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Bestial Suggestions and Additions
championshewolf
Posts: 4,376 Arc User
Update: This update is an attempt to actually make bestial more synergistic with itself, thus a reason that each power should work together other than they make a slash style splat. This is an attempt to actually produce synergies with the sets bleed and fear effects.
The following are suggestions for enhancements, fixes and additions to the Supernatural Bestial set as this set is still incomplete, as comparable to older and newer sets that have come about as well as match similar abilities appropriately to one another. Abilities may have repeat redundancy to keep consistency with suggestions made earlier, such as blurbs about bleeds.
Bleeds
Non-Set Powers
Energy Builder
Close Attack
Close Area Attacks
Crowd Control
Healing
Buff Self
Buff Targets
Block
Controllable Pets
Movement
Energy Unlock
The following are suggestions for enhancements, fixes and additions to the Supernatural Bestial set as this set is still incomplete, as comparable to older and newer sets that have come about as well as match similar abilities appropriately to one another. Abilities may have repeat redundancy to keep consistency with suggestions made earlier, such as blurbs about bleeds.
Bleeds
This is a general catch all for bleeds inflicted by any attack. Bleeds in general are the weakest damage over time (DOT) effect in the game currently. This is mostly due to the fact that they are fully resisted source of damage, and to solve this, make bleeds ignore most shields like toxic DOTs do now.
Another part of this suggestion is one of two options. First option, increase the damage of bleeds to double their value. This would pretty much match them up to toxic dot DPS in general, and being that bleeds typically require being in melee and can be harder to maintain, would probably be more fair to those that use bleeds. The other option would require retooling of other effects, like rupture and that would be allow bleeds to stack to 10, like toxic DoTs. Rupture would have to be retooled, possibly lowering its damage in the long run on this second option.
Another part of this suggestion is one of two options. First option, increase the damage of bleeds to double their value. This would pretty much match them up to toxic dot DPS in general, and being that bleeds typically require being in melee and can be harder to maintain, would probably be more fair to those that use bleeds. The other option would require retooling of other effects, like rupture and that would be allow bleeds to stack to 10, like toxic DoTs. Rupture would have to be retooled, possibly lowering its damage in the long run on this second option.
Non-Set Powers
Bestial is the only set in the game that actually has filler powers from other sets that really don't belong in the set but were put in to basically fill the set out. In this case, both Venomous Breath and Pestilence have little to actually do with the Bestial set, but were both put in as an attempt to fill in a glaring lack of abilities that just aren't present in the set. These two powers should just be removed completely from the set now as Bestial doesn't get all that much benefit from them.
Energy Builder
Bestial Fury
Nothing really needs to change with this power.
Close Attack
Shred
Bite
Massacre
Swipe (NEW) - Suggested Icon
The advantage, Penetrating Strikes, should be changed. Instead of it being a 50% chance to inflict an -8.3% resistance debuff, this will instead inflict a 1.22% resistance debuff every time a bleed is inflicted. This debuff can stack up to 10 times, thus would be a total of 12.2% resistance debuff after shred has inflicted 10 bleeds. Change the name to reflect this change to Infectious Strikes.
A secondary option is that Penetrating Strikes should instead apply Shredded debuff, which would be very much in theme and in line for the bestial set. Penetrating Strikes, as is, is just rather pathetically weak compared to most other debuffs of similar types.
A secondary option is that Penetrating Strikes should instead apply Shredded debuff, which would be very much in theme and in line for the bestial set. Penetrating Strikes, as is, is just rather pathetically weak compared to most other debuffs of similar types.
Bite
Furor Venenum causes a effect called Infection. The current effect is a short duration stun that's pretty ineffectual. Instead, change this effect to be similar to Trauma, ending any HoTs on the target and reducing healing done to the target. Remove the enrage refreshing from this power.
Vampiric Bite (2 Point Advantage) - If the target is bleeding, any bleed effects will be instantly ended and the user will get a small HoT that scales per bleed effect ended on the target.
Vampiric Bite (2 Point Advantage) - If the target is bleeding, any bleed effects will be instantly ended and the user will get a small HoT that scales per bleed effect ended on the target.
Massacre
Massacre needs to have a 20% - 100% chance to inflict bleeds per attack (based on charge time). In addition, Bloody Mess advantage should be turned into a 1 point advantage that gives a 15% damage increase on bleeding targets and in addition also refreshes any bleeds stacks currently on the target. This will line it up with other powers that have similar effects in other power sets.
