PWE ...get off ur bums.....

nepht · September 2012

...and buy CoX.

Makes perfect sense you have all the other Cryptic games and Paragon is an awesome dev team. Heck Cryptic still owns the engine

Nerds would love you for it \o/

agentnx5 · September 2012

Nepht... I don't think this will happen, regrettably.

They've kind of had a rough year financially so far: http://www.google.com/finance?client=ob&q=NASDAQ:PWRD

On the brightside, maybe what we can do is make content that would make CoH refugees more at home. Costume stuff, new explorable content that echoes with familiarity, and emote packages to put in the Z-Store.

nepht · September 2012

agentnx5 wrote: »

Nepht... I don't think this will happen, regrettably.

They've kind of had a rough year financially so far: http://www.google.com/finance?client=ob&q=NASDAQ:PWRD

On the brightside, maybe what we can do is make content that would make CoH refugees more at home. Costume stuff, new explorable content that echoes with familiarity, and emote packages to put in the Z-Store.

Actully around $10 a share is back to normal for PWE last year they were caught up in the social networking fad of last year when that type of **** was cool with stock type peoples and their shares went madly up to $24 a share.

I'm a PWE shareholder I keep tabs on them constantly.

*EDIT* must say a tiny amount of shares ...thankfully .

You hear that PWE ...I AM WATCHING YOU -.-

mistformsquirrel · September 2012

I actually agree with Nepht. It's a smart move - it's a proven profit maker, it's beloved by a great many people, and - this is I think the brilliant part - it's different enough from CO that it allows you to keep a huge chunk of the superhero market under your thumb.

See, COH and CO are very different when you remove the genre trappings from them; they play differently, behave differently, reward you differently, feel differently... the only things they have in common are their genre, customization features and the studio that originally created them.

So if you get them both under the same roof, you have a place for people to go when they're tired of one game and want something different while still in the superhero genre... and you're still making money either way.

----

However there is one absolutely KEY thing that has to be done for this to work:

You have to, absolutely must, restore the COH team as best as is possible. There's two reasons for this -

1) Player confidence. Players understandably come to know their devs over the years - and players had immense confidence in Paragon Studios dev team. Failure to restore the team as close as is possible to it's original form would dent player confidence and create doubts that the quality that had long been enjoyed could continue.

2) Quality in and of itself. It's not that you can't hire new people to run an old game and have it work out - a lot of Paragon folks weren't original to COH after all; but they are proven developers who know the ins and outs of the game better than anyone out there; and they know where they were planning to take the game next so there's no abrupt shift in direction.

Basically I think buying COH would be a wise move for PWE and a boon for CO as well. A lot of the animosity caused by being in competition could be resolved if both games existed but were no longer actual competitors - instead they'd be teammates and players could and would drift between the two freely.

That's how I see it anyway.

grifvindh · September 2012

From what I understand NCSoft never sells off any titles it kills. It just kills them. Conventional wisdom is NCSoft sees no value in selling content to competitors.

mistformsquirrel · September 2012

I wouldn't be shocked if that were the case, and would explain why Tabula Rasa never got a chance at a revival.

Still, I can hope/dream <_ _>

nepht · September 2012

grifvindh wrote: »

From what I understand NCSoft never sells off any titles it kills. It just kills them. Conventional wisdom is NCSoft sees no value in selling content to competitors.

Wonder if because the deal was use of engine and a second game the fact that the second game was never made that might break the contract and Cryptic can take the game back?

Sort of like what happened to Fox and Marvel with the Daredevil movie IP.

lotar295 · September 2012

It would be the wisest move PWE could do right now,CO and COH were both originally made by cryptic,and it would bring A TON of COH players back,bring back COH in the hands of cryptic and or PWE,then CO and COH can no longer try to be better than one another,and both can be owned by a single company,and as stated before,it would REALLY bring massive profit for PWE/cryptic.

/signed for PWE to bring back COH

mistformsquirrel · September 2012

Come to think of it, as someone said in another thread: Hiring the COH devs is still a wise move even if we can't get COH back. As I noted above, this is a group that has a lot of good will from the COH community; putting them on say... CO, and not only would you get proven developers who I'm certain could learn CO inside and out quickly - but would provide a concrete commitment to making the game better; something I think most of us want. < . .>

I can dream anyway.

*edit* I don't want our devs to feel this is a slight against them >< I realize it could sound that way.

What I mean is... I feel like CO desperately needs more people in order to create the level and quantity of content we need to keep the game rolling and realize it's potential. Combining that with a smart PR decision and talented people is just a plain old good idea.

mistformsquirrel · September 2012

nepht wrote: »

Wonder if because the deal was use of engine and a second game the fact that the second game was never made that might break the contract and Cryptic can take the game back?

Sort of like what happened to Fox and Marvel with the Daredevil movie IP.

Paragon was actually in the process of making another game when it got shut down < . .>

nepht · September 2012

mistformsquirrel wrote: »

Paragon was actually in the process of making another game when it got shut down < . .>

And thats my point they never finished lets call it COH2 cause c'mon thats what it was.

