Subscriptions

trailturtle · June 2013

Thanks to your constant (and constantly amazing) feedback, the error related to billing and subscription processing that has been impacting certain players using Visa credit cards has been identified. We are working with our billing and payment partners to correct this error ASAP. We're all-hands on-deck, but we don't have an immediate ETA on a fix. Soon as we know, you'll know.

Of course, we will ensure all affected players are compensated.

Thank you so much for your continued support.

-The Champions Online team

theravenforce · June 2013

Thanks for this update, I know personally a number of my friends will be pleased to hear there is some progress on this front.

Thank you TT and the Development Team.

dr490nbr347hi · June 2013

Compensated? Zen shopping spree here I come. >:3

atring · June 2013

Your contractions look a little uncertain...

rebelscum58 · June 2013

So, until you DO have an ETA on the fix, what should those of us who can't resub and thus can't play without deleting or converting characters do? Just attempt to resub constantly and play effectively for free for the few hours at a time the system takes to reject us? Use some other payment method? Just don't play for the few months it'll undoubtably take you to actually fix it?

jonsills · June 2013

atring wrote: »

Your contractions look a little uncertain...

Comes of typing it up in a word-processing program, then copy-pasting into the forums. ' and " don't translate well into the formatting here.

When I have to do something like that, my solution is to type it up in Notepad (since I use Windows); the formatting is identical to that of the forums.

skcark · June 2013

trailturtle wrote: »

Thanks to your constant (and constantly amazing) feedback, the error related to billing and subscription processing that has been impacting certain players using Visa credit cards has been identified. We are working with our billing and payment partners to correct this error ASAP. We?re all-hands on-deck, but we don?t have an immediate ETA on a fix. Soon as we know, you?ll know.

Of course, we will ensure all affected players are compensated.

Thank you so much for your continued support.

-The Champions Online team

What about those of us who are being told "Your issue is not related to this incident" by Customer Support, despite being the exact same thing?

rebelscum58 wrote: »

So, until you DO have an ETA on the fix, what should those of us who can't resub and thus can't play without deleting or converting characters do? Just attempt to resub constantly and play effectively for free for the few hours at a time the system takes to reject us? Use some other payment method? Just don't play for the few months it'll undoubtably take you to actually fix it?

I dunno about you, but each time i sub there's a $1 subtraction each time just to set up the sub for it to cancel the next day, i wouldn't call a dollor a day as being "free"

rebelscum58 · June 2013

That's a good point, though it does make me wonder. How is it that they can get that one dollar fee to go through reliably every time, but the actual subscription payment fails reliably every time? That doesn't make any sense at all.

kojirohellfire · June 2013

skcark wrote: »

I dunno about you, but each time i sub there's a $1 subtraction each time just to set up the sub for it to cancel the next day, i wouldn't call a dollor a day as being "free"

Well, considering that I just received my monthly bank statement today, judging from it, it looks like those $1 transactions aren't permanent, so technically it is "free."

It's nice to see that they finally admitted that they've been having a problem.

draogn · June 2013

I'm not being told that in order to resume my subscription, which wasn't due for renewal until the 17th of July, to resubscribe. The problem with this is not only is the 3 months for 29.99 deal no longer offered, but because of this error, I have been screwed out of almost a month of gametime.

This is a terrible way to run a business.

damedarkstar · June 2013

Indeed it is a terrible way to run a business. Know a few even myself considering not even bothering anymore.

rebelscum58 · June 2013

So, I resubbed instead using a paypal account I'd almost forgotten I had, and now it says the next billing date is July 7th. Which is odd.

jaazaniah1 · June 2013

When this happened to me at the beginning of June I resubbed with my Visa and it let me play for free (sans Zen) for 3 weeks. I resubbed again a few days ago. Still no charge on my Visa, but I'm still playing :biggrin:

rebelscum58 wrote: »

So, until you DO have an ETA on the fix, what should those of us who can't resub and thus can't play without deleting or converting characters do? Just attempt to resub constantly and play effectively for free for the few hours at a time the system takes to reject us? Use some other payment method? Just don't play for the few months it'll undoubtably take you to actually fix it?

rebelscum58 · June 2013

I'm just kind of worried if I did that they'd find out and then ban me for exploiting a bug in there system to get free subscription time. That and I already did try resubscribing with my card directly and it dropped me to silver again within the day. Thus, trying through paypal as mentioned above.

deadman20 · June 2013

I've just gotten hit with this issue myself, my sub seems to have just gone out at the worst possible time. Hope this gets fixed and players get their subs back in the next 6 hours! I've got a CC riding entirely on your (PWE/Cryptic's) actions here and now.

taintedmess · June 2013

rebelscum58 wrote: »

I'm just kind of worried if I did that they'd find out and then ban me for exploiting a bug in there system to get free subscription time. That and I already did try resubscribing with my card directly and it dropped me to silver again within the day. Thus, trying through paypal as mentioned above.

