Bugged skill

Exorcising Bullet are bugged in soul tree for marksman there is a talent called trap off magic (incresses the damge off Exorcising Bullet by 30% and dismount and silences players affected by huntermark for 6sec.
after update it dosent sliences player anymore, and when i try it on mobs its dose sliences so can u plzz look att that thanks.
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Comments

  • underworldfiend
    underworldfiend Posts: 72 Arc User
    Yes! #nerfmm
  • unusualsuspect1
    unusualsuspect1 Posts: 694 Arc User
    > @underworldfiend said:
    > Yes! #nerfmm

    What? All 10 or so of them left in the game of any worth? They already nerfed their damage output with the last update. I think a damage specced light bard can probably do more damage than an MM now. It's getting somewhat sad.
  • nickvv
    nickvv Posts: 340 Arc User

    > @underworldfiend said:

    > Yes! #nerfmm



    What? All 10 or so of them left in the game of any worth? They already nerfed their damage output with the last update. I think a damage specced light bard can probably do more damage than an MM now. It's getting somewhat sad.

    I bet you're not from EU servers
  • develichious2
    develichious2 Posts: 178 Arc User
    edited June 2018

    Exorcising Bullet are bugged in soul tree for marksman there is a talent called trap off magic (incresses the damge off Exorcising Bullet by 30% and dismount and silences players affected by huntermark for 6sec.
    after update it dosent sliences player anymore, and when i try it on mobs its dose sliences so can u plzz look att that thanks.

    godbless, finally some nerfs
  • stew675
    stew675 Posts: 250 Arc User

    Exorcising Bullet are bugged in soul tree for marksman there is a talent called trap off magic (incresses the damge off Exorcising Bullet by 30% and dismount and silences players affected by huntermark for 6sec.
    after update it dosent sliences player anymore, and when i try it on mobs its dose sliences so can u plzz look att that thanks.

    godbless, finally some nerfs
    Now if only they can remove some of the thousand control breaks/immunities that warriors get
  • develichious2
    develichious2 Posts: 178 Arc User
    edited June 2018
    stew675 said:

    Exorcising Bullet are bugged in soul tree for marksman there is a talent called trap off magic (incresses the damge off Exorcising Bullet by 30% and dismount and silences players affected by huntermark for 6sec.
    after update it dosent sliences player anymore, and when i try it on mobs its dose sliences so can u plzz look att that thanks.

    godbless, finally some nerfs
    Now if only they can remove some of the thousand control breaks/immunities that warriors get
    warriors already lost some anti cc with the patch tho. from 7s cc immunity to 5s when assaulting.. feels real bad
    Post edited by develichious2 on
  • silnec
    silnec Posts: 248 Arc User



    warriors already lost some anti cc with the patch tho. from 7s cc immunity to 5s when assaulting.. feels real bad

    How dare they do this 2s nerf to assault?!!!1




    Joke aside, 5s immunity to cc when assaulting still is very strong though. How I wish dark vampires get stealth in vamp mode...
    ⋆⋆⋆ SEPHMEISTER ⋆ Illyfue ⋆⋆⋆



    "this game is dying on all servers, wake the fk up" - Amarantos

    This is the truth. PWE does not care.


  • unusualsuspect1
    unusualsuspect1 Posts: 694 Arc User
    I don't know how warriors can possibly survive only being able to get 5s of CC immunity with every assault, on top of the multitude of control breaks they already get, control immunity for huge swathes of time with other skills, massive self heals and damage blocking skills, damage reflect skills, and so on that all recharge at crazy short cooldowns with high rune energy. I guess at least the rest of the classes in the game get this sort of thing too? Oh...wait....

    Yeah, there's a reason why at the core of every pvp team there's warriors running rampant killing everything in sight with nigh impunity.

    I have a warrior too. There is not even the slightest glimmer of equality at equal levels of gear development. That some MMs got to control them at all was one of the few things that were an effective counter-tactic. Guess that's why MM's got nerfed. The golden child class of this sad sad game has to remain just that in Wanmei's eyes.

    PvP in this game wouldn't actually be half-bad, if warriors were removed, or at least nerfed back to equality with everything else, but then the tears would truly flow.
  • develichious2
    develichious2 Posts: 178 Arc User
    edited June 2018

    I don't know how warriors can possibly survive only being able to get 5s of CC immunity with every assault, on top of the multitude of control breaks they already get, control immunity for huge swathes of time with other skills, massive self heals and damage blocking skills, damage reflect skills, and so on that all recharge at crazy short cooldowns with high rune energy. I guess at least the rest of the classes in the game get this sort of thing too? Oh...wait....

    Yeah, there's a reason why at the core of every pvp team there's warriors running rampant killing everything in sight with nigh impunity.

    I have a warrior too. There is not even the slightest glimmer of equality at equal levels of gear development. That some MMs got to control them at all was one of the few things that were an effective counter-tactic. Guess that's why MM's got nerfed. The golden child class of this sad sad game has to remain just that in Wanmei's eyes.

