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Forums > Home› Champions Pen and Paper RPG

Female Nephilims?

Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
edited August 2011 in Champions Pen and Paper RPG
You know this bothered me while I was farming the 5k Nephilim kill. Why isn't there any female Nephilims. Are they just to hot to be seen in public? Or does Therakiel have... plans for them? :confused:
Post edited by Archived Post on

Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Because Nephilims are neither blokes or chicks....




    :D
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Then the Females must really look ugly to share a body with a male... Come on surely there are? :rolleyes:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Heartless50 wrote:
    Then the Females must really look ugly to share a body with a male... Come on surely there are? :rolleyes:

    Check the "big foots" in Canada and My Lost Foot mission in MC.....Thats ugly.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Heartless50 wrote:
    Then the Females must really look ugly to share a body with a male... Come on surely there are? :rolleyes:

    Nope. They simply don't have genders. There are no male or female nephilim. There are just nephilim.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Because Female Nephilims are smart enough to know better than to trigger the Apocalypse. Plus, guys dig angelic figures, so being a cute hero instead of an obnoxious fallen angel make sense.

    Proof

    But in all seriousness, Nephilims are said to be some sort of alien creatures completely separate from the likes of Man and Women.

    Here's an excerpt of one of Therakiel Scriptures:
    In all these things, Therakiel considered only the preservation of his own plans. Though he used words of friendship and alliance and took the form of a benefactor, his heart was hard and held little trust for his mortal servants. So he also stole the essence of Man and Woman and mixed it with his own essence, forming creatures in his own image, called Nephilim.

    The Nephilim were not Angels of Heaven, nor Demons of Hell, nor were they Man or Woman, nor any other part of Creation, but they were powerful and served Therakiel with loyalty, since their essence was his own. Though they carried the power of Therakiel's and moved at his bidding, they had also the essence of Man and Woman to hide them from the eyes of Heaven and of Hell.

    Therakiel took care that his followers should not become too numerous, lest he should be revealed through them, and he pitted them against each other so that each would curtail the strength of each. But the Nephilim he preserved, and stored up for the Day when he would require them.
    Notes

    As said within this one and other scriptures, Therakiel has little but contempt toward humanity. Holding little interest beyond achieving dominion over them and Earth itself. The whole Therakiel lore, is essentially a reflection of the myth of the events that led Man and Woman's exile from the Garden of Eden.

    For instance, Caliburn is seen as sort of a paragon of Man, some sort of allegory of Adam, the first Male human within the biblical mythos. And as such, being the only one who can truly stop him, is the only human worth his attention.

    And so came Eve, a woman, who is deemed to be his complete opposite, represented by Valerian Scarlet; whose tendency toward evil is some sort of metaphor regarding prejudice held against women within archaic mythology. Valerian's purpose, being Caliburn's equal in all things, serves a special part in Therakiel's plan, in that she is meant to usurp Man's power and in turn, turn over the Earth to Therakiel (holding a similar symbolism as the snake, being the one who thought good and evil to Man and Woman).
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    SPrime wrote:
    Because Female Nephilims are smart enough to know better than to trigger the Apocalypse. Plus, guys dig angelic figures, so being a cute hero instead of an obnoxious fallen angel make sense.

    Proof

    But in all seriousness, Nephilims are said to be some sort of alien creatures completely separate from the likes of Man and Women.

    Here's an excerpt of one of Therakiel Scriptures:



    As said within this one and other scriptures, Therakiel has little but contempt toward humanity. Holding little interest beyond achieving dominion over them and Earth itself. The whole Therakiel lore, is essentially a reflection of the myth of the events that led Man and Woman's exile from the Garden of Eden.

    For instance, Caliburn is seen as sort of a paragon of Man, some sort of allegory of Adam, the first Male human within the biblical mythos. And as such, being the only one who can truly stop him, is the only human worth his attention.

    And so came Eve, a woman, who is deemed to be his complete opposite, represented by Valerian Scarlet; whose tendency toward evil is some sort of metaphor regarding prejudice held against women within archaic mythology. Valerian's purpose, being Caliburn's equal in all things, serves a special part in Therakiel's plan, in that she is meant to usurp Man's power and in turn, turn over the Earth to Therakiel (holding a similar symbolism as the snake, being the one who thought good and evil to Man and Woman).

    Well... then what do the superheroes destroying everything represent?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    blockofwoodforheadman wrote:
    Well... then what do the superheroes destroying everything represent?

    GOD.....
    /ten chars
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Well... then what do the superheroes destroying everything represent?

    Heroic insurance's monthly increase, ^^.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Val is a fashion critic and a Toadie of EVil... She reminds one of a certain traitor angel near a hamlet called Tristam or something..