Provided you are supplying your details i dont see how they could.

kojirohellfire · June 2013

taintedmess wrote: »

Provided you are supplying your details i dont see how they could.

Indeed, you're not committing fraud. The money's there, the identity and bank account are yours, all the information is accurate. It's not our fault that PWE isn't taking the money despite their previous attempts to claim otherwise.

serarelm · June 2013

I had to "re-sub" 2 or 3 times in the past week due to billing issues stemming from being automatically unsubscribed, as it stands, I should have gotten my stipend in that time but nothing is there. Hopefully this will get rectified soon and the stuff I payed for shows up. without altering or delays future stipends to match this delay.

chalupaoffury · June 2013

Dammit, 500 days vet reward (when I shoulda been at a thousand plus, but again, your account system freaking sucks) is 3 days away. forever. A much needed retcon and therakiel action figure was waiting for me on my day off, today. Now, instead, I gotta wonder if I'm gonna have a sub or not for the next week.

I dunno what you're planning as compensation for this, but I think a round of retcons for everyone who subs is definitely in order, at the least. That wouldn't cost you anything, and it's a nice start.

flamingbunnyman · June 2013

rebelscum58 wrote: »

I'm just kind of worried if I did that they'd find out and then ban me for exploiting a bug in there system to get free subscription time. That and I already did try resubscribing with my card directly and it dropped me to silver again within the day. Thus, trying through paypal as mentioned above.

taintedmess wrote: »

Provided you are supplying your details i dont see how they could.

I don't think there's be a ban involved, but considering what happened when they screwed up the Zen stipend, I can easily see them going "You played 45 days for free, so we're deducting them from your current payment. You have 0 days remaining on the subscription you just paid for. Please pay again, so we can deduct the remaining 15 days."

And then they'd probably screw up the Zen stipend for that period too.

kojirohellfire · June 2013

Well, they might have just fixed it. I got my 500 Zen today which, according to their explanations for why we weren't getting it along with constant account deactivation, implies that the payment finally went through.

exonik0pwe · June 2013

I hope they fix it soon... (my sub is still inactive)

serarelm · June 2013

Aaaand just had to resub again just now. and it's showing it'll go inactive on July 6th. What the hell is going on with the billing? (still no stipend in sight, over a week past due)

malkavianmadman · July 2013

Well I have had to sub twice in 2 weeks. first time via visa (didn't know about this issue) and the second time via paypal. Now I am waiting for the funds to be taken. Mine also states that my sub is inactive and I have game time till the 8th. Really getting pissed off with this.

rowan79 · July 2013

Of course, I hope this isn't the case...but what if this is being done on purpose?

flyingfinn · July 2013

There is covert shutdown going on behind the scenes.
PW isn't just as capable of sundowning products that NCSoft was.

...

skcark · July 2013

rowan79 wrote: »

Of course, I hope this isn't the case...but what if this is being done on purpose?

Same thing i've been saying really. multiple people who were still on the 3 months for 30 dollar deal have had this issue. then they also target normal people as a way to cover up the fact that they simply wish to force those on the discount price onto the more expensive subscription.

flamingbunnyman · July 2013

skcark wrote: »

Same thing i've been saying really. multiple people who were still on the 3 months for 30 dollar deal have had this issue. then they also target normal people as a way to cover up the fact that they simply wish to force those on the discount price onto the more expensive subscription.

I know I've posted it before, but you guys REALLY need to take off the tinfoil hats, and remember Hanlon's Razor:

Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.

themightyzenith · July 2013

flamingbunnyman wrote: »

I know I've posted it before, but you guys REALLY need to take off the tinfoil hats, and remember Hanlon's Razor:

"Heinlein's Razor has (since) been defined as variations on "Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity, but don't rule out malice".

Just using your link.

flamingbunnyman · July 2013

Notice that that's a similar quote, with a different name, not a modification or update to Hanlon's Razor.

And do you really think that Cryptic is capable of accomplishing anything malicious without bunging it up?

themightyzenith · July 2013

flamingbunnyman wrote: »

Notice that that's a similar quote, with a different name, not a modification or update to Hanlon's Razor.

And do you really think that Cryptic is capable of accomplishing anything malicious without bunging it up?

Many believe that Hanlon's Razor might be a corruption of "Heinlein's Razor".

