Roles - "Control Power Strength"?

puckyuu · August 2012

I just do not understand what Control Power Strength is.

As is said in the Ranged Damaged role:
"Control Power strength is decreased by 20%"

May someone please clarify what it is or what it means? Much appreciated

pugdaddy · August 2012

I think Control powers are Holds, Paralyzes, Crowd Control stuff.

theravenforce · August 2012

puckyuu wrote: »

I just do not understand what Control Power Strength is.

As is said in the Ranged Damaged role:
"Control Power strength is decreased by 20%"

May someone please clarify what it is or what it means? Much appreciated

Yes, any "Incapacitates", Stuns, Sleeps, Paralyzes are CC. Which at the moment are totally broken.

CC str is increased in Support Role.

haleakala · August 2012

When a character is held, etc. the CC has a strength. If it is a player character being held, that strength is represented by the bar that appears on screen, the one you press z to reduce. Z is effectively doing "damage" to the hold. Damage incoming to the held character also (usually) reduces the CC's strength. Higher hold strength means it takes more damage to eliminate the CC. If you are DPS (in Ranged or Melee Damage roles), any CC you apply is weaker (by 20%).

gamehobo · August 2012

If you don't PvP then there's no real difference between DPS roles and Sentinel Role when it comes to "Control Power Strength"

I've recently switched my Crowd Controller to Ranged DPS role and for the most part the mobs are held just as long.. PvE Mobs are basically held till death.

Take this to mean that all Crowd Control is pretty much as good as in ranged role as it is in support role until devs change or address the system.

xamikaze01 · August 2012

gamehobo wrote: »

If you don't PvP then there's no real difference between DPS roles and Sentinel Role when it comes to "Control Power Strength"

I've recently switched my Crowd Controller to Ranged DPS role and for the most part the mobs are held just as long.. PvE Mobs are basically held till death.

Take this to mean that all Crowd Control is pretty much as good as in ranged role as it is in support role until devs change or address the system.

This isn't forcely true. I play also a Controller with a PVE oriented build. My main paralyse is Vengence with Redemption Denied (wich is a lvl 1 Paralyse/Stun duration). The duration is longer and the hold strength actualy makes it possible to deal some extra damage before the target releases from the Paralyse. For instance, 3 days ago, I played with a Squall during a harmon lab, his Paralyse skill (wich I don't remember the name unfortunatly) wasn't capable of taking as much damage as my Vengence. Vilains were taking around 70% dmg before my Paralysis wears off while the one from the Squall was breaking before the Vilain was loosing 50% of his health. So I realy think there is a difference and something is probably affecting the Health Strength from our Holds.

Now there is also the exception with stuns, in this case you get full benefit from Specialisations and Manipulator toggle on the duration of stuns, sinds they don't break, and hold strength mods seems to increase slightly the duration of those too. So, I believe CC strength mods aren't broken as you may think, but what exactly do they do is another question, probably not much.

But saying Ranged Damage role has exactly the same power of hold as a Support role character is a false statement, I can ensure you of that.

sagewithbubbles · August 2012

xamikaze01 wrote: »

This isn't forcely true. I play also a Controller with a PVE oriented build. My main paralyse is Vengence with Redemption Denied (wich is a lvl 1 Paralyse/Stun duration). The duration is longer and the hold strength actualy makes it possible to deal some extra damage before the target releases from the Paralyse. For instance, 3 days ago, I played with a Squall during a harmon lab, his Paralyse skill (wich I don't remember the name unfortunatly) wasn't capable of taking as much damage as my Vengence. Vilains were taking around 70% dmg before my Paralysis wears off while the one from the Squall was breaking before the Vilain was loosing 50% of his health. So I realy think there is a difference and something is probably affecting the Health Strength from our Holds.

Now there is also the exception with stuns, in this case you get full benefit from Specialisations and Manipulator toggle on the duration of stuns, sinds they don't break, and hold strength mods seems to increase slightly the duration of those too. So, I believe CC strength mods aren't broken as you may think, but what exactly do they do is another question, probably not much.

But saying Ranged Damage role has exactly the same power of hold as a Support role character is a false statement, I can ensure you of that.

