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Random military things you might need to know...
cybersoldier1981
Posts: 2,501 Arc User
For people playing characters with military experience.
1- A 'Dragoon' is not a dragon, a person with dragon powers, someone who rides a dragon, or anything at all to do with dragons. It's a heavy infantry soldier.
2- Desert Eagles are not standard issue, or any kind of issue at all. They're actually awful handguns because of their low magazine capacity, rare ammunition, and weight. A fully-loaded Desert Eagle weighs as much as a fully-loaded M16A2 assault rifle. Also, they're gas-operated handguns... which is terrible for anything outside hobby shooting and they require constant cleaning after use.
3- Marines are not soldiers, and they don't like being referred to as such. Yes, you can argue about the job and whatnot- but Marines earn the title of being called a Marine, and it is VERY important to them. Also, an 'Ex-Marine' is a bad thing- that's how they refer to the guys that have been kicked out. 'Former Marine' is the appropriate term, and most Marines believe that 'Once a Marine, always a Marine'.
4- Army personnel are not authorized to consume alcohol in uniform except under certain circumstances. None of those circumstances are 'Club Caprice'. Marines, however, were founded in a bar and therefore... drinking in moderation is acceptable in uniform.
5- No one gets promoted for doing random awesome things, except EXTREMELY rare cases. Certain requirements for time in service, and time in their current rank must be met and even awards are calculated on a points system... so you might want to hold up on that 21-year-old Major. Rank structures are available online, as well as guides on how those ranks are addressed and such.
6- Being part of an elite force takes not only skill, but TIME. No one is a Navy Seal as soon as they join the Navy, no one is Special Forces as soon as they join the Army. There are specific rank and time requirements for each. If you want to be 'elite' and still somewhat young and fresh- Marine Force Recon and Army Rangers take personnel as soon as their basic training requirements are completed, prior to sending them to MOS (job) training.
7- There are no 'assassins' in the military.
8- Dishonorable Discharges are VERY serious. Usually it means more than 'you screwed up' or 'had problems with authority'. Chances are, the Dishonorable Discharge comes with a heavy helping of prison time... and you might not see a real job for the rest of your life.
9- You can't get out of jail or a sentence by joining the military.
10- Saying something is 'Classified' is vague. It's a way of saying 'restricted', not a classification in itself. Classification levels are as follows: Unclassified, Confidential, Secret, and Top Secret. Specific caveats exist in each to be specific as to who with those clearances can still see/know/be a part of the information. So, just because you have a 'Top Secret' clearance, it doesn't mean that all 'Top Secret' information is open to you- you must have a 'need-to-know'.
11- Marines have Drill Instructors. The Army Has Drill Sergeants. HUGE difference.
12- Once you are finished serving in the military, after your contract... you are not legally allowed to wear your uniform. However, if you -retire-, you can wear it.
13- Sniper rifles do not have a red dot. These point back at the sniper, so obviously they'd be the dumbest idea ever... and would serve no purpose at that range. Red lasers are usually used in close quarters, like ship-boarding or SWAT teams. The laser that is used is an infrared laser, which shows up when you look through nightvision goggles... and it's green (like everything else when you wear those goggles).
14- The military actually pays pretty decent, especially considering the benefits. The 'broke soldier' usually is the guy that isn't very responsible, no matter how much he makes- or sometimes may have a few kids and a wife to support.
15- The military doesn't really 'develop' their own tech. So, you might wanna think before making that Navy Seal power armor... military tech is tested by the military, but developed by major corporations.
16- Most military people aren't brainwashed into being Gung-Ho 24/7. They're normal people otherwise, doing normal people things. Like playing Champions Online, wasting time on the forums, and eating bacon jerky.
17- Pilots are officers or warrant officers. Enlisted men don't fly birds, simple as that. Not enough pay to deduct if they break something.
18- Barracks on base are actually better than dorms. The old 'bays' with fifty bunks go away after basic training and MOS (job) training. After that... it's actually pretty sweet. Of course, overseas in Afghanistan and Iraq... it's crappier by a long shot.
19- Most military personnel have some college, or are at least somewhat educated. After all, that GI Bill and the Tuition Assistance is pretty sweet.
20- They're all weird in a way. Seriously, hang around a bunch of GI's one day. They all have these bizzaro quirks. I mean... they're like any other batch of folks thrown together, so there's potential for military groups to have people from all walks of life.
21- Regular explosives don't make fireballs. That's Hollywood, and sometimes the fuel tank from a vehicle you see exploding. Explosives can cause things to ignite after the initial blast, but that's friction. Fun fact: In the oilfield, workers used to put out oil fires with dynamite. Another fun fact: You can light a block of C4 on fire and it won't do anything.