And as to your question.......who knows? Lack of communication makes people speculate.

deathsentry2012 · July 2013

had the same problem again with subscription..also now, can't seem to connect. i can login and select a character..but then connecting..the load screen goes on forever and times out..so i thought with cryptic north things would get better..am i wrong?

skcark · July 2013

flamingbunnyman wrote: »

I know I've posted it before, but you guys REALLY need to take off the tinfoil hats, and remember Hanlon's Razor:

Oh yes, because it's not sheer greed when they pushed out gamble bag after gamble bag, then mock box after mock box so what i said can't ever be possible because there isn't a single greedy bone in the bodies of PWE/CO staff who want to ensure everyone pays an arm and a leg for anything.

Maybe you think i'm paranoid, maybe what i say is true, or maybe i say it just to make a point too because at this stage i'm just very pissed off at how they treat the problem and i'm one of those being kicked off from the discount subscription rate caused by this sheer amount of stupidity from them which is also full of malice and i don't feel like listening to someone defend a leech

trailturtle · July 2013

Update:

1) The core of the issue should be fixed (as of Friday night). We've worked with one of our partners (I believe they help with our databases) to put a fix in place. All of our tests have worked properly.

2) For people who've been affected, the engineers are starting the conversation today about how to fix you up.

3) We're starting the conversation on compensation internally. Stay tuned.

Thanks for your support, everyone, we appreciate it.

-TrailTurtle

flamingbunnyman · July 2013

skcark wrote: »

Oh yes, because it's not sheer greed when they pushed out gamble bag after gamble bag, then mock box after mock box so what i said can't ever be possible because there isn't a single greedy bone in the bodies of PWE/CO staff who want to ensure everyone pays an arm and a leg for anything.

Maybe you think i'm paranoid, maybe what i say is true, or maybe i say it just to make a point too because at this stage i'm just very pissed off at how they treat the problem and i'm one of those being kicked off from the discount subscription rate caused by this sheer amount of stupidity from them which is also full of malice and i don't feel like listening to someone defend a leech

There's a difference between changing your business plan (implementing grab bags and lock boxes) and committing an act of fraud (what you're accusing them of with their billing issues).

If they really wanted people off the discount rate, all they'd have to do is announce "As of (whatever date), we will be discontinuing the (whatever the name of the promotion was). At that time, anyone still on that promotion will have their recurring billing discontinued, and will have to resubscribe under one of our standard subscription rates."

Or, they could fake a system issue that impacts a HUGE portion of the player base, alienating a large number of players, and costing them a vast sum of money, just to get an extra $5 or less from you each month. Yeah. That sounds like a smart plan.

damedarkstar · July 2013

I've been on that three month thing since 18th and only got play a week. Also my card was charged will I be recompensated with time or refund would like to know. I've went support route but has been less than helpful.

But also thank you for the update is a sign of honestly wanting fix issue on your side keep us somewhat informed.

kojirohellfire · July 2013

flamingbunnyman wrote: »

There's a difference between changing your business plan (implementing grab bags and lock boxes) and committing an act of fraud (what you're accusing them of with their billing issues).

If they really wanted people off the discount rate, all they'd have to do is announce "As of (whatever date), we will be discontinuing the (whatever the name of the promotion was). At that time, anyone still on that promotion will have their recurring billing discontinued, and will have to resubscribe under one of our standard subscription rates."

Or, they could fake a system issue that impacts a HUGE portion of the player base, alienating a large number of players, and costing them a vast sum of money, just to get an extra $5 or less from you each month. Yeah. That sounds like a smart plan.

Pretty much. PWE and Cryptic haven't proven themselves to be competent enough to pull off anything as complex as a conspiracy of fraud and pull it off successfully. Their management and coders don't seem to be that intelligent.

If they actually attempted anything as insidious as skcark was claiming, they'd probably wind up giving the three-month bargain subscribers an extra month or two for free. That's just how blatantly incompetent they are at everything they do.

jaybee37 · July 2013

Finally, my payment went through yesterday via PayPal, and I've got the three month sub I started trying to pay for at the beginning of June.

Anyway, I hope everyone else gets fixed up. In the future, maybe keep Billing Support informed so they have more information to offer the angry customers. Just a thought.

sharand · July 2013

*deleted* Nothing to see here, carry on Citizens.

deadman20 · July 2013

trailturtle wrote: »

Update:

1) The core of the issue should be fixed (as of Friday night). We've worked with one of our partners (I believe they help with our databases) to put a fix in place. All of our tests have worked properly.

2) For people who've been affected, the engineers are starting the conversation today about how to fix you up.

3) We're starting the conversation on compensation internally. Stay tuned.

Thanks for your support, everyone, we appreciate it.

