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May I run a build idea by you?
stardiver
Posts: 76 Arc User
I promise I'll make this quick so as not to take up too much of your time. I'm considering a "very strong weapons user" build which centres around Enrage's size changing mechanic. I intend to use as much as I can from Heavy Weapons for offence, but will very likely stick to Power Armour for my defence, specifically Invulnerability and the Power Armour heal, I forget what it's called. Concept dictates that I use Strength as a primary super stat, with Constitution and Endurance as secondary super stats and really not too much past that. Would such a thing work, or would I be failing hard on some kind of synergy I'm not seeing?
Furthermore, with Enrage as my form, should I be doing my best to pick only knockback/up/down attacks, or would it be enough to stick to just Eruption? I ask, because from my experience with a very early form of the build, Enrage is pretty easy to build up and keep up with just that. Sure, it takes a few applications of the power, but I've never had it drop off in combat. It seems to me that many of the Heavy Weapon attacks I actually want don't have knockback as their effect, and the ones that do aren't what I had in mind.
Furthermore, with Enrage as my form, should I be doing my best to pick only knockback/up/down attacks, or would it be enough to stick to just Eruption? I ask, because from my experience with a very early form of the build, Enrage is pretty easy to build up and keep up with just that. Sure, it takes a few applications of the power, but I've never had it drop off in combat. It seems to me that many of the Heavy Weapon attacks I actually want don't have knockback as their effect, and the ones that do aren't what I had in mind.
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Of all the things I've lost,
It think I miss my mind the most.
Of all the things I've lost,
It think I miss my mind the most.
Post edited by stardiver on
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Power Armor's heal can only be used with Power Armor toggles. Meaning as long as you're using it to heal, you can't be attacking.
STR - CON/END is alright, but you're going to want some REC with that, especially if you're using Invuln instead of Defiance since Invuln has no built in energy return. Reason being, is that otherwise you're going to spend half of the fight building energy to use your big attacks. You'll want to get you EQ up at least high enough that you can open with something painful.
...I just recently realized something really disturbing. We're all eating Sodapop3's "humble pie."
This is good advice. Keep in mind also that if you can quickly build up 3 stacks of knock resistance with taps of your charged attacks then you'll make that foe knock-immune and can then thus fully charge up powerful attacks like Annihilate or Roomsweeper. This is a team-friendly tactic you should use.
May I make a build suggestion? I normally don't do this, but I'd highly recommend you look at the build I have made and shared here (the revised one I posted):
http://co-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=170281
It's got about a dozen different synergies bringing it together and is fairly strong in PvP and "LOL WOW" in PvE, provided of course you get enough practice and skill with it's quirks and tactical execution timing. I also toggle this character between Tank and Hybrid roles depending on what I'm doing (typically Tank for teamplay, and Hybrid if I'm just farming something simple and want a little boost in damage to make it go quicker)
It might inspire you for some ideas, and Eruption was even mentioned by another person in place of Annihilate.
As XaoGarrett here can probably confirm, my theme builds are surprisingly strong, close to a min/maxer really but more diverse and not as specialized for PvP-only.
PS: Keep in mind, Tanking in this game is one of the more difficult things to do. There's a link in my signature I'd encourage y'all to check out that's related to fixing that problem a bit.
Consolidate the currencies! (Please!)
Does your Champion have a theme song? (share it!)
Got a funny in-game screenshot? (share it!)
Please fix the Overdrive energy unlock! (Should help promote thematic build diversity!)
Invulnerability: I'm not sold on this, but that's what Xanta had in City of Heroes. Baically, she's big, though and incredibly hard to kill, so being invulnerable seemed to make sense for her. I'm not sure what Defiance constitutes (can't quote powers off memory yet) but I don't know if it's applicable to a big tough monster.