22- Rubber bullets can still kill the hell out of you. They can cause massive tissue trauma, bone fractures, and permanent damage. You aren't knocking someone out with them with a headshot- you're cracking open their skull.
23- Most missiles don't have to 'impact' to explode. A Rocket-Propelled Grenade is an exception, with a few others (In those explosives, the head is forced back to rupture a device similar to a primer, which ignites the explosive charge in the projectile). If you were to try to sidestep or swat away nearly anything else- you'd be still caught in the shockwave and blown up- because the missile isn't effective if it hits you and explodes- it needs to explode near you to maximize the force of the blast. Otherwise, how much sense would it make to fire missiles at other aircraft, ever? The odds of missing a target that movies that fast and has that thin of a silohuette are pretty broad. Most advanced missile systems actually have sophisticated guidance systems that navigate them to a certain range of the target- either by calculating distance, identifying a thermal signature, or other means- many can often calculate the lead, windage, and direction of a target on the fly- this is why many missiles cost more than a car. It's not the explosives, it's the guidance system. So, dodge if you want, Superdude- you're still gonna be a smokin' turd when it gets close.
If there are any other questions... I'll be happy to answer.
1- A 'Dragoon' is not a dragon, a person with dragon powers, someone who rides a dragon, or anything at all to do with dragons. It's a heavy infantry soldier.
2- Desert Eagles are not standard issue, or any kind of issue at all. They're actually awful handguns because of their low magazine capacity, rare ammunition, and weight. A fully-loaded Desert Eagle weighs as much as a fully-loaded M16A2 assault rifle. Also, they're gas-operated handguns... which is terrible for anything outside hobby shooting and they require constant cleaning after use.
3- Marines are not soldiers, and they don't like being referred to as such. Yes, you can argue about the job and whatnot- but Marines earn the title of being called a Marine, and it is VERY important to them. Also, an 'Ex-Marine' is a bad thing- that's how they refer to the guys that have been kicked out. 'Former Marine' is the appropriate term, and most Marines believe that 'Once a Marine, always a Marine'.
4- Army personnel are not authorized to consume alcohol in uniform except under certain circumstances. None of those circumstances are 'Club Caprice'. Marines, however, were founded in a bar and therefore... drinking in moderation is acceptable in uniform.
5- No one gets promoted for doing random awesome things, except EXTREMELY rare cases. Certain requirements for time in service, and time in their current rank must be met and even awards are calculated on a points system... so you might want to hold up on that 21-year-old Major. Rank structures are available online, as well as guides on how those ranks are addressed and such.
6- Being part of an elite force takes not only skill, but TIME. No one is a Navy Seal as soon as they join the Navy, no one is Special Forces as soon as they join the Army. There are specific rank and time requirements for each. If you want to be 'elite' and still somewhat young and fresh- Marine Force Recon and Army Rangers take personnel as soon as their basic training requirements are completed, prior to sending them to MOS (job) training.
7- There are no 'assassins' in the military.
8- Dishonorable Discharges are VERY serious. Usually it means more than 'you screwed up' or 'had problems with authority'. Chances are, the Dishonorable Discharge comes with a heavy helping of prison time... and you might not see a real job for the rest of your life.
9- You can't get out of jail or a sentence by joining the military.
10- Saying something is 'Classified' is vague. It's a way of saying 'restricted', not a classification in itself. Classification levels are as follows: Unclassified, Confidential, Secret, and Top Secret. Specific caveats exist in each to be specific as to who with those clearances can still see/know/be a part of the information. So, just because you have a 'Top Secret' clearance, it doesn't mean that all 'Top Secret' information is open to you- you must have a 'need-to-know'.
11- Marines have Drill Instructors. The Army Has Drill Sergeants. HUGE difference.
12- Once you are finished serving in the military, after your contract... you are not legally allowed to wear your uniform. However, if you -retire-, you can wear it.
13- Sniper rifles do not have a red dot. These point back at the sniper, so obviously they'd be the dumbest idea ever... and would serve no purpose at that range. Red lasers are usually used in close quarters, like ship-boarding or SWAT teams. The laser that is used is an infrared laser, which shows up when you look through nightvision goggles... and it's green (like everything else when you wear those goggles).
14- The military actually pays pretty decent, especially considering the benefits. The 'broke soldier' usually is the guy that isn't very responsible, no matter how much he makes- or sometimes may have a few kids and a wife to support.
15- The military doesn't really 'develop' their own tech. So, you might wanna think before making that Navy Seal power armor... military tech is tested by the military, but developed by major corporations.
16- Most military people aren't brainwashed into being Gung-Ho 24/7. They're normal people otherwise, doing normal people things. Like playing Champions Online, wasting time on the forums, and eating bacon jerky.
17- Pilots are officers or warrant officers. Enlisted men don't fly birds, simple as that. Not enough pay to deduct if they break something.
