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Responses on My 'Super' Tank
thekazekami
Posts: 21 Arc User
After hearing about the Internal Dampening Field Power I had an idea to create a sort of 'Super Tank' that could go into a fight, shrug off most damage while attracting most of the attention. I'm a CoH refugee so I'm STILL learning some of the ins and outs of the CO combat system, but I think I have enough to get it right.
The idea was to start Invulnerability with it damage resistance and damage reduction and enhance it with IDF's damage reduction and use Defensive Combo's ability to grant a stack of Defiance to raise my resistance further. Enrage is there mostly for solo play and when I need to worry more about dishing damage then taking it. The Energy attacks are more for theme than anything else, but I gave Force Blast Crippling Challenge as a ranged 'taunt' power. Field Surge is there as sort of an 'oh crap' power and to further raise my life span, but I can swap it out if I find something better.
PowerHouse (Link to this build)
Name: Invicibelle
Archetype: Freeform
Super Stats:
Level 6: Constitution (Primary)
Level 10: Strength (Secondary)
Level 15: Recovery (Secondary)
Talents:
Level 1: Superhuman
Level 6: Physical Conditioning
Level 9: Quick Recovery
Level 12: Relentless
Level 15: Paramilitary Training
Level 18: Boundless Reserves
Level 21: Enduring
Powers:
Level 1: Clobber (Onslaught)
Level 1: Defensive Combo (Rank 2, Crippling Challenge)
Level 6: Mighty Leap
Level 8: Invulnerability (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 11: Uppercut (Rank 2)
Level 14: Enrage
Level 17: Bountiful Chi Resurgence (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 20: Inertial Dampening Field (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 23: Force Blast (Rank 2, Crippling Challenge)
Level 26: Retaliation
Level 29: Havoc Stomp (Rank 2)
Level 32: Aggressor (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 35: Force Cascade (Rank 2)
Level 38: Field Surge (Rank 2)
Travel Powers:
Level 6: Flight
Level 35: Athletics
Specializations:
Constitution: Unyielding (2/2)
Constitution: Fuel My Fire (1/3)
Constitution: Tough (3/3)
Constitution: Resilient (2/2)
Constitution: Armored (2/2)
Protector: Fortified Gear (3/3)
Protector: Bulwark (2/2)
Protector: Debilitating Challenge (2/2)
Protector: Exhausting Strikes (2/2)
Protector: Resolute (1/3)
Warden: Fortified Gear (3/3)
Warden: Elusive (2/2)
Warden: Tenacious (2/2)
Warden: The Best Defense (3/3)
Mastery: Constitution Mastery (1/1)
The idea was to start Invulnerability with it damage resistance and damage reduction and enhance it with IDF's damage reduction and use Defensive Combo's ability to grant a stack of Defiance to raise my resistance further. Enrage is there mostly for solo play and when I need to worry more about dishing damage then taking it. The Energy attacks are more for theme than anything else, but I gave Force Blast Crippling Challenge as a ranged 'taunt' power. Field Surge is there as sort of an 'oh crap' power and to further raise my life span, but I can swap it out if I find something better.
PowerHouse (Link to this build)
Name: Invicibelle
Archetype: Freeform
Super Stats:
Level 6: Constitution (Primary)
Level 10: Strength (Secondary)
Level 15: Recovery (Secondary)
Talents:
Level 1: Superhuman
Level 6: Physical Conditioning
Level 9: Quick Recovery
Level 12: Relentless
Level 15: Paramilitary Training
Level 18: Boundless Reserves
Level 21: Enduring
Powers:
Level 1: Clobber (Onslaught)
Level 1: Defensive Combo (Rank 2, Crippling Challenge)
Level 6: Mighty Leap
Level 8: Invulnerability (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 11: Uppercut (Rank 2)
Level 14: Enrage
Level 17: Bountiful Chi Resurgence (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 20: Inertial Dampening Field (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 23: Force Blast (Rank 2, Crippling Challenge)
Level 26: Retaliation
Level 29: Havoc Stomp (Rank 2)
Level 32: Aggressor (Rank 2, Rank 3)
Level 35: Force Cascade (Rank 2)
Level 38: Field Surge (Rank 2)
Travel Powers:
Level 6: Flight
Level 35: Athletics
Specializations:
Constitution: Unyielding (2/2)
Constitution: Fuel My Fire (1/3)
Constitution: Tough (3/3)
Constitution: Resilient (2/2)
Constitution: Armored (2/2)
Protector: Fortified Gear (3/3)
Protector: Bulwark (2/2)
Protector: Debilitating Challenge (2/2)
Protector: Exhausting Strikes (2/2)
Protector: Resolute (1/3)
Warden: Fortified Gear (3/3)
Warden: Elusive (2/2)
Warden: Tenacious (2/2)
Warden: The Best Defense (3/3)
Mastery: Constitution Mastery (1/1)
Post edited by thekazekami on
0
Comments
Like I said, I'm still kinda new to CO's combat system.