You seen what Bethesda did to Interplay because the didn't make Fallout Online fast enough it was a right royal bumming.

I sure our Chinese overlords could top that. They dont get on with South K anyway. Hold up neither do my lot*...... why cant we all just be friends

*to stop confusion for the new people I was born in the land were you can buy used panties in vending machines and giant lizards make out with even bigga moths . You figure it out \o/

oneheadedboy · September 2012

While I don't think it's practical for PW to buy COH (NCSoft won't sell) I'll echo the sentiment of hiring COH devs to work on Champions. I think that would do more than anything else could possibly do to inspire more of my fellow COH players to make the switch. This would benefit both an increased longevity of our community and an increased revenue/player base for Champions.

From what I've seen, Champions puts out a fraction of the content that we were seeing in COH since our Freedom model launched. We had what was shaping up to be a very expansive end game system, two new zones (not to mention the already existent multitude of Villain exclusive zones, and a multitude of zones in entirely different dimensions,) several complete zone revamps, more new powersets and costumes than I can count, being released on roughly a monthly basis, and I'm sure tons of other things I'm forgetting.

Based on what I've read about Champions- Not trashing it at all- You see only a fraction of the content releases that COH had been seeing. I think bringing our Dev's over to help work on this project would be such a great thing for everyone.

mistformsquirrel · September 2012

I just find it immensely unlikely that the shutdown has anything to do with PWE to begin with.

In my estimation it's exactly like NCSoft said... a business decision. NCSoft is after all notorious for doing this kind of thing. Remember Tabula Rasa? Auto Assault? Dungeon Runners? All dead now; and TR particularly had a small but dedicated fanbase.

helbjorn · September 2012

I would not want to see PWE spend the money to acquire a title that clearly wasn't making NCSoft enough profit. I'd like to see PWE spend a fraction of that money to get CoX's players over here in order to make this a better game.

agentnx5 · September 2012

grifvindh wrote: »

From what I understand NCSoft never sells off any titles it kills. It just kills them. Conventional wisdom is NCSoft sees no value in selling content to competitors.

Exactly. They have a history of doing this. NCSoft is a slaughtering house for game titles, but to be fair they're not as bad as Interplay got, yet.

mistformsquirrel wrote: »

I actually agree with Nepht. It's a smart move - it's a proven profit maker, it's beloved by a great many people, and - this is I think the brilliant part - it's different enough from CO that it allows you to keep a huge chunk of the superhero market under your thumb.

See, COH and CO are very different when you remove the genre trappings from them; they play differently, behave differently, reward you differently, feel differently... the only things they have in common are their genre, customization features and the studio that originally created them.

So if you get them both under the same roof, you have a place for people to go when they're tired of one game and want something different while still in the superhero genre... and you're still making money either way.

----

However there is one absolutely KEY thing that has to be done for this to work:

You have to, absolutely must, restore the COH team as best as is possible. There's two reasons for this -

1) Player confidence. Players understandably come to know their devs over the years - and players had immense confidence in Paragon Studios dev team. Failure to restore the team as close as is possible to it's original form would dent player confidence and create doubts that the quality that had long been enjoyed could continue.

2) Quality in and of itself. It's not that you can't hire new people to run an old game and have it work out - a lot of Paragon folks weren't original to COH after all; but they are proven developers who know the ins and outs of the game better than anyone out there; and they know where they were planning to take the game next so there's no abrupt shift in direction.

Basically I think buying COH would be a wise move for PWE and a boon for CO as well. A lot of the animosity caused by being in competition could be resolved if both games existed but were no longer actual competitors - instead they'd be teammates and players could and would drift between the two freely

That's how I see it anyway.

These are all great sounding, but I have to say, honestly, it sounds like delusions of grandeur.

I feel kind of dirty saying that, because I empathize for the CoH players... But ladies & gents, I'd be totally shocked if this actually happened.

Your best bet is to hire the best & brightest of the CoH team because you know they are qualified, pre-trained, and experienced. That's a huge cost-saver alone right there.

helbjorn wrote: »

I would not want to see PWE spend the money to acquire a title that clearly wasn't making NCSoft enough profit. I'd like to see PWE spend a fraction of that money to get CoX's players over here in order to make this a better game.

This is a strong point that many of you should be listening to.

mistformsquirrel · September 2012

Agentnx5 -

1) I actually made the point further down that if we can't get the whole shebang, we ought to get the devs. < . .> I'm well aware NCSoft has a vicegrip on it's IPs even after they die. It's why we'll probably never see a Tabula Rasa revival despite that IP being ripe for development.

2) From actually playing COH very recently I can say I did not get the sense of a game that was doing anything but extremely well. The servers were well populated, content was flowing on a near constant basis.

In the 5 or so months I spent on COH recently, there were at least 3 power sets that came out during that period (and one shortly thereafter), and on top of that there were new missions in abundance with each issue. Heck, the last 2 major updates each brought new zones.

On top of that the devs had significant future plans -another zone, several more powersets, and hints of the next level of the Incarnate system including it's new primary foe.

A lot of this was revealed like 2 days before the shutdown notice came down.