18- Barracks on base are actually better than dorms. The old 'bays' with fifty bunks go away after basic training and MOS (job) training. After that... it's actually pretty sweet. Of course, overseas in Afghanistan and Iraq... it's crappier by a long shot.
19- Most military personnel have some college, or are at least somewhat educated. After all, that GI Bill and the Tuition Assistance is pretty sweet.
20- They're all weird in a way. Seriously, hang around a bunch of GI's one day. They all have these bizzaro quirks. I mean... they're like any other batch of folks thrown together, so there's potential for military groups to have people from all walks of life.
21- Regular explosives don't make fireballs. That's Hollywood, and sometimes the fuel tank from a vehicle you see exploding. Explosives can cause things to ignite after the initial blast, but that's friction. Fun fact: In the oilfield, workers used to put out oil fires with dynamite. Another fun fact: You can light a block of C4 on fire and it won't do anything.
22- Rubber bullets can still kill the hell out of you. They can cause massive tissue trauma, bone fractures, and permanent damage. You aren't knocking someone out with them with a headshot- you're cracking open their skull.
23- Most missiles don't have to 'impact' to explode. A Rocket-Propelled Grenade is an exception, with a few others (In those explosives, the head is forced back to rupture a device similar to a primer, which ignites the explosive charge in the projectile). If you were to try to sidestep or swat away nearly anything else- you'd be still caught in the shockwave and blown up- because the missile isn't effective if it hits you and explodes- it needs to explode near you to maximize the force of the blast. Otherwise, how much sense would it make to fire missiles at other aircraft, ever? The odds of missing a target that movies that fast and has that thin of a silohuette are pretty broad. Most advanced missile systems actually have sophisticated guidance systems that navigate them to a certain range of the target- either by calculating distance, identifying a thermal signature, or other means- many can often calculate the lead, windage, and direction of a target on the fly- this is why many missiles cost more than a car. It's not the explosives, it's the guidance system. So, dodge if you want, Superdude- you're still gonna be a smokin' turd when it gets close.
If there are any other questions... I'll be happy to answer.
Post edited by cybersoldier1981 on
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Seeing number 7...hmm..is there anyway she could be part of UNTIL then? Or not? She is an assassin in the sense that she would (past) go off and kill targets. She ran into another of my characters "ForceGirl" and was paid to take her out, needless to say she failed and never felt a harder impact
And yes..she is a bell-bottomed assassin hehe
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By way of example, my job in the Air Force was classified Top Secret - Exceptionally Sensitive Information (TS-ESI). Once you hit TS, you start having to be "read into" classified programs (I was read into SIOP, up to Category Nine - I was authorized to know everything about the Single Integrated Operational Plan except for scenarios that might lead to launching nuclear weapons). There are level of classification higher than that; I knew some people with a TS-SCI (Separately Compartmented Information) clearance at Offutt.
(I also had a NATO clearance, which is where I found out that NATO has awesome labels. I was cleared for NATO Cosmic Top Secret ATOMAL.)
And may the God(s) of your choice have mercy on your soul if you make this confusion within the hearing of a soldier or Marine. (As an aside, the Air Force has Training Instructors, but they don't get so touchy about terminology - it's hard to get that wrought up about a military service with office hours.)
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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My SG, DE:LTA is based in UNTIL Special Forces but also get alot of leeway from UNITY. I see UNTIL more as the NATO forces than US Armed Forces. I know alot about the French Foreign Legion rules of being always in uniform and upholding the institution, but overall my knowledge of the military is only built around the US Air Force. I hope to be authentically fantastic and get a bit upset when things turn from NATO into "Team America World Police"
Cyrone gave me some hints about how to deal with command structure.
any one know the rank structure of UNTIL and the other CO beyond standard military organisations?
A sniper is tasked to recon an area, and is given the green light to take out a High Value Target. This is ok, the sniper fulfills multiple purposes on the battlefield.
A guy is trained to sneak into foreign countries and kill political leaders to destabilize a government. This is NOT allowed.
Do you see the difference? One occurs during a battle, the other is not in the battle. Covert operations are different than assassination missions- otherwise, certain political leaders in the real world would have smoking holes in their head.
Also, it's time for a couple more, so see above at #13 and however many else I add afterward.
If she's UNTIL then it's entirely possible that standard military regulations don't apply she sounds a bit like marvels Black widow who in the films at least (it gets confusing in the books) is a agent of SHIELD and has pretty dark background.
Mind you, if she had some particular skill... shady parts of the government(s) would attempt to use her skills, just like internet security companies 'buy out' hackers.
So effectively that character would probably be better suited for the CIA or something.
It's an UN division which means that every UNTIL soldier is also in service in his home military, but relegated to UN. Technically he or she is on foreign mission.
