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Please consider lifting the Global limit for Silvers.
redjaw
Posts: 3 Arc User
Before anyone goes off the deep end, hear me out please.
I ask for Cryptic to consider this as the current 250G resource limit for silvers is now a complete hassle in trades and on the auction house.
Take newer or valuable items such as Dark Speed, Dark Aura, Gravitar pieces, or Therakiel's Sword. I can never obtain these pieces simply because they are sold for far above the 250G cap (the last Therakiel Sword I saw was 3000G, the last Gravitar Couture piece was 7000G).
Storing globals in materials is the current method for silver players to make sure that they don't lose money by continually going over the cap. However, for trades I do not see how we will be able to buy items far over 250G.
Trading items could be an alternative, but not everyone will accept items for trade.
I just want Cryptic to give thought about lifting the Global cap and nothing else. I will not beg or cry for this, I just wanted to give reasons as to why it should be considered.
Thanks.
I ask for Cryptic to consider this as the current 250G resource limit for silvers is now a complete hassle in trades and on the auction house.
Take newer or valuable items such as Dark Speed, Dark Aura, Gravitar pieces, or Therakiel's Sword. I can never obtain these pieces simply because they are sold for far above the 250G cap (the last Therakiel Sword I saw was 3000G, the last Gravitar Couture piece was 7000G).
Storing globals in materials is the current method for silver players to make sure that they don't lose money by continually going over the cap. However, for trades I do not see how we will be able to buy items far over 250G.
Trading items could be an alternative, but not everyone will accept items for trade.
I just want Cryptic to give thought about lifting the Global cap and nothing else. I will not beg or cry for this, I just wanted to give reasons as to why it should be considered.
Thanks.
Post edited by redjaw on
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Comments
You can increase auction house, bank, and hideout amounts through the store. Why not G's?
Deliciously nutritious!
This limit serves no real purpose. It seems highly unlikely, to me, that someone who is not interested in subbing will change their mind over a Globals limit. The game seems to more and more emphasize Silvers who pay through micro-transactions, this limit merely acts as a deterrent to Cryptic's new target customer.
'Caine, miss you bud. Fly high.
Fixed that for you.
Also, to make you aware of a purpose: if they didn't have the cap, gold farmers could actually store copious amounts of G on a free character and bounce the G around from character to character in an anonymous fashion, making them difficult to track and deal with. What kind of anonymous fashion? For starters, selling an item for way more money than it's worth on the AH.
All currency limit impositions on F2P games are motivated by the gold farming market. It is not about encouraging subscriptions. Gold farmers are far less likely to subscribe because it leaves a paper trail.
Before you say that we don't have much of a problem with that, consider that perhaps the policy is effective.
Before you say that it still happens anyway, just rarely, consider that it's impossible to stop entirely; but the fact that it still happens anyway isn't a reason to abandon an otherwise effective policy.
I propose a compromise. Gold farmers aren't going to want to spend more money or time than they have to. Charge Zen or Questionite for raising the cap.
↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → Ⓑ Ⓐ
Gold Farmers ?
We didnt have a problem with that before the restriction either.
If the money can be transferred anonymously then it could be transferred anonymously between gold accounts as well. Money laundering does not require a free account.
If Gold Selling were at all viable in CO then a fee to increase the G cap would be no more of a deterrent than buying multiple accounts was in GW.
'Caine, miss you bud. Fly high.
Such a limit normally serves one purpose : to sell a higher limit to the players. I really
can't understand why there is no such thing in the C-Store. And so it really doesn't
makes any sense here.
I fully support the idea of selling a limit increase in the C-Store.
If someone chooses to pay for their game experience ala carte rather than through a package deal, so be it.
'Caine, miss you bud. Fly high.
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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That sounds like an ideal solution. I too care about the game's economy, and as we have so many silver players I would like for them to be able to more fully participate in trading.
You're missing a major problem - for there to be gold farmers, there needs to be a market. When a 10+ year old game like diablo2 still has a market, yet there's next to none in CO - that should tell you something.
There are plenty of "anti-farm" measures in place, whether it be the stupid report spam or daily limits or the fact that q can only be traded across the market and not players directly.
250g limit means silvers are unable to pay more meaning they become untapped resources for the economy. As we previously had craft mats to get around this it wasn't such a big deal, but at this point silvers really need at least an option to pay for exemption from the silver gold cap.
Yes, the zen/questionite to increase the global cap idea is nice.