Terrifying Strike (New 2 Point Advantage) - If the target is feared, the target is rooted in place for the next 5 seconds and any fear effects on the target is refreshed.
Terrifying Strike (New 2 Point Advantage) - If the target is feared, the target is rooted in place for the next 5 seconds and any fear effects on the target is refreshed.
Swipe (NEW) - Suggested Icon
This is a single target attack that knocks a target up into the air a short distance. It is a clawing uppercut type of animation. This is a tier 3 power, having a CD time of 3 seconds, inflicts a small knock up, costs 33 energy, a 0.67 seconds, 10 foot range, and inflicting 485 damage at rank 1 with a 10% chance to cause bleeding. This power can also be advantaged with Crippling Challenge.
Predators Rage (2 Point Advantage) - If the target is bleeding, this attack will now rupture any bleeds currently on the target, ending the current bleeds and inflicting 251 slashing damage per bleed ruptured.
Predators Rage (2 Point Advantage) - If the target is bleeding, this attack will now rupture any bleeds currently on the target, ending the current bleeds and inflicting 251 slashing damage per bleed ruptured.
Close Area Attacks
Frenzy
Rake (NEW) - Suggested Icon
Eviscerate (NEW) -
Change this power from a click to a 3.5 second maintain. Change the energy cost to 18 with 14 energy per second, and change the animation to alternate between the first and second attack, but sped up some. remove the enrage refreshing effect. Change Fear Sense to a 1 point advantage that grants a 15% damage increase against feared targets, matching the similar power and effect in the darkness set. Finally, each tick of Frenzy has a 15% chance to cause bleeding on the targets affected by this power.
Frenzied Rush (New 2 Point Advantage) - If a target is out of range of frenzy but within 20 feet of the user, Frenzied Rush will do a quick lunge towards them before beginning the maintain effect.
Frenzied Rush (New 2 Point Advantage) - If a target is out of range of frenzy but within 20 feet of the user, Frenzied Rush will do a quick lunge towards them before beginning the maintain effect.
Rake (NEW) - Suggested Icon
A quick conal strike that uses the third attack animation from frenzy, the double overhand claw slash. It has a CD time of 3 seconds and it affects everything in 120 degree cone in front of the user. The attack stuns any target hit for 1.7 seconds. The power should cost 33 energy, has a 0.83 cast time, 10 foot range, max of 5 targets and inflict 485 damage at rank 1 and would be a tier 3 power. It would have a 15% chance to inflict bleed on all targets hit. In addition it has Challenging Strikes for 1 point.
Rend (2 Point Advantage) - Rake does 30% damage bonus, but delivers the damage over time.
Rend (2 Point Advantage) - Rake does 30% damage bonus, but delivers the damage over time.
Eviscerate (NEW) -
This is a tier 3 PBAE attack that does knock up. It does 214 slashing damage at rank 1, has a 10 foot range, hits a max of 5 targets, costs 31 energy a 0.83 cast time and has a 10% chance to inflict bleed. This power can be advantaged with challenging strikes. The animation is a jump spin type animation with claw splats that appear all around the character.
Beserk (2 Point Advantage) - The blood of your victims drives your attacks even further. This attack increases the bleed damage inflicted by an additional 30% and refreshes all bleed stacks currently active.
Beserk (2 Point Advantage) - The blood of your victims drives your attacks even further. This attack increases the bleed damage inflicted by an additional 30% and refreshes all bleed stacks currently active.
Crowd Control
Soul Mesmerism
Maul (NEW) - An Icon
Nothing really needs to change with this one.
Maul (NEW) - An Icon
This attack uses the Karkaradon bite animation attack. This I a maintained effect with an up to 5 second duration. It has an initial energy cost of 19 with 14 energy per tick every 1 second. It is an incapacitate effect but only at a 10 foot range and has a 9 second recharge. It deals 232 slashing damage per tick of this power. This powers own damage will not weaken the incapacitate effect. Maul does not inflict Bleed.
Gorge (2 Point Advantage) While maintaining this power, for every stack of bleed on the target, you receive 0.5% of your maximum health back per tick of this power.