I put in REC because I'm not using Defiance and it's natural energy building.
Still, CC in Havoc can't hurt.
That said, consider Resurgence and Masterful Dodge as your two Active Defenses and also Ego Surge with Adv for another Active Offense. The heal on crit spec "Adrenaline Rush" is also good as is "Endorphin Rush" on Enraged power. And Unleashed Rage is a good power to have with Enraged.
Here is my "Super Tank" build that adds DPS and heal support for the team.
http://co-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=179351
An energy unlock power would be the ticket. They're so powerful that you're only allowed 1.
Taking Masterful Dodge will greatly improve your survival. Bountiful Chi resurgence is a good self healing but to maximize the effect you will need good dodge ability. Conviction is another self heal power which is pretty useful that can heal you for 800+hp at one shot at rank 3 for tank role. It has recharge time from 2 seconds~5 seconds depending on your gear and superstat Intelligence. Recovery is very useful if you have an energy unlock to keep recharging your energy. Inaddition to that, conviction can critically heal, so if you plan to go for critical chance, you can consider Conviction. RoomSweeper is a might power where you can quickly generate enrage stacks cause it can give you at least one stack or more stacks of enrage when you strike enemies with it.
The only think i couldnt find, do the stacks of Defiance also get DR, or Invuln is the only one in that?
There is no such thing as a free lunch. If you aren't paying for it, you aren't the customer; you are the product being sold.
Dollar, dollar, bill, yo. Cash rules everything around you and me.
Nope. The real difference is the endurance return from defiance which pretty much lets you fire off all your click heals every moment they're off cooldown...without the help of other endurance granting powers. Its like getting a combo deal
Per ayonachan ...
164~ CON is 15% resist per stack of Defiance.
202~ CON is 16% resist per stack of Defiance.
249~ CON is 17% resist per stack of Defiance.
308~ CON is 18% resist per stack of Defiance.
385~ CON is 19% resist per stack of Defiance.
489~ CON is 20% resist per stack of Defiance.
Defiance stacks up to 6.
With damage resistance, it is:
dam_raw * (1 / (1 + resist%)) = dam_taken
Example: 1000 raw damage * (1 / (1 + 1.20)) = 454~ damage taken, assuming you have 120% resist.
308~ CON is a reasonable target at level 40. 489~ CON is less reasonable but still achievable.
There is no such thing as a free lunch. If you aren't paying for it, you aren't the customer; you are the product being sold.
Dollar, dollar, bill, yo. Cash rules everything around you and me.
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Serving since September, 2009 / 65 Characters, 63 Level 40's
With rank 6 mods on the purple heroic gears and some good secondary gears, your Invulnerability should have 160 flat damage reduction and 72% resistance.
For defiance, each stack can give you 19% resistance if you have rank 6 mods in your level 40 purple heroic gears and some good secondary gears. The resistance is dependent on your concentration. Thay can stack up to 6 stacks. So, 6*19%=114% resistance.
As overall, defiance has better defense system against huge damage from boss type monsters.
Afaik flat dmg reduction goes first so:
(1000 - 160) / 1.72 = 488 dmg
1000 / 2.14 = 467 dmg
Now i got no idea what normal hard hitting stuff is, but assuming your HP at 40 is around 10k (i think?), is that even noticable?
Hmm never thought about endurance return.
Flat reduction goes last.
It's also a very noticeable difference. Defiance completely outclasses Invulnerability for big hits at the higher levels. It's not even close unless someone uses Defiance and doesn't stack Con. And by big hits we're not talking triple digit attack numbers. Thousands and above.
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Demon Keypo's Building Guide
Freeform Builds Directory (Last updated: 04/23/2016)
Serving since September, 2009 / 65 Characters, 63 Level 40's
My Invulnerability tank is having 380 defense which grants 90% resistance. Invulnerability itself grants 160 flat damage reduction and 72% resistance. He has 10k+ hp. When Gravitar pop yellow bubble and I don't block, it can hit me 48k damage. So basically, Defiance is much more better than Invulnerability since the damage is so huge.