    PvP in this game wouldn't actually be half-bad, if warriors were removed, or at least nerfed back to equality with everything else, but then the tears would truly flow.

    stew675 said:


    Now if only they can remove some of the thousand control breaks/immunities that warriors get

    I simply stated in response to stew675 that warriors has already lost some cc immunity that we had before. and from 7s to 5s is a decrease of 28ish %, which is pretty big. Assault is one of the main skills for an (ele) warrior, imagine a nerf of 28% on a main skill for your own class..

    but aight lets talk.


    massive self heals and damage blocking skills

    The only "massive self heal" i'll agree on is Rio's heart, which was already nerfed once (altho its still really good). the other 3 you get easily are:
    *Blood wish (dark) - 10% max health healed on next 2 hits with 15s to do so, 60s cd
    *bloodlust howl - 10% max health healed on next 2 hits with 5s to do so, 2 min cd (works for all teammates within range as well)
    *humy's heart - all classes has it, so im gonna keep it out of this.

    40% healing when attacking, once every 1-2 min does not amount to a lot when pvping.


    damage blocking skills

    sorry, the what now? unless warriors goes aegis or light awakening (meaning you'll lose out on cdmg bonus on DU AND rio's heart), warriors doesn't have any damage block/reductions outside of lowering an enemy's attack (meaning we'd have to attack enemies first to give the debuff, which can also be purified in a second, while reductions/shields doesn't work like that).


    5s of CC immunity with every assault, on top of the multitude of control breaks they already get, control immunity for huge swathes of time with other skills, massive self heals and damage blocking skills, damage reflect skills, and so on that all recharge at crazy short cooldowns with high rune energy.

    Reflect lasts 18s, and most classes has cooldowns they can use to ignore the reflect entirely (bleed immunities).

    uh high rune energy 'only' lowers cooldown on stances with high nature, and lowers cd of life guardian with high wisdom (and you cant have both really high nature and wisdom). the healing skills i mentioned earlier, soul devour and assault all has static cds only affected by talent points/runes with talents


    I guess at least the rest of the classes in the game get this sort of thing too? Oh...wait....

    coming from a MM im not gonna comment on that.


    Yeah, there's a reason why at the core of every pvp team there's warriors running rampant killing everything in sight with nigh impunity.

    I cant talk for US servers, but its not really the case on EU servers at least. wardens and mages are way more popular than warriors, to the point where im even considering to get rid of wind resistance from wrath to get something else.

    with the 3v3 team I usually go with (priesty + assassin), i usually end up just ccing and annoying enemies while the assassin kills most of them.

    Not really what this is about, but "core of every pvp team", last time i went on US servers and checked, almost no one does 3v3 at high scores? only a handful at 2.4k+, seems all are doing 6v6 for score across the pond.

    Opposite of how it goes on EU servers where all does 3v3 for gears. ofc there's more places to pvp than just 3v3/6v6, but well ff is a joke nowadays and idk how faction is on US servers.

    In the end i'll agree that warriors for sure are in a good spot, but we're not "at the top of the foodchain", in my opinion.
  • unusualsuspect1
    unusualsuspect1 Posts: 694 Arc User

    Assault is one of the main skills for an (ele) warrior, imagine a nerf of 28% on a main skill for your own class..

    Well, since you brought it up. The topic of this thread was losing the ability to Silence on one of my main class skills used for PvP. So yeah, imagine say, assault immunity being taken away entirely, instead of being nerfed by 28% in duration...

    My major gripe, really, comes down to outside of Protectors which only get it once every few minutes, there's not really any class that gets CC immunities. Yeah, water bards, mages and vamps do as well (partial), but a water bard bubble can be dispelled through various means. Vamp form stun/ensnare immunity is a little more annoying, but disarms and silences still work (also work against water bards too). I'll admit that my knowledge of PvP isn't 100% for everything, it's a lot to know, but outside of a 100 Wisdom tormentor getting 5 stacks "Boom" there really isn't any class that has rapid cycle (meaning <1 minute cooldowns) that grants periods of CC immunity.

    High Nature rune energy does indeed refer to stance cooldowns, which when switching also clears various controls. This is why I mentioned it. Soul devour clear controls. High nature assault clears controls and provides CC immunity for 5s to most things. Stance changes clear controls. Pray (if human) clears controls and grants immunity for a few seconds.

    I wouldn't say that "most classes get bleed immunity". MM's and ice mages do, and water+light bards too(?), but since you've mentioned some of those, those are probably the ones annoying you the most. Educate me on the other classes that do (outside of prot rocky protection). I'm interested to know.

    Damage reduction was more an implicit acknowledgement of Divine Uphold's defense boost, which actually is effective in PvP. Seen more than a few warriors pop DU and suddenly take a LOT longer to get them down that last half of their health than the first half while DU is up.

    Reflect is an issue if not these classes because the reflect is so high for warriors (demons and prots pale in comparison to the 20K+ reflects I've seen) that really it makes it very hard to apply controls without almost killing oneself when that is up. Yeah, as an MM I've get a little more leeway. That doesn't mean that I'm not aware of everyone else griping about it.

    <blockquote class="UserQuote">

    with the 3v3 team I usually go with (priesty + assassin), i usually end up just ccing and annoying enemies while the assassin kills most of them.