Gorge (2 Point Advantage) While maintaining this power, for every stack of bleed on the target, you receive 0.5% of your maximum health back per tick of this power.
Healing
Resurgence
Remove the enrage effect from Resurgence, otherwise, no change needed.
Buff Self
Aspect of the Bestial
Regeneration
Wrath (NEW) - Suggested Icon
Bestial Fervor (NEW)
Change the icon to the wolf icon to make it more appropriate for the set (Suggested Icon). In addition, a new advantage specific for this set.
Stinging Wounds (New 2 Point Advantage) Your strikes that inflict bleeding leave the target stinging reducing their mobility. Targets affected by a bleed have their dodge chance reduced.
Stinging Wounds (New 2 Point Advantage) Your strikes that inflict bleeding leave the target stinging reducing their mobility. Targets affected by a bleed have their dodge chance reduced.
Regeneration
No change needed.
Wrath (NEW) - Suggested Icon
This is an active offense that is shared with Infernal Supernatural as well. It shares similar effects to other active offenses, but in addition to the base effects increases critical strike and critical severity by 5/10/15 at rank 1/2/3 respectively.
Bestial Fervor (NEW)
This is a slotted passive offense power. This increase damage done by all melee and bleed effects similar to other slotted offense powers with damage scaling to super stats. In addition, every time you inflict a bleed effect on a target, you are healed a small amount of your health; 1%/2%/3% at ranks 1/2/3 respectively. This is scaled to your maximum health. Finally, every 3 seconds you are standing near a feared target you gain back an amount of energy that scales to your Recovery stat.
Buff Targets
Howl
No change needed.
Block
Feral Defense (NEW)
User crosses their arms in front of their face (like this), providing similar effects to other blocks. Whenever an attack is blocked, the user gains an effect called determination. Determination gives a small boost to any one heal effect that occurs within 5 seconds.
Backed into a Corner (3 Point Advantage) While fighting in melee, you gain a bonus to your critical chance based on the number of opponents attacking you. For every opponent attacking, you gain 2.5% bonus to your critical chance.
Backed into a Corner (3 Point Advantage) While fighting in melee, you gain a bonus to your critical chance based on the number of opponents attacking you. For every opponent attacking, you gain 2.5% bonus to your critical chance.
Controllable Pets
Command Animals
No real changes needed.
Movement
Pounce
This ability needs to have a 25% chance to inflict a bleed. Furious Rush should be changed to a 1 point advantage that can inflict fear.
Energy Unlock
Supernatural Power
No changes needed.
Champions Online player since September of 2008, forumite since February of 2008.
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Post edited by Unknown User on
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But I have a few more here:
Ranged Attack
Organic Lash
Organic Lariat
Tendril Choke
Close Area Attacks
Tendril Burst
Crowd Control
Organic Roots
"What does Bestial need those powers for?" you might wonder. Well, simply to keep your prey where you want it. These powers revolve around grabbing the target with your tongue, tentacles, silk threads, vines or whatever. They prevent your enemies from escaping and make them helpless and wide open for more of your melee attacks.
Also, not every Bestial character is a werewolf, mind you. Quite a few are playing lizards, insects or even plants with it. Just because certain characters couldn't fit these powers into their concept doesn't mean that no one should.
i would like massacre to be a lot stronger, to a haymaker equivalent
Massacre has a higher base damage than haymaker, but a faster charge time thus it's upper damage is lower. Over all its damage is fine.
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and also link to my next point and the one thing that really bugs me about the entire suggestion
I compleatly disagree with this statement both those powers are perfectly thematic if you widen your scope of theme further than that of a animal based beast.
take for example the theme of a Zombie for a zombie out of the 2 selectable passives pestilence is far more appropriate than regeneration and venomous breath makes a excellent puke attack.
They can still choose to get those powers from infernal, which is where they have their synergy. These two powers have no natural syngery with bestial. Hence why they are not appropriate to the set.
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I love these power ideas!
Unfortunately, none of those powers suggested have anything to do with supernatural bestial in theme or premise.
On that note, updated Massacre with a small addition.
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1. Bite - give it an advantage where, if you bite a bleeding target, you get healed.
2. Ravenous - this would be an active offense - it'll help you break out of holds, boost your melee physical damage, and for its duration, all your melee attacks have a 100% chance to inflict bleeding. It'd get an advantage that would consume any bleeds in melee range and heal you.