Thank you for the feedback, but we didn't have silver accounts before the restriction. So, I fail to see what your point is with that. It's like saying "we didn't have photos of the moon before the camera existed." Well, duh.
By the way, we DID have a gold farmer infestation during beta, headstart, and for about 2 months after release. Either you weren't around or my memory is retains a higher fidelity over a longer period of time than yours.
You're entirely missing the point. Cryptic put the restriction in place for the reason I gave. If you think there isn't a market, I suggest pointing it out in a way that explains why the restriction isn't the cause of there not being a gold farmer problem. And give it to Cryptic, not me. I don't make the decisions at Cryptic. I don't even work at Cryptic.
If either of you bothered to read my entire post, you'd know that I'm siding with you on the position that there either shouldn't be a restriction, or there should be a way to eliminate the restriction without subscribing. Keep in mind, this is coming from a pre-order lifetimer who doesn't even have the perspective of having ever been silver... EVER... Though I do understand and empathise. That's why I offer a compromise that'd allow the restriction to be lifted in a manner that doesn't curtail Cryptic's attempts at mitigating the potential for a gold farmer infestation.
I'm with you that it should be in the C-Store, but if you'd actually think about more than just the surface of the differences between Silver and Gold, perhaps not all of the differences were decided based on encouraging subscription. You have to consider how free to play can be abused as well as how to encourage subscription. The logical conclusion is obvious, especially in light of the fact that other games that have both subscription and f2p accounts do the currency restriction thing for this exact reason: curtailing gold farmer infestations.
The chat restriction on new accounts is for the *same reason*, curtailing gold farmer infestations. Frankly, I'd like to see a similar policy put into place regarding it. After playing for so many hours or spending X amount in Questionite or Zen, you should be allowed to raise the restriction. Or alternatively, use Questionite and Zen to purchase the restriction lifts.
↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → Ⓑ Ⓐ
/Signed
This should have been done a long time ago. Most of what the current cap accomplishes is limit trade with silver members both ways--when they want to buy stuff that sells for higher than the current cap, and when they want to sell it.
That was already suggested preceding your post...
More importantly, it means it will actually make Gold & Lifetimers wealthier too because it means you'll have a larger market to sell to. Larger market = more potential buyers. This is a huge boon to Gold and Lifetime members as well as Silver members.
It's a win-win no brainer.
Yeah... Why this exists in STO and an not in Champions is idiotic. Same could be said for the Foundry really.
Ladies & gents, this isn't a new suggestion, just FYI... And yes, I'm still in support of it (as long as the price is right on the Z-Store)
/vote yes
Consolidate the currencies! (Please!)
Does your Champion have a theme song? (share it!)
Got a funny in-game screenshot? (share it!)
Please fix the Overdrive energy unlock! (Should help promote thematic build diversity!)
Do not blame cryptic ... PLAYERS overprice things... blame the greedy ****s that sell items for over 250G...the mind of humans is poisoned with money... even in game... sad story..
Ultimately I believe that some means of raising the G cap for silvers is a good idea. A tiered system where various levels of increase could be purchased in the C-Store and/or earned in game, would be an interesting option.
'Caine, miss you bud. Fly high.
I myself am silver but ive spent CASH for this game ^^
But as i said before... that all needs to stay in queue because there are actually more important things that Cryptic should focus on...
Even if I buy a hideout that still won't solve the problem of me being able to buy extremely high priced items.
Unless there is some feature besides storing I am completely missing with hideouts.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
Perhaps I should establish lines of credit for Silver players who wish to deposit funds to me as their banker. I don't think I'd bother doing that until I'm more assured of my capacity to be available during predictable hours, though. Still, all you Silvers out there, consider asking a Gold friend to be your banker. I know that I wouldn't mind doing it to help someone that I knew, so I imagine that there are at least a few other Golds out there who are both trustworthy and magnanimous. LIKE ME.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I was Dubsy on the Old Forums. I am still @Dubsy in-game. Also, lol.
Listen , just destroy the system and good... if we all stop buying thing over 250G they NEED to sell them cheaper ^^
That easy,like anonymous.. collect all peopel and fight against the system... figth against "ingame" capitalism ...
I wouldn't assume that your logical deduction is why the restriction is there - cryptic/pwe has made plenty of business decisions that weren't logical. Releasing patches that aren't anywhere close to ready is seemingly common practice, yet one would think providing a sub-par product leading to bad word-of-mouth advertising would be important to rectify.