Just like my soldier is still part of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation, but technically her UNTIL service is counted as being on UN mission. This would apply to pretty much every militaryman in UNTIL service - they all had to start in militaries of their home countries.
Precisely, I'm going for a mix between, Black Widow/Jane Smith (Mr+Mrs Smith)
At this current juncture in time, she is still thought of as an assassin, however she does not actively go out and take out people. She retains her mutant and bionic implant powers and uses them to fight for the government and herself occassionally.
She has taken out high profile targets before hand but they generally were other crime lords and/or targets who posed a significant threat to their organisations. For example VIPER wanted to take out ForceGirl due to their "history" and the threat she presented (as well as other heroes ofc). ForceGirl was to be her first, "good target" if you will.
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However, I'm fine with someone in a pretend setting pretending to be of X military service- however, as a service member of 12 years I do wish to see them portrayed accurately and with respect to those services. I see it as the same as portraying someone of another race, culture, or nationality- it should be done with respect (Doesn't mean military people can't be bad guys, of course).
And I'm sorry, considering the droves of players who write off munitions as 'nothing to fear' in RP settings, I think that the frightening reality of how deadly they can be is worth putting across.
I would also like you to point out my inaccuracies.
Also it's an odd take on what a unified Earth government agency would actually be able to perform. NATO and UN troops very rarely have the extended powers that state militaries have in my experience.
But by creating a new structure, in DE:LTA we get to combine the many kinds of command structure from Political to Military to Police. I think it's important to remember that Champions Universe is different from the one of which i write this message from. Each organization would have their own rules, regulations etc..
NOW that being said.. It still irks me to see people who are generally not respectful to volunteer military service organizations like PRIMUS (equivalent of US Armed Forces) or UNTIL.
I just bite my tongue until it gets actually dis-respectful. I dont want to kill anyone's enjoyment of the game.
Basically.
Except the barracks part. There are some pretty bad barracks out there that are worse than any college dorm I ever seen at the lowest level (only counting stateside). Most barracks rooms are also lot smaller than a college dorm room so most single soliders can forget about buying furniture as long as they remain SGT and below in most areas and single, which depending on MOS can be longer than a tenure in that of housing situation than college 4-5 years.
Lately they have been getting better and yeah they got ridden mostly of the large 10-50 people bays outside basic training and some AIT.
And number 9-not anymore but there have been cases due to "special probation" in the southern states where that was the options. Many people dont get accepted and end up in jail because they wouldnt get the waiver. While others make it with waiver. But no, not usually for serious crimes like violent crimes and felonies. It's not unheard of, but very unusual. And in recent times of draw downs, forget about it.
But actually most cases of dishonorable discharge people dont go to jail but they usually did do something serious according to the UCMJ. Like you can get dishonorable discharge for adultery, a non-crime now in the civilian world, but usually the offender in them ilitary doesnt go to jail for it.
Pay is subjective and depends. Officers yes, pay good. E4 and below especially e1 pay not so good, especially single soldiers where sometimes base pay is all you get. Married people get more especially with housing allowance that can be from $900 and up depending on local and most barracks rooms especially in cases where it's a shared room and or bathroom is not worth the rent of $900 and up a month. Single soldiers get shafted in that department.
But overall, this is good post for movie makers as they tend to get those details you described very wrong.
This point does not contradict the OP's reference to Dragoons as Heavy Infantry because, in some cases, heavy infantry made the best dragoons. They benefited the most from the fatigue saving elements of riding and are generally the slowest infantry type without the assistance of mounts.
'Caine, miss you bud. Fly high.
Nobody ever went into the service to get rich, at least not since they stopped including "looting the populace" as a perk.
What units give BCDs for adultery? The Army units at Ft Lewis have been known to put someone out with an Other Than Honorable, but only if the adultery was also prejudicial to good discipline - mostly, they'd prefer to issue an Article 15 and tell the soldier to stay away from their partner in "crime". BCDs, in every case I've been aware of, have been reserved for for-reals criminal acts.
(Incidentally, that could be added to the OP as well - there are a variety of military punishments, and often it's up to the CO which level will be applied. Article 15 is an administrative punishment - it can include restriction to quarters, and I believe even some stockade time, although I'm unsure about that. It's administered by the soldier's superiors. A court martial can, on conviction, result in punishments ranging from restriction to quarters, to loss of pay and rank, to time in the stockade, to one of the three classes of Not-Good discharges [General, Other Than Honorable, and Bad Conduct]. Contrary to some movies, conviction in a court martial is not automatic; there are rules of evidence, and the need to prove the charge, just like civilian courts.)