3. Ferocious Retaliation - this would basically be the same as regular Retaliation, except instead of Punitive Pummeling, it'd get an advantage where you have a chance at clawing at your target as you block, (which would in turn have a chance of inflicting bleeding).
4. Berserking - This would be a cone maintain attack. The longer you maintain it, the greater the chance, (per period), of inflicting a bleed. It'd get an advantage that would turn the power into a 10' PBAoE attack that no longer needs a target.
5. Eye claw - This power would be where your character slashes at the eyes of your target. It'd inflict moderate damage, but the biggest thing is it would disorient your target, reduce the damage they do, and have a chance of confusing them. It'd get an advantage that increases the chance of causing a confusion vs bleeding targets.
6. Stalk - This power would have a 90 sec cooldown. It would wipe all threat from you and lunge toward your target, (the lunge wouldn't do any damage, just get you close). It'd also cause your next attack to cause 2 bleeds on the target.
"Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark
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I chose the name Wrath because this would be shared with Infernal Supernatural as well. Bestial Wrath, Infernal Wrath, basically with just the surname dropped off.
Parry has a similar effect and it's pretty much the most useless effect out there. Ebon Void also returns damage and heals the blocker. I made Feral Defense something unique in that it gives the set increased critical chance.
What I've basically been suggesting with frenzy. Not sure about an PBAE and how well that would work thematically with bestial. Been trying to think up something.
See swipe.
A threat wipe power that doesn't use smoke bombs sounds interesting. But a different name would probably be likened to it. Stalk just doesn't sound like something that would cause someone to take their eye off you.
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I disagree. Why shouldn't a "supernatural beast" have more methods of attacking than claws and teeth? Sure, the average "Manimal" doesn't have a long tongue or tentacles, but what about demons like the Qliphothic Horrors or shapeshifters like the Roin'esh?
You should stop thinking of Bestial as a set only for half-human-half-animal characters.
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Zombies primerly attack with tooth and nail there not all that well knowin for being able to fire of blasts of posionus/toxic energy.
My point being that the current shared powers within the bestial set do not detract from the set they add verity and throw the set open to more than just wares and there like.
removing the suggested powers from bestial would add nothing to the set but would IMO diminish it.
Agreed bestial should be able to cover all types of bestial characters from the werewolf who just wants to help people to the brilliant scientist who injected himself with his poison arrow frog based super soldier serum to stop it falling into the hands of viper.
Or what about the young mutant covered in poisonous spines.
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Respectfully, when I think Bestial - I *do* think claws and teeth. Not tongues and tentacles.
If you want demonic, HP Lovecraft stuff. I feel like infernal should be the place to look.
____________
Royal Flush
My sentiment exactly. Though I would wager it would be a set unto itself. It sounds more Lovecraftian than actual bestial. Not to mention I am just trying to fill out bestial, and get it more or less to synergize with itself and have the set to be a full complete set than the current half set it is and almost non-existent synergy. Basically I am trying to suggest as few powers that would actually impact and require actual animation time as possible.
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I find myself having to agree: "Bestial" isn't "Monster".
The tongue power is nice, but think again on what you just said guys: "a mad scientist who injected himself with poison-dart-frog DNA"... keyword "Poison", the very basis of the Infernal set...
However, I do think it's a little too werewolf oriented, beasts also have a tail to swipe with.
For all the lizards, dragons and such, a couple tail moves would be nice.
Also, perhaps a "Bear-hug", as an hold...
Anyway, I'm mostly talking cosmetics, I suck, numbers-wise.
Yeah, because emitting toxic fumes and flailing burning chains around is so frog-like. :rolleyes:
You should notice that there is a certain synergy between the two Supernatural set: They both profit from Poison and Bleed debuffs. The Toxic part is not unique to Infernal.
I'm in this game long enough to remember when these two sets were one. It's a good thing the original Supernatural was split in two sets without making these completely unrelated. You can now create a more or less natural beast instead of only an infernal demon.
But it's still rather restricted:
<-- Manimal
Spawn expy -->
There should be powers that do not just compliment these two concepts. Supernatural could be much more than just that.
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Then why suggest the removal of powers what harm to your suggestion do they do?
Infernal would be almost entirely inappropriate for such a character I could see the blasts being explained as spitting gunk but what of aspect of the infernal hardly seems fitting.
