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Giving us what we want is so simple.
smoochan
Posts: 2,564 Arc User
It's easy. Sure, in the long run we want more interesting mechanics to challenge us, but in the short run, do the simple thing.
Just double up everything on elite difficulty... health, damage, hold strengths, healing. If after a while that's not enough, just keep tweaking it upwards. Hell, I'm sure the devs can roll up some freeforms with unity gear and see what's feasable.
No new gear or rewards required. We'll pound on that while you guys think of something more creative.
^ hey anti-difficulty guys, notice how I only mentioned Elite difficulty? None of the others would even be touched, and you're not missing out on anything other than that challenge you hate so much. If you can't accept that, then you're just plain selfish or delusional.
Just double up everything on elite difficulty... health, damage, hold strengths, healing. If after a while that's not enough, just keep tweaking it upwards. Hell, I'm sure the devs can roll up some freeforms with unity gear and see what's feasable.
No new gear or rewards required. We'll pound on that while you guys think of something more creative.
^ hey anti-difficulty guys, notice how I only mentioned Elite difficulty? None of the others would even be touched, and you're not missing out on anything other than that challenge you hate so much. If you can't accept that, then you're just plain selfish or delusional.
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
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Here here! Totally agree.
Double (or more) everything in elite...we dont care about loot, we're bored due to lack of challenge! People have been leaving due to lack of challenge.
People are customers.
If you dont have customers,
you might not be able to afford that McDonalds across the street tomorrow.
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This was awesome while it lasted
_______________________________________________
and for the record... I don't bother with anything above normal, at least so far... if people want the supposed harder difficulties to be harder? that does not affect me in any meaningful way, so why would I oppose it?
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# If you enable the nightmare difficulty, every mob is going to get lvld up to 40. ^^
That way...the people who like Elite as it is...don't have to worry about anything.
VARIANT
"Nearly all men can withstand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power."
-Abraham Lincoln-
Because we don't already have enough difficulty settings, right?
- Normal
- Difficult
- Hard
- Very Hard
- Elite
I say we prune the list a bit:Easy
[*]Normal
[*]Elite
These are the settings we hear the most about anyway. I don't even remember the difference the Difficult setting brings compared to Normal.
Never used em, the loot is not in any way interesting and the difficulty between them is not even noticeable.
Normal
Very Hard
Elite
are all iv ever had to use, as they seem to me to represent noticeable increases in difficulty, but still not far enough.
-=-=-=-=-=-(CO in-game handle: @WarCan )-=-=-=-=-=-
"Okay, you're DEAD, what do you do NEXT?"
So I would only want a harder difficulty if appropriate and balanced rewards would come with it, otherwise it's just not a good idea.
And that is in the end the only real reason why some people are against higher difficulty,
since in the end it always ends with things like that.
I remember that even when they started with the whole thing in SL, most people said :
No .. we don't want better gear .. then i took a break just to note that now the beste gear
only came from elite, and that gear also had rendered all purples from Nemesis useless.
So .. you can have Elite x 1.000.000 or whatever .. as long as really the gear is the same.
As long as it doesn't take away from other things we want I'm fine with it.
If it's a choice between new content/leveling paths and a harder difficulty. NO.
Stick with creating new and needed content.
If there had never been a COH there would never have been a CO. :cool:
Elite Difficulty sound good to me, since I'm not greedy for power. However if many peoples wants it then, it won't hurt to do what they said, but..........
What the point of doing Elite if no better reward drops? Elite is good peoples want challenge I know, but not everyone want that kind of challenge. If they consider doing Elite then it's best to find a team for the last reward drops. PVPers love challenge while PVErs wants fun.
So increase difficulty on Elite but less or low reward drops then no one can enjoy but PVPers. But if both Difficulty and Reward Drops increase then people would have some energy left to enjoy the fun or just farm with a hard day
So................ there goes one of my lists..............
A few responses to this actually.