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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Actually, within the last 5 years- a lot of this is changing. Right now, the standard they're trying to meet is at least a 12 x 12 living area for yourself, with a shared bathroom/common area with another room. A lot of units had to fix the old sucky ones- youtube works wonders at getting things to change.
http://www.military.com/join-armed-forces/military-myths.html
I have to stand by what I said- in all actuality, if a judge tells you 'you will join the military or I will send you to jail', not only is this an illegal sentence/penalty- but it also completely bars you from enlistment. However, there are cases where minor crimes have received a lesser sentence because the defendant had intent to join the military, which requires a waiver.
The truth is, this 'You won't go to jail if you join the army' thing hasn't happened since the 1950's. Since then, pretty much... it's just a good ol' fashioned case of 'Boot Camp Bullsh*t stories', or as most people call it- lying.
I joined because I always thought it was a cool way of life. And hey- pay ain't too bad, food is hit or miss, hours can fluctuate, but they let me play with guns.
However, it still wasn't as "an alternative to going to jail"; again, back when that was done, in the '50s and earlier, it was generally a really, really bad idea (consider: do you think it would be a good thing to equip career criminals with military weapons and the training to use them?).
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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And judges never do anything illegal
No really, I see what you are saying. I misread it. Of course a judge cant flat out and say that.
IIRC, most TO&E for handguns nowadays are 9mm. Few, if any units should have TO&E old enough for the .45.
Arguable. The structure of the modern military blurs the distinction between soldier and marine to the point of pointlessness.
Essentially marines are a light infantry force that specializes in Naval operations.
Actually this is what the brevet system is about.
Granted, it's use in the modern military is quite limited.
Essentially it's possible for someone to be breveted to a given rank. They can hold the authority of said rank, but are still paid and have the benefits of their original rank. This is normally someone who's shown extreme aptitude, but has yet to conform to the time-in-grade requirements.
Not by designation no.
Popping someone who can't see you from half a mile with a sniper rifle isn't exactly "Marquis of Queensbury" though.
Then again, if you're not prepared to kill your enemy you shouldn't be fighting in the first place.
9- You can't get out of jail or a sentence by joining the military.
Not in the modern, all-volunteer Army. Back during the draft days though, less serious offenders were given the "go to war or go to jail" option.
Actually there are classification levels above "Top Secret". 99.999~% of them have nothing to do with the US military and no soldier should ever have "need to know" on them.
No. Not really. Their basic job is the same. Take a grass-green recruit and a couple dozen of his friends and turn them into members of their respective armed forces. The Army just tends to have a more laid-back style than the hard-charging marines (well, unless you fsck up, then it's on and you'd be hard pressed to tell the difference).
Some modern sniper systems are actually computer-driven. They take into account multiple environmental factors, ammo type, distance, etc and feed you a firing solution.
Exactly. I NEVER was hurting for money while I was in. Heck, the time I spent as a TMC medic over in Korea, I had money coming out of my ears. I had no real expenses, I lived on post in the barracks, and ate at the chow hall. The post shuttles and inter-post shuttles were free. And the nearest 'ville was a few blocks from post (Youngsan, Seoul South Korea).
And remember the term "built by the lowest bidder".
The military is just like any other community. Good people, bad people, crazy people, weird people, etc. The military is a job like just about any other.
Right. The worst I ever had a barracks situation be was 3 people to a room (and a big room at that). Mainly because the unit I was coming into was in transition and about a dozen people were due to leave and hadn't yet. I spent an entire summer and fall at one post as the only guy in an entire building.
Yes, no, maybe. Enlisted? Sometimes. Especially those who're in longer and looking to make a career or do green-to-gold (go from enlisted to commissioned (officer)).
As I said earlier. It's another community, just like any other.
Most of the fireballs you see are gasoline shots. A big enough explosion will cause a mushroom cloud, it need not be nuclear. And C4 requires an electrical charge to detonate.
That's why the "less than lethal" or "nonlethal" monikers are BS.
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Force Recon uses them still, if I recall correctly.
Ah, the point I was making- walk up to a Marine and say 'Hey, Soldier!' and you might get corrected... civilians, usually get a more delicate explanation. I watched a Master Gunnery Sergeant reduce an army First Sergeant to tears for this. Marines are serious about the title. Job wise? Yeah, similar. Sadly, not the intent- Marines were used as an occupying force in Afghanistan and Iraq- which they do not have the funding or equipment for.
Even in that case- there's a lot of difference. I saw Army Drill Sergeants yell and go nuts- but you haven't seen anything until you've seen a USMC 'shark attack'.
The pay is decent, but I know a lot of sailors had financial problems since they didn't know how to control their bat-****-crazy spending habbits. Or had lazy, good-for-nothing, money leaching spouses.
The GI Bill is generally something used AFTER your military term is over. However, the Navy was very big on having college classes while underway. Can't speak for other branches. If you are a Navy officer, you have a bachelors, minimum (even if it's in underwater basket weaving). Chiefs might even need a dregree by now. The low ranking enlisted people? Pft, no. Most of them are 18-20, so very unlikely to have any college.