Also hows about a character with poisoned claws at the moment you can work them pretty well going with the bestial attacks and pestilence. Though a thinking about hit hows about if they added a 1pt advantage to all the claws attacks called "poisoned claws" that added a chance to poison your target(s) or instead of a advantage it could be incorporated into a new aspect of power maybe "aspect of the viper" or something.
Because they are filler and have no synergy with the set, which is quite obvious.
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Synergy is not the be all and end all of things they are usefull for those of us who do not wish to be just some kind of ware they do not harm teh creation of ware style toons and would not impact upon your suggestions.
If your aim was to truly improve the bestial power framework and not just get more powers in that suit your narrow view of how the set should operate, you would be suggesting things that could be used to improve there synergy with the existing powers not calling for there removal.
Anyways, changed a few things since enrage will now effect bleed dots according to a post from Crush on the test forums.
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I've always thought that since "Claws" is in the set with 2 other frameworks that cause BLEEDS, it should cause bleeds also.
And SHREDDED should be the preview of "Bestial" :cool:
I know it's just a name, but it's always bugged me... :rolleyes:
...Anyone else?
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As for Bestial range attacks, how about some kind of Quill Shooting
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I wouldn't say it is the weakest damage over time effect sinds some builds can do around 120 dmg sec x5 wich is still an average 600dps on top of your other abilties. But it would indeed work much better if the damage was ignoring mitigation and would stack into a single damage source instead of doing its effect on its own. I rather see 600 dmg x1 instead of a chaotic 120 dmg x5 on my screen.
Thats where the sugestion gets less interesting, bleeding is more about getting quickly up to 5 and rupture it for a quick burst. It is already hard for some encounters to inflict 5 bleeds. If you have to rebalance everything around 10 bleeds you get in one of the following problems.
- To much setup time
- Or Overpowered burst (wich would create even more problems for pvp)
I think Shield and resistance penetration would be a much logical and balanced sugestion.
I think right now the set has actualy a good range of melee powers, it lacks more of utility powers like an active offense. But I never say more for more power selection.
Again, 10 bleed is way to much setup for this set and that kind of stacking advantage isn't needed at all. Why make it complicated if you can just keep it simple.
I think this is a better idea, why not replace the advantage by the shredded debuff, sinds it is getting revamped on PTS (right now 10% All + 10% Slashing dmg) it could make the advantage worth while.
Actualy the stuns = a Rank 2 power with an innate stun. So it's not bad at all for a damaging power that include nothing to start with. And not everyone is using aspect of the Beastial so keeping the enrage refresh on this power can keep its use.
Stacking a bleed with this power isn't needed, if you do that there isn't any reason to pick other powers to go with this one. But giving the advantage to refresh the current bleeds is a very good idea.
Hum... Instant hypercut + Rupture? Mmh no... Or at least make the advantage that rupture bleeds to cause your skill unable to knock anymore. And if you don't use the rupture the power is way to similar to massacre.
I think the power could stay as it is right now. The only change that realy needs to be done is changing the Tag to Combo power so it takes benefit from the Specilisation trees. We don't need an extra 1 advantage point, neither to change it into a maintain or give it a chance to bleed. But they could tweek up the animation, I gues, to make it look a bit faster. 2 consecutive swings instead of a double scratch for instance.
The idea of a AoE stun would be a good implementation for the set, but it doesn't requiere the bleeding effect.
Gatsuga! ...
This is a joke power, right? Because, first, Crippling Challenge on a AoE Power is never going to happen. Unless it is a Chain power like Chain Lightning and Boomarang Throw. And the extra 30% dmg + refreshing bleeds as a AoE would be ridiculously disbalanced.
Thats actualy a very interesting idea and would allow to work with a lot of concepts. And the health regen advantage would allow to get a nice % for tankier toons. 5 stack is still 2,5% max health every 0,67sec. Thats far than enough.
It would be pointless to allow such a small change for no apparent reason.
No, no, no! The icon doesn't need a change, every powers have to be in accordance with a larger group of concepts, not specific ones. It is already bad that Howl can only use a Wolf Howl instead of different types of cries. And the snare advantage would actualy be pointless sinds snares doesn't stack anymore and you have already one on your lundge.
