Party Time - Who does what?

viralko
viralko Posts: 21 Arc User
edited July 2010 in General Discussion
So we've heard that there would be a lot of instances and dungeons in this game which can only mean one thing: people will have to party up a lot and the reason I'm making this thread is because the party member maximum limit was revealed. Six, what a dreadful number, it is.

How do you guys think the basic party would be like? What do you think are the classes roles inside a party? Do you think some classes will just not be made for dungeons and instances? Discuss!

My opinion:

So we got 8 different classes, each having a particular role but we only have 6 spots to fill up a party; anyone else find this a little unsettling? It all comes down to how will that party be filled.
The tank is a must, so we got a Protector. The healer is an obvious choice so we got a Priest. The warrior is the lead and the bard is the buffer. That's four, now we have the backbone we need some damage dealers and what we have left are assasins, marksmen, mages and vampires.

I can already see the mages having no problems finding a place in the party, and the marksmen are supossed to have several crowd control skills. What happens with the assasins and vampires? I seriously want to see what will become of this and can't wait for the beta to come and clear my doubts.

The vampire is a new archeotype(sp?) when it comes to perfect world games so we don't know what to expect from it, damage dealing, crowd controlling... anything goes. But we've seen how perfect world handles assasins and I think we can all agree they are not the best member to have in a party, even more if there are 3 other classes that can do better than him on a group (not judging individualy).

Maybe I'm getting ahead of myself and perhaps the dungeons are not going to be party based since we've heard of bosses that need more than 6 people to take them down and I won't have anything to worry about, everyone will have a place to participate in the action without being left behind by groups. It would really suck that some classes won't be able to fully enjoy the game just because a limit on the party member.
Post edited by viralko on

Comments

  • heroicfish
    heroicfish Posts: 2,149 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    viralko wrote: »
    So we've heard that there would be a lot of instances and dungeons in this game which can only mean one thing: people will have to party up a lot and the reason I'm making this thread is because the party member maximum limit was revealed. Six, what a dreadful number, it is.

    How do you guys think the basic party would be like? What do you think are the classes roles inside a party? Do you think some classes will just not be made for dungeons and instances? Discuss!

    My opinion:

    So we got 8 different classes, each having a particular role but we only have 6 spots to fill up a party; anyone else find this a little unsettling? It all comes down to how will that party be filled.
    The tank is a must, so we got a Protector. The healer is an obvious choice so we got a Priest. The warrior is the lead and the bard is the buffer. That's four, now we have the backbone we need some damage dealers and what we have left are assasins, marksmen, mages and vampires.

    I can already see the mages having no problems finding a place in the party, and the marksmen are supossed to have several crowd control skills. What happens with the assasins and vampires? I seriously want to see what will become of this and can't wait for the beta to come and clear my doubts.

    The vampire is a new archeotype(sp?) when it comes to perfect world games so we don't know what to expect from it, damage dealing, crowd controlling... anything goes. But we've seen how perfect world handles assasins and I think we can all agree they are not the best member to have in a party, even more if there are 3 other classes that can do better than him on a group (not judging individualy).

    Maybe I'm getting ahead of myself and perhaps the dungeons are not going to be party based since we've heard of bosses that need more than 6 people to take them down and I won't have anything to worry about, everyone will have a place to participate in the action without being left behind by groups. It would really suck that some classes won't be able to fully enjoy the game just because a limit on the party member.

    Perhaps ask this thread to be moved to the suggestions section so maybe someone with the power the change it will read it, because I agree. Having 8 people squads, possibly one of each class, or room for them, would surely lead to instances being completed faster, everyone having a fair chance of getting a squad, and other things I've not yet thought of. Besides, the more the merrier!
    [sigpic][/sigpic]

    The sensation was scissors and too much to scream,
    so instead I just started to laugh.
  • purexed
    purexed Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    That's where guilds come in, lets say you're a Assassin and there is 1 spot more left in a guild run, of course they should let you in, even if you are one of the most useless classes. If they not let you in, you're in the wrong guild.
    True fanboii
  • xyazoo
    xyazoo Posts: 455 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Ya that's easy to say xD.. In a game where it involves pk there's always competition.. Meaning greedy people. It would be nice if all classes are actually needed but its pretty hard to do that >.> Usually assassins stuns ( if they got any ) dont work on bosses so most of the times they are left out cause thats the only good side they got?. Change that and assassins would be nice to kill bosses with. But most times it ends up with 1 good geared person taking the amount of healers he needs and tank their way by getting spam healed. (Maybe even make alt healer, not allowed but it happens) so i don't think even if your in a "good" guild they will take every classes with them and share loots.