    I'll just leave this here:

    Forsaken World - HammerHeart PVP [Priest]

    I know it's not 3v3, but this is you (the warrior) in this video, right? Seems to me you're doing a lot more than just "ccing and annoying enemies". That's an outright "2 vs the world" gank-fest even with the priest getting controlled hard. I'm watching that warrior there just charge into entire groups and still hitting and one-shotting almost everything bar a few. Do that on any class outside of a prot with rocky up, and you're gonna get CC'd into oblivion even with a priest attempting to spam purify on you with that many opponents. The purify only clears one effect at a time.

    Very, very impressive, but more than just a little imbalanced, don't you think?

    It is clear that even just 5s of CC immunity after an assault is worth more than 10x its weight in gold when you watch that video, and warriors can do it fairly often.

    The upshot is that a well played warrior can pretty much ran rampant for a good 60 seconds starting with all CDs up, and after that, still manage to have enough CDs to break a lot of controls against whoever is left. Most classes simply don't get that level of control breaks. We're talking minutes between each one, not up to 8+ control breaks in the first minute (with 5 or so per minute after the first minute)

    let's say the warrior gets into real trouble, you've still got Rio's heart to buy you time until the next assault comes up. No, they're not invulnerable, but a Dark Awakening Elemental Warrior with high Wisdom is what we see over here running about cleaning up shop against about most anything.

    You did mention wardens though. They ARE good. We don't have any real PvP built ones here that I've seen. Most are just PvE only that play at PvP on occasion. Shame that they nerfed the living heck out of the Sunray warden's by turning Bright Protection into a total joke.
  • amarantos
    amarantos Posts: 3,067 Arc User
    edited June 2018
    >unusualsuspect1 said:
    > The upshot is that a well played warrior can pretty much ran rampant for a good 60 seconds starting with all CDs up, and after that, still manage to have enough CDs to break a lot of controls against whoever is left. Most classes simply don't get that level of control breaks. We're talking minutes between each one, not up to 8+ control breaks in the first minute (with 5 or so per minute after the first minute)
    >
    > let's say the warrior gets into real trouble, you've still got Rio's heart to buy you time until the next assault comes up. No, they're not invulnerable, but a Dark Awakening Elemental Warrior with high Wisdom is what we see over here running about cleaning up shop against about most anything.




    well ijs, its not hard for those warriors to run rampant if theyre running around in near 700cdef arena sets versus a buncha champ geared pvers.

    and devi, stew675 = unusualsuspect1 ;)
    Post edited by amarantos on
  • develichious2
    develichious2 Posts: 178 Arc User
    edited June 2018


    High Nature rune energy does indeed refer to stance cooldowns, which when switching also clears various controls. This is why I mentioned it. Soul devour clear controls. High nature assault clears controls and provides CC immunity for 5s to most things. Stance changes clear controls. Pray (if human) clears controls and grants immunity for a few seconds.

    Ye you're right about stances, was just that from wording you made it seem like high rune energy = lowered everything. my bad for misunderstanding. And it gives immunity to most things besides disarm.


    I wouldn't say that "most classes get bleed immunity". MM's and ice mages do, and water+light bards too(?), but since you've mentioned some of those, those are probably the ones annoying you the most. Educate me on the other classes that do (outside of prot rocky protection). I'm interested to know.

    ye might've been a bit over the top saying 'most' has it but;

    Warriors, MMs, ice mages, wind bards altho all can with proper runes iirc, venom assassin with 90+ nyos nature energy can use mutilation freely.

    I was told archers has some sort of bleed immunity, but cant confirm as i dont have one myself, and demon im not sure about since there's not a lot of demons around here.

    For the classes that doesn't have bleed immunity, they have good defensive cooldowns they can use while BoR/Reflect goes on tho if needed, including prots/wardens/demons/vamp


    Damage reduction was more an implicit acknowledgement of Divine Uphold's defense boost, which actually is effective in PvP. Seen more than a few warriors pop DU and suddenly take a LOT longer to get them down that last half of their health than the first half while DU is up.

    DU no longer increases cdef/def by 25%cdef/2500def. to get dark DU (80%cdmg + 3% extra cdmg based on your cdmg) we sacrifice that tankiness. Even tested it to be entirely sure and i did not gain any defense no matter how much my hp changed.


    Reflect is an issue if not these classes because the reflect is so high for warriors (demons and prots pale in comparison to the 20K+ reflects I've seen) that really it makes it very hard to apply controls without almost killing oneself when that is up. Yeah, as an MM I've get a little more leeway. That doesn't mean that I'm not aware of everyone else griping about it.

    Warrior reflect hits a lot harder than prot ref, but i'd argue that's also because warrior reflect lasts for 18s while prot lasts pretty much as long as the prot wants it to last. Also keep in mind prot ref works for all his party members as well (unless it was changed since last time i saw a prot), so aoeing people in a pt with a prot can be really deadly. example: aoeing 4 enemies with an entire slash storm means: 3 hits * 4 enemies * amount of reflect from prot usually over 10k.
    Ofc warrior reflect hitting for 40k+ is a lot on a single hit compared to against prots in example above, but when fighting the warrior you got the choice to also not attack and wait it out if needed.