I'm ok for an active offense but not one that give more critical chance compared to Lock and Load and at the same time gives almost as much severity as Ice Sheath. Try to balance it please.
Very decent idea, I love it. No particular changes needed, maybe just a internal cooldown of 3sec to the health regen effect like Shadow Form have. To make it more balanced and on par with similar powers.
The effects need no change at all but it would be nice if we could change, like we can with pets, the existing sound of the power with another like a Raptor Hiss, or a Warcry, to match more concepts.
No! No! and no! We don't need a ridiculous anime Dragonball Z block, I rather see my hero put his hand on his head like scared yeti do before I see a hero from a comic genre cross his arms like he belive he is freaking Picolo.
Now I think there are some awsome ideas that could pass, but you are way to much focused on your werewolf character and forget this game and powers should always be open to as much concepts as it can. Making powers that are suited for only a minority of concepts doesn't help the game out. And making them overpowered isn't helping either.
I'm gonna make my own sugestion later, right now gotta go back to work,
Peace!
Agreed. Those Organic and Tendril powers look more like Plant powers, which would belong in Toxic, not Bestial. I think the OP's point is that Bestial should be able to stand on its own from Infernal.
I would like to propose Infernal and Toxic could also be separated but still remain closely related. Toxic should include more Plant-like powers including Vine-skins for those chain attacks. Infernal means demonic in a Ghostrider sort of way. I'm sure it could fill out a set on its own without relying on Poison and Toxic.
Infernal and Ebon Sorcery could honestly be combined. Or at least share the demon summon power and throw in some Living Dead type powers.
That said, I shall try to honor the purpose of the OP and make decent Bestial suggestions.
Some Bestial players might like a Tail Slap power that provides a Knock Back.
Since Bleed is a bit weak, why not add some Disorient effects to provide additional debuffs.
Quill shooting sounds cool.
I'm still working on a "Supernatural Spines/Plants" concept, since certain people insist on Bestial being all about claws and teeth.
Finally, your complaint on howl and its sound effect, first it's not even a wolf howl sound effect. Far from it. It has about as much relation to a wolf howl as it has to dinosaur roar. In fact, when I brought that point up when it was created the devs said they specifically chose the sound so it wouldn't be likened to any particular animal type.
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First I said how hard it is for SOME ENCOUNTERS to stack bleeding, because you know, time you get 5 bleeds on a target they are probably dead 3 minutes ago and so in most case it would be useless to increase that cap, same goes for deadly poison. So saying it is hard doesn't mean it can't stack quickly, so i didn't contradict myself... (like you always like to say)
Personnaly I don't care about the cost and base damage input for each of your so called powers. Those are fictional numbers that can easely change overtime. The reason I don't like your powers are comming from the fact you are completely neglating the fonction of those and make the others look obsolete.
So lets make a comparaison about 2 similar power included in another set:
- So Rake is basicaly a AoE version of Dragon Bite, that inflict bleed and sinds it is a maintain it has acces to greater resources from SN power and it gets a 30% additional bleed damage debuff while SB has none of those. Oh yeah DB has Momentum and the instant kill that doesn't work above MV, hum...
(Balanced?)
- And Swipe is your other so called "balanced" skill with an advantage that can rupture bleeds, so basicaly you are making a Rupture with a knock effect attached to it while at the same time you get a slight (useless) chance to apply a bleed that anyways is going to get ruptured. And don't tell me you are not forced to take that advantage because if you don't it is basicaly a weaker form of Massacre with a cooldown on it... (Balanced or useless? Tell me.)
There is no point, when I see your sugestions, to go for the their counterpart in single blade or other power sets. So if there is no point, beside maybe the cool look, there is no balance.
I also wanted to point out Massacre is the heavy hitter of Beastial : SN while Defile is Infernal counterpart, does Defile stack deadly poison? So hell no, Massacre isn't going to get a bleed chance.
Also no AoE in the game can stack bleed on ennemies and there is a reason why. So unless Cleaving strike allows Reapers Caress to stack bleed on multiple targets in an upcomming patch, I don't see frenzy getting a chance put to bleeds on multiple ennemies even if the chances are low.
Finally, Superman never crosses his arms he wil take a blow (because realy he is more scared about hurting you than him getting hurt), parry it or stop it with his hands or, in other situations, he will take the freaking missile away and flight the hell out of town while blowning it into space.