Don't mind Jaybezz (gamehobo). Everything relating to crowd control in this game is useless and horrible and as bad as genocide in his eyes.

Even the bits (there aren't many, admittedly) that work.

gamehobo · August 2012

xamikaze01 wrote: »

This isn't forcely true. I play also a Controller with a PVE oriented build. My main paralyse is Vengence with Redemption Denied (wich is a lvl 1 Paralyse/Stun duration). The duration is longer and the hold strength actualy makes it possible to deal some extra damage before the target releases from the Paralyse. For instance, 3 days ago, I played with a Squall during a harmon lab, his Paralyse skill (wich I don't remember the name unfortunatly) wasn't capable of taking as much damage as my Vengence. Vilains were taking around 70% dmg before my Paralysis wears off while the one from the Squall was breaking before the Vilain was loosing 50% of his health. So I realy think there is a difference and something is probably affecting the Health Strength from our Holds.

Now there is also the exception with stuns, in this case you get full benefit from Specialisations and Manipulator toggle on the duration of stuns, sinds they don't break, and hold strength mods seems to increase slightly the duration of those too. So, I believe CC strength mods aren't broken as you may think, but what exactly do they do is another question, probably not much.

But saying Ranged Damage role has exactly the same power of hold as a Support role character is a false statement, I can ensure you of that.

You are correct.. but in the game at large (even on Elite) how often do you find yourself needing your enemy to take 70% damaage instead of taking say 50% damage.. In PvE the issue isn't that it "works as intended". The intended use is irrelevant to the gameplay model they created in regards to Crowd Control. This is much more apparent when teaming than soloing.

The HP variance is minimal at best. And most villains in CO have very low HP bags anyhow.. anyone with a large bag of HP is not able to be held.

And the variance against players is much worse.

sagewithbubbles wrote: »

Don't mind Jaybezz (gamehobo). Everything relating to crowd control in this game is useless and horrible and as bad as genocide in his eyes.

Even the bits (there aren't many, admittedly) that work.

Name one part of CC that works. One thing that is designed in favor of a player using crowd control that is not bugged in one fashion or another. Just one.. I need that silver lining.

sagewithbubbles · August 2012

gamehobo wrote: »

You are correct.. but in the game at large (even on Elite) how often do you find yourself needing your enemy to take 70% damaage instead of taking say 50% damage.. In PvE the issue isn't that it "works as intended". The intended use is irrelevant to the gameplay model they created in regards to Crowd Control. This is much more apparent when teaming than soloing.

The HP variance is minimal at best. And most villains in CO have very low HP bags anyhow.. anyone with a large bag of HP is not able to be held.

And the variance against players is much worse.

Name one part of CC that works. One thing that is designed in favor of a player using crowd control that is not bugged in one fashion or another. Just one.. I need that silver lining.

Wither correctly increases your damage, and the CC-duration boosting talents correctly increase stun length.

Despite Wither not having an icon.

CC in this game is the same as healing.

If you take the "correct" powers (Iniquity for healing, stuns for CC), you're going to do well.

Anything else? You're going to have a bad time.

And I'm obviously such a fan of this that my Fomar's almost at 30.

gamehobo · August 2012

sagewithbubbles wrote: »

Wither correctly increases your damage, and the CC-duration boosting talents correctly increase stun length.

Despite Wither not having an icon.

CC in this game is the same as healing.

If you take the "correct" powers (Iniquity for healing, stuns for CC), you're going to do well.

Anything else? You're going to have a bad time.

And I'm obviously such a fan of this that my Fomar's almost at 30.

So Wither advantage works.. except for that it doesn't work.. UI is apart of programming too..

sagewithbubbles · August 2012

gamehobo wrote: »

So Wither advantage works.. except for that it doesn't work.. UI is apart of programming too..

I'd much rather have it give the debuff and have no icon than have it with an icon but no debuff.

No sense in turning it into another Confuse, now.

gamehobo · August 2012

None of it works. Genocide .. Yeah killing of all telepaths.

xamikaze01 · August 2012

sagewithbubbles wrote: »

I'd much rather have it give the debuff and have no icon than have it with an icon but no debuff.

No sense in turning it into another Confuse, now.