    I'll just leave this here:

    Forsaken World - HammerHeart PVP [Priest]

    I know it's not 3v3, but this is you (the warrior) in this video, right? Seems to me you're doing a lot more than just "ccing and annoying enemies". That's an outright "2 vs the world" gank-fest even with the priest getting controlled hard. I'm watching that warrior there just charge into entire groups and still hitting and one-shotting almost everything bar a few. Do that on any class outside of a prot with rocky up, and you're gonna get CC'd into oblivion even with a priest attempting to spam purify on you with that many opponents. The purify only clears one effect at a time.

    Very, very impressive, but more than just a little imbalanced, don't you think?

    It is clear that even just 5s of CC immunity after an assault is worth more than 10x its weight in gold when you watch that video, and warriors can do it fairly often.

    Ye that's me with Divillae (priesty)+ Cieriel (light bard), but keep in mind there's a big difference between going in faction HH and 3v3s. In this vid that Divi made, she can entirely focus on keeping us 2 alive and purifying us none-stop. I also know im gonna be bubbled 24/7 (which im not guaranteed in 3v3s), so im free to use my dmg gear over arena gear so i can wipe most enemies fast and kill others afterwards.

    Also in this video I had DU for most fights -> no cd on assault. what's really broken here is DU for giving assault no cd. that means i can continuously get the cc immunity throughout the 20ish sec DU lasts. While warriors can remove/get immunity to a lot of cc, i was barely disarmed in any of the fights in the video + i was also being purified by divi/cieriel (also 100wisdom divine priests removes 2 debuffs at once)

    Ye you're right, other classes cant do the same thing a warrior can. But that's also the point. ranged characters aren't meant to run into the middle of the enemy group to fight them, which is what happens in the video.


    let's say the warrior gets into real trouble, you've still got Rio's heart to buy you time until the next assault comes up. No, they're not invulnerable, but a Dark Awakening Elemental Warrior with high Wisdom is what we see over here running about cleaning up shop against about most anything.

    Now that's interesting. There's only 1 Dark Awakening Elemental Warrior with high Wisdom that i can think off here, and they (there were more before) usually end up not doing much even with their DU damage immunity. ele warriors with high wisdom gives up a lot of casting speed and damage (85 nature = 50% increased base attack on thunder slash, 100 nature = 30% increased base attack on slash storm + 2s lowered cd) more or less just for the DU damage immunity. Mind giving some more information on this?


    You did mention wardens though. They ARE good. We don't have any real PvP built ones here that I've seen. Most are just PvE only that play at PvP on occasion. Shame that they nerfed the living heck out of the Sunray warden's by turning Bright Protection into a total joke.

    look forward to when people starts improving their wardens then. We have at least 2 with 100 fervor and high cdmg (1 with over 900%) that can, and will, kill most people really fast.
    amarantos said:


    well ijs, its not hard for those warriors to run rampant if theyre running around in near 700cdef arena sets versus a buncha champ geared pvers.

    and devi, stew675 = unusualsuspect1 ;)

    gotta say i agree, most people that complains about warriors (not saying its the case here) are those running around in champ gear expecting to live. godbless arena gear.

    and thanks, had no idea/didn't check

  • unusualsuspect1
    unusualsuspect1 Posts: 694 Arc User

    stew675 = unusualsuspect1 ;)
    Indeed. Sometimes I forget which account I am on when responding to people
  • unusualsuspect1
    unusualsuspect1 Posts: 694 Arc User
    edited June 2018
    My mistake, I meant high nature dark awakening war, not high wisdom. My apologies on that one. Total brain fade when I typed that

    Thank you for the pleasant debate by the way. It's actually really refreshing.

    I think that most of what's been said here is done, but I guess I'll still respectfully disagree on the point of ranged characters and control breaks. Ranged characters still get hit by other ranged characters. Ranged is no longer ranged when they cannot control an assaulting warrior. As a ranged character, I appreciate that a warrior does need to break controls and get close or they are sitting ducks, but by the same token, being able to just ignore controls from masses of people for periods of time simply removes all the advantages that the ranged character had.

    IMO, just give everyone the same level of control breaks/immunities, (to whatever number that is, I don't know, maybe 3 breaks/minute with 5-10s of control immunity per minute?) and then I'd say we're a lot closer to balance overall. I just believe that would make PvP more interesting overall if every class got a chance to shine now and then, instead of sitting at the back and praying that no one controls them ever.
    Post edited by unusualsuspect1 on
  • underworldfiend
    underworldfiend Posts: 72 Arc User
    cc immunity is not the only thing lets not forget tormentors with their insane cc where they can just go a mastery cdef build and be able to kill even the tankiest of healers while not dying because they have everything cced and high defensives. a big thing about this game is that there is large gear disparity you talk about warriors being broken where as the person right now on top of the pvp in EU Is guns who is an mm which is due to some parts mms being op and others him being ahead in gear than 99% of other people you cannot talk about balance when there is gear disparity.
  • unusualsuspect1
    unusualsuspect1 Posts: 694 Arc User
    edited June 2018
    Gear disparity in this game as run by PWE comes down to money only. That is the limiting factor. This is why everyone says this game is pay to win.