    In guilds people always come and go and everyone knows that. so ye why sharing with a possible enemy later on?
  • themomis
    themomis Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Some classes are better at PvE and some are better at PvP. Some players are Killers some are Carebears. Thats what makes the community fun. The different types of players. Its better to have a good player, no matter what class, than someone who is playing the class you want in the party but doesn't know how to play it. If you play your class well then you get runs.
    I always play a magic class. I've tried a priest and didn't do very well. Good thing there was a Rez skill. There's no use in me trying to be a priest. I will just get everyone killed.
    Once ppl try the classes and see what they can do, there will be a place for everyone.
    The Assassin is more of a PvP class. I was in some runs on PWI with Sins. It was sad. Squisher that a Warrior but they have to get in close. Maybe it was the player. I'm sure there's some good sins out there. We'll just have to see.
    The Vampire is a very interesting class. Will they fit in as a mage or will they be more than that. I'm very interested to see how this class plays.
    The Bards will be very useful in runs. I played one in another game. If there similar they can be very powerful if someone takes the time to learn how to play it.
    There is no such thing as " Pay to Win". It's a MMO, there is no end to it, no one "Wins". There IS a " Pay so you don't suck as bad and you look cool doing it".

    Blue type makes my head feel funny

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • luca7
    luca7 Posts: 542 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    themomis wrote: »
    Some classes are better at PvE and some are better at PvP. Some players are Killers some are Carebears. Thats what makes the community fun. The different types of players. Its better to have a good player, no matter what class, than someone who is playing the class you want in the party but doesn't know how to play it. If you play your class well then you get runs.
    I always play a magic class. I've tried a priest and didn't do very well. Good thing there was a Rez skill. There's no use in me trying to be a priest. I will just get everyone killed.
    Once ppl try the classes and see what they can do, there will be a place for everyone.
    The Assassin is more of a PvP class. I was in some runs on PWI with Sins. It was sad. Squisher that a Warrior but they have to get in close. Maybe it was the player. I'm sure there's some good sins out there. We'll just have to see.
    The Vampire is a very interesting class. Will they fit in as a mage or will they be more than that. I'm very interested to see how this class plays.
    The Bards will be very useful in runs. I played one in another game. If there similar they can be very powerful if someone takes the time to learn how to play it.

    Im a carebear =)
    anyway I think that there should be no party, just a limit to how many peple could enter
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    IGN: Momo
    Guild: TBD
    Kindred
    Vampire

    I'm the Nicest person you'll ever meet

  • pensri
    pensri Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    themomis wrote: »
    Some classes are better at PvE and some are better at PvP. Some players are Killers some are Carebears. Thats what makes the community fun. The different types of players. Its better to have a good player, no matter what class, than someone who is playing the class you want in the party but doesn't know how to play it. If you play your class well then you get runs.
    I always play a magic class. I've tried a priest and didn't do very well. Good thing there was a Rez skill. There's no use in me trying to be a priest. I will just get everyone killed.
    Once ppl try the classes and see what they can do, there will be a place for everyone.
    The Assassin is more of a PvP class. I was in some runs on PWI with Sins. It was sad. Squisher that a Warrior but they have to get in close. Maybe it was the player. I'm sure there's some good sins out there. We'll just have to see.
    The Vampire is a very interesting class. Will they fit in as a mage or will they be more than that. I'm very interested to see how this class plays.
    The Bards will be very useful in runs. I played one in another game. If there similar they can be very powerful if someone takes the time to learn how to play it.