Wolverine crosses his claws but not his arms unless he is going for his X strike. He has freaking claws. Why would he crosses his arms at the first place unless it is to cut you down in little pieces?
And Hulk it's basicaly the same, he blocks attacks while trying to protect most of his body against bullet, because he feels the pain you know, until he burst out of rage and get on rampage.
So yeah basicaly you want your toon to cross arms like they do in Dragonball Z, unless we both have different conception about crossing arms.
How so I'm simply saying that synergy is not required for for every power within a framework
In what way, you've still yet to actually, you know, address this. In fact, you sit there and say you don't care about the numbers, yet that's exactly what you are arguing in fact, which you've yet to actually go out and look at the numbers yourself.
Rake isn't a maintain it has a 3 second cooldown actually attached to it, and frenzy was the power to be turned into a maintain. Reading comprehension?
Actually it doesn't even compare to massacre damage wise. It is designed as a control power, and an alternative to actually shred as far as something with a CC on it. If you want massacre, take massacre. So, at what point are you actually making here other than trying to state it's massacre?
You keep repeating this but still offer no reason why. Actually I made the suggestion that power sets that inflict bleeds which is all of bestial and single blades have a chance on all attacks ot inflict bleeds as well.
Umm, defile is not bestial's counterpart as defile causing debilitating poison all the time which also decreases resistance to toxic damage. This is an apple and orange comparison and also makes no sense.
You are comparing bleeds but what you should be comparing is deadly poison. Epidemic has a 15% chance, per damage tick, to inflict deadly poison. Vicious cyclone has a 10% chance per tick, to inflict deadly poison. And yea, reaper's caress in my suggestion would get a chance to inflict bleeds. Really, the grounds that no other AE inflicts bleeds logic is a tad wobbly there, especially since the point of the bleed statement was to get bleeds on all attacks that used them.
Uh, no this argument is really pointless. You can say no it didn't happen till time immemorial, but they have. You make wobblier excuses to say it didn't happen than actually prove that it didn't happen now at this point. In fact your whole argument hinges on the weak sauce excuse that it was used in Dragonball Z when it was definitely used more often than that and well before DBZ was even a spot on the American radar.
Your whole argument seems to be hinged on single blade versus bestial instead of actually, I don't know, trying to get single blade buffed up and beefier. If the whole point of your argument is single blade can't do it so bestial shouldn't, it's a fairly weak sauce argument and that, so far, has been the basis of your entire argument. Instead of actually looking around at the other sets, which is where you should be looking, you narrowed your focus so thin you completely missed the point. In fact, you limited your argument to saying that no other set can inflict bleeds on all powers, so bestial shouldn't either, when you should have been comparing to infernal, which can just about on every power inflict poison. And poison does way more DPS over time than bleeds do, especially since it stacks to 10.
Silverspar on PRIMUS
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What about for a block something like a boxers block with added bonus points if it could be coded in such a way that meant if your character had wings they gathered round your chrachter.
I would also like to see more bite and big beast attacks by big beast I mean attacks I could envisage coming from larger animals such as bears less jumpy and more whack. Almost a combination of might and bestial. As not all beasts need be agile and I think there's a lack of non agile looking attacks.
You just see things you want to see, and can't see for once you are freaking wrong...
I don't care about your numbers, because they don't represent anything in game. When you make a sugestion it doesn't matter if it deals 10000 dmg (because those numbers get rehauled), I wan't to know what is the purpose of this power and how it fits in the set without disbalancing the rest of the game. Wich you never explain...
I made the old switcheroe and made a mistake. But no my reading comprehension is fine. Thank you for asking.
So again my question? What is the point of a control power if you already have the same effect on a power that does more damage beside for the advantage that cause rupture? Why not just create a power that cause Ruptures instead of making a pseudo useless power that requieres an advantage to have any use?
If you can see their similar aspect than you will never able to balance anything in this game, both of those powers are mend to Burst your target. They are Finisher moves that use deep synergies between the Powerset itself and the specilisation trees to get the most out of it (even if spamming those is sometime the best DPS option). They deal both huge amounts of damage and there for have an increased energy cost. Some of them rely on special status to get extra effects or in the case of defile it just Support your next toxic skills to deal more damage. So it makes perfectly sense to compare both of those powers like it would be perfectly normal to compare those with Tiger Bite, Ebon Ruin and every single target heavy hitter.
