its your toon.

    And please dont start with the "pvp should be fun for all", no. People worked hard to get their toons to be better than others just so they can compete in pvp, those who do gear up and work hard shouldn't have their hard work taken away because some people are too lazy to better their own toons, therefore they wanna NERF everything else.
  • im2gr84u
    im2gr84u Posts: 695 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Well apparently the OP gets 1shot by reflector, thats says all :D

  • Celleiste - Storm Legion
    Celleiste - Storm Legion Posts: 62 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    The biggest problem isn't so much the sins that can chain-stun you.

    It's the sins that can perma-silence you and TICKLE you to death.

    Now *that* pisses me off. As someone who IS well geared and DOES have good resistances, and is built to hit those pesky eva sins, it really grates on my nerves that they have to CC the living hell out of me like the biggest noob in existence to kill me.

    Warriors? I can deal with them easily. If they're good, their CCs will keep me occupied long enough that I'm dead. if not, they're screwed -- if they can't hit past my resist to kill me before their stun chain wears off, then they're the screwed ones.

    The only thing really "op" about wars is the fact that they can quickly cycle their stances (with relatively low cooldowns, I might add) and have a way to block CC EVERY round. More so if they're human, because it means they don't have to blow Pray.

    And, for anybody with the nerve to say dark vamps are OP, LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL. I'm sorry, dark vamps don't have a lot of CC. We hit you on pure skill and ridiculously high damage. And no, I'm not talking about those eva nubs you run into, because we all know eva is a poor choice of class building, because you get screwed when you run into an acc stacker. Sure, nobody else can hit you, until that pain in the **** acc stacker that has some semblance of atk/crits slaps you twice and you're dead.

    Thirdly: BoR is easily countered. It's called "stop being a noob" and "don't hit them when BoR is up". CC them. Bond them. BoR's cooldown is enough that if you make them waste it, then you're fine. Granted, if they don't hit hard with it, go ahead and hit right through it. It's pretty damn useless unless you're not hitting them.


    I am, however, interested to see those aggro changes.... Since I have a tendency to aggro troll in instances...
    <Dirty Boxing>
       Allegiance
        Celleiste

    -- 80 Dark Vampire -- Blood Dual Spec --
  • riotz24
    riotz24 Posts: 37 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    First nerf the sins and war, then nerf the bards, then the priests and everything else

    Oh, whilst we're at it, lets nerf the bosses in GoS and ToK, and then maybe the zodiac bosses too because they are too OP and take too long to kill....not to mention the pain in the pass elemental bosses

    AND whilst we're at it why not just nerf anything and everything we deem as challenging? :rolleyes:

    I've played vamp, priest, bard, lycan priest, elf priest, glacial priest, divine priest, rebel priest and currently have re-rolled to a warrior, all of which had been my main (winged etc etc)

    if you feel as though your toon can never compete with others, it is not up to the game to fix that for you, but rather you do the necessary thing is

    1. re-roll
    2. just find something else enjoyable
    3. know your toon better

    War's bor have a long **** CD and it only lasts for a few seconds, all of which as soon as you hit with their bor on, you would know and assuming you do see your screen, you would stop attacking until their bor dies.

    As for sins, as long as you pop them out before they use that out-of-stealth-super-op-1-hit-youre-dead-skill you can easily stun/lock/freeze them and kill them

    lastly, just because you think warriors or sins are OP, doesn't mean they win at everything, clearly if a class is seen as better, then more people would be playing it, therefore sins and warriors are the classes that most do play in pvp.
    We have disadvantages in pvp also, imagine warrior v warrior, sin v sin, it comes down to gears, resist/mastery and skill, we don't get it any easier than your other classes.

    Unless of course your toon is utterly under geared to even compete in pvp, in which case its not the class, its your toon.

    And please dont start with the "pvp should be fun for all", no. People worked hard to get their toons to be better than others just so they can compete in pvp, those who do gear up and work hard shouldn't have their hard work taken away because some people are too lazy to better their own toons, therefore they wanna NERF everything else.

    dude, know ur classes BoR has a 90sec CD runed has around 75sec, it can be used in both rounds in arena , and practicly used on every encounter in 12s its up for 19sec runed 21sec I THINK, "it dsnt last long, and has a massive CD" my ****, dnt pipe up unless u know what ur talking about
  • riotz24
    riotz24 Posts: 37 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    natsss wrote: »
    lol lv3 wing sin lose against lv3 winged mage

    sin lose versus pretty much all class at end game ( arena gear / fullmast/resistance )
    like water bard win vs all at end game

    BoR is just so easy to counter

    your 'HE SWITCH STANCE OP CHEAT I CAN TRANSFORM HIM' HU maybe if you would have CC him before he get his red hand he would have wasted some dispel before getting red hand and active BoR?