    It was mentioned earlier in this thread that we are talking about equal gear levels.

    Throw enough money at the game and most anything can be OP through gear alone. Above it was mentioned that there's 2 wardens on Illyfue with 100 rune energy already. At about a 5% chance to make an immortal advanced rune per attempt (I'm not sure of exact number but that feels about right) that's a lot of runes and a big budget. I do okay personally money wise with some spare money to throw about on occasion, but I certainly don't have the budget or luck to make 100 rune energy alt characters on a whim. Very few people here have >850% cdam just standing about unbuffed (I can think of maybe 2?), let alone 900+

    Also, define "top of PvP" please. How are you measuring that? 1 on 1, 3 v 3, or group vs group? Also, by what metric?
  • develichious2
    develichious2 Posts: 178 Arc User


    Above it was mentioned that there's 2 wardens on Illyfue with 100 rune energy already. At about a 5% chance to make an immortal advanced rune per attempt (I'm not sure of exact number but that feels about right) that's a lot of runes and a big budget. I do okay personally money wise with some spare money to throw about on occasion, but I certainly don't have the budget or luck to make 100 rune energy alt characters on a whim. Very few people here have >850% cdam just standing about unbuffed (I can think of maybe 2?), let alone 900+

    just to correct, 2 wardens across all EU servers that i know has 100 fervor and high cdmg, there's some still getting up there.
  • develichious2
    develichious2 Posts: 178 Arc User
    edited June 2018


    My mistake, I meant high nature dark awakening war, not high wisdom. My apologies on that one. Total brain fade when I typed that

    damn thought there were some big differences between warriors on US/EU servers. Guess most are ele, aside from a few bloodlusts there too.

    And i'd guess those warriors seem really OP during their DU, but after that's gone their damage output should be a lot lower and manageable.


    Thank you for the pleasant debate by the way. It's actually really refreshing.

    Right back at you, always up for discussions when its about warrior related stuff (altho we kinda went off topic from the thread).

    Wish we could get some US/EU arena matches going on, would love to bash heads against some strong US warriors.
    Post edited by develichious2 on
  • unusualsuspect1
    unusualsuspect1 Posts: 694 Arc User
    edited June 2018

    damn thought there were some big differences between warriors on US/EU servers. Guess most are ele, aside from a few bloodlusts there too.

    Pretty much, but there are also a handful of Aegis too, mostly for the annoyance factor, but I think also for the Evil Ward healing debuff to deal with healers (I imagine is why)


    just to correct, 2 wardens across all EU servers that i know has 100 fervor and high cdmg, there's some still getting up there.

    Thanks. Also to clarify, I meant maybe two characters in the entirety of all NA Servers with >850% cdam unbuffed (not just wardens) that I am aware of. I cannot speak for everyone, but of the people I do speak to, we're all agog at the sorts of numbers we see on EU characters.

    Over here though, various people tend to favor mastery-stacked builds to better tackle the 800% cdef healers.

    Post edited by unusualsuspect1 on
  • underworldfiend
    underworldfiend Posts: 72 Arc User
    edited June 2018

    Gear disparity in this game as run by PWE comes down to money only. That is the limiting factor. This is why everyone says this game is pay to win.



    It was mentioned earlier in this thread that we are talking about equal gear levels.



    Throw enough money at the game and most anything can be OP through gear alone. Above it was mentioned that there's 2 wardens on Illyfue with 100 rune energy already. At about a 5% chance to make an immortal advanced rune per attempt (I'm not sure of exact number but that feels about right) that's a lot of runes and a big budget. I do okay personally money wise with some spare money to throw about on occasion, but I certainly don't have the budget or luck to make 100 rune energy alt characters on a whim. Very few people here have >850% cdam just standing about unbuffed (I can think of maybe 2?), let alone 900+



    Also, define "top of PvP" please. How are you measuring that? 1 on 1, 3 v 3, or group vs group? Also, by what metric?

    well to be specific i mean ilikebigguns im sure a lot of people here know about him. and 1 on 1 3v3 group take whatever you like he has a divine shield on a low cooldown which can also be reset and with his cdef/attack/mastery he's able to one shot or come close to it even the tankiest of healers. does more damage than a champ gear DD in pvp and is tankier than most.

    edit- he's the one who made this post as well xD
  • unusualsuspect1
    unusualsuspect1 Posts: 694 Arc User



    well to be specific i mean ilikebigguns im sure a lot of people here know about him. and 1 on 1 3v3 group take whatever you like he has a divine shield on a low cooldown which can also be reset and with his cdef/attack/mastery he's able to one shot or come close to it even the tankiest of healers. does more damage than a champ gear DD in pvp and is tankier than most.

    edit- he's the one who made this post as well xD

    Speaking as an MM, the best way to deal with them is to control them. MM's have very few control breaks, aside from anima shelter skills, arena stones, etc (which everyone has access to). Get through their very few control breaks, and just control them down. Unless they're being spam purified by someone of course. Not sure how it is in EU, but over here you can't take 2 steps in most any PvP scenario without getting spammed with non-stop controls, which Dev above said didn't really happen to him. Maybe this is how our experiences differ?