Considering former forum moderators can get banned by said system without even having logged into the game, it doesn't solve anything. If someone really wants to spam, they simply rotate alternate accounts.
And almost everybody agrees the cap is bogus. MOST people agree to let silvers pay to raise their G cap like every thing else... Seriously? :eek:
You want the to lower the limit players sell things at in a player run economy that has been running for almost 3 years, JUST to compensate for a poorly thought out artificial limit that almost EVERYBODY agrees is limiting, and needs to be changed?!
As it was already pointed out, having a hideout won't affect your ability to "TRADE" higher levels of G for items you want, since it doesnt' affect your max G carrying capability.
Which is the function that is used for TRADING :rolleyes:
What is your problem? :mad:
| ME | A "Guide" Book" | | I, have a "DREAM! | ( Member since Feb 2008 ) ... ?
[SIGPIC]http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b132/AngelOfCaine/STILLS/Misc/CO-Sig_01e.png[/SIGPIC]
This means in order to buy anything over the price of 250g, they have to trade the gold across in installments of no more than 250g at a time.
So for a 7000g gravitar item, you'd have to 28 separate trades to get all the gold across.
If the seller puts the item in with the first trade, there's nothing to stop the buyer from refusing to do the next 27, thus getting the item for 250g.
If the seller puts the item in with the last trade, there's nothing stopping the seller from simply refusing to actually trade the item over and walking off with 6750g.
It's such a wide-open thing for scammers it's not even funny. This leads to two problems:
There's a legitimate, actual reason to have to do things in such an insecure way(making it harder to detect the scammers).
It effectively means that smart people, who don't want to get scammed, will refuse to buy or sell anything over 250g from/to a silver.
The only other option a silver has is to trade the money, again in installments, to a gold player and have the gold player complete the transaction. In which case there's equally nothing stopping the gold player from walking off with the money or the item.
The 250g limit itself isn't the problem; the problem is that it makes silvers have to trade in multiple, unsecure installments. Add some kind of escrow system that automatically releases the item when the silver finishes depositing money in it, or a similar modification to the trade window, and it becomes merely an annoyance instead of a big problem.
It would be MUCH simpler to just let silvers buy a boosted G limit and call it a day
| ME | A "Guide" Book" | | I, have a "DREAM! | ( Member since Feb 2008 ) ... ?
[SIGPIC]http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b132/AngelOfCaine/STILLS/Misc/CO-Sig_01e.png[/SIGPIC]
No **** really lol.
*ding! ding! ding!* I think Nepht just found a possible way to get this done if Cryptic wants to continue being stubborn about it.
Hmm, maybe some good can come from the merger afterall... ironic. Anybody willing to follow me over to the official PWE forums and see if we can get Perfect World to help get some sense into Cryptic on this?
Consolidate the currencies! (Please!)
Does your Champion have a theme song? (share it!)
Got a funny in-game screenshot? (share it!)
Please fix the Overdrive energy unlock! (Should help promote thematic build diversity!)
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I was Dubsy on the Old Forums. I am still @Dubsy in-game. Also, lol.
That would solve it as well, but given that silvers can actually store an UNLIMITED quantity of G already simply by getting a hideout, the real problem is the fact that you can only TRANSFER 250g at once because of the per-character limit.
With the unlimited hideout storage, the other effects besides the transfer problem are just annoyances that can be worked around.
now would be a good time to reward those players.
Maybe 1% could/would ever take advantage of the greater than 250G pocket change.
Hold it. Go start a real life business, make it successful, and then try to avoid being "greedy". See how long your business lasts. Sell things for the exact amount it costs to produce them, ship them, hire workers, everything else. Make sure you aren't make any profits, because to yourself and many others, that equates to "greed". Do all that, and then you can come and spout garbage about human minds being poisoned by money.
Do you have ANY idea what Capitalism is?
Capitalism is a system in which the government is not allowed to take your money, your capital. It has nothing to do with whatever the heck you're getting at here.
And would you like to know what'd happen to those items that everyone's after if you somehow succeeded in "destroying the system"?
Those items would stop appearing on the market. No one would bother hunting them down, because they take too much work for too little payoff. It'd be much easier to flood the market with smaller, more easily-attainable items, and so no one would ever get those big-name items unless they farmed them on their own.
