Useless Jobs

alligatoring
alligatoring Posts: 11 Arc User
edited April 2011 in General Discussion
I was wondering if anyone else thought that tamer and botany are "useless"? Heres what I mean: At level 1 botany you can get 1-3 lvl 1 mats, at lvl 6 you still only get 1-3 lvl 1 mats. You would think levelling botany would have some other perk than just being able to harvest the higher levels mats (like getting more per mat harvested).

For tamer I finally got level 2 and what do we get for it? The ability to capture one more soul than everybody else and if we wish to fork out 10g an extra incubation slot. I figured those and the pet slots would be a reward from levelling up tamer.

I also foolishly froze armorsmith because I thought weaponsmith would be more useful to my friends since we can craft 4 different classes weapons but since they all require the same mats (at least for forging) theres no way to get to lv2 - even with 2 friends sending me all their salvage mats I only have 7/100 in it.

It probably sounds like a lot of whining but I was hoping maybe some other people had the same thoughts and they might notice and change/improve some of these "useless" jobs.
Post edited by alligatoring on

Comments

  • StoneGalka - Storm Legion
    StoneGalka - Storm Legion Posts: 88 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    I also believe there should be perks to the jobs.Not just, "oh yay lvl 5 botany i can now pick lvl 5 herbs".:rolleyes:
  • Distro - Storm Legion
    Distro - Storm Legion Posts: 83 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    No.. Botany is really useful.
    Tamer is crappy job (so i heard from guildies). Why? You have wroted reasons already.
  • alligatoring
    alligatoring Posts: 11 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    Botany is more useful than tamer because of how much money you can save making your own pots but it should offer more I have level 6 and I still get 1 cactus per harvest - Im not suggesting we get 20 mats per harvest but 5 or so guaranteed on lower level mats would be nice.

    Tamer is pretty useless all together. I just hope they improve them thats all. I dont mind the challege for levelling it but with that work I think we should be rewarded instead of, as I said earlier, having to fork out money for a slot I figured we had earned.
  • PugnusDei - Storm Legion
    PugnusDei - Storm Legion Posts: 234 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    The idea of harvesting more plants at a higher level is not a good one. Because -- suppose a high level wanders through SoO and harvests multiple cacti or golden vines with each pick. Then they sell them. Result is way more plants become available at the AH. Price goes down. Well -- this is very bad from the perspective of low levels because -- how they going to earn money now?

    So -- game can't reward high levels if result is to harm low levels. Can only reward high levels if result is neutral to low levels.
  • Xsasukex - Storm Legion
    Xsasukex - Storm Legion Posts: 1,568 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    i can agree with you on the point that tamer is pretty worthless... But in what damn way is botany worthless? o.O thats one of my most useful jobs together with alchemy and cooking. I can farm my own pots, I can sell the mats i harvest, or i can farm mats and make dreamland pots and sell them. So No. Botany is very useful, besides it goes really fast to lvl it also, no need to farm like crazy just to be able to farm higher lvl mats, cuz when i need higher lvl mats my botany are way ahead of me still :p
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  • alligatoring
    alligatoring Posts: 11 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    They could make it more rewarding, the price of stuff depends on supply and demand if a high level goes and harvests it and they push the price down - they arent going to make money either so why would they bother? The idea isnt without its flaws but I find it annoying to go to harvest 8 hyacinth and cactus for a quest item and it takes me 8 cactus to get it. At level 6 I think we'd have more botany "skill" and therefore recover more because we have practised harvesting.
  • nightwolf200
    nightwolf200 Posts: 3,073 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    botany is useful as with ALL alchemy recipes require plant gathering and a few cooking recipes do as well so you save money doing mat runs compared to spending ridiculous amounts of tradable gold for mats and you can sell high lvl pots/dreamlands on ah for a good amount of tradeable coin (make about 3 gold a day from botany/alchemy)
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  • StoneGalka - Storm Legion
    StoneGalka - Storm Legion Posts: 88 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    I was just saying jobs should have perks as well >_<. Like picking herbs under your current botany lvl will always be 3 of whatever herb you pick. Or cooking/alchemy having higher chances of getting 2-3 of the item being made. And more to the point, tamer does need to be improved.
  • cashshopno
    cashshopno Posts: 44 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    Tamers camping rare spawns like Nightmares and Griffins can make massive coin, can they not?
  • krusty17
    krusty17 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    i dont see how it makes sense how you should get 5 plants out of a single cactus
    besides why would you dig low lvl herbs when you're higher lvl
    Tamers camping rare spawns like Nightmares and Griffins can make massive coin, can they not?

    yes im a tamer and i have a full time job, i dont have time to camp nightmares
    give me more pets than that damn little witch that i can catch to sell ppl plz
  • StoneGalka - Storm Legion
    StoneGalka - Storm Legion Posts: 88 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    krusty17 wrote: »
    i dont see how it makes sense how you should get 5 plants out of a single cactus
    besides why would you dig low lvl herbs when you're higher lvl