Some people worry that Defiance is not very effective against mobs like arena guards in the nemesis confrontation. Anyway to overcome this problem, just take either Masterful Dodge/ Unbreakable/Resurgence as active defense will help a lot in the survival. Also, just add a good self healing power that will be fine. Each of my tanks can survive pretty long after I pull the whole room of arena guards in a nemesis room for the Nemesis Confrontation.
To put that in perspective (using the defensive numbers you used earlier)
Defiance: 5000 / 2.14 = 2336
Invul: 5000 / 1.72 - 160 = 2747
Invul is very good at handling trash mobs who tend to deal damage somewhere in the 300-500 range with some ~1k burst hits and the occasional crit. But Defiance pulls away once you get to the heavy hitters.
From my combatlogparser I can tell you that:
The red is how much damage my hp takes and the white numbers are the base damage of the attacks that hit me.
Crushing,,2113.41,5796.29
Crushing,Critical,2798.52,7675.29
Crushing,,3456.97,12632
Crushing,,8303.39,22773
Crushing,Dodge|Block,269.186,16221.4
Crushing,Dodge,1197.86,14614.9
Crushing,Dodge,1108.57,14437.4
Crushing,Block,1864.21,21448.3
Crushing,Block,1338.88,19270.9
Crushing,Dodge,2012.91,19733
Crushing,Block,1307.05,19520.7
Crushing,Dodge|Block,2005.86,80763.6
The combat log is old and I cannot tell you exactly what was going on or how many defiance stacks I had on or even what, if any, aura buffs were on me. But the log does show dodges, blocks, and even criticals and when something kills something.
I know invul for me is around 75% and 140 flat mitigation so here is an estimate of what I would take with invul.
Crushing,,2346.51,5796.29
Crushing,Critical,3126.08,7675.29
Crushing,,5235.32,12632
Crushing,,9550.64,22773
I didn't include LK into the equation since I 'can't' because I truly don't know the exact mitigation of LK....and I don't know when my defiance used LK for those numbers...
BUT only very few PvE bosses can hit 10-100k damage to you. And 90% of the time you will spend dealing with trash mobs and slightly stronger trash mobs. You would be better off using Invul (for me it is just a 33% resistance difference and I am bias...I love my defiance..) I say, ignore the numbers and junk and make all the mistakes you can now so you can look back on yourself later and grin from ear to ear due to your success from trial and error. If anything, all you need to know is that defiance scales on con and every other defense passive scales on your super stats(whatever they may be)
Thats why AT the behemoth having Unbreakable as active defense. When you activate unbreakable, all the ordinary monster cant even hurt you by mile when it match with Defiance. For a freeform, the player can take Intelligence to greatly lower down the recharge time. If gear up properly and have Intelligence as secondary supersat, the active defense can cool down by 39 seconds. If use a legion gear, then it will be even lower.
I can see replacing Field Surge with Masterful Dodge anyway.
Roomsweeper is fun, but it's kind of annoying to have to chase down everything you just sent flying away.
Uppercut/Havoc Stomp tend to be my Enrage builders for that reason.
When XP earnings during a Double-XP Weekend still feel like I'm underperforming,
there's something terribly wrong with the reward system...
You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Original Join Date: Feb 2010.
Due to various unknown factors for my data I cannot give you a direct answer BUT from experience block is on its own layer. I can guess that my block is either 270% or 320% since I used LK.
My avoidance was either 61.9%+(MD1 for certain numbers) or 77.4%+(MD1 for certain numbers) but I do not know if I had legion gear at the time or not..If I did have legion gear then I wouldn't know if I had my rank 4 avoidance in it or 2 gambler's...so eh..
But yea, Dodge comes first then block? then your passive+defense+10%fromtankrole+LK
People use Block?
j/k
Defiance with IDF and dodge/avoid thrown in makes for one tough toon.
Also I'm not sure why you chose Cascade. Not only did you not even rank it to 3, with the SS you've chosen you won't even be able to afford to fully charge it outside of the times Aggressor is off CD. I'd drop it entirely. Don't rank force blast. As your CC carrier it's base damage is too low anyway. Also be aware that Bountiful Chi lowers your damage by a flat 10% for each instance of it you have running. This is basically the equivalent of half a rank. Threat based is partly on how much damage you deal so be very careful not to stack it and lower your damage too much.