On top of that, many of the people who get rich off of those items would no longer have that income, which prevents them from buying things themselves. This causes other items on the auction house to stagnate and sit there for longer, with no one buying them, which means no income for the people who put up THOSE items... Which means THEY aren't buying anything, thus preventing income to OTHERS who had stuff up for sale. Are you getting the pattern, here?
I really wish all these "humans are all evil and greedy" people would learn some math, economics, psychology, history, anything that might actually give them some insight on what they're talking about. This kind of ignorance is one of the most destructive forces on the planet.
Cupid@Tool-box, stunningly radiant stag ready to play matchmaker between villain and arrow!
Vixon@Tool-box, frighteningly eager to summon despair for his adversaries!
Jebin Zedalu@Tool-box, elementalist weaponmaster. ...One of these things is not like the others!
First off english is not my native language.. in my country capitalism means peopel that are money greedy... (( ?Streben nach Gewinn im kontinuierlichen, rationalen kapitalistischen Betrieb? ))...
dunno how to tranlsate that to you that u understand it...
Goverment . lol.. most governments are controled by Bankers...who are part of a shadow-government... who put aspartame in our food and flouride in our water and who spread aerosole containing aluminium to our skies...
Nothing is yours when "your government" decides all what you have belngs now to them then you cant do things... since the military is part of your goverment... so .. your argument failed already...
AND tahts good, peopel who want those items can go hunt them... for personal use like i did...
Ive 3 Dark Auras on my Characters .. it isnt that hard to farm...lol
Seriously it takes a whole day ( if u got job, family , reallife ) to farm 500G... but it took me 2 hours to get dark aura and 1 day to get 3 others auras...1 of them i gave away for free.
But ive seen peopel selling items for over 250G.. seriously NO ITEM is worth it...
No sorry i dont want to join the massive abusement of human rights...
People never sell for the amount it is worth it.. mostly everything is priced 60% of the production cost.. wow... and u say that is good?
Im for a new world where everything is free for EVERYONE.... like in Start Trek...
Im sorry that my mind isnt poisoned by the spirit of money...
Go watch Zeitgeist , Endgame ( Alex Jones) and Project Venus ... then come again and argue...
Just use google and google for "money controls the world" ... so many people know about the evil spirit of money...how can you tell its good?
in some countries you dont get healed in a hospital if you dont have money.. wow...
peopel have to be homeless just because they dont have money...( no matter why.. )
Youre heartless if you say thats good...
....AWESOME MUCH SUCCESS \o/
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
I give everything for free or in trade of somethign i could use of.. like 4 Eggs for 800 Mililiters of Milk...
Or a Selfmade bread for a Glass of selfmade marmalde...
500G in a day.
I must be an idiot or something to not be able to manage that. Don't suppose you can send some of the greedy fake-money my way?
Wait wait, 60% of the production cost?
I work at a snack shack place where we make cotton candy. The grand total production price for cotton candy? 10 Cents. We sell it for three dollars.
Supply and demand. If people want it enough, they will throw money at it no matter what it does.
I can show you at least sixty websites found in one Google search designed to spew BS theories and conspiracy short stories about the government. Don't like the government? Vote somebody new in...Depending on where you are, I know not everyone is within the realms of NA.
Usually this is an issue with countries that are in more of a power grip scenario then a free will system. As well, many times those that need help have problems caused by themselves because of the lack of knowledge or the correct environment. Should the government really be spending millions on making sure Jim Bob from down the street can pretend to be fine only to be found drunk in the alley again?
Now, this has heavily derailed the topic. Global hunger and poverty isn't related to the use of a resource cap on a video game, so lets leave it where it is.
Simple fact is, many people want the ability to purchase a boost to the maximum globals cap. I don't think anyone has said no yet, however feel free to point yourself out so we can egg- er, acknowledge you.
However, whether Cryptic/PWE find it a useful investment of time and money is the question. Will it be done? Who knows.
Deliciously nutritious!
Its a question about how many lvl 40 chars you have, because more Unity runs .. more G
105 Silver tokens were always 600g for me.
| ME | A "Guide" Book" | | I, have a "DREAM! | ( Member since Feb 2008 ) ... ?
[SIGPIC]http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b132/AngelOfCaine/STILLS/Misc/CO-Sig_01e.png[/SIGPIC]
How do you manage that? I've got hundreds of silver tokens on many characters, and they're all probably sitting at 100 to 300 G.