    No, you would only get 3 each time, and some of the mp restore recipes are usually used for a while since they so rare from the cook. Or you may want to sell or send them to an alt.
  • cokedrunk
    cokedrunk Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    I put in the suggestion box that tamer should be only allow to use basic soul catching at 1 vigor. For people without tamer job to use it at 1 vigor really screws the tamer job. People without the tamer job should have to use up 3-5 vigors to use it.
  • StoneGalka - Storm Legion
    StoneGalka - Storm Legion Posts: 88 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    A higher chance at soul drops would be good, and higher chances of a green egg? and higher capture success rate.
  • Ravnika - Storm Legion
    Ravnika - Storm Legion Posts: 48 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    cokedrunk wrote: »
    I put in the suggestion box that tamer should be only allow to use basic soul catching at 1 vigor. For people without tamer job to use it at 1 vigor really screws the tamer job. People without the tamer job should have to use up 3-5 vigors to use it.


    Why should they have to use 3-5 vigor to use it?

    Don't just start spouting things like this without giving viable reasoning behind other than "because I say so".
  • cokedrunk
    cokedrunk Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    I think it sucks that Advanced Soul Catching cost 5 vigor for tamer. Why couldn't it stay 1 vigor what is the reasoning behind it. You can't catch as much Chained Demons, and Chained demons base stats aren't any different than the Scarabs.

    It would make sense for people without tamer job to use more vigor. Or make it so their failure rate to capturing souls is crappier compare to tamer.. So they end up using up 3-5 vigor whereas Tamer would only need to use 1 vigor when capturing souls.

    You either make tamer job better by improving tamer job a lot better than non tamer or make it worse for non tamer at their soul catching. Unless they plan to put out a lot of monsters that non tamer people can't catch soon. Tamer jobs will suck for a long time.
  • Crum - Eyrda
    Crum - Eyrda Posts: 506 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    krusty17 wrote: »
    i dont see how it makes sense how you should get 5 plants out of a single cactus
    besides why would you dig low lvl herbs when you're higher lvl

    Rosemason collection, primrose dreamland, hp/mp regen food. 5x primrose is 250k xp which isn't a small amount for 5 mins worth of farming herbs, and I still get rosemason quests to get lvl1/2/3 first aid pots/supply at random which duh, take low level herbs to make.
    Then of course, there's the lower level hp/mp regen food. Not everyone is willing to spend 70g for gloomy sadness recipe if they got desert water for free from Mitchell. Like me :o

    And while 5 mats per plant might be overkill, something like job lvl - mat lvl = amount of mats you get would be a welcome change imho. So while a lvl6 botanist would get 5 lavander per herb, they'd still only get 2 agrimony/violet rose or whatever. A level 4 miner would get 3 copper ore instead of 1 90% of the time etc. Would be a nice perk instead of simply being able to harvest mats your level, imho.

    Thumbs up for the OP.
  • Vexxa - Eyrda
    Vexxa - Eyrda Posts: 194 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    I agree that it is very unfair to have tricked us into thinking that tamer job is actually a real profession.

    When everyone can farm pets and get a blue for themselves it makes tamer pretty useless except for helping guildies get better pets so they don't have to waste leveling time farming for themselves.

    The other jobs for gear are UBER STUPID the way they are set up. Even with a whole guild focussing on one or two people to level up their skills they can never make any gear for the high levels and the gear they make is randomly just a bunch of junk.

    Better to just go get instance drops or shard gear and not deal with pompous twits keeping all the good gear for themselves and to sell at ridiculous prices.
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  • StoneGalka - Storm Legion
    StoneGalka - Storm Legion Posts: 88 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    Rosemason collection, primrose dreamland, hp/mp regen food. 5x primrose is 250k xp which isn't a small amount for 5 mins worth of farming herbs, and I still get rosemason quests to get lvl1/2/3 first aid pots/supply at random which duh, take low level herbs to make.
    Then of course, there's the lower level hp/mp regen food. Not everyone is willing to spend 70g for gloomy sadness recipe if they got desert water for free from Mitchell. Like me :o

    And while 5 mats per plant might be overkill, something like job lvl - mat lvl = amount of mats you get would be a welcome change imho. So while a lvl6 botanist would get 5 lavander per herb, they'd still only get 2 agrimony/violet rose or whatever. A level 4 miner would get 3 copper ore instead of 1 90% of the time etc. Would be a nice perk instead of simply being able to harvest mats your level, imho.

    Thumbs up for the OP.

    Finally, some1 who understands what i was trying to say:D.
  • vyanu
    vyanu Posts: 0
    edited April 2011
    Short response about Botany and Tamer. Botany is fully useful and actually there should be no fear about bigger chars getting low lvl herbs, energy is limited and so their amount of herbs they harvest is limited too.

    Tamer is a very different point. Not that a tamer needs to hatch 360 eggs before levelling to lvl 2, they even have to pay for another hatch slot. Else there is no benefit. Same goes with lvl 3 , we pay for another slot, but gain nothing.