    [Te-rial was a fool to trust me w the world stones]

    Caliburn I hate that pompous man with a passion.. Taffy Winters is JEalous of the Red Snake its a Peyton Place in VB! I My trust Ka but the rest I'm not quite happy with the vibe my hero sense is a tingle..

    Thought they do fit the David Adams Fleming -Odysseus-Joseph Campbell- Journey of a Hero model
    as represented long ago in Eastern Model of A Journey to the West and the Monkey King!

    Lady Neph? Np way they'd be nekd as that evil Demon Angel hybrids a poor at budgeting clothes.
    Long Live the Sakura 150! Like the 47 Samurai! We still have no plaque to show for glory
    But Konohanasakuya-hime (木花之開耶姫) The Blossom Princess knows who her champions are!
    She is often considered an avatar of Japanese life, especially since her symbol is the sakura, or cherry blossom.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    SPrime wrote:
    But in all seriousness, Nephilims are said to be some sort of alien creatures completely separate from the likes of Man and Women.

    From what I can tell nephilim in CO are no different from the original nephilim:

    So I'll just quote

    Genesis 6:1-7

    1And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,

    2That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.

    3And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

    4There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

    5And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

    6And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

    7And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.


    The only other reference apparently being:

    Numbers 12:30-33

    30And Caleb stilled the people before Moses, and said, Let us go up at once, and possess it; for we are well able to overcome it.

    31But the men that went up with him said, We be not able to go up against the people; for they are stronger than we.

    32And they brought up an evil report of the land which they had searched unto the children of Israel, saying, The land, through which we have gone to search it, is a land that eateth up the inhabitants thereof; and all the people that we saw in it are men of a great stature.

    33And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.


    (both King James Bible version)



    Since the Bible never clearly states who or what the "sons of God" are who father the nephilim with the daughters of man, it seems (if one reads the in -game Lore quote SPrime provided) that in Champions Therakiel is playing the role of sone of God in a way.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Nephilims are genderless but look as male.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallen_angel#Origin_of_the_term
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    martin wrote:
    Nephilims are genderless but look as male.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallen_angel#Origin_of_the_term

    "Im not a woman Im not a man Im something that you'll never understand" :eek:

    So in
    Essence They Fell from grace for "GRACE" ;)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    EDIT
    Nevermind, I just realized this is under the Pen & Paper RPG category.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    SPrime wrote:
    And so came Eve, a woman, who is deemed to be his complete opposite, represented by Valerian Scarlet; whose tendency toward evil is some sort of metaphor regarding prejudice held against women within archaic mythology. Valerian's purpose, being Caliburn's equal in all things, serves a special part in Therakiel's plan, in that she is meant to usurp Man's power and in turn, turn over the Earth to Therakiel (holding a similar symbolism as the snake, being the one who thought good and evil to Man and Woman).

    I truly don't care what she represents. I just want her sleeves! >E
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    SPrime wrote:
    And so came Eve, a woman, who is deemed to be his complete opposite, represented by Valerian Scarlet; whose tendency toward evil is some sort of metaphor regarding prejudice held against women within archaic mythology. Valerian's purpose, being Caliburn's equal in all things, serves a special part in Therakiel's plan, in that she is meant to usurp Man's power and in turn, turn over the Earth to Therakiel (holding a similar symbolism as the snake, being the one who thought good and evil to Man and Woman).

    Or Valerian is Lilith, Adam's first wife who left and mated with the archangel Samael.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Its cause all dogs go to heaven, but they won't let women in :D

    *ducks*

    Seriously though, angels as a general rule don't have genders. Since the christian perspective is that man is made in the image of God, it would only make sense that angels would mimic him. Biblical sctripture tends to treat women as second class in most cases.

    Sidebar: Not a christian myself, and this sort of sexism is one of the reasons why I'm not :o
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Lastsonofzod wrote:
    Its cause all dogs go to heaven, but they won't let women in :D

    *ducks*

    Seriously though, angels as a general rule don't have genders. Since the christian perspective is that man is made in the image of God, it would only make sense that angels would mimic him. Biblical sctripture tends to treat women as second class in most cases.

    Sidebar: Not a christian myself, and this sort of sexism is one of the reasons why I'm not :o

    The bible treats women more like property not even second class, and in almost all circusmtances, a woman is the reason for the downfall of an important character. Eve is the reason Adam got expulsed from paradise, Delilah robs Samson of his strength, etc, etc, etc. Hell the only woman that was actually treated more than property was Mary.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Silverspar wrote:
    Hell the only woman that was actually treated more than property was Mary.