1) Some of us run adventure packs right now... for basically no reward beyond what little xp, resources, and questionite we get, and all of that could be gotten about a thousand times faster elsewhere. This suggestion is less about "risk vs reward", and is a lot more about "fun vs bored". If, for you, having more fun isn't in itself a worthy enough reward, then this suggestion was not made on your behalf.
2) What's the point of new gear? So we can farm the crap out of the new higher difficulty, get fully geared up, and then we're right back to square one with the content being boring and easy because we got more powerful? Sure, you could say you want to use this place to gear up for something else... but oh look, now that content is stupidly easy too and we've magically turned the game into even more of a bore fest. Adding better gear rewards turns this into a very very temporary solution... by not adding gear, we give it a bit of lasting power by forcing us to conquer it with build and play strategy, rather than numbers. Sure, we could add in the gear you normally get through silver recog.. but I'm sure someone would quickly point out that you can get that faster through the unity missions.
3) "Elite is good peoples want challenge I know, but not everyone want that kind of challenge." Then don't put the difficulty on Elite. The only thing you'll be missing out on is that challenge that you don't enjoy anyway. If, like you suggest, we add better gear rewards, then that just makes the people who don't want the challenge feel like they're missing out on something (because they will be), and the last thing we want to turn this game into is a bunch of people standing around showing off their gear trying to act like it matters.
I don't care about gear or currency. I want to be the hero I want to be and not have that make the game less enjoyable.
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
Exactly
In fairness, one of the reasons we never hear about ANY of the other difficulty settings is because currently they don't do anything. If we want any type of challenge in this game we have to go all the way to max difficulty (Elite) and STILL not be signficantly challenged by it. THAT is the reason we never hear about the others--if the hardcore, and even plenty of not so hardcore (like me), players already fail to meet a decent challenge in Elite mode, why even try the lower settings?
If Elite was so hard I actually find the content too difficult with it I might try a lower setting (cuz I sure as hell don't find the current "Normal" mode challenging enough). But as it is, I have to rely on Elite difficulty alone to still not have a significant challenge increase (unless I enter a Lair, which I usually don't do, and are more challenging than regular content regardless).
On topic, I can live with what the OP is asking. Though, lower difficulty settings than Elite (other than normal) should probably be included as well so that we finally have an adequate range of difficulties in this game.
Simply adding more numbers is a bad idea. For the time it takes to implement, there are things that can be done that effect a much greater number of players, and accomplish a great deal more.
Note: I'm not saying that an increase of difficulty is a bad thing, or that I'm against improving the effects of a difficulty slider. I'm saying that this particular method is a terrible way to go about it, and the good way to address the issue is incredibly unlikely due to the number and severity of other issues that need addressing.
I think you might have missed the point. The whole argument is "we don't care if something breaks because we can turn elite difficulty on and off at will". Therefore the sum total of what needs to be done is go into the database and change the values for elite. If double isn't enough then we'll ask for more later.
The whole point of the request is to limit it to elite only, nothing else, and thereby remove the need for any of what you mentioned.
I'm glad to see that so many people get what I'm saying.
Far as I can tell, Elite difficulty is primarily accomplished through a buff, the one we see on mobs in Elite, and that all that's really required is to adjust the numbers of that one buff. If that's not the case, then all they would really need to do is implement that buff and apply it to every mob in an Elite difficulty instance.
Like Gavinruneblade pointed out, they don't have to pick through it with a fine tooth comb. I'm asking for a quick'n'dirty sweep-of-the-hand approach that wouldn't take much time or resources, and would no doubt please a good portion of the population.
And all anyone will have to do to keep things exactly as they are now is set their difficulty to Very Hard. Hey listen, would you rather be an Elitist, or very hard? ~_^
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
Just because you say it's simple and it looks simple doesn't mean it actually is simple.
If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, smells like a duck, and ***** like a duck... it's a duck.
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
Nuuuu. First, taking something we have now, and risking breaking it because it doesn't fit with what some people want is beyond the pale. It doesn't matter if the impact is limited due to the ability to turn it off. If your change makes something literally unplayable, it's actually worse then doing nothing because you spend resources effectively eliminating a feature. Or on the flipside, you spend time, but the change you make doesn't actually increase the challenge.
