Cosmic Keys - you want HOW much??!

sinhani · November 2012

It seems like there's an awful lot of drops in CO now that require Cosmic Keys to unlock them.

I currently have a huge stash of lockboxes in my shared bank account, courtesy of my five characters of varying levels. When I realised I needed Cosmic Keys to open them I looked for them in the C-Store - as a Gold Member I get 500zen per month to play with, so I thought, why not? Until I saw how much Cryptic were charging for said keys...

100zen EACH? Seriously? :eek:

Considering the ridiculously high drop rate of lockboxes, isn't that viciously expensive? I've collected 40 of the things since the Halloween Event, which was less than a month ago - and I'm a fairly casual player. Even if I 'took advantage' of the 'special offer' of 10 keys for 900zen, that would still entail me spending over thirty quid to open all 40 lockboxes - that's half my weekly food shopping budget! I don't have that kind of money to burn on virtual stuff, as I'd imagine a lot of people don't right now.

I don't mind spending my zen on costume sets, items and the like, because at least with them I know exactly what I'm getting before I buy. But with these lockboxes there's no way of knowing whether they contain something fantastic or something completely useless - and I'm sorry, but I feel that 100zen a time is way too much to spend on a gamble. That fact that I'm getting practically buried in blimmin' lockboxes every time I play also indicates to me that the ratio of crap to epic is probably weighted more heavily on the side of crap, which makes the 100zen price tag even harder to swallow.

If lockboxes are going to be dished out like Haribos from Poundland, then surely 10 Cosmic Keys for 100zen is a fairer price? I'd pay that without a quibble. But 100 - for just one? On yer bike, Cryptic - my family have gotta eat first!

flyingfinn · November 2012

Good thing is, that you don't have to open that 40 lockboxes. Actually you don't have to open a single box.
Keys aren't meant to be fair, Keys are meant to be money.
To PW.
To NWO.

Or you could just eat less.

crypticbuxom · November 2012

100G is a pretty decent in game price.

Oh...you said Zen.

sinhani · November 2012

flyingfinn wrote: »

Good thing is, that you don't have to open that 40 lockboxes. Actually you don't have to open a single box.
Keys aren't meant to be fair, Keys are meant to be money.
To PW.
To NWO.

Or you could just eat less.

True, true, true and true.

...Anybody wanna buy 40 lockboxes offa me then? Anyone..? No..? Oh hey, where'd you all go..?

And yeah, I could eat less. Or I could stop paying my bills. Or dress my son in bin liners when he grows out of his clothes. Oooh, so many choices, which one..?

I'm not saying lockboxes are a crime against humanity or anything - CO is, after all, just a game. And if this new and rather exploitative mechanic mushrooms into something that actively prevents my enjoyment of this game I can simply walk away from it and look for an alternative - taking my monthly sub with me. I'm sure they wouldn't miss me a jot...

I guess I just had this crazy, Horatio Algier-esque idea that if Cryptic charged less zen for keys, more people would buy more of them - because getting right royally shafted for 10zen a time is not as painful as getting right royally shafted for 100. As any professional (i.e. good at it) gambler will tell you: in order to win, you should only bet what you can afford to lose.

flyingfinn · November 2012

Well, some people had this Horatio Caine-sque idea that if Cryptic would just put the stuff from Lock Boxes to also in Z-store, more people would buy them more. Because paying actually something you want makes more sense to some people.
And what an actual professional gambler would tell you: house allways wins.
But then again i'm just shooting from the hip, without any actual knowledge.

haleakala · November 2012

sinhani wrote: »

I guess I just had this crazy, Horatio Algier-esque idea that if Cryptic charged less zen for keys, more people would buy more of them - because getting right royally shafted for 10zen a time is not as painful as getting right royally shafted for 100. As any professional (i.e. good at it) gambler will tell you: in order to win, you should only bet what you can afford to lose.