Barracks depend on the branch. I know in the Navy, not every base even had barracks for sailors, so living on the ship happened. Living on the ship sucks. Barracks at boot camp are supposed to be like those on a ship... Which isn't saying much.
I wouldn't say most of the sailors were weird. Nukes, yeah, probably. But most of the others? Not so much. Really smart people in general are weird, though.
[at]riviania Member since Aug 2009
Anyway i would like to add a thing:
this is a fantasy game, i personally love to add realism and makes things in the proper way, yet is true that the world we are playing in, is not like the real world.
In a world full of meta human and others super powered peoples i don't think is that crazy to see a very young one being a hig ranked military guy... take the NPC for example: we have Gertz, that is not very young, ok, but we even have Ukwonko, that is what... 28? 30?
Plus a player is RPing a protagonist, not an npc, so his toon will be far more powerfull than the npc and in a world with a huge green monster jumping around, a world terrorist threat always ready to take the rule of everithing, a semi god that wish to raise and so on... well, in such a world i frankly doubt that the army would say "Well, this guy can lift a tank, mind control dozens of soldiers and fly... but he is in the army only from a short time, we cannot set him as a major, no matter if he saved the life of the President... twice"
Realism is a wonderfull thing, but i think that the fun, in a game, must have the priority.
And i am one who have a toon who RP talking is a General and another one who is a Major, both with a completely reasonable bios for that (very long military career and so on), i only thought it was better to say things plain and simple, indeed, once again, it's a game.
But having said that I have lived in much worse conditions during field ops and during my 3 pumps (deployments) to Iraq. I never expected to live in luxury in the field or on deployments but it would have been nice to have better quarters while in Garrison. I even volunteered to be a barracks manager after I had my spinal surgery, since I would be useless trying to do anything else, to try and get the barracks back in order but I ran into so much red tape it wasn't funny.
Getting the sorry excuse of "Oh we don't have the funding this quarter," got old fast. It was also infuriating to see the damn Regimental CO getting an 80 inch HD TV for the conference room so he could watch sports with the other officers.
How you can tell their age if game graphics are so simplified? Pretty much only very old NPC have elderly faces, given Champions Online stylisation.
Those NPC from UNTIL can be 28 as well as 35. Or even 40.
No matter if comic book universe or not, no existing military in any country will give CO rank just like that - because it's not a matter of power or fighting skills, but a matter of knowledge. You're supposed to know that much, just to be a lieutenant (a fairly low officer rank). Very young people could be NCO if they're good. Averything more requires military equivalent of studies, so young character could be cadet or ensign, but not a "real" CO. A "mere" lieutenant is supposed to handle all things under his command (not personally, but he's still supposed to at least know about most things), most of them being a rather dull administration work.
Not even in Marvel universe Frank Castle and Nick Fury are youngsters.
Though it depends what do you consider an old character. During my conscription lieutenants were usually 27 - 30+, I wouldn't call any of them "old". And they were supposed to know everything about their company. If something was not right it was lieutenant who was in trouble, not his chief or sergeant. All of them were academy graduates, there were also two ensigns who were still learnig before being given their own command.
It really takes time in every military under the sun.
When I was creating my UNTIL toon I gave her age 27 right off the bat just to give her enough time for living up to her lowly lieutenant title.
First, I get that the assassin/sniper thing still applies to UNTIL, and my alt's a sniper, not an assassin, but I'm not sure how the pilot and tech development apply; lore from things like the shop page for the Become Black Talon item and some other stuff on UNTIL suggest they work their own items, and a lot of guys in the game seem to know how to pilot flying craft.
Second, if you've played the open mission where VIPER goes after the mayor, anyone using the info about sniper dots and assassins would chalk them up as hyped-up terrorists. That's kind of what VIPER is anyways, but the red dots part just made me think of the point where a tone of aiming dots show up at once. Bet more than a few had discharges of any sort if they actually served.
Third, seeing as this is a superhero game, and dodging and blocking only reduce damage for some reason, the last one about rockets may only be partially relevant in the game. I mean, yea, you can't knock it away harmlessly, but if you're strong and gung ho enough to knock a rocket, mabye it only dose partial damage anyways.
Side note on that last one about your last one; if you have the retaliation block power slotted and you purchase the advantage "punitive pummeling", blocking anti-air rockets may make you punch the warhead when it reaches you. No effect on damage, but it dose look really awesome.
That's why I was so irked by the ending of the '09 Star Trek movie - sure, Kirk had just proven he was a hero, but he never proved anything about being able to command the loyalty of a starship full of people, especially over the long term. (I understand he gets his comeuppance on that score in the new movie, but I haven't gotten around to seeing it yet.) He should not have been jumped six grades in rank; instead, he should have been permitted to graduate immediately at the rank of Lieutenant, then we should have gotten a montage of Kirk reporting to new ships at various ranks until finally assuming command of the Enterprise at the rank of Captain.