Read my post again. It doesn't matter what the change is, it has to get production approval. That is development time. Second, if a change is made, it isn't as easy as "Just double everything". Say they double exactly everything, now VIPER's attacks bypass shields 100%, and Brickbusters debuff healing 100% with one hit. The change needs to be implemented properly, even if it's a small and easy change, else you end up with a repeat of both the Backup Device and Legacy device debacles except the othere way. Quick and dirty is exactly that. It's because of quick and dirty, and the tragic results that come from following that design "Philosophy" that producers have work, and that work is making darn sure that people are -not- doing thing in such a rank amature way.
A good example would be power balance changes. If what you said was true, Mr. Crush could pop out changes every build without consideration for production scheduals, resource allotment, or rational design. It's just a database tweak, he should be able to do them whenever and see how it works. It ends up bad, people get retcon tokens, they can hold off until he decides to change it back. Thing is, that's not how it works. Changes must be schedualed, approved, tested, and implemented properly.
This would be no exception.
Except for when it's supposed to be an Elephant, but the entity is calling the wrong database for it's model, animations, sounds, and sexual orientation.
Hmm, you got a point... LETS TRIPLE IT INSTEAD!
Actually a freeform can spike for well over 20,000 (quite easily too these days)
QUADRUPLE AT LEAST!
Im being serious! Elite is THAT much of a walk-over.
Now to not be serious:
unless its a witch
And best of all, you have no idea why it's a duck, and in fact, your program has no ducks in it. Computer programming can be an absolutely arcane art sometimes, and things that have nothing whatsoever to do with the thing you fiddle with change because of something you did.
Want a good example? Back on City of Heroes, one of the devs made a minor tweak. I think it was to the AI.
This AI tweak deleted all the doors in Grandville.
Computer programming is weird like that.
Wait? Whaaaa..?
At this point, i dont think any customers will return to tiny bug fixes and tweaks like you suggest. And by E-peen you mean like the vast majority who ARE asking for a difficulty up? You put yourself in a dark corner there.
Just what i was thinking.
First. Making E-peen comments does not make you clever, witty, or insightful. An increased difficulty slider isn't about "E-Peens", it's about engagement. If players are not engaged by gameplay, they won't play. CO has other things to engage players, and issues far more pressing than "Is max difficulty too easy?", so it's likely far down on the list of things to do.
Should difficulty be addressed? Yes, but not now with so many other issues that are far more pressing. Should it be an example of "Moar numbrs plox!!!"? No, that's quite simply silly.
Don't say vast majority when you don't know the player population, number of people for, and number of people against. You put yourself in an incredibly ignorable and ingnorant-looking corner there.
Well its funny, you see out of the vast majority in the past topics for difficulty increases, there's only a few people out of the WHOLE LOT who seem to bring up the same misguided or deluded points and throw insults to try and get the topic derailed.
Oh im sorry thats totally not what youre doing now. Is it?
There is no vast majority. There is you and the anecdotal support you dug up to agree with you in your entirely self-serving theory that the lack of players is because Cryptic didn't tailor the game to you instead of damned-obvious-for-three-years lack of substantial increase in the number of missions to offset the speed by which you can hit the level cap.
If you guys were honest about why you want these changes instead of presenting yourselves as the leaders of some silent majority of leet warriors you'd get more support. But since folks can smell the Grond-sized fecal piles coming out of you they're resisting.
You want your e-peen fluffed. You want to have the Elite difficulty made harder to achieve e that aim. There is nothing to be ashamed of about this and you don't need to keep lying about the demand for it so it seems less selfish of you.
Meh.
Wait? Whaaaa..?
Everybody else volunteered, douche, i dont even know them
Another one has gone delusional! Somebody get a straight jacket.
I told you to lay off the draysha boosts else you were gunna end up a slobbering halfwit.