Businesses drop merchandise prices to: get you into the store so they can entice you to buy something else; because the manufacturer reduces the wholesale cost to the business; to get rid of surplus in cases where supply outweighs demand; I'm sure there are other reasons, but none of the three I listed apply. Perfect Cryptic probably based the prices on keys go for in STO or other PW games.

fantasycharacter · November 2012

You want goodies, you buy cosmic key, only 100 zen, lucky lucky! SPECIAL FOR YOU ONLY!

underchicken · November 2012

For all that is holy Sinhani, DON'T LOOK at the prices Rank up Catalysts and Freeform slots are going for. I don't want your heart to burst out of your chest, run across the room, grab a gun, and shoot itself. Could be messy.... ya know?

Seriously though, prices are whack.

man515drake · November 2012

I have to agree the drop rate for lock boxes is ridicules if I opened every lock box that dropped I would have to be amazingly wealthy and stupid.

I ran a couple of AP and kept a tally sheet on the boxes that dropped it was 52 boxes. That would be 5200 zen after just one days play muliply that by 7 for a weekly spend it would be 36400 zen.

That is 3640 USD I believe and I don't believe anybody would spend that amount of money.

The drop rate seems to be this high only to make sure you don't forget lock boxes exist. I don't think even PW or Cryptic expect you to open them all.

underchicken · November 2012

man515drake wrote: »

The drop rate seems to be this high only to make sure you don't forget lock boxes exist. I don't think even PW or Cryptic expect you to open them all.

But they can sure rub them all up in your face saying, " HEY! You know you want these new shinies! Just buy a few of these keys! COME ON! So what if there's only a 1% chance to even get what you want out that box!" :rolleyes:

docclarksavagejr · November 2012

I have a few unopened lockboxes myself, and I somehow find I'm in NO hurry to open them.

Count me on the bandwagon of "Cosmic Keys BAD!".

blkmask · November 2012

Add me to the idea that Cosmic Keys being 100 zen is BAD!!!!

I am also a subscriber and I have never opened a lockbox because the price is too high. I for one have always thought if the price of a Cosmic Key was only 10 zen I would open some on a regular basis. But 100 zen is just plain crazy.

gandales · November 2012

A few things about lockboxes and their keys:

1) They are a way to put things at a higher price without most people really notice it. If you take a set of lockboxes rewards as a package you realize that even if it is debatable that the extra things(buffs, mods, etc) you can get from them has its value, they are something thta under normal conditions the player would not buy them. So for PW would never be a better deal to sell those things on the zstore at least not at a price people would not start crying about.

2) The existanse of lockboxes is mainly about advertisement(compared to grab bags) and its drop rate needs to secure availability, i.e. that basically nobody would stop buying a key becasue lack of lockboxes.

3) if you get 1 or 10 for 100 zen, it comes down to the chances you get by the gambling package.

wacky99 · November 2012

I've got something like 140 of them sitting in my hideout storage cupboard. I've been deleting any new boxes I get, because I know that I don't want what's in them, and like the OP, I despise the gambling aspect of it all.

If Cryptic offered the actual mods in packs for the same price as a key, I'm sure people would be happy to lash out every now and then.

Also - the drop rate seems to be dodgy - it seems to replace an item, not appear as a new item alongside an existing drop. An example - I completed the "Lemurian Antiquities" mission (the mission where your first nemesis appears at level 25). I had 8 drops for the whole mission, 4 hovertank lucky dip boxes and 4 primus commendations. You can't tell me that if, as Cryptic state, these boxes were in addition to normal drops, I would have only received 4 primus commendations? I've done that mission lots of times and it's usually pretty decent for item drops.

starboardnacelle · November 2012

To put things in perspective, they cost 125 Zen over in Star Trek Online. You actually get one more key per month with the same stipend.

theravenforce · November 2012

It would be nice if Cosmic Keys could drop from Cosmic Villains or be part of certain mission rewards, you know the ones which people rarely do now that Alerts come along, it could make people explore CO more.

Just a thought..

crypticbuxom · November 2012

theravenforce wrote: »

It would be nice if Cosmic Keys could drop from Cosmic Villains or be part of certain mission rewards, you know the ones which people rarely do now that Alerts come along, it could make people explore CO more.

Just a thought..