    There's also a good number of healers in NA (800% cdef, 80% cdodge, 15K+ def, 1700+ resists) that I think would not come close to getting 1 shot unless the healer is caught with wrath down and without a bubble of some kind. If he's still able to do that even then, then that just comes down to amazing gear stats, so refer back to my first point above re: PTW. Amazing gear statistics is not an attribute inherent to a class.
  • nickvv
    nickvv Posts: 340 Arc User
    edited June 2018




    There's also a good number of healers in NA (800% cdef, 80% cdodge, 15K+ def, 1700+ resists) that I think would not come close to getting 1 shot unless the healer is caught with wrath down and without a bubble of some kind.


    Those are his specialty, 6 shot with 70k normal hits each, nice cdef and cdodge you have there.
  • underworldfiend
    underworldfiend Posts: 72 Arc User
    edited June 2018



    well to be specific i mean ilikebigguns im sure a lot of people here know about him. and 1 on 1 3v3 group take whatever you like he has a divine shield on a low cooldown which can also be reset and with his cdef/attack/mastery he's able to one shot or come close to it even the tankiest of healers. does more damage than a champ gear DD in pvp and is tankier than most.

    edit- he's the one who made this post as well xD

    Speaking as an MM, the best way to deal with them is to control them. MM's have very few control breaks, aside from anima shelter skills, arena stones, etc (which everyone has access to). Get through their very few control breaks, and just control them down. Unless they're being spam purified by someone of course. Not sure how it is in EU, but over here you can't take 2 steps in most any PvP scenario without getting spammed with non-stop controls, which Dev above said didn't really happen to him. Maybe this is how our experiences differ?

    There's also a good number of healers in NA (800% cdef, 80% cdodge, 15K+ def, 1700+ resists) that I think would not come close to getting 1 shot unless the healer is caught with wrath down and without a bubble of some kind. If he's still able to do that even then, then that just comes down to amazing gear stats, so refer back to my first point above re: PTW. Amazing gear statistics is not an attribute inherent to a class.
    he has 50k attack with mm skill and 2.2k mastery you cant get that much defense or res ever and the 6 shot(burst of rage) is just so much burst accompanied by a stun so its a class thing id say. if you dont use divine shield or something on yourself your gone poof.
  • unusualsuspect1
    unusualsuspect1 Posts: 694 Arc User
    edited June 2018


    he has 50k attack with mm skill and 2.2k mastery you cant get that much defense or res ever and the 6 shot(burst of rage) is just so much burst accompanied by a stun so its a class thing id say. if you dont use divine shield or something on yourself your gone poof.

    Must be running with an exceptionally high wing charge level, and a maxed out gold relic to reach the 40K attack score, to then go on to hit 50K attack with the +25% boost that burning range gives (only for 3 shots though).

    Not sure how reaching 2.2K mastery either, unless, again, high wing charge and maxed out Astroplane Hudson, and maybe mastery transmutes on gear as well?

    All of what you're talking about though comes down to mega-$$, not the class itself. There isn't a single MM on this side of the Atlantic hitting anything like those levels. I have 100 Nature energy on my MM too (more by sheer luck on a number of rune combinations, than actually going for 100 nature), but I'm not all-in on Soul, I'm actually mostly PvE and Earth/Precision/Light Awakening based instead (ie. the complete opposite of what all of it should be if I cared about PvP at all, which I don't). I don't have the financial budget to go all out on a PvP build on top of my PvE build even if I did care. Even so, I do have a true burning rage rune, and can only touch on 36K attack with BR, ~1900 mastery at full buff, ~800% cdam, and there's plenty of those tanky healers that only gets them down to 2/3rds health on. That extra 14K attack and +300 mastery, along with being all fire attack (I'm all earth attack for PvE primarily) must be the deciding factor, but then again, such statistics are not normal. That's a HUGE investment, and I'd warrant that a healer with a similarly huge investment might be able to tank it okay.

    Still, none of what you're telling me is convincing me that it's specifically a class thing. If anything, you've only cemented it further that it's an investment vs investment thing.
  • underworldfiend
    underworldfiend Posts: 72 Arc User


    he has 50k attack with mm skill and 2.2k mastery you cant get that much defense or res ever and the 6 shot(burst of rage) is just so much burst accompanied by a stun so its a class thing id say. if you dont use divine shield or something on yourself your gone poof.

    Must be running with an exceptionally high wing charge level, and a maxed out gold relic to reach the 40K attack score, to then go on to hit 50K attack with the +25% boost that burning range gives (only for 3 shots though).

    Not sure how reaching 2.2K mastery either, unless, again, high wing charge and maxed out Astroplane Hudson, and maybe mastery transmutes on gear as well?