    Oh ya i tottally see where you are comming from lol. I raised my sin and since i was an experianced player i raised his vit to add to his balance, and with decent gear he can actually tank when the barb messes up or needs help. Not always but at least in general he doesnt die in 3 hits during runs lol. I realized that if you raise the sin right and tank with the barb when nessary you can keep agro off the harder hitting classes such as the mage or archer. it makes the party balance out so they arnt pulling agro all the time lol. And if the sin isnt pure dex like mine wasnt you dont have to worry about it dieing and pulling agro all the time XD.The power of a sin is nice but if you cant survive who cares lmao. Plus if they do something with the their assasins like on PWI like remember how the BMs and Sins could combine their curse skill. And how much faster runs can go when you take their curses and power hit with an archer or mage? Things will die very very quickly lol. So ya it depends on the people playing the class =). And yes i agree about the bards Iv played that style class in another game myself. They really do help. They were the only class on the game i played that could heal peoples pets without items they had an aoe skill and they could go buff crazy on the party. So ya its a very useful class and fun to play. And Ya the vampires thats gonna be my first character i really want to see whats the difference between it and a mage. Other then the elemental magic aspects.
  • xyazoo
    xyazoo Posts: 455 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    themomis wrote: »
    The Vampire is a very interesting class. Will they fit in as a mage or will they be more than that. I'm very interested to see how this class plays.

    From what ive seen on a lv 22 vamp aint much =D But they do get a AoE curse so im guessing they will be debuffers and have DoT skills
  • knode
    knode Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Being in the Chinese beta all the classes bring something to the table as far as I can tell. This is in the form of DPS, CC, debuff, or over all utility.

    But every group is going to start like this. Protector plus priest. From what I have seen protectors are the only ones that can tank the bosses inside dungeons. Warriors do well with some things but don't have the tanking ability of the protector. And then priest are the main healing class in Forsaken World. Bards can be used for back up heals and utility but they can not main heal a group.

    Now who knows if this will hold true for the NA version of the game. I guess we will all have to wait around and see.
    IGN: TBD

    Future Priest of Forsaken World
  • heroicfish
    heroicfish Posts: 2,149 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    knode wrote: »
    Being in the Chinese beta all the classes bring something to the table as far as I can tell. This is in the form of DPS, CC, debuff, or over all utility.

    But every group is going to start like this. Protector plus priest. From what I have seen protectors are the only ones that can tank the bosses inside dungeons. Warriors do well with some things but don't have the tanking ability of the protector. And then priest are the main healing class in Forsaken World. Bards can be used for back up heals and utility but they can not main heal a group.

    Now who knows if this will hold true for the NA version of the game. I guess we will all have to wait around and see.

    Hopefully assassins have that HP regeneration buff like in PWI. That made things sooooo much nicer!
    [sigpic][/sigpic]

    The sensation was scissors and too much to scream,
    so instead I just started to laugh.
  • mrgiovanni
    mrgiovanni Posts: 184 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Marksman, Sin, Wiz, and Vamp will be the hardest classes to find groups with. It seems this game has 4 dedicated DDs out of its 8 classes. Who knows though Maybe a group will be able to run with a Vamp+Bard instead of a priest(if you got a good protector) or a Warrior tank with Bard+Priest. I hope that is the case since otherwise Protectors, and Priests will have no rest being asked to help with dungeons.

    Thinking back Vamp might have more utility than the other 3 in the opening comment, but I still hold that it will be hard to find a group from the amount of Vamps that will be made. You will want 2 Vamps in a group max. This could be said about any class, but I still believe there will be more Vamps than any other class because: 1 it is unique and there is alot of buzz about them, and 2 they are a DD class which more people enjoy playing than a tank/healer.

    Sins will outnumber mages, but if it is like PWI Sins are more desirable than mages since they have greater DPS. Mages on the other hand have great burst damage, which is great for PvP, but in a long boss fight you would rather have someone who will constantly contribute, and not have to overly worry aout mana.

    Marksmen seem to have good Aoe dmg and since they are physical I assume they will have decent DPS(like an archer) so they will be desirable, but still competing with 3 other classes for the 2 open spots in a balanced party.

    This is all just speculation, but I would say think twice about playing a DPS on a PvE server if I were you. Make sure it is really what you want to play. If it is by all means play it. If your decision could go either way between 2 classes think about which one will be better able to help a party.
    Life is Pain, Highness! Anyone who says differently is selling something.
  • knode
    knode Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    heroicfish wrote: »
    Hopefully assassins have that HP regeneration buff like in PWI. That made things sooooo much nicer!