You see that is not comparable, because those effects are extra flavours unique to a couple of sets. You can indeed deal more damage with deadly poison because it stack up to 10 and pierce half of the damage resistance. but they are not comparable just by the fact you can rupture them and deal around 15K dmg with a critical rupture with 5 bleeds on a target. So basicaly you want bleeds to be as strong, maybe even stronger than Deadly Poison and at the same time beeing able to Rupture everything that got caught in your AoE powers, and with you extra 30% dmg on your Rake power you would even increase that damage potential by 30% damage sinds Rupture use the exact same category of damage type as bleeds. With my calculations we are going for 39K dmg ruptures with the current setup on boss fights. And thats not even if I include the 20% base damage bonus from Brawler Spec.
You know what just bring me a video link where you see those heroes doing what you are saying they do. And we be settle up for that part.
No it's a pretty valid argumentation. If a particular powerset isn't capable to do something and that existing powers are already restricted to certain limitation like (1 bleed max for AoE) you shouldn't break the rule unless you allow other powersets in your sugestion to break the whole game. It is your sugestion and you decide how well you build it, and if you don't want to sugest anything for Single blade wich is the first powerset you should be comparing to, not infernal. I will just take my pencil and note everything you didn't wrote and tell you with my standarts why I think your sugestion is just wrong. I'm not against a buff, but I think SB is actualy pretty decent, and it can also be improved. Same goes for beastial. But we got two unique mechanics in game, bleeding and deadly poison. And it would be stupid to waste bleedings the way they work right now and transform them in a reskined deadly poison.
PS : Pretty shamefull you didn't sugest Enrage buff to increase damage from bleeds like it did before On Alert Patch.
Example of a zombie that would perfectly fit beastial, from another game: Hunter (from Left4Dead)
I would especially love to have that leaping mechanic from Left4Dead, you know so that when you jump and are in contact in a surface you leap off the surface. Would be sooo much fun in urban and close-quarters combat.
More feasibly though would be a hold, one that would knock an enemy on their back and then you jump on them and play "clawed confetti making" with them. Z-spam to break-free (PvP), and doesn't work on cosmics or legendaries (instead just becomes a rapid slashing maintain attack for these foes). Even if the hold didn't last for long, a hold & maul type of attack I feel is very fitting and has already been proven to be immensely fun and lead to cleverly timed tactics.
I really like your suggestions overall and I agree with your reply here too. Plant-based attacks are a different set.
My favorite of your suggestions actually that intrigues me is the "backed into a corner" advantage.
Good point, I agree. That said, it's "completely"
Consolidate the currencies! (Please!)
Does your Champion have a theme song? (share it!)
Got a funny in-game screenshot? (share it!)
Please fix the Overdrive energy unlock! (Should help promote thematic build diversity!)
If I may, this is the exact issue I've had with Silverspar in the past...
There are times she's extraordinarly unwilling to admit if their's a flaw in her logic (even if it obvious to everybody else). Although I have seen recently her soften on that hardlined no-compromise attitude, and not take criticism as personally as she used to. The reason the debates between her and I took a nasty turn toward personal attacks however, was due to imagined-favoritism & sucking-up (specifically with regards to implying because she's been around longer she knows better than everyone who hasn't been around as long) to Gentleman_Crush over untested and frankly imbalanced suggestions.
But now that I have criticized her past now I'm going defend her some too.
This topic has great suggestions! Her tank suggestions topic is even better! I like the theme, creativity, planning, and even formatting she put into this topic. Futhermore, from where I'm viewing, you're taking this a bit too personally. Take a chill, she's hard-headed as stone (and occasionally on rested laurels at times) sometimes but she means well and invested a lot of time, effort, and heart into this topic. Oh! And she's very knowledgeable about good tanking in this game, her and I frequently seem to agree on tanking stuff. Take a look at her other suggestion, I bet you'll like it.
This is a fair, well-made point. That said there should always be a understanding that concepts doesn't mean the final product will look like that. Getting closer numbers in conceptual helps.
Consolidate the currencies! (Please!)
Does your Champion have a theme song? (share it!)
Got a funny in-game screenshot? (share it!)
Please fix the Overdrive energy unlock! (Should help promote thematic build diversity!)