    All of what you're talking about though comes down to mega-$$, not the class itself. There isn't a single MM on this side of the Atlantic hitting anything like those levels. I have 100 Nature energy on my MM too (more by sheer luck on a number of rune combinations, than actually going for 100 nature), but I'm not all-in on Soul, I'm actually mostly PvE and Earth/Precision/Light Awakening based instead (ie. the complete opposite of what all of it should be if I cared about PvP at all, which I don't). I don't have the financial budget to go all out on a PvP build on top of my PvE build even if I did care. Even so, I do have a true burning rage rune, and can only touch on 36K attack with BR, ~1900 mastery at full buff, ~800% cdam, and there's plenty of those tanky healers that only gets them down to 2/3rds health on. That extra 14K attack and +300 mastery, along with being all fire attack (I'm all earth attack for PvE primarily) must be the deciding factor, but then again, such statistics are not normal. That's a HUGE investment, and I'd warrant that a healer with a similarly huge investment might be able to tank it okay.

    Still, none of what you're telling me is convincing me that it's specifically a class thing. If anything, you've only cemented it further that it's an investment vs investment thing.
    he has mastery id gear thats why 2.2k mastery he's not a crit dps has only like 450% cdmg xD. wing charge is level 33 and again hes not the only one anymore.as for attack he has like 34-35k attack base. his relic is an enhanced quality one with 9/9 slots and 500 attack spirits and honestly there are many others with better relics etc. and thats the thing it only counts for 3 shots but since burst of rage is a single skill he gets the bonus on all 6 hits.
  • unusualsuspect1
    unusualsuspect1 Posts: 694 Arc User
    edited June 2018
    Thanks for all the feedback. He sounds like he's cracked the nut, so to speak, on how to deal with massive crit-def builds. That's awesome. I was beginning to lose faith that there was a way to deal with them, but he's stacked his gear in a way that is purpose built. I'm so glad that there's actually a legitimate counter to that tactic.

    That then makes this a rock-paper-scissors deal. If someone wanted to, they could construct a character that is approaching 30k defense (with buffs), and fully resistance stacked, instead of crit def, and it would tank what he's done just fine. He's found the paper to the rock that most people are using, and no one is using the scissors.

    Give that man a medal!
    Post edited by unusualsuspect1 on
  • underworldfiend
    underworldfiend Posts: 72 Arc User

    Thanks for all the feedback. He sounds like he's cracked the nut, so to speak, on how to deal with massive crit-def builds. That's awesome. I was beginning to lose faith that there was a way to deal with them, but he's stacked his gear in a way that is purpose built. I'm so glad that there's actually a legitimate counter to that tactic.

    That then makes this a rock-paper-scissors deal. If someone wanted to, they could construct a character that is approaching 30k defense (with buffs), and fully resistance stacked, instead of crit def, and it would tank what he's done just fine. He's found the paper to the rock that most people are using, and no one is using the scissors.

    Give that man a medal!

    its not just him if you have ever played on private servers almost every DD has a mastery gear set. and the problem with dealing with mastery build is that you can id your entire gear for lets say fire mastery but a healer cant get res ids or youd have to make like 3-4 gear sets for each res lol( there is a +10 all res id but as far as i know thats really hard to id). and if you itemise that way then you become vulnerable to crit builds so its not easy to itemise defensively. also not every class can make a mastery set because some classes depend on crits for crowd control or become too squishy that way mms can do it because they have their own personal divine shield.
  • jespervestman12
    jespervestman12 Posts: 93 Arc User


    he has 50k attack with mm skill and 2.2k mastery you cant get that much defense or res ever and the 6 shot(burst of rage) is just so much burst accompanied by a stun so its a class thing id say. if you dont use divine shield or something on yourself your gone poof.

    Must be running with an exceptionally high wing charge level, and a maxed out gold relic to reach the 40K attack score, to then go on to hit 50K attack with the +25% boost that burning range gives (only for 3 shots though).

    Not sure how reaching 2.2K mastery either, unless, again, high wing charge and maxed out Astroplane Hudson, and maybe mastery transmutes on gear as well?

    All of what you're talking about though comes down to mega-$$, not the class itself. There isn't a single MM on this side of the Atlantic hitting anything like those levels. I have 100 Nature energy on my MM too (more by sheer luck on a number of rune combinations, than actually going for 100 nature), but I'm not all-in on Soul, I'm actually mostly PvE and Earth/Precision/Light Awakening based instead (ie. the complete opposite of what all of it should be if I cared about PvP at all, which I don't). I don't have the financial budget to go all out on a PvP build on top of my PvE build even if I did care. Even so, I do have a true burning rage rune, and can only touch on 36K attack with BR, ~1900 mastery at full buff, ~800% cdam, and there's plenty of those tanky healers that only gets them down to 2/3rds health on. That extra 14K attack and +300 mastery, along with being all fire attack (I'm all earth attack for PvE primarily) must be the deciding factor, but then again, such statistics are not normal. That's a HUGE investment, and I'd warrant that a healer with a similarly huge investment might be able to tank it okay.

    Still, none of what you're telling me is convincing me that it's specifically a class thing. If anything, you've only cemented it further that it's an investment vs investment thing.


    he has 50k attack with mm skill and 2.2k mastery you cant get that much defense or res ever and the 6 shot(burst of rage) is just so much burst accompanied by a stun so its a class thing id say. if you dont use divine shield or something on yourself your gone poof.