    Haven't seen anything like that but I have not played an assassin to a very high level yet.
    IGN: TBD

    Future Priest of Forsaken World
  • jackyo
    jackyo Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    all parties have 3 roles

    Tank
    DD
    Healer


    in FW i belive it will go as Such:

    Tank

    Protector
    Warrior

    DD

    Warrior
    Vampire
    Dwarf
    Assassin
    Wizzard


    Healer

    Priest
    Bard
    Vampire

    sure there are debuffers/ buffers and other roles
    but if u are trying to find a party in a hurry.. u just need 3 roles
    Have you ever Danced with a Devil in the pale moonlight ?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    ~Human / Demon Warrior~
    ~CB Phase 1 Tester~
    Dungeon design contest Phase one Winner
  • mihog
    mihog Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    if 6 party members only than its simple party build

    tank
    healer
    4 damage dealers

    >,>
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • purexed
    purexed Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    The party setups will always mix depending of which instance, some may need 2 tanks, some may need 2 healers due the hard hitting monsters etc. I am sure sooner or later that class or that class will get a spot, and as someone said earlier in this thread.

    Rather someone who can play his class well but is less needed then a class that is needed but the one playing doesn't know **** about his class.
    True fanboii
  • tautaupaupau
    tautaupaupau Posts: 59 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    It is not as straightforward as some people make it out to be. For example you can throw the protector out of the window, if the boss has magical attack and put a mage tanking. Get 2 or 3 Healers for that insane AOE dmging Boss. It depends on the situation. But yeah there can be some sort of ideal party or something. The traditional one is:

    Tank-Protector
    Healer-Priest
    DD-Mage & Marksman

    And then you have a few "outsiders" like Bards, Assassins and Vampires. Only the Vampire is a knew concept to MMOs, the other two have been largely used by other MMORPGs, so we know, more or less, what to expect from them, I'm assuming buffs and CC for bards, and single target DPS with a few stuns for Sins.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    IGN: Xenobi
    Class: Heretic
    Anti Sadistic but not Moralistic.
  • voidsarcher
    voidsarcher Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    im one of those people who thinks you need skilled players rather than certain classes. like for instance the sin it will probly have very few aoes and crowd controlling damage but if a sin is played right you want them for the bosses cause they can deal good damage and work with the tank to avoid taking agro.

    as for the other classes im gonna bet that they all have a seperate purpose other than their main one like buffing, healing , tanking, etc. cause im a cleric in PWE and if done right i can out DD alot of people. alot of blademasters can tank bosses because of their build. mages and psys can support heal though not nearly as well. it all depends on how you play your class and how open the mind is to a possibilty that will make the parties build.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • dasset
    dasset Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    I seriously don't see a problem here. You will get into a party sooner or later even if you're a vampire or mage. Yes some classes might be more useful then others on certain bosses. But if PWE do their job correctly they will make sure all classes brings something good to the table for every instance.

    What I worry about is having 1 tank-class and 1 healer-class. I would rather see hybrid-classes like Shamans and Druids in WoW. This game is admitively a WoW-clone anyways.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • heroicfish
    heroicfish Posts: 2,149 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    im one of those people who thinks you need skilled players rather than certain classes. like for instance the sin it will probly have very few aoes and crowd controlling damage but if a sin is played right you want them for the bosses cause they can deal good damage and work with the tank to avoid taking agro.

    as for the other classes im gonna bet that they all have a seperate purpose other than their main one like buffing, healing , tanking, etc. cause im a cleric in PWE and if done right i can out DD alot of people. alot of blademasters can tank bosses because of their build. mages and psys can support heal though not nearly as well. it all depends on how you play your class and how open the mind is to a possibilty that will make the parties build.

    Idk about the assassin thing..

    My sin always took agro from tanks, even one that was 70+ while I was 59 (I think he was just fail - didnt even have the pdef attack buff yet - but other barbs my lvl I stole from easily even as they spammed their agro skills). I even stole it from another sin who was in her 80's, but she wasn't dex built, so that wasn't hard at all.. It became easier in BH39 to just tank all the bosses myself, LOL. People would always leave the party before we ran it though because they doubted I could do it. xD

    I guess I'm just saying no class really needs a set role. If you're built right and have high enough HP, you can do just about anything. Hell, I even tanked qingzi on my 54 LA mage.

    However.. although 6 people in a party is great and you can go around finding whatever classes fit your needs blah blah, I still feel that just upping it to 8 people so you can have that much more help, the ability for 1 of each class, and frankly that much more fun with extra people is still a good idea. (:
    [sigpic][/sigpic]

    The sensation was scissors and too much to scream,
    so instead I just started to laugh.
  • tautaupaupau
    tautaupaupau Posts: 59 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    heroicfish wrote: »
    Idk about the assassin thing..