On Recovery - I'll think about it. I was advised to look after my super stats and one or two other stats, so that should be doable. Hell, Sam's trying to balance Dexterity, Intelligence, Constitution, Strength and Ego
On the suggested build - unfortunately, I'm not knowledgeable enough to read builds yet. My highest level character is 19 so far, and that was over event-boosted experience. I will tell you one thing, though - I don't intend to tank. With anything. I'll probably be spending most of my time soloing anyway. When I do team, I generally have a problem with pre-defined "roles." That's not to say I disagree with tanking, just that I'm more the "lone wolf" type of player.
And I still have to ask - is it worth building for many knockback attacks or should I make do with whatever one or two I happen to pick up?
Of all the things I've lost,
It think I miss my mind the most.
Since endurance is your other secondary, consider taking thermal reverberation from the fire power set. It scales with endurance, and there is a power in heavy weapons called Brimstone that has an advantage called aftershock that will allow you to activate thermal reverberation. If you stick with endurance, give them a look.
Really, when it comes to building and maintaining Enrage, what you really need first and foremost is an attack you're willing to use constantly in battle. For me, that usually means a good single target knock and a good AoE knock, but if you're OK with throwing Eruption in between attacks constantly that's really all you need.
Also, agent's build is pretty good, basically it gets its main source of healing from its passive which is much more leveling friendly, although being you want a character that is just flat out tough as nails Regeneration probably doesn't fit well. Even though, at 40, that build has quite a bit of potential resistance, what you probably do want is either Invulnerability or Defiance. What Defiance is, is a flat resistance buff that stacks to 6 as you take damage. Each stack is worth around 15% resistance, so it's no slouch, although it's late blooming. The upside is that when you get a stack, or refresh the ones you have, you also get some energy.
...I just recently realized something really disturbing. We're all eating Sodapop3's "humble pie."
So you actually don't have to rely on knocks for enrage building if you don't want them.
Also, Defiance may actually fit your theme quite well. It is the "The Harder You Hit Me The Tougher I Get" power.
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'Wen considered the nature of time and understood that the universe is, instant by instant, recreated anew. Therefore, he understood, there is in truth no past, only a memory of the past. Blink your eyes, and the world you see next did not exist when you closed them. Therefore, he said, the only appropriate state of the mind is surprise. The only appropriate state of the heart is joy. The sky you see now, you have never seen before. The perfect moment is now. Be glad of it.' Terry Pratchet The Thief Of Time
Does Defiance offer a flat damage reduction aspect? That might be the clincher. I want Xanta to basically ignore small damage attacks.
On Enrage: Stupid me. I looked at Enrage and how it gets built, but I never looked at specific attack powers to see if they don't build Enrage separately. OK, that solves my problem, then. I LOVE Eruption and I'll probably be taking Cleave and spamming that, so that ought to be enough. Thank you for pointing that out, it solves so many problems
On Brimstone: I'd honestly rather not take that, but I'm still not sure. See, in City of Heroes, Xanta was by far my highest-level character - level 50 and in possession of almost all the Incarnate powers. For her "Judgement," I gave her basically a very big AoE lighting attack, which I explained as "forbidden magic" that most people can't use, because you basically have to be struck by lightning and not die. I did this because City of Heroes simply didn't provide a physical option for a super strength wielder, so I had to fudge, but this ended up giving Xanta an extra side to her character. I'm still on the fence about whether I want to keep it, but if everyone's unanimous about this power being so good, then I guess I probably should.
On energy: I honestly don't have that much of a problem using my energy builder to build energy. I don't know how efficient that is in terms of DPS, but considering Bludgeon is AoE, then I really have no problem using it. Plus, with Xanta being strong, I actually do spend a lot of time in combat finding big things to toss at people
*edit*
Also, what does one do for healing? Might doesn't seem to have a self-healing power.
Of all the things I've lost,
It think I miss my mind the most.
For healing look mainly at gadgeteering and mystic. For a tank/tanky hero conviction and bionic shielding are good choices. If you are going to build some dodge through gear you can allso take bountifull chi resurgence with resurgent reiki advantage (but I don't think it will be a good choice for lvl:ing with invuln or defiance as passives).