Hey don't talk like that about confuse, it does a "descent" job, hum... , on isolated targets when facing large groups of ennemies! :rolleyes:

xamikaze01 · August 2012

gamehobo wrote: »

You are correct.. but in the game at large (even on Elite) how often do you find yourself needing your enemy to take 70% damaage instead of taking say 50% damage.. In PvE the issue isn't that it "works as intended". The intended use is irrelevant to the gameplay model they created in regards to Crowd Control. This is much more apparent when teaming than soloing.

The HP variance is minimal at best. And most villains in CO have very low HP bags anyhow.. anyone with a large bag of HP is not able to be held.

And the variance against players is much worse.

Depends what role you play in a team, if you are the only support character, a controller can make his team survive via the Sentinel Debuff and every holds he puts on ennemies. And you will actualy go trough the mobs even faster than with a healer because ennemies won't get the time to retaliate with Knocks or Pulls. And even without direct heal powers, if the tank is not an archetype and has enough CON, it will be able to survive without any trouble the end Bosses of any lairs.

Now if you are playing with a healer, thats where you get a problem. If the healer does a fine job at healing people you are becomming useless because you have decreased damage output and a third DPS would have been a much better choice. If you hold ennemies and make sure your teammates doesn't get hurt you are removing the whole point of a healer in your team.

To get on your point now, I agree with you 20% variance on hold strength doesn't seem that much when facing ennemies, but when you are a dedicated offensive support role it is more than enough to take down the ennemies in a fight with you team without them getting hurt.

I also agree with you on other post that certain effects should be reworked, like Disables, Confusion and CC strength items overall.

- Confusion should be totaly reworked for both PVE and PVP, I made a sugestion a while ago that sugest to turn ennemies affected by those power to becomme your temporary allies. But that idea didn't seemed to have reached Cryptic ears, and people overall didn't cared about confuse powers. For PVE content it does work, but I don't know why, people usualy choose on 1/10 targets the one I just confused 1sec ago.

- Disable should get rid of the interupt feature when broken, and should work more than 0,2sec on Legendaries and Cosmics when they don't even have one stack of resistance. (extra CC strength would be needed)

- Paralysis should work on Legendaries and Cosmics (extra CC strength would be needed), even if it wouldn't last more than 2/3 sec sinds it would anyways get destroyed instantly by your teamates because of the Hold Strength Health. But at least it would interupt bosses and give another purpose to a Controller beside of a little debuffing and healing when fighting those.

- Finally, CC strength item should still give extra duration to your crowd control powers like it does but also considerably increase the Control Strength and Thresshold of those effects, allowing every holds to take considerably more damage before they break and giving the possibility to affect Legendaries and Cosmic for longer durations. Right now it doesn't provide enough benefits compared to other utility mods.

sagewithbubbles · August 2012

Just noticed your bit about "who cares if they take 70% damage instead of 50% damage"...

The debuffs on Holds apply if you attempt to Hold (or Stun or Sleep), not if you succeed.

So you can make full use of Wither (and Sentinel Mastery) on pretty much anything.

It's also pretty damned good for soloing. Prepping an AoE with a quick AoE stun makes clearing minion packs quite a bit faster when I'm soloing on my main (like for Unity, as he's the only character I have with Unity 2 unlocked).

xamikaze01 · August 2012

sagewithbubbles wrote: »

Just noticed your bit about "who cares if they take 70% damage instead of 50% damage"...

The debuffs on Holds apply if you attempt to Hold (or Stun or Sleep), not if you succeed.

So you can make full use of Wither (and Sentinel Mastery) on pretty much anything.

It's also pretty damned good for soloing. Prepping an AoE with a quick AoE stun makes clearing minion packs quite a bit faster when I'm soloing on my main (like for Unity, as he's the only character I have with Unity 2 unlocked).

She was talking about the damage ennemies could take before the hold got destroyed, not the damage resistance you were reducing by attempting holds on ennemies.

sagewithbubbles · August 2012

xamikaze01 wrote: »

She was talking about the damage ennemies could take before the hold got destroyed, not the damage resistance you were reducing by attempting holds on ennemies.

Ah, I misread. Thanks.

Roles - "Control Power Strength"?

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