The first part is more accurate at least. The vast majority of the dozen or so posters in the topics on difficulty increases were for it. That is not representative of the player population by any stretch of the imagination, and any magnificant leap made to try and assume it's representative, is doomed to fail.
Right now what I'm doing is approaching the situation from an objective position. I don't consider a difficulty increase a bad thing, but I understand that it is neither as easy as anyone has made it seem, or a rational thought to pick a number from the sub-cockle area without consideration to what it will actually do to gameplay.
Also I'm not being unreasonable when I say that, of all the things that need Dev time right now, a difficulty improvement is probably low on the list, and probably rightfully so.
My "Insults" were observations to the huge stretch that had to be made to say that a few posters in a few threads were representative of the player population as a whole, and yes when that type of behavior happens, one of the first gut reactions is to assume the person responsible has no clue what's going on, and is therefore ignorable.
Don't make that mistake. Stick to actual facts, and understand what's most likely.
We conducted several tests on the test server actually, and we were blasting through level 50s and 60s like they were nothing. The only critter that really delivered a sizable challenge was actually a level 60 teleiosaurus. So not sure doubling up on everything would work. I thnk there would have to be more mechanics to be offered other than pure tank and spank as most of the encounters are currently.
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On the other hand, folks who are threatened by the "accomplishments"* of others in a video game are just as immature, if not more, because they seem to be unable to accept that others have fun in ways that they don't, and feel the need to characterize those folks as "bad people" for it.
Like I said, if you can't accept Elite difficulty being for people who actually want a challenge, then you're just plain selfish and delusional.
* - note, I placed quotation marks around accomplishments here because it's just some stuff people did in a video game.
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
Yes, I agree, and those mechanics are a fantastic thing to look forward to in the long term. This is an idea for something to cover the gap between now and then.
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
I speak for myself, and the folks who agree with me, of which I know there is more than one, hence my use of the pronoun we. I don't try to give any sort of percent of the population because it doesn't matter.
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
Just wondering if changing every single enemy in the game is actually as simple as it might seem.
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The one who can't shut up formerly known as 4rksakes
About the @handle - it's a long story.
Profound quote.. "I'm not a complete idiot - several parts are missing."
No People are leaving due to lack of content. People are bored due to there being nothing else to do once you did all the zones, grab all the loot, and do all the alerts and comic series.
Pretty much this.
And you don't think that part of the reason for this is that almost everyone that plays is able to easily breeze through all the content that's already here?
Let's not rehash this again.
I think the biggest issue that needs to be addressed is the big gap in power among players. While some are able to solo pretty much everything others have trouble to manage basic content.
Causes?
many from differences between ATs and freeform, though equipment(including awesome devices) to skill.
I don't think it is a good idea to divide population and give the sensation of elite people without giving some path or hope to reach that status. If not, it would be like having a VIP server, which imho didn't work too well for CoH
Make a poll on the game. Ask some random lvl 40 players which of them have done Andrith, Mandragalore and Therakiel Temple at least a couple times and if they did it how they felt about them. That might give us some idea of what is the real status on perceived difficulty on this game.
They have a path given. its called subscribing or getting a freeform slot. And people put hard work into building toons that can solo those kinds of places. There is nothing unfair about it. You want a toon to be as good as those "Elite" put int he same time and effort they do, search the forums and ask how they did it.
Plus people leave for both the difficulty and the amount of content we have. its not hard and there is not alot of it. both equal out to people running through it in no time.
A few people being able to solo 5-man content like a boss is not why most players don't really team up to do 5-man content outside of Nemcon in the first place.
You can thank crippling bugs and shoddy teaming mechanics for that.
I agree that this might be the main reason people leave or barely play the game anymore (at least for me), but I think that lack of challenge only aggravates the issue. Granted, if it comes down to either a significant (playable) content expansion or a difficulty review, I'd take the content. But an increase in challenge could help me enjoy that content better and not run through all of it so fast. It might also give me more incentive to run it again.
I'm not rehashing anything. Someone commented about running out of things to do too quickly. You know as well as I do that if the game is too easy that means people are running through all available content even faster.