    Though again, she didn't get much say in whether she wanted to bear a child or not. The angel came and said "You will have God's son", so all she really was was an ovary :P

    Seriously now, the bible was written in a time when ... ah you all know all that :)

    So back to Mary. She is indeed portrait differently. That is though for two reasons:
    Firstly we are now talking about the New Testament which saw quite a few changes, from a vengeaful God to a forgiving one etc.
    Secondly, Mary is not see in the bible as a woman but as a mother. And while many patriarchal societies might not have respected women, as most of those societies still were based on a woman raising the children, many of these societies still respect their mothers.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Arranged marriage and dowry for matters of State have been well documented.. Before James revisions to the text that made Rome happy. It was shown later Greek versions of the original text found in the remote places of safety some things about early women i n the church were respected in splinter groups but persecuted by the Orthodox . I think Solomons Sub Saharan Wife the Beautiful Queen of Sheba was treated in a unique light.. hardly a trend or precedent.. but there were two popes that hid their womanise by living as males.

    Even Crusading King Richard I, tried to marry his Sister to the brother of Saladin to gain Jerusalem by peaceful means.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited August 2011
    At the risk of getting punished, trolled, whatever...

    Many of the faults found within Christianity is found within the people attempting to follow it, human beings make constant mistakes and screw up repeatedly, in regards to treatment of women, yes many men from almost all cultures, religions ect have always put women in a lower class until the last century where there has been a huge change in roles.

    I would not place the fault in Christianity, because Christ who is entirely what it's based off of gave repeated commands to show love to one another, Love was a repeatedly asked of the disciples, apostles, ect. Many times through the new testament, Christ treated the women with a godly love, to the point where even his disciples were surprised at the site that a woman was being treated in such a way. but then again in past societies, children were held in a low class as well as women, even lower at times. Christ, whom I follow, repeatedly had to tell the disciples as well as others to show love and kindness to the children and even used them as examples in his teachings.

    Christiansity, TRUE Christianity teaches very different mindsets compared to what Man tries to impliment for his own gaines, that in and of itself is why we have Catholic, Baptist, Pentecostal, Gospel Ect...it is MAN taking a certain scripture and making it fit his own agenda, but in regards to CHRIST, I have studied, I have seen a constant love and treating those who society deems as "Second class" with Kindness and dignity.

    If you look into books like Ephesians 5:25 it is telling husands to love their wives as Christ loved the church, sacrificing for her. If you look at the extent Christ went to in regards to the Christian faith, he gave his life willingly for the church, Which means Husbands are not expected to treat their wives as second class but to treat them with love and dignity, sacrificing for them constantly.

    which can be followed up with 1st corinthians 13:4- which talks abotu the apsects of love. "Love is patient, it is kind, it is not arrogant, it does not keep a record of wrongs... Again constantly laying out what a christian is SUPPOSED to be and the ATTRIBUTES they should exhibit, not what we have in the world today of politicians and false leaders "claiming" to follow God, but show nothing for it. Christ even proclaimed "You will know them by their fruit" a refernce to the question he asked his disciples "Figs don't grow from thistles do they?" which a person could easily say "Of course not, a thistle can not, and never will grow a Fig, anyone who tells you otherwise is either crazy or a liar" Which in a sense is exactly those things, anyone who claims to be a christian and does not exhibit the attributes and characteristics of what a christian should be is either crazy or a liar. So I ask of you, please don't bash what I believe. I ask this humbly and without any ill will. I just wanted to read up lore on Therakiel, and I understand there are biblical references in it, but I really don't think the negativity towards Christianity should have been used. It hurts me that so many people use small quips to make negative remarks towards it. I understand that you have certain views, and I respect that, but please respect the faith and practices of others in this gaming community.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited August 2011
    I am curious why you are resurrecting year long dead threads?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited August 2011
    I wanted to know more about the lore of this game and began reading from the very last post backwards and enjoying learning more about a game I really appreciate and getting insight about certain villains to research.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited August 2011
    sean_raiko wrote:
    I wanted to know more about the lore of this game and began reading from the very last post backwards and enjoying learning more about a game I really appreciate and getting insight about certain villains to research.

    it is great for curiosity and information to read a forum thread that is older.... BUT it is against forum rules to necro a thread and bring it back. they prefer you to start a new thread instead of bringing old crap up
  • Archived PostArchived Post Posts: 1,156,071 Arc User
    edited August 2011
    Just to clarify, the PnP lore has nothing at this point regarding Nephilims in the Champions Universe. They were added to Therakiel's minions by Cryptic Studios for the MMO.

    I wouldn't be surprised if they eventually appear in an updated Vibora Bay source book incorporating developments since Cryptic bought the IP.
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