-TrailTurtle

zolandar · July 2013

I just got hit by this today -- so it isn't fixed. 9 days after updating the subscription it goes silver AGAIN -after months of being auto -updated. And yes I'm using VISA.
Looks like I'll miss out on the Flag speed ....

trailturtle · July 2013

zolandar wrote: »

I just got hit by this today -- so it isn't fixed. 9 days after updating the subscription it goes silver AGAIN -after months of being auto -updated. And yes I'm using VISA.
Looks like I'll miss out on the Flag speed ....

My assumption is that the fix is applied to transactions at the first stage -- so we'll probably have 8 days or so of transactions failing because they didn't start with the fix in place. That's my guess.

It'd probably be worth charging it again, or you can wait for a response from Customer Support.

kojirohellfire · July 2013

deadman20 wrote: »

o0ka1n0o · July 2013

trailturtle wrote: »

Update:

1) The core of the issue should be fixed (as of Friday night). We've worked with one of our partners (I believe they help with our databases) to put a fix in place. All of our tests have worked properly.

2) For people who've been affected, the engineers are starting the conversation today about how to fix you up.

3) We're starting the conversation on compensation internally. Stay tuned.

Thanks for your support, everyone, we appreciate it.

-TrailTurtle

Compensation sounds way cool. I guess I'll give it a try again and see what happens. Wish I could get results immediately on whether it's working or not, heh.

skcark · July 2013

trailturtle wrote: »

Update:

1) The core of the issue should be fixed (as of Friday night). We've worked with one of our partners (I believe they help with our databases) to put a fix in place. All of our tests have worked properly.

2) For people who've been affected, the engineers are starting the conversation today about how to fix you up.

3) We're starting the conversation on compensation internally. Stay tuned.

Thanks for your support, everyone, we appreciate it.

-TrailTurtle

Will i be on of the ones included? Because customer support has been BS'ing me about "Your issue is in no way related to this error everyone else is having, here is your Auth code to prove it" followed by yet more automated messages of "We are sorry, we are trying to fix this issue which everyone is experiencing from this code (the EXACT same damn Auth code).

Either hire real humans for the support section, or program better auto script bots. It's just sad when those spam sex ad bots on MSN have a higher vocab than your own bots.

Will those of us who have lost our 3month for $30 subscriptions be given it back? And i don't mean that as being the compensation either.

zolandar · July 2013

I've been trying to call the support number all afternoon and gotten no real change. Just the curt all reps are busy response followed by a hang-up. Maybe it rings 4 times before that and then goes through the usual all busy response & disconnect. I've never seen a support line where they NEVER gave you the option to wait even if everyone is busy. Referring to the support pages for assistance instead of actually letting me talk to someone, to me is an insult. Automated customer service is fine IF it works.

I've gotten confusing emails from Cryptic that seem separate from the support tickets saying my account has been updated again, which it wasn't. Its still SILVER again with all my old characters unplayable. The support ticket email seem little more than automatic acknowledgements of the ticket, and as yet have given me no real response, nor any estimation of the time of its resolution

exonik0pwe · July 2013

zolandar wrote: »

I've been trying to call the support number all afternoon and gotten no real change. Just the curt all reps are busy response followed by a hang-up. Maybe it rings 4 times before that and then goes through the usual all busy response & disconnect. I've never seen a support line where they NEVER gave you the option to wait even if everyone is busy. Referring to the support pages for assistance instead of actually letting me talk to someone, to me is an insult. Automated customer service is fine IF it works.

I've gotten confusing emails from Cryptic that seem separate from the support tickets saying my account has been updated again, which it wasn't. Its still SILVER again with all my old characters unplayable. The support ticket email seem little more than automatic acknowledgements of the ticket, and as yet have given me no real response, nor any estimation of the time of its resolution

I dont think anything is fixed yet...like TT said they might need a week or so to get everything back up...but yeah CS dont seem to care much. The only person talking to us in this moment is TT noone else seems to care that we are paying costumers.

zedbrightlander1 · July 2013

kojirohellfire wrote: »

It's true! It's true! I hear Billy West's voice in my head. :eek:

GET - OUT - OF - MY - HEAD - BILLY - WEST!

rowan79 · July 2013

Has PWE disabled the support page now??

mergallenfur · July 2013

Happened to me again today (3rd or 4th time total) after a couple of weeks of it being fine. I happened to have some money in a Paypal account so I switched to that for now in the hopes that my account will stay Gold this time. It's at least nice to hear that things are being done about it.

exonik0pwe · July 2013

mergallenfur wrote: »

Happened to me again today (3rd or 4th time total) after a couple of weeks of it being fine. I happened to have some money in a Paypal account so I switched to that for now in the hopes that my account will stay Gold this time. It's at least nice to hear that things are being done about it.

Yes they do... things about it.... and stuff....... :I

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