And no, defiance doesn't have flat damage reduction that invuln does. And yea, I kind of understand that "small hits can't kill me" feel. That's the main reason I have invuln on my tank, because I really can't understand, how exactly if you will shoot from a machine gun into a tank, tank will be destroyed after enough bullets?... Take rocket launcher and blow the thing up if you want to hurt it.
Being able to manage energy without using your EB much is significantly better in terms of dealing damage, but personally I like it most because relying on my energy builder is boring/annoying. Yeah, the character is still doing something, but it's just an autoattack, I don't really have any input; I don't get to press buttons, or choose which ability to use or which secondary effect I need. If you're happy letting the EB do its thing for a few seconds at a time, then mechanically you'd still be well-served by improved energy stats and/or related powers, but you don't strictly need to function without ever using the EB.
Bionic Shielding (in Gadgeteering) is my favorite heal for almost any character; it's visually not very intrusive (it just makes you glossy until the charges are used up, which is usually not long), provides a pretty strong heal on a pretty short timer, and can also be used on allies/teammates which is occasionally handy (rasafrasa suicidal escort NPCs...). Conviction (in Celestial) is also worth mentioning. Resurgence (in Bestial or Infernal) is a very strong heal, since it scales with Constitution, although it's considered an Active Defense so it has a longer recharge than most heals and shares the lockout timer with other such powers. The heal-on-kill specialization in the Vindicator tree is handy. The Endorphin Rush advantage on Enrage doesn't heal huge amounts, but it is another supplementary source.
All of this is to say that what can count as "magic" is actually very undefined in my head, thus almost anything will pass, just so long as I reserve it only to the biggest, flashiest attacks. In other words, you've sold me on Brimstone
On Energy Builders: This is probably a spot where I'll have to disagree with the community, but I like Energy Builders. Sure, they're not very strong, but I have no problem letting my character auto-attack enemies. I played the original Diablo, after all
On slotted passives: Yes, Invulnerability seems like the better choice here. We have a monster, basically the Juggernaut. It makes sense to render "death of a thousand paper cuts" impossible. I don't know if it's very good, but... We'll see.
On heals: Wow! You've given me a LOT to work with
On Active Defence/Offence: How good are those powers and should I seek to have one, or is the "active" status on them meant to be more of a drawback, in the sense that "this power is too strong so we have to limit its use." For instance, I have no reason to build a character without a slotted passive since there's a special slot for it, but would I have reason to build one without an "active something?" I ask, because I found an Active Offence power I rather liked - Aggressor. This sounds like something I may want to use, and it strikes me as similar to "Build Up" that I'm used to. Just figured I should bring this up.
Again, thank you for all the advise. I now have two characters I want to play, and that's a pretty strong motivator to stick around
Of all the things I've lost,
It think I miss my mind the most.
I'm starting to sound like a broken record but here it goes again:
From most necessary, to least necessary / most optional:
Also it is important to distinguish between just having an active offense and running an "offense cycle". This has been one of the most useful things I've learned from PvP dueling in this game actually, how to pay attention to cycles.
Now explaining them in words is kind of difficult, as it's one of those things you have to get use to doing & observing rather than saying, hands-on learning is needed. Closest I think I'm going to get is if I just say it's the series of combination attacks, buffs, or tactics that you use as a set for a given situation. The active offense is often the start of your offense cycles. If you get hit hard you may have to skip into your defense cycle to save your life. But treating it as a series of combos rather than just "press this button to defend" or whatever, is the key.
Some quick, somewhat "meh" example cycles for a build just to give you an idea:
This seems simple but it depends a lot on what happens in combat and what you're up against in practice. In real world terms this would be called "tactical pre-planning", so that when it comes time to execute the tactics you are familiar with your options and can stay focused on the combat, not letting you HP bar or flashing red screen cause you panic.
Consolidate the currencies! (Please!)
Does your Champion have a theme song? (share it!)
Got a funny in-game screenshot? (share it!)
Please fix the Overdrive energy unlock! (Should help promote thematic build diversity!)