Well, then, the German slang for what Capitalism means is flat-out wrong and misleading.
I hold no love for the government, believe me on that one. You seem to be complaining about the government deciding that what you own is theirs? Guess what, bud... CAPITALISM IS THE OPPOSITE OF THAT. Capitalism is where the government does not have any claim to what you own. So, I fail to see how my argument has failed in any way.
Or, they could spend time doing something they enjoy, and sell the fruits of their enjoyed-labor to others in order to get something that they want, but don't want to directly pursue.
A real world example would be if you enjoy making music, or art, or costumes. You can make those things, sell them, and then use the money to buy a house, which you'd really rather not have to build by hand all on your own.
Items are worth what people and circumstances make them worth.
Dark Aura only drops during a certain event. How do you propose that people go and hunt down that item themselves? It's not currently available. You need to get it from others. So, you buy it. Getting the item even though the time to drop it has passed is worth it to many people, so they're okay with paying the high resource amounts. It means not having to wait for the next time that event begins.
And this is exactly why you will never understand. You are content with not knowing how the real world works.
Running a business is a constant exchange. You exchange goods for money, you exchange money for services, those services create more goods, and the loop goes on. What you call "abuse of human rights", I call "supplying someone with a job so that they have what they need to live". It's this movement to fight the "corporate villains" that is causing homelessness, not money.
Money is, quite simply, a value placed on productivity. If you're a productive person, you have more money. Generally speaking, of course; this stops being the case once the government gets involved and takes it from you, decreeing that the useful members of society should be taxed as punishment for making a positive difference.
Yes, I do say that is good. It means that everyone benefits from the exchange.
You will never, ever make an exchange that gives you something you feel is worth less than what you are giving. If you're spending $3 on cotton candy, then you have decided that that cotton candy is worth more to you than your $3. And the one selling it has decided that your $3 is worth more to them than their cotton candy.
Even when you're giving someone something for free, you are making an exchange that you feel benefits you. You are giving someone a Dark Aura in exchange for the light and bubbly feeling you get from doing something nice for someone else. And let me tell you, I don't mind that at all! More power to you. If you have the means, and can survive without it, and want to make someone happy, go for it. But don't try to force the rest of us to do the same, when we may not have the means to get by without it.
I'm more worried that your mind is poisoned by ignorance and naivete.
Productivity has to come from somewhere. As I said, money is productivity given a hard value. So, tell me: If everything's free, where does the productivity come from?
You can sit there all day and tell me that people should do work from the goodness of their hearts, but let me tell you something... The only thing that those "humans are evil" bozos are right about is that humans do things for their own benefit. Which is the same as every other creature on the planet. If productivity is rewarded, more productivity occurs. A rewarded behavior is a repeated behavior. If "everything's free", then people are working for a benefit that they hardly see or feel. There's no incentive to continue working. This is why exchange exists, this is why money exists.
And don't tell me that your 4 eggs for 800 milliliters of milk is an example of "everything's free". It's an exchange, in which you benefit because their milk is of greater value to you than your eggs. You would rather have that milk, else you wouldn't be going through the trouble of making the exchange in the first place.
If I watch those, would you be willing to watch the videos put out by Lee Doren (HowTheWorldWorks) and Stefan Molyneux (stefbot) on Youtube?
I know about the productive and beneficial spirit of money. That's how I can say it's good. Unfortunately, the people doing bad things in the pursuit of money are the only ones your kind focus on, and thus, you never learn what it really means.
It's good.
Call me heartless if you like.
Most homeless people, at least in nations where you can actually keep the money you make, are homeless because they are unproductive. Lazy. Sure, people can fall on hard times, but the ones that are productive pick themselves back up quickly. Or at least, they'd be able to if there were jobs available, which there haven't been lately because of people wanting to stop the corruption that money supposedly causes. If businesses could run the way they need to run (free of well-intentioned ignoramuses trying to put an end to them), homelessness wouldn't be a problem for anyone that didn't bring it on themselves.
Cupid@Tool-box, stunningly radiant stag ready to play matchmaker between villain and arrow!
Vixon@Tool-box, frighteningly eager to summon despair for his adversaries!
Jebin Zedalu@Tool-box, elementalist weaponmaster. ...One of these things is not like the others!
Nope , no way , not in this lifetime pal , I aint giving out free books no freaking way, they stare at my bewbs for free thats the only freebie they are getting.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
Call me "Butter", cuz I'm on a roll!