    Actually any basic pet skill from Hicks can catch interesting pets , Tamers just have the sole chance to catch ultra uncool pets like Chained Demon or Spiders, while Nightmares and Griffin can be caught by nearly everyone, at least at lvl 1 Tamer.

    This is utterly demotivating to waste a job point for taming. You need for next level hatch 2240 eggs..consider how many eggs those are, and for what? ..another slot ...thats all

    What definitely should be changed is the catching of rare souls. Tamers wait hours over hours for rare spawns and someone lazy with basic skill just comes along and kills steals the soul, while its fought down. There definitly should be timer protection on it like its worked out for drops or during the longin phase.

    Same goes for spawns in events..why must a drakeling be caught with a normal Hicks skill, it's ultrarare and then someone who has put no time no work into his skill is able just to snatch it.
    Concerning the point, that PWI wants to make money with the game, all people who work on tamer job wont be happy with all the giveaways of pets. There is actually no motivation for anyone to work on Tamers with the existing system. And be sure the cash pets arn't something what keep people in game too long, to spend more money in real.

    I really hope these points will find consideration.
  • icauseriots
    icauseriots Posts: 244 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    Botany is actually very useful because it helps you in creating pots. Taming got useless after a while and to answer your question on weapon smith/armor smith. Weapon smith is pretty easy to level up. Armor smith is a bit harder considering it takes so many points. All you have to do is farm LH and Welkin for gear to break down and you power level it almost. I have made plenty of money from armor smith already and i know people in my server who make plenty of money off weapon smith. So you just need to put the right effort towards doing it.
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  • alligatoring
    alligatoring Posts: 11 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    I didn't mean botany was useless in the same way tamer is, but I thought we would get more perks from it. I dont think we should be able to, as higher level botanists go in and farm for 5 minutes and end up with 100 mats - I was just trying to throw an idea of a perk out there. Theres a better idea posted about it being your botany level minus mat level = number of mats you get - that seems fair.

    Tamer on the other hand needs major improvements - I also find it weird we're a tamer and yet we get no real perks over people with the basic skill. We are training as tamers it should cost people without it more energy and us less. Camping nightmare or griffin is also preposterous - they are so heavily farmed the only time I got to one was when it spawned on top of me while questing and even then some jack- waited for me to bring it down and then stole it. I still think we've earned a free pet slot and maybe a reasonable fee for more incubation slots.

    As far as wep/armorsmith goes I have two friends sending me mats and people in guild sending all unwanted blues/40+ greens their way and now I have 9/100 - all four use the same 2 salvage mats and I dont think its great as all the greens are junk anyways. If one or two recipes had different mats levelling would still be a challenge but a reasonable one.
  • alligatoring
    alligatoring Posts: 11 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    I forgot to add that tamers should be able to craft pet potions and pet food since good pet potions are way too expensive and if you're over 50 Creekbank only gives you lvl 50 pots =\
  • cashshopno
    cashshopno Posts: 44 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    I'm saving a job point for Arcanist. I just know it's gonna be awesome. :D
  • tybault
    tybault Posts: 3 Arc User
    edited April 2011
    And while 5 mats per plant might be overkill, something like job lvl - mat lvl = amount of mats you get would be a welcome change imho. So while a lvl6 botanist would get 5 lavander per herb, they'd still only get 2 agrimony/violet rose or whatever. A level 4 miner would get 3 copper ore instead of 1 90% of the time etc. Would be a nice perk instead of simply being able to harvest mats your level, imho.

    Thumbs up for the OP.

    I feel compelled to point out that with your idea of job lvl - mat lvl = amount of mats you get, well that's completely insane. Cause you see, if job lvl 1 tries to pick a rose of mat lvl 1 you get 1 - 1 = 0. So, even if you got a skill up from doing this, you wouldn't even be able to actually pick a mat till your botany lvl was 1 lvl above it. So lets amend it to (job lvl - mat lvl) + 1 = amt of mats, which is at least viable, well when you do that you're always going to get 1 mat when picking same lvl herbs. I don't know about anyone else, but I like having the chance to get more than 1 mat per harvest, so even that I'm not particularly fond of.

    To be honest, if botany was going to be improved I don't think it should be by increasing the number of mats you get per harvest so much as offering a chance to get rare mats more easily. What I mean is stuff like the nutrition supplement, magic blood, bound essence, etc. Stuff that is farmable, but that doesn't drop in the world as often as herbs spawn. They could offer something like that in quest format, like once you reach lvl 4 or 5 botany you get a once daily quest to trade however many sleeping lotus for 5 or so nutrition supplement/magic blood. It would have to be balanced, but it would offer someone like myself who always has more mats than I need a chance to trade them for something I could use instead of having to buy it in the auction house.

    And before anyone says anything about that hurting economics, well I don't think letting ppl get 5 mats a day would hurt the auction house trade in those items. It would just be a perk for higher lvl botanists.