Check out the Animation!
The scenario that your described for the Powers Origin? That IS Brimstone. I mean exactly. Your character raises their weapon. A Bolt of lightning strikes the weapon. You smash the ground with the weapon so hard you cause a miniature volcanic eruption and filed of fire to surround your character. It sounds like a near perfect fit for your concept, if you want to keep it.
This is a video that someone uploaded to You Tube with their Heavy Weapons character using the various powers.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8sFFzVe_dc&noredirect=1
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'Wen considered the nature of time and understood that the universe is, instant by instant, recreated anew. Therefore, he understood, there is in truth no past, only a memory of the past. Blink your eyes, and the world you see next did not exist when you closed them. Therefore, he said, the only appropriate state of the mind is surprise. The only appropriate state of the heart is joy. The sky you see now, you have never seen before. The perfect moment is now. Be glad of it.' Terry Pratchet The Thief Of Time
Of all the things I've lost,
It think I miss my mind the most.
Really don't agree with list past number 1. Primarily because every build is different; plenty of builds and setups don't need an Energy Unlock at all, and just as many already have so much killing power that an AO barely improves performance. Some builds have more use for Forms than others, and some Forms are more useful than others, making them more necessary to add to a good build.
Basically, I don't think you can boil it down to a definitive 1-6 ranking of importance in a game with so many variables and options.
However, for people first starting out with making builds, I like your list as a way of saying, "You should really try to have one of each of these" (at least 1-5).
I know... Of course that going to depend on each individual build!
Heck I just got done recommending to a different fellow that he could pick up two Active Defenses and that'd be fine. Most of my builds don't even have a On-next-hit power, including my main character.
So yeah, very subjective. That wasn't my point though, my point was to give it as a beginner's tip for success. Because once you start to realize that buffing you build around a core focus you'll see how you can make a freeform stronger than an ordinary archetype can be and you'll have something you can be proud of because you made it and it's strong in combat.
PS: I've also known a number of very skilled players that actually have more than one slotted passive, they change it out depending on what role is needed on-the-fly. (i.e.: Targeting Computer & Invulnerability)
Consolidate the currencies! (Please!)
Does your Champion have a theme song? (share it!)
Got a funny in-game screenshot? (share it!)
Please fix the Overdrive energy unlock! (Should help promote thematic build diversity!)
However... I have to say that I love my energy builder. It deals decent damage, but I LOVE how it looks
And I do appreciate the list. When I started out a couple of days ago, I hadn't the foggiest what any of that stuff was. Getting a list of categories is very helpful. I don't know if I'll stick to the order given - like I said, my damage seems good enough to last for the time being - but I'll definitely try to snag one of each. Probably keep an eye on how my character is performing and react accordingly. I can't plan that far ahead since I don't know the game well enough, but I'll see about picking up a self heal when I start getting hurt, more damage if I start taking too long and so forth.
Stats and perks and what have you are always the hardest to balance, I think, but if I can get a character that's reasonable in general, I should be able to manage specific stats more reasonably, either via gear or via the stat boost skills.
Of all the things I've lost,
It think I miss my mind the most.
Yup. Wasn't really a criticism, we agree that it's a generally good idea to have one of those (1-5), especially for beginning FF'ers. I've never tried to run dual passives, but I've thought about it more and more lately with Alerts. I tend to not team, so I find myself with random groups in every Alert... many times I've found myself on a DPS toon with 4 other DPS players, or on a tank toon with a comparable tank running alongside in the Alert, etc. It would be kinda cool to just be able to switch over into a totally different, but still effective, role.
I find that the Active Offenses/Defenses are where I vary most between builds. Since I go for concept, I end up picking multiple clickies either for the visual effects or for theme (my PA tank permanently cycles 3 AD's).
That's what I like most about the game, though: you've got a set of power types you're going to have on pretty much every toon (passive, AD, AO, energy power, AoE attack, single target attack, heal, block, form), but tons of options for each of those, and then plenty of room left over to play with. Very fun.