Well the more that new players play content and get used to seeing new content for said keys, the more the player base will demand more content over the shlock of cash grab items. Don't want them to get too used to playing the actual game to demand more of it.

serendipitynow · November 2012

the tako boxes are insane, theres about a 2% chance of getting legion gear per box (the only really worthwhile item in them) and there are, if i remember correctly 14 or 15 types of legion gear, so to have a good chance of getting the piece you want thats 50x14= 700 boxes needing $700 of keys!

I did a run of 1000 on test and still didnt get 1 of every piece of legion gear - that would be $900 and still not getting what you want (if its the one that didnt drop for example in my test) - Thats beyond ridiculous, $900 for an item you still dont get!

Thats another reason legion gear should go on the nemesis vendor or questionite store - too much randomness when trying to fit so many rares into 1 box. Both the stores need some serious new good additions to them afterall.

The vehicle box is a lot better designed, roughly 1% chance of any of the 3 vehicles, and no further randomising (done over 600 of these on test)

jolokia13 · November 2012

The pricing on these keys is just unbelievable compared to the odds you are facing.

I'll spend my dollar on a scratch off ticket. Better odds!!

jonsills · November 2012

jolokia13 wrote: »

The pricing on these keys is just unbelievable compared to the odds you are facing.

I'll spend my dollar on a scratch off ticket. Better odds!!

Better rewards, too.

BTW, did you know that poor kitten is being chased by a couple of wastits? (That's the evil carnivorous cousin of the wastem...)

tithlonias · November 2012

I'm in with you guys. I have a lifetime subscription and I've shelled out enough cash on top of that to get all of the costume packs and nearly all of the travel powers. I'm not paying $1 to roll the dice... maybe I would on a lottery ticket but that's real life and the reward for a winning lottery ticket is far greater than a virtual object in an old MMO.

Thankfully, I have no alts who would have a vehicle, thematically speaking so it should be fairly easy for me to just destroy any lockboxes I get. I wonder if the devs keep track of how many lockboxes just get dropped instead of unlocked; it might provide them a clue as to how effective this strategy (cash grab) is.

theravenforce · November 2012

jolokia13 wrote: »

The pricing on these keys is just unbelievable compared to the odds you are facing.

I'll spend my dollar on a scratch off ticket. Better odds!!

Thanks to that image I am NEVER buying a lockbox key again!

Besides, you'll never kick my kitty!!!!!!!

(Yes I have a kitten called Tawny

)

haleakala · November 2012

tithlonias wrote: »

Thankfully, I have no alts who would have a vehicle, thematically speaking so it should be fairly easy for me to just destroy any lockboxes I get. I wonder if the devs keep track of how many lockboxes just get dropped instead of unlocked; it might provide them a clue as to how effective this strategy (cash grab) is.

Nope, there's only one stat they need, sales of keys. Destroyed lock-boxes are irrelevant to them. It sorta reminds me of the old Fritos commercial. As long as keys are selling, "destroy all you want, we'll make more."

brianblack8281 · November 2012

I have 230 lock boxes in my shared bank (earned since Halloween), half are Taco boxes and the other is the new Tank boxes. With the free Zen (500 Zen) I get each month and the amount of Q I trade for Zen (about 400 Zen per month) that would equal out to be about 9 keys I can buy. The only way I could open them all is to open my wallet and spend until I have no money left, so good bye rent money.

My idea would be to sell them for
1. 15 Zen each for "F2P" players.
2. 10 Zen each for "Gold Subscription" players and 3 free keys per month with the 500 Zen stipend.
3. 10 Zen each for "Gold Life Time" players and 5 free keys per month with the 500 Zen stipend.

And make the Lock Boxes a Rare drop instead of the current Common drop.

To me this would be fair.

ashensnow · November 2012

brianblack8281 wrote: »

My idea would be to sell them for
1. 5 Zen each for "F2P" players.
2. 10 Zen each for "Gold Subscription" players and 3 free keys per month with the 500 Zen stipend.
3. 10 Zen each for "Gold Life Time" players and 5 free keys per month with the 500 Zen stipend.

Perhaps I am missing something but wouldn't this mean that subscribers would pay more than F2Pers when buying 8 or more keys ?