Watch your advantage points in general. If an attack is meant to be a primary source of damage, rank it to 3. Be sure to max rank at least your main travel power. It'll make combat much easier. I'd recommended staying away from flight in a melee build and sticking to your second choice in athletics. The latter is much better in combat. You do not have a power with the challenging strikes advantage. I'd suggest dropping one of your two CC carrying powers for it though you do have other options as well. You can put it on Havoc Stomp if you'd like.
Good advice all around.
And yes, I know I cannot use IDF and Enrage at the same time. The plan is to use whichever I need at the moment, IDF for tanking and Enrage for damage/solo play.
My Invulnerability tank is using Strength, Constitution and Intelligence as superstat. I use Intelligence because I have lower recharge time for both Masterful Dodge and Resurgence. Because of that, I add some points to Recovery with my talents.
My Regeneration tank is using Strength, Constitution and Recovery as superstats. For this tank, I only use Resurgence as active defense. I have devour essence to heal myself pretty fast while doing damage.
How does raising Strength and Con increase your starting energy?
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
_______________________________
The user formerly known as Dr. Sage.
_______________________________
Errr 126% avoidance??? Percent? Really? Not that I can remember.
But basicly, the numbers in your character screen are pre-DR? Thats kinda stupid for anyone who's number crunching...
I noticed that Eye of the Storm is giving a bubble too, and each tik it refresh the shield. Wouldnt that be a viable setup along with perhaps Defiance of Lightning reflexes? As you 'absorb' the incomming damage, while you can use your bountiful Chi as healing in the duration (specialy on lightning reflexes).
By stat-ing Recovery.
So something like Str/con/rec over something like Str/con/int, then.
That's kind of what I figured from your post, but wanted to make sure.
I use Str/con/rec on my Might/MA tank. I'd use Int on a more cooldown-heavy build, but that particular build isn't.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
_______________________________
The user formerly known as Dr. Sage.
_______________________________
Yes, Rank 3 MD "Adds" 126% avoidance BUT your actual avoidance is not 126%.
Here is another re-post from the past:
Rank 3 LR(470+50%) + Rank 3 MD(126%) + 369 Avoidance + 21% grants 90.2% AVOIDANCE
Rank 3 MD(126%) + 21% grants 63.2% AVOIDANCE
139 Avoidance + 21% grants 61.9% AVOIDANCE
To give you a hint on how good avoidance is here is how much damage I took with just 63.2% I had no defense/resistance at all(Just used r3 masterful dodge+swingingw/flippin' and no gear on whatsoever)
[Combat (Self)] You lose 69 (188) Fire Damage from an unknown ability.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 138 (375) Fire Damage from Yellow Beam.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 276 (750) Fire Damage from Green Beam.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 553 (1500) Fire Damage from Blue Beam.
[Combat (Self)] Mega-Destroid Terminator deals 5115 (13888) Particle Damage to you with an unknown ability.
[Combat (Self)] Mega-Destroid Terminator deals 7206 (19565) Particle Damage to you with Eye Beams.
88.9% Avoidance + 19% Defense
[Combat (Self)] You lose 16 (188) Fire Damage from Red Beam.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 32 (375) Fire Damage from an unknown ability.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 65 (750) Fire Damage from an unknown ability.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 129 (1500) Fire Damage from Blue Beam.
90.2% Avoidance + 19% Defense
[Combat (Self)] You lose 14 (188) Fire Damage from Red Beam.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 28 (375) Fire Damage from Yellow Beam.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 57 (750) Fire Damage from Green Beam.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 113 (1500) Fire Damage from Blue Beam.
[Combat (Self)] Mega-Destroid Terminator deals 2026 (20776) Particle Damage to you with Eye Beams.
And here is 100% Resistance to all damage (Came from only using Experimental Artificial Life Injection...destroid has defense penetration so I can't show you those numbers)
[Combat (Self)] You lose 94 (188) Fire Damage from Red Beam.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 188 (375) Fire Damage from Yellow Beam.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 377 (750) Fire Damage from Green Beam.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 753 (1500) Fire Damage from an unknown ability
Finally my 6-stacked 18% defiance with 35% defense from gear, 10% defense from tank role and 25% defense from 3 armadillo secondaries so 178% all together.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 69 (188) Fire Damage from Red Beam.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 138 (375) Fire Damage from an unknown ability.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 277 (750) Fire Damage from Green Beam.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 554 (1500) Fire Damage from Blue Beam.