    as ice mage you can use drake skin after ice block then just hit him ( yeah ice block is longer than BoR )

    PS: if you are teamed and you are against a warrior

    vampire can bond theim or just feast then keep distance
    water bard : he'll destroy him before he even be able to do anything
    wind bard : they immun theim self and their team to bleed ( so BoR )
    light bard : heal ? ok maybe not but just go for a sleep then !
    mage : ice block /transform / snare / stun
    MM : just hit while you are under soul resolution or CC
    prots : just stun him or use rocky or you reflect lol
    priest : heal hit stun whatever you are priest ..
    ele war : you're the same
    blood war : immun under bloodlust fury
    aegis : cc him
    sin : just stealth and run away :D

    just dont use multi atk and use high damage skill or high CC skill ( YEAH DONT USE A PURGATORY OR FURY OF ICE OR BURST OF RAGE OR FLAIR WITHOUT ANY BLEED IMMUN)
    seee now ur talking ****....... except for the sin part
    and FoI,PoL i cast at grps... i only find out theres a warrior in there wen its too late


    even if they made BoR more visible would make a difference, ie priest bubble covers BoR wich is a jk
  • Drachus - Eyrda
    Drachus - Eyrda Posts: 1,532 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Pleaseeeee tell me that people suggesting dark bonding an ele war with rh bor are suggesting it only for 1v1's... cause if they are suggesting it for group pvp... just nononononononononono~. Dark bonding an ele war who has RH bor in group pvp is just nono unless you're in a tiny pvp situation. Sure, he can't move around, but you just essentially made his bor immortal for the period he is bonded... If someone hits him while his bor is up - an accidental aoe, etc - the person still gets reflected. Bonds does not make his bor stop reflecting... which fully neutralizes your aoe'ers if the bonded war happens to be in the middle of the pvp. It's easy enough to see the war's bor and avoid using single target attacks, but not all classes have the luxury of having strong single target attacks... and in group pvp, it's the aoe's that shine more than anything. In large group pvp, the worst thing you can ever do to an elemental warrior is bond them while they have RH bor up. Imagine an immortal almost 20k reflect that you cannot avoid in mass pvp. Just no. You likely could have killed the person and stopped the bor if they had not been bonded.



    Anywho, from what I see here, I get the feeling there are not any really good, strong elemental warriors on pve servers, which makes sense. However, a lack of experience with strong elemental warriors does not by any means make them weak, and when it comes to group pvp, especially large group pvp, elemental warriors reign supreme as far as the three trees go. An insanely stat'd elemental war in zodiac style pvp is just amazing, and not just because of bor. :|
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • aestheticsbro
    aestheticsbro Posts: 92 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    BoR is easy to counter but IMO the problem is that cd is too short.
  • Inzho - Eyrda
    Inzho - Eyrda Posts: 260 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    natsss wrote: »
    lol lv3 wing sin lose against lv3 winged mage

    sin lose versus pretty much all class at end game ( arena gear / fullmast/resistance )
    like water bard win vs all at end game

    BoR is just so easy to counter

    your 'HE SWITCH STANCE OP CHEAT I CAN TRANSFORM HIM' HU maybe if you would have CC him before he get his red hand he would have wasted some dispel before getting red hand and active BoR?

    as ice mage you can use drake skin after ice block then just hit him ( yeah ice block is longer than BoR )

    PS: if you are teamed and you are against a warrior

    vampire can bond theim or just feast then keep distance
    water bard : he'll destroy him before he even be able to do anything
    wind bard : they immun theim self and their team to bleed ( so BoR )
    light bard : heal ? ok maybe not but just go for a sleep then !
    mage : ice block /transform / snare / stun
    MM : just hit while you are under soul resolution or CC
    prots : just stun him or use rocky or you reflect lol
    priest : heal hit stun whatever you are priest ..
    ele war : you're the same
    blood war : immun under bloodlust fury
    aegis : cc him
    sin : just stealth and run away :D

    just dont use multi atk and use high damage skill or high CC skill ( YEAH DONT USE A PURGATORY OR FURY OF ICE OR BURST OF RAGE OR FLAIR WITHOUT ANY BLEED IMMUN)

    Lemme see, Rocky has a cd, im granite so not so many stuns and reflect is nice yes but it aint killing no sin worth its salt.

    Oh look my mm is precision so that bit of bs concerning soul resolution is just that, clearly you havent played much mm but no worries very few people have.

    As a human glacial priest just WTF are you talking about. I have 2 anti ccs but here is the thing, while they have long cds a sins cc is f............... spammable.

    For the stupid arguments about mass pvp, lets get this straight, on Eryda you don't versus dummies, youre versus players who are heavily geared, know their class and are smart. All things being even its the freaking CLEAR AS #$(&#$ day class/tree imbalances that make most of the difference.