F2P (8 keys) = 40z
Sub (5 keys + 3 free = 8 keys) = 50z

Since lockboxes, in general, are designed around the a low chance to get what you want in order to encourage (all but require actually) one to buy them in significant numbers to get what one wants the suggested pricing model suggests that subscribers pay more than F2Pers for the same desired items from the lockboxes.

Why should subscribers have to pay more than non subscribers for the same thing ?

lsya · November 2012

I hate the whole lockbox/key thing.

Even with free zen every month, I will never spend any on keys. It's a waste.

brianblack8281 · November 2012

ashensnow wrote: »

Perhaps I am missing something but wouldn't this mean that subscribers would pay more than F2Pers when buying 8 or more keys ?

F2P (8 keys) = 40z
Sub (5 keys + 3 free = 8 keys) = 50z

Since lockboxes, in general, are designed around the a low chance to get what you want in order to encourage (all but require actually) one to buy them in significant numbers to get what one wants the suggested pricing model suggests that subscribers pay more than F2Pers for the same desired items from the lockboxes.

Why should subscribers have to pay more than non subscribers for the same thing ?

I meant to put 15 Zen each for F2P players. The one time I don't double check my typing.
That's my bad, sorry. I fixed it.

ashensnow · November 2012

brianblack8281 wrote: »

I meant to put 15 Zen each for F2P players. The one time I don't double check my typing.
That's my bad, sorry. I fixed it.

No need to be sorry. If I had a dollar for every typo I've made on these forums....

jonsills · November 2012

ashensnow wrote: »

No need to be sorry. If I had a dollar for every typo I've made on these forums....

...you could probably afford to unlock all your boxes! (Webster knows I could...)

spyralpegacyon · November 2012

Meanwhile, TOR goes F2P with 'Cartel Packs'. If this is the testbed for EA's other MMOs...

c3rvand0 · November 2012

As ridiculously over priced as they are, whilst idiots keep buying them with paid for Zen, ie cash, PW will not scrap them or reduce the cost. They only reason they would reduce the price is if the increased number of sales would result in greater profit. It would seem that they think the current price is the sweet-spot to maximize their income. If so, there are more wealthy ****wits out there than I had realized. Could all the people buying these keys please contact me as I have a wonderful venture you might be interested in, mining all the moon's cheese. I have exclusive mining rights for the next millennium and a mere $1 million investment will guarantee a chance to make a fortune when we start importing the cheese.

c3rvand0 · November 2012

jonsills wrote: »

...you could probably afford to unlock all your boxes! (Webster knows I could...)

Nope even a dyslexic, amputee with severe learning difficulties couldn't make enough spelling mistakes to open that many.

towershield · November 2012

c3rvand0 wrote: »

Nope even a dyslexic, amputee with severe learning difficulties couldn't make enough spelling mistakes to open that many.

Two words: SMS Language

No disabilities requires. Allegedly.

smoochan · November 2012

There aint nuthin' in them boxes worth havin' anyhow. Only box worth stickin' a key into is the ol' warm-jar-o-peanut-butter-under-the-umbrella-tree, if'n ya know what ah mean

jonsills · November 2012

smoochan wrote: »

There aint nuthin' in them boxes worth havin' anyhow. Only box worth stickin' a key into is the ol' warm-jar-o-peanut-butter-under-the-umbrella-tree, if'n ya know what ah mean

I, ah, don't think I do, no. (And for the love of Cthulhu, please don't explain it to me!!)

towershield · November 2012

jonsills wrote: »

I, ah, don't think I do, no. (And for the love of Cthulhu, please don't explain it to me!!)

Go to youtube.
Search "under the umbrella tree".
Third result.
Despair

merlecorey · November 2012

Honestly, I'm surprised they're not using that other skeevy tactic: The first hit is always free.

Give people just enough free keys to get hooked on opening lockboxes, but give the freebies out frequently enough to keep interest up - maybe 1 key rewarded from a daily or weekly quest. After using the free allocation, pop up a message offering to sell more keys for a "reasonable" price. I mean, a dollar per lockbox? Sure, no problem, just a few more keys to get that fabulous prize. I can quit any time I want!

(For the record, no, I'm not buying keys either. I may only have been back for a few days after a two year absence, but I can recognize a scam when I see one.)

Cosmic Keys - you want HOW much??!

Comments