    My sin always took agro from tanks, even one that was 70+ while I was 59 (I think he was just fail - didnt even have the pdef attack buff yet - but other barbs my lvl I stole from easily even as they spammed their agro skills). I even stole it from another sin who was in her 80's, but she wasn't dex built, so that wasn't hard at all.. It became easier in BH39 to just tank all the bosses myself, LOL. People would always leave the party before we ran it though because they doubted I could do it. xD

    I guess I'm just saying no class really needs a set role. If you're built right and have high enough HP, you can do just about anything. Hell, I even tanked qingzi on my 54 LA mage.

    However.. although 6 people in a party is great and you can go around finding whatever classes fit your needs blah blah, I still feel that just upping it to 8 people so you can have that much more help, the ability for 1 of each class, and frankly that much more fun with extra people is still a good idea. (:

    Remember, if you steal aggro its always the DD fault, I repeat ALWAYS. Stolen Aggro means 80% of the times PARTY WIPED, even though the tank sucked, even though the healer let the tank die, people will always point at the DD's and with good reason, if you can't control your damage might aswell reroll for another type of character.
    That's the way I see it at least.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    IGN: Xenobi
    Class: Heretic
    Anti Sadistic but not Moralistic.
  • knode
    knode Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    It is not as straightforward as some people make it out to be. For example you can throw the protector out of the window, if the boss has magical attack and put a mage tanking. Get 2 or 3 Healers for that insane AOE dmging Boss. It depends on the situation. But yeah there can be some sort of ideal party or something. The traditional one is:

    Tank-Protector
    Healer-Priest
    DD-Mage & Marksman

    And then you have a few "outsiders" like Bards, Assassins and Vampires. Only the Vampire is a knew concept to MMOs, the other two have been largely used by other MMORPGs, so we know, more or less, what to expect from them, I'm assuming buffs and CC for bards, and single target DPS with a few stuns for Sins.

    In leveling multiple toons in the Chinese beta this is not the case in Forsaken World. Letting a mage tank may of worked in PWI but I don't think it will work in FW. They have far to few hit points to do this.

    Like I said in another part of this thread. Protectors tank & priest heal. That's pretty much the way it is. Now maybe warriors can tank at higher levels. But so far I have not seen this happen. And then off healers do not have the ability to main heal for a group. But everyone has a role. I don't see to many situations where you are going to say "No we don't want your assassin. We are going to hold out for a mage." All the DPS classes bring enough to the table to get the job done.

    As for the stealing aggro thing. It's NOT always the DPS person's fault. Some tanks just suck and no matter what you do they can't keep aggro. Some people play tanks or healers just to feel needed. Not because they are good at them.
    IGN: TBD

    Future Priest of Forsaken World
  • tautaupaupau
    tautaupaupau Posts: 59 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    knode wrote: »
    In leveling multiple toons in the Chinese beta this is not the case in Forsaken World. Letting a mage tank may of worked in PWI but I don't think it will work in FW. They have far to few hit points to do this.

    Like I said in another part of this thread. Protectors tank & priest heal. That's pretty much the way it is. Now maybe warriors can tank at higher levels. But so far I have not seen this happen. And then off healers do not have the ability to main heal for a group. But everyone has a role. I don't see to many situations where you are going to say "No we don't want your assassin. We are going to hold out for a mage." All the DPS classes bring enough to the table to get the job done.

    As for the stealing aggro thing. It's NOT always the DPS person's fault. Some tanks just suck and no matter what you do they can't keep aggro. Some people play tanks or healers just to feel needed. Not because they are good at them.

    Well I didn't play the Chinese CB but from what your saying you were occupied lvling multiple characters. So you would have reached lv20/30 tops? So you can't say a mage can't tank at those lvls. In PWI the first and maybe only boss you could tank as Mage was at lvl60. Not saying that I'm right here, actually as the one with most experience in the game of the two of us, we should take your word for it.

    As for the picking the most handy DD available, I never said the contrary, but some are better suited for some situations than others.

    Now for the last part I hope you noticed my sarcasm in saying that its always the DD fault. I did refer to bad tanks and stupid healers. But the truth is theres some DD's who only care to do the most damage they can and brag about it. DDing is not that straightforward.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    IGN: Xenobi
    Class: Heretic
    Anti Sadistic but not Moralistic.
This discussion has been closed.