Now I can't say with 100% certainty "COH was financially in good shape". I don't have the information to make that judgement; but I've been in 'dying' games before and they almost never look like that, with the large quantity of players on a regular basis and the constant influx of "stuff".

----

Ultimately - I just want COH to not-die and for CO to get stronger.

I want both of those things and this is one of the few ways I can see those goals being accomplished.

Anyway that's all I'll say, ultimately it's not up to us and I can't influence anything, I just wanted the case laid out is all.

*sigh* now back to drawing (so tired, but must get page done ><)

agentnx5 · September 2012

Thank you for sharing some of those background details, mistformsquirrel. I'll keep that in mind for the future.

thecosmic1 · September 2012

mistformsquirrel wrote: »

1) I actually made the point further down that if we can't get the whole shebang, we ought to get the devs. < . .> I'm well aware NCSoft has a vicegrip on it's IPs even after they die. It's why we'll probably never see a Tabula Rasa revival despite that IP being ripe for development.

Keep in mind that "getting the Devs" is more complex then just hiring them. Those Devs need to want to work for Cryptic again. They need to be willing to work for what Cryptic can afford to pay. And, Cryptic needs to have the money in the CO budget to hire more Devs.

2) From actually playing COH very recently I can say I did not get the sense of a game that was doing anything but extremely well. The servers were well populated, content was flowing on a near constant basis.

In the 5 or so months I spent on COH recently, there were at least 3 power sets that came out during that period (and one shortly thereafter), and on top of that there were new missions in abundance with each issue. Heck, the last 2 major updates each brought new zones.

On top of that the devs had significant future plans -another zone, several more powersets, and hints of the next level of the Incarnate system including it's new primary foe.

A lot of this was revealed like 2 days before the shutdown notice came down.

Now I can't say with 100% certainty "COH was financially in good shape". I don't have the information to make that judgement; but I've been in 'dying' games before and they almost never look like that, with the large quantity of players on a regular basis and the constant influx of "stuff".

Just as a counter to this, for nearly a year the STO team told us new content was coming - we saw pictures and videos, etc. We were told a new FE was on the way every month in a new Engineering Report - and were told how the Devs have even played some of it. We were told a lot of things. Of course then we came to find out that the STO team had been secretly working on the FTP conversion for nearly a year - which is why we had no new Mission Content. We also learned they hadn't even started on the new FE they supposedly had played.

We also came to learn that Atari had cut the STO team down from over 40 to 20 Devs due to Atari's financial hardship. We even learned that because of Atari money was so tight at Cryptic that they didn't even have styrofoam cups for coffee in the break room. And all that time we were told everything was fine, new content was coming, and new things were pushed into the C-Store monthly.

The point of the above is that talk is cheap, and what a Dev might say to you on a forum doesn't necessarily match-up with what's going on behind the scenes. If it wasn't for the PW buy-out both STO and CO would now be defunct.

The superhero genre is a small MMO market. Based on NCSoft's financials for the 2nd Quarter, CoH constituted 2% of the gross sales - and NCSoft lost a ton of money in that quarter. There's just no real money in that genre.

PW doesn't need 2 superhero games. They could spend as little as $2 million buying CoH, but imagine what $2 million could do to CO if they were willing to throw that money into development here? It could entirely change the face of this game.

But to be honest I wouldn't be too sure in believing that CO isn't in the same boat that CoH was - not making enough money and just hanging on until PW decides to invest or close.

oneheadedboy · September 2012

thecosmic1 wrote: »

Just as a counter to this, for nearly a year the STO team told us new content was coming - we saw pictures and videos, etc. We were told a new FE was on the way every month in a new Engineering Report - and were told how the Devs have even played some of it. We were told a lot of things. Of course then we came to find out that the STO team had been secretly working on the FTP conversion for nearly a year - which is why we had no new Mission Content. We also learned they hadn't even started on the new FE they supposedly had played.

We also came to learn that Atari had cut the STO team down from over 40 to 20 Devs due to Atari's financial hardship. We even learned that because of Atari money was so tight at Cryptic that they didn't even have styrofoam cups for coffee in the break room. And all that time we were told everything was fine, new content was coming, and new things were pushed into the C-Store monthly.

The point of the above is that talk is cheap, and what a Dev might say to you on a forum doesn't necessarily match-up with what's going on behind the scenes.

The key difference here would be that in COH, we know for a fact that all of the previously mentioned new content was actually being developed, because we've been able to play it ourselves months in advance on the beta server.

klitty · September 2012

And this is the response from Cryptic!! Right here!!

rianfrost · September 2012

I would be content to ee if they coudl hire a number of the developers. I still am hoping for the long shot, but if the people i liked are working here, well then i will just play here more.

agentnx5 · September 2012

klitty wrote: »

And this is the response from Cryptic!! Right here!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gy5iT4aarKg

Or in the case of bugs... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjhrIsSCcjs

championshewolf · September 2012

agentnx5 wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gy5iT4aarKg

Or in the case of bugs... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjhrIsSCcjs

Yeah, Toast!

PWE ...get off ur bums.....

Comments