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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Please keep in mind that the CU was created to be as close to the real world as possible . The basic premise is that unless stated otherwise the CU adheres to real world standards. This is important in that it allows thousands of people to share the same world without breaking the consistency of that world.
'Caine, miss you bud. Fly high.
I think you misunderstood- that missile isn't going to hit you- and it's going to detonate long before it's in arm's reach.
Which makes absolutely perfect sense, and I have to agree with you.
So, you're REALLY awesome at kicking bad guys' butts? You'll STILL need to learn how to lead. Leadership and combat proficiency do NOT equate one another. There is a reason that, no matter how good you are- you STILL have to spend a certain amount of time and develop those leadership skills before getting that rank.
Let's put it this way- I don't want 'Captain Good-At-Everything' in charge of me when he's only been in a year or so. Most of the time, the 'Super-Soldier' is the last guy you want in charge simply because he forgets that not everyone can be on his level- he ends up running the rest of his unit in the ground and making them hate him. And remember, you have to lead from the front- with everyone armed and pissed off behind you.
QFT. Radio proximity fuzes. They have been around in some form or another sense the 40s. This is not new tech, but tried and tested.
And they are not just in missiles. But big guns and artillery shells have them as well. Uncle arty always works best when he bursts over your head and rains on you. Instead of making a big divot in the ground and wasting all that energy.
Pretty much, unless its made to make holes in heavy armor, It will most likely explode some distance from you and turn you into swiss cheese.
Sorry for the derail. My inner tank girl had to speak up on this. Ill be quiet now
Well Okonkwo is really an UNTIL officer which may have a totally different rating schematics than regular army or regular military.
In the CO world I think maybe only a few NPCs outright say Navy Army Air Force MArine. Anything else any other organization no telling how fast someone move up the rank or so. Even within the real branches of military, the rank structure is different especially for the NCO side.
The record of youngest General officer rank (Brigadier) holder was 20 years old and about 8 months named Galusha Pennypacker. US.
yup.
Seen a few butter bars that were pretty good, but all usually was found out to be prior enlisted NCO.
One was good in leadership, and probably coud lead people anywhere but he didnt know the job one single bit.
"uhm sir, not to be rude or anything but you know I cant sign these papers right? We'll both get murked by the Colonel if I sign there instead of you. And you have a staff meeting to today and please, dont forget your cover and dont call the Commander Bob again, maybe wait until you pin on Major. Yes, you have to wear the cover outside, sir....What? Oh people salute you because you're an officer. Yes they have to salute you. No, you are not supposed to run the other way."
Or the one that tickled me from a call from an officer wife that called my office with a water quality complaint.
So we go through the steps she said the water taste funny. So to get more of an idea, I ask what do it taste like? Do it have a metallic taste, rotten food taste and smell, or anything? She reply, "It taste like enlisted water." At this point I'm trying hard to not laugh and proceed to tell her, "Well, there is no difference in enlisted water and officer water it's all on the same line." Then in a shocked manner she respond "What?! We are drinking the same water as enlisted soldiers?" I just said after that "Yes. I'll be out there to check it out and we'll go for there." Had to cut it short I dont think I could have held it in much longer, the laugher. True story. Around 2004 time period.
This made me laugh.
Back when you had to salute officers' vehicles, we had a Colonel's wife who threw a fit when someone didn't salute her and we all suffered for it. She always came during a certain time, so we started doing forced marches up and down the road, on both sides, really slow. She'd honk and scream and we'd go slower.
Yeah the wives of officers are some self entitled idiots for the most part. Back in 09 we were doing some base security drills and I was one of the Sergeants of the Guard going back and forth checking on the gates. We were conducting random stops at the gates and inspecting the vehicles for explosives and what not as part of the training. So at one gate we stopped a car and the woman ended up being a Colonel's wife and she went ballistic.
"Do you know who I am? I'm so and so's wife! I will have you busted down for this!"
"Good luck with that ma'am. I work for the Base General. Have a nice day."
I come from a military family, but I'm the black sheep in that I'm the only male that didn't serve in some branch or another.
My grandpa actually served in 3 different branches at various points. Army, Air Force, and Naval Reserve. The Army->Air Force transfer happened because he was in at the tail end of WWII, when the Air Force was still the Army Air Corps. When it became a separate branch in its own right, he transferred over. Never got the story of how he ended up in the Naval Reserve, but I know that was during peacetime after Korea.
My dad actually had an interesting discharge case happen to him. He was Navy. Got discharged as Other Than Honorable. Fought it for years and finally got it changed to General Discharge. Long story short: He knocked out a superior officer while they were at sea. Spent the rest of the voyage in the brig and was discharged pretty much immediately upon reaching port. I'm sure there was some red tape involved, but I never got the whole story of how the discharge actually occurred.