    Must be running with an exceptionally high wing charge level, and a maxed out gold relic to reach the 40K attack score, to then go on to hit 50K attack with the +25% boost that burning range gives (only for 3 shots though).

    Not sure how reaching 2.2K mastery either, unless, again, high wing charge and maxed out Astroplane Hudson, and maybe mastery transmutes on gear as well?

    All of what you're talking about though comes down to mega-$$, not the class itself. There isn't a single MM on this side of the Atlantic hitting anything like those levels. I have 100 Nature energy on my MM too (more by sheer luck on a number of rune combinations, than actually going for 100 nature), but I'm not all-in on Soul, I'm actually mostly PvE and Earth/Precision/Light Awakening based instead (ie. the complete opposite of what all of it should be if I cared about PvP at all, which I don't). I don't have the financial budget to go all out on a PvP build on top of my PvE build even if I did care. Even so, I do have a true burning rage rune, and can only touch on 36K attack with BR, ~1900 mastery at full buff, ~800% cdam, and there's plenty of those tanky healers that only gets them down to 2/3rds health on. That extra 14K attack and +300 mastery, along with being all fire attack (I'm all earth attack for PvE primarily) must be the deciding factor, but then again, such statistics are not normal. That's a HUGE investment, and I'd warrant that a healer with a similarly huge investment might be able to tank it okay.

    Still, none of what you're telling me is convincing me that it's specifically a class thing. If anything, you've only cemented it further that it's an investment vs investment thing.


    burning rage changed from 3 hits to 3 sec so u can make full 6 shot with 50k+ . burst off rage( 6shot) is 1.60 sec cast time so u can full cast it and use 1 more skill after with 50k+ attck and the cd off that attck buff is 30 sec.

    and abute yes not all classes fit with mas/ attck build , cuse u need to sacrefice tanky stuff to go alll in attck/mas , thanks to mm bubbel i can do that that allow me to go all in damge and same time be tanky,

    2 mas build works perfekt with classes that can control aloot that make it more deadly.

    3. and mas build works better with classes with multi hits .
    4. and my attck is 37.5 and mas 2300 with pet.
  • jespervestman12
    jespervestman12 Posts: 93 Arc User



    well to be specific i mean ilikebigguns im sure a lot of people here know about him. and 1 on 1 3v3 group take whatever you like he has a divine shield on a low cooldown which can also be reset and with his cdef/attack/mastery he's able to one shot or come close to it even the tankiest of healers. does more damage than a champ gear DD in pvp and is tankier than most.

    edit- he's the one who made this post as well xD

    Speaking as an MM, the best way to deal with them is to control them. MM's have very few control breaks, aside from anima shelter skills, arena stones, etc (which everyone has access to). Get through their very few control breaks, and just control them down. Unless they're being spam purified by someone of course. Not sure how it is in EU, but over here you can't take 2 steps in most any PvP scenario without getting spammed with non-stop controls, which Dev above said didn't really happen to him. Maybe this is how our experiences differ?

    There's also a good number of healers in NA (800% cdef, 80% cdodge, 15K+ def, 1700+ resists) that I think would not come close to getting 1 shot unless the healer is caught with wrath down and without a bubble of some kind. If he's still able to do that even then, then that just comes down to amazing gear stats, so refer back to my first point above re: PTW. Amazing gear statistics is not an attribute inherent to a class.
    i have 6 ways to breake control and 1 off them is imuu to cc in 5 sec and if u gonna count healer purifiey to then that just +
    and also its not good ide to go on mm cuse i dont think u can control mm so well as mm can control u so = u will end up in cc youre self . and ofc if it is ga ng bang then yes anyone woulld be perma controld .
  • unusualsuspect1
    unusualsuspect1 Posts: 694 Arc User


    i have 6 ways to breake control and 1 off them is imuu to cc in 5 sec and if u gonna count healer purifiey to then that just +
    and also its not good ide to go on mm cuse i dont think u can control mm so well as mm can control u so = u will end up in cc youre self . and ofc if it is ga ng bang then yes anyone woulld be perma controld .

    Trap Escape = Break All Controls, once every 2 minutes
    Vitality = Break Ensare/Sleep/Stun/Slow effects, once every 5 minutes

    and that's basically it.

    There's no other control breaks that MM's get from either rune energy or awakening (that I'm aware of, unless it's undocumented, and that's very much possible given the state of documentation in the English client). Burning rage can grant slow/stun immunity if Furious Fire is triggered, but need high Fervor for that. I actually don't know if it works at low Fervor energy, I've not tested it.

    Aside from that, all other control breaks are what is available to all characters (Arena Stones, Battle Aegis, Food, etc). Yes, MM's can control, a lot, but as a class we don't natively get anything like the class-specific beneficial control breaks/immunities that other classes are capable of. On the whole, MM's are very susceptible to being controlled.

    I wasn't counting healer purify. If that's included too, then it's a completely different story. An MM of the build you've made can run rampant killing stuff very quickly.