Highest avoidance I have ever had was 97.8%...Wish I had my pts gear for it..
Yeah I double checked just now and I am pretty sure it is 126% avoidance but as I said 126% does not mean you won't get any damage. As you know I have a single blade using Masterful Dodge at rank 3 and he is getting 500~1000 damage from blue bubble even he is blocking. So, that means 126% does not mean you won't get hurt.
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But the above isn't truly needed since there isn't anything in co pve-wise that would really require having that much thought into mitigation. Still it would make for one impressive tank.
1) Regeneration as passive
He has 10k+ hp, having 410 defense(grants 97% resistance), Resurgence heals me around 6k hp and boost the self heal from regeneration, devour essence with the advantage that can heal me 300+hp every 0.5 seconds. I also use nanobot swarm which quickly reduce the recharge time on resurgence and it also heals me some hp with the advantage point. Because I am using the gizmo in the Miniaturization Drive to make my character large during combat, so sometimes I can solo Gravitar sometime I fail to do so. If I replace it with either Masterful Dodge or someother self heal, I am pretty sure I can solo Graviitar in case everyone got killed.
Invulnerability
This tank is having 380defense(grants 90% resistance), having Resurgence and Masterful dodge and Conviction. However, this tank cant solo Gravitar cause Invulnerability is not so effective against huge damage and my self heal can't keep up with the damage from Gravitar if everyone is down. He also has around 10k hp. Superstat=Str/Con/Int.
with str/con/rec for Brick I have all the cooldown reduction I need.
I actually use plentiful of avoidance on my room. I use a avoidance gear with r5 avoidance core and with r1 MD I get 77.1% avoidance. Using revitalize from int spec tree and nanobot swarm, my MD is almost permanent giving me the dodge which I need. Stack with invulnerability (75% dmg resistance) and gear with spec tree for another 44% this brings it down to only 10.45% of any incoming attacks assuming no defense penetration. This is then subtracted from the dmg absorption of invulnerabilty. Now with all the dodging going on, add BCR with RR to give about 3 stacks of BCR healing for about 450hp every 2 seconds and if you are being bombarded with attacks then 450 every .5 seconds, this will make you pretty unkillable except during the very short lapse in MD.
I don't remember the exact number..I think I wrote it down somewhere or something but I can't find it right now..ANYWAY! The lowest that I have tried to get them down to is 22 seconds with around 8ish second between them I believe...
Avoidance penetration would make for a hell of an advantage....but hey, blue sky and sunshine `till then.
Yes it is possible but that requires alot of INT and probably the use of AoAC which although gives perma AD but will not have any additional damage resistance from say invul or defiance which will make the build less tanky imo.
70-90% dodge 100% of the time along with invul passive but 'lower' hp or 70-90% dodge 80% of the time with 'higher' hp along with invul passive.
Which one would you pick?
AoAC isn't useful at all(sadly)
26 second AO/AD require 691 Int 389+93 Cd reduction.(I didn't get the protector tree nor vindi tree but I did get expertise 2 from the int tree)
Hp-wise you are walking around with ~5.5k but as for what your defenses can be:
(For me)
79% 169 Invulnerability(3)
77.2%-82.3% Avoidance
25% Defense from Gear
The funny part is when you figure out what 691 int really is..
I use warden tree and vindicator so gear gives me 44% DR and invul gives 75%. Avoidance with MD R1 is 77.1%. HP in hybrid is 10k plus and tank mode brings it to 12k plus.
What is important also is because of con stacking, i can use ego surge + nimble mind to give me 80 plus % with crit gear crit chance with 75% severity. This significantly boosted my heal from conviction and damage from unleashed rage and neuroelectric pulse generators. Lost quite a bit of heal and UR damage with the imbue nerf so had to compensate for it.
691 INT? 6 R9 int mods gives 133*3 plus 3 vigi gear another 132 plus pri int 80 plus talents 12+8+5+5+5 maybe throw in 1 or 2 growth amulet R9 not sure how many stat points it gives at R9 and the starting base 5. Going aopm will be able to outdo this of course to go into the 700 range
Highest int I have ever had(Solo) would be 910. Nothing of significance came from this..Concentration was 32/16 (I think..don't really remember..)
Always enlightening reading your posts, very informative .
Sorry for asking this noob question.
Thanks for the information, I know Aura of Primal Majesty, just don't know its short form xd.
eww. :P I prefer moar strength and constitution over INT any day.