The only reason it was changed to General years later is because someone looked into the record of the officer in question and noted that the officer himself received a Dishonorable discharge and had a track record of abusing his authority and treating enlisted men like crap. My dad was an E-3 (Seaman), and the officer involved was an E-4 (Petty Officer 3rd Class) at the time. They put two and two together and figured my dad's story was true and the officer being KOed was justified (his actions resulted in an injury my dad carries to this day). I can't imagine something like that happens very often at all, and had that officer himself not been discharged Dishonorably it probably would not have happened. For the record, it took the better part of 30 years to get that ruling reversed, and it only got reversed to General instead of Honorable.
So, odd occurrences with discharges do happen, but they're exceptionally rare from what I understand. Usually, how you're discharged is how you're discharged, and no reversal is possible.
I don't know for sure, but I suspect that officer's behavior resulted in more than one enlisted man getting an Other Than Honorable discharge and many of them were probably reversed. Sounds to me like that guy never should have been promoted in the first place.
(No, I don't know what the officer was discharged for. It wasn't relevant to my dad's case, so he was never told)
I can verify this particular case, as I've seen both discharge papers with my own eyes. One is dated 1972 and says "Other Than Honorable", the other is dated 1997 and says "General, Under Honorable Conditions".
Given that Nick fury is some where north of 100 he's had plenty of time to climb the ranks though he's only made it to Colonel and Frank only made it to captain.
On the other hand marvel also have Abigail Brand who commands S.W.O.R.D and is only 28 or Carol Danvers who was 29 when she lost her powers to rogue and by that point she had reached the rank of Major in the air force, worked for the CIA and worked for NASA.
And finally lets not forget Captain America who possibly was never even a captain (or enlisted for that matter) but now holds the rank of commander.
I think its safe to say that when it comes to rank structure comic books ignore a lot of it in favour of the rule of cool.
Depends on which storyline you follow, or universe.
Originally Captain America was only a "captain" when dressed in costume, and he had a "secret identity", and he was actually a private or corporal I believe, NOT a Captain as portrayed in the movies.
But to be fair, battlefield commissions were a common thing in WWII.
Well, to be truthful, it kinda is. It just has superheroes in it.
If you check the Champions Online timeline, they include real life events that have happened, including 9/11 and the War in Iraq. So probably, these rules still apply, and are probably very true. So for example: Osama was killed, and by who? The military. They didn't state some tights wearing cape did it. The military did, and on the same date that it did in our time. So we can probably draw up the conclusion that protocol still runs the same way in this universe as it does in our universe. They might have /ADDITIONAL/ protocol regarding meta humans, but I wouldn't say /CHANGED/ protocol. If anything, they might have restrictions on meta humans. Like meta humans might not even be eligible to be enlisted. Or meta humans can't hold an officer position while enlisted, because they're much stronger than the average human.
I will admit, though, they might be a little more lenient than the examples I just gave, because this /IS/ a rather tongue in cheek universe. I mean really, the police in MC are a joke. They got overrun by a prison break. In real life, cops are pros. They're very effective, and very well trained individuals. You don't 'overrun' the cops in a city the size of Detroit. There are /A LOT/ of them (Actual numbers would return that there's roughly around 2,200 to 2,400 sworn cops in Detroit.), and I'm sure they would have hired more for a prison of that size. They can handle the tasks they're tasked to do.
So I guess everything just kind of has to be taken with a grain of salt.
@ScarredSilencer
@ScarredSilencer
You've nicely highlited one of the reasons I hate super hero universes set in the real world
Taking the prison brake point first its a prison holding at least a few super powered individuals yet there seems to be very little anti super powered hardware deployed. Power armoured cops guard the jet but not one to be seen at a breakout of potentially super powered individuals what's that all about?
Now back to 9/11 in champions verse how did it happen it certainly couldn't have happened as it did in the real world unless of course New York has no suppers (seems unlikely)
Also war in Iraq death of osama again power armoured troopers, advanced scanning equipment though on the flip side the bad guys are gona have suppers as well and where dose a group like Viper or even Argent fit into the equation. Or come to think of it daemon there always seem to be after upping there mystical might and the middle east region of the world is often associated with dark arts and mumbojumbo when it comes to fiction.
In short the idea that key events in our world happened in the champions universe after suppers were unleashed just seems like madness.
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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I've read that issue and to be honest it never rung true with me there was just something about it that seemed false. and the idea of no body being crazy enough just doesn't fly when you look at marvels line up of villains.
As to the real world I'm honestly surprised it never crossed the minds of those paid to think about such things but that's a discussion we should probably stay clear of as I realise 9/11 is probably far to close to recent memory for most people.